very good thread on a different topic. but without knowing the characters you'd think glenn, nominally a journalist for one of the fox wannabe outfits, is another administration official here, brought in to attack Zelensky. Which is basically what happened.
— Josh Marshall (@joshtpm.bsky.social) February 28, 2025 at 11:33 PM
Derek Guy’s whole thread is worth sharing — here’s the main points:
Much of the commentary on Twitter surrounds whether Zelenskyy was disrespectful by not wearing a suit to the meeting. There are hundreds of tweets at this point, but I'm only showing one, which captures the MAGA sentiment.
— derek guy (@dieworkwear.bsky.social) February 28, 2025 at 8:00 PM
One reason why I think respectability is stupid is because it's often used as a mask. Such judgements are rarely about the clothes themselves, but more often about the bodies beneath them. To wit, no one raised an issue when Elon wore a graphic t-shirt and ball cap to meet the Trump cabinet.
— derek guy (@dieworkwear.bsky.social) February 28, 2025 at 8:01 PM
As a general matter, I also dislike the idea of respectability in dress because the concept is often unevenly applied. It bothered me to see Vance smirking during this moment, as he supposedly champions the forgotten working poor who are most often shamed because of these concepts.
— derek guy (@dieworkwear.bsky.social) February 28, 2025 at 8:01 PM
Just look at how we view hoodies. On Mark Zuckerberg, the hoodie is a symbol of whiz kid meritocracy breaking norms and developing the New Economy. On people like Trayvon Martin, the hoodie is sometimes seen as proof of criminality. Again, it's about the bodies beneath the clothes.
— derek guy (@dieworkwear.bsky.social) February 28, 2025 at 8:01 PM
FWIW, it's perhaps worth noting that when Benjamin Franklin visited France between 1776 and 1778 to ask for military support for the then-new-formed United States of America, he wore a coonskin cap. "Proper" French court attire at this time was a powdered wig.
— derek guy (@dieworkwear.bsky.social) February 28, 2025 at 8:00 PM
At the time, French elites were fascinated with the idea of a "backwoods philosopher," so Franklin strategically played up his "rustic" American roots. The coonskin cap, of course, was something of a symbol of the American frontier. And the trick worked: he charmed the French with his hat.
— derek guy (@dieworkwear.bsky.social) February 28, 2025 at 8:00 PM
OK, not a one-to-one comparison, as Americans have no fascination with the quarter-zips. But people who insist that Zelenskyy should have worn a suit should answer a very simple question. Would Trump and MAGA have a different position on Ukraine if Zelenskyy wore a suit this entire time?
— derek guy (@dieworkwear.bsky.social) February 28, 2025 at 8:01 PM
If you answer yes, then I think Trump and the MAGA movement is stupid. Matters of geopolitics should not be affected by issues of fashion.
If you answered no, then I think we agree that this is just a pretense. Trump's position on Ukraine is not about clothes. And MAGA follows whatever Trump says.— derek guy (@dieworkwear.bsky.social) February 28, 2025 at 8:00 PM
Zelenskyy's character can be judge more directly by how he treats others and whether you think he's protected his country. From what I've seen, he has treated Americans with respect. His attire is to remind people he's at war, not unlike Churchill wearing a siren suit to the White House in 1942.
— derek guy (@dieworkwear.bsky.social) February 28, 2025 at 8:00 PM
Anyway, those are my thoughts. You can choose to dress in certain ways to elicit certain reactions (e.g., perform respectability), but real respect is about more meaningful actions. Important to not conflate how you choose to dress with how you judge others. Dress respectability is Victorian ethics.
— derek guy (@dieworkwear.bsky.social) February 28, 2025 at 8:01 PM
Trump’s suits, of course, always look like he slept in them, probably at one of those sub-Motel-6 joints in a strip mall along an interstate highway. I’ve had bosses who insisted that all employees ‘look well groomed’ even while they themselves dressed like they were planning to clean out the garage. It’s purely a power play, usually by someone who secretly knows he’s not actually qualified for his paycheck.
