I would recommend that if you have not already filed your taxes, don’t. Ask for an extension for as long as possible:
The IRS will lay off thousands of probationary workers in the middle of tax season, according to two sources familiar with the agency’s plans, and cuts could happen as soon as next week.
This comes as the Trump administration intensified sweeping efforts to shrink the size of the federal workforce, by ordering agencies to lay off nearly all probationary employees who had not yet gained civil service protection.
It’s unclear how many IRS workers will be affected.
Previously, the administration announced a plan to offer buyouts to almost all federal employees through a “deferred resignation program” to quickly reduce the government workforce. The program deadline was Feb. 6, and administration officials said employees who accept will be able to stop working while still collecting a paycheck until Sept. 30.
However, IRS employees involved in the 2025 tax season were told they will not be allowed to accept a buyout offer from the Trump administration until after the taxpayer filing deadline, according to a letter sent recently to IRS employees.
The NY Times, some of Trump’s biggest enablers, have a very concerned op-ed:
If you were to ask the top chief executives in the world to name the best strategy to attack waste in their organizations and balance the books, there is one answer you would be very, very unlikely to hear: Take an ax to accounts receivable, the part of an organization responsible for collecting revenue.
Yet the private sector leaders advising President Trump on ways to increase government efficiency are deploying this exact approach by targeting the Internal Revenue Service, which collects virtually all the receipts of the U.S. government — our nation’s accounts receivable division. Last week, the Trump administration started laying off about 6,700 I.R.S. employees, many if not most of whom are directly involved in collecting unpaid taxes.
Every year, the government receives much less in taxes than it is owed. Closing that gap, which stands at roughly $700 billion annually, would almost certainly require maintaining the I.R.S.’s collection capacity. Depleting it is tantamount to a chief executive saying something like: “We sold a lot of goods and services this year, but let’s limit our ability to collect what we’re owed.”
Perhaps only the company’s competitors would approve of such an approach. Yet here we are. Aggressive cuts to our nation’s accounts receivable function will reduce the amount of tax revenue coming in, which will in turn increase our nation’s deficit and add to our $36 trillion in debt.
On a personal note, I filed the first week of February. Because of the screwiness of this website and how the IRS changes how they count donations via paypal and other online sources from year to year, I have gotten in the habit of getting my paperwork to the accountant the MOMENT I get it. That way, if I end up owing a couple thousand, I have time to file an extension, save, and get it paid without penalties. That has mostly stabilized now that we have moved to Patreon, and I can just make a quarterly payment and have everything about even. This year, however, I was going to receive a very modest refund, so the accountant just efiled as soon as she I did not owe anything. Normally when I efile it is two weeks and everything is done. This year, not so much:
The thing people need to understand is that the oligarchs think all the money is theirs. Trump and Musk view the Treasury as THEIR money, and will have no problem making it impossible for anyone to get the money back they are owed, so long as it means they can gut the IRS to keep themselves from having to pay anything. My refund was so small that it will be inconsequential (don’t get me wrong, I want the fucking money, it’s mine), but this is going to screw over a lot of people who rely on these things. I am not sure many of you realize how much people who do not make a lot of money rely on these refunds to do big ticket purchases they could not otherwise do because they have no or bad credit. I know people who make under 25k a year who reliably get refunds and they spend it on frivolous things like dental work they have put off for the year.
Welcome to the new America, I suppose.
John S.
I would say don’t forget about Adam Silverman, but I guess he was effectively driven away and relegated to his nightly post about Ukraine (which is invaluable).
ETA: You just got big footed by AL, so looks like things are back to normal around here!
Zzyzx
I haven’t been here much lately because the news is so depressing, but have I missed some drama?
Old Man Shadow
@Zzyzx: We’re liberals. There’s always drama.
bbleh
Betty too? I haz a sad.
