Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

It is not hopeless, and we are not helpless.

Putting aside our relentless self-interest because the moral imperative is crystal clear.

“Until such time as the world ends, we will act as though it intends to spin on.”

Those who are easily outraged are easily manipulated.

Not loving this new fraud based economy.

’Where will you hide, Roberts, the laws all being flat?’

Dumb motherfuckers cannot understand a consequence that most 4 year olds have fully sorted out.

JFC, are there no editors left at that goddamn rag?

Stop using mental illness to avoid talking about armed white supremacy.

“They all knew.”

“What are Republicans afraid of?” Everything.

American history and black history cannot be separated.

We are aware of all internet traditions.

When I was faster i was always behind.

It may be funny to you motherfucker, but it’s not funny to me.

Disappointing to see gov. newsom with his finger to the wind.

It is possible to do the right thing without the promise of a cookie.

The current Supreme Court is a dangerous, rogue court.

I’ve spoken to my cat about this, but it doesn’t seem to do any good.

Mediocre white men think RFK Jr’s pathetic midlife crisis is inspirational. The bar is set so low for them, it’s subterranean.

Innocent people do not delay justice.

If America since Jan 2025 hasn’t broken your heart, you haven’t loved her enough.

Damn right I heard that as a threat.

Find someone who loves you the way trump and maga love traitors.

You are here: Home / Politics / Biden Administration in Action / Landmark Prisoner Exchange with Russia

Landmark Prisoner Exchange with Russia

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President Biden in Action

Landmark Prisoner Exchange with Russia
Washington Post  (gift link)

The United States, Russia, Germany and four other countries swapped at least two dozen people Thursday in the largest prisoner exchange since the height of the Cold War. Those released included American journalist Evan Gershkovich, former Marine Paul Whelan, Russian dissidents and others from the United States, Germany, Poland, Slovenia, Norway, Russia and Belarus.

The exchange caps months of painstaking diplomacy involving negotiations at the highest levels of multiple governments. “The deal that secured their freedom was a feat of diplomacy,” said President Biden in a statement. Russia received eight prisoners Thursday, and released 16, many of whom were unjustly accused or handed heavy sentences for minor offenses.

 

Reader Interactions

229Comments

  4. 4.

    bbleh

    Oh big deal.  Everybody KNOWS that if Real President Trump were still in charge, they would have BEGGED to release ALL their prisoners, just because of their awe at his greatness!  Also something something Jesus something.

    (Srsly, I wouldn’t be surprised if the Felon has already “truthed” something like this.

    I admit, this came as a surprise to me.  It’s a real testament to the Biden folks’ skills that this could happen even with the current levels of tension AND the US election.

  8. 8.

    tom

    The WSJ reports that Biden called the Slovenian prime minister to secure the pardon of two Russian spies they were holding to move the deal along. An hour later, Biden announced he was not running for president.

    Wow.

  11. 11.

    hueyplong

    @tom: And you could make a fairly strong argument that the WSJ isn’t exactly a Biden propaganda source.

  12. 12.

    Leto

    @bbleh: I know the press corpse shouted that question at Biden during his presser*:

    What do you say to President Trump’s statement that he could have gotten them home without any concessions (in terms of trading prisoners). Biden: Why didn’t he?

    Because he’s a self-serving sack of shit, who never gave a rat’s ass about any of them, that’s why. But Biden is too nice to say that… publicly.

    *H/t Hueyplong in the last thread, at comment #479

  13. 13.

    E.

    @bbleh: Well, cnn.com has two yeah-but stories about it already. It was a bad deal that encourages hostage taking, and it was Putin acting quickly before Trump gets in. So yeah.

  15. 15.

    JoyceH

    What’s particularly nice is that a couple months ago Trump was posting at his Dollar Store Twitter that Putin would released the WSJ reporter “for me but not for anyone else”.  Sounds like Vlad has given up on his American asset?

  16. 16.

    Lapassionara

    Biden is a great president. Not a great campaigner for president, at least, not in a country whose electorate votes based on who would they rather have a beer with.

  17. 17.

    Sure Lurkalot

    @bbleh:

    Everybody KNOWS that if Real President Trump were still in charge, they would have BEGGED to release ALL their prisoners, just because of their awe at his greatness!  Also something something Jesus something.

    Trump couldn’t care less about the prisoners, it’s all about a win for the big man himself. That this isn’t clear to many millions of my fellow Americans after 9 years of his despicable self being front and center is the woe of my lifetime. He neither “tells it like it is” or cares one iota about anything or anyone except himself and money

    ETA: H/T Leto at #12.

  18. 18.

    Gin & Tonic

    @NotMax: ​
    There have been rumors bubbling for several days among people who follow this stuff closely, based on movements of some of the russian prisoners. The scope was unknown, but it looked like a deal was very close.

  20. 20.

    Chris

    @Lapassionara:

    It always seems worth mentioning that the majority of voters cast their ballot against that guy that we were all assured they wanted to have a beer with.

  25. 25.

    NotMax

    @tom

    Dunno if you’ve seen anything about it but Dolt 45 and his media ’empire” has hooked up with a concern based in Slovenia to provide streaming services.

    Pro Publica report.

    This month, former President Donald Trump’s media company announced it was making its first major purchase: technology to help stream TV on Truth Social, its Twitter-like platform.

    There was a mystery at the center of the deal: One of the companies on the other side of the transaction, which went unmentioned in Trump Media’s press release but was named in securities filings, is an obscure entity called JedTec LLC. Based in a North Louisiana village, the company has virtually no public footprint and no website, and it is unknown to streaming technology experts.
    [snip]
    The ultimate provider of the technology is a British firm called Perception Group, which has offices and engineers in Slovenia. The clients listed on its website are far less prominent than Trump’s social media site. They include a telecom in Slovenia, an entertainment service for crews on commercial ships and an Arabic-language streaming service in Sudan. Source

  28. 28.

    hueyplong

    It’s entirely possible that Vlad hasn’t given up on his asset at all, but instead decided that the current swap was something that should be handled among adults without the preening involvement of a bloated toddler.

