Here’s the PBS live stream, since CBS keeps crashing on my machine:
Sorry, but I’ve got a severe case of the Just CANnots. Gonna go take a nap, since I’ll be putting together the Weekly Covid / H5N1 Update later (as well as, probably, some kind of recap roundup).
Have at it, jackals!
Ishiyama
I’ve got my popcorn and cocoa prepared. Sitting by.
Ceci n est pas mon nym
Watching via Robert Reich’s substack.
We’ll see how much of couch-boy’s smarmy lying face my wife and I can stand.
They just said they’re going to be providing live fact-checking.
piratedan
Red 5, standing by….
watch for that cross-fire down there by the turrets…..
TBone
Just watched Bette Davis play Queen to Errol Flynn’s Essex. Tango! 🎶
https://youtu.be/Y0tmPirFikI
Mousebumples
Not watching, but tracking on socials and here while I postcard.
25 done tonight so far!
3Sice
Watch party from the party:
https://www.youtube.com/live/qaRwozQeD_w?feature=shared
Soprano2
I’m eating dinner and watching. I want to know everything that happens.
dmsilev
@piratedan: For me, it’s more like “Red wine, standing by…”
BretH
I want to puke from the coverage already.
BlueGuitarist
@Mousebumples:
Good for you
dmsilev
“In order to have a thoughtful and considerate debate….”
“….we’ve replaced JD Vance with an actual thoughtful and considerate person”
dmsilev
Well, that doesn’t bode well for the quality of questions.
3Sice
Vance is
weirdcreepy.TS
Watching with the sound off – someone has told JD Vance to look at the Gov – thinks he’s imitating MVP – but as above, just creepy
piratedan
cripes, they start off with GazaIsrael?
Tazj
@dmsilev: I know. The US is now facing an apocalypse over to you Governor Walz.
Soprano2
That was a stupid question. How would you know without knowing the circumstances?
stacib
Am I the only person who is totally aggravated when a candidate talks about chickens when you’ve asked about eggs? There is plenty of time to attack trump – please answer the questions asked.
dmsilev
JD Vance, giving thanks for the social safety net that he and his running mate are trying to dismantle.
Math Guy
First “gotcha” question and neither candidate seems inclined to answer.
Soprano2
@stacib: But it’s a dumb question.
Another Scott
@Soprano2: +1
Harris-Walz won’t take office for 3+ months.
Cheers,
Scott.
Percysowner
I watched for about 30 seconds and decided I am just going to peace out. I can’t bear to hear Vance’s lies. Plus I’ll just get all upset and then I won’t be able to sleep. I can read reviews tomorrow and if it’s good the whole thing will be posted and I can go there.
Hey, I missed Trump/Biden and Biden did not do well. I missed Trump/Harris and Harris did great. My watching won’t affect how Walz does or how I will vote.
Omnes Omnibus
different-church-lady
Has Vance used the c-word yet?
3Sice
Vance’s response is confusing.
Ceci n est pas mon nym
Ooh first lie! The old chestnut about giving money to Iran.
piratedan
Vance dodges the question for the first minute and then stands up the DJT foreign policy.
ohhh a fact check… and great eyeliner action from Vance.
dmsilev
@Soprano2: You’ll notice that Walz didn’t answer the question. He talked about the Middle East crisis in general and then pivoted to talking about Trump’s leadership more broadly.
Jinchi
@piratedan: I’m hoping the campaign has a good statement on Israel. They’ve been trying to make it go away, but I think Netanyahu would love to cause trouble for them by triggering an all out war and demanding Biden back his idiocy.
different-church-lady
@Omnes Omnibus: But he sure knows how to shovel bullshit.
Elizabelle
They are both doing well.
One of them has an anvil on his ankles. Donald Trump!
Quinerly
@Percysowner:
I might have to flip it off.
Vance is too slick. Turns my stomach.
Walz is holding his own but started out nervous, imo. I can’t even imagine the pressure Walz is under.
stacib
@Soprano2: I know – I got that part, and maybe I’m asking for too much, but this happens more often than not.
zhena gogolia
He keeps mispronouncing Walz as Waltz.
Paul W.
@stacib: under no circumstances do I want a VP candidates writing foreign policy as to the use of a preemptive strike.
i was surprised and a little relieved Vance also ignored the loaded question.
Another Scott
@stacib: Nope.
This isn’t a debate. This is a forum for the candidates to present their views and their proposed policies. Taking slanted, gotcha questions as given in good-faith isn’t the way to “win”.
Cheers,
Scott.
Soprano2
@dmsilev: Yes, because it was a dumb question.
dmsilev
An actual climate change question. Drink up, everyone, this is a rarity.
Princess
Fast talking little shyster.
zhena gogolia
Vance pivots to criticizing the disaster response.
dmsilev
Does Vance _really_ want to bring up Donald “Sharpie” Trump’s record on hurricanes?
Soprano2
@stacib: True, sometimes it makes me mad, but in this case it was an unanswerable question.
zhena gogolia
WTF is Vance talking about???
Math Guy
Vance: Suppose the scientists are right, not that I’m conceding that point.
3Sice
Vance is what happens when you show up for the time-share presentation.
zhena gogolia
I can see already they’re going to give Vance more time than Walz.
piratedan
wow, what a big fucking lie from Vance
the whole economy is roaring due to US Infrastructure
HeleninEire
I have it on mute. Took the Gummy only an hour ago. It takes a bit longer to kick in. I was busy WATCHING THE METS BEAT MILWAUKEE.
