Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Accountability, motherfuckers.

If America since Jan 2025 hasn’t broken your heart, you haven’t loved her enough.

This really is a full service blog.

You cannot shame the shameless.

Perhaps you mistook them for somebody who gives a damn.

Rupert, come get your orange boy, you petrified old dinosaur turd.

The line between political reporting and fan fiction continues to blur.

“The defense has a certain level of trust in defendant that the government does not.”

The Giant Orange Man Baby is having a bad day.

Let the trolls come, and then ignore them. that’s the worst thing you can do to a troll.

Republicans: “Abortion is murder but you can take a bus to get one.” Easy peasy.

A norm that restrains only one side really is not a norm – it is a trap.

When we show up, we win.

The next time the wall street journal editorial board speaks the truth will be the first.

You don’t get to peddle hatred on saturday and offer condolences on sunday.

Donald Trump found guilty as fuck – May 30, 2024!

Dear Washington Post, you are the darkness now.

Beware of advice from anyone for whom Democrats are “they” and not “we.”

Fundamental belief of white supremacy: white people are presumed innocent, minorities are presumed guilty.

I might just take the rest of the day off and do even more nothing than usual.

🎶 Those boots were made for mockin’ 🎵

Nancy smash is sick of your bullshit.

The fundamental promise of conservatism all over the world is a return to an idealized past that never existed.

Let there be snark.

You are here: Home / Elections 2024 / Cold Grey Dawn Open Thread: When the Rubles Dry Up…

Cold Grey Dawn Open Thread: When the Rubles Dry Up…

by | 105 Comments

This post is in: , , , ,

October 7th:

October 24th…

October 23rd, Tucker Carlson, having a public breakdown at Charlie Kirk’s TP-USA gala:

Less widely known ‘influencer’ Tim Pool, just identified as one of the American grifters taking money from Russia:

Russia money stopped eh

[image or embed]

— Shiv Ramdas (@nameshiv.bsky.social) October 22, 2024 at 8:30 PM


Even Tulsi Gabbard!

MAKES YOU THINK...

Reader Interactions

105Comments

  2. 2.

    JWR

    Only one comment? SECOND, woo hoo!

    ETA Anne Laurie, I really, truly enjoy your Cold Grey Dawn posts. Humorous, but always informative. Thank you.

  4. 4.

    Tony Jay

    Oh dear, Stench/Snowball ‘24 – Hate, Herpes and High Cholesterol has so few high profile endorsers to promote that they’re reduced to pulling Tulsi Gabbard off the ‘a stupid person’s idea of what a left winger looks like’ beat to come pretend Republicans are the happening Party. A few highly online anti-Left nutpickers might cry, but really, talk about 🤷

  5. 5.

    Baud

    So we chased away Manchin, Sinema, and Gabbard.

    I don’t think I’ve ever been prouder to be a Dem.

  6. 6.

    TBone

    I needed a bit of solace this morning and so am sharing for anyone else who might.  I was unable to copy and paste these words of wisdom and therefore, so that they appear in one short and easy to read place, I’ll just post a link.

    https://tracyseed.com/all-i-really-need-to-know-i-learned-in-kindergarden-by-robert-fulghum/

    Comfortable common sense returns like a breath of fresh air.  Ahhhhhh

    And it is still true, no matter how old you
    are – when you go out into the world, it is best
    to hold hands and stick together.

  8. 8.

    satby

    The loser stench is beginning to spread. Yarrow noted in a previous thread that Kevin Drum highlighted the Emerson poll showing recent deciders breaking for Harris over the convict 60% to 36%. People want to back winners.

  9. 9.

    TBone

    Pepperidge Farm remembers

    FLASHBACK: Melissa McCarthy Eviscerates Sean Spicer As Trump’s Press Secretary

    Melissa McCarthy was dazzling.

