Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

“Everybody’s entitled to be an idiot.”

I did not have this on my fuck 2022 bingo card.

Some judge needs to shut this circus down soon.

“woke” is the new caravan.

Republicans do not pay their debts.

Never entrust democracy to any process that requires Republicans to act in good faith.

You don’t get rid of your umbrella while it’s still raining.

It looks like winning debates is a black job!

Somebody needs to explain to DeSantis that nobody needs to do anything to make him look bad.

Fight them, without becoming them!

He wakes up lying, and he lies all day.

Fight for a just cause, love your fellow man, live a good life.

We cannot abandon the truth and remain a free nation.

If senate republicans had any shame, they’d die of it.

If you’re looking for someone who’s young and athletic, go watch a fucking movie.

Republicans would impeach Biden if he bit into a whole Kit Kat rather than breaking the sections apart.

Be a traveling stable for those who can’t find room at the inn.

Consistently wrong since 2002

Putin must be throwing ketchup at the walls.

Republicans: The threats are dire, but my tickets are non-refundable!

GOP baffled that ‘we don’t care if you die’ is not a winning slogan.

The frogs are rarely mistaken.

if you can’t see it, then you are useless in the fight to stop it.

You are here: Home / Elections 2024 / Late Night Open Thread: That Lingering Smell of Burnt Toast

Late Night Open Thread: That Lingering Smell of Burnt Toast

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Remember when your middle-school history textbook tried to get you interested in the ‘colorful’ figures of the original Gilded Age bust-out, cartoon characters like John D Rockefeller and Nominally President Harding? Someday historians — assuming there are still historians — will treat Musk and TFG’s “interview” the same way…

Best example of Trump’s slurring I’ve heard: “Sthrikehh”, at the 9second mark:


this conversation is first ballot inner circle dunning-kruger hall of fame

[image or embed]

— not an art thief (@famousartthief.bsky.social) Aug 12, 2024 at 10:03 PM

… Elon: “You need [a president] that evil dictators are afraid of.”

Trump: “I have a great relationship with Putin.”

Elon: *continues to talk about how world security requires a U.S. president that scares vicious dictators*

Trump: “I know every one of them. Putin, Xi, KJU… They’re at the top of their game. They love their countries.”

Trump: “[Biden] shaid something that was sho sthupid… It’sth sho shad.”…

Trump: The EU is taking advantage of us. We protect them with NATO, and they won’t even let you sell a car to Europe.

Elon, who sells cars in Europe: *silence*

Elon: “It would be impossible to have a conversation with Harris or Biden, it’s like talking to an NPC.”

Trump: “I get along with KJU, we had dinner. … We had a great relationship, he likes me. He’s the boss over there.”..

DDOStoßlegende
[image or embed]

— Alex Cruikshanks (@alexsaysstuff.bsky.social) Aug 12, 2024 at 8:46 PM

That Lingering Smell of Burnt Toast - STOCKPILE

(Nick Anderson via GoComics.com)

Reader Interactions

159Comments

  2. 2.

    piratedan

    this would be incredibly funny, if Elon didn’t control Starlink and Space X or Trump, for all we know, still isn’t trying to peddle state secrets for bank to pay his lawyers.

    so much for the “meritocracy”, because if one existed, these fuckers would be digging ditches.

  3. 3.

    piratedan

    @Rathskeller: my understanding via various sources on BlueSky is that they are.

     

    I know, I thought wearing sanitary pads on their ears in solidarity was a new low, but there appears to be no level of casual cruelty that is beyond them.

  4. 4.

    Villago Delenda Est

    Digging ditches takes a bit of skill.  Then again, cleaning public restrooms takes some skill.  Is there something they could do that doesn’t require any skill at all, because they have none to offer.

  7. 7.

    Phylllis

    @Villago Delenda Est: No on both activities. Digging ditches requires understanding how trenches work and how to reinforce them so you don’t get buried in one. Cleaning bathrooms includes understanding the safety data sheets supplied with the chemicals you’re using or how to properly operate a Kaivac machine. All of which are way beyond either of their ‘intellects’.

  12. 12.

    frog

    Best example of Trump’s slurring I’ve heard: “Sthrikehh”, at the 9second mark:

    It was more likely a bad signal compression algorithm, or faulty noise suppression attempt.

  14. 14.

    Chet Murthy

    @frog: haha no.  that sort of slurring was all over TCFG’s speech, but -not- Musk’s.  And by all over, I mean -everywhere-.  He sounded like Sylvester the Cat.

  16. 16.

    Phylllis

    @opiejeanne: Some speculation in the previous thread that it’s a put down towards folks using IVF to conceive — probably aimed at the Walz family. Or they’re just, you know, weird.

  17. 17.

    frog

    @Chet Murthy: that sort of slurring was all over TCFG’s speech, but -not- Musk’s.

    Musk and Trump were not in the same room.  Trump phoned in with an iPhone.

  22. 22.

