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You are here: Home / Foreign Affairs / Foreign Affairs Open Thread: Putin on the Fritz

Foreign Affairs Open Thread: Putin on the Fritz

by Anne Laurie|  August 16, 20244:55 pm| 69 Comments

This post is in: Foreign Affairs, Open Threads, Russia

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Putin - STOCKPILE

(Walt Handelsman via GoComics.com)

 

Putin is days away from saying that he’s going to build a wall and make Ukraine pay for it. https://t.co/SLH3PMcv1i

— Hal Sparks (@HalSparks) August 13, 2024

pic.twitter.com/yoUh8GMWEF

— Andrew (@sranysovok) August 15, 2024

What Ukraine’s Kursk Incursion Means for the Long War – Puck https://t.co/W7pr3hkukL

— Michael Huggins (@MichaelHugg2591) August 15, 2024

But seriously… Russian immigrant Julia Ioffe, at Puck this Tuesday, on “Ukraine’s Guns of August“:

… The blitz recalled Yevgeny Prigozhin’s “March of Fairness” in June 2023, when his mercenary Wagner troops took over Rostov, the southern Russian city from which much of the war against Ukraine was being run, and made it halfway to Moscow without Russian government troops putting up much of a fight. (Prigozhin, you’ll remember, conveniently died in a plane crash last August, most likely after a bomb exploded on board.) So it was shocking to see, this time around, how little the Kremlin and the Ministry of Defense seem to have learned from that caper, and how much arrogance seems to underlie some of the decisions to fortify—or not fortify—the Russia-Ukraine border.

A week later, the situation is still very much in flux, with neither the Russian or Ukrainian sides saying too much about it. (What they have said, though, is fairly predictable: glee from the latter and fury from the former.) Ukrainian forces now control somewhere shy of 300 square miles of Russian territory. But from everything I’ve read and heard, no one seems to know what the plan is—or if a plan even exists. On some level, it seems that this is a new chapter in the same book we’ve been reading since February 2022: the Ukrainian military, ever the underdog, does something daring that surprises and dazzles the West and looks amazing on social media; the Russian military is caught off guard and unprepared, which leads to an embarrassing loss; but the law of large numbers gradually catches up, Russia learns from its mistakes, adjusts, and begins to overwhelm Ukraine once again through sheer numerical advantage.

Are we seeing the same thing play out in Kursk? Or is this time different? Will it help Ukraine change the trajectory of the war, or even the narrative? I called my friend Michael Kofman, a military analyst with the Carnegie Endowment (who also happens to have been born in Kyiv), to find out. Our conversation, which I hope you enjoy, has been edited for length and clarity…

What do you think were the objectives of the push into Kursk?
My own sense of it is that Ukraine likely hopes to raise its troops’ morale and to change both internal and external perceptions of the war by conducting a daring and bold offensive of this kind into Russia. At the very least, it would help change the narrative—and it clearly has, at least for a few weeks—of what has so far been an overall negative trajectory for the war over the past year.

I suspect the actual objective of this operation is to hold some amount of territory in Kherson and hope to trade that for territory Russia is currently occupying—for example, the buffer zone they’ve taken in Kharkiv. Or alternatively, at the bare minimum, to entrench and use this buffer in order to pull in Russian forces from Kharkiv and other parts of the front inside Ukraine. Russian political leadership is clearly going to be furious over the prospect of a prolonged occupation of Russian territory, which ideally will divert some significant percentage of the Russian forces currently pressing the Ukrainian military along the front in Donetsk. The idea here, I think, is to create perhaps a larger but more successful version of the battle in Krynky—when Ukrainian forces crossed the river and held this lodgment for quite a long time in Kherson—a forced, attritional battle…

A lot of Ukraine's success here derives from a Potemkin normalcy Putin has cultivated since the war's start. No defense in depth fortifications even in border areas. Everything is fine. NATO will surrender soon. Go shopping.

Wagner should have been the wake up call. And yet… https://t.co/shSVuqLNJq

— zeddy (@Zeddary) August 14, 2024

Putin on the Fritz - STOCKPILE

(Jeff Danziger via GoComics.com)
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Reader Interactions

69Comments

  1. 1.

    schrodingers_cat

    August 16, 2024 at 4:58 pm

    The forces of autocracy while not completely defeated have been on the backfoot lately. Putin seems to be scrambling. In India BJP heads a minority government, the Tories lost badly, may that trend continue in November

  2. 2.

