BREAKING: RFK Jr. just announced that Kamala Harris refused to even meet with him. Retweet so all Americans see this and know Kamala Harris is already putting her incredibly decision making abilities on display. pic.twitter.com/w7UPYmUSiZ
— Kamala’s Wins (@harris_wins) August 23, 2024
political failson endorses real estate failson
should have done the endorsement on apartheid failson's twitter for a failson trifects
— Cake or Death (@Johngcole) August 24, 2024
Ed Kilgore, at NYMag — “RFK Jr., Trump Form Coalition of Vengeful Whiners”:
… Well over halfway through his presser, Kennedy finally pivoted to the positive case for endorsing Trump, asserting that they were in agreement on the key issues of “free speech, the Ukraine War, and the war on children.” Again, it seems Trump’s free-speech commitment amounts to little more than being the enemy of Kennedy’s enemies, particularly those who have mocked his subscription to an array of conspiracy theories. He made the most sense in accurately describing the 45th president as lukewarm at best toward Ukraine. As for whether Trump will act on the prime concern of the Kennedy-Shanahan ticket — the alleged government-corporate plot to kill, sicken and fatten up kids to make money for Big Pharma and Big Ag — RFK Jr. seems to be relying mostly on blind faith. He said he hoped that Trump would “keep his promises in this case,” recognizing that hadn’t been a very good bet in the past, along with an acknowledgement that they don’t agree on a lot of issues. (That’s an understatement; in April Trump accused Kennedy of being “far more LIBERAL than anyone running as a Democrat,” and more liberal than Jill Stein or Cornel West.)
And so, this deeply alienated man will form a strange partnership with the Republican candidate for president based mostly on a common sense of grievance with Democrats and other elites, and a common lust for vengeance. As for what his endorsement will be worth, that’s unclear. He’s been dropping like a rock in the polls, especially since Kamala Harris became the Democratic candidate; the most recent national survey, by RMG Research, put him at three percent of the vote. And it is not at all clear how many of his remaining supporters will follow him over the brink into MAGA-land, which some correctly perceive as a place where environmentalists and those who fret about military spending (a particular preoccupation of Kennedy’s running mate, Nicole Shanahan, who wasn’t at the presser but was apparently in on the decision) and childhood health are often treated as hippies and suspected Marxists. The timing of the move was convenient in that many pollsters already in the field to figure out if Harris will get a post-convention “bounce” will also be able to discern whether Kennedy’s move swayed any actual voters.
We’ll also see what, if any, effect RFK Jr.’s support has on Trump, surely the most narcissistic and hard-to-influence presidential candidate ever. At his presser, RFK Jr. said he wanted to introduce a “culture of kindness” into the Trump campaign. Good luck with that, Bobby. Probably should stick to the script of whining and plotting vengeance.
robert kennedy is just an awful human being in every conceivable way but i appreciate him essentially saying his campaign was a ratfucking operation that didn’t work so now it’s time to just outwardly work to beat the democratic party because nobody likes him because, again, he is a garbage human
— not an art thief (@famousartthief.bsky.social) Aug 24, 2024 at 12:17 AM
RFK Jr is planning to leave his campaign in Central Park and blame it on cyclists.
— Patrick Chovanec (@prchovanec) August 24, 2024
https://t.co/dav0LUlOzU pic.twitter.com/lg5hDaPqC1
— Benjy Sarlin (@BenjySarlin) August 23, 2024
He’s home now where he belongs. Vladimir Putin’s new MAGA Republican Party. pic.twitter.com/twdtXkrjFJ
— Ron Filipkowski (@RonFilipkowski) August 24, 2024
brainworm starving up there https://t.co/a2ujwTM31Y
— Mira of Kyiv ???? (@reshetz) August 23, 2024
the American political media is a catastrophic failure, chapter eleventy kabillion.
there is not a single Democratic voter who thinks that rejecting RFK Jr. is a "tough puzzle". not one. but this guy has to make it up to pretend there's some kind of horse race drama here. https://t.co/NEt7CWQjsY
— Travis Mason-Bushman ???? (@polarscribe) August 23, 2024
I dunno, he’s probably lucky most people weren’t talking about how he led the anti-vaccine movement in Samoa, directly causing a measles outbreak that killed 80 children https://t.co/WtZrTPtLCl
— Mr. Chau (@Srirachachau) August 23, 2024
Sidebar: Someone needs to explain the Sunk Cost Fallacy to Ms. Shanahan…
RFK Jr’s VP Nicole Shanahan says they cannot endorse Trump until he admits Operation Warp Speed was a failure:
"The hesitation we have right now in joining forces with Trump is that he has not apologized or publicly come out and said Operation Warp Speed was his fault.
The… pic.twitter.com/K08QJnweNT
— End Tribalism in Politics (@EndTribalism) August 23, 2024
War for Ukraine Day 913: Ukrainian Independence Day
Splitting Image
I’m hearing that the Trump campaign is beginning to feel that they cannot win the election without Pennsylvania, and are responding to the situation by sending J. D. Vance to campaign there for the entire rest of the campaign.
Surprisingly, this is not putting a dent in the feeling of optimism that has been growing in me for the last few weeks.
Gvg
I wonder if the tabloids will finally stop running weird Kennedy clan stories whenever they run out of any new made up scandals? Will the celebrity mags stop running Kennedy nostalgia every couple of years? it’s been decades, the topic is a little old.
Trump is so stuck in the past, and some others like Brannon, they actually thought this Kennedy could impact the election. They all need their heads examined.
kindness
RFK Jr’s campaign was a grift funded by Republican daddies to rat fuck Joe Biden. RFK Jr more or less admits it. His VP is still acting like she can deny it.
Dangerman
Ms. Shanahan waiting for a Trump apology? Shit, I’m waiting for a Lottery ticket win. At least I have a nonzero chsnce.