    Melissa starts with “I’m here to swallow gum and take names” and ends with…

    A. CNN in a cage
    B. Sean Spicer hitting people with the podium
    C. A moose and a lamb to demonstrate the Moose-Lamb ban
    D. Spicer shooting the crowd with soapy water from a water gun
    E. Alternative facts about crowds
    F. Talk of erections and ovulation
    G. Spicer reading off his password
    H. Trashing the NY Times
    I. The ban is not a ban but it is a ban but it isn’t a ban
    J. Lots of props
    K. Poop
    L. Grinning idiot, Betsy Devos, talking about bears. That’s it. Bears.
    M. All of the above

  10. 10.

    satby

    Infectious optimism and enthusiasm at the capacity Harris rally in Houston. Meanwhile, in chilly Traverse City MI, the convict walks out to the Undertakers theme music:

    Aaron Rupar @atrupar

    WTF — after the Undertaker’s whole theme played, the music abruptly cut to Trump’s theme song and he starts bobbing. His crowd has already been standing around for like 8 hours!

  12. 12.

    Bruce K in ATH-GR

    @satby: Which explains the full-court press to portray Trump as the inevitable landslide winner, so that any adverse result can be written off as fraudulent and inconceivable and worthy of a response akin to January 6.

  13. 13.

    Tony Jay

    @Baud:

    Trump’s hyper-populist all-in and Democrat glee at the centre-ground’s revulsion signals victory for both extremes, say independent groups

    NYT/WAPO Joint Editorial Comment

  16. 16.

    satby

    @Bruce K in ATH-GR: It’s not a “full court press” though. Plenty of other papers have endorsed Harris, papers that are more likely to influence because they’re local. WaPo and LATimes just undercut themselves, and that cowardly act, plus the resignations and loud denunciations by their own high profile columnists, are extending the story beyond the day it happened.

  19. 19.

    satby

    Norm Ornstein:

    It is a breathtaking show of cowardice and irresponsibility if the nation’s newspaper refuses to make an endorsement in this existential election. Will Lewis, Jeff Bezos, David Shipley are all complicit in this. Shame on them all. 

  21. 21.

    Baud

    @satby:

    On reddit, they’re referring to it as the Streisand Effect. I just hope the billionaires’ cowardice inspires some people to join us in defeating Trump.

  22. 22.

    satby

    (links shared are Threadreader, worth reading it all) Josh Marshall makes a great point:

    We talk a lot about the crisis of public trust in America. But when we do we’re generally talking about Red or …

    Disaffected America. Lack of trust in the press, in elections, in scientific or expert authority, etc. But there is this other crisis of trust in institutions and people that’s the province of Blue America. And Bezos with this one decision has stepped right into it.

  23. 23.

    satby

    @Baud: Well, if the Emerson poll is accurate, it is. Plus, being an old, I remember how Ronnie Raygun (spit) won an election he was manifestly unqualified for with his upbeat “Morning in America” theme. People gravitate to positive, hopeful messages. Biden had it in 2020, Harris has it now.

  25. 25.

    John S.

    @satby:

    But there is this other crisis of trust in institutions and people that’s the province of Blue America.

    Wait until everyone realizes how much they got played by the media and the pollsters on Election Day. I don’t think the MSM will recover from it.

  26. 26.

    Baud

    @John S.:

    We’re probably still a minority, but it seems like more and more people in our side are becoming aware of how they’re being played by big media.

  28. 28.

    p.a

    @John S.:
    Wait until everyone realizes how much they got played by the media and the pollsters on Election Day.

    Everyone =/= Magats. If they’re unaware now, they never will be. There’s ignorance, then there’s willful ignorance.

  29. 29.

    a thousand flouncing lurkers (was fidelio)

    I’m sure I could not feel sorrier for Mr. Bezos if I tried. I’m just tapped out in the sympathy supplies.

    If anyone else feels a similar challenge, here’s a link to a thread on Bluesky of various sportsball announcers describing Freddy Freeman’s big hit.
    I find it funny that any announcer in Spanish has to say something that sounds like “goooooooooooaaaaaallll!!! even if that’s not how the sport actually designates scoring.

  30. 30.

    Mousebumples

    @satby: thanks for the thread reader app links.

    Good morning, everyone.

    When Kamala hopefully wins, I hope she keeps Lina Khan and asks Liz Warren how to tax the living fuck out of these billionaires.

  31. 31.

    schrodingers_cat

    @Baud: People will go to get great lengths to avoid examining their own biases. And admit that they were wrong. A fact that demagogues and manipulators of news like the Vichy Times use to their advantage.

