I frequently see posts like these on Bluesky and Twitter. They started when JD made an ass of himself in a donut shop, but yesterday’s incident when he held up two dozen eggs and claimed that eggs are $4 a dozen when a sign showing $2.99/dozen was legible behind him is another example. He’s consistently had small crowds and there’s been more than one example where his staging looks awful.
I don’t think the answer is as simple as “they hate him and want to embarrass him.” Instead, I think he’s the “out-guy” on the sales team. He’s Shelley in Glengarry Glen Ross, if you remember Jack Lemmon’s character in that film.
I’ve spent a lot of time observing sales culture, especially sales culture where sales is in charge of other parts of the company, and don’t know what they’re doing. The Trump organization is a pure bottom-feeding sales team, selling a dubious “brand” that they try to slap on everything with Donald as the head of sales.. That’s the only thing he’s somewhat good at – everything else he’s done is a failure. Some characteristics of a sales-led organization:
- Sales thinks they’re incredibly bright, insightful and important. They’re some of the biggest fart huffers on the planet. They watch videos and attend conferences where other salespeople convince them that good ideas, positivity, and savvy dealmaking are all that’s needed to succeed in business. Actual planning or follow through isn’t part of their success formula.
- Sales loves to do things that look like action but are basically nothing. COVID put a crimp in their game, but old-school sales guys like Trump love nothing more than hopping on a plane for a meeting. The meeting might not accomplish shit, and it could just as easily been a Zoom or a phone call, but flying to a customer’s location is a way to look busy, gain frequent flyer miles, and have a couple of nice dinners on the company’s dime. It’s no surprise that Trump loves his private plane with the gold toilets. The 2016 campaign was heaven for him, because he could fly everywhere and just riff for an hour or two to his adoring fans.
- The head of sales is highly influenced by the “in-guys” on the team. These guys can whisper in his ear and get him to do things that he might otherwise have second thoughts about. Don Jr is an in-guy (at times) and he apparently pushed Donald to choose JD.
- When the organization is struggling, instead of systematically addressing the issues, the head of sales looks for a new savior to come and fix everything. This is a point where ambitious wannabe in-guys can wield outsized influence.
- If the organization is doing fine but needs to grow, the a new savior with a new strategy will catapult the organization to new heights. The in-guys often start out as a savior.
- When the in-guys think the new savior isn’t doing well, or some other team member isn’t doing well, they shit talk that team member to the head of sales, and also passive aggressively work within the organization to strew banana peels in his path. Sales leaders hate negativity and are too chickenshit to fire anyone (that’s one of the ways that The Apprentice is total fiction), so the out-guy is generally forced to quit since they can’t endure the stream of shit falling on their head.
So, in the case of JD, Don Jr (in-guy) whispered in daddy’s ear to convince him that JD was a new savior. The new savior strategy was to get more incels to vote for Trump. At the time, the campaign was (in their view) doing great, so JD was sold as the guy who could whisper the right things into a group of voters who would vote for Trump if they could only get out of their mom’s basement.
JD shit the bed almost immediately, and then Harris arrived on the scene, so there’s panic on the streets of West Palm. The sales leader, Donald, lashes out at everyone. The bat signal goes out, and people like Corey Lewandowski and Laura Loomer now have Trump’s ear. Whoever the current in-guys are, they quietly find ways to fuck Vance. They advise Trump to distance from him, and they also cut the advance budget and put the biggest fuckups on JD’s advance team.
So, I guess from one perspective, his advance people hate him and want to embarrass him. But the reason isn’t just random animus. JD’s getting out-guy treatment, and poor advance work is just one of many indicators.
Dept. of Legal Sideshows: United States vs. Google II – Ad Tech Boogaloo
Aimai
Excellent analysis. It’s also court politics. Fun to see it in this light.
zhena gogolia
Interesting take.
Jeffg166
Only the best people.
Belafon
I saw something this morning that said that Loomer is out. If it’s true, I can’t wait for her to take revenge.
Embirr
We’ve reached the point where there is a demand for list of 15 things to turn things around – but none of them will address the root cause which is a shitty product (Hi Don!).
So we’ll have more direct mail, new branding, firing low performers (who are there because it’s hard to peddle dog shit), and cost cutting for travel and entertainment.
Typical promotion of the guilty, firing of the innocent.
narya
I think that’s true, but not the whole story: Thiel’s dollars likely figured into the equation as well. As for JD’s advance team, if JD had any abilities whatsoever, he’d fix it himself or know who to get to fix it. That’s where your strategy comes in, in that no one thought that actual competence was needed, AND TCFG’s intent to grift every last dollar he could meant that they wouldn’t want to pay for competence
ETA: I like your overall analysis, in case that’s not clear. It does have the ring of sales BS to it.
NorthLeft
How about the simplest explanation…..the guy is just not very popular and is a terrible speaker/human being.
BeautifulPlumage
I’m NOT a sales type, so I appreciate this analysis. I was wondering if all the fuckups could really just be a bad advance team.