Chet Murthy
@kindness: “His VP”
Gosh, I wonder what she thinks now. Since Bear Boy is no longer running for Preznit, Shanahan is ….. a third wheel, right? What’s she expecting?
KatKapCC
Sure, bro.
wjca
It was obvious months ago that, without Pennsylvania, Trump has no real path to victory. Only complete morons would be only now beginning to grasp that.
Given that requirement, sending Vance there even once, let alone for an extended stay, is the definition of counterproductive. Which aligns well with the Trump campaign’s track record.
HumboldtBlue
That man is bugfuck crazy, and he makes even Trump, that fantastical collection of moldy cheese and old socks, look somewhat normal.
dmsilev
I think my favorite summary of the RFK Jr endorsement was “You think Vance is weird? Hold my bear”.
dmsilev
@Splitting Image:
“If you promise to vote for me, I’ll send him somewhere else”. I dunno, seems like a compelling pitch to me.
Chet Murthy
OK, I saw two cray-cray things to say:
Vance says TCFG will veto an abortion ban ( https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2024-election/jd-vance-says-trump-veto-national-abortion-ban-rcna168084 )
That’s insane.
Jay
@Chet Murthy:
It’s a “Say Anything” Campaign. Words have no meaning and never match up with actions.
HumboldtBlue
Grandmas of a certain age are on alert when JD Vance shows up and the doilies are on the furniture.
Now that’s some sexy lingerie.
West of the Rockies
@Chet Murthy:
Both of these will alienate the moronic, bigoted base but bring in no new voters.
Raoul Paste
@Jay: Exactly
TooManyJens
Someone found an old article where they interviewed RFK Jr’s daughter and how the fuck do the stories about this guy keep getting worse?
https://bsky.app/profile/marisakabas.bsky.social/post/3l2j5n6rcdv25
TS
@Chet Murthy:
I think he also said his campaign is full of joy – the joy of hate is about all he has. Whatever Harris/Walz promote, the weirdo replies with “I said that, I will do that”.
Thanks AL for all your uplifting and positive threads, it is so great to read them all.
mrmoshpotato
@TooManyJens: Whale juice shampoo!
SpaceUnit
This is rapidly becoming the scenario in which a whole bunch of clowns trapped in a burning big tent and tripping on bad acid find a cache of weapons and turn on one another.
ETA: I imagine even Putin is doing a face palm right now.
Chet Murthy
@TooManyJens: His daughter Kathleen (“Kick”) was 6 at the time of these events. That was 1994. He’d been separated from Kick’s mother for 2yr, so this was at a time when he shared custody. The mind boggles. She was -six-.
mrmoshpotato
@Chet Murthy: Fond childhood memories!
Richard
@SpaceUnit haha well said and a good description.
BR
@Chet Murthy:
Yeah, Trump brayed on Truth Social that he will be good for women and reproductive rights. I saw some social media posts saying that the evangelicals are freaking out over this. And there’s no way anyone who was leaning Dem is going to get tricked by this, so it’s just a self-inflicted wound.
John Revolta
After all, look how great it worked for Ronny ‘Boots’ in Iowa!
Chet Murthy
@John Revolta: “sending J. D. Vance to campaign there for the entire rest of the campaign.”
Every day he tells himself “the old man might kick off, the old man might kick off, the old man might kick off.” If you could bottle self-hatred and sell it, milking J Divans would make you a rich, rich man.
BR
@TooManyJens:
What. The.
I didn’t think RFK Jr could get any creepier or weirder. Someone needs to do a Venn diagram of RFK Jr, Trump, and Vance weirdness.
Edit, from that thread:
HumboldtBlue
New Drone Footage From The Eruption In Iceland – Burning Moss and Dramatic Landscape
BR
@TooManyJens:
This story has a less than ideal title for RFK Jr:
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2024/08/rfk-jr-endorse-trump-execute-drug-dealers/679597/
And it’s not an endearing story.
John Revolta
@TooManyJens: …………why didn’t they just…………close the windows??
Chet Murthy
@BR: It doesn’t exactly make Joseph P Kennedy II look like a paragon, either.
BR
@Chet Murthy:
No it doesn’t. And I remember he tried to stir up some Dem primary drama a few years back, but I don’t really remember what. It was all Mass politics and I don’t follow it.
Chet Murthy
@BR: That was Joe Kennedy III primarying Markey, perhaps? The third, not the second.
TooManyJens
@John Revolta: Someone pointed out that to bungie-cord the whale head to the car they would have needed to open the windows to run the cord through the interior. (Assuming they didn’t have a roof rack.) I mean, you could still close them most of the way but the whale juice is gonna find the gaps.
BR
@Chet Murthy:
Oh, whoops. They’re all the same to me…
Chet Murthy
@BR: I encountered a “Joe Kennedy” [not the one we’re discussing] when I was cleaning up an I/T mess at a big Boston custodial bank. He was harmless enough; also useless. I was there to do -work-, to find and fix bugs before the contract got torn up. He was there to …. idunno, wander around and talk to people. Nice work if you can get it, I guess.
Generational wealth is a pox.
mrmoshpotato
@John Revolta: Because they needed fresh air! Duh! 😁
mrmoshpotato
@TooManyJens:
LMAO!
HumboldtBlue
Two Jews On The Street. Absolutely brilliant.
John Revolta
@TooManyJens: Hmmm. Okay, I guess I’ll buy that……….. seems to me you could still get the windows pretty much closed though. Maybe there wasn’t as much whale juice as I had pictured. God, I HOPE there wasn’t as much whale juice as I had pictured.
Jay
@John Revolta:
If they used bungee cords or rope, that’s a 1/4 inch to 1/2 inch gap if they ran it through the windows, and of course, the rotting whale juice will wick it’s way down the tie downs, dripping off the whole way.
The “trick” is to use zap straps, also known as ratchet straps, through the door jam, keeping the straps tight, through the interior, before closing the doors, keeping the ratchets outside the car. So you can then run the straps over the whales head and tighten them down.
