My main exposure to right-wing propaganda is a few minutes of Fox at the gym. We got there a little late yesterday, so I was exposed to a show called “Outnumbered“, which is Fox’s answer to The View, I guess, because it’s “four female panelists and #OneLuckyGuy”. Hmm. Anyway, yesterday’s show was about Trump hanging his mugshot outside the Oval Office. I didn’t watch enough to get the gist of it, but that was the topic, and I assume they had a spirited debate as to why Trump was right to do that because he’s the victim of Democrats’ overreach.
Commenter Gloria DryGarden sent in something she saw on Facebook: the excuse-making for Elon Musk. I’m including the whole thing below, under the break.
Gloria inspired me to search for Fox content about Musk. Here’s a Hannity interview of King Musk and vassal Trump, dated on Valentine’s Day, naturally, where they “shut down media attempts to ‘drive us apart’ amid DOGE efforts. Here’s Dean Phillips telling Democrats they’re making a mistake by focusing only on Musk. If there was an always-wrong Olympics, he’d be a gold medalist in almost every category. Focusing on an unelected broligarch who is out to steal our tax money is exactly the right strategy for Democrats. (I had to sign up for Fox News to see that Phillips clip so RIP my inbox.). Here’s the google search I used to find this content if you want to see more headlines.
Hope Walz isn’t right-wing media, of course, but she had an interesting take on one of her recent TikTok’s. She got a comment about “Congratulations Making Newsmax today” — Hope’s response was “I guess I’m doing something right” and she noted that whenever someone posts something transphobic or hateful on her page, that means it’s not being targeted at a trans person and instead at her, so that’s a good thing. I thought that was a good “fuck the haters” perspective.
Anyway, I don’t watch a lot of right wing media, so if you have some links or text to share, this is the thread for it.
Here’s what Gloria saw on the Book of Face:
“I am just going to leave this here. Attribution at the end.“ Based on some things Elon’s said over the past several days…the amount of Social Security fraud could run well over $100 billion YEARLY.“That’s JUST the Social Security fraud.“They deliberately created a system that DOES NOT LOOK for duplicate SSN’s.“A system that also doles out well over $100 billion/year to people who HAVE NO SSN WHATSOEVER.“What if…the amount of the fraud here is not only publicly exposed, they reveal who’s actually been getting all of this money?“I sure as hell would want to know. If a highly organized group of people inside our own government deliberately set up a Social Security system to facilitate financial theft on a mind-boggling scale.“This isn’t just one political party. If this is the case. One party would NEVER be able to successfully hide from the other party that they were doing this.“This would have to be the UniParty. McConnell and all the others in the top GOP power structure would have been in on it, before Trump’s arrival.“They branded me a traitor. History will call me a hero. Stay in the know:”
opiejeanne
Oh, FFS! I have been seeing this claim that Someone is getting all of that SS money and I’ve seen it laughed at extensively. It’s a conspiracy theory, but like some of the worst of them it probably has legs
About 20 years ago I got someone else’s bank statement in the mail. It had my address but a name I didn’t know. The bank was real cagey about it, didn’t want to explain it to me, but verified that it was someone using my SSN in order to have an account with them. BofA. They fixed it so that I never got another statement meant for him, and I realized that this person was undocumented. He wasn’t taking anything from me, just needed a number.
J. Arthur Crank
The average American isn’t that bright, and half of them are below average (in this case we have a pretty good bell curve so the median and average are nearly the same). This is especially true when it comes to numerical literacy.
Baud
I agree.
Kayla Rudbek
And what I have been seeing on Bluesky about the SSN is that:
John S.
@Kayla Rudbek:
I’m Gen X, and this was not the case for me. Although when I began working, I did have to go to the SS office to sort out that my father’s name was somehow attached to my SS number.
FelonyGovt
@Kayla Rudbek: This is absolutely true. I’m a Boomer and didn’t get my SS # until I got my first job at age 15. We thought it was kind of weird when we were advised to, and did, get a SS # for our daughter shortly after she was born.
Ohio Mom
I am reminded of something my sister the librarian once said, “Oh course we lose books! Look how much inventory we have to track!”
Yes, there is some fraud in the Social Security system, we know that because when the Social Security Administration finds it, it gets into the news.