Coda…
It bears pointing out that the nitwit who mentioned Zelensy’s attire is Marge Greene’s boyfriend, so we know he has the sense of a chunk of drywall.
— Christopher Nelson (@iamkanyetwitty.bsky.social) February 28, 2025 at 8:52 PM
YY_Sima Qian
derek guy is worth following in general, always witty in calling out the ridiculous in modern (or post-modern) men’s fashion, often driven by toxic masculinity.
Chetan Murthy
There’s a thing I remember being told in France in 1991: the writers of Le Monde assume that the readers are more-or-less up-to-date with the news so far, and they don’t report as if from a state of tabula rasa. Whereas in the US, it’s the the other way: reporters assume that their readers are stone idiots, imbeciles who were born yesterday.
This shitbird Glenn knows why Zelenskiyy dresses the way he does, and he’s fully aware that the controversy about it was hashed-out …. three goddamn years ago. He’s misleading his readers by reporting otherwise.
Rusty
Questions of dress and decorum are distractions when people want to avoid underlying issues of inequality and oppression. Thay our press would rise to the bait is just another sign of their failure. Freeing the Tates and bringing them to the US, abandoning any semblance of principles of supporting democracy or freedom by attacking Ukraine and all our allies, reveling in bigotry, abandoning the poor and sick to hunger and disease, I’ve never felt so embarrassed by my country.
TBone
Rumpy neighbor wife, who I am still good friends with because reasons, once texted me asking if hubby was still our neighborhood security system. Of course he is! Her reason for asking? “I JUST SAW SOMEONE IN A HOODIE WALKING DOWN THE STREET! I AM AFRAID!” I gently made fun of her that night while simultaneously reassuring her since her husband was out of town.
YY_Sima Qian
@Rusty: Dress is one of the main ways to enforce hierarchy.
YY_Sima Qian
@Chetan Murthy: He works for a propaganda outfit.
TBone
When the 2007 Financial Crisis hit, I wore a pinstriped, navy blue suitdress with a gold chain belt to the office. My boss took one look and LOLd. He was laughing all day.
On Thanksgiving, half day capped off by restaurant office party, I wore my full length brown suede coat with faux fur collar and lining, looking like Legends of the Fall. With a tradwife long dress.
I miss that attorney boss. He understood me. Both of us commie pinkos, as his bestie joked in an email to us.
YY_Sima Qian
The worry:
However, Transatlanticism is also a shared orientation in threat perceptions, arguably more so. That shared orientation has been shattered w/ most of the current mainstream European governments. However, the European far right shares the desire for an ethno-nationalist multipolar world system that nevertheless still advantages the West, so a Transatlantic reconciliation is still quite possible even on this basis.
JoyceH
Sort of tangential but I’ve watched too much news today and I’ve had it up to the back teeth with Republicans claiming that Trump is the one who can bring peace because he’s such an awesome deal maker. Well, actually he’s not. His signature move is to decide he wants a property come hell or high water, overpay for it, and then be unable to make a profit on his new property. When he opened the Trump Taj Mahal, his critics suggested his new casino would just cannibalize his other casino. No, Trump insisted, gamblers would respond by gambling more. But the critics were correct and both Trump’s casinos (and a lot of others) went bust. He didn’t just wreck his own casinos, he pretty much ruined them all.
Baud
He wore pants. What more do people want?
TBone
@JoyceH: I saw this guy at Trump’s Taj Mahal in Atlantic City before Donold’s first term. Up close and personal.
This anthem is amazing
m.youtube.com/watch?v=k03dsRUVbcQ
TBone
@Baud: 🎯🔥
Jeffg166
I think Zelensky did a great job with the ambush. Putin’s proxies not so much.