  31. 31.

    Geminid

    Turkiye’s Ministry of Foreign Affairs says Turkiye’s M.I.T. intelligence agency coordinated this hostage exchange from beginning to end.

    This seems possible. Turkiye has brokered prisoner exchanges between Russia and Ukraine before.

  35. 35.

    Scout211

    @suzanne: Here is his complete statement.  (.pdf)

    Here is NBC’s summary:

    Whelan’s brother thanked President Biden and others for the release of his family member after “Paul was held hostage for 2,043 days.”

    “Paul Whelan is free. Our family is grateful to the United States government for making Paul’s freedom a reality. We’d like to thank President Biden, Secretary of State Blinken, and National Security Advisor Sullivan for their engagement with the Russian Federation to create the environment where Paul’s freedom became a possibility,” David Whelan said in a statement today.

    He went on to thank members of Congress and people who supported his brother’s release “from across the globe.”

    “There is no way to thank the many Americans and others who helped and gave hope to Paul from afar, writing letters and donating to his GoFundMe prison account,” he said in the statement. “We are grateful for the assistance that, like Paul’s extended family, came from across the globe.”

    David Whelan also said that “we were discouraged from speaking out about Paul’s case.”

    “But we believe the media attention has been a crucial factor in securing Paul’s freedom,” he said. “Those first years were hard when the Trump Administration ignored Paul’s wrongful detention, and it was media attention that helped to finally create critical mass and awareness within the U.S. government.”

    “Paul Whelan is not in a Russian labor colony any longer, but he is not home,” his brother said. “While Paul was wrongfully imprisoned in Russia, he lost his home. He lost his job. We are unsure how someone overcomes these losses and rejoins society after being a hostage.”

    David Whelen ended his statement reiterating, “we are grateful for everyone’s efforts to help Paul while he was away” and asked for space and privacy for his brother.

  38. 38.

    Leto

    @Sure Lurkalot: agreed; this is where he fits right in with the authoritarian leader model, because that’s the main idea in that model: what’s good for the leader is, by default, good for the country. Which 100% fits within his transactional world view.

    Which also highlights why he has such disgust with public service. I’m thinking here of his quote with the military: “What do they get out of it?” He’s pea brain literally just doesn’t understand that there are people who do things for the greater public good, for advancing all of us. Ofc that’s also conservative mantra as well: fuck the public good, it’s all about meeeeeeee!

  40. 40.

    Michael Bersin

    I was downtown this morning and came across an acquaintance, not a MAGA nor a republican, assuredly a “progressive” – we had a lengthy chat. He used phrases like “the Democrats” and had obviously been influenced by the continuous rightwing spin attacking Joe Biden. Lots of both siderism. I asked him, “So, Joe Biden hasn’t done anything?” He stopped.

  41. 41.

    lamh47

    @lamh47:

    MAGA response to that trying to claim folks were held under Biden.

    But Paul Whelan was arrested in Moscow in 2018 under the Trump admin.

    So for all the MAGA trying to claim it was not…facts or facts.

  44. 44.

    WereBear

    It would seem President Biden still “has all his buttons,” as my grandmother would say.

    This just in:

    In the book, Pelosi recounted what she was told by several “doctors and other mental health professionals” at a memorial service for a psychiatrist. They told her that they were “deeply concerned that there was something seriously wrong” with Trump, “and that his mental and psychological health was in decline.”4 hours ago

    https://newrepublic.com › post › n…

    Pelosi Shares Dire Warnings She Received on Trump’s Mental Health | The New Republic

  45. 45.

    columbusqueen

    I really hope Joe calls Speaker Moses & tells him to “kiss my ass” about resigning.

  46. 46.

    Jeffro

    @Steve LaBonne: He is going to be ranked very high by future Presidential historians.

    He will indeed!

    He’s already 14th out of 46.  (two notches ahead of Saint Ronnie, too!)

    trump is dead last, so you know that’s an accurate scale.  =)

    W needs to be ranked like 44th or 45th, imho.

  47. 47.

    suzanne

    @Scout211: I’m glad to see that David Whelan clearly called out Trump in that statement. Paul Whelan has made statements critical of Biden in the past.

  48. 48.

    Tony Jay

    @bbleh:

      Srsly, I wouldn’t be surprised if the Felon has already “truthed” something like this.

    I’ve found that you have to get in your “wouldn’t it be ridiculous and pretty enraging if that fucker and/or his media fluffers said something like (fill in the blanks with the worst thing you can think of)” takes pretty damned quick, because if you wait, then however terrible the words you want to put in their mouths, they will say something worse than it sooner rather than later.

  49. 49.

    FastEdD

    I am so proud of President Biden. Always doing the right thing. When asked about TFG and hostages, the President replied, “Why didn’t he get them released?” I usually don’t argue with wingnuts but I did a couple days ago, just to see what their bogus arguments were. We got to the subject of Afghanistan and how I was proud of the fact that we have no more troops there. Wingnut replies were along the lines of he didn’t do it the right way, tRump’s plan was something something yadda yadda and Biden didn’t follow it. You know, orange man was in office for four years, and he didn’t do it. I DGAF what his plan was, he didn’t do it. This was followed by them screaming obscenities at me and calling me stupid and a liar, and so on. The usual stuff why I don’t engage with them. Your guy has a record. Run on it and quit making excuses.

  54. 54.

    Bupalos

    It’s really interesting to think about why this happened now. And fascinating that a big part of this exchange is Russian dissidents. On Putin’s side I can see it as a further move towards fascism and maybe as a kind of prelude to trying to freeze the conflict in Ukraine. A pause that can give space for further militarization of Russian society. He’s running up lately against unsustainable Russian body counts in the slow grind towards genocide.

  55. 55.

    Barbara

    @JoyceH: Here is my total conjecture.  My understanding is that other nations had to agree to release Russian spies, and perhaps it was made clear to Putin that those nations would release the imprisoned Russians now or never.