Anyway…if you have a minute go to Wonkette (but come right back here) and read Evan’s live blog introduction. Very funny.
Betty
Cleanest economy in the world ? Huh?
Quinerly
@Princess:
Slick.
My brain must be fried tonight. I am having a hard time following Vance.
dmsilev
@piratedan:
Copy that into the clipboard; it’s going to get a lot of use tonight.
kalakal
Walz seems to be settling in, rather nervous at first. I think he’s getting into his groove. Vance comes across as a corporate speak creep. Lot’s of platitudes, some lies, no substance
Primer Gray (formerly Yet Another Jeff)
Hillbilly Vanilli got his own style of gish gallop…
zhena gogolia
It is harder to tell the truth than to lie. This is all that these debates prove.
Quinerly
@3Sice:
THIS!!!!
3Sice
@Quinerly:
It’s not just you.
Soprano2
Inflation Adjustment Act! Plus, we’re producing more energy now than ever.
Jeffro
Walz is starting to settle in…good!
zhena gogolia
WTF is Vance talking about? What does he mean by “producing energy”?
Ramona
@Soprano2: it is indeed a dumb question! Why is supporting Israel in a preemptive strike against Iran the very first and seemingly only measure this questioner can think of? She could have posed it in an open-ended way like what is your policy on supporting our Israeli ally in the face of Iran’s attack on it.
SatanicPanic
Padres up 3 -0 top of the 3rd
stacib
@zhena gogolia: Now, this time I wished Walz would bring up trump holding up aid to PR, and then tossing paper towels at them. Aargh, I should just go to bed
Adding, I also thought that was a great answer Walz gave.
Soprano2
What bullshit. We’re producing more energy now than ever.
zhena gogolia
THEY ARE GOING TO LET VANCE TALK AS LONG AS HE WANTS TO
piratedan
big lie number 2, doubling down on the US manufacturing is not being restored.
Balconesfault
Manufacturing investment in the US has been in a huge upward curve the last couple years.
kalakal
Wtf is Vance on about?
Tazj
@Jeffro: Yes, he looks more confident now. I’m listening to him and mostly muting Vance.
Dorothy A. Winsor
Vance’s slick aggressiveness upsets me. I feel the need to ward it off. Luckily I can turn off the TV and come here.
Primer Gray (formerly Yet Another Jeff)
@zhena gogolia: Apparently he thinks we should be the only source of energy production…
different-church-lady
Walz is staring at Vance like a father who’s gonna give the kid a lickin’ as soon as he gets home from school.
Omnes Omnibus
Fact check there.
zhena gogolia
THE CRISIS AT THE BORDER
I’m out
Another Scott
@zhena gogolia: +1
I’ve just been listening to the C-Span feed. I’m out.
I might check the transcript later.
Walz is doing well, but both of them are having to talk way too fast because you can’t explain a complicated response to a complicated problem, and counter lies from the other guy, in 120 seconds.
Cheers,
Scott.
zhena gogolia
@Dorothy A. Winsor: Get used to it. He’ll probably be our Führer for the foreseeable future.
Quinerly
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
Good description….I keep thinking “slick.” But “slick aggressiveness” really nails it.
Balconesfault
How many times does this slime ball throw his mom under the bus?
dmsilev
“Build the Wall”
He’s playing to his boss.
Omnes Omnibus
@zhena gogolia: Stop it.
Math Guy
This is not a debate; it is a made-for-tv spectacle.
Old School
I assume there’s a clock and Walz keep completing his response in the time, so I’m kind of confused why Nora O’Donnell keeps saying, “Governor, your time is up.”
piratedan
big lie #3 framing immigration is a crisis. ty CBS, you fucking turds.
Betty
I can’t do this. Just too many lies!
dmsilev
@Omnes Omnibus: So, they decided to change policy? I thought the plan was “let the lies flow freely”.
Primer Gray (formerly Yet Another Jeff)
Yes, Vance…tell us about those executive orders Kamala has written…
piratedan
Walz is pissed off and now he’s pivoting to the DJT sabotage of the Immigration Bill.
TBone
Tim Walz kicking ass right now. THIS IS PERFECT
mrmoshpotato
@piratedan:
Nominated.
bbleh
“Slick aggressiveness” indeed. And Walz is doing well at turning the questions back onto Trump. I’d still like to see him go on the attack, but at least so far the questions haven’t really given him an opening.
Quinerly
@piratedan:
Walz is hitting his stride. I’m feeling better.
Math Guy
I’m done.
Another Scott
Todd Rundgren – Lockjaw (4:03)
Cheers,
Scott.
dmsilev
Vance is coming off as the asshole that he is.
Quinerly
WTF was that look Vance gave?
frosty
@Mousebumples: Good idea, I think I’ll do the same while I read the comments.
TBone
“Border Czar” – drink!
sdhays
@zhena gogolia: Atrios made the point that if the “moderators” aren’t there to keep people generally following the agreed upon rules and keep the candidates half-way honest, they have no purpose whatsoever. Just have Siri/Alexa read some canned questions and let the candidates answer/discuss.