If anything this will help get Europe organized faster. They know they are on their own now.
satby
Love derek guy’s take (have followed him for a while now). And his thread just made me realize that Trayvon Martin is probably why comedian Josh Johnson’s signature performance attire is always in a hoodie. Everyone knows clothes are symbolic, that’s why the MAGAts wear their stupid little hats.
cmorenc
We are truly through the Looking Glass into upside-down-land when John Bolton has become a voice of reason as a critic of Trump and his SoS Marco Rubio.
cmorenc
We are truly through the Looking Glass in upside-down land when John Bolton has become a voice of Reason about American Foreign policy and a critic of a Republican Administration and Secretary of State.
Chetan Murthy
@cmorenc: Not disagreeing with you at all, but ….. haha and then there’s Bloody Bill Kristol. I’m not complainin’ about him, but geeez, if somebody had told me 20yr ago that i’d be on the same side, in the same foxhole ……
TBone
@cmorenc: I said the same thing to myself yesterday while giving him a few moments of my time. What the …
WereBear
@Baud: Women to be horsewhipped for wearing them.
eclare
@Rusty:
You and me both. And that’s before I saw this abhorrent questioning about a suit.
I wish Zelenskyy would have gone all Samuel L. Jackson on him. I wish I had a motherfucking suit…
Betty Cracker
@YY_Sima Qian: Great point about the European far right being a potential factor in all of this. I don’t know enough about the political situation there to assess the likelihood.
TBone
@WereBear: I have a fabulous 1930s or 40s b&w photo stolen because of the woman’s face while wearing pants to her Court hearing about wearing pants. Stone cold stoneface with laughing eyes. Defiance personified.
TBone
@Betty Cracker: copied from early morning thread where I glitched
I used to read about nonviolent communication when I was a pacifist, and received an email newsletter invitation to a seminar.
In Hungary.
My unsubscribe note contained a non-non-violent communication method.
WereBear l
It’s also a way for male bosses to require female employees to “dress professionally,” which had some variance due to personal choice…
WereBear l
@TBone: And this in the age of photography.
WereBear l
@TBone: You’re so lucky, every time I try to dress ironically it never seems to work for me.
TBone
@TBone: trying for points with Orban?
TBone
@WereBear: Keep trying, I say!
Princess
Trump wanted the mineral rights deal but Putin doesn’t want him to have the rights because Russia has plans for them. So Putin told him to scupper the deal and that’s what we saw. Or something close to the above. It’s all pretext. But now everyone knows who the US is at this moment so it was a useful teaching exercise.
WereBear
I have been in SUCH a true crime mood… but I don’t wonder why… it started when I saw girls my age getting murdered…
Self defense. I developed “hate-dar” to tell if I was looked at as a person. Or not.
WereBear
@cmorenc: Old school Republican.
He wants to dip his beak, not go to the mattresses.
MagdaInBlack
A commenter over at “Pharyngula” just used a term: “ConvenientVision.” It allows you to only see what you want to see and nothing else.
I think it’s a feature of the maga folks red hats.
TBone
Timothy Snyder:
snyder.substack.com/p/five-failures-in-the-oval-office
MagdaInBlack
@TBone: Zelenskyy was the only thing in that room that was not a failure .
TBone
@WereBear: we had many famous murders of girls in DelCo over my growing up years. One was a dear friend. That case led me to learn about immunity from prosecution as a very young teen. Of COURSE the white boy was immunized!
Hate-dar is a good thing to have.
TBone
@MagdaInBlack: 🎯🔥
You reminded me: I’m looking forward to today’s Tiedrich Treatment.
TBone
@TBone: I still wonder if Robert ever got paid for that gig.
TBone
@TBone: forgot a detail: I sang “Big Balls In Cowtown” to one of the partners in that coat! 😆
m.youtube.com/watch?v=FQXlVT0mmkI
That other partner was an elderly Italian gent, a cool breeze blowing through Dodge, who was “of counsel.”
TBone
Did I kill this thread already? Sorry!
Matt McIrvin
@MagdaInBlack: Everyone sees what they want to see to some extent. But there are disciplines that attempt to bring this under control. Science is one. They want to kill it.