    The Thin Black Duke

    @Phylllis: As someone commented earlier, it’s more than just being “weird”–it’s a deliberate act of cruelty. It’s performative nonsense that illustrates why right-wingers are so bad at comedy. One of essential tools a good comedian needs is empathy, and these vile people don’t give a fuck about anyone and anything outside of their nihilistic echo chamber.

  23. 23.

    sab

    Husband has to get up soon to take daughter in law to work back at near her old house. Today they move into our old house. 3 cats, 1 rabbit, 1 dog.

  24. 24.

    mrmoshpotato

    Elon sounds like this is maybe the third or fourth time he’s had a conversation with a fellow human.

    Perfection.

  25. 25.

    TBone

    @frog: as was pointed out in the post, we’ve all heard him phone in to various things for years now.  We have a lot of blather to compare this with.

  26. 26.

    TBone

    “Full family” marked on the cup is the tell that it is merely another lame attempt to dominate.  I’d ask one of those idiots if that means they’re making their kids drink it until full (urine consumption was a thing promoted by a RWNJ for a while).

  27. 27.

    bjacques

    @The Thin Black Duke: empathy (let alone any love) and a sense of humor are both lacking, and it shows in their attempts at “jokes”.

    It kinda reminds me of the difference between Frank Zappa and the Bonzo Dog Doo-Dah Band. Zappa scorned a lot of popular music and it left (for me) a sour taste, like with Joe’s Garage. The Bonzos respected the musical styles they parodied, and that made them a lot more fun. Even the parodies would have been successes in those genres (“Hello Mabel”, “Canyons Of Your Mind” – which Zappa referenced).

  29. 29.

    lowtechcyclist

    @The Thin Black Duke:

    As someone commented earlier, it’s more than just being “weird”–it’s a weird and nearly incomprehensible attempt at a deliberate act of cruelty.

    FTFY.  I mean, look at the work people had to put into it in the previous thread to figure out WTF they might be trying to communicate.

    Sure, cruelty was their intent, but instead they turned themselves into even more of a bizarre joke than they already were.  So just point and laugh.

  31. 31.

    bobbo1

    “It’s a real weakness to want to be liked.” [Looks thirstily at audience for approval.]

  36. 36.

    p.a.

    @lowtechcyclist: Sure, cruelty was their intent, but instead they turned themselves into even more of a bizarre joke than they already were…

     

     

    I’ve known some families that spoke with their own “family” accent.  Not a regional or local speech pattern, but something very personal, just unique to the parents & children, picked up like language itself, from constant contact.  No odd grammar or difficult-to-understand pronunciation even, just a cadence & sound.  These people are like that, just with a focus on weirdness & meanness imbibed from constant contact.  The bubble shrinking all the time.

  41. 41.

    The Thin Black Duke

    Sure, cruelty was their intent, but instead they turned themselves into even more of a bizarre joke than they already were. So just point and laugh.

    Sure, it’s funny. But it’s also important to follow up the “pointing and laughing” with a kick in the junk.

    These clowns are amusing until they transform into Pennywise and they’re marching us into cattle cars.

    The problem with making them the punchlines of bad jokes is some people not taking their intentions seriously, and their intentions is to make the rest of us disappear, by any means necessary.

  43. 43.

    TBone

    @The Thin Black Duke: that’s why follow up questions are so important.

    What is your family full of? Because that’s a sperm collection cup that says your family is full up!

    The memes practically write themselves.

  44. 44.

    Baud

    @The Thin Black Duke:

    The problem with making them the punchlines of bad jokes is some people not taking their intentions seriously, and their intentions is to make the rest of us disappear, by any means necessary

     
    Agree. I think that’s a lot of what happened in 2016.

  45. 45.

    TBone

    @The Thin Black Duke: I don’t mean to make light of your assertion because it is true.  It’s why I keep Old Slugger (my baseball bat) handy.  When our neighbors tore out beautiful flower beds and replaced them with river stones, hubby cried out “Oh good!  Ammo for a rock fight!”

  46. 46.

    TBone

    It is helpful for me to remember that we are the majority.  They are outwitted, outnumbered, outflanked, and shit out of luck.

  47. 47.

    lowtechcyclist

    @The Thin Black Duke:

    Sure, it’s funny. But it’s also important to follow up the “pointing and laughing” with a kick in the junk.

    No, you don’t understand – pointing and laughing IS the kick in the junk.  Being not taken seriously, or even worse, realizing that they’ve become the butt of the joke, hurts them more than any kick in the junk would.

    The problem with making them the punchlines of bad jokes is some people not taking their intentions seriously, and their intentions is to make the rest of us disappear, by any means necessary.

    Except that making them the punchlines of bad jokes is the most effective way to make them disappear.  You’re not an Alpha Male if everyone’s laughing at you, and the whole point of being a Trumpist, for so many of his followers, is to be one of the Alpha Males, to wreak revenge against everyone else for having the nerve to exist and regard themselves as equal to them.  But if it isn’t working, if being a Trumpist just makes you a joke, then what’s the point?