CaseyL
It’s possible they don’t want to embarrass JDV so much as they want to minimize his public exposure because every time he opens his mouth he loses another “independent” voter.
JDV is the connection to the Theil moneyline, and the Christofascists love him. And he is very well aware that Trump will be “President” in name only – and possibly not long, even in-name-only – with himself as either the real power in the WH or the heir once Trump has shuffled off the mortal coil.
TL;DR: JDV isn’t gonna let himself get pushed out, even if the campaign wants him out. What’s some public humiliation if ultimate power is the possible payoff?
Ksmiami
How the fuck is this race even close? Seriously- ready to just give up on the US
TBone
I once worked in a Main Line commercial real estate sales firm (got my salesperson license at night school while working full time at their office). It was a learning experience! The only time I ever worked any type of sales job and good riddance to it.
The Office, on weird steroids.
Ishiyama
Don’t you mean “f*cked the sofa?”
Tony G
That sounds about right. I’ve never worked in sales (thank God) but I had a position for ten years in which I had to meeting with software salespeople and listen to their balderdash about vaporware. The biggest bullshitters on the planet.
geg6
What an interesting take and it rings very true. Heh. I love to see it.
OT: I am starting to clean out my desk in preparation for retirement and found a photo album of my many trips to visit my sister in the Stuart/Jensen Beach/Palm City, FL area and I am completely puzzled as to why the hell I have an album full of photos of me, my sister, her husband and our friends being drunk and smoking pot over the course of 5-6 years while I finished my undergrad and started my grad program. I am 100% sure I never brought this in as an office show and tell. I have no idea why it is here at work.
Geminid
@Belafon: Last night I saw a clip circulating on Twitter of Loomer reacting to the news of her exile. A truly pathetic case. That woman is of unsound mind and I think she realizes this.
Citizen Dave
Obligatory: Always Be Closing. A–B–C
Seriously, this is an excellent (and hilarious) way to view trumpworld. Really enjoyed it.
hueyplong
I used to love deposing sales types. Sometimes, after a surprisingly short response to a question, I’d just lean forward and look at them, and the dudes would resume volunteering testimony.
Suzanne
There were two other aspects to Vance that were appealing:
1) Peter Thiel’s money
2) The Integralist Catholics, et al…. Dreher, Ahmari, Deneen, Vermeule, and their followers.
There’s also a chunk of neo-monarchists like Curtis Yarvin.
Suzanne
@Ishiyama:
“You can’t unfuck that couch.”
WaterGirl
@geg6: Good thing you didn’t leave it behind on your last day! :-)
hueyplong
@Suzanne: I’d go with:
(1) Thiel’s money; and
(2) Vance was the most fulsome in his personal flattery of Trump.
Citizen Dave
@geg6: That is hilarious! Hoping to do the same clean out in a couple years. Funny how time goes by and then things have been cubbied away for 10, 20 years.
hueyplong
@Suzanne: Pretty sure he shit the sofabed, which is pretty damn rude to uphostery that was expecting intercourse.
geg6
@WaterGirl:
Ha! I keep telling people around here that, after 26 years, they think they know me but that they don’t know me at all. I told one of my suite mates about it and we decided I should show it as entertainment on my last day, where at the end of the day we will be toasting with a bottle of prosecco I bought the other day for exactly that.
Suzanne
@hueyplong: I think the shameless flattery is part of it, yeah. But I think liberals/leftists underestimate the crazy right-wing Catholics right now and their drive to eliminate democracy. It’s probably the most active subculture on the right at the moment.
ETA: I don’t think Trump even gets it. But I think that’s part of why Vance is so fucken thirsty. They want a Catholic dominion and don’t give even half a shit about democracy.
MazeDancer
How about selling voting to Dems?
Here’s everyone’s chance – PostCards!
PostCardPatriot.com is officially open for biz. Get your new designs and fresh addresses.
Just click on my nym.
WaterGirl
Can I put a kitty blog in here? I just heard from commenter Auntie Anne:
The GoFundMe is a little confusing because it’s written by the person who fostered this sweet kitty before he went to his forever home with Auntie Anne, and it also mentions an organization.
So this is Auntie Anne’s kitty, and maybe we can help her out a bit. It looks like they are 2/3 of the way toward their goal.
Chris
@narya:
Yeah.
I’ve seen a lot of commentary that seems to assume J. D. Vance is Trump reaching out to hillbillies, which seems to me like it’s exactly backwards and mistakes Vance’s self-publicity for the reality. Picking Vance, assuming there was any thought behind it at all, wasn’t Trump doing outreach to the little people. It was Trump doing outreach to the elites. Financial elites, in the sense that he’s a direct line into Silicon Valley oligarchy, and intellectual elites, in the sense that he’s a published author of some notoriety who’s exactly the kind of pseudo-academic that the “intellectuals” of the GOP think of as a deep thinker.
