Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

The arc of history bends toward the same old fuckery.

A democracy can’t function when people can’t distinguish facts from lies.

… riddled with inexplicable and elementary errors of law and fact

When we show up, we win.

President Musk and Trump are both poorly raised, coddled 8 year old boys.

Let me file that under fuck it.

I am pretty sure these ‘journalists’ were not always such a bootlicking sycophants.

Giving up is unforgivable.

The media handbook says “controversial” is the most negative description that can be used for a Republican.

“Can i answer the question? No you can not!”

if you can’t see it, then you are useless in the fight to stop it.

It’s a good piece. click on over. but then come back!!

Jack be nimble, jack be quick, hurry up and indict this prick.

fuckem (in honor of the late great efgoldman)

We can’t confuse what’s necessary to win elections with the policies that we want to implement when we do.

There are consequences to being an arrogant, sullen prick.

Too often we confuse noise with substance. too often we confuse setbacks with defeat.

Innocent people do not delay justice.

You don’t get rid of your umbrella while it’s still raining.

Hey Washington Post, “Democracy Dies in Darkness” was supposed to be a warning, not a mission statement.

Their boy Ron is an empty plastic cup that will never know pudding.

They are lying in pursuit of an agenda.

Whoever he was, that guy was nuts.

Anyone who bans teaching American history has no right to shape America’s future.

You are here: Home / Elections 2024 / Wednesday Morning Open Thread: Party On – Excellently!

Wednesday Morning Open Thread: Party On – Excellently!

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  2. 2.

    Baud

    I’m really impressed with how so many people were able to change all the content of the speeches and the videos to focus on Kamala in basically a month’s time.

  5. 5.

    TBone

    @Ken: I’m ready to bang out a U turn as necessary at any time.  Pivot!  Do not fear change.  Relish your ability to adapt!

    Don’t let ’em sneak up from behind!

  6. 6.

    hrprogressive

    @Ken: ​
     

    Seconded.

    Again, I can’t overstate how happy I am to have been wrong about pulling off “The Switch” the way they did.

    But holy shit let’s not spend that amount of time and create that much doom and anxiety ever again, eh.

  9. 9.

    Ken

    Other favorite reviews of last night:

    Popehat: Jesus would not approve of how much I am enjoying the thought of how tonight is enraging Trump and his deplorables. But He has infinite grace and will forgive me.

    chatham harrison is tending his garden: Join the Democratic Party, & you too can marry a woman way, way out of your league

  10. 10.

    JerseyBeard

    Watched with my 14 yo last night. He loved the party vibe, as did I. I thought Georgia absolutely won the night with that roll call. But then my guv, the knucklehead-busting Phil Murphy did me proud with his, “We’re from Jersey, baby…and you’re not!”

    I felt seen.

  11. 11.

    rusty

    The Loomer piece is unhinged, but insightful.  Both sides speak of freedom, for the Republicans it’s the right to buy inefficient appliances and light bulbs, and to treat your employees badly.  For the Democrats it’s the freedom if your are part of the LGBTQ+ community to actually be who you are, if you are poor to not worry about your next meal, if you are a woman to access healthcare, if you are a racial minority to not live in fear of the police and to be able get equal access to jobs and services.  To follow on about our press from below, they treat access to appliances and to healthcare as equal by both siding, and then wonder why we think they are crap at their jobs.

  12. 12.

    NotMax

    Any of y’all have experience with nicotine patches?

    Journey commencing later today (assuming no delays) probably 15 or 16 hours door to door. Sprang for a box of ’em for the trip

  13. 13.

    SFAW

    @rusty:

    Someone should forward your comment to the Harris/Walz campaign, in the hope they’re push it with the MSM. I’m serious — it encapsulates a key, and under-acknowledged, difference between parties

  15. 15.

    HinTN

    OT – I wish someone would show that WW II clip to Joe and his nat sec team and remind them that it took amazing numbers of systems and shells, an amazing number of troops, and an amazing will to carry the fight to the NAZIs, to secure freedom for Europe. We’re relying on Ukraine to do that with their limited population and the severely restricted systems and CONOPS to protect Europe. Remove the handcuffs, Joe.

    / end channeling Adam

  16. 16.

    TBone

    @NotMax: take it off an hour before bedtime to avoid vivid dreams (nightmares) and slap that puppy on first thing in the a.m. (a fresh one).

  18. 18.

    HinTN

    @NotMax: No experience with patches, just cold turkey for me. You’ve got this!

    ETA – Wish I could be at the meet-up. Was just in NYC last week. Perfect weather!

  29. 29.

    BC in Illinois

    This morning’s insight from The WaPo, Jason Willick:

    How Alexis de Tocqueville explains Democratic Party conformity:
    Why Democrats could so easily pivot from defending Biden’s abilities to celebrating Harris’s takeover.

    Snippets:

    “Whichever spin you accept, it’s hard to argue with George Packer’s characterization in the Atlantic: ‘The same forced unity that gave Biden the primaries despite his obvious infirmity will give Harris the nomination despite her well-known weaknesses.’ ”

    “herd-like uniformity of opinion”

    “It can be dizzying, for an outsider, to see the Democratic Party and its allied institutions walk in lockstep”

    “The tendency of Democratic politicians to conform”

    “Democratic Party conformity”

    “Thus the Democrats and parts of the media effortlessly quashed complaints about Biden when he was their candidate, and effortlessly forgot Harris’s flaws as they summoned new mass enthusiasm around her.”

    [According to de Tocqueville . . . ] The country’s leaders increasingly followed rather than led, a pattern that continues, with rare exceptions (Dean Phillips!), to this day.

    All contained in a 781-word essay that never once casts its gaze toward, or even mentions the existence of, the Republican Party.

    For context:

    Jason Willick writes a regular Washington Post column on legal issues, political ideas and foreign affairs. Before coming to The Post in 2022, he was an editorial writer and assistant editorial features editor for the Wall Street Journal, and before that a staff writer and associate editor at the American Interest.

    So what we’re seeing in the DNC is not hope and excitement, but simple conformity.

    The way Democrats do.

  30. 30.

    JerseyBeard

    @Baud: No doubt. I told my son I could do 20 more mins of Georgia easily. But Jersey felt the most…Jersey. Really, I just enjoyed the whole dang thing.

  32. 32.

    Ken

    President Obama: Trump is a 78-year-old billionaire who hasn’t stopped whining about his problems since he rode down his golden escalator nine years ago. We don’t need four more years of bluster and chaos. We’ve seen that movie and we all know that the sequel’s usually worse

    POST FACT CHECKER: We give this four Pinocchios.

    • There is no evidence that Trump is a billionaire other than his financial statements, which have been found fraudulent by a court of law.
    • There have been many periods in the last nine years where Trump has not been whining, because he was asleep and/or shoveling fast food into his mouth.
    • Saying “we don’t need bluster and chaos” is untrue, as some of us — such as the Post — would in fact prefer that, as it increases revenues.
    • Oh, really?  The Empire Strikes Back. Wrath of Khan. T2: Judgement Day.
  35. 35.

    rodwell

    Watch the roll call on C-Span.  The last two rolls call at the Democratic convention (2020 and 2024) were very entertaining to watch.  Enjoy my Governor (Phil Murphy) saying, we are from Jersey, and you are not.  Watch some of the Republican roll call this week and what a snooze feast.