Man, go away for one long weekend and …
Just Some Fuckhead
All the frontpagers quitting, all the commenters fighting. Nothing left here for DOGE to do.
trollhattan
Elmo just demanded y’all show up at the office. Right after firing everybody who didn’t file an activity report. Tomorrow, sun to rise in west, so be prepared. Billionaire’s gonna billionaire.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
“Not working as intended”?
Au contraire, I think it’s working exactly as intended.
My normie wife wakes up in the morning, listens to a smattering of Totebagger Radio (I stay out of earshot), then over coffee says “We’re observing a slow-rolling coup right before our very eyes and nobody knows wtf to do about it.”
ArchTeryx
It’s sadly all too predictable after such a devastating loss. A lot of folks here, I think, feel that the enemy’s won and the war’s lost, so the only ones left to turn on are one another. Seen it before. Saw it in 2000. Saw it in 2004. Saw it in 2010… and that’s just this century.
Though, at the risk of starting yet another flamewar, Mistermix needed a vacay from this mess no matter what. He was quite rapidly turning into an LGM front pager, constantly posting doom, gloom, and taking shots at our own side, and posting several times a day. I didn’t see that as necessarily a permanent thing; it’s just how he’s coping with the utter catastrophe we find ourselves in.
Victory has many fathers. Defeat is an orphan. Defeat by fascists makes orphans. Don’t blame anyone for being despondent.
WaterGirl
Cole, that’s not fair. Betty Cracker has had some crackerjack posts lately. David Anderson has put up some great activism posts.
And Rose has been a wonderful addition to the site.
Your glass is so half empty today that you are inadvertently dissing some of the great people who are still here.
Rose Judson
I’ll be on later with a non-respite post.
VFX Lurker
My CPA e-filed last Wednesday or Thursday morning. My larger California return was marked “issued” last Friday, so I should get my California refund soon. IRS is still stuck on “Return Received” for my much smaller federal refund.
Hope you get your IRS refund soon, John.
tam1MI
I filed my return the very first day I was eligible to in January. I got my refund back in a week, I figure it slipped through before the Muskrats hit.
John Cole
@WaterGirl: It’s monday and I am churlish and pissed off and that is redundant but I have deleted the shitty stuff I posted at the end.
John Cole
@Rose Judson: I’m sorry it was shitty of me I am just frustrated.
rikyrah
I don’t get a refund, so I am gonna wait until my usual date – 2 days before .
I have been busy with work, so I don’t even know what’s been going on here.
I was hoping that we were going to get involved with the Florida Special Congressional elections. Hoping that we would go all in, if only to have something to focus on.
J. Arthur Crank
I had an unusually large federal refund this year so I filed about 3 weeks ago. I have not tried to check the process of the refund, but perhaps I should.
John S.
@John Cole:
You’re not wrong, Walter. You’re just an asshole. 🙂
satby
I’ll file an extension just to delay sending them $ as long as possible. A spite extension.
A Ghost to Most
Pie filter still active? Check.
Still pie-ing away ideas that don’t conform to the tribe? Check .
Embrace the Suck.
Elizabelle
Got to say, John, I love your tag DOGESHIT.
I think it is going to get a heavy workout. Also, good advice re the taxes.
Ghost of Joe Liebling’s Dog
@comrade scotts agenda of rage:
Not working, as intended.
catclub
@comrade scotts agenda of rage: upper middle class tax cheats LOVE cuts to the IRS. The GOP always tries to satisfy that desire.
The NYT’s careful ignorance of the past is no longer amusing.
Sister Golden Bear
I have an unusually large refund this year — turns out CA’s short-term disability is tax free so I didn’t need to make the estimated tax payments I made — so I filed two week. Unfortunately, since I still can’t work, I really need the money, but my refund is still pending.
Steve LaBonne
You get one extension and if you owe money you have to pay it by April 15- the extension is only for filing.
Kelly
We’re expecting a big refund. We paid the equivalent of 2/3 of our gross income for Mom’s dementia care facility before she passed away in July. We’re claiming her as a dependant and deducting her bills. Handed over all the paperwork to our tax service over a week ago. The refund will replenish savings but we can wait comfortably if it takes a while.