    And of course, whatever appeal Trump has to normies diminishes when he and his entire cult are seen as ridiculous.

    Ridicule is THE most effective weapon against fascists.  Wield it with pride.

  48. 48.

    TBone

    @lowtechcyclist: Wholeheartedly agree.  But also carry a big stick for when they get angry and lash out.

    My hubby is my big stick.  He always steps up at the proper moment with something searing after I work the room.

    Timing.

  49. 49.

    Princess

    @The Thin Black Duke: You’d think pointing  out their real intentions would shake people up and make them turn away from them. You’d think. But evidently when you tell focus groups of normies their plans, they flat out don’t believe you and say you’re lying.

    So for the purpose of this election. I’m going to stick with “They’re weird and gross.” Because it seems to be working.

    Anyone remember that Flintstone’s episode where Fred got too popular with the teens so Wilma dressed up as a teenager and got them all to turn against him by calling him a square? That’s what we’re doing. Is it a shame that people are so stupid, this is what it takes? Yes it is. But that’s where we are.

  50. 50.

    Baud

    @lowtechcyclist:

    It’s not about not using ridicule. It’s about not us not getting so entertained by our ridicule that we forget that were not doing it for our amusement but to defeat evil.

  54. 54.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Baud:

    It’s not about not using ridicule. It’s about not us not getting so entertained by our ridicule that we forget that were not doing it for our amusement but to defeat evil.

    Anyone in this room likely to forget that? Hell, is anyone on our side anywhere who pays enough attention to be part of a conversation like this likely to forget that?

    This is not 2016.

  56. 56.

    Chris Johnson

    @Princess: That’s the thing though: authoritarianism is kind of central to rightwinginess, and therefore half-authoritiarianism is normieness. To really, seriously take objection to the idea of ‘some people are just better OK’ is LEFT wing. Not everyone is left wing.

    For that reason, going with the argument of ‘they are evil, they are bullies, they are unjust authorities’ works best with left wingers and fails with authoritarians.

    They’re like ‘no, they’re not unjust if they won. DUH. How can they be bullies if they won? Sounds like you’re just weak’.

    So the normie angle becomes ‘maybe we can let them HALF kick your ass? Is that fair?’

    But the mockery says ‘they are CLOWNS’. They are not better, they are fools. If they bully, it’s from an outsider position. They’re not ‘one of us’. And indeed they are not: it’s authentic. A hell of a lot of authoritarian leaders and right wingers get there through previous failure and falling back on just the social engineering of ‘whatever, I beat you up’. They’re hollow, they’re failed, they don’t have merit.

    So the normie angle on that becomes ‘heh heh, hey maybe go easy on the guy okay? Also, ew’. It’s way way more damaging than ‘look at the scary evildoer’ because a lot of people either wholly or half-sympathize with the power.

    You don’t want to get defeat half as much as you want to get DISGRACE. These people are a pretense of power. They’re fake. It’s bullshit. Dictatorships are shams. Scratch a dictator and find a weak-ass human who’s trying to be way more than he really is.

    Our way’s better… but their way is a sham, disgraceful. That’s why ‘weird’ works. It’s a core disqualifying truth about creepy right wingers.

  57. 57.

    Ken

    These guys weren’t talking to each other, they were each talking to their fan-base separately.

    Perfect summary.

  58. 58.

    Baud

    Anyone who thinks Americans are a better people than we were in 2016 should go back and look at Biden’s poll numbers in June.

  59. 59.

    TBone

    While it’s completely reasonable to feel angry at these marches and the odious ideas they represent, it isn’t a good political strategy for the simple reason that it doesn’t help advance your goals and may actually strengthen the alt-right. It may be tempting to combat the extremism of the alt-right with righteous anger, and for many, it sounds like a logical response; but our research shows that it is a terrible tactical one. Meeting anger with anger not only increases violence; it tends to diminish support for your movement and distract media coverage so that it centers on the violence rather than the core issues at stake.

    Reposting this good argument for using humor. Laughtivism!

    https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2021/01/far-right-nazis-proud-boys-humor-laughtivism.html

     

  61. 61.

    The Thin Black Duke

    @Baud: This.

    What has fucked our side repeatedly over the years is complacency. I’m not worried about how targeting them with mockery is effecting them–it’s us.

    Sure, the couch-fucking jokes are funny, but I don’t want the Democrats to frolic merrily into November thinking that it’s already over. I want us to be a NFL team five touchdowns ahead in the 4th quarter keeping our foot on the pedal.

  65. 65.

    Mousebumples

    Hard to tell if this was a case of “Everything Trump Touches Dies” or “Everything Elon Touches Dies”

    Porque no los dos? (why not both?)

  66. 66.

    Kay

    NEW ABC/Washington Post national poll (B) among *likely voters*:

    Kamala Harris 51% (+6)

    Donald Trump 45%

    Really could not (realistically!) be better. His ceiling is 45, she’s above 50 and up 6. She’s amazing and so is Walz.

  67. 67.