  56. 56.

    BretH

    Cribbing from someone on the intertubes:

    For someone whose supporters claim they love because “he tells it like it is” TFG sure has a lot of spokespeople coming out to tell us what he really meant.

  58. 58.

    Old School

    @columbusqueen:

    I really hope Joe calls Speaker Moses & tells him to “kiss my ass” about resigning.

    While I’m sure it’s tempting, Biden needs the House to pass spending bills by the end of September.

  59. 59.

    Bupalos

    @WereBear: We need to ramp that up. One of the biggest benefits of Biden pulling out is it puts the too-old stuff squarely on Donold’s plate. And he’s definitely declined.

  60. 60.

    Scout211

    I am being petty here but cry wingnut tears, all you MAGA.  Your hero did not bring these prisoners home, President Biden did.

    On the highway that I drive regularly, a MAGA has posted a homemade sign in front of his house for the past few years that reads:

    BIDEN LEFT A VETERAN BEHIND

    So now he’ll post a sign that reads:

    THANK YOU BIDEN, FOR BRINGING A VETERAN HOME

    Yeah, I didn’t think so either.

  61. 61.

    bbleh

    @WereBear: @hueyplong: @Dorothy A. Winsor: @Bupalos: oh my!  shot across the bow indeed!  as well as deft use of a stiletto and I don’t mean the heel.

    This has always been an issue just waiting there like a wrapped Xmas gift, but it would appear they’re starting to untie the bow.  Timing is everything in politics, after all.

    Oh my.

  62. 62.

    FastEdD

    Hugging the girl, singing Happy Birthday to her, joking not to get serious with a man until she’s 30. What a truly decent person we have as President. It seems everything brings tears to my eyes lately.

  65. 65.

    Bupalos

    @Barbara: Putin probably cares a lot less about getting back particular Russians than he does about shipping out Russian dissidents and having them loudly confirmed as agents of the west. And signaling a kind of diplomatic engagement. It will be interesting to see if Russia pivots off this to push for freezing the conflict in Ukraine.

    Russia watchers like Mark Galleoti have said all along that there’s really no question people like Whelan and Gershkovich would be swapped at some point, it’s the whole reason they are taken hostage. The interesting thing is when and what that timing may signal. And in this case it’s really interesting that a bunch of Russian political prisoners are included here.

  67. 67.

    WereBear

    @bbleh:

    Remember when, every couple of months, there’d be an op-ed in the FNYT assuring us that President Trump had his moments but this selfless servant writing this was part of a Merry Band who made sure President Trump didn’t destroy the globe.

    I wasn’t reassured then and I’m not reassured now.

  68. 68.

    different-church-lady

    @WereBear: ​Right, but according to the NYTs, if a majority of people polled don’t care, that means he’s perfectly fit to be president.

  69. 69.

    Scout211

    (NBC)    President Biden and Vice President Harris will be at Joint Base Andrews in Maryland tonight to welcome the three released U.S. citizens when they arrive on U.S. soil, national security adviser Jake Sullivan said today during the White House Press briefing. The three are Wall Street Journal reporter Evan Gershkovich, former U.S. Marine Paul Whelan, and Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty journalist Alsu Kurmasheva.

    Vladimir Kara-Murza, a legal permanent resident, will be traveling to Germany, where his family will meet him after standing with Biden during his address earlier today, Sullivan said.

    “We expect him back here in the United States soon,” Sullivan said, where he will be able to see the president and others in the U.S. government.

  71. 71.

    Lyrebird

    @WaterGirl: Hey WG!  Thanks for the new thread and for the other stuff we don’t see happening…

    Request:  Could we have either a pet pic thread real soon or something NOT breathtakingly important that folks can happily disagree on utterly?  I know Major^4 is super busy and TaMara is taking her own well-deserved break, but maybe a cooking or cooking-adjacent thread,

    “Instant Pot Mac & Cheese: right or wrong?”

    “Who is your favorite YouTube/TikTok chef?”

    I know Omnes and Steve can fill half a thread on appropriate haberdashery, about which I know zilch.

     

    ETA: is it HumboldtBlue with the new kitteh?

  75. 75.

    jimmiraybob

    Former president Whiny Baby Needs a Time out and his sidekick Buttkissinbilly (2024!) seem to be having an episode over the Biden-Harris success.  Let the tears flow.

  78. 78.

    David 🐝KHive🐝 Koch

    @Gin & Tonic:  when Assange was released 5 weeks ago, I immediately thought it had to do with a prisoner exchange:

    David 🌈 ☘The Establishment☘🌈 Koch

    June 26, 2024 at 8:32 pm

    Any thoughts on Assange. Was this part of a below the surface exchange?

     

    It’s so obvious the Russian wanted their asset released but they also didn’t want direct ties.

  79. 79.

    Martin

    @NotMax: <in heavy Russian accent> “We will stream greatest shows from motherland. Stories of making country great. Cops arresting many black people. Superheros saving world from Ukrainian nazis. Women in kitchen making soup. You will like. Will make you very rich, can buy big dacha.”

  81. 81.

    Lyrebird

    @HumboldtBlue: DAYummm that is a fine ad about some of the most dedicated public servants in our nation and the former Liar in Chief.  Whew.

    Thank you, and I beg pardon for putting pressure on you above to supply more kitty photos.

  83. 83.

    Jackie

    Watching National Security Advisor Jake Sullivan choke up with emotion while updating the MSM got me all teary eyed, again. I’m so happy for ALL who were freed today, BUT especially for Paul Whelan, who for six years, had to watch other Americans taken captive after he was, get released before him.

  87. 87.

    Mike E

    @Leto: NO SPOILERS take: NBC coverage has been truly awful. I find the concern trolling quite tiresome and Fox Sports-esque.

    My enjoyment of the gymnastics hasn’t been diminished a bit, these women are all awesome no matter their nationality.

  88. 88.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @bbleh:

    I admit, this came as a surprise to me.  It’s a real testament to the Biden folks’ skills that this could happen even with the current levels of tension AND the US election.