  37. 37.

    Suzanne

    I fell asleep before the Obamas came on, so I am catching up this morning between meetings. I saw that a joke about crowd sizes that was really an unsubtle dick joke went viral, and I loved it. This is the kind of content I really enjoy.

  38. 38.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @rusty:

    the right to buy inefficient appliances and light bulbs, and to treat your employees badly.

    The rights that conservatives are losing and are so angry about is the right to be an asshole.  Racism, sexism, homophobia (including all queers), bullying, domestic abuse, treating your employees badly, the list goes on.  Stuff like light bulbs are just a minor example of their anger at being forced to do anything for the public good.

    And they are losing these rights!  Legally and in terms of social pressure they have lost tremendous ground since 1980, and are only now thanks to Trump’s vile SCOTUS starting to claw back their right to hurt others on a vast scale.

  43. 43.

    Ken

    @Frankensteinbeck: The light bulbs, and weirdness like “rolling coal”, remind me of one of Terry Pratchett’s observations: “Here at last was a species that could be persuaded to shoot itself in the foot.”

  46. 46.

    Flanders Other Neighbor

    My younger daughter is just going to miss the age cutoff to vote this year, but she convinced her grandma (who lacks enthusiasm for some reason) not to sit out because of the impact of Roe, not to mention our family members who are gay and will be targets.

    Grandma is in AZ and hates Kari Lake, so the impact will be greater than if she was here in CA.  I suggested keeping it simple and voting Dem all the way down the ballot.  She thinks RFKJR is a nut and hadn’t even heard the bear story yet, so that’s not an issue.  She also didn’t hear about Vance’s furniture rumors, but got a laugh out of it.

  48. 48.

    A Ghost to Most

    As a Belgian once told me, “Europeans think 100 miles is a long way. Americans think 100 years is a long time.”

  49. 49.

    hueyplong

    @Leto: What makes Obama Obama is the fact that it’s accordion hands and a dick joke, and maybe a dessert topping as well.

  50. 50.

    UncleEbeneezer

    @Baud: But if I don’t stand aside with my arms folded while everyone else passes pails of water to put out the fire, how will anyone know I’m special?

  51. 51.

    BellaPea

    @BC in Illinois: I read an interesting article about the new editor and staff at the WP. Apparently, under the current leadership, a lot of former Murdoch employees have come on board. It’s creating quite a bit of chaos. I’m not surprised to see that type of negative imaging of the Democrats.

  52. 52.

    Balconesfault

    The comment on the driving hits home.

    For example, I live in Austin, but for work might drive up to Kansas in a day if the flight schedules aren’t convenient.

    The wife and I were just over in Paris for the Olympics, and added on a trip to Slovenia to visit my cousins. Took it easy with a 4-day drive going, including a day in Venice, and a half day dedicated to climbing Alpe dHuez on my bike. On the way back made a couple days hard drive to get back for ticketed events.

    My cousins were amazed that someone would just drive from Paris to Slovenia like that. To them the idea of a trip to Paris seemed as big an endeavor as it is for us to fly from Texas.

  55. 55.

    JML

    @BC in Illinois: what a fucking clown. FFS, Dems have been eating out of the old Will Rogers saw “I don’t belong to an organized political party, I’m a Democrat” for a century. we’ve had defections consistently in Congress, and the media loved it. So we finally unite (wonderfully) we’re now the party of conformity?

    WaPo is failing. Of course, any time you hire clowns from the Wall Street Journal editorial pages, you know you’re getting right-wing shitbags. (their financial reporting is still good, if a bit slanted. Their editorial page has been to the right of Attila the Hun for 40 years…)

  56. 56.

    Jackie

    Heh!

    Donald Trump called off an interview with a local newspaper during a visit to Michigan after he was asked to verify his claims about out-of-control crime in the area, according to a new report.

    The Republican presidential nominee campaigned Tuesday in Howell, where he argued that a “crime wave” attributed to his Democratic rival Vice President Kamala Harris was occurring at levels “nobody has ever seen before,” but he was unwilling or unable to cite evidence for those claims, reported The Detroit News.

    Donald Trump called off an interview with a local newspaper during a visit to Michigan after he was asked to verify his claims about out-of-control crime in the area, according to a new report.

    The Trump campaign had initially agreed that Trump would participate in an interview with The Detroit News on Tuesday,” wrote state politics reporter Craig Mauger. “But after the newspaper began asking about the Michigan crime data before the event, a campaign aide said the presidential candidate no longer had time for an interview after the speech.”

  57. 57.

    Scout211

    Great line-up of speakers last night. But Michelle Obama was just amazing and IMHO, the best speech of the night.

    Georgia was by far the best state delegation count.  Seems to be a universal opinion. But the whole DJ-led music for each state was really great.  As I said last night, it made a historically boring delegate count really fun and festive.

  58. 58.

    matt

    I think the Loomer piece is more about her own personal financial situation as a right wing influencer than about general prosperity in the country.

  59. 59.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    @Ken: I’m deliriously happy that we pulled off the handbrake u-turn at 85 mph but please can we not do it again for a while

    Or, better yet, deal with the circumstances that made it necessary, please.​

  63. 63.

    Scout211

    @Jackie: Donald Trump called off an interview with a local newspaper during a visit to Michigan after he was asked to verify his claims about out-of-control crime in the area, according to a new report.

    LOL

    Why doesn’t Trump sit down with local reporters?

  66. 66.

    geg6

    I’m loving everything about this convention and I have to say I’ve never seen anything like it.  I can see antecedents, but nothing quite like this.  Obviously, 2008 Obama vibes for sure.  But also all the female energy of 2016.  And even the 2020 vibe of celebrating our diversity and using the need to pivot a different and more entertaining plan for how a convention looks due to the pandemic.  They’ve taken all of that and added an online savvy that the right has seemingly lost touch with when they have dominated it for so long.  And, IMHO, a very consequential turn away from taking the MSM so seriously and fearing to fight fiercely so as to try to curry media love.  The MSM are almost as much a danger to democracy these days as MAGA and it is too obvious to continue to ignore.  Everything the FTFNYT writes about Dems and the ridiculous WaPo fact checking are so in our faces now but they expect us to act like we always have, from a defensive crouch.  Biden sort of got the ball rolling on this but very subtly.  Well, the Harris/Walz campaign is openly fighting back and creating their own story their own way and pushing back hard when needed.  So, now, are national Dems.  And so is the base.  The stories about the MSM whining about convention accommodations is like candy to me.  I can’t stop eating it up.  And that, to me, is the best thing about this convention.  We don’t give a shit about what they think.  We’re going to do it our way and they can either tag along and see the fun or get run over.

  67. 67.

    Leto

    @Scout211: the only person whose oratory skills are on the same level as Baracks, and at times absolutely exceed his. The 1-2 combo of them is just devastating, and we’re all here for it.

  68. 68.

    UncleEbeneezer

    I love that Forever-FLOTUS, Michelle Obama made it quite clear that we are not throwing away all the progress that people fought and died for, just because you don’t agree with the Dem position on your favorite issue.  And the crowd erupted in a very loud cheer of support.