    TBone

    Great news:

    Amid threats of certification battles and mass voter challenges, Vice President Kamala Harris’s presidential campaign has assembled an expansive senior legal team that will oversee hundreds of lawyers and thousands of volunteers in a sprawling operation designed to be a bulwark against what Democrats expect to be an aggressive Republican effort to challenge voters, rules and, possibly, the results of the 2024 election.

    https://www.joemygod.com/2024/08/harris-staffs-up-legal-team-to-battle-gop-challenges/

  68. 68.

    TBone

    @Baud: glad I don’t use hashtags now and never have in my entire life. Diminishment of language to a certain number of characters was a huge red flag right from the start, plus the unserious name Twitter sealed my decision to never participate on that site.

    Too close to “twit.”

  70. 70.

    AM in NC

    @bjacques: That recent WAPO (or maybe NYT) article on the Zappa family was a devastating indictment of Frank Zappa as a person, and made me feel just fine about rejecting his music decades ago because of his misogynistic lyrics.  Don’t care that the man can compose and play music. He seems like a creep, and his lyrics reflected that.

  71. 71.

    Kay

    Matthew Yglesias
    @mattyglesias

    53s

    ABC poll has Harris winning the election on the strength of strong margins on mental and physical health, honesty, and values. Trump still favored on the economy & immigration.

    She’s up 12 on reproductive rights, up 7 on health care and up 5 on gun safety but political pundits don’t care at all about those issues so Yglesias and the rest don’t even mention them.
    You watch. None of them will mention them. Because those are considered “womens issues” and therefore not at all important.
    Luckily they matter to voters. Talk about an echo chamber. Twitter has only made this worse. Media follow one another like lemmings on there and bring it out here.

  72. 72.

    Rusty

    @The Thin Black Duke: Even with a big win in November, we will still be dealing with a hostile Supreme Court that will be unilaterally advancing conservative causes.  We are in a for a long fight no matter what the poll results.

  73. 73.

    Mousebumples

    @The Thin Black Duke: I don’t want the Democrats to frolic merrily into November thinking that it’s already over. I want us to be a NFL team five touchdowns ahead in the 4th quarter keeping our foot on the pedal.

    100% agree. Let’s run up the score. Keep the Senate, flip the House, give Trump an embarrassing electoral college loss.

    I’m hoping more Dems will remember 2016 and take nothing for granted. But young Dems may need a reminder of how sideways that went. (expectations vs reality)

  74. 74.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Baud: ​
     

    Humanity hasn’t progressed that much since 2016.

    Who said it’s progressed at all?

    But it’s still different from 2016 in many ways. I’m not saying we’re better or worse situated than in 2016, but the terrain differs enough that we’re not likely to win or lose for the same reasons we lost or might have won in 2016.

  75. 75.

    Kay

    Gun safety is good for Dems. There’s room for growth if we’re only up 5 there. We should be up double digits. A lot of normies hate the proliferation of guns and gun nuts – again, not media, but voters.

  78. 78.

    Keith P.

    Trump is Elon Musk’s *third* string pick.  He was originally on board with DeSantis. When DeSantis flamed out, Musk started pitching Vivek Ramaswamy.  He’s not a good kingmaker.

  81. 81.

    Kay

    Maybe Harris/Walz think focusing on that will just bring out more gun nuts – which is valid- but to a lot of people on our side gun safety is in the top three issues – we just have to reach them.

  84. 84.

    TBone

    @Kay: Donold now using bulletproof glass while children go to school and have active shooter drills should be played up in the media.

    I bet the Lincoln Project might do something with it too.

  86. 86.

    Mousebumples

    @Suzanne: see one of the overnight threads if you or anyone else wants to know. I think AL called it Balloon Juice after Dark.

  87. 87.

    Princess

    @Baud: Exactly. Best policy and greatest accomplishments of my lifetime but everyone wanted a vibes election. Everyone.

  88. 88.

    Elizabelle

    @Suzanne:  Previous blogpost.  Stupid white people tricks.

    Thanks for answering about the Healthplex.  Good to hear of its expansion.  Always forget about them.  

  89. 89.

    Kay

    The sperm collection jars are going to be an absolute mystery to voters. They’re yet another indication that the Right is up its own ass and becoming incomprehensible to normal people.

    When they ran against reproductive rights in Michigan they decided to run against trans people instead, because obviously they can’t run on reproductive rights. The yard signs had like a 30 word statement on them. I had to really decipher it to figure out that they were running against reproductive rights and I’m in no sense a normie. If I can’t read the code they’re really in trouble.

    You really do have to guard against that in a political party. It’s easy to fall into.

  91. 91.

    Princess

    @The Thin Black Duke: we’ve lost the highest court in the land. We’ve lost 90% or more of the most respected news media. This election isn’t about defeating fascism; it’s about allowing us to continue to fight in the face of what we’ve already lost. No one should be complacent.

  92. 92.