    Westyny

    August 16, 2024 at 5:00 pm

    Bridges destroyed and more Russian conscripts surrounded: https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2024/8/16/2263512/-Russian-stuff-blowing-up-Ukraine-blows-up-a-key-bridge-in-Kursk?pm_campaign=front_page&pm_source=trending&pm_medium=web

    I like it.

  3. 3.

    hells littlest angel

    August 16, 2024 at 5:10 pm

    “Or do they not care about the dead littering the streets when they’re Russian bodies?”

     

    Uh, Vlad, you’d better sit down …

  4. 4.

    Parfigliano

    August 16, 2024 at 5:12 pm

    I dont care about dead russian troops.

  5. 5.

    Marleedog

    August 16, 2024 at 5:14 pm

    To put this somewhat into perspective,  300 sq mi is about 1/5 the area of Rhode Island.

  6. 6.

    hitchhiker

    August 16, 2024 at 5:15 pm

    Last night I finally watched the documentary 20 Days in Mariupol. It’s hard to think that there are sitting members of the US Congress who openly support Vladimir Putin, but that is where we are.

  7. 7.

    SpaceUnit

    August 16, 2024 at 5:15 pm

    That statement by Putin would be laughable if I wasn’t worried that he was establishing a pretense for using nukes.

  8. 8.

    Omnes Omnibus

    August 16, 2024 at 5:15 pm

    To paraphrase Basil Fawlty, “You started it.  You invaded Ukraine.”

  9. 9.

    Another Scott

    August 16, 2024 at 5:16 pm

    Interesting stuff. Ukraine is continuing to make VVP look like a petulant gangster rather than head of a modern nation with a professional military.

    Made me look. RUSI.org (from September 2023):

    There are important questions about what Prigozhin’s demise means for the future of loyal Wagnerites currently residing in Belarus; about the implications for Wagner’s activities abroad, particularly in Africa; and about what messaging this may have for any others in Prigozhin’s position.

    But whether the Kremlin is ultimately responsible for Prigozhin’s demise or not, the most pressing question for President Vladimir Putin himself will be whether these events have been sufficient to quash any of the after-effects of Prigozhin’s short-lived rebellion two months ago, and whether this will have any serious implications for the upcoming election cycle.

    […]

    First, since Prigozhin’s mutiny, the Kremlin has taken restrictive steps to prevent a similar recurrence, and has boosted internal security in a number of specific ways. In a direct response to the rebellion, one of the most visible of these was to give regional governors the authority to establish their own private military companies, designed to counter domestic uprisings. These paramilitary units would have a role not only in defending Russia’s borders – as beleaguered border regions such as southern Belgorod have come under increasing attack from insurgent anti-Kremlin groups in recent months – but also from internal dissent. This suggests that Moscow is taking seriously the idea that figures similar to Prigozhin might appear, and that the Kremlin needs to be prepared.

    Second, it was revealing that in the wake of Prigozhin’s death, one of the Kremlin’s first actions was to call the Rosgvardia (National Guard) back from its holidays in Rostov where the rebellion first occurred, and to put all security services on high alert. It was evident that the Kremlin expected some sort of backlash to his death, although none has yet come.

    […]

    So far, it doesn’t look like much of the military, or the National Guard, or the local PMCs, have much interest in putting up a fight against Ukraine in Kursk. Certainly not to the standards one would expect from the “2nd best military in the world”.

    [recycled joke] Russia claims to be the 2nd best military in the world, but it looks like they’re the 2nd best military in Russia. [/recycled joke]

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  10. 10.

    TBone

    August 16, 2024 at 5:16 pm

    I think it was a brilliant move.  I hope Putin’s feet of clay continue to crumble, along with those of all of our dictator-wannabe and autocratic enemies.

  11. 11.

    BR

    August 16, 2024 at 5:17 pm

    Speaking of Russia, I don’t know if you all saw the remarkable interaction Harris had with the WSJ reporter when he returned from Russia. Worth sharing with friends on social media.

    https://media.mas.to/media_attachments/files/112/892/963/263/099/308/original/4d34547dd80474b1.mp4

  12. 12.

    Omnes Omnibus

    August 16, 2024 at 5:18 pm

    @SpaceUnit: Adam Silverman seems to disagree.

  13. 13.