    And nary a leak!

  90. 90.

    BR

    An intersection of politics and Olympics to consider — Biles just won gold. JD Vance crapped on her four years ago for dropping out.

  91. 91.

    Leto

    @Jackie: apparently Mark Fogel’s family just released a statement basically saying that after three long years, he’s being forgotten again. I absolutely understand their pain, and heart ache, but at the same time I know this administration is doing all they can to get as many people out. It goes back to the fact that we’re now having to work with our allies to get them to release Putin’s thugs/murderers because we’ve run out. And also the ire/fire needs to be directly focused on the Russians for doing this. Pariahs of the world.

  92. 92.

    Soprano2

    @NotMax: I think that’s the most amazing thing, evidently no one but them knew this was happening until they announced. That’s the hallmark of true professionals.

  95. 95.

    Bupalos

    @HumboldtBlue: It feels good. There’s a lot of good within it. But the final “us vs. them” framing is kind of senseless and isn’t actually constructive democratic politics.  To the extent that this really is a battle for democracy, it represents a kind of pyrrhic way of fighting that does more harm than good.

    The same ad with about 60% less Carl Schmidt there at the end, and I’d be down.

    Obviously not going to be a popular view here.

  96. 96.

    Another Scott

    @E.: The BBC radio reporting on “News Hour” had similar hand-wringing that it will encourage VVP (and others) to grab US people in hopes of getting something from us.

    As if that never happened before.

    [ groucho-roll-eyes.gif ]

    Biden’s team knows how to do this diplomacy stuff. It’s unfortunate that it’s necessary – it would be great if everyone got along and stayed within the rules – but it is.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  97. 97.

    hueyplong

    @HumboldtBlue: My immediate reaction is anger that I have gone nearly 8 years without seeing something like that ad every day.

    Narrator sounds like Peter Coyote.

  99. 99.

    Lyrebird

    @Martin: Ah, I am hesitant to click before I know whether your “chew on this” means “hey, you say you work with young adults, you will either laugh or cry here” or “hey, I followed up from that last thread just to tell you personally to GFY you are so wrong…”

    ETA: if I seem paranoid, it’s that I’m unemployed, and the past few weeks and few threads have been intense.

  100. 100.

    Martin

    @Mike E: Agreed. Normally I am binging the fuck out of the Olympics but the coverage and access – like why is it so fucking hard to find the thing to watch have taken all the joy out of it.

    For a while now I’ve been gravitating toward the Paralympics which is MUCH more enjoyable to watch. The jingoism is gone, the attempt to build up investment in the viewer is gone. The announcers aren’t always yelling. It’s just very straightforward, and everyone is happy no matter who wins.

  102. 102.

    Dave

    @BR:

    Dave

    That is a moment I will always remember if only because the negative response to her was disgusting, as if they own her (particularly problematic for the obvious reasons), and the people that genuinely seemed think they had the right to question her decision as if any athlete reaches that point and makes that decision for funsies will always baffle and disgust me just a little bit.

    And I’ll never understand it beyond the most surface level.  It hit hard partly because the reaction actually felt more authentic than a lot what makes it into outraged puke funnel. Just gross really

    Somehow I posted this under the wrong name; not that I’m a regular commentator more of a lurker but whoops.

  106. 106.

    M31

    Gymnastics is so insane.

    I think if I had a year to practice, and a good spotter, I could probably walk slowly across the balance beam and not fall.

    watching them do backflips, wow

  107. 107.

    Leto

    @Mike E: I guess I didn’t hear that? I don’t know what “concern trolling” in gymnastics sounds like. Pointing out that when they fell, or stepped out of bounds, was bad? Legs apart, which counts as a deduction? Being happy when the competitor nailed their routine? What do they need to change to make it more enjoyable?

  108. 108.

    Martin

    @Lyrebird: Well, ‘GFY’ is the kind of rhetorical counterargument I’ve gotten used to receiving from time to time here.

    Why on earth would you hesitate to click a link? Do you think I would link to child pornography or a video of someone getting beheaded?

  109. 109.

    Mike E

    @Martin: I’m a USA fanboy from way back and my Yugo heritage has me more than a tad salty for certain pro Russian states. That being said, I root hard for these young people and sit in awe of the skill level/determination on display. NBC could spend a minute on this but their sponsors come first, sadly.

  114. 114.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @schrodingers_cat:

    This is way off topic, but I wanted to ask you a question about Indian music, specifically if you know anything about a drone instrument called a Shruti Box. There’s a Wikipedia article on it which provided some info, but I’d be interested in any experience you may have had with it. If not, no worries — not a big deal. TIA.

  115. 115.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Jeffro:

    He’s already 14th out of 46.  (two notches ahead of Saint Ronnie, too!)

    I’m not enough of a historian to compare Presidents from vastly different times, but Joseph Robinette Biden continues to be the best President of my lifetime, and that includes Ike, JFK, Clinton, Obama, and (fuck) LBJ, who are all ranked ahead of him in this ranking.  So Biden belongs in the top 10.

    trump is dead last, so you know that’s an accurate scale.  =)

    Good!

  118. 118.

    WaterGirl

    @Lyrebird: I can figure something out.

    I haven’t been posting because I’ve been pretty upset about something myself, but that’s no reason for you guys to bear the brunt of that.

  120. 120.

    hells littlest angel

    @tom:The WSJ reports that Biden called the Slovenian prime minister to secure the pardon of two Russian spies they were holding to move the deal along. An hour later, Biden announced he was not running for president.

    Wow.

     

    We are so lucky to have him, one of the best presidents in our history. I am heartened that future president Harris has had him as a mentor for the last four years.

  121. 121.

    Martin

    @Mike E: Just as you wrote that, 145 notifications went off on my electronic devices to inform me of a thing that happened at the Olympics.