Tangentially related, get your passport if you haven’t got one. Republican voter ID bullshit is on the agenda.
Matt McIrvin
Would filing later make things better or worse? I’ve been assuming that whatever IRS we get down the line will be determining who gets an audit by looking at party registration and political donation records.
Kosh III
We owe a tad over $100 so I am MAILING a CHECK on April 13.
trollhattan
Ever since Trump Tax Cut 1.0 we have owed on every return, sometimes to the penalty level. This, despite 0 dependents on our W4s. Seems to be a combo of them gaming the deduction tables and the SALT cap, which fvcks Californians high and hard. Hoping that sunsets, which he’s “promised” but all it takes is somebody to note he’s helping Californians and New Yorkers, and it will stay in place.
Have until April 15 to decide on file or extend, but a check to the IRS will be required no matter what.
Matt McIrvin
@catclub: but some of them are Democrats, and if the IRS turns on them? Interesting times.
trollhattan
Us, in a
yearmonth? Republicans are not called American Taliban for no reason.Doug R
I know here in Canada the CRA doesn’t get too worked up if you’re owed a refund and you’re late. But only for a year or so.
Matt McIrvin
@A Ghost to Most: Nobody owes you a reading of your comments. Driving people off the site is one thing, allowing people to personally filter commenters out is another.
glc
@John S.: I was puzzled by that remark but I see in the thread that Cole deleted some remarks. I can imagine.
Anyway here’s something else sensible: https://the.ink/p/anat-shenker-osorios-actual-plan
Doesn’t pull punches so if that annoys anybody they should just skip it.
On the tax side (back on topic) I owe quite a bit for reasons, and I wanted to get it over quickly – but I was wondering about all the current mayhem and how to respond. I really don’t like kicking that sort of can down the road but it’s one of the more noticeable things one can do. There’s one form that gets sent out very late or I’d have done it already.
I sent [email protected] the 5 things I did last week. Adding a little noise to the system.
Ohio Mom
@Kelly: Get all your papers, not just your passport—your birth certificate, your marriage license, your divorce papers, your Social Security card, probably something that proves your address (lease, deed, whatever), if you are naturalized, those papers, did I leave anything out? Oh, driver’s license or state ID card.
Xerox them, put the originals where you won’t lose them (we use a safety deposit box) and keep the xeroxes separately (in the file cabinet in the guest room/office for us). Except for the driver’s license/state ID obviously.
My BIL wanted to be added to my MIL’s checking account — a wise move considering she’s 93 and he’s the POA — and the bank wouldn’t let him because MIL can’t prove who she is. Her passport and drivers license are expired; she hadn’t seen her birth certificate or marriage license since forever, and anyway, the name on the birth certificate doesn’t match any the other papers because her family Americanized their Latvian name when she was a small child. She has a vague memory of going to an official building to get renamed.
No one (looking at you BIL) wants to go through the trouble of calling up the offices in Detroit that have the necessary records so this will probably blow up after MIL’s death.
She votes absentee, so all she needs is the last four digits of her Social Security number. That’s assuming the mail-in vote gets delivered. We would drive it down to the Board of Elections ourselves but that’s illegal. Unless we bring her along and she’s not that mobile anymore.
How did I get off on this tangent?
Redshift
Oh, NYT, you’re so close to getting that this means they’re lying about their objectives! Come on, it’s just a small step further…
Soprano2
Our accountant always has to file an extension because our taxes are complicated now. I never know if we’re paying or getting money back.
Starfish (she/her)
@Just Some Fuckhead: As a probationary commenter, your services are no longer needed. Please write [email protected] and let Elon know that he sucks using five bullet points.
rikyrah
@Elizabelle:
CLAP CLAP CLAP
satby
@Kosh III: that’s my strategy too.
Kirk
@Ohio Mom: don’t just xerox them.