The idea that he’s outreach towards incels isn’t wrong (though I’m pretty sure they’re sold on Trump as it is), but the overlap between incels and Republican so-called “intellectuals” is, I would venture to guess, not small.
...now I try to be amused
I like the comparison of the Trump Org to the Glengarry Glen Ross business. Trump is a small businessman at heart, and the Trump Org might be the world’s biggest small business.
TBone
@…now I try to be amused: or the world’s scammiest.
Ken
@Embirr: I’m expecting an announcement that the Trump campaign is now “AI-infused”. They’ve already done NFTs and cryptocoins.
Hmm… If they don’t jump on the AI bandwagon, does that mean even the king of grift can’t figure out how to make money from it?
Suzanne
A good piece about Vance and the “TheoBros”.
@mistermix.bsky.social
To everyone who mentioned money: yep, that’s another reason that I missed.
Thanks
Josie
@CaseyL:
This is exactly what I have been thinking. I don’t feel like joking about anything to do with JDV, knowing that, if we lose, he will be in line to be president. That is even a more horrifying thought than the current candidate.
cope
This post may be worthy of nomination for inclusion in the next edition of the “Oxford English Book of Extended Metaphors”.
Bill Arnold
@Belafon:
May there be big “I Will Not Be Ignored Don!” energy from Loomer.
Falling Diphthong
@geg6: And thus do we all dismiss each piece of evidence that we are shifting between alternate timelines.
The one true timeline has ALL the missing socks.
hueyplong
Elsewhere, Mark Robinson says he is suing CNN. Great idea. File tomorrow.
@mistermix.bsky.social
@Aimai:
Male-dominated, pseudo-macho culture has a number of the same rules, no matter where it exists…
Chris
@Suzanne:
Part of it I think is that the loudest theocratic voices in the U.S. have traditionally been evangelical or otherwise Protestant, with Catholics being among the outsiders they were bashing. That hasn’t really been true in a while – the religious right in its current form of “right-wing Catholics + fundamentalist evangelicals” is nearly fifty years old – but the image still sticks. Most people thinking of America’s crazy preachers still picture a Southern televangelist in a Boss Hogg outfit preaching from a megachurch somewhere in the Texas panhandle.
That and the fact that while evangelicals (at least the white ones and not even just them) are still very lopsidedly a Republican bloc, Catholics have been pretty evenly split for decades. A lot of non-Catholic liberals know Catholics who are sane, normal, and not in search of a theocracy. A lot of liberals are Catholics who are sane, normal, and not in search of a theocracy. (Our only two Catholic presidents were both liberal Democrats, after all). So the idea that there’s a really strong and really loud strand of Catholicism that’s essentially indistinguishable from Torquemada’s, and that it would be that strong in America of all places, doesn’t click with a lot of people’s mental image of either America or Catholicism.
...now I try to be amused
@hueyplong: Looking forward to discovery!
Soprano2
I laughed at the description of sales people, because so much of it is true. At my first full-time job, I tried to tell our biggest salesperson that the way he instructed me to do his estimates was cutting his commission, but he blew me off because I was 25 and a woman. Six months later I was called into the general manager’s office and asked to explain why I hadn’t told this salesman that the way I was doing estimates was messing up his sales commission!!! I am not kidding. I think my mouth fell open and I said something like “I told him six months ago that it was a problem and he told me to keep doing it this way”, of course he denied it and the general manager (who didn’t like me, it was reciprocated) didn’t believe me over his best sales person. I was so pissed!!
OT, I sure didn’t have “a rodent ate my car’s engine harness” on my bingo card for today. I told them to fix the damage because that was less than $600, while getting a new harness on backorder was $4,700! I want to get a new vehicle anyway, I’m sure not going to spend that kind of money on a car I just want to trade it. Sheesh, I hope my week gets better.
Harrison Wesley
@Ishiyama: I don’t know if I’d couch it in those terms…I mean, I don’t know if I’d….oh, hell.
...now I try to be amused
@Chris: Such Americans have never heard of Opus Dei.
jonas
As Simpsons fans will recall, the voice of Ol’ Gil is basically Dan Castalanetta’s tribute to Jack Lemmon in GGGS.
Falling Diphthong
I’d put it alongside the deluge of mailers to Dem voters–it’s a critical mass of grifters, wafting a veneer of carrying out campaign acts while pocketing most of the money.
To tie it to the AI theme, they do things that look like what you would expect from a campaign at a glance. And then you look closely and ask why JD doesn’t have a decent advance team, and why Josh Marshall is getting a dozen fliers urging him to donate to Trump, and why everyone seems to think someone else had a plan to ring doorbells and give rides to the polls.
dmsilev
@Ken: Nobody would believe a claim that the Trump campaign is infused with intelligence, artificial or otherwise. Maybe Artificial Stupidity?