    I am increasingly of the view that they should just broadcast this stuff in realtime and it’s up to you if you want to watch the opening ceremony at 2AM or watch it on demand later. Last night my wife wanted to watch the womens 1500. Simple enough. We knew the event happened because we got 145 notifications informing us of the outcome earlier in the day, went on the app and couldn’t find the race because it hadn’t happened yet. We weren’t just delayed to prime time, we were delayed 3 more hours from east coast and had to wait for NBC to decide that the event was now something we were allowed to watch. What the fuck is this timeline we’re living in? Why does NBC pretend that it’s still 1992 and they can’t show us the thing we know has happened, because NBC sent me 5 notifications earlier in the day that hit happened, because they want to pretend that the internet doesn’t exist and we have to wait for the broadcast window to open. These people are bad at their job and they should all be fired.

  122. 122.

    catclub

    @LMM: Vlad knows which way the wind is blowing.

     

    umm, he sure missed a storm in Ukraine when he was expecting a vacation.

  123. 123.

    Leto

    @dc: oh, I’ve watched them too. Don’t understand a word of it though, so it’s lost on me. Also see that they primarily focus on Latin American athletes, which… given their demographic makes sense? I mean I guess when the London Olympics occurred, and we were living there, I should’ve bitched at the BBC for covering… British athletes. It’s such a strange critique, that the national carrier would focus on the national athletes in most circumstances. I simply don’t understand the critique.

  124. 124.

    Mike E

    @Leto: it’s more of an overall tone applied to  the events. Fox takes their pro USA jingoism up to a much higher level so I don’t mind NBC’s angle so much, it’s their audience after all. The concern is about finishing with hardware and a lot of events shouldn’t come with that extra twinge, or narrative, for a more politically loaded descriptor.

    Also: beefs. Fox plays up rivalries to the nth degree and I get stabby when other networks even hint at that… they should know better but oh well.

  126. 126.

    Nettoyeur

    So Putin trades two dozen innocent people his goons grabbed as hostages for two convicted murderers his govt paid to kill people Putin wanted dead. What a guy. And the GOP wants to hand Ukraine’s 40M people over to Putin’s army. How Christian of them…..

  127. 127.

    Archon

    This makes me think Putin has either decided Trump isn’t going to win or he can’t keep his army together in Ukraine until Jan 20

  131. 131.

    hueyplong

    @Bupalos: If the ad was made by Lincoln Project, then your reservation about it is easily explained by noting that it’s not actually done by our party or our candidate.

  132. 132.

    Hungry Joe

    @BR: It was infuriating the way some know-nothing goons dumped on Biles for dropping out. As I understand it, she was having a mental glitch — she couldn’t keep track of where, exactly, she was as her body soared and twisted and tumbled in space. Such glitches aren’t uncommon in athletes: Pro golfers suddenly can’t sink a three-foot putt, infielders can’t make an accurate throw to first, tennis players can’t get a serve in.

    The difference is, when one of those players loses control it costs them … strokes. Runs. Points. When it happens to a gymnast she can literally break her neck. So Biles stepped back until some circuitry in her brain reconfigured itself.

    And for that, Vance trashed her as being weak. Go walk a balance beam, you preening clown.

  133. 133.

    Leto

    @Martin:

    I am increasingly of the view that they should just broadcast this stuff in realtime

    They do. I watched it, but I don’t say anything in the threads because 1) I’m not an asshole, and 2) people are at work right now and will want to watch it tonight. If you’re not watching it in real time, I don’t know what to tell you other than get a better cable/streaming service. I have YouTubeTV and I get everything. If you don’t want to know when something happens, opt out of the notifications. This is basically the third Olympics like this, so at this point it’s “grandpa yelling at clouds”.

    These people are bad at their job and they should all be fired.

    Luuuuul

  134. 134.

    Lyrebird

    @Martin: Well, ‘GFY’ is the kind of rhetorical counterargument I’ve gotten used to receiving from time to time here.

    I’m sure you have indeed.  I don’t *think* you have received that from me personally, FWIW.

    And no I don’t think you would link to banned materials.

  135. 135.

    Soprano2

    @Scout211: They were really, really, really butthurt when he got Brittany Griner out. That’s probably what that sign is about. I doubt he’ll give Biden any credit at all.

  137. 137.

    Mike E

    @Martin: oh yeah, they’re bad enough posting video on YouTube with outright spoilers in the thumbnail when a lot of us would love to be pleasantly surprised with some upsets like US women’s rugby winning the bronze at the last second.

    Fortunately I can pull in over-the-air coverage of soccer on Telemundo (delightful) so I don’t get left behind without cable or subscription to peacock (which is a marketing push to snag peeps wanting to avoid the whole spoiler annoyance).

  138. 138.

    HumboldtBlue

    @Jackie:

    Huh, I don’t why that would happen, I’m not sure who produced the ad, no idea where to find it on another platform.

  139. 139.

    BR

    Also as someone pointed out, Biden’s freeing of the prisoners from Russia knocked Trump’s racism out of the news cycle. Trump only got a half day for his nonsense.

  140. 140.

    Jackie

    @Leto: Yeh, my heart hurts for Mark Fogel, too. I hope he’s freed as one of Joe’s last presidential achievements before he leaves office.

     

    @Leto:

  141. 141.

    Barbara

    @Mike E: I’m watching it live on Peacock, and depending which broadcast you watch you can get different announcers.  Maybe this is why the coverage is not bothering me as much.  When I tune into the “highlights” of daily coverage, I do get annoyed at the commentary.

  144. 144.

    Lyrebird

    @WaterGirl: Hey be good to yourself WG!

    And you probably saw already, but

    @HumboldtBlue: agreed to being volunteered!

    I have plenty of kitten photos and videos to share, just let me know where and when they are needed.

  145. 145.

    3Sice

    Trump’s net worth has plunged $900 million since Harris entered the race for the White House.

  146. 146.

    Leto

    @Mike E: Can you name an Olympic broadcast where the national TV carrier didn’t up the “jingoism” for the national team when a medal was in concern? Can you name another country who plays it straight neutral?