Get notarized copies. Ideally use an attorney with notary power. Yes it will cost. It can also make a massive difference.
brendancalling
Why file at all? Who’s gonna make you pay? Who’s even checking the tax returns?
satby
@Ohio Mom: yeah, get out of Ohio. Red states hate their own citizens and make life difficult for them. I’m going back to IL at some point in the next several years, I miss the sanity of blue state governance.
TBone
Direct quote from my financial advisor/tax accountant:
He is still unaware of my plan to send in an extension request form instead of a check this year. We usually file in February and I snail mail a check on April 15. Not this year!
japa21
Filed online January 31. Refund deposited in bank February 9.
Still waiting for Illinois to get it done.
TBone
J.C. thank you for platforming Jane Fonda – I have shared it widely to rousing cheers!!!
trollhattan
@TBone: We
firedstopped using our accountant after he included a “what you saved under the Trump tax cuts” memo to our returns package.Let’s just say it raised some trust and judgement issues.
No Nym
People not being able to spend their refunds on long-delayed big-ticket items and so forth will certainly help tank the economy quicker.
I am getting a refund this year (filed last week) and requested it to be emailed through DeJoy’s USPS on the outside chance that it will get here and I won’t have to refresh my account info for the DOGEshits.
sab
@Ohio Mom: I don’t know how you got off on your tangent but is very useful advice. So thank you.
TBone
@trollhattan: that’s a wise move! I’m only in with this guy for a small portion of my portfolio as a diversification method. Plus he does good taxes. The bulk of my portfolio is not in his wheelhouse, despite his initial efforts to have transfers. I was able to haggle his advisor fee down too. So he’s a very straight shooter on the up and up so far. Believe me, I’ve vetted him pretty extensively and his wife tax assistant and his female administrator at his investments office are no slouches either.
We never discuss actual politics except he dunked on Elno with me at an in home meeting – we visit each other at home periodically.
sab
@trollhattan: Yikes!
TBone
@TBone: my new Episcopal Priest and the head honchos at my new NEPA activism group were favorably impressed!
Matt McIrvin
@brendancalling: My guess is, that option will only be available to known MAGA.
TBone
PS I just want to say to those who complain about this comment system formatting: you’ve never used an office computer under pressure where you jot down a note to self to keep your place in things, and it shows! Also, please do use your built in “find in page” search tool!
Chacal Charles Calthrop
@Ohio Mom: useful advice!
I was the executor of a former roommate’s husband’s estate and it turned out his parents — both immigrants — could not prove they were legally married. They sad they were married in the home country but there are no records of that. Quite the headache.
Chacal Charles Calthrop
@No Nym: I still think we are going to see stagflation. Stagnation from all the people who don’t have money to spend (whether from loss of job, cuts in government funding, or no tax refund) and inflation from the tariffs, bird flu shortages, and a Fed determined to protect the value of the dollar.
Jane2
@WaterGirl: Agree. Also agree that some commenters need to rein it in.
TBone
Deleted
FelonyGovt
@glc: I just wrote to [email protected] myself:
I understand you want to know five things that people did last week. I’m not a Federal government employee, but I am a loyal American so I thought I’d do my part.
1. Went to the doctor
2. Went to Costco
3. Vacuumed the house
4. Cooked dinner
5. Wrote to my Senators and Representatives complaining about Elon Musk, a drug-addled corrupt racist billionaire, illegally taking over the government with the apparent concurrence of a senile felonious sexual abuser President.
John S.
@Jane2:
It would be nice, but I don’t see that happening. BJ has always been a zoo since its inception, and Cole doesn’t like to moderate comments if he can help it.
Moderation is extremely difficult to get right, according to last night’s excellent installment from John Oliver.
John S.
@TBone:
I think (hope) it’s just that she stepped away from actively being a front pager while she focuses on her health. Not that she is gone for good.
TBone
@Steve LaBonne: DOH my plan is foiled, thank you for the heads up, I had forgotten in my anger!
TBone
@John S.: grateful for that response, thank you!
ETA also too for the John Oliver, I will look for that.