    TBone

    August 16, 2024 at 5:19 pm

    @Another Scott: Pooty recently put the head FSB guy in charge, didn’t he?  Non-military dude.  Telling.

  14. 14.

    Mr. Bemused Senior

    August 16, 2024 at 5:20 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus: ssshhh!  Don’t mention the war.

  15. 15.

    Baud

    August 16, 2024 at 5:20 pm

    Annex Russia.

  16. 16.

    JML

    August 16, 2024 at 5:29 pm

    There’s a reality that a stalemate as is very much favors Putin, who has more resources and a lot of the land that he actually wanted in the first place (not entirely, but it’s substantial) under something resembling Russian control. Getting to a cease-fire and drawing new borders as is would have been a win for him…but not so much if he’s actually lost Russian territory.

    I’m not sure how this plays out, but making these kinds of strikes might have more strategic value than tactical for Ukraine if it changes the political landscape around somehow freezing things “as is” or doing something to make this war more of a reality for more of the Russian people. At what point will civil unrest grow in Russia? (can it?)

    I don’t approve of assassination but if anyone deserves it it’s Putin…

  17. 17.

    TBone

    August 16, 2024 at 5:37 pm

    I see that Comer announced an investigation into Tim Walz’s “connection to the Chinese Communist Party” today 🙄.  I wish him all the success of his previous investigations.

  18. 18.

    hueyplong

    August 16, 2024 at 5:41 pm

    @TBone: Comer does a lot of announcing.

    He’s a malignant Rosanne Rosanadana.

  19. 19.

    Geminid

    August 16, 2024 at 5:41 pm

    @Another Scott: WTOP’s* national security  reporter  J.J. Green said Putin has now put Russia’s FSB security agency  in charge of Kursk Oblast operations because he has lost faith in the Russian  Army and doesn’t think it can do the  job.

    * I get DC’s all-news WTOP on their Fredericksburg  transimitter, 107.7 FM. A good news source.

  20. 20.

    Ken

    August 16, 2024 at 5:42 pm

    @Another Scott: Ukraine is continuing to make VVP look like a petulant gangster

    Uh, Another Scott, you’d better sit down …

    (Shamelessly stealing from hells littlest angel up there.)

  21. 21.

    matt

    August 16, 2024 at 5:42 pm

    Putin’s sad that nobody is condemning Ukraine for fighting back and seizing Russian land? Is he so far up his own asshole that he’s forgotten what human beings are like?

  22. 22.

    matt

    August 16, 2024 at 5:43 pm

    @hitchhiker: I mean, loathsome people like Marge Greene and Matt Gaetz are in Congress. I’m surprised none of them has been found with 55 gallon drums full of corpses in their basement.

  23. 23.

    Shalimar

    August 16, 2024 at 5:43 pm

    I suspect the Ukrainians have an idea of what they want to happen next.  No one including the Ukrainians thought about invading Kursk until it turned out they had been planning an operation for months.

  24. 24.

    TBone

    August 16, 2024 at 5:44 pm

    @hueyplong: I remember when one of their “witnesses” was indicted for being a Chinese spy 😆

    https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/gop-house-informant-indicted-allegations-was-agent-china-rcna93633

    Oh and “malignant Roseann Roseannadanna” is *chef’s kiss

  25. 25.

    Shalimar

    August 16, 2024 at 5:45 pm

    @matt: There are no basements where Gaetz lives. water table is too high.  He keeps his corpses in the storage shed out back.

  26. 26.

    Ken

    August 16, 2024 at 5:48 pm

    @Shalimar: Don’t be silly, Gaetz has alligators to take care of that.

  27. 27.

    mrmoshpotato

    August 16, 2024 at 5:50 pm

    @matt: Putin doesn’t see Ukrainians as human beings.

  28. 28.

    TBone

    August 16, 2024 at 5:52 pm

    @mrmoshpotato: hmmm, that’s funny cuz that’s how I see Pooty.  Not a single shred of humanity or decency.

  29. 29.

    Chet Murthy

    August 16, 2024 at 5:53 pm

    @mrmoshpotato: I doubt he sees the average Russian as a human being either.  Which doesn’t change the gravity of what you wrote: I agree completely with you.

  30. 30.

    ColoradoGuy

    August 16, 2024 at 5:53 pm

    @mrmoshpotato: Nor Russians.

  31. 31.