And it gets into the news because the SSA is a public agency with public records. Nothing is perfect, the world remains unredeemed. In the grand scheme of things, they are relatively small amounts. You want less fraud, increase their budget so they can hire more staff to find it.
When I retired, Ohio Son went from being on SSI to being on SSDI on my retirement account. Then Ohio Dad retired and Ohio Son was moved to SSDI on Dad’s account because his benefit would be higher.
There was a lot of paperwork and a few snafus involved. Once I had a telephone conversation with a SSA staff who was double checking that Ohio Son was indeed eligible.
She asked for his work history, and I dutifully recited it. Then she asked, “What is this XYZ Temple?!” “Oh, sorry, forgot about that. The synagogue hires high school students to work at the Sunday school to keep them involved in the congregation when they are going through their disaffected teenage phase. They give them $20 a week and I never think of it as a real job. But you are right, he did work there.”
And all was well.
I offer this as an example that their record keeping is robust.
Nukular Biskits
Somewhat related but, as I mentioned last night (???? things are kinda blurred since I just got back from 6 weeks of 12-14 hr days in San Diego), I re-followed a number of MS Republicans on my Twitter account (I never closed mine as it and FB are about the only platforms on which these regressive assholes “interact with constituents”).
I did so with the sole purpose of giving them hell.
Will it make a difference? Damfino but it makes me feel better and the Kool-Aid-drinking true believers following them who aren’t bots will at least see some pushback.
Oh, and fuck civility.
DEBG
The stupid burns so much. It’s unbearable. Like eating a ghost pepper (which I would never do).
Phylllis
@Kayla Rudbek: My brother and I were like 11-12 (one year & 2 days apart) when we got SSN’s–this would have been 1973 or 74. Enumeration at birth as an option began in 1987–application is part of the birth certificate process.
Ohio Mom
@Phylllis: I can only imagination the outcry in 1987 over giving newborns Social Security mumbers, government overreach, Big Brother, etc.
John S.
@Ohio Mom:
Without Fox News to tell everyone how evil SSN enumeration is, nobody cared.
Sister Golden Bear
@Kayla Rudbek: Nice breakdown.
A simpler version for non-techies is that SS account numbers are unique therefore by definition they don’t need to be de-duplicated. There are a small number of cases — widows who never had a paying job and used their husband’s SSN, plus orphaned minors — where >1 person shares an account, equivalent to a married couple sharing a joint bank account. Two people, one account.
That does not mean there are multiple SS accounts sharing the identical number which are being for fraudulent purposes, as Musk was claiming.
No there are not any 150 year-olds receiving SS, or claiming to receive SS. It’s quirk of the system defaulting birthdates to 1875 if that info is left blank.*
*I haven’t seen an explanation for that, but my guess is that when these systems were written, it was done as protective measure to so if the info was missing, it defaulted to a value that might be wrong, but wouldn’t crash the program using that data.
Phylllis
@Ohio Mom: I have to say I wasn’t paying attention to it at the time. I’m really only aware of it from my Medicaid caseworker days starting in the early 90’s. The SSN application was required to add the newborn to the mom’s case.
Ohio Mom
@John S.: Oh there were probably Birchers frothing about it.
sentient ai from the future
@Sister Golden Bear: I havent been able to track down a source for that 1875 claim, so i dont know how accurate it is. it’s a claim that makes sense given the era in which it arose and, similar to “unix epoch” timekeeping, they’d want a field that if defaulted to 0 would be about as early as they’d have to go back with record keeping (i.e. with personnel, a birthdate of someone who was in their 80s when the language was originally built in the late 1950s)
but the claims themselves come from folks claiming to have expert knowledge, and i have no way to evaluate the veracity of those claims to said knowledge.
i just figured i should mention this as i have propagated one of the mastodon links that made the claim, and have seen it thrown around with increasing frequency.
John S.
@Ohio Mom:
Yeah, but back then they were just cranks with newsletters that nobody subscribed to. Fox News platformed those motherfuckers and took them mainstream.
NotMax
@sentient ai from the future
As the default error is 150 years back, in, say, 1955 that would be 1805.
The 1950s are a bit early though, for COBOL.