  33. 33.

    schrodingers_cat

    @Baud: Privilege gives you blinders, its upto you whether you take those off or continue to live with them. Its not an easy thing to do and it makes for a lonely existence.

    Leaving my bubble of privilege has made me see things I wouldn’t have otherwise.

  34. 34.

    bjacques

    @satby: thanks!

    I’m guessing those subscribers aren’t coming back, and will untangle themselves wherever possible from Bezos’s other interests. If Harris wins—and I expect she will—we will remember how eagerly Bezos threw us liberals under the bus to kiss Trump’s ass. If she loses, we won’t be in any mood to pay his rag to sanewash Trump II: Electric Boogaloo.

  35. 35.

    Baud

    @bjacques:

    I feel bad for Washington. They finally got rid of Dan Snyder, and now they gotta deal with another rich douchebag owning a local institution.

  39. 39.

    satby

    @Princess: And the many streaming out during his rally 😆

    I love that for him. The thing that Harris upset him with most at the debate keeps happening.

    everyone have a nice day. to market I go.

  42. 42.

    Shalimar

    Tim Pool wants to “acquire” a family?  I see the Russian largesse hasn’t completely dried up if they’re offering him a prostitute to marry.

  44. 44.

    Suzanne

    It’s just incredibly distressing to see Tucker Carlson basically drooling at the fantasy of being spanked by Trump and to realize just how cowardly and repressed these people are and how it fucks them up for the rest of their lives, in almost every arena of life.

    Rod Dreher said something super-gay on Xhitter yesterday that is going around, too. And, like, you scratch a white conservative dude, and this fountain of kinks and shame and proclivities comes out. They’re just, many of them….. just so fucked up.

  45. 45.

    K-Mo

    Alternate caption: “Mr Pool will be taking some time off the crawl back under whatever rock he came from.”

  46. 46.

    Princess

    @satby: I love Trump having to speak to an almost-empty gymnasium in Michigan while Harris talks to a packed stadium in Texas with Beyoncé and Willie Nelson. I love that for him.

  47. 47.

    p.a.

    The Republican Party: Rubes & Rubles!

    The Republican Party:  Rubles Rule Rubes!

     

    Madison Ave, I am available…

    (also too, is Madison Ave still an advert powercenter?  Or is that so 1960s?)

  51. 51.

    Princess

    @Suzanne: I’ve always said the reason why Drehef is hiding out in Hungary is that he did something and someone told him he better go into exile  or it would become public knowledge. Repressions on repressions with that guy.

  53. 53.

    Betty

    @satby: I like Josh’s phrase, this climate of bewilderment. A lot of that bewilderment can be laid at the feet of the MSM who have refused to address honestly the calamity that is Donald Trump.

  54. 54.

    Suzanne

    @Baud: I wouldn’t care, if they could just have the good grace to keep them to themselves and not inflict them on the rest of us. Like, just be gay, or just be atheist, or just be trans, or just hire a domme, or just indulge your weird interests. I guarantee you can find a supportive community. Instead, their fucken unresolved issues warp their personalities until they’re these black holes of disorder, sucking in everything and everyone around them.

    @Princess: Nothing would surprise me about Dreher at this point. I am sure there is an active gay community in Budapest and that he basically fled the USA so he could swim around in it without being recognized.

  56. 56.

    Kay

    Nate Silver is hedging his bet – he wants you to know that Harris “could still” win.

    Lol. They’re all such fucking cowards. I swear I have more respect for the committed MAGAS than I do the media weenies. Be an out and proud Right winger! Fly your flag!

  57. 57.

    lowtechcyclist

    @TBone: ​
     
    From your link:

    I find the relative dearth of national security officials warning the nation of her fascist tendencies particularly encouraging. She doesn’t talk like Hitler or praise Hitler or long for “the kind of generals that Hitler had,” which strikes me as a far superior attitude to have about Hitler than, say, her opponent’s.

    And yet his fans are nowhere near asking themselves that obvious question, “are we the baddies?“

  58. 58.