MagdaInBlack
@Matt McIrvin: Yes indeed, we all wear the blinders of our choice. I just like the term with regard to the maga culture.
Baud
@Matt McIrvin:
Agreed.
The propagandists also are good at using social media to get people invested in the validity of their beliefs.
Jeffro
If you had told me in 2016 that in 2024, I’d be aligned with Liz Cheney, Mike Pence, and John Bolton on anything, much less foundational issues of democracy and government, I’d ask you to put down the hash pipe.
Professor Bigfoot
@TBone: This is how I know there are a few out there; and that alone keeps me– well, not quite sane, but away from a gibbering madness.
YY_Sima Qian
@Jeffro: We should keep in mind that Cheney, Pence & Bolton do not in fact believe in liberal democracy, all of them are committed neocons. They just think the MAGA brand of illiberal democracy will be fatally detrimental to US hegemony, and they are right.
Ohio Mom
@satby: What a smart observation — you are definitely right.
Paranoid Android
German satire website hits it on the head:
”Major security lapse: Two Russian agents gain access to the White House”
der-postillon.com/2025/03/sicherheitspanne-weisses-haus.html
Professor Bigfoot
@Jeffro: Woulda taken something more potent than hash to make me think THAT would happen.
And here we are!
TBone
@Professor Bigfoot: thank you! I drove most of them attorneys in Media nuts!
pajaro
@YY_Sima Qian:
Liz Cheney sacrificed her career to oppose Trumpism. Kristol is, for the moment not a Republican. The thing that all of us need to remember, constantly, is that our allies in this struggle are our allies. We need to treat them as allies, as long as the struggle is going on, which, in this case, is a minimum of the next four years.
There will be time in the future to remember that they had different views on any number of issues, and to oppose them. That future time, when we can go back to something resembling the ordinary disagreements that marked my life, seems like a fantasy right now. For the moment, we need each and every person who agrees with us on the danger posed by Trump and the need to oppose him.
Gin & Tonic
@Princess: No it wasn’t. No minds were changed. Nobody learned anything they didn’t already know.
NotMax
Repeated from downstairs.
“J.D. Vance is a piece of shit.”
Baud
@Gin & Tonic:
We knew before the election. I hope every American shedding tears for how things are now is Harris voter. I’m just sorry other countries have to pay the price, since they didn’t get a say.
Geminid
@cmorenc: John Bolton is a frequent guest on Saudi-based Al Arabiya’s English language television network, and he’s very critical of Trump. Al Arabiya features interviews with other former officials both US and European with similar views of Trump. I don’t watch the interviews but the posts on the network’s Twitter account summarize the salient points.
They’ll also bring in some ex-Trump officials like former ambassador Carla Sands , as well as media slut Lindsey Graham; but on balance that network is critical of Trump and his foreign policies.
The editors and journalists demonstrate plenty of awareness of US politics, and not just the foreign policy side either.
This interests me because Al Arabiya is owned by the Saudi government. Al Arabia is never, ever critical Saudi Arabia’s rulers or their foreign policies, but they seem to have tacit approval to criticize Trump and his.
eclare
@Baud:
I got a say, and I got fucked. Not in a good way.
Matt McIrvin
@Baud: I hope some of them are NOT Harris voters, because Harris lost and we need a bigger constituency than that to move forward, whether by votes or any other way. If everyone who voted for Trump thinks that what’s going on now is fine, we’re stuck.
Baud
@Geminid:
Like
TBone
@Gin & Tonic: hard disagree but I can’t say more because NotMax’s video just raised my blood pressure and I want this party to stay polite today. So I’ll say I respectfully disagree.
TBone
@eclare: did you get a kiss first? Me neither.
WereBear
@YY_Sima Qian: But under tRump, no one gets what they want!
They
Are
Slow
Learners
And completely untrustworthy.
Baud
@Matt McIrvin:
I suppose it depends if you’re going to be hopeful or pessimistic.that people will learn not to take us for granted.