Sister Golden Bear
@sentient ai from the future: I haven’t been able to track down the source of the 1875 claim either, but I’d just say regardless of the specific year, the logic of setting a default value if there’s null field still makes sense.
sab
@Phylllis: @Ohio Mom: That was about the time that the Tax Code started requiring SSNs for dependents on tax returns. Part of Reagan’s hunt for fraud and abuse.
cmorenc
@Sister Golden Bear: 1875 was useful as a programming tool as a sentinel value indicating invalid or missing data in the birth year field.
Peke Daddy
“The richest man in the world is stealing from you.”
Betty
I still want someone to investigate whether it was Musk’s boys who cut off Social Security benefits for me and 700,000 Americans living overseas. I did file the required forms for anyone who wants to tell me my benefits were cut off for noncompliance. Nonetheless I have re-submitted the forms.
TBone
@NotMax: thank you for the hot pickled vichyssoise recipe. I tweaked and it is now perfect Snow Day fare. Twice the potato (cubed into different sizes, some small enough to melt into the broth), twice the onion, half the minced pickles, and omit the brine altogether. Double the sour cream and flour at the end. Voila! Best Snow Day soup evah!
NotMax
@TBone
Enjoy!
TBone
@DEBG: always keep your hands away from your eyes and nether regions. If all else fails, use frequent palate cleansers!
I’m not even talking about food hahahaha! Chopping scotch bonnets!
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_L3Vt2rHSPk
TBone
@NotMax: it is so freakin’ good on a blizzardy day, my tummy feels like Pooh just had a big jar of hunny!
Suzanne
The big Elmo news of the day is that he appears to have “fathered” another child by another baby mama, this time a right wing influencer, Ashley St. Clair.
Kayla Rudbek
@FelonyGovt: I remember getting my Social Security card and having my dad explain to me that the first two digits were based on the state that you lived in when you applied for the number (which is probably yet another thing that the DOGE idiots don’t know or understand). With that limitation in place, there are only really seven unique digits in the number instead of nine.
TBone
PSA crooksandliars is a great place for on topic of this post content.
Also too, this type;
Let’s All Make Monday ‘Not My President Day!’
HopefullyNotcassandra
Undocumented workers pay billions of dollars in payroll taxes, too. They will never get this money back.
New analysis by the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy (ITEP) found that undocumented residents paid £25.7 billion into Social Security funds and $6 billion into Medicare in 2022; both programs that they are not entitled to use. In total, undocumented immigrants paid $96.7 billion, or roughly $9,000 per person, in taxes in 2022.“
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/other/undocumented-immigrants-payments-into-social-security-detailed-in-report/ar-BB1qTmHA
TBone
Excellent palate cleanser for emergency use brought to me by the ghost who inhabits my algorithm! Not music this time:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=aiqKK4ysI7g
NotMax
FYI.
Deepish dive into U.S. arms and equipment going to Ukraine.
Central Planning
@Kayla Rudbek: My wife and I were both born in New York State and the first two digits of our ssn are not the same. None of the ssns of our kids have an identical 2-digit number in them either.
TBone
@TBone:
Marc
The problem with COBOL-based systems is that prior to the 80s most used 6 digit BCD (Binary Coded Decimal) numbers to represent dates. Many of the weird cutoff/wrap-around dates resulted from various Y2K fixes to that issue and vary from system to system. Post-80s systems tended to use 32 bit binary time/date encoding, which still has wrap-around issues. ISO 8601 time/date format (2025-02-15T12:22−08:00) wasn’t standardized until 1988 and wasn’t in common use until the mid-90s.
Martin
When we get fed up with an existing system and we seek out change, we look for markers that the change agents aren’t themselves secretly beholden to the existing system, to its norms and conventions. We seek out people who break those, who are obscene, at least within the context of the system they are seeking to oversee. Trumps obscenity, Musks obscenity are features for people wanting change, just as Luigi’s obscenity is a feature to a different group of people.
They will not change their view of the merit of that obscenity until they change their view of the merit of the system they are seeking change from. That’s gonna take a while.
And as for SSNs – it’s the first 3 digits. NY State takes up all of 050-134. If you are ever in conversation with people it’s worth pointing out that 580-584 is Puerto Rico and 586 is Guam. Having a SSN means you are a citizen, but not necessarily eligible to vote in federal elections. And there are loads of people running around that opted out of Social Security because you could do that before 1984. And some religious groups can opt-out. So there are bunches of people who won’t have SSNs until they apply for Medicare.