    Betty Cracker

    Saw a clip of Rogan’s Trump interview on CNN this morning, and the vibe was extremely odd. Trump was simpering like he does in the presence of Putin and his lackeys. He babbled about putting the brain-wormed RFK Jr. in charge of public health and pandered hard on cultural bullshit. Rogan allowed the orange fart cloud to kiss his ass and didn’t question any of the crackpot stuff in the clip I heard. It was a circle jerk.

  59. 59.

    Suzanne

    @Kay: Silver has publicly stated that he’s voting for Harris. Not sure if I believe him. I might. I think of him as a person with very little theory of mind.

  60. 60.

    Princess

    @Kay: “His gut” tells him that Trump will win. So much for the power of statistics and being a numbers guy. Might as well listen to my own gut if after all that polling and weighting and aggregating and special sauce it all comes down to Nate Silver’s gut.

  63. 63.

    Kay

    @Suzanne:

    Theyre manipulative to advance their own careers and stay on the right side of power. I’m sick of all of them. We need a straightforward election analyst who doesn’t play games. Someone with some courage and integrity.

  66. 66.

    Suzanne

    @Princess: Silver strikes me as a person who can’t distinguish genuinely believing something to be true based on evidence from wanting something to be true. I understand that, because I struggle with that. The difference between us being that I recognize that struggle and admit it.

  67. 67.

    Baud

    Polling and predictions are pretty much worthless to the average person. Theyre basically a more scientific version of horoscopes for folks are are uncomfortable not knowing what the future holds.

    ETA: The only possible use is in helping to decide where to donate and send postcards, etc. But only early polling helps with that.

  69. 69.

    Princess

    @Suzanne: I’m bad at it too. For instance, I feel really good about our chances now but I almost always do so I don’t trust that. But that’s why I’m a historian who describes the past; not a person who makes money predicting things.

  70. 70.

    Suzanne

    @Kay: I don’t know what value Silver or the other poll analysts bring at this point. Inherently any of these poll models suffer from a garbage-in-garbage-out problem. We probably need less analysis at this point.

  71. 71.

    Kay

    I don’t have to tell anyone here this but the Washington Post was never going to save us.

    “The guardrails” in this country collapsed a long time ago. The only thing holding the country together is 1/2 of the citizens, and we will save it. Again.

    Our institutions were weak and led by cowards and they collapsed sometime in 2018. It’s just us. We’ll save us.

  73. 73.

    Suzanne

    @Princess: I feel terrible right now, but I often do, because I am a pretty risk-averse person and I recognize that shades my reactions.

    One may notice that I have made no predictions and placed no bets. Even during the Great Biden Conflict of Summer 2024, I was incredibly conflicted. Calling me “cowardly” would be a fair description, but I’m also not trying to make any money at this, just BS-ing on a blog.

  75. 75.

    Geminid

    @Baud: I read that Dan Snyder would not sell the Commanders to Jeff Bezos. Washington Post sportswriter Sally Jenkins was instrumental in breaking the stories about the toxic, sexist culture thst Snyder encouraged in his organization, and Snyder held a grudge over that.

    I also read that what really set the other NFL owners against Snyder is that when the stories about the Snyder’s organization came out and his contuinued ownership was called into question, Snyder hired private detectives to dig up dirt on other owners. He evidently thought that the best defense was a good offense.

    After learning that, some of the anti-Snyder owners wanted the League to formally force a sale. In the end, Snyder was allowed to sell the Commanders “voluntarily,” but everone knew he had to.

  76. 76.

    Marleedog

    @danielx: ‎

     

    fuck that guy.

    We tend to think of Maryland as deepest blue. One of the reasons is that CD1 is gerrymandered for the Republicans so the rest of the state can remain comfortably Democrat.

    The result is the excrable culture warrior do nothing Andy Harris, whom I have the ignominious honor of having as my Rep. He will win reelection along the lines of 65/35, but he has at least 2 votes against him. Spousal unit and I have both had our mail in ballots accepted and counted by the state of Maryland.

  77. 77.

    JAFD

    Good morning, fellow Jackals !

    Is a beautiful fall morning here in Nu Joisy.  We’ve had lot of good weather this fall – almost at point of drought.  Perhaps ’tis to make up for last year, when it rained Every Bleeping Weekend In September And October.