    “We’re Not Going Back” is such a great message because it rallies our troops and serves as a warning/response to not just Republicans but also to the assholes running around encouraging people not to vote while trying to divide our coalition and kill our momentum.

  70. 70.

    p.a.

    There’s freedom “of”, freedom “from”, and freedom “to”.  Rethugs are all about the in-group’s freedom “to”: bully, intimidate, denigrate, discriminate…

    Wilhoit’s Law

  72. 72.

    rodwell

    This Jason Willick nonsense column is why MVP rightfully is ignoring the NYT and Post.  I was on Team Biden, and I believe that the MSM treated him badly.  But damn did Joe pick a great successor, which is why he will go down as a great president.  Yes, MVP changed the dynamics of the race, but she is doing it with the reelection team that was assembly by Biden.  MVP brings a new level of excitement and joy that unfortunately Joe could not do.  All my younger relatives who have been anti Trump are really pump up by Harris.

  74. 74.

    catclub

    @Frankensteinbeck: The rights that conservatives are losing and are so angry about is the right to be an asshole.

     

    AND get no criticism for it. They can even still be assholes.

  75. 75.

    zhena gogolia

    I didn’t understand the last tweet in the OP. Can someone explain it to me? Are the resistlibs the Nazis or the Allies?

  76. 76.

    zhena gogolia

    I have so much work and life stuff to do that I am unable to watch all these speeches. It’s giving me agita.

  77. 77.

    Almost Retired

    Just saw a clip of JD Vance saying something to the effect of “now that Walz is in Chicago, he finally gets to serve in a combat zone.”  Good God I hate that insufferable couch-fucking prick.

  78. 78.

    Seonachan

    I appreciate the tweet about Europeans appreciating the size of the US but the only thing that would impress them about our “100 accents” is that it’s so few for a country this size. Over there dialects are like zip codes.

  80. 80.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @JML:  You see comments on this blog about not wanting to be “cult-like” or “Blue MAGA.”  I doubt that I have ever had more than 80% agreement with any politician (or commenter on this blog).  I don’t see the point of emphasizing the differences during an election season.  Primaries and the legislative process are great places for those discussions.

  81. 81.

    satby

    @zhena gogolia: the Allies, the good guys. Resist libs are the people pushing back on RW disinfo on social media sites and demanding that mainstream press report the stakes, not the horserace.

  82. 82.

    3Sice

    For all the energy, the rallies and the memes…. pauses for three count, crowd laughter, dad joke grin.

    I had forgotten about his rhetorical knife work skills.

  83. 83.

    Baud

    How Tim Walz Saved Workers’ Lives and Limbs

    The Democrats’ vice-presidential nominee has won extraordinary advances in worker safety in Minnesota.

  84. 84.

    Flanders Other Neighbor

    Tony Evers really struggled just to finish his short speech last night.  As I understand it, there’s no term limits for WI governor, so I suppose the usual suspects are gearing up a mental acuity/age smear campaign.

    Not sure why the DJ didn’t cue up something catchy from the Violent Femmes for that round, though.

  88. 88.

    Leto

    @geg6: I’ve thought about this wrt how the media is screaming about lack of access. Conservatives back at the of Nixon started planning for a way to bypass the media to get their message out. The way they did it, primarily Fox News, was very siloed. Everything ran through this one entity. I think we’re engaged in the same project, but it’s through a dispersed method. Hundreds of individual people, all putting their own take on the information. It’s a very democratic way of getting your information out.

    I think it also highlights what a shit take that guy gave in the article BC linked. Herd mentality? Uniformity? Conformity? Idk what he’s smoking or snorting, but he should maybe stop.

  92. 92.

    Ceci n est pas mon nym

    @Scout211: I loved the Obamas’ speeches. Michelle struck just the right note in celebrating the hope but reminding us there are assholes ahead. I felt like we’re all saying “Aw Mom I know it’s a school night but can’t we stay up and enjoy our sugar high just a little longer?”

    Beautifully subtle size joke Barack threw in there. All our leading Dem voices are trolling him, poking him where it’s designed to maximize the futile rage, and it’s wonderful to see.

  93. 93.

    Mike E

    I like to cite the example of the Boston Marathon bombing to illustrate how far down the news media has fallen: watching the race live on ESPN, the worldwide leader in sports™, I was amazed at the length, breadth and depth of coverage which made absolute sense since this is precisely what they do. I switched to CNN and some other outlets where the reporting was so obviously inferior it was all at once jarring and unsurprising so I switched back and kept the channel there on ESPN until it got closer to dinner time.

    I happened across Inside Edition with Deborah Norville (a former MSM anchor) who hosted this sensational, celebrity-centric news magazine and again, I was pleasantly surprised by the news collection and the no-nonsense presentation of this horrifying event. I’ll never forget how much it cemented in my mind the utter lack of integrity CNN et al have when it comes to providing basic knowledge in a proper context. Villago has it right.

    @kindness: yeah well, sure it sucks to be interrupted by protests but this is what freedom actually looks like so Colbert gets his purpose in the scheme of things right, also

  94. 94.

    SatanicPanic

    The energy and excitement are real. It feels really good watching the convention, like Michelle said, there’s a magical feeling in the air. We’re on the offensive. Can’t wait to hear from Harris herself.

    And the point about filling TWO arenas in one night- damn Trump must hate that. Millions of MAGAs are shitting their pants right now.

  95. 95.

    Ken

    @Jackie: He did look tired during that Michigan speech. Very tired, very low-energy.

    (I think it was the Michigan speech — he was in a parking garage, standing in front of a few policemen who looked bored.)

  96. 96.

    kindness

    Anyone watch Colbert last night?  I did.  Chicago is loving him.  At a couple points during the show, Palestinian protesters interrupted guests yelling & chanting.  Colbert was gracious.  I’m less so.  It pisses me off that the protesters only seem to protest Democrats.  I mean, Trump has said he’d give Bibi free reign to drive the Palestinians into the sea.  Democrats on the other hand have called for even handed policy.  So why is it OK for the protesters to try and fuck up their ostensible partners and not lift a finger against those who truly despise them?  It’s a shallow hypocrisy.  Screw them.

  99. 99.

    Leto

    @Baud: which is why when they deploy her in this role, she’s so damn effective. They each had a message only they could deliver. 1-2.

     

    @Flanders Other Neighbor: we had this discussion last night. “Jump Around” is a special song they play when their football is losing, so ofc it’s always on.

    :)

  101. 101.

    moonbat

    @Ken: Started wondering at one point last night whether one goal of this convention is to give TCFFG an apoplectic fit. lol

  102. 102.

    oldgold

    EVERYYBODY says this race is going to end up being very close.  I am beginning to wonder about that.

  105. 105.

    Leto

    @Omnes Omnibus: plus not everyone aspires to the “top” echelon of politics. We need capable, competent people at all levels. We have that, and are able to showcase that to the nation. Just another selling point for team democracy.

  107. 107.

    SatanicPanic

    Dumbass Gless Kessler today:

    Mostly thematic speeches left relatively few claims to check from the roster of speakers.

    IOW Glenn wants a day off from being told he’s a fucking idiot

  112. 112.