Ohio Mom
@Kirk: Good idea. I haven’t needed notarized copies yet but I could see that could be useful and necessary.
No Nym
@Chacal Charles Calthrop: I think it is the natural consequence of all those things you mention. Any one of them is bad by itself, but put them all together, and it is hard to be optimistic about where all this is going.
feebog
My tax guy already filed. I had an unexpectedly good year so even though I increased by estimated taxes for the last two quarters, I still owed a ton to both the feds and state. So, in no hurry. That said, John is probably right and the caution extends well beyond the IRS. Mass layoffs are going to affect service across the entire spectrum of federal agencies.
TBone
@feebog: I’m so glad you spelled affect correctly. Thank you for renewing my faith.
FelonyGovt
@glc: I also wrote to [email protected]:
I understand you want to know five things that people did last week. I’m not a Federal government employee, but I am a loyal American so I thought I’d do my part.
1. Went to the doctor
2. Went to Costco
3. Vacuumed the house
4. Cooked dinner
5. Wrote to my Senators and Representatives complaining about Elon Musk, a drug-addled corrupt racist billionaire, illegally taking over the government with the apparent concurrence of a senile felonious sexual abuser President.
billcinsd
Who will be at the IRS to process your request for an extension?
FelonyGovt
My comments may have been deleted because of the email address I included- anyway I wrote to OPM as Elon requested:
I understand you want to know five things that people did last week. I’m not a Federal government employee, but I am a loyal American so I thought I’d do my part.
1. Went to the doctor
2. Went to Costco
3. Vacuumed the house
4. Cooked dinner
5. Wrote to my Senators and Representatives complaining about Elon Musk, a drug-addled corrupt racist billionaire, illegally taking over the government with the apparent concurrence of a senile felonious sexual abuser President.
billcinsd
@TBone: I think your tax advisor needs to think better or agree less with MAGA
Ohio Mom
@satby: We are stuck here as long as Ohio MIL is on this mortal coil, she is very dependent on Ohio Dad. She really belongs in assisted living but won’t do it. So when she fell out of her chair election night, Ohio Dad had to drive over and pick her up. For one example.
And it would be complicated finding the right location far Ohio Son. His SSDI will follow him anywhere but his Medicaid Waiver is out of Ohio and wouldn’t transfer. And every state has different rules. He wouldn’t be eligible for a Medicaid Waiver in Massachusetts for instance, because he is only autistic, not autistic and intellectually disabled (or at least that was still true several years ago).
Life is full of roads not taken.
FelonyGovt
@Ohio Mom: Ugh, I feel for you. My father-in-law has dementia and should not be living alone, but instead he calls my husband to run over to his apartment every time he needs anything.
KRK
I don’t see how waiting to file is the right plan if one is due a refund. Get in the queue sooner rather than later. It’s not like it’s going to get less f*ed up in the short term.
And an extension doesn’t buy time to send the payment if one is due. You’d really just be banking on there not being enforcement. Which, you know, okay. But at least be aware of what you’re doing.
billcinsd
@Elizabelle: Roy Edroso has gone with DOGEbags
Ohio Mom
@FelonyGovt: I hope we are not as selfish when we are old and frail. My MIL has always needed to be the center of attention and she is managing to continue to succeed at that, even with her very limited capacities.
I hope you are able to find a way to get your FIL into some sort of supervised living soon. He has to be a danger to himself and others, or soon will be.
Timill
@Ohio Mom: Get all your passports up to date, not just the US one (for those of us with multiple citizenships).
As well as notarized xeroxes, scan them all, preferable to an off-site backup. Mine are in OneDrive, which has its own risks, but if all my computers are lost I’ll still have access.
satby
@FelonyGovt: oh, well done 👍
Leto
Youtube: Last Week Tonight w/ John Oliver: Facebook and Content Moderation. (22 min)
zhena gogolia
@FelonyGovt: Excellent!
robtrim
I used TurboTax Online – with a simple return I pay nothing and am getting Fed and State returns done and submitted electronically. I’ve already received my Fed rebate. State (DC) is in process and should be in my checking account shortly. If you have a simple return, Turbo Tax Online is the way to go. Just don’t buy any of the extra crap they try and sell you. Free tax returns are the way to go.