UncleEbeneezer
The whole Sales fetish seems to be a big thing on the Right. My Buckley-loving, Conservative but Never-Trump, Dad said for decades that Salesmen are the “only ones who earn their salary.” Along with the Owners/Executives, naturally.
jonas
This is an excellent strategy to get everyone to quit talking about the scandal engulfing your campaign and focus on something else. Please proceed, Lt. Gov.
Falling Diphthong
@hueyplong: It will be a contest for eyeballs between Mark Robinson v CNN and RFK’s threatened criminal action against that dreadful Nuzzi who kept harassing him.
Sister Golden Bear
@Belafon: What’s the over/under on when broiled bunnies start appearing at Mar-a-Lago. Because Loomer is not going to be ignored.
Craig
Spot on on the sales angle. Sales culture is gross, or amusing depending. Nothing grosser than a Tech SKO(sales kickoff off) event. I’ve worked a bunch of them and the hotel bar is always a loud ass, macho shithead posturing waking dream. One small silver lining, especially in Vegas is just identifying the In-Guy with the open tab and charging drinks to him. Usually the bartenders are only too happy to help with this.
...now I try to be amused
@UncleEbeneezer: I’ll say this for salespeople: Sales is up there with stand-up comedy as one of the most psychologically brutal occupations in existence. I’d never do it in a million years. That said, they are way to full of themselves.
Come to think of it, stand-up comedy also has more than its share of assholes.
Scout211
It’s also possible that the Trump campaign team was expecting the media to merely be stenographers and the MAGAs just to drink in the crazy that Vance spews like they do with Trump. He obviously never backs down with his racism, misogyny and xenophobia. Trump has never backed down, so maybe they thought, “why shouldn’t this work for JD Vance?”
But it hasn’t worked with Vance, starting with Democrats calling him weird and then the media and Democrats looking into his history and his past statements.
So then what does the campaign do? They schedule smaller and smaller venues and essentially demote him to more like a crazy campaign surrogate, not second in line for the presidency. They can’t fire him so they try ways to keep him out of the news.
You know, like they do in companies that hire the boss’s weird nephew who f*cks up every job he tries.
But then again, I’m just spit-balling here.
ETA: clarity
Ishiyama
e e cummings: a salesman is an it that stinks
narya
@Chris: I saw a link on BSKY this morning to a New Republic article that said some evangelical pastors are getting pushback from their parishioners when they QUOTE Christ in their sermons; JC is apparently now too “woke” and soft and weak for them. (I didn’t read the whole thing; too many popups and barriers.)
West of the Rockies
Is anyone worrying about the VP debate? Walz is smart, and as a former teacher, probably very quick on his feet. Vance is an Ivy league creature though and is not stupid. I’m sure he will have some dirty tricks and (what he thinks are killer) one-liners.
The VP debate strikes me as maybe the last chance Trump will have to change the almost baked-in narrative that he and Vance are weirdo losers.
...now I try to be amused
@Scout211:
This is working out as I had hoped. Trump’s wannabes think they can get away with acting like Trump, but they haven’t got Trump’s teflon. One by one they go down in flames.
Baud
@…now I try to be amused:
Agreed.
BellaPea
The sales analogy is great. I also agree with the suggestion that Vance is an awful candidate, awkward and arrogant at the same time. I saw an interesting article today on my news feed that young men are now going to church in larger numbers than young women. I see two things about that: the incels culture movement toward tradwives, and also the young women are no fools. They see their future in these evangelical churches–roped into marriage without possibility of divorce if things go wrong, limited access to contraceptives, mandatory motherhood, and out-and-out sexism in the work place if they do find a job.
Ishiyama
@West of the Rockies: One cannot help being concerned. Vance’s debating style is obvious, but finding the most effective response/attack is not. But Tim has a secret weapon: his English teacher wife, Gwen. Time to dust off the rhetoric textbooks.
Harrison Wesley
Don’t know how much there is to worry about JDV’s Ivy pedigree Ron DeSantis is an Ivy guy, too.
Scout211
There’s always something to worry about. But since Walz has in the past made all of his speeches with no teleprompter, I have confidence that he can stay on message and his personality, sense of humor and goodness will shine.
Reports are that Vance is using Tom Emmer to play Walz in his debate prep.
I thought that was funny. Style over substance. Please proceed JD.
The Pale Scot
@geg6:
Maybe you were drunk and smoking pot?
Just kidding, couldn’t resist
BR
@West of the Rockies:
I have arrived at a mostly zen place this election: I don’t worry about things I can’t change. I didn’t pay attention to the lead up to the Harris v Trump debate and same for Walz v JD Couch.
Lobo
@Chris: My question is who wins in the end? Those Protestants hate Catholics. Differences in theology, politics, application, etc. I wonder why the founding fathers put in separation of Church and State in the Constitution?
Hoodie
The sales culture stuff is pretty accurate, seems like it’s layered on a small business culture where the in group is always the dipshit family members. I one hundred percent believe that JD was a brain dead DJTJ idea. Only a moron like him would think reaching out to incels was a great plan and that guys like Thiel would fork over real money. Those guys make all kinds of vague promises but usually end up backing out.