What kind of whale? Had to be like a Pilot Whale.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
Speaking of that, I am wondering how long before Mushroom dick’s minons releasing a badly edited version of Harris acceptance speech were they replace Harris with Trump.
FelonyGovt
JD Vance in Pennsylvania should go over about as well as Dr. Oz with his crudités.
Splitting Image
@John Revolta:
If the people involved had resembled rational human beings in any way, there wouldn’t have been any whale juice to worry about.
scav
Between the bear and the whale, can we agree that the resale value of any Kennedy owned automobile has just plummeted?
sukabi
@scav: at this point I’d be surprised if he didn’t haul 2 legged corpses in his car….
allium
@BR: Joseph Kennedy II (aka Joe Jr.) died while taking part in Operation Aphrodite, an unsuccessful plan to equip worn-out bombers with remote-control systems and use them as cruise missiles. The bombers still needed human pilots to take off, so a pilot and co-pilot would take the plane up to about 2000 feet, arm the remote control systems and explosives, and bail out. Joe Jr. died when his plane detonated before and his co-pilot could escape.
Interestingly, Joe Junior was being groomed by his father to get into politics and possibly win the Presidency. When Joe Jr. died, his father transferred his political ambitions to Joe’s brother Jack, and the rest is history.
Frankensteinbeck
@John Revolta:
The whale will be in autolysis by that point, so it is constantly producing new juice. The brain is definitely slowly turning into goo and leaking out. The smell will be an absolute nightmare and that stuff is not clear or watery either.
David 🐝KHive🐝 Koch
Yet again Junior Kennedy left his supporters hanging
mrmoshpotato
@Frankensteinbeck: DId not need to know.
HumboldtBlue
Opal loves her cheese.
John Revolta
I can sense whale juice slowly congealing its way into the collective ambiance here. “Welcome to Balloon Juice- now featuring Whale Juice!!”
Gotta move with the times y’all.
Jay
@John Revolta:
Team Trump Whale Juice, only $159 an ounce.
Certified.
buy on line at http://www.wRiPuOfF.ru
Weird, weird and weirdest.
HumboldtBlue
It’s Time For Bloopers | Olympic Highlights with Kevin Hart and Snoop Dogg
Geoduck
Another way to dispose of a dead whale.
John Revolta
@Jay: Honestly, way back at #18 when mrmoshpotato said “Whale juice shampoo!”, and before I had clicked on the link, I had no trouble believing that a) whale juice shampoo was an actual thing and b) RFK Jr. had been using it on his daughter and maybe himself too. These are the rigs of the time……………
matt
Quitting the presidential race to spend more time with heroin.
Jay
@matt:
Gloria DryGarden
They still have paid door-knocking gigs in some of the swing states.
(from previous thread)
so excellent. How can I find out about postcards for the eastern Colorado district where a really decent electable democrat is running against Lauren boebert, in a usually red district? That’s the campaign I’d like to help. Do I just call my local state democrats office?
2liberal
@Gloria DryGarden: boebert moved to CO-4 and will most likely cruise to victory in the general
Juju
@HumboldtBlue: When you mentioned moldy cheese, I thought the rest of the sentence was going to include the phrase, with raccoons in an ugly suit, look somewhat normal. I was a bit disappointed.
Jay
@2liberal:
Maybe, maybe not.
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/colorado/
Juju
@Chet Murthy: I don’t know if that’s insane as much as truly unbelievable as pigs flying or monkeys coming out of, as Joe Biden might say, “ well anyway..,”.
Gloria DryGarden
I feel sad today.
My close friend from high school is so ridulously republican that she’s posting on Facebook about Kennedy having a good speech, and the other day, vaguely trying to throw scary words and shade at
kanaka(really need my tablet to catch on) Kamala Harris because her dad published a book about economics that might be “Marxist”. Some of you already replied about that. On her same thread, she answered my what do you mean what is your point question, in a vague way, and said she’s conservative, not into big government.
But she’s not considering/responding at all my post to her about how 80% of White House staff, and a whole bunch of republicans are abandoning Maga, saying that TcFG is unfit and dangerous, and that I trust their thinking. She’s posted that she doesn’t buy the dictator idea about trumplet, she thinks it’s the democrats, who gave dictatorial ideas. God. JFC
She’s An old bestie, who went to medical school, and is a smart caring woman, but apparently can’t think long enough to hear anything new. It saddens me when respected old friends stop thinking and get hypnotized by the weirdos over there. I won’t spend more words on her post. But it hurts.
And these people shock me. They keep repeating their strange talking points, the people in that pro tRump camp.
I did listen to a few minutes of Donald making speeches. He modulates his voice well, sounds soothing, calming, hypnotic, almost reasonable. I could see how one might be hypnotized temporarily. But there is so much clear fucking evidence that he is not to be trusted for any reason, at any moment, about anything, except that you can count on him to lie and find benefit for himself. She’s gonna vote for him, I bet, and thus for the project 2025, and her sister is gay, too.
How people can buy stereotypes, decide for others that their life choices are wrong, and then vote in a way that hurts others… it boggles my mind most especially when I know them. It hurts to know this about people in general, and that there are such high percentages still pro maga, that’s it’s still a close race…
and it hurts even worse when it’s friends, and I can no longer trust that friend or any of their thinking.
Viva BrisVegas
I’m still boggled by the logistics of this whale business. Where do you find a whale small enough that the head can be lifted onto the roof of a car? How do you cut it off? Bungie cords or no bungie cords how do you keep the head from sliding off the car roof? What do you do with it when you get it home?
Ksmiami
@Gloria DryGarden: meh. I understand being a little sad, but on the other hand, it’s freeing to shed people in your life that are diametrically opposed to your values- life is too short to make excuses for people who can’t be arsed to see reason and care about others. If your friend is voting for Trump, likes his platform and refuses to consider your opinions, that friend is inherently a bad person. The GOP is a Nazi Bar – voters who walk in and drink are Nazis.