Sister Golden Bear
@Kayla Rudbek: FWIW, a while back Social Security stopped basing the first digits based on the state, and now they’re assigned randomly. I’m insufficiently but IIRC it was done both to free up more numbers, and as a security measure to help patterns in the data that could be exploited.
Martin
@Marc: Right, but 2 digit years aren’t really a problem in the vast majority of these cases because you can almost always infer the century based on other data, which is how they cleaned up the dataset. Sure, there are likely still some 2 digit years in the dataset, but I guarantee there is somewhere in there a 4 digit one that has been sanitized and is the one that is used.
#hascleanedupgigabitesifnotterabytesofoldcoboldatasetsinagovermentsetting
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Martin:
Fuck those people, they have blood on their hands they will never be able to scrub off. Like, imagine thinking a fucking billionaire asshole is going to make good change for you
Marc
@Martin: Having a SSN means you are a citizen
I could be wrong, but can’t a resident alien with appropriate work visas obtain an SSN (or some sort of TIN)? As far as I know, having a valid SSN is not proof of citizenship.
Martin
@Sister Golden Bear: Yeah, embedding any data in an identifier is officially a ‘bad idea’. It was really useful in the days before high speed computers but these days you want that data randomized.
Ask any trans person.
opiejeanne
@Kayla Rudbek:
From their site: The nine-digit SSN is composed of three parts: The first set of three digits is called the Area Number. The second set of two digits is called the Group Number. The final set of four digits is the Serial Number
Martin
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): You do it too. You just look for a different set of norms and obscenities. AOC got where she is for the very same reasons. Her social media presence was considered obscene for a member of congress, but it conveyed youth and a connection to voters.
RaflW
As a Minnesotan, I just want to say “Buzz off, Dean Philips.”
We may have a reputation for ‘Minnesota Nice’ but he’s exempt for being such a complete turd in a punchbowl.
opiejeanne
@Central Planning: Yeah, my kids were all born in the same hospital but their first three numbers don’t match, so I don’t know.
My husband is 3 years older than I, and was born in Loma Linda, CA. I was born 40 miles away in the San Gabriel Valley, and our first number is the only match.
Martin
@Marc: A SSN doesn’t necessarily mean you are a citizen. For instance, you could renounce citizenship and still be eligible for benefits. At a minimum, you will still be documented in the system as having paid into the system. It’s not like your records get deleted.
You can request a SSN when you apply for a green card. Fucking loads of people have SSNs. It’s not a national ID, was never intended to be a national ID, and anyone looking inside that system and thinking it serves as one is a fucking idiot.
Another Scott
@Kayla Rudbek: @Central Planning:
My J and her sister are twins, born in the early ’60s. Their first initial is the same, their last name is the same, their Social Security numbers are the same except for the last digit (differs by one).
Really, really, NOT recommended.
Their credit reports have been mixed together, (“you can’t refinance your mortgage because you have another mortgage in another state that puts you above the limit”) they get each other’s mail, etc., etc., even though they live half the country apart.
George Foreman’s 5 sons must have, er, interesting credit reports as well.
:-/
Zappa probably had it right in naming his kids (but it looks like he should have done better in setting up his estate).
Best wishes,
Scott.
Ruckus
@Kayla Rudbek:
I am an old and I got mine when I was 12- 13. Because I got a part time job around that age. Made $1.25/hour. Retired 3 yrs ago. My SS is enough for me to live off of, mostly because of how many decades I worked. Life has changed a tad since then. Where I live now was lemon and orange groves with a house every so often, way back when.
opiejeanne
@Sister Golden Bear: Thanks. The info on the intertoobs is not always the best.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Martin:
Maybe. But at least mine is based in objective fucking reality.
How would these people react if I walked up to them and told them they fucked me over as a worker, as a union member? That people like Musk are not your fucking friends if you’re not also a billionaire, and maybe not even then? And I gave them an example of how I’ve been fucked over of Jeff Bezos just deciding to ignore a union vote at Whole Foods, with Bezos explicitly citing what the Trump admin has been doing at the NLRB and how that could materially affect me, when I rely on my health insurance at least partially through the union I’m a member of?
Marc
@Martin:
I was just asking about this sentence:
Which doesn’t seem to say what you meant it to say.