Ishiyama
Doug Emhoff is speaking in San Antonio today. Harris/Walz is going after Texas.
Princess
@West of the Rockies: I’m not worried. I think Walz will do fine. But I don’t think he’ll dismantle JD and leave him crying like Harris did Donald. I think his reptile person hide is too think for Walz to get under his skin easily
Also, I don’t think VP debates make much difference.
SatanicPanic
@West of the Rockies: nah, it’ll be fine. If Vance shows up Walz too much with his book knowledge he’ll look like a snooty Harvard grad. Which is going to hurt his outreach to stupid people.
Urza
@Ksmiami: We all wonder that. And get depressed over it. But leaving the US leaves the power to the crazies. And the military, and the nukes. And if American democracy fails there’s a good chance other democracies fail. And that is not a world we want to live in. So, regardless of how much it hurts us mentally we need to keep fighting, and not from another country as an expat as was proven this year they’ll make sure you can’t vote for sanity from afar.
Joy in FL
@WaterGirl: Replying to say that I just made a small donation for the sweet and adorable Chunk (comment #27). There were quite a few recent donations, and I’m thinking that Jackals have been busy helping.
I hope Chunk will be fine and have lots of happy years with Auntie Anne.
Also my two magnets arrived today from Cafe Press. Tunch and Steve make impressive surrogates for the Harris/Walz campaign : )
Baud
@Princess:
Agreed.
raven
CNN —
A pressure campaign from Donald Trump and Republican allies to change Nebraska election law was dealt a significant setback on Monday as a pivotal Omaha state senator said he would not support a last-ditch effort to overturn a 30-year law that awards electoral votes by congressional district rather than statewide winner-take-all.
State Sen. Mike McDonnell, a former Democrat who joined the GOP earlier this year, said in a statement Monday that he would not vote to change the law in Nebraska before the November election.
“After deep consideration, it is clear to me that right now, 43 days from Election Day, is not the moment to make this change,” McDonnell said. “I have notified Governor (Jim) Pillen that I will not change my long-held position and will oppose any attempted changes to our electoral college system before the 2024 election.”
Scout211
@Ishiyama: Doug Emhoff is great. It seems like he is everywhere and is a wonderful surrogate.
So where in the world is Melania, you ask? The answer to that is wherever she will be paid in the six figures.
Sister Golden Bear
@UncleEbeneezer: But of course, because the concept of a product is far more valuable than actually making the product itself, doncha know.
Kent
I’m in education and the textbook sales folks are particularly ridiculous. Showing up at every ed conference and such with their elaborate displays. When basically no teacher who attends those ever has much of a say in their district’s textbook adoption process. That is a whole endless committee process that no one ever wants to get stuck doing.
You pick up their swag and freebies and that is it. I don’t care how beautiful their display is and how compelling their sales pitch is. Decisions about textbook adoptions are completely outside my control.
Matt McIrvin
@Lobo:
Who cares, we’ll be dead.
danielx
@Belafon:
Details please.
Prometheus Shrugged
I’m far from a Mark Cuban fan, but I thought that his answers to economics/sales culture questions on the Brian Tyler Cohen podcast could be persuasive to a certain sector of younger white men.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QqDPrv8oFyY
I didn’t realize before watching this that Cuban was such a big Kamala supporter (and not just a never-Trumper, which I did know from 2020).
Sister Golden Bear
@Harrison Wesley: Someone pointed out that Vance was a kid from a rural(ish) poor family — catnip to Ivies as a DEI admit. So he may not have gotten in strictly on his own merits. (No shade to other minorities who undoubtedly did have to work twice as hard and be twice as good to be even be considered.)
Kent
Me too honestly. I turn off most of the poll porn and wishcasting. No amount of information is going to change my mind about who to vote for, and living in Washington State I know that if the election gets close here we are all doomed anyway. I am focused on Marie Glusenkamp Perez’s campaign, my local Dem Congresswoman. I usually don’t have close consequential races to participate in so this is new and interesting.
JML
@Prometheus Shrugged: Cuban is fairly progressive on a lot of issues. Like most rich dudes he doesn’t want to pay taxes very much, but he’s not a fool.
Baud
@Kent:
I ♥️ swag.
danielx
‘Scorched earth’: Laura Loomer unleashes anti-GOP tirade after reportedly getting booted from Trump’s entourage
Puts a smile on my face and a spring in my step. Lesson learned for Loomer: travel with Trump is for as long as he likes you and/or sees it in his interest to have you around. After that you’re off the bus.
XeckyGilchrist
This is fantastic, thank you!
The only thing that rings false is in comparing Vance to Shelley, and I could be wrong about this – wasn’t Shelley accomplished and competent at some point?
Bort
“Oh, this is bad, this is really bad! You work, and you slave, and you steal just enough for a sweet lick of that shiny brass ring… don’t I get a lick? Doesn’t Gil get a lick?”
prostratedragon
Maybe this is less an indicator that he’s an out-guy than a case inpoint of why:
This couldn’t be fixed merely with better advance work.