And I find it astounding how CBS basically said “we’re so incompetent that we can’t possibly do any fact checking via the medium through which we make ALL of our money, so here’s a shitty QR code for those of you who both know what the hell that is and don’t already have a favored online information source”.
kalakal
Great response by Walz
Ramona
What does Vance mean by let’s posit climate change is happening so that we don’t have to get into weird science….? He’s no scientist! The question already posits what he do soooo graciously is willing to contingently stipulate!!!
Ah good, the CBS moderator did unequivocally state that overwhelming scientific consensus is that climate is warming.
Soprano2
I wish Walz would point out that Harris isn’t president.
mrmoshpotato
@TBone: Already drinking.
zhena gogolia
@Quinerly: WEIRD SHIT to quote GWB
piratedan
Vance is going to eat shit on Immigration now. Walz tries to wedge to Vance from Trump on working together issues.
Quinerly
@mrmoshpotato:
I may start.
zhena gogolia
Ugh vomit the “American citizens”
dmsilev
You know what we don’t have in Springfield, Senator? People eating pets.
Math Guy
@mrmoshpotato: Yeah, already a third of the way through a bottle of port.
JoyceH
Anyone else notice that Harris is already president? Vance keeps talking about how Harris did this or that. Huh.
bbleh
Oh my, Vance doubling down on Springfield?
TBone
NICE!!! Walz went biblical 🤣
Vance went Nazi meltdown 😆
zhena gogolia
Fact check! Drink!
piratedan
Vance is going full Nazi. Vance arguing with the moderators now.
Math Guy
Shut off his fucking mic.
Quinerly
@Math Guy:
I’m going to dig around in the refrigerator for PBR.
stacib
@Soprano2: IKR, and she doesn’t have an administration.
Leto
Stop fucking letting him talk, mute his fucking mic; JFC
Omnes Omnibus
@piratedan: It took less than a half an hour.
dmsilev
@Math Guy: They did.
Soprano2
@mrmoshpotato: Me too.
mvr
Why the fuck does Vance get 30 seconds and then they turn off both mics?
Betty
Checking in. Vance is out of line. Complains he was fact checked and gives himself extra time. Talks over the moderator. Disrespectful.
Omnes Omnibus
“Margaret, the rules say you’re not supposed to fact check” is the new “I was specifically told there would be no math”
Soprano2
@Math Guy: They did!
piratedan
@Omnes Omnibus: Wharton school, I’m sure that those folks have the best interests of the American public in mind.
Leto
@JoyceH: Apparently the VP is actual person in charge in Couch world.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
I thought the moderators weren’t going to do fact checks?
JoyceH
They did it! They cut the mikes!
Soprano2
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): I guess they couldn’t stand the lies.
SatanicPanic
@Omnes Omnibus: did he really say that?
hrprogressive
Not sure why Harris/Walz spent time downplaying expectations, Walz is doing great.
Hard to compare to MVP’s grand slam performance, but he’s doing damn fine.
HeleninEire
@Quinerly: LOL. We are old. I knew exactly what PBR meant.
different-church-lady
@Omnes Omnibus: Objecting to fact checking has a bit of Streisand Effect, doesn’t it?
twbrandt
@hrprogressive: under promise, over deliver.
frosty
@SatanicPanic: I wanted to watch the Orioles tonight but without cable it’s almost impossible. We have Disney+ which should include ESPN but it didn’t work. Between MLB and the O’s it’s almost impossible to watch them after you ditch cable. Without spending a lot of $$ on a streaming service that also carries and pays Fox News.
Oh well. Back to the VPs and postcards.
different-church-lady
@hrprogressive: Under promise, over deliver.
Betty
Vice President is not President for the umpteenth time.
eclare
@zhena gogolia:
Best and most truthful thing W ever said.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@different-church-lady:
It could look whiny imo
Omnes Omnibus
@SatanicPanic: Basically, if not word for word.
piratedan
Vance going out there and blaming the government for corporate greedflation.
Leto
@Betty: I guess in a Trumpov/Couch defiler administration it would be, but in reality…
SatanicPanic
@frosty: I’m just following the box score. I’m “in class” ie. on a zoom call for my online course. For the life of me I can’t figure out how to watch the game either.
SatanicPanic
@Omnes Omnibus: wow
zhena gogolia
@SatanicPanic: Yes, he did.
Omnes Omnibus
Do you really not know why?
Chief Oshkosh
@JoyceH:
Vance is doing that to get Walz to say “well, that’s not our problem because Harris isn’t president yet.” To which Vance would say “Aha! So you agree that Biden fucked that up!”
Pretty straightforward attempt to drive a wedge between Biden and Harris. Hopefully Walz was coached on it.
Dorothy A. Winsor
Wonkette makes me feel better
Leto
@piratedan: I hadn’t heard the educated don’t have common sense line in a long time. They’re just recycling everything at this point.
SatanicPanic
@zhena gogolia: something not right with that man
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Soprano2:
I guess. I’m just following along here, I’m not watching. Didn’t want to listen to Vance’s voice
TBone
Trump’s merch is all made in China, J DIvanka!
Soprano2
But we did get cheaper goods from China! That happened!
frosty
@mrmoshpotato: Yep. Been drinking. Need to mix another cocktail. Rum tonight.
zhena gogolia
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): It’s unbearable. I didn’t think anything could be worse than Trump.
narya
TCFG’s name and “wisdom” should never be in the same sentence.
bbleh
Vance is talking poetry and Walz is talking prose. Vance is talking about strength and leadership and American Manufacturing™ and fast and future greatness, and Walz is citing facts.