RaflW
@Peke Daddy: Also, at least what gets me wound up: “The weirdest man in D.C. now has your SSN and bank account number. D’you trust him?”
Martin
@opiejeanne: California was 545-574 prior to 2011. Some states had discontiguous numbers – like Florida that outgrew its original set and has a 2nd one. And the group number in the middle got reshuffled all the time, so *when* people were born matters. A hospitals group number could easily have changed in the two decades between parents and kids being born.
This is why you can’t sanitize data the way you think. I had a group trying to sanitize old addresses so they could validate address data against modern datasets – and I had to shut that shit down hard because prior to 1971 zip codes weren’t even required, zip codes move all the damn time, street names change constantly – you can only validate an address in the context of the timestamp for when it was last update, and those datasets simply don’t exist (nor do most systems timestamp when only the address was updated, and not the whole record, not to mention once you validate the address, you’ll change the timestamp so that you can no longer validate it again because it’ll be ‘now’ and misalign to the dataset you are validating against.)
This shit is extremely hard to do.
Victor Matheson
@Ohio Mom: That practice of giving infants SSNs at birth was actually specifically designed to reduce fraud in income tax filings. In the late 1980s in order to declare a dependent on your taxes you started to have to provide an SSN. Something like 5 million dependent children disappeared overnight.
Martin
@Marc: Yeah, I misspoke there.
hells littlest angel
If it’s misinformation you’re looking for, there’s plenty of it right here in this thread.
Phylllis
@Victor Matheson: And they absolutely cross-reference that stuff. We had a situation where the non-custodial dad finagled a printout* with his kids SSN info from a new front desk worker at my county social services office. Both he and the mom filed with the kids as dependents. He filed first, so custodial mom’s return was flagged. It was eventually straightened out & dad was in some kind of hot water.
*So was our office, because information was provided to someone who was not the named payee for the case. Her excuse? ‘He said he was the dad.’ She didn’t last much longer.
Starfish (she/her)
@Kayla Rudbek: There was also some speculation that Musk and his boys are stupid and do not understand that the same value may show up multiple times in different tables of relational databases, It is not like there was not a Government Accountability Office out there to reduce waste.
Starfish (she/her)
@Marc: You are correct. My mom had a SSN long before she was a citizen.
Suzanne
@Phylllis: So Ex-Mr.-Suzanne is bad at adulting, and he made a similar error. Per the divorce agreement, we had to trade off the deduction, and he filed in the wrong year. (Numbers: they be difficult.) So I got contacted by the IRS, because two people claimed the same kid. And it was so funny-slash-annoying, because I was confused by the letter, so I called to talk to someone… and they couldn’t tell me who filed with my kid’s SSN…. just that someone else did. So, to document that I was in the right, I had to dig out my divorce/custody papers and copy them and send them in. It took months to resolve. Really, really annoying.
VFX Lurker
Yep. My husband started here on an O-1 visa. He received an SSN then, which he used to file his taxes.
After he got his green card, he kept the same SSN. So, he has a work history with the same SSN for work he did under his O-1 and his green card.
JaneE
Traitor seems about right. History will call you pig ignorant apologies to the pig. Probably some child who never heard of S/360 much less programmed one.
No one lives to be 150, but older computers stopped dead when there was no data in a numeric field. The earliest cohorts added to SS didn’t have documentation the way we do now. Birth certificates either didn’t exist, weren’t official documents, or burned up in old court house fires. When birth certificates became necessary, some people did not remember what year they were born. It had never been important before. Could not leave it blank if you wanted your check run to go all the way to the end. So pick a date that everyone will know is not correct. Except Musk and his whiz kids.
Just try to collect SS. No docs no benefits. And the docs you used in the 70’s to apply won’t be good enough in the 90’s when you want to switch to a widow’s benefit. Been there with my mom. Not fun, time consuming, not cheap either. The good news is they eventually pay all the benefits you are due. Or they did before Musk and his friends started breaking the code.
NaijaGal
@Marc: I had a SSN before I became a US citizen. I was a dependent of my mom, who was on an H-1B visa, so my SS card said that I was not authorized to work. Still have the same SSN after naturalizing, but a new card that removes the language about authorization to work.
jimmiraybob
Hey, no mo problems. Today the King has declared, “He who saves his Country does not violate any Law.”
As long as he and Musk are saving the country there ain’t no laws to stop them. No laws no problems.