Adding, I do like the thesis. It’s been obvious that he’s being left out there on his own to dangle on that fraying rope.
Gin & Tonic
@Soprano2:
We once brought my dear wife’s car in to a mechanic because it was running very poorly, misfiring, etc. This was during COVID and she was working at a vax clinic away from home, so we had to go with “I know a guy” type of reputation. He fixed the car, but told us that when he first opened the hood, a mouse ran out. This was over 100 miles from home, so the mouse had been in there for some time.
Chief Oshkosh
@MazeDancer: Please tell them that they misspelled “Addresses” in the “Get Adresses” [sic] button on their splash page.
Sheesh, these kidds…
trollhattan
More news you “hate” to see.
Cripes, if this dude ends up delivering NC….
He should commit an evening to watching Black Klansman.
MazeDancer
@Chief Oshkosh:
oopw. I told me. Me feels dumb.
Thanks!
Quinerly
Why on earth aren’t we all boycotting Musk’s X? (Full disclosure…I never signed up and I can’t understand where people find the time for all these social media platforms)
https://www.theverge.com/2024/9/23/24252438/x-blocked-users-view-public-posts
NeenerNeener
@narya: Here’s the “archived” version of that article:
https://archive.ph/60plj
Quinerly
@Suzanne:
Very good read. Thanks for posting.
Auntie Anne
@Joy in FL: thank you so much!
Chief Oshkosh
@MazeDancer: It happens.
Also, the form for requesting addresses seems to be broken. It allows entry of name, email address, and subject, but does not allow for entry of a message, and the Send button is not active.
Lapassionara
@danielx: she is just so weird looking. Yikes!
different-church-lady
He’s already come right out and boasted that he’s going to lie about facts (the “illegal” immigrants thing). We’ve reached the “You love me for my lies” phase.
rk
@West of the Rockies:
I was worried about that, but not so much anymore. In theory, Vance should be more than a match for Walz. After all he’s got a law degree from Yale and should be a good debater. But watching him speak, he’s condescending and awkward under pressure. He’s not genuine ( I mean look at his turn around from calling Trump Hitler to becoming his number one fan). Plus he’s unlikable.
Walz also connects with people.
I think that Walz will be able to hold his own against JD.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@danielx: I know it’s petty, but that Loomer blowup filled me with glee.
Baud
@danielx:
Crazy MAGA Ladies for Harris.
Joy in FL
@Auntie Anne: You are very welcome. I hope Chunk has a full recovery and gets to enjoy many years with you.
prostratedragon
Another toon to go with the sheep cheering the wolf.
MazeDancer
@Chief Oshkosh:
Ugh. Really? Have been getting requests. But thanks, will check.
Snarki, child of Loki
“They can’t fire him so they try ways to keep him out of the news.”
SURE, Trump can fire Couchfucker Vance: just invite him along for a stroll along 5th Ave., and *BANG* fired.
Baud
@Snarki, child of Loki:
That would probably increase Trump’s popularity.
Matt McIrvin
@West of the Rockies: I am tremendously worried.
People are talking about how Walz seems like a decent, normal guy, and Vance is a smarmy asshole. But “smarmy asshole” usually wins on points in this kind of debate. Smarmy assholes roll right over their opponents. All you have to do is Gish gallop a bit, drown them in surprising bullshit and the talking heads will be talking about how smart you are and that the other guy didn’t address your point this, that and the other.
Ted Cruz is an expert debater. That’s the personality that usually wins.
Harris won because she didn’t play by the usual civil-liberal-debater rules–she went on the attack and established dominance. Can Walz go for the jugular like that? I have no idea. Vance won’t look like a confused old man like Trump did.
bbleh
@West of the Rockies: forget the Ivy part. The number of self-impressed, sheltered, borderline-inbred kids on MY campus was — well, probably not a majority, although certainly one if you measured by loudness.
What I’m hoping for is Biden v Ryan II. Vance having some kind of electrical device inserted somewhere, and Walz just smiling and laughing and aw-shucks-ing and occasionally skewering him (in a friendly way!).
Crazy Uncle Brian
@Belafon: It will be a thing of beauty! Perhaps she will handcuff herself to a door at Mar-A-Lago.
Doc Sardonic
@Soprano2: Just to mention so folks can file this away in the may come in handy at some point file. Rodent damage is covered under most auto insurance policies if you carry full coverage with comprehensive, it is considered vandalism.
Princess
@Matt McIrvin: it wasn’t just that she went for the jugular. Harris won because she expertly baited an extremely baitable dude. Most people aren’t that baitable.
narya
@NeenerNeener: Thanks–it’s horrifying.
karen marie
@CaseyL: Except that Vance is humiliating himself. How could he not see the $2.99 sign on the display? He chose not to look, because, like Trump, the only thing important in that store is him. He had a narrative and he was not going to let reality interfere, so he made the deliberate choice to not look around his immediate area.