YY_Sima Qian
More fallout from the sorry spectacle at the WH:
After more than a decade of prevarication, the Vietnamese government finally decided a couple weeks ago to proceed w/ a US$ 6+B project to build a standard gauge railway linking Kunming in the PRC to Hanoi, taking out Chinese loans & using Chinese technology to do so. This railway could eventually link up w/ PRC financed & built railways in Laos, Thailand & Malaysia, forming SE Asian part of the the pan continental Asian network envisioned by the PRC government back in the mid-’10s.
Like I said before, decades are happening in these few weeks, & the pace appears to be accelerating.
Princess
@Gin & Tonic: I’m seeing a lot of reaction from my normie world I haven’t seen before. Maybe they didn’t change their minds precisely but I see a new sense that this can’t be ignored.
TBone
@YY_Sima Qian: Jiminy Cricket
Suzanne
Derek Guy is on of the best people on the internet right now. Great thoughts about clothes, of course, but a great deal about their semiotics and imagecraft, some fantastic asides about walkable, affordable cities, and just top-tier snark.
Princess
@YY_Sima Qian: Thus is exactly the kind of shift in pov and action I’m talking about. I see it in Canada too.
YY_Sima Qian
@pajaro: I am not suggesting that the anti-Fascist coalition should reject working w/ such elements on a tactical basis to fight against MAGA, we need to leverage every bit of anti-MAGA force available, but they should be seen as co-belligerents, not allies. Even as allies, they are the USSR in WW II kind, at best.
NotMax
@TBone
Rascality to engender a more placid temperament.
;)
YY_Sima Qian
@Suzanne: The snark is what I like the best about derek guy.
Baud
@Princess:
America’s power is tied to liberal power Reagan convinced people of the opposite, and now we’re going to pay the price.
p.a.
Right now, as long as the Euro Right pumped up by Putin and tRump can be contained, Ukraine has breathing space. If other gvts go the way of Hungary, US, maybe Romania, well, obviously not good.
I also wonder if Europe/the functional NATO nations maintain liberal control and continue aid to Ukraine, and Germany flexes its muscles more, whether other nations might get a bit jittery. Long memories in Europe. But that’s projecting waaayyyy ahead.
YY_Sima Qian
@TBone: Sorry, I am not quite getting this reference.
stinger
My reactions to the criticism:
Derek Guy adds great historical context.
TBone
Happy Womens History Month, everybody!
YY_Sima Qian
@Princess: Vietnam (& any country in the world) would want to maintain “sound” ties w/ the US, but I’m not sure MAGA will let it.
Vietnam has been the top beneficiary of the Sino-US trade/tech wars to day, becoming a maintain conduit for PRC made goods & components to enter the US market, via transshipment, relabelling & final assembly. There is every indication that Vietnam will come under intense scrutiny as the Trump gang seek to economically de-couple from the PRC & re-shore manufacturing. However, Vietnam is far too integrated w/ the PRC centric supply chain, & PRC investment & tech transfer far too important to Vietnam’s developmental goals (see the new rail project), for Vietnam to choose the US over the PRC.
TBone
@YY_Sima Qian: it is a “my better angel” Disney character, and my way of taking the Lord’s name in vain when I am…perplexed and annoyed and frustrated and want to cuss.
YY_Sima Qian
@TBone: Ah, got it.
TBone
@NotMax: thank you ever so! It is now 44 degrees and sunshine and it is the last day of False Spring here, on the first day of calendular Spring!
NotMax
@TBone
Pace Mr. Fields: “Godfrey Daniel!”
TBone
@NotMax: HA! William Powell love! I watched him last night in Life with Father.
My reward by Al Go Rhythm
The Young Rascals “How Can I Be Sure?” on The Ed Sullivan Show
I might not be making much sense, just trust me
Bruce K in ATH-GR
@pajaro: Yeah. Remember Churchill on Stalin: “if Hitler invaded Hell, I would give the Devil the courtesy of a hearing in the House of Commons.“
Geminid
@TBone: Happy Women’s History Month to you!