Easy peazy.
Next.
kalakal
@Marc: I’m a resident Alien. I got a Red Card*
and an SSN card within about 2 weeks of arrival
*A Red Card is basically a temporary Green Card
You get one so you can work while they process the Green Card
I think they last 2 years but can be extended if they haven’t got
the Green Card processed in that time
hitchhiker
@John S.: I saw on thread on reddit today asking if people are less intelligent now than in the past.
As dozens of readers quickly pointed out, no — it just feels that way because now they’re constantly in our faces instead of handing out badly printed leaflets somewhere.
Ruckus
@Sister Golden Bear:
It defaulted to a number that could be actually used but would be very seldom. My grandparents would have been born around that time, maybe just a bit past. Much of humanity has been able to survive longer starting around/a bit after WWII. Medicine changed a lot about that time or during.
Ruckus
@JaneE:
What I wonder is will the people that voted for shitforbrains ever figure out that HE is the cause of a lot of the crap that we ALL are going to have to get through? And that having an unstable government really, really sucks – huge donkey balls.
I’m an old fart – have been collecting SS for over a decade, and I figured out when I was around 12 yrs old that rethuglicans were not good for the country and ALL of it’s citizens. The shitforbrains side of life seems to go through bits of time like this where the economy and the country seems to be against a lot of the citizens that do a lot of the dirty work of humanity and screw them into the ground, just so the uber assholes can brag about the size of their bank accounts. They screw millions into the ground to make their bank accounts bigger – big enough that it’s unlikely they could ever spend it all in 2 lifetimes. Their subconscious views of themselves must be bags and bags of manure with their picture and name on them. Said view of them is likely very common to most of us.
NotMax
Did someone say SSN?
:)
Phylllis
Oops, wrong thread.
OldDave
I learned COBOL (and Fortran) in the mid 1970s. The idea of Object-Oriented COBOL broke what’s left of my mind.
Shalimar
@Suzanne: Great. Musk is the world’s richest deadbeat dad. You know most of those children won’t inherit anything. Elon is just the type of guy to pick a most ruthless child and give him all of it.
bbleh
Well *I* for one SUPPORT Brother Elon’s DILIGENT efforts to TRACK DOWN the MASSIVE FRAUD being perpetrated on the American People by the Tax-Hungry DEMONS of the Uni-Party! And if that means some delays or adjustments to the so-called “Social Security” system, so much the better! We cannot allow PROGRESS to be held HOSTAGE to the so-called “needs” of a greedy few who now depend on their monthly HANDOUTS because of BAD LIFE CHOICES!!
[turns, steps directly on puppy, exits humming “Deutschland Über Alles]
Ohio Mom
@Victor Matheson: Oh! You jogged my memory, I’d forgotten that.
tam1MI
My Trump-y neighbor just unleashed a hell of a statement on me:
NEIGHBOR: “If you are born in this country, at least one of your parents has to be a citizen for you to be a citizen!:
ME: “Uhhhhhhhhh, no, to be a citizen of this country you just have to be born here. It’s in the Constitution.”
NEIGHBOR: “Oh, no, they changed that.”
ME: “………”
Enhanced Voting Techniques
Not to mention Musk is a drug addict, something the media is taking great pains to avoid.
And Musk is a billionaire, not an accountant. IF DOGE was serious were at the accountants?
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Martin: and adding to what Martin is say, the the law that created Social Security specifically says the SSN is not to be used as a national ID (on the instance of the Right)
Another Scott
@OldDave: A long-term online friend, decades ago, liked to take obscure (and not so obscure) non-OO programming languages and use them to solve the standard OOP “shapes” problem.
IIRC, he had routines for DOS Batch, COBOL, PL-1, dBase, and on and on.
(Of course, I cannot quickly find it…)
Best wishes,
Scott.
Gloria DryGarden
@Nukular Biskits: i keep those few former friends on my Facebook so I can get bits of what those weirdos are up to. I’m básically done arguing, I’m just an observer, or a mole. I won’t go searching for it, I hate what they are up to, but it’s also important that we know.
fucking tsunami of bullshit, but, better to know, so we can inform how we push back, or resist, or make a stand where it might count.
Thank you mistermix. It’s useful, albeit painful. Thanks for searching it deeper.
( So many swear words!!) Late again, doing other things today.