    The Thin Black Duke

    @AM in NC: Neal Degrassi Tyson once quoted a colleague of his who said, “If you’re the smartest person in the room–leave.” Tyson’s takeaway from that comment was it’s too easy to step into an echo chamber where nobody challenges you anymore and when that happens, you stop growing intellectually. Zappa needed someone to say to him, “Hey, dude–you’re being an asshole.” But nobody ever did.

  94. 94.

    Suzanne

    Oh FFS, I went and looked. WTF is my problem.

    @Kay:

    They’re yet another indication that the Right is up its own ass and becoming incomprehensible to normal people. 

    Abso-fucken-lutely. This is the most culty, weird, disturbing, utterly gross thing I’ve seen all day. I mean, I just woke up and I’m having coffee right now, but still.

    Like, these people….. I’d cross the street to avoid them. I’d move across state lines to avoid them.

  97. 97.

    Anne Laurie

    @TBone: That’s not burnt toast I smell.

    There’s an old folk tale, medically disproven, that smelling burnt toast (or hair) is a sign of an ischemic incident (stroke).

    Alongside the reference that both TFG & EM are toast, as in done, and beyond just toasted.

  98. 98.

    Suzanne

    @Elizabelle: No problem. Y’all are getting two new hospitals over there….. the one in Springfield in 2027 and then one on the site of the former Landmark mall in 2028. We designed and drew them simultaneously (took three years). The Landmark site is going to be part of a bigger multi-use development, and it’s a little bit bigger, so it will take a bit longer.

    ETA: If you don’t like the way they look…. I had nothing to do with the exteriors.

  99. 99.

    geg6

    @AM in NC:

    Same here.  Never was a fan of Zappa’s oeuvre and part of it was his obvious contempt for any music that wasn’t his own and his disdain for, it seemed, everyone that wasn’t him.  He seemed a real asshole.  Glad see my instincts once again confirmed.  But sad for his kids.  What terrible parents they had.

  100. 100.

    TBone

    @Anne Laurie: I got that reference right away 😊

    My comment was in response to the Weird!

    Incidentally, Covid did not obliterate my sense of smell – it gave me phantom smell episodes (car exhaust !) just as you describe, plus an awful metallic taste that’s hard to get rid of.

  102. 102.

    Elizabelle

    @Suzanne:  Good to hear!  Does the new hospital use all of Landmark’s footprint?  Are there other uses for that site?

    ETA:  No coffee yet!  You clearly wrote multi-use.

  103. 103.

    The Thin Black Duke

    @geg6: The three-LP collection Shut Up and Play Your Guitar is an acceptable compromise. There’s no misogynist lyrics to get in the way of the listener’s enjoyment.

  104. 104.

    Geminid

    @Kay: My two gun-owning friends would be happy to see Virginia’s gun laws strengthened to the level of California’s. They vote Democratic every election, every year.

    I think we’ll make some more progress towards that goal before too long. In the 2020 General Assembly session, with Democrats finally in control of both chambers, the legislature passed  six gun safety measures and Governor Northam signed them. Northam had made gun safety a major campaign issue in 2017, when he beat Ed Gillespie by 7 points. Democratic legislative candidates did likewise that year and in 2019.

    I expect that Abigail Spanberger will make gun safety a primary issue next year, and that will help make her Governor and put Democrats in control of both legislative houses again. Then Virginia Democrats will enact more gun safety laws along the lines of California’s.

  106. 106.

    kalakal

    The  thing about ridicule is it works fast. The GOP and their flunkies in the MSM normally take years of drip drip to mould public perception of Dems eg the decades long hatchet job on Hilary. By the end of that normies just ‘knew’ that HRC was ‘bad’, if asked they couldn’t say why, they just knew. in the same way ‘everybody knows Republicans are better for the economy’. Social Media and ‘weird’ have totally upended this and at lightning speed. The usual suspects are flailing and thrashing and in the process coming across as even weirder to normies. If everybody ‘knows’ you’re a clown you’re in trouble getting them to trust you to run the govt. As far as normies are concerned TFG & the MAGAs are messaging in Linear B, they have the same  appeal that   Lawrence Welk had to Motorhead fans.

    The important trick is not just to keep hammering that they’re weird, but that they’re nasty weird

  109. 109.

    The Thin Black Duke

    @OzarkHillbilly: I know, dude. We’re golden. But it’s not us I’m worried about. As always, it’s about turnout.

    But, tbh, I’m cautiously optimistic because I think the GOP’s lunacy has reached a tipping point where regular, non-political junkies are saying to themselves, WTF?!?

    I mean, you know it’s bad when the goons behind Project 2025 have to create training videos on “How To Be Normal”.

  110. 110.

    MomSense

    @Kay:
    We are in a much better position and bringing back key voters to our coalition.  Lots of positive changes and the momentum is on our side but I still think this is going to be a very close election.

  114. 114.

    zhena gogolia

    @Suzanne: Look at the overnight thread. Or don’t, it’s your choice!

    ETA: Always read the comments before saying the same thing as 300 others.

  115. 115.