Omnes Omnibus
Folks that are Venture Capital [pointed glance at Vance]
Leto
Lol, “Venture Capital”
3Sice
Vance’s superpower is being a twat. Somehow he’s pulling Trump down with him.
zhena gogolia
@3Sice: You think so?
BretH
Vance is a great used car salesman.
SW
Good day of baseball
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@bbleh:
Is that good?
Quinerly
@HeleninEire:
It’s kinda funny. The kids are drinking it in a lot of bars. I hit a bar in Taos a few weeks back. I was the oldest person drinking PBR. All the 25 year olds were drinking it.
I keep it around in the summer in the refrigerator since it’s my “yard beer.” Bought a 30 pack since I am getting ready to start winterizing the yard. Plus, I have planted 35 Apache Plume seedlings, some Winterfat, Fernbush, False Indigo, and Turpentine Bush seedlings in the last 4 days.
piratedan
the US didn’t offshore those manufacturing jobs, THOSE CORPORATIONS DID.
Nice isolationist tack from Vance.
oh fuck, they’re going character, those bitches.
Betty
Have to mute Vance. I just can’t stomach his lies and distortion.s
frosty
@HeleninEire: @Quinerly: OMG you think you’re old???
Primer Gray (formerly Yet Another Jeff)
Kinda confused on going into medical debt to put food on the table…
Spanky
Sorry, JD, fast talkers make my eyes glaze over. Makes me think they’re lying, for some reason.
Math Guy
I’m going to turn off the tv and just follow this thread. Let me know if I need to turn the tv back on.
Omnes Omnibus
“I am a knucklehead at times.”
piratedan
going to go NOPE out here, if they’re going here and going to check resumes
frosty
@SatanicPanic: I think it will be at a local bar if the O’s pull it out. Hopefully one I can walk home from.
Bill Arnold
@Quinerly:
My brother’s fraternity at Cornell (1980s) had a PBR vending machine. One quarter would buy one a PBR.
Betty
Good explanation from Vance on the hoopla about his China trips.
SatanicPanic
@frosty: errrrr, I think that game’s ove
Update- oh duh I misread you. yeah I’m going to see if the bar across the street will have the game up
Soprano2
@piratedan: They always ignore that. They also never mention that it started in the 1980’s before NAFTA.
Old Dan and Little Ann
I am so fucking sick and tired of these questions just being ignored. Why fucking bother? Just say, “Okay, Vance. Talk for 2 minutes about anything you want.”
Another Scott
I wonder how many people noped out after the first 15-20 minutes.
Cheers,
Scott.
Chet Murthy
@Quinerly: about 10yr ago, I was in a bar and a kid ordered a PBR and a shot. I asked him why he got the PBR, and he told me: “because I’m going to spend the $$ on good whiskey, not on the beer, which I’ll barely taste after the shot.” Kid made sense.
bbleh
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): I don’t know. Vance has the salesman patter down very smooth, some of which is reasonably true and some utter BS. Walz is trying to stick to the truth, and that’s hamstringing his delivery, although he comes across as very earnest. Obviously some people will hear what they want to hear, but for those who are genuinely torn (fewer, I think, than many believe, but still potentially the swing votes) I don’t know which will be more compelling.
Sigh. This is theater criticism. But I guess that’s what we’re watching.
Juju
@Ceci n est pas mon nym: my limit was a bit over 10 minutes. Walz seems to be doing well, but it sounds like JD needs to learn a bit about how the presidency works. He’s blaming the VP for a lot of things the VP cannot do. I’m not too impressed by his Ivy League education.
This has nothing to do with the other part, but what does Gaza have to do with Social Security? I was dealing with stuff in a different room and only heard parts of things with that question.
frosty
@Quinerly: My youngest is drinking Yuengleng, which is at least a step up from his previous Bud Light. It’s one of my Lawnmower Beers, though, along with Natty Boh and Rolling Rock.
Rolling Rock ponies (7 oz) are the best Lawnmower Beer. They’re gone before they get warm and pissy.
I should add, a LM is the one you drink AFTER mowing the lawn. Sometimes in the shower at which point it is a Shower Beer.
Now back to the original topic.
Omnes Omnibus
@Bill Arnold: My fraternity’s beer vending machine had a variety of beer, good and bad. It was loaded randomly. Same time frame, same price,
HeleninEire
@Quinerly: I love reading about your wonderful life. I am 18 months away from retirement. I will travel…the same as you…all the time…but my travel will be mostly international.
Forever, until I can’t do it anymore.
zhena gogolia
@Betty: You mean Walz?
3Sice
@BretH:
Second place, knife set.
Old J.D. really needs this deal….
Quinerly
@Bill Arnold:
The frat houses at my undergrad (’78-’82) mostly had the vending machines with Miller High Life (pre Miller Lite). There was a Miller brewery in NC.
It was also the era of “Penny Draft.” (18 was the drinking age for beer and wine)
dmsilev
Oh good, the JD Vance sticks his foot in his mouth about women’s health section.
kissel
@HeleninEire: I love your entire comment.
Betty
@zhena gogolia: Yes, of course. Thanks for the correction.
frosty
@HeleninEire: That’s our plan. So far domestic, pulling a trailer. Three or four months at a time. Maybe two though from now on since we don’t have to get all the way to the Pacific.
Although … southern Spain and France …
Leto
They don’t trust you, Couch fucker and by extension the rest of your party, because we have real life experience under your Christofascist rule via the Corrupt 6.