Maxim
@Gloria DryGarden: Looks like Ike McCorkle is the one polling well against Boebert in CO-4. Here’s his campaign website:
https://ike4co.com
If you scroll down you’ll see volunteer opportunities.
Citizen Alan
@Gloria DryGarden: “Did your cult leader tell you to believe that?” is how I respond to people like that now. I won’t even try to engage with a Trump voter on the merits of any issue. Because they do not bring merit to any discussion.
Maxim
@Viva BrisVegas:
Chainsaw, according to the daughter.
@Viva BrisVegas:
She says he liked to study animal skulls, so he probably intended to get all the flesh off the skull somehow.
MattF
Alexandra Petri reports the reaction of the brain worm (gift link).
Jay
@Viva BrisVegas:
@Maxim:
Pilot whales, which often ground themselves have a head about the size of a cow.
Chainsaw is a clown show, messy, wasteful, ineffective, sawsall is the way to go.
Brainworm Kennedy has several large “estates”. The whale head can be left in the open, far enough away from the mansion, pool, tennis courts, swimming pool, guest houses to let natural rot, scavengers, bugs strip the skull and weather wash the skull.
It can also be flensed removing most of the fat, tissue, skin to speed the process.
The brainworm Rich are not like you or me.
Done right, you can pretty much strap anything down and keep it from sliding around.
Given his roadkill obsession, I am surprised he doesn’t keep bodybags in his trunk, but maybe that’s a bit too Chappaquiddick when the cops routinely pull him over.
The Thin Black Duke
I’m old enough to remember the photograph of a dying Bobby Kennedy on the kitchen floor, his glazed eyes staring at nothing. I can’t imagine what Bobby would think of the sick joke his son turned into.
TBone
I have trouble getting myself to pay any more than fleeting attention to the latest iteration of Kennedy, seeing how far from the mighty oak that nut has fallen and rolled away. I do enjoy the snark of the
tweetsxits though 😁Yesterday (maybe it was at Digby’s place) someone pointed out that Donold has called for the execution of drug dealers more than once. Recently, even. In light of the college roommate outing turd junior as a cocaine dealer, you’d think he might have had at least one thought about his choice prior to becoming another albatross hanging from the neck of Pumpkin Spice Pol Pot. But, no!
TBone
@Gloria DryGarden: I, too, had a bestie like that. Friends since we were twelve years old. I kept thinking her good qualities would outweigh the cra cra. But in the end, the worm ate her entire outlook, her worldview, and her sanity. She began to lash out at me in very weird and specific ways after J6.
It made it very easy to move on.
Save yourself more heartache if you are able to reduce and/or cease contact. Don’t look back.
Gloria DryGarden
@2liberal: it’s worth fighting for. There’s a chance..
TBone
@Splitting Image: I hope he spends a lot of time in Philly and ends up like the Hitchhiking Robot.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/hitchhiking-robot-hitchbot-meets-demise-philadelphia-after-about-2-weeks-n402606
Baud
@The Thin Black Duke:
It makes me happy that I don’t have any kids.
TBone
@SpaceUnit: 🎯 I too have been calling it the flaming clown circus for a while now!
TBone
@HumboldtBlue: 💙 who am I to dis a brie
TBone
Yesterday’s Grace Kelly marathon paid off – two films I hadn’t seen yet (The Country Girl and this one). Excellent work.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bridges_at_Toko-Ri
Atypical of the World War II movies produced by Hollywood, The Bridges at Toko-Ri was considered a quiet anti-war [23] themed movie. The Korean War never got the same attention in media as World War II as its geopolitical purpose in world security was considered dubious. Brubaker’s character questions the purpose of the Korean War with the Rear Admiral and others. The final scenes of the movie document the hopeless deaths of the main protagonists as they lie in a muddy ditch in a foreign land.
Gloria DryGarden
@2liberal: it’s worth fighting for. There’s a chance..
@TBone: thank you. It’s hard. I’ve babysat her children, we’ve traded bodywork, she’s given me cranial sacral treatments that deeply cleared up trauma from my body, I massaged her sister through stage 4 cancer, it’s profound the passages we’ve seen each other through; our moms were close friends, her mom taught me to ski, we’ve had meals together, and hikes, and I used to visit her when she moved to the other half of the state. At one time we were just one step out from family.
I’m certainly not going to spend more words with her, beyond what I’ve written already to her. I’m already grieving so much this last few years. You are right, I can’t be spending time w her, and here I was on the verge of asking if we might share on the phone, about having both recently lost our dads. This just gets into the fabric of my past inner circle.
Rusty
RFK Jr. endorses Trump because free speech? Just another case of white guys thinking that everything they say should be taken seriously, and they should be able to say anything without any questions or push back. That is the main intersection between those two.
Gloria DryGarden
@Ksmiami: it’s just harder when it’s a deep friend, a sister friend.
I have other people I exchange favors and intermittent checking in with that I just ignore most of the time, once I see they can’t move or listen, and won’t change.
TBone
@Gloria DryGarden: maybe have a little ceremony where you formally grieve for a day, remembering the good times, but then remember to end with a focus on the cancer that took your friend while she still lives. The toxic mix of emotion can be purged for good. Like a funeral.
Remember that you can’t care for anyone else until you’ve cared for yourself.
I don’t mean to say the grief will resolve immediately – that takes time. But it’s a good send-off way to start the process.
prostratedragon
@TooManyJens:
From the comments there, fine Gothic calligraphy.
Chris T.
@TBone:
You’re acting as though his words had logic to them. DonOld’s statement is meant to tell his cultists that they have permission to shoot brown people on sight (white people aren’t drug dealers).
Gloria DryGarden
@Baud: do childless men have as little value as childless women?
There are times I too am glad I don’t have children. Not always. But sometimes.
I have monumental admiration for those that have raised children.