    Went to https://voter.svrs.nj.gov/auth/sign-in, found my absentee ballot was received and accepted, ready to be counted.  Somehow nj.gov had forgotten my password for ‘My Voter Record’ – had it noted down, still had to get new one.

    Those of you into boardgames have heard about Amabel Holland’s new game/puzzle City of Six Moons.  Dan ‘SpaceBiff’ Thurot has an interesting essay on translating and finding meaning, also Hapax Legomena, at  https://spacebiff.com/2024/10/25/city-of-six-moons/   Mayhaps if you need something to take your mind off of current events.

    Hope you are healthy (or, at least, getting better) and happy, and having a great weekend !

  80. 80.

    artem1s

    @TBone: OMG

    1. Melissa McCarthy was a genius.

    2. It’s important to remember how unprepared TCF was for that first term and how many awful, incompetent people worked for him – may they always be so ashamed that they have a blank spot in those years on their resumes.

    3. I’m glad there has been such a great pushback on the non-endorsement, endorsement. But more glad to see other journalists calling it out.

    4. There is always going to be a certain amount of reluctance to remember how bad TCF’s administration was top to bottom. Biden has been so stellar we’ve had the luxury of not having to dwell on it for several years. As bad as the MSM has been, in vainglorious  attempt to get ever more clicks they also unwittingly chronicled that administration in ways we’ve never seen before. They can’t memory hole it the way they did W.

  81. 81.

    BritinChicago

    @Suzanne:  I think you’re right to make no predictions and place no bets. The blatantly undemocratic E.C. means that it essentially comes down to a couple of hundred thousand people in seven states, people who might vote either way or might not vote. I cannot imagine what it is like to be one of those people, to be undecided, or not sure it’s worth bothering to vote. Who are those people, and why do they have such power?

  82. 82.

    Mel

    @JAFD: Any board game recommendations for good mystery solving or archaeology themed board games? I’m looking for a few to take my mind off election stress and to pass time during surgery recovery.

  83. 83.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Mel:

    My wife and son and I have been playing Finders Seekers. It’s a subscription thing, they send you a box with a new game each month.  They’re set in different locations around the world, the one we just did was set in Paris.

  86. 86.

    Chief Oshkosh

    @bjacques: I’m not sanguine about that. I recall that the supposed-liberal-once-upon-a-time CEO (or owner?) of Whole Paycheck (I mean Whole Foods) shit all over liberals for our liberally liberal liberalness, resulting in a hue and cry for boycotts, and that those lasted about as long as it took for a vase of Whole Paycheck flowers to wilt.

  90. 90.

    Msb

    @satby:

    good one, especially the conclusion:

    Probably without even realizing it. Frankly, I’M surprised at the intensity of the reaction. But seeing it it makes sense. It’s a whose side are you on moment, sides which transcend partisan politics. And Bezos has rung a bell I’m not sure he can unring.

  91. 91.

    Tony G

    “he will also be using the extra time to pursue acquiring that family”.  You know, I acquired my family back in the eighties, so I’m really not up on the latest trends.  But my understanding is that these days a young man can acquire a family through one of those Bitcoin-operated vending machines.  Supermodel wife, 1.5 kids, and you’re set!

  93. 93.

    Msb

    @Betty:

    me, too. It is confusing to see and feel Kamala winning and see and feel Trump crumbling into failure and dementia, and to have the media telling me to believe their numbers and not my lying eyes.

  94. 94.

    frosty

    @Kay: ​ Josh Marshall? He’s at least not afraid to tell us what he doesn’t know and why.

    ETA Also the first blog I read. Yes, even before Balloon-Juice!

  96. 96.

    Another Scott

    @Betty Cracker: Tmurp supposedly said once that (in relation to The Apprentice) “ratings are all that matter”, and he acts like it carries over into the rest of his life since then.  That’s one of the reasons why he says some crazy thing every 3 days or so – to stay in the news and get ratings.

    Rogan gets big, big ratings.  So, of course Tmurp is going to suck up to him.

    (There are exceptions that prove the rule, of course.  E.g. Taylor Swift.  But as a general principle it seems to work.)

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  97. 97.

    Another Scott

    @Suzanne: Dunno.

    Carlson knows his audience, but also knows (to some extent) what’s going on in the real world.