Quinerly
@HeleninEire:
Thank you. I really don’t have the desire to fly anymore. I just don’t like the process….getting to and from the airport, waiting for flights, luggage. I would probably freak out in an airport now.
My jam is “driving around with my dog, looking at things, and talking to strangers.”
p.a.
@Bill Arnold: We had a Coke machine that ‘Gansett bottles fit into. I think the bottles were a bit slimmer than other brands, or maybe just the cheapest, so that’s what was stocked. Long time ago; late 70s.
Ridnik Chrome
If I was lost in the desert and dying of thirst and somebody came along and offered me a PBR, I’d drink it. But first I’d ask if they had anything else.
ETA: I’d drink an entire case of PBRs before I’d watch even a minute of JD Vance on TV.
Math Guy
Is the “debate” qualitatively different than it was 15 minutes ago?
Chief Oshkosh
@Quinerly: I recently had occasion to reacquaint myself with Narragansett beer. I don’t recall liking it as much as I do now. Weird, because I’ve definitely gotten more picky. Anyhoo, try some if you get a chance (it’s still pretty regional to RI and MA, I think). It’s a pretty good light lager
ETA:
<a href=”#comment-9377936″>@p.a.</a>:
Hi Neighbor!
Math Guy
@Ridnik Chrome: Unless they had water, PBR is the next best thing.
zhena gogolia
@Math Guy: It was triggering us so I stopped watching. I’m trying to follow along here, but I guess not many BJers are watching either.
HeleninEire
@frosty: LOL.
I understand that you are a bit older than us. I watch your travels on FB and I am awed.
When I say “old” I mean it in a great way. I love being “old.” I thought I would never get here. And here I am.
frosty
@Quinerly: That’s us, except for the dog!
Quinerly
@Ridnik Chrome:
It’s an acquired taste….”Summer yard beer.” Sometimes you just want a tall boy in a can.
I’m mostly an IPA chick in certain venues.😉
Leto
@Ridnik Chrome: Do you have any motor oil? Is my own urine in consideration? Can I wait for the slightest morning dew that might be available?
Ceci n est pas mon nym
I’ve noticed that Walz is very skillfully finishing right on the buzzer, just before the moderator says “your time is up”. He’s timing his responses very well.
Couch-boy is making my stomach roil. So far still able to watch, but not sure how much longer I can last.
TBH, I’m listening with one ear while surfing the internet, reading BJ, etc.
Math Guy
@zhena gogolia: But it looks like a nice thread on beer is getting started.
lamh47
It’s actually kinda amazing to me the differing opinions on how Walz is doing on my socials…Vance wins I guess because as long a liar is good at it, people let them slide…but IDK, I think he’s coming off as swarm
ETA :Also, not for nothing, but no one really cares about it…the folks who do weren’t gonna be for Harris/Walz anyway, the folks who don’t already are for Harris/Walz.
Juju
@Quinerly: my brain isn’t fried, and I’m having trouble too.
Betty
@zhena gogolia: I am trying, but it’s hard. Vance is slippery. Now he is agreeing that Amber Hurd should be alive after saying it is right for states to ban abortion.
zhena gogolia
@Ceci n est pas mon nym: That’s his teaching experience! You develop an internal clock.
WaterGirl
@Math Guy: I think it’s boring. They are talking so fast I can’t really get myself to listen. It feels like used car people who come at you so fast that they roll over you. Even Walz is coming across like that because of the fast talking.
mvr
These mdoerators suck.
Frank Wilhoit
@bbleh:
Everything is theater criticism. That is THE problem.
zhena gogolia
@WaterGirl: Walz is at his best with nice people. (Kind of like Biden.)
SatanicPanic
@Quinerly: one of my favorite bars sells them in tall cans, and I don’t mind. Sometimes you just want something that you can sip on and not get too drunk.
Ishiyama
Finally Walz calls Vance a liar about the baby death law.
frosty
@HeleninEire: Buckle up! The years keep moving faster! But yeah, traveling after retirement and not working is great. Hope your travels go as well.
But in between your trips to Dublin* be sure to get to Glacier National Park. It’s now our all time favorite.
* I’ve been watching your trips on FB too and I’m intrigued! Gotta talk Ms F into it though.
WaterGirl
The moderation is terrible. Virtually non-existent. I should say that I’m about 20 minutes behind.
Old Dan and Little Ann
I’d drink a PBR. The 2nd one always tastes slightly better.
SFAW
@HeleninEire:
Unfortunately, I was at work, and missed it.
Part of me wants them to win it tomorrow, but a small part of me wants there to be a Game 3 at Citi Field, so my daughter can attend. [She already has tickets.] But having it come down to a must-win would not be good for my psyche.
By the way: when is the Walz/Hillbilly Vanilli debate going to take place? I’ve been hearing about it, but …
3Sice
Vance is trying to steer America into the Cybertruck because his boss needs to move it off the lot.
Ryan
@Old Dan and Little Ann: You should try the fourth!
Quinerly
@frosty:
I was supposed to be in Utah at the end of the month…..Boulder, Utah area and Capitol Reef. Looking like I am going to cancel. Wound up with this kitchen cabinet update project that I was a bit impulsive about.
I am going to be on the road for 5 weeks after Thanksgiving. Bisbee, Tubac, Tucson, Phoenix, Winslow, Cottonwood, Cameron, AZ
Math Guy
@WaterGirl: 20 minutes is not bad. Some people are still decades behind.