I prefer to not have the person first in line when Trump drops dead to be someone so wed to his narrative that he refuses to look at or acknowledge conflicting evidence that everyone can see right there next to him.
CaseyL
@WaterGirl: Donation made for sweet Chunk.
Splitting Image
@Matt McIrvin:
He will look like an asshole, though. Not the good kind either. If he talks over Walz for the entire evening, he’s likely to lose the debate by more than if Walz goes on the attack.
Vance is as big a phony as his namesake and his cousin Coy, and the Confederates didn’t take a liking to them either.
ColoradoGuy
Over at Joe.My.God the actual screenshots from Mark Robinson were published a few days ago. It’s one thing to read on CNN and elsewhere that they were “disreputable”, and quite another to see them for yourself. Most folks will not be able to read them all the way through … they just get grosser and grosser.
I’m pretty sure his staff saw the actual screenshots, and agreed to resign en masse. This ain’t the kind of thing you want to see on your resume.
rikyrah
@narya:
You will never convince me that the only vetting that needed to be done with Vance was that Thiel’s check cleared.
That’s it
Check cleared=Vance on the ticket
zhena gogolia
@Matt McIrvin: Walz can go for the jugular.
karen marie
@Suzanne: For all the articles about Vance’s conversion to Catholicism, I cannot find a single one that shows him actually going to a church service anywhere.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@zhena gogolia:
Agreed. It was a stump speech, but he showed he can go for the jugular in the first speech he gave in Philadelphia as the VP candidate
Omnes Omnibus
@Matt McIrvin: Ted Cruz was good at a very particular type of debate. The high school/college formal debate that has a very specific set of rules and a scoring system that rewards fast talking gish gallopers.
Why would you think that Walz wouldn’t know that old POTUS/VP debate rules don’t apply anymore. Walz’s goal will be to make Vance look like the arrogant, out of touch asshole that he is while remaining relatable himself. It is something that should be within his grasp.
zhena gogolia
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): He’s very quick on his feet. (Successful high-school teacher, has to be.)
narya
@rikyrah: Yup. I think that other pieces of it amplified that decision or made it look like the correct decision, but first and foremost were the bucks. Lawyers are expensive, and TCFG needs a lot of them–not to mention it is all, every part of it, a piece of the grift.
zhena gogolia
@Omnes Omnibus: I was worried about Biden before June 27 because of the ageism and ableism of this country. I’m not worried about Walz vs. Vance at all.
Shana
@geg6: So it wouldn’t be stumbled upon at home? Just a guess.
Tenar Arha
@WaterGirl: all set with a chunk of change for Chunk ;)
Scout211
A jackal posted a link to just one of those posts and it was, Ewww! Plus the fact that he included his sister-in-law in his graphic post made it super creepy.
Sources are saying that his staff offered to hire IT experts to do more research and investigate the porn site posts, since he denied that the posts were his. The staff became uncomfortable when he refused to let them investigate so they resigned.
At least this is the story that they are putting out through “sources” to cover themselves.
Quiltingfool
@ColoradoGuy: I read some of them. Looks like Penthouse forum writing to me.
I now wish I hadn’t read it. Needed a healthy dose of brain bleach.
Live and learn, I guess.
Quinerly
“Lt. Gov. Mark Robinson’s alleged rejection of the offers sowed doubt among some staff members, people familiar with the matter tell WRAL. His response in the wake of the report likely played a role in the exodus of members of his gubernatorial campaign staff, they said.”
https://www.wral.com/story/robinson-rejected-offers-of-tech-help-to-investigate-posts-on-porn-site-sources-say/21638904/
EthylEster
Re: there’s panic on the streets of West Palm
Never confuse Palm Beach and West Palm Beach.
They are two completely different entities.
MazeDancer
@rikyrah: Think it’s possible that besides the cash – big, big, big cash – there was the signed promise that Trump would get a full, complete, and total pardon for everything past, present, and future.
In exchange for which Trump would resign for health reasons.
Which would be preferable to the open window. Which Trump had to know would be part of the Thiel plan.
Auntie Anne
@CaseyL: thank you!
Auntie Anne
@Tenar Arha: thank you!
Scout211
It is. We filed a claim for extensive damage to the electrical wiring in my husband’s truck due to rodents. It did help with the costs, which ended up only being our deductible. But building a second garage to keep the truck from more rodent damage hiked up the costs a little bit more. Insurance didn’t help with that. LOL
Misterpuff
@raven: An honest to goodness RINO.
WaterGirl
@Joy in FL: Yeah, I have been watching. in the 2.5 hours since I added that comment, they’ve raised $2,342 with 43 donations.
I’m thinking that a bunch of jackal’s have stepped up to help Auntie Anne save her kitty. BJ peeps are the best. Thank you!