And, Rabbit Rabit!
eclare
Great photo, WaterGirl. I love elephants.
TBone
@Geminid: I am not on my dumbphone today so you are all spared some “emotional” trauma ha ha ha!
I also cannot use my search tool properly today GAH. Oh, there it is, I found it down the rabid hole!
ETA thank you, my manners just kicked in again.
Suzanne
@stinger: Another thing I noted yesterday: JD Vance is still wearing makeup. I watched the Zelensky exchange and Vance’s eyeliner is obvious.
TBone
@Suzanne: J. Dogebag Vince
NeenerNeener
@Suzanne: JD Vance looks like Poppin Fresh with a beard. And a scowl. Once you see it you can’t unsee it. He’s ruined Pillsbury ads for me.
YY_Sima Qian
@Bruce K in ATH-GR: Yes, but Never Trumpers don’t bring nearly as much to the table in the fight against MAGA, as the USSR did against Nazi Germany & its E. European allies, & eventually Imperial Japan. Churchill was also among the earliest proponents of a Cold War against the USSR even before WW II had fully wound down.
TBone
like only Janis can
Janis Joplin “Maybe” on The Ed Sullivan Show – YouTube
Baud
@Suzanne:
Too bad we can’t make fun of people in drag because of all the innocents.
rikyrah
Good Morning, Everyone😊😊😊
Baud
@rikyrah:
Good morning.
stinger
@Suzanne:
Yes!
TBone
Serenade for MAGA snowflakes
Janis Joplin – Cry Baby (Live
“What am I doing in Casablanca?”
Suzanne
@NeenerNeener: The beard is to cover the weak chin.
Why do white supremacists always have weak chins?! They need to intermix with some Italians — there’s a reason we had fun with Luigi memes — but I know we’re a little swarthy for them.
Baud
@Bruce K in ATH-GR:
Saw a photo of the protest in Greece. Massive.
MagdaInBlack
@Suzanne: Last night in my quest for diversion from the day, I stumbled upon a youtuber, Tyler Bender, doing a half hour dish on the many baby mamas of Elon musk. It was the kind of lunacy with substance I needed and I somehow thought you might enjoy the dish. I get she may not be to everyone’s taste, but she made me laugh.
youtube.com/watch?v=a1rw7om0CB8&t=139s
p.s. shes a horrible cook, and curses aplenty.
Baud
@Suzanne:
Weak chins = weak souls
prostratedragon
Straddling Black History and Women’s History months:
The “Six Triple Eight” Proved That No Role Was Too Small During World War II
The picture at the top was taken in Rouens after VE Day, when the unit marched in tribute to Joan of Arc.
Matt McIrvin
@Baud: The right’s concept of foreign policy is the same as their concept of domestic policy, which is the same as their approach to raising children: cruelty, brute force and uncertainty are the elements of “strength” and the fear they establish is “respect”.
But it’s a contemptuous fear. Children raised this way learn to think in terms of what they can or cannot get away with. And some of them eventually become bullies themselves. It’s not the way you get cooperation from the world either.
Jackie
Apparently someone said something to FFOTUS last night: In an overnight rant on his social media, FFOTUS ranted about how unfairly Pete Rose was treated by MLB, and will be pardoning him “in the near future.”
FFOTUS only cares about cheaters – like himself.
TBone
@MagdaInBlack: right up my alley cat
Suzanne
@MagdaInBlack:
Perfect. Exactly what I need.
I will watch it later when there are no kids around, LOL.
MagdaInBlack
@Jackie: That should help bring the price of eggs down.
TBone
@prostratedragon: excellence, as always!
TBone
@Jackie: Pete had a home near where I used to live. He was a jackass in the Bam Margera sense. Whose crew also had a place nearby.
Spanky
@Jackie: Oh! Good news! This must mean we’ll all get pardoned for cheating on our taxes too!