    Remember that video of him shopping in a sports store in Idaho or Montana where some big guy called him out for being a horrible monster, and Carlson tried to brush and laugh it off (“my kids are here”, IIRC) until he realized he was being filmed?

    Remember his texts in the Dominion Lawsuit?

    Fox viewers were outraged when the network called Arizona for Joe Biden on election night, a race call that was accurate. Fox executives and hosts began to worry about ratings as many of those viewers fled to other conservative outlets.

    “We worked really hard to build what we have. Those (expletive) are destroying our credibility. It enrages me,” Carlson said in a Nov. 6, 2020, exchange with an unidentified person.

    On Nov. 8, after Biden was declared the winner, Carlson texted a couple of other employees: “Do the executives understand how much trust and credibility we’ve lost with our audience? We’re playing with fire, for real.”

    Later in the chain, as others bring up Newsmax as an emerging competitor, Carlson said, “With Trump behind it, an alternative like Newsmax could be devastating to us.”

    In text messages to a producer on Nov 13, 2020, Carlson braced for a Trump press conference: “He’s only good at destroying,” Carlson said of the then-president.

    He later added, in regard to the fraud allegations being made by Trump and his allies, “He’s playing with fire.”

    TRUMP

    In a text exchange with an unknown person on Jan. 4, 2021, Carlson expressed anger toward Trump. He said that “we are very, very close to being able to ignore Trump most nights” and that “I truly can’t wait.”

    Carlson said he had no doubt there was fraud in the 2020 election, but said Trump and his lawyers had so discredited their case — and media figures like himself — “that it’s infuriating. Absolutely enrages me.”

    Addressing Trump’s four years as president, Carlson said: “We’re all pretending we’ve got a lot to show for it, because admitting what a disaster it’s been is too tough to digest. But come on. There really isn’t an upside to Trump.”

    In texts early on the morning of Jan. 7, 2021, a day after the violent assault on the U.S. Capitol, Carlson and his longtime producer, Alex Pfeiffer, bemoaned how the rioters had believed Trump’s election lies.

    “They take the president literally,” Pfeiffer said. “He is to blame for everything that happened today.”

    “The problem is a little deeper than that I’d say,” Carlson replied.

    “Obviously the problems are deep but at the core of it is Trump saying it was stolen,” Pfeiffer wrote.

    “Not the core,” Carlson wrote. “Awful but a symptom.”

    Later, Carlson writes of Trump: “He’s a demonic force, a destroyer. But he’s not going to destroy us. I’ve been thinking about this every day for four years.”

    Etc.

    Just like with Neal Boortz in Atlanta talk radio in the early 1970s, these guys aren’t stupid. Their persona on the media isn’t who they really are. Their job is to be a preferred voice for their audience so that people tune in every day and buy their advertisers’ stuff. Like with Tmurp and The Apprentice, ratings are what matter to these guys. They tweak what they say to get higher ratings. Everything follows from that.

    My $0.02.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  98. 98.

    JAFD

    @Mel: Hi there !

    I’m not a morning person and am in middle of really busy week.  But will keep you in mind, check with friends, get back to you when I can.

    Mayhaps you can have Ms. WaterGirl send me your email address, so I can get in touch with you directly ?  Would want to know a bit more about what you like, dislike, before recommending.

    Anyway, if you like the 18xx games – fairly complex struggles of 19th century railroad building and finance – can be played online for free at 18xx.games

  102. 102.

    Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony

    @Bostondreams: Yes, like most right wingers, he turned his back on everything he said he believed in for years the second it became inconvenient

  103. 103.

    Citizen Alan

    @p.a:  This. Shitgibbon tells the lies they want to hear. Just like how the MAGAts turned on Fox and went to Newsmax when Fox was forced by a defamation case to admit the truth.

  105. 105.

    Mel

    @JAFD: Thank you. I will ask WaterGirl to send my email.

    I love anything to do with archaeology. Also a fan of mystery / detection games and novels, games and books related to medieval themes, and games and novels with an eerie / supernatural twist  (former teacher of Southern Gothic lit classes and Victorian horror / Penny Dreadful era lit classes, so..,).

    Not so much into world-building games, war games, etc.

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