WaterGirl
@FelonyGovt: They went into SPAM. I just released them.
John S.
@TBone:
My pleasure. Hope you’re having a great day!
WaterGirl
@KRK: If I understood correclly…
The idea is that people can’t be let go while there are still 2024 returns to be dealt with. The later you get them in, the longer it is before they can dump more employees.
Don’t know if my understanding is correct or not.
cmorenc
Trump/Musk’s wet dream is to entirely replace income taxes with tariff revenue, but tariffs make imported goods more expensive and less competitive vs domestic goods, the income from which will no longer be taxed. And that’s completely aside from the fact that tariff costs on any goods that are only available vis import will regressively fall much harder on low and middle income folks than upper income people, since they are added on to consumer prices with exactly the same effect as a sales tax. And with imported goods at a competitive disadvantage to domestic goods, domestic producers will be under less competitive price pressure.
But supposedly with pressure off from imports, there will purportedly be more opportunity for domestic goods providers to flourish, free of income taxes costs – but at the cost of no income tax revenue plus no tariff revenue to the extent they now outcompete imports – so how is the infrastructure essential to a commercial society to be supported? And no guarantee any increase in domestic production will produce significantly lower consumer prices – remember, tariffs reduce foreign competition that was keeping prices too low for domestic products to supposedly compete?
Doug R
@Matt McIrvin:
This is a mistake.
Blogs should be about hashing out differences of opinion and then working together.
Shutting off differences of opinion means we don’t talk to each other anymore and the community gets smaller and smaller.
That being said, I don’t mind blogs banning active trolls who argue in bad faith.
AND for the rest of us, if something someone said comes off the wrong way, remember you can easily misjudge tone from a keyboard.
John S.
@Doug R:
100%
TBone
@John S.: it turns out I was celebrating on the way to the supermarket, rocking out to WQSU college radio joyfully today! Also Noah ate some cat treats just now, yay!
But then Roberta Flack came on and I started crying. R.I.POWER ROBERTA! Hubby drove me slowly around the neighborhood as I caressed his face.
🎶😭
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=d8_fLu2yrP4
John S.
@TBone:
I know, that’s a huge loss. Roberta Flack was great. But in my Jewish way of thinking about death, it’s very hard to mourn someone who lived such a rich and full life. We should all be so lucky.
TBone
@John S.: shalom!
Barry
@A Ghost to Most: Buh-bye!
cain
@ArchTeryx:
I will probably owe because since 2017, Trump increased how much I pay. I used to get money back!
A lot of Trumpers also like getting money back when they find out they aren’t going to get any money back – they are going to lose their shit.
Not easy to blame that on Biden.
cain
@Matt McIrvin:
They won’t have enough people to do audits.
Sister Golden Bear
@cain:
I remember Kay talking about how there was an annual buying spree in her neck of the woods when people got their tax refunds. (They were in effect using the overpayments as a savings account they could only access once a year.) So if they can’t get their refunds, they won’t be buying stuff, which will widen the effects in ways that will be hard not to see. Hope all those Trumpers who own car dealerships are preprared….
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@cain:
Heh heh, never underestimate the power of propagandists like Faux “News” and the rest to do exactly that…and easily.
Goebbels got nothing on that crowd.
satby
@Ohio Mom: so sorry. Check IL and MI, they might have broader guidelines. Sympathy on the ML issue.
I can’t really move from IN either for a couple of years at least, but I intend to bug out after that. To a state that isn’t trying to make my life actively worse.
Kayla Rudbek
@glc: I still say that responding to those 5 bullet points is one of the few situations where it’s acceptable to use AI to generate your answers, so that Grok AI’s training data winds up as Habsburg AI (more inbred than the Spanish Hapsburgs).