    AWJ

    August 16, 2024 at 5:54 pm

    @TBone: There’s a history going back to the reign of Ivan the Terrible of Russia attempting to use secret policemen as soldiers, with catastrophic results.

  32. 32.

    Shalimar

    August 16, 2024 at 5:55 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus: We all hope Adam is right about nukes.

  33. 33.

    Shalimar

    August 16, 2024 at 5:57 pm

    @Ken: I was a few feet from a young 4-foot alligator last night.  Gaetz does not have the fortitude to raise alligators.  They’re very scary.

  34. 34.

    SatanicPanic

    August 16, 2024 at 5:58 pm

    @Parfigliano: I feel bad for some Russian soldiers, I bet imagine lots of them don’t want to be fighting in Ukraine

  35. 35.

    mrmoshpotato

    August 16, 2024 at 6:00 pm

    @TBone: You’re saying something different.

  36. 36.

    trollhattan

    August 16, 2024 at 6:02 pm

    Ukraine: hey Russia, you taught us everything about invading a neighboring nation. So we took all your lessons and then did the opposite.

  37. 37.

    mrmoshpotato

    August 16, 2024 at 6:02 pm

    @Chet Murthy:

    @ColoradoGuy: True, given how many Russians he’s sent to uselessly fight Ukrainians.

  38. 38.

    mrmoshpotato

    August 16, 2024 at 6:04 pm

    @Shalimar: It wasn’t cute enough to want to hug? 😁

  39. 39.

    Shalimar

    August 16, 2024 at 6:04 pm

    @SatanicPanic: The average age of Russians killed in Ukraine is apparently 39.  That sounds a lot like the only people signing up for the fighting are older men resigned to dying so their families can get the death payoffs.

  40. 40.

    Ihop

    August 16, 2024 at 6:04 pm

    I am such an infrequent commenter, but  i want it known that it gives me no joy to see rock solid confirmation that pooty-poot is an indicted whiny ass kitty baby.

  41. 41.

    Shalimar

    August 16, 2024 at 6:05 pm

    @mrmoshpotato: I do have a picture of a dumbass hugging it (it’s mouth was tied with rope).  I did not want to give it a hug.  I am not an idiot.

  42. 42.

    hueyplong

    August 16, 2024 at 6:06 pm

    @Shalimar: Curious whether the source for that number rates this the oldest average age for casualties in any conflict.

  43. 43.

    SatanicPanic

    August 16, 2024 at 6:08 pm

    @Shalimar: damn, that’s grim.

  44. 44.

    zhena gogolia

    August 16, 2024 at 6:09 pm

    @Shalimar: You think people are going voluntarily?

  45. 45.

    Ihop

    August 16, 2024 at 6:09 pm

    I am such an infrequent commenter, but I wish it known it gives me no joy that pooty-poot is such an indicted whiny ass titty baby.

  46. 46.

    Shalimar

    August 16, 2024 at 6:11 pm

    @hueyplong: I am curious too.  I have never heard of anything like that before.  Maybe Silverman would know.

  47. 47.

    Chet Murthy

    August 16, 2024 at 6:12 pm

    @zhena gogolia: All the commentators I’ve watched (e.g. Anders Puck Nielsen, Mark Galeotti) say that Putin isn’t making the mistake of an involuntary mobilization: he’s using incentives (usu money) to get volunteers.  And sure, also prisoner battalions, which we wouldn’t call voluntary.  Though Galeotti thinks that pretty soon Putin’s gonna have to call for another involuntary mobilization, b/c of this Kursk incursion.

  48. 48.

    Shalimar

    August 16, 2024 at 6:12 pm

    @zhena gogolia: I am sure you have read a lot more on this than I have.  My understanding is that conscripts can’t be deployed outside of Russia, so the units fighting in Ukraine are mostly people who have signed up for it.

  49. 49.

    Chet Murthy

    August 16, 2024 at 6:15 pm

    @Shalimar: Galeotti talked about this recently.  He explained that early on in the war, conscripts were sent over the border into Ukraine, and the outcry from mothers was fierce: so fierce that Putin pretty much had to promise that it wouldn’t happen again, and he’s apparently pretty much abided by that promise.

    Though, I’ve read of cases (how many?  no idea) of conscripts being forced to sign contracts.

  50. 50.

    hueyplong

    August 16, 2024 at 6:18 pm

    @Shalimar: If you’re right, they’d be wise to check out how “Russia” is defined.