WaterGirl
@Matt McIrvin: I think worried might be your middle name. :-)
MagdaInBlack
@Doc Sardonic: Was just checking to see if anyone mentioned that. Thank you. Body shop here and we have replaced rodent chewed wiring several times in the years, all done thru insurance claims.
Doc Sardonic
@EthylEster: West Palm is where the “help” lives
Doc Sardonic
@MagdaInBlack: Learned that from our Jeep dealer, gaddamn squirrels cost Progressive about 10 grand for damage to mine and wife’s Jeeps.
Chief Oshkosh
@MazeDancer: Seems to work now! :)
TEL
@Soprano2: Had my engine harness eaten by rodents a couple of years ago. Apparently, Honda uses some kind of soy-based material to wrap the harness wires in, which rodents mistake as food. Fortunately, my insurance paid most of it.
artem1s
@Lobo: \
I guess being intimately familiar a continent torn by bloody religious wars for 500 years will make even a Calvinist zealot like Sam Adams to Nope out of establishing a state religion. I imagine Franklin probably took the pragmatic view that it would be better if he didn’t have to worry about getting imprisoned or burnt at the stake for being a deist and closet atheist. I’m pretty sure Jefferson just wanted to be able to rape his slaves guilt free without being God-bothered to death by the Abolitionists.
EmanG
Brilliant exegesis. I feel like there’s a tight 5 comedy routine just paraphrasing what you just wrote.
K-Mo
@bbleh: I agree with this. Except Ryan is way more appealing than Vance. Walz will be fine. And the stakes just aren’t that high.
K-Mo
MrMix, this was a fun read, and on point, if not about sales departments per se (I have no idea) then about toxic masculine groups (I can attest). Painful but schadenfraudish to contemplate.
Wolvesvalley
@WaterGirl:
Auntie Anne’s kitty’s GoFundMe is now within $8 of the goal. :-)
WaterGirl
@Wolvesvalley: Great work everybody!
Wolvesvalley
@WaterGirl: And now it’s $17 over the goal! Yay!
Ruckus
@narya:
It does have the ring of sales BS to it.
That’s not a ring, it’s all 5 church bells in every church in town being rung at the same exact time. And with a 10,000 watt amp at each location amplifying the sounds. IOW it is sales BS.
RevRick
The thing about the two rallies is that the Walz rally ( of which I was one of the 3,000) was held in swingy Northampton county which went to Trump in 2016 and swung back to Biden in 2020, while Trump romped in Berks county, site of the Vance rally, both times. Which makes JD’s turnout more sad trombone.
Ruckus
@Ishiyama:
The correct answer is C, both of the above.
pluky
@Soprano2: Hopefully lesson learned: put it in writing, and get sign-off.
pluky
@Matt McIrvin: Walz was a Command Sergeant Major. He not only knows how to go for the jugular, he can rip it out along with the associated musculature and connective tissue.
Kayla Rudbek
@karen marie: Opus Dei doesn’t advertise itself too openly, but St. Catherine of Siena was the Opus Dei parish in the DC metro area about 20-30 years ago, according to Mr. Rudbek who grew up here. There are apparently some other Catholic parishes here in Northern Virginia who still insist on women wearing veils/head coverings in church, which is pre-Vatican II practice; also having Mass in Latin is another signal for the RWNJ. I’d have to go check the reviews on Google and Yelp to figure out which ones are which. I swear I am going to live to see an official schism in American Catholicism (in my arrogant opinion there’s a de facto one already happening).
wjca
Seems like the simplest solution would be for the non-Opus Dei folks to just rebrand their parishes as Episcopalians.
Or threaten to do so, en masse. The goal being to pressure the Vatican to rotate a bunch of current bishops to sinecures elsewhere, and replace them with bishops who are not RWNJs.
wjca
I’ve certainly encountered a whole lot of that over the years. But I have also encountered a couple of (actually quite successful) sales guys who cared about getting their customers what they needed. To the point of saying “We’ve got a really awesome product, but it just isn’t what you need.”
Definitely made me, and apparently a lot of others, file them as a goto guy whenever I needed something. No matter what company they might have moved to.
Kayla Rudbek
@wjca: some problems with this: 1) many of the liberals raised Catholic have disaffiliated from religion entirely or have already switched over to the liberal Protestants 2) for historical reasons, many of the remaining Catholic liberals aren’t going to switch over (long memories of the Episcopal Church etc being the oppressor) 3) the supply of priests into the bishop pipeline is more right wing than the average Catholic so there aren’t that many liberal Catholic priests left (many liberal Catholic men not particularly wanting to do the celibacy thing).
I have been considering switching over, and if I was single I probably would have done it already. As it is, my medical records have me as officially no religion, I suspect that Mr. Rudbek or my sibling or godson will give me a Catholic funeral anyway, and if any of the Protestant churches around here would do weekend evening worship, they’d have a better chance of getting me into a church again as that would be better logistics.
Chris T.
@Soprano2:
Mice and squirrels and the like find insulation tasty.
They (auto places) have peppermint spray to discourage them (rodents).