    Balconesfault

    @Gin & Tonic:  I admit, living these days at 800 ft, I had to stop a few times once I was getting over 4,000 to let my breathing rate come down.

    And I had to remind myself over and over as cyclists caught and passed me, that 40 years and 40 pounds ago I’d have had little problem matching their pace.

  114. 114.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    @BC in Illinois:

    …her well-known weaknesses…

    And those are exactly what?  Oh yeah, weaknesses if you look at her thru right-wing framing.

    Packer’s another Atlantic clown (actually, the overwhelming majority of Atlantic “writers” are clowns) who basically launder glibertarian/right-wing talking points for broader consumption aimed primarily at the Totebagger Radio audience.

  123. 123.

    Flanders Other Neighbor

    @Balconesfault: That’s also my excuse.  However, we’re still out riding and I’d bet good money a whole bunch of guys I went to high school with are not and can’t.

  124. 124.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    @Baud: Polling says close. Our feelings mean very little.

    Polling means very little.
    I glanced at the NYT homepage the other day, always a mistake.  They led with several swing state polls. All showed Harris ahead or competitive.
    I found myself just as annoyed with this as anything else they put on their front page.  Why? It’s ostensibly good news.
    This doesn’t tell me anything useful. It doesn’t tell me what Harris will do, what the relevant arguments are, the facts behind those arguments (I wish).
    Polls are metrics for the legacy media to tell if their narratives are working on their not-so-discerning audience.​

    Good polls don’t change my need to vote or bring the others around me out to vote. They don’t even usually tell me about the down ballot. Apparently they are used to guide the trash coverage of the MSM; so, frankly, first kill all the lawyers pollsters.

  125. 125.

    Shalimar

    @Manyakitty: As I said on LGM yesterday, I can’t say that VP Harris has a better chance of winning than President Biden had.  Republicans are doing everything they can to rig it and we still can’t say for certain they won’t succeed.  But I will say absolutely that there was no way Biden was generating enough enthusiasm to blow Trump out by 7 points or more, and that is a real possibility now with Harris.

  126. 126.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    Open thread so I have a book, Dragoncraft, coming out Sept. 21. The ebook is available for pre-order on Amazon. The cover is fantastic and today is cover reveal day. You can see it at that Amazon link.

    Here’s some blurby stuff: Tireless snoop Addy and dragon-inspired glassmaker Emlin may be in love, but her father betrayed his brother, and someone still wants the brother dead.  In a treacherous world, they struggle to protect their families while hanging on to one another.

    Romeo and Juliet meet Fireborne

  130. 130.

    Mike E

    @The Kropenhagen Interpretation: Polls are metrics for the legacy media to tell if their narratives are working on their not-so-discerning audience.

    Exactly. We all need to heed Michelle Obama’s advice: when bad polling comes out, which is a certainty, put the phone down and do something about it.

  135. 135.

    Jackie

    Did this great news get mentioned?

    Rep. Mary Peltola (D-AK) “ranked first on Tuesday in an open primary to set the field for her re-election bid, claiming just over 50% of the vote in preliminary results, well ahead of 11 challengers vying for her position as the state’s sole member of the House,” the New York Times reports.

    And this?

    “Gov. Ron DeSantis’ attempt to elect conservative-leaning school board members across Florida hit a snag Tuesday, as candidates backed by the Republican governor fell in several key races,” Politico reports.

    “DeSantis, who has made reshaping Florida’s education system a top priority, endorsed 23 candidates ahead of Tuesday’s election. And as of late Tuesday night, at least 11 appear to have lost. That is a notable downturn from 2022, when DeSantis saw a runaway success: Of the 30 he endorsed two years ago, just five lost.”

    As a West Coaster, I’ve fallen behind all the fast moving posts the last two days, so apologize if already discussed!

  136. 136.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    @Baud:

    Polling means very little

    Correct, but it means more than our feelings.

    I feel like we have to do all the work and get every vote out regardless of any poll and that will mean the difference.

  138. 138.

    Gloria DryGarden

    @TBone: I skipped through b Obama speech, do you know at what minute marker is this delightful size joke?

    I listened to Michelle Obama first, and sobbed the first 10 minutes, releasing the top half inch of dread and terror I’ve been feeling.
    then it was time to try to quit staying up all night. I’ll get some more on YouTube, later.

    [oh, and I landed on a variety of little news bits, pundits, anger pieces at the childless cat woman stuff, fox giving air time to jd Vance, and fucking whathisface, who I found frighteningly hypnotic, and revoltingly certain of the things he was saying. Man knows how to work a crowd. It was pretty sickening, his alternate reality. ( I took a bullet for democracy) revolting. Any pundit discussions that headlined a rebuttal, to the cat woman speech, included more repeats of mr Vance. No, just no. But I can see how good those folks are at selling their pov.
    Revolted and cranky over it. ]
    I need some good dick jokes, and some theater where the bad guys get demolished

  140. 140.

    rikyrah

    Felt this in my soul.

     

    Kenny Akers (@KeneAkers) posted at 6:15 AM on Wed, Aug 21, 2024:
    “For years, Donald Trump did everything in his power to try to make people fear us,” she announced. “His limited and narrow view of the world made him feel threatened by the existence of two hardworking, highly educated, successful people who also happened to be Black.” — https://t.co/lPVUhXOk24
    (https://x.com/KeneAkers/status/1826216539747750353?t=vT57K1-VbMGCGVdEQu1BaQ&s=03)

  141. 141.

    tam1MI

    @kindness: It pisses me off that the protesters only seem to protest Democrats.  I mean, Trump has said he’d give Bibi free reign to drive the Palestinians into the sea.  Democrats on the other hand have called for even handed policy.  So why is it OK for the protesters to try and fuck up their ostensible partners and not lift a finger against those who truly despise them?  It’s a shallow hypocrisy.  Screw them.

    Someone in Our Failed Media Experiment finally gets it:

    This is part of a pattern. Gather any large number of Democrats together, in almost any city or state, whether at rallies, fundraisers, or presidential appearances, and pro-Palestinian protesters will try to wreck the event. These actions have been building to threats of outright violence. Pro-Trump and Republican events, meanwhile, are almost always left in peace.

    But for those who are thinking strategically, the answer is obvious: Yes, they want to elect Trump. Of course they want to elect Trump. Electing Trump is their best—and maybe only—hope… They start with a fundamental political problem: Their cause is not popular. Solid majorities of Americans accept Israel’s war in Gaza as valid and fiercely condemn the Hamas terrorist attacks as unacceptable. The exact margin varies from poll to poll depending on how the question is asked, but when presented with a binary choice between Israel and the Palestinians, Americans prefer Israel by a factor of at least two to one.

    The only answer to that question, again from the practical point of view, is the message of the protesters in Chicago: Maybe we can’t help you if you do listen to us, but we can hurt you if you don’t!