Primer Gray (formerly Yet Another Jeff)
@Math Guy: But now it’s quantitively different!
Geminid
@SatanicPanic: You can probably get tbat Orioles game on the radio.
HeleninEire
@Bill Arnold: When I was in college at Pace University NYC…1981 – 1985 there was a pub…a real pub…in the dorm.
It closed just a year or 2 after I graduated, when the drinking age changed from 18-21.
Jeffro
@frosty: I’ll see all of those beers and raise you a Schaefer Light ;)
($6/case back in the day…$4.50/case if it was past its expiration date LOL)
Quinerly
@3Sice:
You are on a roll.😎
Leto
@Quinerly: I’ll be honest, I’ve kinda stopped listening. Couch fucker is going to lie his ass off, and Walz is stuck trying to fact check him. This is the issue when you don’t have moderation and you let a pathological liar do his thing. Walz is qualified in the event something happens to President Harris. The End.
Ridnik Chrome
@Quinerly: The first time I ever got drunk was on PBR, and let’s just say it was a bad experience. Hated the stuff ever since, and was deeply bemused when the kids in Brooklyn adopted it as their beer of choice.
Now, Corona, on the other hand, is a great cheap beer. And the Minutemen wrote a song about it, too.
frosty
@Quinerly: I’m Reinheitsgebot all the way. Pilsner, Helles, Dunkel, Lager. A blond IPA if that’s all they’ve got.
Flanders Other Neighbor
Pabst Theater – Excellent. Pabst Beer – not so much.
At least it wasn’t as bad as Old Style. I refused to drink that stuff when I was in high school, and my bar was pretty low.
Jeffro
@Old Dan and Little Ann: nothing better than a PBR tallboy at a punk rock show!
Quinerly
@Jeffro:
I know a bar in Bisbee, AZ that had Hamm’s for $2 last February. Amazing.
p.a.
Late co-worker and fishing buddy was, shall we say tight with the dollar. We were on strike 16 weeks in ’89 against NYNEX so to save $$$ Artie began to drink Black Label 🤢. He never gave them up until about 2010 when his son got a job at a liquor store, and he got decent beer (whatever his son liberated that week) for the bubble. Even some IPAs, but never stouts/porters.
bbleh
@Frank Wilhoit: arguably appropriate for these “joint appearances.” But to quote Dave Wasserman, I’ve seen enough. Zzzz now.
mrmoshpotato
@SFAW: All wild card games are at the same venue. They aren’t coming back to NY.
(Or ESPN is a liar.)
LNNVA
@Chief Oshkosh: I haven’t heard of that beer in so very long. My brother, who died some years ago, had two cats he named Nara and Gansett! Thanks for the memory.
kissel
@SFAW: I think game 3 (if needed) would still be in Milwaukee. The wild card round is all 3 games at the same ballpark.
Quinerly
@frosty:
I love me some hoppy, hazy IPA.
NutmegAgain
@Flanders Other Neighbor: High school was a quart of Schlitz, a pack of Marlboros, and a nickel bag of what passed for weed in those days.
Misterpuff
Vance giggling thru Tots and Pears due to school shooting events. He wants to be nonchalant about the whole thing but it rankles.
frosty
@Quinerly: We’ll be in AZ for this year’s Snowbird Road Trip. Heading back through ABQ. I’ll send you a FB message when I figure out the timing and we can try to find a place with IPAs and Pilsners. Some time in March.
Math Guy
Remember Coors? When they restricted distribution my classmates would drive to Kansas to buy a few cases and “smuggle” them back in to Lincoln, NE.
Leto
@frosty: agreed!
3Sice
Hat tip to Walz for wasting 90 minutes he won’t ever get back.
Soprano2
@Leto: That was so much bullshit. Vance wants a national abortion ban.
zhena gogolia
New thread.
Jeffro
@Leto: I’m with you for almost-similar reasons. Vance is clearly well-trained, knows what he’s there to do (not look crazy), and is fine with lying, lying, lying.
Walz is not a ‘meta’ kind of guy, and so he’s kind of half-Kaine-ing his way through this. If he’d opened with “JD is slick and you’re going to hear a LOT of smooth lying tonight”, that would be one thing. Unfortunately, he keeps trying to have a conversation (sometimes with JD, sometimes with the moderators) and it’s landing kind of flat imho.
Omnes Omnibus
Walz is good on guns.
SW
“If Joe Biden’s policies caused the inflation, why did it happen in every other country on the face of the Earth?”
somebody sometime please.
p.a.
@Jeffro: “Schaefer is the, one beer to have, when you’re having more than one!”
That marketing jingle probably wouldn’t fly today.😉
Omnes Omnibus
Vance just used “weird.” Weird.
frosty
@Math Guy: I drove two cases of Coors across the country in my TR-3 for my East Coast brother. Gack!
lamh47
I think this is def more true than not…
Ridnik Chrome
@Leto: Sorry if I hurt your feelings. By all means, enjoy your PBR.
frosty
@Leto: If you get to my neck of the state check out Gunpowder Falls. The brewmeister learned in Bavaria. Nothing but Reinheitsgebot!
Leto
@Ridnik Chrome: Noooooooooo!
Quinerly
@Ridnik Chrome:
My first time I got drunk was on Country Club Malt Liquor. Pony cans. Country club “crest” on the can.