    Maybe this is just on the “big” events like gymnastics and swimming. We’ll probably see it in the track and field events too. I know for the BMX freestyle events, both men’s and women’s, the commentators were hyping up everyone. They were psyched for all the competitors, lauding them, and talking about what made each special. The men’s and women’s mountain biking? Same thing, especially as the on the women’s side it was a French lady who won, and it was the final race of her much lauded career. Men’s side? Last 2 1/2 laps were absolute fire, amazing competition, and it was presented that way. Archery? Tons of positive talking even when it’s a huge mismatch (early rounds).

    Idk, I’m watching a ton of events and I don’t exactly see it. Swimming is on atm, and they while they spoke about the American woman, they’re also discussing all the other women and their accomplishments and how good they are. /handsup

  149. 149.

    catclub

    @M31: Gymnastics is so insane.

    Indeed.  I have a strong bias in favor of sports you can play your whole life.  Football and gymnastics are both in the other category.

    Tennis, swimming, table tennis, cycling

  150. 150.

    Jackie

    @Old School: Thank you!😊 The audio is awesome, but coupled with the visual… A very poignant ad.

    I think this is one of the Lincoln Project’s best – so far.

  154. 154.

    Leto

    @Mike E: that’s a fair criticism, if you don’t like the on air talent. There’s certain football broadcasters who I don’t like. Their on air babbling sucks. Same with F1. I don’t like the in-pit commentator Ted Kravitz. Literally every time he pops on, first words out of my mouth are: SHUT UP, TED!

    If you only have OTA, then yeah, you’re definitely more limited in selection. It is what it is.

  155. 155.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Leto: I haven’t watched the coverage of the big ticket sports this year,  but there is a historical tendency to show thing like American gymnasts chalking their hands or getting a pep talk instead of showing top contenders from other countries competing.  I have no problem with announcers being homers, but I want to see the athletes doing the sport.

  156. 156.

    Martin

    @Leto: I guess the problem is I have been overreliant on Peacock. I have like 3 other NBC apps – that don’t seem to offer anything different (you’re making me wonder if I missed something there). I have NBC on sling which is just doing the time delayed thing with less control. I don’t have Youtube TV. Possibly there is a 5th NBC app I need to download.

    I can of course use a VPN to circumvent much of this, but that’s well on the other side of ‘fuck you NBC, I don’t want to watch the Olympics any longer you have ruined it for me’.

  157. 157.

    Quicksand

    @Martin: For $8 you can get a month of the Peacock streaming service.  [EDIT: I’m just now seeing that you already have it, so this can just be an FYI for others.]  They have every sport, every event, and a lot of things in both real-time and as on-demand replays (maybe everything?)  I haven’t seen any ads.

    This is, finally, a good way to watch the Olympics.  Having said that, I don’t know how long the delay is between a real-time event happening and when it becomes available as a replay.

    I watched a bunch of surfing this week, and generally each replay “show” on Peacock has been 8 heats, 30 minutes each, for about a four-hour program.  In between heats, and even in between sets when the waves aren’t cooperating, the announcers don’t just babble.  They’re quiet.  You can just watch the waves, and the  competitors jockeying for position, and all of the support infrastructure doing its thing.  It’s pretty neat.

  158. 158.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    I don’t care what they say, our President is still doing a damn good job at presiding.

  159. 159.

    Baud

    I have Peacock and use the NBC app to stream, mostly, but the app is not well designed. It’s actually easier to find stuff on YouTube.

  161. 161.

    laura

    President Biden just keeps on being a hard working public servant and I’ll forever be grateful to him. He deserves the respect of a grateful nation, but we’ll see what actually occurs.

    The hostages’ families must be over the moon- and I expect Brittany Griner is as well. I hope that those still detained are homeward bound soon. And I just wonder about that idiot family that upped sticks and moved to Russia late last year for a more decent and pure Christian life and promptly had their assets seized. I expect they may have some feelings right about now.

  163. 163.

    Leto

    @Omnes Omnibus: They still show the American athlete getting ready, but they also show the other top competitors routine. Are they showing 20th place? No. Are they showing the top 8? Yeah. Over here X did this floor routine. Y did this vault routine. This is moving them up for a medal, this will make it harder, etc etc etc.

    The critique I don’t get is that, “They’re not showing all the athletes!” Yeah, they’re not. They never have, never will. If people really want other countries POV, get a VPN, dial in to that country, knock yourself out. Plenty of people do that. Welcome to 21st century technology. What a time to be alive!

  166. 166.

    Leto

    @Martin: I get that; I have Peacock free via my ISP, but it’s a shit app and I just don’t use it outside of some specific TV shows. We have YouTube TV and it’s just been a dearth of coverage on everything. If it’s not an NBC affiliated channel, then there’s specific channels that have popped up for specific coverage. Maybe that’s something we can discuss post Olympics, basically a coverage review?

  167. 167.

    Jackie

    Nancy Mace inserts foot into mouth, again, apparently posting “Where’s Joe Biden been? Is he still working?” Just as the news broke about the hostages being released.

    This response was chef’s 😘:

    Podcaster and president of the activist group The New Agenda, Amy Siskind, replied to Mace’s post, “Are you working, Nancy? Cause Congress seems to have taken a 2-month vacation. Also check out the news about the American hostages released. Thank you President Biden!”

  168. 168.

    Mike E

    @Leto: I can sorta “find” alternative sources (*cough*streams*cough*) for live coverage so I pick and choose. I relish Telemundo futbol (and Univision for different league coverage) when given the choice to get exposed to MAGA idiots like Alexi Lalas. I look forward to Pres Harris’s RICO prosecution of Fox Empire, heh.

  169. 169.

    divF

    @Lyrebird:

    I know Omnes and Steve can fill half a thread on appropriate haberdashery

    Center vents or side vents ? Discerning dressers want to know.

  170. 170.

    hueyplong

    @Jackie: Actually, Mace is diligently working at her sole job, being a congressional troll. She’s just not doing it very well.