  142. 142.

    rikyrah

    Grace Panetta (@grace_panetta) posted at 9:56 PM on Tue, Aug 20, 2024:
    Michelle Obama: “The minute a lie takes hold, we cannot start wringing our hands. We cannot get a Goldilocks complex about whether everything is just right. We cannot indulge our anxieties about whether this country will elect someone like Kamala — instead of doing everything we
    )

    scary lawyerguy (@scarylawyerguy) posted at 4:40 AM on Wed, Aug 21, 2024:
    Legitimately wonder whether people in the media realize this is an indictment of them b/c what Michelle Obama is saying is that it’s up to Democrats to call out these lies b/c the media refuses to do so
    (https://x.com/scarylawyerguy/status/1826192551277113672?t=kl_kDtUGB7kBCdq0EMTQ2Q&s=03)

  145. 145.

    Ruckus

    @TBone:

    It’s only one more thing to add to the enjoyment of modern travel….

    When I traveled for work, I was once told that I was in the top 5% of customers at a major car rental company, that’s how often and how much I rented. I actually was often recognized by a couple of stewardess because I flew one leg both directions so often. Good times…..

  146. 146.

    oldster

    Every time I see delegates in cheese hats I think: Wisconsin!

    And then I think: why doesn’t every state have its own recognizable head-gear?

    Make this happen!

  148. 148.

    Geminid

    @Omnes Omnibus: I think I have seen only one actual Democrat here use the term “Blue Maga.” I’ve seen it used plenty on other forums by followers of people like Ryan Grim and Ken Klippenstein; the Jerkobin crowd.

    When a couple of the trolls who popped up in July used that invidious term I could tell where they were coming from, and it was a place hostile to my party.

  149. 149.

    Ceci n est pas mon nym

    @Leto: It was definitely a dick joke. We cracked up.

    He holds his hands a distance apart as if measuring something, brings them MUCH closer together while talking about crowd size, then glances at his hands in “surprise” at the gesture he appears to be making.

    It was a most excellent non-verbal joke.

  150. 150.

    rikyrah

    Peanut was over last night.

     

    So, you have me, the political junkie watching in the living room, and then my sister, watching in her room…

     

    We are both reacting to Forever FLOTUS… reacting to the same parts of her speech…

     

    Cheering like it’s Sunday afternoon and the NFL is on…

     

    And, she is like, ” you two are too much.”

     

    LOL

  154. 154.

    TBone

    @Ruckus: I know you know this, but never smoke in a rental car! And, don’t park it on the beach at midnight and get so busy you don’t notice when the tide comes in.  You’ll need to be towed off the beach after you empty as much ocean out of the car as you can before the tow truck arrives.  Then you’ll have to suck the rest of the water out with a carwash vacuum the next day.  Thankfully when I did that, it was a convertible and the sun assisted in the drying out.

    When I rented that Sebring, I didn’t know it would bring the sea!

  156. 156.

    SatanicPanic

    @rikyrah: I thought the Goldilocks thing was about nervous Democrats who might be afraid of nominating a Black woman, because they think the country would never elect a Black woman.

  159. 159.

    Baud

    @Geminid:

    We hold ourselves to standards, and what happens is out-group adversaries like to use those standards to troll us into believing we’re not good enough under our own criteria.  And the tactic works on some people.  We just need to stay disciplined and recognize that our standards are not for other people to enforce. They

  161. 161.

    KatKapCC

    @oldster: It would be fun to come up with the list of hats for each state.

    California…hmm, maybe we could have a sea otter or an avocado. Or a pot leaf, ROFL.

  162. 162.

    Ceci n est pas mon nym

    @rikyrah: Poor dog started lobbying for a walk about halfway through Michelle’s speech. I was not going to leave the room till I had heard both Obamas speak. I knew they’d be widely available on YouTube, but it was important to me to be there and hear them live.

    (Postscript: Dog seems happy enough this morning, I think I’m forgiven)

  168. 168.

    oldster

    @SatanicPanic:

    I thought the Goldilocks rebuke applied to all kinds of second-guessing, esp. purity-ponying.

    “Kamala isn’t tough enough on crime. Kamala is *too* tough on crime. Kamala isn’t black enough. Kamala is *too* black. Kamala is complicit in the genocide of Palestine. Kamala is an anti-semite.” And so on, for whatever the whiner’s pet issue may be.

    And Michelle says: she ain’t perfect, but she’s light-years better than the only alternative. Do something to get her elected.

  170. 170.

    Jackie

    @SatanicPanic: No, Michelle was referring to “quit fussing if our candidates aren’t ‘just right’.” No candidate is perfectly aligned with “your ideal”… and remember The Alternative and VOTE!

    Eta: Republicans voting for Harris/Walz are perfect examples.😊

  172. 172.

    SatanicPanic

    @TBone: it was about that too:

    We cannot get a Goldilocks complex about whether everything is ‘just right.’ We cannot indulge our anxieties about whether this country will elect someone like Kamala

    i don’t think it was a dig at the media

  175. 175.

    K-Mo

    @Sure Lurkalot: She’s so good.  Kessler and his recurring assignment is a good example of why I think they just don’t have enough intellectual resources.   They can’t give the kind of analysis or reality-checking that would be useful (and stand behind it) and they have an apparent dumbass on staff so they have him do this.  It’s inane.

  176. 176.

    oldster

    @KatKapCC:

    Great ideas!
    Thing is, the meaning of the hat does not have to be obvious right away. Cheeseheads only became cheeseheads via repetition and familiarity. There are lots of other symbols that Wisconsin could have chosen, and lots of other states that make cheese.

    So, states should just try things and see what sticks.

    (Though I would caution Delaware against trying to make headgear out of credit cards or incorporation forms.)

  177. 177.

    Wolvesvalley

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: Beautiful cover! I just hit the “pre-order with one click” button.

    I’m really looking forward to reading it. Every one of your books so far has been even better than the previous one.

  178. 178.

    Belafon

    @SatanicPanic: To me, it seemed she was explicitly pointing out the handwringing that went on after Biden’s debate performance. How will Democrats act if Trump’s Gish gallop is allowed to run over her by the moderators at the next debate? Will they freak out again?

  181. 181.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    @different-church-lady: Wait, when did we defend Biden?

    The media actually did notice the Democrats who defended Biden, but they waited to discuss it until:

    They got their scalp
    They could use it against the new nominee
    Their book is set to publish

  183. 183.

    artem1s

    @TBone: ​ 

    I’m ready to bang out a U turn as necessary at any time. Pivot! Do not fear change. Relish your ability to adapt!

    It has nothing to do with fearing change. It’s about not wanting to keep pivoting because some High Priest of Punditry is deliberately misleading the public just for yucks and clicks. I’m sick of the MSM keeping the entire country in a state of panic over tan suits and imaginary hordes of those people bringing taco trucks to every corner. I spent all of 15 minutes listening to MSNBC Decision Desk 2024 on day one and Noped Out. Not going there ever again. I’ll watch the Convention live stream feeds off their website. I don’t need a fucking pundit to interpret the news for me. But be aware – those who are watching PBS and MSNBC and other news shows are being fed a load of doom, hatred, and crap. They’ve already decided to keep on with the “Nancy and Kamala shivved Joe in the back and they pulled off the real coup” narrative. I for one will Nope Out of the Democratic Party if they let punditry panic take over this campaign again. The voters are sick of the constant lose/lose, dems in dissaray narrative. Too many times the dems have let themselves get bullied into questioning their candidates best qualities. Time for it to stop.

  185. 185.