Suzanne
I’m going to try to manifest Spring tomorrow by making pasta salad.
different-church-lady
It’s not about the bodies beneath the clothes; it’s about the brain that controls the mouth flapping about the clothes.
WereBear
It was one thing when mere citizens were having their lives ground to sausage.
But foreign policy and the Dow? Now we’re talking threats to something of value.
MagdaInBlack
@WereBear: Oh, you noticed that too?
Professor Bigfoot
@YY_Sima Qian: Exactly this.
We should Lend-Lease them a lot of Studebaker trucks, but never TRUST them.
I honor the Cheney’s commitment to the Constitution, but I don’t TRUST them one iota. They’re still conservatives.
Baud
@Matt McIrvin:
Agreed. But Trump’s power internationally is derivative of America’s power, and America’s power is largely a result of 20th Century liberalism. Trump is drawing down from our bank account.
Jackie
@Spanky:
Of course! That’s the real reason Muskrat’s firing all IRS employees; no more audits for the masses!
YY_Sima Qian
I think it would benefit Americans to appreciate the parallels of what is happening in the US right now & what has happened in the ROW. The US is not exceptional, its problems are not exceptional, & the solutions are not, either:
While state capture is not new to the neoliberal economics in the US, the degree seen right now probably has few precedents. Sinologists have drawn the parallel between disruption to USG caused by DOGE & Mao launching the Great Proletarian Cultural Revolution to disrupt the CPC nomenklatura, & Sovietologists have drawn the parallel between DOGE’s actions & dismantling of the administrative state via Gorbachev’s glasnost & the stripping of state/public owned assets by former Communist apparatchiks during “Shock Therapy”. South Africa post-Mandela is a “good” one, too.
Spanky
@Baud: Just out of curiosity, has there been any mention of what’s happening with military recruitment? Any collapse on the numbers? Or are all the nascent nazis jumping at the chance to hurt somebody?
daize
@Jackie:
There’s also the statutory rape allegation. Which is another disturbing tie-in.
Baud
@Spanky:
I heard numbers were down even before Trump. I haven’t heard anything recent.
Gvg
@WereBear l: until I was 40 or so, I looked less than 20. I found it advantageous to dress professionally so that people understood I was an authority, not one of the students. I did not blame people though. I really did look and sound very young. Luck of genetics can be mixed. Now I don’t have to worry about that. My younger body also didn’t think those clothes were uncomfortable. Compared to non college food service jobs, professional dress in air conditioned offices seemed just fine. They also came with health insurance benefits. When you meet the public, you need to control their perceptions quickly, in order to be efficient with your time.
Womens high heels need to go out of fashion though. Damaging to feet you pay for decades later.
These days I am more of a paper pusher, computer monitor person with an aging body so comfort is more important. The death of the local mall is a problem. Trying on clothes is harder, there are fewer choices in a small town. Internet shopping means buying the same thing again. I have lost significant weight and need to go shopping. Not looking forward to it.
this era of republicans are so tiresome. Stupid people repeating such stupid attacks that it is hard to even respond. It ought to be sufficient to say “don’t be so childish and superficial, you already know why Zelenskyy doesn’t wear a suit. “
tobie
@stinger: Not only did Musk wear a baseball cap in the Oval Office. He also wore a t-shirt under his long coat (not a suit jacket) and his son picked his nose at the Resolute Desk. It is truly a sight for sore eyes to see how Republicans are able to manufacture outrage in their base. The common thread in all their complaints is that they/we are being disrespected. At least when Rodney Dangerfield said, “I don’t get no respect,” it was a joke.
MagdaInBlack
@TBone: I thought it might be =-)
bbleh
Oh FFS, all this noise about how Zelenskyy dressed is the WORST sort of media sideshow. It’s a non-issue, while the REAL issue — the collapse not just of US strategy but of US trustworthiness for a GENERATION — is being all but ignored (at least in the US).