I think of what a client once said to me, about her eldest. She said he was difficult from the very beginning, and he continued to be difficult. She said, he was so difficult, that if he’d been adopted, they would have given him back. And another friend who, when asked if she could do it all over again, would she have kids, and her answer was no. And I know people who had a child, but then that child died, or disappeared. So they ended up childless in spite of their best intents. There’s no romance, and it’s a pretty tough road, with a range of generosity, sweetness and heartbreak in it, I guess.
im happy that family members of jerk-ass candidates have come forward, as in the case of Kennedy, and trump. Mary’s brother is telling his story too, and it’s nothing good about uncle Donald.
im pretty happy that the Walz Harris ticket is full of child-loving great parents w great big hearts. It’s nice to feel warm.
Chris Johnson
@Chet Murthy: I mean the tricky part is that it’s true. Trump WOULD veto a national abortion ban if that was all it took to make him King for the pitiful rest of his life rather than a convict in jail.
Ya gotta remember Trump has no opinions outside of narcissistic demand. He is a deeply broken critter. The crazy right wingers are right to be worried about him betraying them, because he would betray anything. And yet it means nothing as it’s in the service of nothing. It’s all just empty.
TBone
@Chris T.: I’m acting as if RFK, Jr. is a stupid person. I don’t parse Donold. But if I was tying myself to a crazy, old loser like he did, I’d at least have a second thought first.
Gloria DryGarden
@TBone: a grief ceremony. That’s a good idea. I’ll write some letters to burn or send to the drawer.
I think you’re saying put the toxic part of her, in a pile, and let that go, as I release her.
there are good memories for sure, healing classes all 3 of us took together, years of varied connections, kindnesses and gratitudes.
the gay sister who had cancer, she’s still alive 20 years later, she kind of credits me for holding a space of light, that her cancer thing changed on my table. She’s probably a voting democrat.
Baud
@Gloria DryGarden:
I have little value, but I don’t think that’s connected to my spawn-less situation.
I like kids, as long as they’re other people’s. But raising them is too risky, for some of the reasons you noted. And my parents had a tough time. Children deserve good parents, and I wouldn’t be one.
TBone
@Gloria DryGarden: there’s my opportunity to share Heather Cox Richardson today 💙😍
https://heathercoxrichardson.substack.com/p/august-24-2024
Chris T.
@TBone: Ah, I see. Well, he is (crazy and/or stupid, RFJKr that is) but he speaks Rich White Man-ese, where no Rich White Man is ever guilty of anything criminal. He and Old Don are using the same language here.
TBone
@Gloria DryGarden:
Dinah Maria Craik
TBone
@Chris T.: 1,000% correct
Princess
@Chet Murthy: Ah, the long awaited Trump pivot to the centre. They must be really scared. Of course the media and normies will eat it up.
TBone
@Baud: your pearls of wisdom are always a valuable contribution.
Gloria DryGarden
likewise. I might have been able to be a decent parent once I was way older, but too late on the female time scale. It’s been a delight to borrow kids, mostly 4 year olds for over a decade. Healing sweetness, in between grueling work..
K-Mo
@Chet Murthy: OMG Trump is like a dying computer that is just spitting out unprocessed data
TBone
@Chris Johnson: E. Jean Carroll’s words after facing him in the court room are coming back to me. As well as my Anthem:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=V5j8lz4oD4Q
Princess
@TooManyJens: The whale juice is going to run along those bungee cords into the interior of the car where it will rain down on everyone sitting there. As we were told it did.
Jay
@Gloria DryGarden:
@TBone:
Over the years, we have “cut” many people out of our lives.
For me, it has always been easier.
I was always the guy who would show up on moving day, with a pick up truck, and work hard until the end, for a beer and a slice of pizza, but was never “valued”.
Even by family.
I have T, and some close friends, Covid just sped some of that up.
We miss friends we have “lost”, just through time and distance, but we don’t miss people we have cut out of our lives because they became toxic.
The Thin Black Duke
@Baud: I try to be a good person; sometimes I succeed, but it’s something I have to work on all the time.
However, I knew I wouldn’t be a good father, and the choice I made to ensure that wouldn’t happen is one of the few choices I made as a young person that I don’t regret.
Chris Johnson
@Gloria DryGarden: Funny thing about that: yeah, kinda.
The thing about ‘childless men’ is it doesn’t translate the same into the domain of the weird and creepy. It’s probably better to look at the word ‘value’.
The trouble with these people is they’re stuck on a primitive, bad-TV-show version of what ‘value’ is, and that drives everything. To these people, women are just counters, not even vessels, and they’re stuck in this dope-fiend appraisal of the world as something to get more of, to get all of, to ‘win’. Nothing else matters. So it’s not a rational appraisal of value. It’s a ‘a ha, you lost, I win’ posturing, and that’s ALL that is there.
So women don’t even matter except as counters, children don’t matter except that they are you beyond death, and nothing you do matters more than how you do it: so to the extent that ‘childless men’ means ‘incels’, they’re zero value unless they kill something or do something else like earn a crapload of money.
And men with children will quickly find themselves mocked if they’re fool enough to, y’know, father.
You can’t go digging for meaning here. It’s rationalization based on monkey poo-flinging dominance. Any time you see people carrying on about relative value of isolated individuals in some libertarian-like philosophical bent, you’re seeing some fool abandon the observation of systems in order to poo-fling about how he gets to be better than you (or, in some cases, could theoretically be just better than you). That’s ‘value’ as an isolated, standalone concept that people can have or not have.
The real world is somewhat more complicated.
prostratedragon
@HumboldtBlue:
Wisdom Kaye’s Olympics high fashion show
lowtechcyclist
@scav:
Right down there with the resale value of JV Dance-owned upholstered furniture.
TBone
@Jay: I learned that lesson the hard way so many times, but the one that cut to the bone was how I was treated by my small, formerly close-knit family when my parents died.
I was able to resurrect a relationship with my only sibling, but it’ll never be the same.