    Scout211

    @SatanicPanic: I thought the Goldilocks thing was about nervous Democrats who might be afraid of nominating a Black woman, because they think the country would never elect a Black woman.

    I think that it could mean that.  But I heard it more as a caution to supporters to not cling to the perfect version in their heads about who our candidate is and what she can do. We can all talk about our versions but to make sure we still support Harris-Walz and our local Democrats.

    I heard it like the saying, “Perfect is the enemy of good.”

  186. 186.

    rikyrah

    LOL

    Ragnarok Lobster  (@eclecticbrotha) posted at 9:50 PM on Tue, Aug 20, 2024:
    “The affirmative action of generational wealth.”

    My God, the absolute shade.

    Ragnarok Lobster  (@eclecticbrotha) posted at 9:53 PM on Tue, Aug 20, 2024:
    Michelle Obama’s speaking style reminds of what my pastor said about the shade throwing ability of his wife: you’ll be halfway home after you hear her speak before you realize she just cut off your head.
    (https://x.com/eclecticbrotha/status/1826090157742658003?t=awooo210LN-eWgSQ-2NCjA&s=03)

  190. 190.

    Dave

    @rusty: Hell it includes if you are straight man the freedom to be yourself and not obsessed with if any given action of belief will label you “not a man”.

    And while I don’t think that should be the primary message it is important for a lot of men.  Particularly young ones whose frame of reference probably now includes a lot of dudes lost down the talk radio/fox news/manosphere rabbit holes.  Depending on what generation they are looking at.

    Thought the manosphere is finding plenty of older bitter marks as well.

  191. 191.

    Balconesfault

    @Sure Lurkalot:  thanks!

    Indeed, a thing of beauty.

    I wonder if Kessler is capable of feeling embarrassment?

    Or is the whole point of his column just to get reposts and clicks via websites that have names like “antiwoke.com” and “libertywarriors” reinforcing their assertion that no, it’s the Democrats who are liars.

  192. 192.

    JCJ

    @Leto:  I know you are yanking the chains of Wisconsin Badger football fans, but they have been overall rather good over the last 30 years.  Prior to that they had several lean years.

  194. 194.

    Leto

    @artem1s:

    Not going there ever again

    and

    are being fed a load of doom, hatred, and crap.

    You know these are two contradictory statements, right? Ah, ofc you do. Ok, back to it.

  195. 195.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @Dave:

    Hell it includes if you are straight man the freedom to be yourself and not obsessed with if any given action of belief will label you “not a man”.

    Given the violence I have been on the receiving end of for not meeting that standard… yes.

  196. 196.

    SatanicPanic

    @Belafon: I think it was directed at people who were suggesting that we couldn’t nominate Kamala Harris. I don’t think she was trying to say anything bad about Biden, but her point that she was finally feeling hope was hard to miss.

  197. 197.

    Leto

    @JCJ: oh I know. Last night when we were discussing the song choice, can’t remember who linked the video, but it was Wisconsin v Penn St, and Wisconsin lost that game. It’s good nature needling ;)

     

    @3Sice: “please clap” levels of energy here.

  198. 198.

    Balconesfault

    @Scout211: 

    But I heard it more as a caution to supporters to not cling to the perfect version in their heads about who our candidate is and what she can do. We can all talk about our versions but to make sure we still support Harris-Walz and our local Democrats.

    On my various social media discussions, I keep telling people that they’re idiots if they spend the next 3 months trying to chase down things they disagree with Harris and Walz about.

    Of course there are things I disagree with them about, the only person I agree with 100% of the time is myself, and I don’t even agree with everything I believed 10 years ago.

  199. 199.

    Tenar Arha

    @NotMax: They’re okay. Start by testing out a lower  dosage and see how you react. (You could find out it makes your heart race too much, or you’re allergic to the adhesives). Also, bring something to fiddle with for your fingers. Fidget ring, pencil, or straw all good.

  200. 200.

    Ruckus

    @geg6:

    There are enough of them that we do have to give at least half a damn what they think, especially if their entire train of bull and shit is to screw up and over everything and everyone.

    A large number of them are followers. Which means they just fall in lockstep and think as told. And right now the teller is shitforbrains. A far worse than normal example of how far humanity can fall off the train of humanity.

  202. 202.

    rikyrah

    Kyle Griffin (@kylegriffin1) posted at 9:52 PM on Tue, Aug 20, 2024:
    This passage from Michelle Obama:

    “[Kamala] understands that most of us will never be afforded the grace of failing forward… we will never benefit from the affirmative action of generational wealth.

    “If we bankrupt a business… or choke in a crisis, we don’t get a second, third, or fourth chance.

    “If things don’t go our way, we don’t have the luxury of whining or cheating others to get further ahead… we don’t get to change the rules so we always win.

    “If we see a mountain in front of us, we don’t expect there to be an escalator waiting to take us to the top.

    “No, we put our heads down. We get to work. In America, we do something.”
    (https://x.com/kylegriffin1/status/1826089941530788338?t=jWxICzYeK0Q74hGvp79sxw&s=03)

  204. 204.

    Balconesfault

    @Belafon: 

    How will Democrats act if Trump’s Gish gallop is allowed to run over her by the moderators at the next debate? Will they freak out again?

    Biden’s problem, and even he admitted it, was that you can’t respond to a Gish gallop by going into the trenches to dig out the individual facts that refute the bullshit.

    Because in the allotted time, you can only take on one or two of those assertions and the rest end up unchallenged.

    I assume Harris understands this and will instead just step back and point out that everything Trump is saying is a lie, and make him defend his bull crap rather than her defending reality.

  205. 205.

    Josie

    @TBone: ​
     It’s my understanding that federal law prevents removal from voter rolls up to 90 days before a federal election. Ninety days have passed, so these efforts would seem to be useless at this point. Could someone more well versed in the legal issues confirm this?

  209. 209.

    Scout211

    @Omnes Omnibus: @Geminid: You see comments on this blog about not wanting to be “cult-like” or “Blue MAGA.”

    I just skip over the commenters who use straw man arguments to make their points.  Using an  extreme version of what a commenter said to continue an argument is tedious and annoying. So many commenters have tried to say, “that’s not what I said” or some version of that but the argument seems to just escalate when there is an engagement.  I just skip, or pie because it’s impossible to reason with someone who hears only the extreme version of what is being said.

  210. 210.

    UncleEbeneezer

    @Scout211: That was my interpretation too.  POTUS is the leader of an Imperialist world power.  The job entails a bunch of shit you won’t agree with or like, by definition.  Get the fuck over it and vote for the exponentially-better candidate like a god-damn adult.  This ain’t complicated.  Ignore the rat-fuckers urging you not to vote.

  212. 212.

    tam1MI

    @artem1s: It has nothing to do with fearing change. It’s about not wanting to keep pivoting because some High Priest of Punditry is deliberately misleading the public just for yucks and clicks. I’m sick of the MSM keeping the entire country in a state of panic over tan suits and imaginary hordes of those people bringing taco trucks to every corner. I spent all of 15 minutes listening to MSNBC Decision Desk 2024 on day one and Noped Out. Not going there ever again. I’ll watch the Convention live stream feeds off their website. I don’t need a fucking pundit to interpret the news for me. But be aware – those who are watching PBS and MSNBC and other news shows are being fed a load of doom, hatred, and crap. They’ve already decided to keep on with the “Nancy and Kamala shivved Joe in the back and they pulled off the real coup” narrative. I for one will Nope Out of the Democratic Party if they let punditry panic take over this campaign again. The voters are sick of the constant lose/lose, dems in dissaray narrative. Too many times the dems have let themselves get bullied into questioning their candidates best qualities. Time for it to stop.