And yes, it’s easy to “sell,” and the MAGAts are screaming about it — shades of the Tan Suit — because it’s all they’ve got, so the media head for it like moths to a flame. But what a waste of pixels …
Wyliecoat
@Princess: this
Gin & Tonic
Putin wants Trump to give him Ukraine. Zelensky said “not on my watch.” So Trump’s burning desire for a Nobel Peace Prize went in the toilet, and he threw a tantrum. End of story.
The Thin Black Duke
@Gin & Tonic: We just witnessed the twilight of the American Empire. I hope the cheaper eggs were worth it.
dc
@TBone: Statistically, her husband is more of a danger to her than some random guy walking down the street.
NeenerNeener
Richard Grenell has a post on Xhitter implying that Zelensky is unpopular in Ukraine by comparing him to Meghan Markle in the UK. And the MAGA Nazis and bots are, of course, upvoting it.
Gin & Tonic
@NeenerNeener: Grenell, who pressured Romania into releasing the odious Tate brothers?
He should note that Zelensky is more popular in Ukraine than Trump is in the US.
patrick II
He still have made a giant mistake and worn a tan suit.
Elizabelle
@Gin & Tonic: I disagree. Maybe our minds were not changed, but we have been following the news.
I think a lot of Fox World may have been shocked. Also heard that host Brett Baier was courteous to Zelenskyy (haven’t watched the interview from last night myself).
A lot of MAGAts voted to own the libs, for lower taxes, or out of magical thinking (back to the pre-Covid world). They may not have voted to support Putin, or Musk, or DOGE. Especially when it might blow back very badly on themselves and their kids.
Ohio Mom
@Suzanne: It’s not that JD wears makeup for me — as a public figure, he’s on camera a lot and I wouldn’t be surprised if other male politicians wore concealer or other makeup — it’s that it’s applied clumsily and is stupid looking.
If a woman wore her eyeliner that way, I’d feel the same, Go somewhere and get a lesson on doing it right.
Of course, the irony of Vance wearing drag on his eyes is a statement in itself.
Ohio Mom
@Jackie: Cincinnati named a street after Pete Rose before it was obvious that was a bad idea. Wait until someone is dead, just to make sure you are not making a mistake.
trollhattan
Overnight international news I listened to focused on Trump’s performative ambush and underbusing of Zelensky, while still carving out time to highlight our embrace of measles. We would be a sidebar laughingstock if this weren’t so dangerous to the globe as a whole.
TBone
@dc: I sent her a Calvin & Hobbes photo meme where they’re making scary faces and you are correct!
bbleh
@Elizabelle: I agree — I think this likely was eye-opening for many who have been living more or less under a rock. The question now is, which way will they jump, and how many? How many will just crawl back under their rocks? How many will be persuaded by the (tellingly noisy) effort of the MAGA-herders to rally them behind Their Leader and his Righteous Anger at being so dreadfully sartorially disrespected? And how many will start to murmur quiet questions among themselves?
We don’t need many …
Soprano2
I like Derek Guy, his takes are always interesting. I do believe the way you appear influences what people think about you. Our boss doesn’t dress like one and honestly it kind of bothers me. I don’t think suits are necessary, but I think sloppy shorts on the boss in an office are cringe-inducing. I think people who work in offices should look neat, not like they’re watching a football game at home. Work dress should be appropriate for the job. I’m old…..
Kayla Rudbek
@YY_Sima Qian: yeah, going all the way back to sumptuary laws and the Roman Caesars wearing purple, if not before then (probably when humans first started wearing clothing).
Kayla Rudbek
@satby: once you get past sanitation and protection from the elements (or other safety concerns) all clothing is a costume
cw moss
@Suzanne: I’m way late to this thread, but YES re Derek Guy. He does this through attire the way The Last Psychiatrist does (or used to, anyway) through psychoanalytic concepts. Equally incisive and entertaining and humane.
NotoriousJRT
@Chetan Murthy: Misleading the “readers” (he’s glenntv afterall) is the primary feature of these grifters. It is not in any way a bug.