I had a dream book my mom urged to me to keep as a small child. She told me to make my dreams into stories, with illustrations. The Blue Martians is one I don’t have to look at, it’s seared into my memory – the aliens took my brother away during a ride on the swing set. My grandma and me were left at the playground, inconsolable. Now it has come to pass.
Ken
Brilliant post title, Anne Laurie. We really should have an annual awards ceremony to recognize these things.
TBone
@Ken: I thought the same thing! Thanks for saying so, I second the motion.
Princess
If Trump can manage to stick to his “veto an abortion ban” pledge, there will be voters who might lean towards us who will believe it a shift to him. There’s a certain kind of white woman who is desperately looking for authorization to vote for him again, and that’s his target. But when has he ever said the same thing twice running? It will allow “fact” checkers to claim that saying he opposes abortion is false. Wait for it.
David 🐝KHive🐝 Koch
@TBone: They wasted Kelly in the movie. Her part was so small It was really a cameo. That’s said Bridges at Toko-Ri is hellva movie.
Ken
@TooManyJens: A bunch of bizarre social media posts about “whale juice” and “chainsaw vibes” suddenly make sense. Well, as much as anything about that incident can make sense
The winner, from Ed Zitron: “Why does every RFK jr. story feel like a German fairytale used to scare children”. Course that one made sense to me before I read the latest.
Gloria DryGarden
@TBone
“how I was treated by my small family” …after “my parents died”
one sibling, “never the same.”
yup, me too, it’s still pretty fresh, it cuts deeply. The circumstances are different, but the loss, the change in possible connection… I can’t really even write about it. Yet.
Gloria DryGarden
@Jay: having people who value one, sure makes a difference.
feeling unvalued, makes a difference, the other way.
Baud
@Ken:
AL has been killing it.
Gloria DryGarden
@TBone: I’ve been on a little Matthias schoenarts film festival. “Far from the madding crowd” has recently come out free on YouTube, and I just love it. He and Kerry mulligan. Jesus. So good.
Gloria DryGarden
Randy, Pollyanna/hell: when you come lurking here
please see comment #93
K-Mo
@Gloria DryGarden: I’m sorry for your loss.
TBone
@Gloria DryGarden: 💙😍
Gloria DryGarden
@Maxim: might be Trisha calvarese, in colo district 4.
Mousebumples
That’s my vote. I’m not sure if they’re doing postcards, but hopefully, they have some job they need help with that you think you can do.
TBone
@David 🐝KHive🐝 Koch: agreed BUT (😁) the chance to see that movie uncut, in its entirety, was priceless. As Spencer Tracy said of Kate in Pat and Mike, there may not be much meat on her bones, but what is there is cherce! (choice)
Baud
Via reddit, Elon Musk weighs in on the childless women thing. (Twitter link)
TBone
@Gloria DryGarden: timing is everything. So much loss all at once magnifies each loss. Hubby’s family ALL died within a space of six months, even his younger siblings. To this day, I don’t know how he didn’t go round the bend during/after that. I like to think I played a small part in keeping him here on the planet during that all-out assault, but he’s got something more than me deep within.
TBone
@Baud: Goddamnit
That fucking guy! I am so tempted to click…
Stay strong, TBone!
TBone
@Gloria DryGarden: And I meant to add “so do you” (have something deep within you can rely on).
Baud
@TBone:
I’ll save you a click. Elon says “this is deeply concerning” in response to an article that 45% of women will be childless by 2030.
zhena gogolia
Just unsubscribed from Penzey.
MomSense
RFK jr is a deeply disturbed person. The podcast Maintenance Phase did a several part series on him. I can’t stand him so I usually avoid anything about him but this podcast is so good and funny (their beat is diet and wellness) and they are so skilled at taking apart snake oil sales people that I listened.
Baud
@zhena gogolia:
I would have thought Penzey would be back to normal now. (I don’t subscribe).
Chief Oshkosh
@Gloria DryGarden: It is hard and I don’t have a solution. I have cut off most them – just not enough time and energy to deal with all of them. Others I have to work with, and so I just don’t engage politically, which is the correct approach anyway. Finally, there is one family member and one old friend who are still in my life. We deal with our political differences by a simple rule – if we’re at their house, it’s their rules. If we’re at my house, it’s my rules. If we’re somewhere else, then we just don’t talk politics. When I’m not around them, I just ignore the rest of their behavior, as in, I have no knowledge of it and I don’t want to have any knowledge of it.
But, there’s no question, this was a long, long culling, and it started with Shrub’s response to 9/11.
TBone
@Jay: I just saw your post about fElon Skum and the Russian oligarchs in last night’s Ukraine thread. Thank you very much for sharing that important follow up news!!!
Baud
It’s tragic but not new. The tagline for the Civil War was brother against brother.
TBone
@Baud: 😆 it will be the smartest ladies, he should fear us
TBone
@zhena gogolia: what happened???
Baud
@TBone:
The cyber truck doesn’t seem Ike a vehicle designed for mothers with young children. Just saying.
TBone
@Baud: see? Pearls of wisdom!
lowtechcyclist
@Baud:
Elmo posts a screen shot of a Medium headline that 45% of women between 25 and 44 are expected to be single and childless by 2030, and he finds that “very concerning!!”
One thing that’s going on is that fewer women are marrying right out of high school or college than they used to. Quite understandably, they want to learn to make their own way in the world and have an idea of what they want to do with their lives before committing to a lifetime relationship with someone. (If you don’t know who you are and what you want out of life, how would you know whether your potential mate will be a good companion for that journey? I’d think that would be true regardless of gender.) And that takes a few years – many if not most of us aren’t there by age 25.)
That part’s non-gender-specific. The more gender-specific part is that too many men are either assholes (or downright abusive) or have never grown up, and women don’t have to put up with that shit anymore. Hence single, childless women over 25, and hence incels.
TBone
@Baud: 😆
It’s not a pro-natalist design, for sure!