    What many in the Legacy Media don’t seem to realize or don’t want to admit is that their crazed jihad against Joe Biden was for a significant number of people the last fucking straw.

  214. 214.

    rikyrah

    LarryO continues to win. They were talking about Doug and how he resigned from his law firm and took a job as a professor,because he didn’t even want the APPEARANCE of impropriety, and LarryO went off, talking about how John Roberts’ wife is continuing to rake in MILLIONS at a firm who has clients that go before the Supreme Court. He was absolutely disgusted as he said it. An offended LarryO is always the best LarryO.

  216. 216.

    Ruckus

    @rodwell:

    Joe Biden is old, we all know that. He is not all that much older than I am so I have an understanding of old, from the perspective of actually belonging to that segment of humanity. And one of the things I’ve learned in all those years is that we are all subject to time. I had a cousin who made 6 months. Not 6 yrs, not 60 yrs, 6 months. In the overall concept of life there are a number of steps. Old is one of them, and not everyone gets up to old.

    Life is what we do with the time we spend using oxygen. Life is better when you enjoy it, as against trying to make it worse for everyone else so that you feel like you’ve done something. And to me that last sentence is the difference between liberals and conservatives.

  217. 217.

    rikyrah

    @tam1MI:

    What many in the Legacy Media don’t seem to realize or don’t want to admit is that their crazed jihad against Joe Biden was for a significant number of people the last fucking straw.

     

    The absolute last straw.

  218. 218.

    UncleEbeneezer

    @Geminid: Almost no one here uses that particular phrase, but several people constantly express the same spirit/sentiment in different language.  Just replace “Blue MAGA” with references to Silos, Lockstep, “blindly loyal” and Groupthink.

  220. 220.

    dm

    @kindness:

    It’s simple, really. They know they stand a chance of persuading Democrats. There’s no point in protesting at Republican events because Republicans won’t listen and won’t care.

  222. 222.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    @tam1MI: What many in the Legacy Media don’t seem to realize or don’t want to admit is that their crazed jihad against Joe Biden was for a significant number of people the last fucking straw.

    @rikyrah: @Frankensteinbeck:

    One fucking hundred percent.

  226. 226.

    Leto

    @rikyrah: I thought he was talking about Uncle Clarence and JENNNAY at first, but then remembered, oh yeah, her. They don’t even know the word integrity.

  227. 227.

    Citizen Alan

    @Scout211: I laughed continuously at the juxtaposition of the incredibly straight laced white dude who was calling out of the states while standing uncomfortably next to DJ Cassidy, who was decked out in blue lame from head to toe with a straw hat and sunglasses and conducting himself like he was in a club or perhaps performing at a wedding reception. I want to see them in a buddy cop movie.

  230. 230.

    Leto

    @Citizen Alan: rikyrah informed us that the DJ appears regularly at BET shows/events, and the “PASS THE MIC” is one of his signature things. I just called him DJ blue shirt, but yeah, the contrasting visuals was funny :)

  232. 232.

    UncleEbeneezer

    @dm: By this logic we shouldn’t waste our time protesting the Klan/Nazis.  And the Women’s March and all the Muslim Ban protests were a waste of time, since they were protesting Trump instead of Dems.

  234. 234.

    tam1MI

    @dm: It’s simple, really. They know they stand a chance of persuading Democrats. There’s no point in protesting at Republican events because Republicans won’t listen and won’t care.

    No, it’s much more malevolent than that. And the MSM has finally noticed:

    This is part of a pattern. Gather any large number of Democrats together, in almost any city or state, whether at rallies, fundraisers, or presidential appearances, and pro-Palestinian protesters will try to wreck the event. These actions have been building to threats of outright violence. Pro-Trump and Republican events, meanwhile, are almost always left in peace.

    The only answer to that question, again from the practical point of view, is the message of the protesters in Chicago: Maybe we can’t help you if you do listen to us, but we can hurt you if you don’t!

    If Harris loses,, pro-Palestinian protesters can claim that they were responsible for her defeat. That claim might not be true—in fact it probably would not be true—but try disproving it. The pro-Palestinian movement would have at least some basis to argue: You lost because you alienated us.

  235. 235.

    balconesfault

    @Flanders Other Neighbor: I also had Eileen pick me up (scoop me off the pavement?) up at the top, rather than riding back down.  While it looked fun watching the riders zooming down while I climbed … I really wouldn’t have trusted my descending skills through all those hairpins on the way down, given my level of fatigue and the altitude

    I’d have probably worn out my brake pads before the bottom!

  238. 238.

    K-Mo

    @Balconesfault: She *should* be able to prepare an effective engagement strategy.  My amateur suggestions:

    1) Flag the gallop as full of mistruths and promise to have her staff provide a detailed rundown (and then do it!  Don’t wait for anyone else to do it!)

    2) Identify the key lie that underlies his case and trash it.  At the last debate (and since) his argument was that everything was great under him and everything turned bad under Biden.  Actual facts: Trump cache in riding a long recovery engineered by Obama and oversaw its collapse.

    3) Get on to her positive message.

  239. 239.

    balconesfault

    @tam1MI:   But be aware – those who are watching PBS and MSNBC and other news shows are being fed a load of doom, hatred, and crap. 

    Moreover, they’ll have their feeds curated …

    https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2024/8/19/2264461/-PBS-bloviators-censor-Hadley-Duvall-s-DNC-story?pm_campaign=front_page&pm_source=trending&pm_medium=web&fbclid=IwY2xjawEy9jlleHRuA2FlbQIxMAABHQ-uxqAI5cZq9qt4YS8KdYW7cu3csVjy0zC077Frc8RvKAihWKhmCFhpQg_aem_OqWZiw4yZcOliVl1YeAyzw

  241. 241.

    Citizen Alan

    @Seonachan: Actual linguists would say that we have a lot more than a hundred accents in america. Probably statistically not as many as europe, but then we do not have the diversity of languages spoken commonlyv here that europe does. And the fact that the whole country gets its news and entertainment from a common source does tend to homogenize all the accents Into something approaching that of the typical NBC news broadcaster. But the International Dialects of English Archive lists eleven accents for mississippi alone. When I started at Ole Miss IN 1987, It marked my first close interactions with people from the delta, from yazoo city, and from the coast, and to me, they sounded like they were from completely different states.

  242. 242.

    pajaro

    @tam1MI:

    Pro-Palestinian protesters only aim their message at Democrats for two reasons:  first, that it’s a Democratic president who is conducting the policy (providing military aid to Israel) that they oppose.  It’s analogous to why in 1968 the demonstrations were held at the Democratic (not Republican) convention;  and second, that it’s only Democrats who will listen to them.  They are aware that Republicans don’t give a shit what they think, that they will sick the police on them, and that they will use the demonstration as a reason to demonize them.

  243. 243.