I would prefer that we just keep this between you and me. I have a reputation to maintain.
kissel
@Omnes Omnibus: had the same thought. Nice try by him to reverse the use of the word weird.
zhena gogolia
@lamh47: That sounds like my husband’s analysis.
Chief Oshkosh
@Jeffro:
Schaefer! It’s dere! It’s dere fer me!
The other Schaefer catch line.
And here’s the master singing the original:
https://www.facebook.com/originalschaefercompany/videos/317403215335878/
Math Guy
OMG, now I’m following this thread and the new BJ thread at the same time.
Leto
@frosty: Oh, we might be headed that way around Christmas time when we visit my parents in SC. I’ll try to remember to check it out!
SFAW
@mrmoshpotato:
Shit, you’re right. I figured it would be two at the higher seed, one at the lower. This all-games-played-at-the-higher-seed’s-home is pretty fucked up.
Fuck Rob Manfred, even if it’s not his decision. And fuck Roger Goodell, just on general principles.
Quinerly
@frosty:
I remember those days. A real windfall we all thought in NC if someone went west of the Mississippi and could bring back cases of Coors.
HeleninEire
@frosty: Let me know if you decide to visit Dublin. Soon I will be there for the entire summer, every summer. I will show you around.
Omnes Omnibus
Sometimes it’s just the guns.
Kay
I think I met the worst voter ever canvassing this weekend. OMG just on and on about how both sides are bad, a LONG lecture about additives in food and an outraged announcement that AOC is worth 25 million after 4 years in congress. I didn’t have the energy to refute that.
I excused myself, mumbling about “dinner”, although it was 2:30. She seemed mad that I left.
“Independents” are without a doubt the dumbest voters out there.
Indycat32
@Quinerly: I envy you. That’s the life I thought I’d have after retiring. Instead I spend my days feeding cats, cleaning up after cats and worrying about cats. Full disclosure: I’m on glass 3 of wine.
Chief Oshkosh
@LNNVA: You’re most welcome! I love the cat names. Thanks for sharing.
‘Gansett got sold to one of the big boys years ago, but then (if I have this right) somehow went back to being small-time independent. Here’s there new digs:
https://www.narragansettbeer.com/
Ceci n est pas mon nym
Watching a feed from Robert Reich’s substack. Every once in awhile he can’t take it any more and pauses the debate feed to take over the screen and rebut something. So I may be a minute or two behind the rest of you jackals.
I think it’s time for alcohol. There’s a bottle of Cabernet Sauvignon here somewhere.
Oh and… “Christ have mercy”???? Who says that?
SpaceUnit
Late to the party as usual. I’m not watching the “debate” because I figured anything after Madam VP’s awesome bait n’ bash performance would be a letdown. I’m enjoying the commentary here though.
I’m enjoying the beer discussion as well. At the moment I’m drinking a Samuel Adam’s Octoberfest which is not entirely bad. Typically I drink mostly IPA’s with an occasional Modelo Negra.
Captain C
@mrmoshpotato: That’s correct. Wild Card round is best of 3 (first to 2 wins) in the higher seed’s home park. Both teams get home games starting in the divisional round.
Ryan
Boy, if you didn’t know better, you’d think Harris has been president the last 3 1/2 years.
Quinerly
@frosty:
I will be at home in March. Let’s meet up! Santa Fe, Albuquerque, or my home. I’m on the Las Vegas, NEW MEXICO side of Santa Fe.
Jager
@BretH:
No he’s not!
Ryan
Federal lands? Uhhh, yeah, did you see Top Gun Maverick? Tom Cruise was living in a hangar in the Mojave Desert. Why can’t we build homes there?
TBone
“…deserve to be here”
There is no swastika emoji
Joy in FL
If I were an “illegal alien,” could I buy a home? Would I have the money for a down payment? Wouldn’t my identity be verified? If I’m “illegal,” won’t I be facing a whole lot of problems that are not related to buying that home?
What is Vance talking about, with these “illegal aliens” who are buying up these homes?
I mean these as rhetorical questions.
sab
@Indycat32: Welcome to my world.
Primer Gray (formerly Yet Another Jeff)
How exactly are undocumented immigrants buying up all the houses?
SFAW
@Chief Oshkosh:
“Louie”? “LOUIE”?????? It’s “Louis,” you nimrods.
And as great as Louis was, this is my favorite Schaefer commercial.
SFAW
@Primer Gray (formerly Yet Another Jeff):
Bitcoin?
Quinerly
@SpaceUnit:
Modelo Negra is a favorite of mine with Mexican or Northern New Mexican food. In the bottle, with a lime wedge.
Captain C
@SFAW: I think it’s because the other option is a longer series (with at least one travel day) and at that point the one and two seeds are getting pretty much a full week off which is a disadvantage as they might not be as game sharp. Seeds 5 and 6 wouldn’t have been there under the original 3 division plan and 5 would have only gotten one away game once they added a second wild card. Probably the least worst option.
Bill Arnold
@Math Guy:
Cheap beer.
I remember generic beer in the 1980s, just pre the movie Repo Man.
IIRC it came in a white can with BEER written on it in a large font. Probably an ingredients list and etc.
It was … not good, at least that case of it wasn’t.
frosty
@Ryan: Um … there’s no water in the Mojave? And it’s a long commute to any jobs.