Rusty
@TBone: Government to provide for all its citizens, not as a means to protect property. As it was put to me, “Things don’t matter (property, money, etc.), ideas don’t matter (political philosophy, dogma, theories, etc.), people matter.” In America we place property first, really money, ideas second and people last. Even ideas are a distant second to money, everything eventually boils down to money. Think Citizen United letting g money decide which ideas matter. Biden, and before him LBJ, we’re the only president’s in my life that allowed people to not be last. Even LBJ let the idea of anti-communism and American pride end his presidency because of the Vietnam War.
By the way, “Things don’t matter, ideas don’t matter, people matter”, was told to me as a way to understand the gospels.
zhena gogolia
@Baud: The Palestinian protestor didn’t get to speak at the DNC!
kalakal
@Baud: And does it occur to him that boosting misogyny may not be the best answer?
zhena gogolia
@TBone: He’s complaining that the DNC didn’t give a speaking slot to the people who’ve been disrupting Democratic campaign events.
TBone
@Rusty: well said! 🎯
Baud
@kalakal:
No.
Princess
@Baud: And their response is always force or trap women into marriage and kids. Never: make it more attractive and appealing for women to marry and have children.
K-Mo
@Ksmiami: IMO most if nota all people are potentially susceptible to being seduced by something hateful and awful. I can’t write them all off as inherently bad. Hanlons Razor is my friend. We can’t give these people any power but we can hope for their salvation.
lowtechcyclist
@Rusty:
I like that! Along the same lines is Pratchett’s “sin is treating people as things” which I’ve come to regard as an extremely clarifying corollary to “love your neighbor as yourself.”
Gloria DryGarden
@Rusty:
brilliant summary. I can get behind that even if I don’t join in mainstream religious practices.
Princess
If you tell young women: get pregnant but if you have a complication or get cancer, we, the country with the most advanced medicine in the world, will cheerfully watch you die in the parking lot not lifting a finger when a simple common safe medical procedure could save you — those women will not want to get pregnant.
That aside — the later women in aggregate have children, the less likely your population can remain stable by internal birth rate alone. Which means immigration.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Chief Oshkosh: I never realized how lucky I was that my family are almost all Democrats. My neighbors are a different story. We just don’t talk politics.
TBone
@zhena gogolia: 😞
The speech that the Georgia Rep. was gonna give has been published. It’s not a secret. Why throw away your reputation on a short speech by ONE person that didn’t happen, when you could have just dedicated a spice blend to it and republished it? Duh!!!!
Sour grapes yield vinegar.
Much rather have honey most of the time.
Gloria DryGarden
@Baud: yeah, and he’s a really great father. Mm hmm. Not weird at all, totally supportive.
//s
EmbraceYourInnerCrone
@Gvg: I hope the Kennedy clan stories stop but unfortunately the DNC found it necessary to have Caroline Kennedy’s son as a speaker. Gotta love how Chelsea Clinton got warned repeatedly after Hillary’s loss not to enter politics while much of the older public has this weird obsession with the Kennedy’s. I will admit to enjoying watching one of them get tromped in an election in Massachusetts a few years ago. Thought the name would cruise him to victory…nope.
SFAW
@TooManyJens:
Somewhere in doggie Heaven, Seamus Romney is conflicted. On the plus side, he’s no longer the most fucked-up thing tied to a family car’s roof. On the other hand, he might now fade into obscurity.
kalakal
@Baud: I’m shocked
narya
@Baud: I’ve come to recognize that one of the threads that kept me from having children is seeing my parents’ profound grief when my sister died (41 years ago this week). It’s far from the only thread–lots of life circumstances worked against it being a viable option for me–but I also think my fear would have really affected my ability to be a good parent.
SFAW
@Ken:
I’ll have to re-read my Struwwelpeter (auf Deutsch, natuerlich) to see if anything lines up.
But it sounds like Junior was auditioning to be der Schneider.
SFAW
@Baud:
It would not surprise me to learn that what 45 percent of women surveyed actually said was “Have a child with Melon Husk, even though he’s (allegedly) worth billions? No fucking way,” and he misinterpreted that.
Gloria DryGarden
@Ken: for a beautiful, uplifting non-scary fairytale -like narrative see Jay’s comment on the next thread. Gardening, hand feeding bumblebees, stewarding the land so beautifully that the birds who took up residence saved them from the grasshoppers.
I’m going to put on my necklace of pearls of wisdom and kindness gems, and go read it again.
SFAW
@Chet Murthy:
Probably stealing that.
Dorothy A. Winsor
How does the US childless rate compare to the rate in other well-off countries? Are we talking about a US specific phenomenon? That would implicate our policies.
Kay
Checking in with Michigan Republicans:
zhena gogolia
@TBone: I did read it — at least she endorsed Harris. Yay.
TBone
@zhena gogolia: one wonders if Penzey read it…(my comment was in reference to Penzey not you!)
TBone
@Kay: 😆
Geminid
@Kay:
“Come on you Wolverines!”
That was George Custer’s Civil War battlecry, and I always say it to myself when I read about another fight between Michigan’s fractious Republicans
Gloria DryGarden
I’ll see what can do. The do it yourself method hasn’t been working. I need to call up my spiritual case managers teams. “call home” some people call it.
meanwhile , extra blessings to you and your husband on all that.
and to everyone here who’s lost close ones to death, estrangements, and political divisiveness.
lowtechcyclist
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
Too lazy to look it up right now, but my recollection is that pretty much all the well-off countries have even lower fertility rates than we do.
Sally
@MattF: I think that brain worm starved to death.
Kay
@Geminid:
I can’t believe they have TWO county parties with disputed chairs.
Tony G
@Gvg: That’s right. I’m an old geezer of 68. JFK was killed when I was seven years old and RFK was killed when I was twelve. The notion that the Kennedy name makes much difference to anyone younger than me is just absurd. They’re political figures who died a very long time ago.
p.a.
Talking about whale decapitation is a desperate attempt to rise into the realm of top-5,000 liberal blogs, I must say.