    Dave

    @Frankensteinbeck: I’ve done some very traditionally masculine things (infantry and way more war than Vance) for a variety of reasons some neutral some absorbed toxicity (being a “sensitive” kid and responding to that is the toxic) so I totally understand the fear that many guys do have and it is well past time to kill toxic masculinity.

    And I feel you for being targeted for not conforming to that. That shit is ugly and like much trauma has a bad habit of turning the victims into the victimizers. Still have a lot of difficulty being vulnerable in a real way it’s a slow sometimes painful process to something better.

  245. 245.

    Ruckus

    @kindness:

    It’s humanity.

    It is good and it is bad. Sometimes it’s both at the same time.

    Anyone who ever figures out how to actually fix this will be by far the first.

  247. 247.

    Chris Johnson

    @Jackie: I can do ya one better. :)

    Swift appears… and VENTS her outrage at Trump in a new song, second in a medley she performs live at a Kamala Harris rally. And it just eviscerates him, it’s all about how she’s moving on and everyone’s moving on, we have power now and we don’t have to take his shit anymore. Doesn’t even mention Kamala Harris’s name directly, or Trump’s: it’s implicit and understood that we know what she means.

    The first song in the medley is ‘Look What You Made Me Do’ :D

  248. 248.

    Dave

    @Paul in KY: No but if you indoctrinate yourself sufficiently it can become an addiction and craving in the way the worst sort of drugs can.

    With the extra bonus that there are a great many narratives available and even encouraged that make it easy to frame it as a sort of primal connection for lack of a better term.

    Last tour was 12 years ago now and I nearly lost myself in it. Literally and conceptually but sometimes it whispers in my ear and the desire to be in the madness again is nearly palpable.

    So yes we need to do better and really much of the online right is about feeding this narrative and it’s intoxicating dysfunction to young men who are susceptible to it…

     

    I might be a bit off topic.

  252. 252.

    Matt McIrvin

    @tam1MI: I think there’s another aspect. For as long as I’ve lived, activists and advocates on the left have craved the drama involved in morally condemning and rejecting “their own side”. It’s much more exciting than doing it to your actual enemies. It marks you as a person of principle, sadder but wiser, no dumb cheerleader.

    This isn’t just the further left– the performative centrists are if anything even worse.

    Things like the Lincoln Project seem remarkable because we’re not used to the right doing much of this.

  253. 253.

    eclare

    @Jackie:

    Her shows in London are done, I don’t think she has any scheduled for a couple of months.

    I hope she calls in on a videophone holding one of her cats!

  254. 254.

    UncleEbeneezer

    @Matt McIrvin: We need a “horseshoe” metaphor to refer to the fact that Centrists and Leftists both constantly do the same bullshit they mock the other for doing.  It’s totally the Spiderman-pointing-at-Spiderman meme.  The complete denial and like of self-awareness by both, is hilarious.

  255. 255.

    Citizen Alan

    @K-Mo: I would love for Kamala to have a notepad and a pen with her during the debate just so that she can keep a running tab of how many obvious lies Shitgibbon says in response to the questioning. Then before she begins her answer to any questions, she should say something on the lines of “For those of you playing at home, by my count, Donald is up to seven  easily disproven lies with no pushback from the moderator, and we are only on question 4.”  And only then should she answer the actual question.

  257. 257.

    Matt McIrvin

    @UncleEbeneezer: Liberals and progressives are inherently suspicious of partisanship– it’s usually used pejoratively. They’re more fond of ideology, because that’s real intellectual content– and then they get hung up on differences of ideology. But I think we could use more partisanship. It’s how things actually get done.

  260. 260.

    dm

    @UncleEbeneezer: The Women’s March and the airport protests were different — then you’re resisting power (airport protests) and hoping to persuade your fellow citizens (Women’s March), plus maybe demonstrating some political power. Again, there’s no hope of persuading those in power, the goal is to change who is in power.

    With the Nazis and fascists, you’re not trying to persuade them, you’re actually resisting them.

    But protesting at speeches and rallies, you’re hoping to get a hearing from potential allies.

    And it’s working: Joe said the other day they had a point. The Harris campaign has been reaching out to members of the uncommitted movement.

  261. 261.

    Eolirin

    @Geminid: She is. I think she’s got a good shot of replacing Murkowski when she retries. I think she’s the only Dem who even has a chance.

  262. 262.

    Ruckus

    @TBone:

    Don’t smoke. At one point in time I smoked a bit of a then non legal substance but even that was a rather small amount. Just never had the interest. I’ve also never parked a rental car on the beach and I used to rent weekly. More miles on rentals per year than my own car. Awww the life of the frequent traveler, getting almost as much air time as a flight crew member, waiting, baggage check, sleeping sitting down, sleeping on the floor of the airport in Atlanta because the flight was canceled and the airline hotels were the cheap ones across town with an hour bus ride each way and the floor was better, carrying the event backgate money to the office, often $30K or more and having the occasional bag check clerk freak out when inspecting said bag….. made a nice pillow to sleep on the floor though. The things I’ve tried to forget and have been unable to….

  263. 263.

    Paul in KY

    @Dave: Maybe you’re not completely ‘sane’ ;-)

    I served in military, but (thank God) was never in a combat theater. My dad was with Patton’s Third.

  266. 266.

    Geminid

    @Eolirin: Senator Murkowski and Rep.  Peltola campaigned together during the last weeks of the 2022 midterm election

    Ed. Alaska has a lot of unaffiliated voters and they probably liked seeing a Dem and a Republican campaign together.

  267. 267.

    Ruckus

    @Leto:

    They know integrity, they just don’t think it’s actually important.

    OK some of them very likely have zero clue what the word actually means, They also might be mistaking it for integer.

    Or intelligence.

    Maybe not that last one, that might mean they have some……

  270. 270.

    knittingbull

    @NotMax:

    I quit 27 years ago with them, seriously doubt I could do it without them. I’m sure they’ve improved over the years.

  271. 271.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    @NotMax: On the nicotine patches, keep some medical tape handy.  There is a very good chance some will fall off sometimes.

  272. 272.

    LadySuzy

    @kindness: My hypothesis: protesters know that republicans don’t give a damn about the Palestinians. They know that there is  absolutely no leverage possible against a corrupt party who is aligned with corrupt Netanyahu.

    As opposed to the democratic party who is willing to listen. They sense that their applying pressure could have some effect.

    We’ve seen this phenomenon on different other issues over the years. People don’t protest against the GOP because they know it is absolutely futile. They try to apply pressure on the sole political party that is open to listen to others, and open to find solutions.

  273. 273.

    BellyCat

    @NotMax: Highly recommend Nicotine mini lozenges (2 or 4 mg) if the patch doesn’t work out. Best deal is at Walmart. Even better deal (half the cost of Walmart) is Sam’s Club.

    Quitting smoking is something your lungs will undoubtedly thank you for. Quitting nicotine would be great too, but I happen to love nicotine as much as coffee And can’t drink coffee without CRAVING nicotine when trying to quit.

    Ultimately, can’t tolerate the “dull crayon” feeling when trying to quit nicotine (which I attempt for a few weeks every year or so, unsuccessfully I might add!). Been using the mini lozenges for years.

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