  172. 172.

    tam1MI

    @M31:

    Gymnastics is so insane.

    I think if I had a year to practice, and a good spotter, I could probably walk slowly across the balance beam and not fall.

    When I was in high school, my gym class had a unit where we could all learn gymnastics. I managed to fall off the balance beam while I was getting on the balance beam.

  173. 173.

    Baud

    The other complaint I have with NBC this year is that they seem to have amped up the number of commercials.

    I don’t know if this is true, but I heard many  years ago that NBC finances about half of the Olympics with the amount it pays for exclusive US rights.

  174. 174.

    Leto

    @Quicksand:

    Having said that, I don’t know how long the delay is between a real-time event happening and when it becomes available as a replay.

    Regarding swimming and gymnastics, the swimming events are all happening throughout the day. But they’re usually wrapping up by about 5-6pm EST because that’s 10-11pm France time. Then NBC has about 2 hours to package up the days events for their 8pm broadcast. Similar to the gymnastics. That happened between 1-3pm, so they have time to package, and be ready for 8pm.

    Now, I don’t know now how long until they have a package ready to go on the app. That’s ignorance on my part as I don’t use the app.

    They’re quiet. You can just watch the waves, and the competitors jockeying for position, and all of the support infrastructure doing its thing. It’s pretty neat.

    That’s really cool. Also maybe just a sport specific difference? I know that broadcasters are deathly afraid of on-air silence, so yeah.

  176. 176.

    Martin

    @Leto: To be fair, much of the problem is that the US has by far the largest team of athletes and has since the Soviet Union fell, so we are in more or less _all_ of the events, and so there are few opportunities to not have an American to root for, so there are few events where we can get a break from it.

    That the people attending the event feel predominantly American (they may simply be louder as most countries aren’t nearly as nationalistic as Americans) doesn’t help with that overall vibe. It feels like too much taken as a whole.

  179. 179.

    Leto

    @Mike E: Jesus, Alexi Lalas. Fucking Carrot Top of soccer. Yeah, I caught part of his rant when the US men went out of the COPA. It was basically the same thing as Ted: SHUT THE FUCK UP, LALA!

    @Baud: whole heartedly agree with this critique: TOO MANY COMMERCIALS! But it does have to do with the fact that they’re trying to recoup the money they paid for the exclusive rights.

    Related topic: NBA just redid their TV contract deal and Amazon won the rights there. Even though the NBA will receive massive, massive bucks, it’s being hailed as one of the worst deals made due to the fact that your local sports bars/hotel bars/random places aren’t going to subscribe to Amazon just to broadcast those games. I generally subscribe to that theory, but I guess we’ll see how it plays out over the next decade starting in the 2025-2026 season.

  180. 180.

    Jackie

    @BR: I don’t think the media’s done with TCFG’s racism display from yesterday.

    Now that the immediate adrenaline rush is over, the MSM’s back to speculating on Harris’s potential VP choice. TCFG news can’t be too far behind LOL🤞🏻

  181. 181.

    Martin

    @Leto: You are not alone in that assessment of Ted. I’ve mostly stopped watching when F1 decided that two parade laps in the rain constituted a race so they could avoid refunding thousand dollar tickets, but what I do catch now causes me to grit my teeth a bit with the commentary.

    I miss the Varsha, Matchett, and Hobbs days when they could openly dunk on Sauber for being a shit team. It was mean, but funny as hell.

  182. 182.

    gene108

    Paul Whelan and my brother went to the same Junior High at the same time.

    My brother saw the name, saw some background info about Paul being from Ann Arbor, checked his yearbooks, and saw the current pictures and made the realization.

    I don’t think they knew each other in Junior High though or not very well.

  184. 184.

    cmorenc

    @Sure Lurkalot: wrong!  Trump does care for others than himself – his daughter Ivanka because she is hot, and he can get away with a little grab-ass in pictures of himself side-by-side with his arm against her waist.

  185. 185.

    Martin

    @Baud: I’m not sure they have amped up the commercials or we’ve all gotten accustomed to not having commercials and the absurdity of what we tolerated for years is a little jarring.

    The transition in and out of the commercials is terrible though. Commercial will end and drop into the middle of a commentators sentence.

  187. 187.

    Baud

    @Martin:

    Commercial will end and drop into the middle of a commentators sentence

     
    Agreed. It feels like they have AI handling the cuts to commercials.

  188. 188.

    gene108

    @Leto:

    Maybe this is just on the “big” events like gymnastics and swimming.

    It’d be interesting to compare the coverage of USA’s men’s and women’s gymnastics teams at the Olympics, as men’s gymnastics is, at best, an after thought for most Americans.

  191. 191.

    frog

    @Bupalos:

     

    it puts the too-old stuff squarely on Donold’s plate.

    While “DonOLD” is accurate it is a bit subtle and sounds forced. “Old Don” has a very clear, in your face, meaning.

  194. 194.

    David 🐝KHive🐝 Koch

    @Baud: ​ private internet access. It lets me download torrents, which some VPNs wont, and they have a great price, $79 for 39 months.​

  195. 195.

    HumboldtBlue

    @hueyplong:

    That’s a famous picture of Mexican pop superstar Selena Quintanilla, who in the early 90s was a huge rising star. Her career was cut short, however, by the woman seen standing to her right, a woman who claimed she was Selena’s biggest fan, Yolanda Saldivar. She then murdered Selena and was sentenced to life in prison.

  197. 197.

    Leto

    @Martin: Dude, that race at Spa in the downpour? I totally agree they shouldn’t have done the two laps, that they should’ve just held the race the next day. I’m all for wet weather racing, but that was too much. They’d had some recent wrecks coming up the hill, in the lower 2/3 series, that were absolutely brutal. I think one kid died? Just have the race the next day. FIA is right there with FIFA and the Olympic Committee.

    @gene108: same with men’s and women’s soccer. Women absolutely carrying 99% of the load/coverage with this. But it’s also the Olympic effect. We get heavily invested in a sport on a 4 year cycle. You start to get a ramp up with like the US qualifying event which is right before this, but past that? *crickets

  199. 199.