Hope it works!👍🏻🤞🏻
BethanyAnne
I told Mom when I was 17 that I was a genetic dead end. 20 years later, I went to store sperm before transition, and found out that I was right all those years ago. They said that I was infertile enough that IVF wasn’t a sure thing, but it was the only hope I’d ever have of having kids. I never wanted kids, and eventually just let the stored sperm be destroyed.
My family aren’t hardcore Trumpers, but they are conspiracy-curious, and have bought into some weird shit. Brother in law tried to tell me that he believed Obama was the actual mastermind behind the Biden administration. I told him my usual: “extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. What’s your evidence?” All he could come up with was that Obama once said he’d like a 3rd term. I just looked at him, and we moved on. I mean, what do you say to such weak sauce?
frosty
@lowtechcyclist: That was one of the themes in the book The End of the World Is Just The Beginning. Demographic collapse everywhere, maybe the worst in China. And the least in North America where it’s buffered by immigration.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@lowtechcyclist: Then our policies on childcare, family leave, etc. do need to change, but immigration is really the surest way to bolster the population.
zhena gogolia
@TBone: I know!
Rusty
@lowtechcyclist: Agreed, for me it’s treating people as objects, but same meaning. We treat people, such as the poor, as objects to be fixed and then wonder why we have such bad outcomes, where instead we need to be in relation with them as people, and work with them as members of our community.
BR
@frosty:
And the world will benefit from a slow leveling out of population, so it’s better to increase immigration rather than try to increase domestic birth rates as if that’s even a thing:
https://overshoot.footprintnetwork.org/newsroom/country-overshoot-days/
Maxim
@Gloria DryGarden: There was polling for her as well as McCorkle, linked upthread, which was a bit confusing — are they both running? Has the Dem primary not happened?
But Calvarese was trailing Boebert badly in the polls, while the reverse was true with McCorkle, so I was hoping he was the candidate (not knowing anything about either of them beyond that).
Gloria DryGarden
@Dorothy A. Winsor: it’s actually a branch of geography, the demographics, birth rates, aging populations. All of those would be great search terms. It’s going on in many developed countries. Japan, for sure.
immigration helps because it brings in younger folks to work and be in the economy. And we aren’t the only country dealing with racism and cultural differences as a huge culture clash.
it’s confusing in a way, because leveling out or decreasing the world population might be helpful in terms of resource uses, pollution, overcrowding and poverty, climate change, etc.
MomSense
@SFAW:
I immediately thought of the poor Rmoney dog when this story came out. What bothered me most about that story aside from the casual sociopathy, was the trauma that poor dog experienced. They had to stop and hose the cat off because of the diarrhea all over the car. Then they continued on their way. It still infuriates me.
MomSense
@TBone:
Can we hold some space for people and businesses to express their beliefs? I think it’s a sign of confidence when we can just acknowledge that people have different opinions and beliefs. Nothing they said was threatening, offensive or hateful.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@Gloria DryGarden:
There’s clearly some national interest only because of Boebert as I got a PPP poling text on Friday. It asked about Harris and Felonious D, I expected that, but then asked about Boerbert and her opponent, Trisha Calvarese:
https://www.trisha4colorado.com/
I thought that odd given I don’t live in that district (aka the godforsakeneasternplainsofcolorado).
Calvarese is leading with the “My opponent is a bugnut, insane carpetbagger” meme.
As we observe frequently in Misery, running in a district like this as a Dem is at some levels pointless but it’s great we have people willing to do it.
Michael Bersin
I, too, did not get to speak at the DNC.
First, you’ve got to be on board with the agenda and support a nominee with sufficient delegates. That’s how it works. So far so good.
You have to be somewhat influential. Damn, missed it by that much.
The good thing for me is that it’s a lot of work to get your speech in a deliverable form, so I avoided that.
I do have grievances I would have worked into the speech. For instance, people who start a right turn in traffic by veering left. The rent is too damn high. Just to name a few…
trnc
In what way have we moved the tentpole? We aren’t adopting any of Kinzinger’s conservative policy positions. If Kapur is referring to getting a DNC speaking slot, that’s a proper acknowledgement of republicans who have not run over the cliff and, more importantly, who are endorsing the democrat.
Shalimar
@Baud: At least Elon left out “all the hot ones should have my children.” You know that is what he’s thinking.
the pollyanna from hell
@TBone:
@TBone: Gloria asks me to reply in a dead thread to TBone and Dinah Maria Craik. All I can say is that’s a beautiful snatch of poetry, and worthwhile guide to life and humanity.
Uncle Cosmo
Don’t forget to include all the Auntie Macassars... or would that be more like “Anti MacAssholes”?
Uncle Cosmo
Which reminds me of a story from my misspent younger days:
I never did get to climb the Spanish Steps, then or ever again (it’s on my “aw, buck it” list).
Amen, amen, I say unto yinz, should that insane Thuglican clown posse get hold of projectile weapons, remember “line of sight” and stay the hell out of it while they’re hosing one another down with hot lead. Yer frenz & famblies will thank you.
dnfree
@The Thin Black Duke: This is an example of why naming a child after yourself (Jr.) is a bad idea.
steve g
RFK Jr discovers that having filed some lawsuits does not in itself qualify you for public office. Starting out your political career by running for office for the first time as a candidate for president is deeply unserious and deeply misguided and deeply poor judgement and deeply pathetic. If Trump managed to win despite everything, RFK would get exactly nothing out of it, there is no way he would get a cabinet position or anything else, Trump would flick him away as he would an annoying piece of lint.
dnfree
@TBone: I’m still heartbroken about Hitchbot. Made it all over Canada getting help from everyone. Comes to the United States and gets destroyed just for kicks.
Kayla Rudbek
@Dorothy A. Winsor: if I recall correctly, we have a higher birth rate than Japan, South Korea, Spain, and Italy. The Scandinavian countries may have a higher birth rate than we do.