  51. 51.

    mrmoshpotato

    August 16, 2024 at 6:21 pm

    @Shalimar: What a dumbass!

  52. 52.

    Gvgg something illeagle

    August 16, 2024 at 6:25 pm

    I had guessed that Ukraine meant to destroy specific strategic targets, possibly that were going to be used against them soon. I haven’t seen any confirmation so I am probably wrong. I would be, gathering military supplies and destroying armaments they can’t use plus factory’s and supply depots of arms and soldier supplies. You know, military targets like Russia can’t be bothered to do, but which actually help with a real war effort. Cutting roads and train tracks would also be useful, and ports.

  53. 53.

    zhena gogolia

    August 16, 2024 at 6:29 pm

    @Shalimar: Well . . . I think pressure is being applied rather blatantly in places like Buryatiya.

  54. 54.

    sdhays

    August 16, 2024 at 6:38 pm

    @Shalimar: Laws don’t really work in Russia, but anyway, according to Russia,  Crimea, Donetsk, and Kherson ARE Russia, for legal purposes.

  55. 55.

    TBone

    August 16, 2024 at 6:42 pm

    @AWJ: 👍

  56. 56.

    TBone

    August 16, 2024 at 6:48 pm

    @mrmoshpotato: well that’s as close as I could get using the English language.

  57. 57.

    mrmoshpotato

    August 16, 2024 at 6:51 pm

    @TBone: Seeing someone as not having a shred of humanity is different from seeing them as not human.

  58. 58.

    DesertFriar

    August 16, 2024 at 7:00 pm

    @Marleedog: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tAjSLM6_sis

    Bill Harley “The Size Of The State of Rhode Island”

  59. 59.

    Jay

    August 16, 2024 at 7:17 pm

    1/ Russia is reportedly creating ‘Kursk battalions’ of newly enlisted conscripts, many of whom are barely trained teenagers paid only $0.75 a day, are being sent to Kursk to fight the Ukrainian incursion. Some are being forced to sign contracts to fight at the front lines. ⬇️

    https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1824347862706090202.html

  60. 60.

    Ksmiami

    August 16, 2024 at 7:20 pm

    @Parfigliano: except they’re aren’t enough of them…

  61. 61.

    Poe Larity

    August 16, 2024 at 7:32 pm

    Maybe JD can have a second life preaching to Russians to have more babies.

  62. 62.

    satby

    August 16, 2024 at 7:37 pm

    Quick update on the GFM for Buddy cat, with the deepest appreciation for all the support today 💗:

    He’s doing well, surgery was a success and probably a complete cure. It turned out to be a mechanical obstruction from something he ate (hair, fur, string?) that got hung up in his gut and caused a slow growing blockage. He doesn’t have megacolon after all. He is staying in the hospital until Monday to get IV antibiotics to prevent peritonitis.

    I can’t express how grateful I am (and he is too, though he doesn’t know why, just that it’s much better, especially with good painkillers!) Thank you, thank you!

  63. 63.

    TBone

    August 16, 2024 at 7:40 pm

    @mrmoshpotato: please do not explain my language to me.  I did not stoop to publicly calling him or describing him as inhuman because I am not a Nazi.  But I can think it for myself in this instance.

    I know the difference.

  64. 64.

    TBone

    August 16, 2024 at 7:41 pm

    @satby: awwww, that’s wonderful!  I adore happy endings! 💜😍

  65. 65.

    Another Scott

    August 16, 2024 at 8:45 pm

    @satby: Excellent news.  Thanks for the update!

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  66. 66.

    Subsole

    August 16, 2024 at 9:24 pm

     

     

    @Shalimar:

    If not friend, then why it smile so big and friendlike?

  67. 67.

    Subsole

    August 16, 2024 at 9:25 pm

    @Shalimar:

    “Signing up.”

    Yeah. I guess we can call “too slow to outrun the press-gang” that…

  68. 68.

    Quaker in a Basement

    August 16, 2024 at 10:15 pm

    Vlad must have learned by now that it’s a bad look to whine about the consequences of your own fuckups.

  69. 69.

    Ruckus

    August 17, 2024 at 3:01 am

    @matt:

    Is he so far up his own asshole that he’s forgotten what human beings are like?

    I’d say yes, Putin is so far up his own ass that he can actually see daylight. And his neck hurts from being stretched that far.

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