Quinerly
@Indycat32:
I got out of the “kitty biz.” They are sweet and always had one for years. Allergies just got so bad. That kitty hair….I always had Tabbys. Orange and Gray.
SpaceUnit
@Quinerly:
I like to drink it in a frosted glass.
Yeah I know, but I grew up in Pittsburgh.
Chris
@stacib:
Well, on the day a candidate talks about chickens when I’ve asked him about eggs, I’ll probably be pretty pissed, but if by “you” you mean the media, then no.
If there were some way to know that the pundit is asking a question in good faith that actually reflects reality, and not the political equivalent of “when did you stop beating your wife,” then sure, we should be mad. But there isn’t. Acting as though that’s what’s going on is granting an assumption of good faith to the pundit that they probably don’t deserve, and certainly that pundits who’ve come right out and said they refuse to fact-check the politicians don’t deserve.
SFAW
@Captain C:
It’s still un-American, whatever the reasoning.
Jackie
@kissel: Three games at higher ranked ballpark still beats a one and done playoff game.
p.a.
@Chief Oshkosh: There’s some good stuff, but I don’t like the Shandy. Not a lite beer guy AT ALL, but ‘Gansett’s is passable.
SFAW
@Jackie:
Except when it’s the Mets winning the one-and-done.
frosty
@Jeffro: Best price I ever got was Keg Brand Natural Flavor Beer in 1972. $2.87 a CASE!! I could set it down at a party and no one would steal it!
kissel
@Jackie: agree. I wasn’t complaining about it, just letting someone know.
Quinerly
@p.a.:
I loathe lite beer. Ugh. Michelobe Ultra/Light….an abomination.
Math Guy
I miss Ballantine, with the Baromean rings.
Chris
@Joy in FL:
I generate mortgage closing documents for a living. I’m not allowed to send them out until I’ve checked that we have a valid and unexpired federal ID for each of the borrowers (title-only borrowers included). So yes, of course your identity has to be verified.
Now, you don’t have to be a citizen, but if you’re not, we’ll want a copy of your green card too, and if you’ve got one of those, by definition you’re not an illegal alien.
(Of course, they know all of this. They’re just making the mouth-noises they need to to make it acceptable to attack immigrants).
cain
Senor Tom Nichols find Walz over-prepped and would have preferred more organic. Also dropped a lot of chances to go on the attack. I am not watching it so I don’t know if all that is true. But it’s likely the campaign wanted him to be very conservative.
Quinerly
@frosty:
I bought some canned “Happy Camper IPA” once for $1.50 a 6 pack at The Globe Drugstore in St. Louis. It’s a Santa Fe Brewing beer. It was “distressed.” Tested it out. Went back and bought several cases. It was quite the deal.
clay
@cain: I think that’s just his nature. He’s not really an “attack dog” kind of guy.
Chief Oshkosh
@p.a.: The Shandy is undrinkable and I didn’t like any of their IPAs or the Lite. I’m sure the lager tasted better this summer because I was in RI with the old friends who introduced me to the original. Regardless, I enjoyed it way more than I should have. :)
Quinerly
@cain:
Walz is very restrained. Too restrained, imo.
(As I said above, I can’t fathom the pressure he is under)
Quinerly
@SpaceUnit:
💚💙💚
WaterGirl
@Math Guy: Ha!
BretH
Christ what an asshole.
Chief Oshkosh
@cain: I agree with Nichols, not the over-prepared part, but the part about missing several obvious and legitimate opportunities to go on offense. Not reminding everyone of Trumps SHITTY hurricane responses (!) and directly comparing it to Biden’s AND then bringing up the opportunism both Trump and Couchboy have been exhibiting JUST IN THE LAST FUCKING WEEK is nearly political malpractice.
But, tempest in a teapot. Nobody’s going to care by the weekend.
Ishiyama
Vance is a bald-faced liar. Major gaslighting.
Ishiyama
And Walz pulls out a fourth quarter victory on January 6!
Jackie
Deleted. Misunderstood the comment
BretH
Finally. The reason Vance is there in stage.
mvr
@Flanders Other Neighbor: Going to second this.
And there was a week when I was 17 that I confirmed this. Good week and bad week.
cain
@Chief Oshkosh:
Yeah, he’s a fairly mild guy. That’s ok. Harris is who scares everyone. :)
mvr
@Math Guy: i always liked it when Oregon used pastueirization (which I can’t spell) to basically make an anti-union beer illegal.
Ryan
@mvr: I think it pasteurization.
Ryan
@Chief Oshkosh: Totally agree. Rule #1, do no damage. Mission acc…. er…
Ishiyama
This turned out to be a relatively conventional debate. Neither candidate got hot under the collar; Vance’s smarmy indignation was phony, as was his use of cherry picked facts to support his arguments. Tim Walz didn’t really have an effective counter to that tactic, but he was able to stick to his own lines, and scored some points of his own. But when J.D. kept hypocritically crying crocodile tears about the need for solutions to people’s real life problems, Tim kept agreeing with his points and talking about having common ground. I’m not sure how that played for the audience, but at the end of the debate, Tim & J.D. and their wives exchanged cordialities, expressing that there were no hard feelings.
FelonyGovt
@SFAW: Unfortunately there would be no Game 3 at CitiField. All 3 games in the Wild Card round are at Milwaukee.
Ruckus
@3Sice:
Not to be too crude but I believe that you left out a rather important modifier.
Vance is fucking
weirdcreepy.