    O. Felix Culpa

    @The Thin Black Duke:

    But it’s also important to follow up the “pointing and laughing” with a kick in the junk.

    100% agree. Lots of people in Germany and elsewhere pointed and laughed at Hitler and his silly Nazi party. We all know how that turned out.

    Mockery is a great tool, but mockery alone is insufficient to defeat the fascists. As you say in a follow-up comment, gotta get our folks to the polls. Our metaphorical but effective kick in the junk.

  117. 117.

    Elizabelle

    @The Thin Black Duke:  And Frank Luntz, the pollster, saying he couldn’t find any undecided young 20 something women for his focus groups.

    They have decided.  And most are not on Team Weird.

  118. 118.

    Starfish

    @TBone: What kind of fuddy duddy stuff is this?

    Over the years, Twitter has expanded the character count and added multimedia.

    The hashtag wasn’t about limited character count. It was about increasing the visibility of what you wrote and finding your people. For example, if you were at a conference and the conference suggested a hashtag, you would use it, and you would make what you were writing visible to the attendees of the conference. It was a nice way to meet people.

  119. 119.

    RevRick

    @piratedan: As is pointed out in a post over at LGM, white male is the ultimate identity politics, because it has rendered itself invisible.

  121. 121.

    Suzanne

    @Starfish: Agree. At the risk of poking the bear….. the reason emojis emerged as a communication shorthand was because of character count on Twitter and in text messages.

  122. 122.

    TBone

    PSA it is Katharine Hepburn Day on TCM’s Summer Under the Stars for all those who celebrate!

    All hail the Great Kate!

  123. 123.

    TBone

    @Starfish: *shakes fist at cloud 😆

    I am already aware of what you explained.  My comment was about why I was not joining xitter from the beginning.

  124. 124.

    Starfish

    @Suzanne: Check out the previous thread. It’s weird. i didn’t dive into the comments. I just looked at the photos and decided it was too early in the morning for whatever this was.

  125. 125.

    Ceci n est pas mon nym

    @RevRick: Yep. To the point made by @Kay at #11:

    You watch. None of them will mention them. Because those are considered “womens issues” and therefore not at all important.

    a typical dismissal would be that those aren’t the concerns of “regular voters”.

  126. 126.

    prostratedragon

    Time to double down on the white supremacy. From Josh Marshall:

    Trump just announced a Tuesday “crime and safety” rally in a Michigan town that has been heavily associated with the KKK for decades (Howell, Michigan). Just last month White Supremacists marched through town chanting ‘We love Hitler. We love Trump.’

    His thread includes some historical notes on Howell and Livingston County. As this local journalist, for one, is at pains to point out, the Klan is no longer a presence in the area. But on the other hand, just last month there was a “We love Trump. We love Hitler” marchthrough the town, so someone thinks that message will find support there.

    Comments from the granddaughter of the school superintendent who became a target of tbe Klan back in the 70s.

  127. 127.

    Princess

    @MomSense: I agree. What strikes me is the solidity of Trump’s polling. He got around 46% in 2016 and 2020. After all his mess, Jan 6, charges, trials, stealing documents, Biden stepping down, weirdness, great campaigning by Harris, his confusion and clear decline… he’s at 45%. I think a lot of his voters are unenthusiastic, but they’re still sticking by him.

  128. 128.

    Ceci n est pas mon nym

    @TBone: I’m not sure I’ve seen nearly as much Katherine Hepburn as I should have in an ideal world. Love her in everything, even silly stuff like Stage Door.

    I loved her autobiography, which is where I was first exposed to the idea of Howard Hughes (one of her suitors) as a dashing young adventurer instead of a crazy old hermit who didn’t cut his fingernails.

  129. 129.

    MomSense

    I love seeing the dance party videos/reels people are posting while waiting for Harris Walz rallies to start.
    The pollster Joshua Doss gave an interview to Newsweek about perceptions of the economy.  What I found interesting is that the markers people are using in their understanding of what a good economy is have changed since the pandemic.  Explains a lot.

    Joshua Doss is also on all the socials and a really good follow.

  130. 130.

    MomSense

    @Suzanne:

    Also emojis are fun.  If we were talking in real life and I said something cheeky you would see that expression on my face.  Emojis are limited but they add a bit of character to remote communication.
    Humans have been communicating with symbols from the beginning – before words and history.

  131. 131.

    RevRick

    @piratedan: Um, the vigilante parties in the late 18th and early 19th centuries that attacked and drove out native Americans from their homelands, before Jackson’s Trail of Tears made it official. Slavery and Jim Crow lynchings. These MAGA whites just want to return to that level of cruelty and depravity in order to create their herrenvolk homeland.

  132. 132.

    Betty Cracker

    In a sense, we’re probably lucky Musk bought Twitter since he’s apparently too stupid and unfocused to become a digital-first Rupert Murdoch with a mission to destroy democracy. That danger was and maybe still is real, especially since MSM journos seem determined to remain a captured constituency on the platform.