    Martin

    @Raven: Yeah, some events are fine. I adore the French fans cheering in sync with the Butterfly swimmer.

    The over focus on certain athletes gets a little out of hand. I adore Biles, but my wife commented that we’ve watched all of the women’s gymnastics events so far and she’s not sure the commentators have said Hezly Rivera’s name yet, so my wife has stopped using her name and now refers to her as ‘The Other One’.

  200. 200.

    KatKapCC

    @lamh47: It’s a good line, but I worry it’s gonna form another attack on his cognition, because only one of the four big names mentioned was arrested while Trump was in office, as far as I’ve read. And we know Republicans don’t actually give a damn about freeing hostages and will use anything and everything against Biden.

  203. 203.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @schrodingers_cat:

    It is a type of harmonium. Until a few days ago, I had never heard of a Shruti Box either, so didn’t know if it was a common term in India, or parts of India.

  204. 204.

    Martin

    @Leto: I was supposed to be at Spa 2021, but our trip was canceled due to Covid, and I would have been $2K deep at least just for that day. I was pissed and stopped watching, but decided to tune in for the last race to see how the WDC turned out for my man Hamilton. Well, that was a BIG fucking mistake. LOL.

    Yeah, a F2 driver died the next year. They’ve made changes, but I’m not sure it’s sufficient. F1 has had to reschedule races before and they should have done so here, but handing out points and refusing to give refunds in a race where nobody was allowed to pass is fucking bullshit. And I think Max is the whiniest most entitled little fucker, and fucking hate whiny people, so there’s not been much incentive for me to return, and I can’t imagine I will.

    I like sports, but I don’t like how entertainment has taken priority over sport. That’s usually when I check out. I’d rather watch the local Div 2 college team play an earnest game than all of this.

  206. 206.

    Raoul Paste

    I saw a comment on another blog saying that they better reserve 30 minutes or more for the standing ovation Biden will get at the Democratic convention.

    And then added that, no matter how long the applause,  it wouldn’t be long enough

  207. 207.

    Martin

    @raven: Well, it’s kind of a shame she missed a shot at that, but I can only imagine the ranking board at NBC HQ where they figure out which athletes and sports to relegate to obscurity to make time to cover Clark.

    Meanwhile my daughter blasts past all of their efforts in order to cue up South Korean pistol shooting.

  208. 208.

    raven

    @Martin: There are a lot of Georgia football fans really pissed that they scheduled the game in Austin the weekend of the F1 race. Try to get a room!

  212. 212.

    Bill Arnold

    @BretH:

    TFG sure has a lot of spokespeople coming out to tell us what he really meant.

    It’s particularly funny when different Trump-explainers confidently make different “what Trump meant” assertions.

  213. 213.

    KrackenJack

    @Baud: Like David KHive, I use PIA. I also have a Private IP from them that solves some problems with sites that don’t like VPNs. They do block access to some email services to avoid spam generation. (You’ll get a time out from your email client.) You can ask them to whitelist those or, I suspect, do some configuration to have the client software bypass the VPN. I haven’t done that even though my email host just went back on the blacklist after 4 years.

  215. 215.

    Other MJS

    @Leto:

    Biden: Why didn’t he?

    That’s pretty quick-witted by any measure. Don’t tell me he read it off a teleprompter.

  217. 217.

    hueyplong

    @Geminid: Well, being a troll is precisely how you position yourself to move up in the GOP, so we’re saying the same thing.

  218. 218.

    sab

    My husband is firmly in the ” we threw the best president of my lifetime under the bus” camp and he is not coming back until November when he votes.

    I was a milder version of the same. Sad but I like Kamala. But I still kind of agree.

    After this latest I am all over the place. Only Biden could have done this. Elders function because contacts and they do have contacts.

    ETA Real people got released? Actually?

  220. 220.

    sab

    While Joe Biden wasn’t doing his job campaigning he was doing his job presidenting. Americans do stupid or not stupid (actual reporting) jobs all over the world. They hope their gov has their back. This time it did. Took a while but that wasn’t Bidens fault. Often we don’t.

  221. 221.

    Other MJS

    @Bill Arnold:

    It’s particularly funny when different Trump-explainers confidently make different “what Trump meant” assertions.

    It’s often perfectly clear what he meant and they’re flailing for some way to un-mean it.

  223. 223.

    Kayla Rudbek

    @Lyrebird: for respite, we could always go with the standard knitting and/or crocheting argument of “wool versus acrylic” or the traditional bicycle argument of “700cc versus 27” tires”. Or the Oxford comma or “two spaces after a period” arguments.

    My traditional family argument about “how to properly tie knots” works better with visual and physical props, in my opinion. And if the boat comes undone and drifts off from the dock, the last person who tied the boat up loses the argument.

  226. 226.

    Ruckus

    @Lapassionara:

    I used to be an employer.

    That is how I look at being a citizen in our country. We hire people to do the work of the country we all own, including those that we select for hire. We hopefully look at them as the best people to do the best job, but like 99% of employees the pool of possible employees is made up of the people that want the job and apply for it. We as the board of voters hold possible board meetings and while remote we can often suggest questions to ask, clarifying an issue that we feel is important. And then we vote, like members of any other board and an employee is selected. Now of course this isn’t any employee, it is the president of the corporation, and a back up plus a few other employees. Of course our board is all citizens over 18, not in jail on a felony and many states allow a felon who has paid their debt to society can vote, so the board meeting is a bit of a pain in the butt but only happens every 4 yrs and we do not all have to fit into the same building or at the same exact time to vote and can do it by mail. And there are enough of us that the payroll isn’t bad and our portion is a value based upon our pay. Not a bad system.

  227. 227.

    Lyrebird

    @Kayla Rudbek: Excellent! :-) I think there have been multiple Oxford comma debates already, it’s a blog tradition!

    But I’d rather see people’s fiber arts, of course.

Comments are closed.