    I think the more immediate danger is ExTwitter functioning as a Radio Rwanda in the wake of an election result that riles up the many Nazi fuck-squibs who are active there. If that doesn’t happen, it will be because of the cowardice of the loud mouths, not any steps Musk will take to tamp down their hysteria or address disinformation.

  135. 135.

    cmorenc

    @Rusty:

    @The Thin Black Duke: Even with a big win in November, we will still be dealing with a hostile Supreme Court that will be unilaterally advancing conservative causes.  We are in a for a long fight no matter what the poll results.

    Yes!  In overturning Chevron and the expansive immunity decision, the RW 6 were specifically anticipating a Trump election victory and setting up the framework for implementing a Project 2025 type agenda.  The Dobbs decision put in place the basis not only for outlawing abortion, but as an eventual sequal, permitting the outlawing any forms of birth control other than perhaps very fail-prone barrier methods (because ardent anti-abortionists claim that even hormonal methods like the pill work by disabling implantation of a sacred fertilized ovum).  That’s exactly what Alito implicity had in mind by disingenuously remarking that Dobbs did not overturn birth contol. And the line of “religious liberty” cases were growng to the point of swallowing the 1st Amendment establishment clause to a residual nub amid a sea of Christian nationalism diverting public funds to relgious schools.

    The RW6 will view the Harris Administration as a mere speed-bump slowing their agenda down for 4 years, but meanwhile will be busy building the legal infrastructure for the eventual coming of something very much like Project 2025.

  136. 136.

    Starfish

    @MomSense: This is interesting. Say more about what people thought were the markers of a good economy before and what they think are markers of a good economy now.

    “The economy is great” always rang hollow to me because I work in tech, and there have been constant large layoffs for the last two year, usually companies laying off their senior people. The salaries are plateauing.

    Last night, I went to a restaurant with some people, and over half the menu was not available not because they ran out of food but because the restaurant is mismanaged and half the staff quit so they didn’t have anyone to make the salads, so the rest of the staff was making the half of the menu that they could make.

    Housing and food both feel a lot more expensive than they have historically been. And “inflation is plateauing” means prices are not going up more not that they don’t feel way up already.

  140. 140.

    Suzanne

    @Princess: Trump has always had a high floor and probably a low ceiling. But yes….. one of the things that I kept thinking in 2016 is that Dems were completely unprepared for the kind of evidence-free “vibes” environment we were in. I remember one of the debates between TFG and HRC, and she brought up Alicia Machado, and at the end, she kind of shimmied her shoulders and smiled, like she had successfully dunked on him. And I kept thinking that she was not getting that his people were not evaluating him in any sort of objective or rational way.

    Every election with Trump in it is a vibes election. I’m glad we figured that out.

  142. 142.

    schrodingers_cat

    @Baud: @The Thin Black Duke: The RSS with their weird uniform and cult like behavior and their extreme agenda was a butt of jokes until it wasn’t.

    We can mock them and point and laugh but not let that lull us into complacency. They may sound ridiculous but they mean every word they say and will put those ridiculous plans in action given the opportunity.

  143. 143.

    Suzanne

    @Starfish: Housing is a lot more expensive than it has historically been. The country (actually the entire world) is urbanizing due to the nature of the economy. And in the country, we experienced a huge slowdown in housing construction starting 2008 and we are just now getting back to normal numbers of new housing starts, but we had about 15 years of under-supply…. which, because houses last for decades, means we haven’t caught up and that shortage persists. And the housing stock we have is aging and lots of the houses we do have are in the wrong places.

  145. 145.

    Starfish

    @MomSense: Oh, gosh! That is right. Housing prices are so very expensive right now.

    This is an issue that people who have owned their houses for a while can be completely out of touch with.

  146. 146.

    Princess

    @Suzanne: “Every election with Trump in it is a vibes election. I’m glad we figured that out.”

    Yes, I think that’s right. That’s a really good observation. It means we’re still fighting in his turf but our leaders know how to do it.

    Harris is so smart. I’m blown away by her.

  147. 147.

    M31

    @Starfish: ​
     

    big parts of tech are in a slump, yes

    but the restaurant thing, I think is evidence the economy is doing well — those mismanaged employees had other options so they quit

    one of the amazing things about the Biden era is how well lower-wage workers are doing overall

  148. 148.

    MomSense

    @Starfish:

    And rents!  My sons are all renters and two of them are paying more than half their income for their housing.
    My middle and his wife are trying to buy.  They put offers on two houses Friday, above asking with escalation clauses and both attempts were unsuccessful. Both houses were on the market for a day.  I’m already receiving letters from realtors with buyers who want to pay more than what I did for my new house. Cash offers.  I haven’t even unpacked yet.

  149. 149.

    Suzanne

    @MomSense: A record-high number of renters are considered officially “rent-burdened”. The US cities that have seen stabilization or decline in rent prices, such as Austin, TX, have been building more. There’s a commenter here who calls that “Reaganomics for housing”, but the data is pretty suggestive that when there is more residential construction happening, it leads to maybe not lower housing costs, but at least not-rising-as-fast costs.

    The project I worked on that I linked to above is a good example of what I think needs to be a way forward: dead, out-of-date suburban shopping mall, near freeways and with existing infrastructure connections, demolished and built on more densely. Low density is a killer.

    My neighborhood, which is mostly two-and three-story single-family homes that are built pretty tightly to one another on narrow lots, has a few places where a small developer bought a couple of adjacent lots and built some connected townhomes, or bought one of the houses and divided it into apartments, or a homeowner built a detached garage with an apartment above it. All of those options are illegal in much of the country.

  150. 150.

    Starfish

    @MomSense: In my area, the prices seem to be plateauing. Some sellers are trying to sell at peak COVID prices; but with 6% interest rates, that is going to be so very expensive, and no one is buying that.

  151. 151.

    MomSense

    @Suzanne:
    On a former Naval Air Station the economic development team has been putting in housing developments that are all apartment buildings.  The apartment buildings are wonderful and they are in a developed area that already has public transportation.  I was walking with some friends and mentioned them and before I could get out how great they are my friend said something disparaging about the apartment complexes.  I said I thought they were great and that we need more housing where the jobs are and that they are connected to the local and regional bus lines which is another bonus.  To his credit he came around and said he hadn’t thought about it that way and that he could see they were a good thing.  My friends are solid Democratic voters but they are out of touch with housing struggles.

  152. 152.

    Starfish

    @MomSense: That fight between pro-density and anti-density Democrats is the town where I live. We are surrounded by a greenbelt and have had height restrictions that have gotten more strict over time. Some people want to build up the transportation corridor, and there is opposition to it. There is this “the town is full” thing going on, and the town hasn’t really grown that much over the past couple of years. It is going to be dwarfed by the surrounding towns. The number of kids in the school district are dropping because people with kids cannot afford to live here anymore.

    We had an anti-housing retired school teacher run for a seat in state government. People were lukewarm on the sitting candidate, but the school teacher lost. I am taking this as a good sign that things are shifting when it comes to housing.

  153. 153.

    Starfish

    @MomSense: I don’t think National Sierra club has taken a position on housing, but your environmentalism is trash if everyone is “Hey, we created a greenbelt in the 1960s. Environmental mission accomplished.” During a period where climate change is a serious issue, we can’t have these unserious takes on what the environment is.

    https://www.npr.org/2023/02/10/1156164561/as-the-sierra-club-reckons-with-its-past-a-new-leader-charts-a-more-inclusive-fu

  154. 154.

    Suzanne

    @MomSense: Yeah, there have been a couple of proposed medium-density multi-family housing projects here in PGH that have been defeated by wealthy neighbors freaking out at the City Council. They would have been great…. building on already-developed commercial land, so no sprawl or displacement of existing homeowners. But they didn’t want their views impacted, or more traffic or street parking. And what it really comes down to is they don’t want more neighbors who aren’t rich.

  155. 155.

    MomSense

    @Starfish:
    Thanks for that link.  I think the environmental movement has changed quite a bit from when I first started with PIRG way back when.  It has to keep changing and to become more inclusive and make environmental Justice and equity more of a priority.

  156. 156.

    scav

    @Starfish: Remember that even if the house has been owned for a long time, the owner sees their taxes going up after nearby sales, so they’re still very aware of the situation.  Worse if they’re on a fixed income.  Where I am, talking about nearby house sales (and nearby is increasing in scope) has possibly bypassed idle chat about the weather.

  157. 157.

    MomSense

    @Suzanne:

    It is only because of the unique governance structure of the redevelopment authority that we were able to put in those apartment complexes.  They were featured in right wing media outlets and even The Daily Mail in such an awful way.  Why the hell do Londoners give a shit about our housing solutions?  Of course they turned it into a chance to be racist and create a bogus conflict between immigrants and real ‘muricans.

  158. 158.

    Bill Arnold

    @Starfish:

    but with 6% interest rates

    My first mortgage was 10.5 percent, an ARM that adjusted annually. Eventually (10-15 years?) re-fied at 4 percent, which was amazing the time, when the original ARM dropped to 6 percent.
    People can adjust. Complaining is easy and fun.
    The real issue appears (averaged nationally) to be insufficient supply, driven in part by restrictive regulations and zoning and slower-than-necessary approvals.

  159. 159.

    Another Scott

    @Bill Arnold: … and too many “investors” buying houses for cash, especially when localities were doing nothing about it and the MotUs were letting everyone think they could get rich by turning into an AirBnB.  Surprise, bubbles have consequences…

    There’s still too much money out there doing nothing productive, because taxes on the top 1-5-10% have been far too low for far too long. Money that doesn’t circulate is worse than unproductive – it’s dangerous because it strangles important investment in the commonweal and gives those how have it too much power.

    It will probably take “all of the above” to get housing back in something like balance (more supply of single-family, different zoning for more multi-family, regulations to decrease sprawl, etc.). It’s good that Harris is pushing for federal changes.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

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