Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Someone should tell Republicans that violence is the last refuge of the incompetent, or possibly the first.

Oppose, oppose, oppose. do not congratulate. this is not business as usual.

We can show the world that autocracy can be defeated.

Rupert, come get your orange boy, you petrified old dinosaur turd.

Republicans do not trust women.

Republicans don’t want a speaker to lead them; they want a hostage.

Never give a known liar the benefit of the doubt.

He wakes up lying, and he lies all day.

People really shouldn’t expect the government to help after they watched the GOP drown it in a bathtub.

“Jesus paying for the sins of everyone is an insult to those who paid for their own sins.”

if you can’t see it, then you are useless in the fight to stop it.

Is it negotiation when the other party actually wants to shoot the hostage?

It’s pointless to bring up problems that can only be solved with a time machine.

Jesus, Mary, & Joseph how is that election even close?

This isn’t Democrats spending madly. This is government catching up.

No offense, but this thread hasn’t been about you for quite a while.

🎶 Those boots were made for mockin’ 🎵

Wow, you are pre-disappointed. How surprising.

Republicans are radicals, not conservatives.

The arc of history bends toward the same old fuckery.

“woke” is the new caravan.

Hey hey, RFK, how many kids did you kill today?

When we show up, we win.

Washington Post Catch and Kill, not noticeably better than the Enquirer’s.

You are here: Home / Democratic Response to Trump 2.0 / Tuesday Morning Open Thread: The Way We Live Now

Tuesday Morning Open Thread: The Way We Live Now

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Protest the offices & homes of everyone who attends.

[image or embed]

— Dana Houle (@danahoule.bsky.social) April 7, 2025 at 12:09 PM

Cowards, ‘reporting’ on courtiers — ‘Trump to hold “pep rally” for House Republicans and big donors Tuesday’:

President Trump is planning to attend the National Republican Congressional Committee’s big donor event Tuesday night, on the eve of a consequential House vote on the budget package that passed the Senate Saturday.

Why it matters: Expect something between “pep rally” and pressure campaign, sources tell Axios.

– Trump will try to persuade GOP lawmakers to take the next step on getting his “one big, beautiful bill” passed into law. A vote is planned for Wednesday on the budget resolution.

– But his appearance at the National Building Museum also will come amid growing concern among lawmakers and donors about the market meltdown Trump’s tariffs have caused.

Zoom out: House Speaker Mike Johnson (R-La.) faces another challenging week. Some of his fellow Republicans used a Sunday conference call to raise concerns about the Senate budget resolution, which doesn’t call for cuts as deep as many conservative lawmakers would like…

Zoom in: The entire GOP leadership is expected to attend, along with rank-and-file members, big dollar donors from out of town and DC-based lobbyists.

The House is planning to vote on the budget resolution on Wednesday before Congress leaves time for the Passover and Easter recess.


Shit’s gonna get real when Republican Senators & Representatives start seeing protestors outside of their houses.

— Dana Houle (@danahoule.bsky.social) April 6, 2025 at 9:37 PM

Remember when Kirstjen Nielsen couldn’t go out in DC without being harassed?

— Dana Houle (@danahoule.bsky.social) April 7, 2025 at 4:28 PM

Reader Interactions

206Comments

  1. 1.

    Baud

    We have to give the president space.

    Let’s compromise and send him into space. He can join Musk on his Mars adventure.

  5. 5.

    VeniceRiley

    On April 17th the U.S. Trade Representative’s office is expected to impose fees of up to $1.5M per port call for ships made in China and for $500k to $1M if the ocean carrier owns a single ship made in China or even has one on order from a Chinese shipyard. 🧵 1/

    https://x.com/typesfast/status/1909362292367802840?t=qXyoell15xhXib0sEPFyfw&s=19

    It’s about to get way worse. The US simply doesn’t have the shipyards to make up the shortfall. Please read the thread

    (X, I know. But important!)

  6. 6.

    sab

    The Republicans running the Ohio state legislature want to defund our public libraries. My county’s library system already has a new library bond issue on the May ballot. Apparently this was no surprise to them.

  7. 7.

    Chief Oshkosh

    @Baud: Is a 4×6 cell enough space?

    And Johnson would be sent to clean the toilet and freshen up the place — he’s used to it.

  8. 8.

    MagdaInBlack

    I’ve unlocked a whole different level of depression over this. I call it the “wtf do we/ I do now ?” level.

  9. 9.

    Soapdish

    A few billion in market plunges here, a few billion in market plunges there, and pretty soon you’re talking about some real money.

  13. 13.

    MagdaInBlack

    @Baud: John Pavlovitz, on his FB feed, is calling trump ” St. Upid ; the patron saint of economic collapse.”

    Made me laugh, bitterly, but a laugh none the less.

  14. 14.

    mrmoshpotato

    Analysis by Aaron Blake: Amid a stock market-busting tariff gambit that has cost many of them substantial wealth, some of President Trump’s the fascist, orange, conman’s most prominent billionaire backers and others who entertained his tariffs because they are morons are breaking with him in a major way pissed that the stock market crash caused by the orange conman also fucked over their portfolios.

    Fixed.

  16. 16.

    p.a.

    Having bitter fun mocking the red hat cargo cultists (h/t J Cole) on fbook and their “but now is the time to buy!” comments.

  17. 17.

    What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?

    I bet when even now and even after several more months of this, if polled on who they trust more on the economy a substantial majority of US voters would say Trump. Because he’s a “successful business man”.

  18. 18.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    @VeniceRiley:

    Promoting US ship building is a good idea. Just crippling our economy to do it is not.

    That’s from the thread and pretty much says it all.

    Of course US domestic shipbuilding (of the non-military kind) has been drastically small for a long time.

    Another piece highlighting how what Hair Furor is proposing will backfire:

    https://www.scmp.com/opinion/world-opinion/article/3304779/trumps-plan-port-fees-chinese-made-ships-wont-save-us-shipyards

  24. 24.

    Baud

    @Matt McIrvin:

    I hate when people give Dems messaging advice, but I wouldn’t mind seeing the message “You can’t trust Republicans with your money” getting out there.

  28. 28.

    Betty Cracker

    Currently watching three male Ruby-Throated Hummingbirds fight for control of a new feeder we hung just off the river-facing porch. Amazing aerobatics accompanied by furious record-scratch vocalizations!

    We seem to have more hummies than usual this year, judging from the volume of nectar consumed. At first I thought it was two birds involved in this particular struggle, but for a few seconds, I could see two perched on the feeder, then a third zoomed it to kick off another round of the battle.

  29. 29.

    Nukular Biskits

    WRT to that first Dana Houle post:

    Shit’s gonna get real when Republican Senators & Representatives start seeing protestors outside of their houses.

    I 100% agree.

    And many of you may disagree with this (and I’d understand your point) but I think the home addresses (and those of their “vacay homes”, etc) of each of these Republicans should be made public.

    I don’t know how it is for the rest of y’all but my Republican congressional delegation views their respective constituents either with contempt and/or fear, refusing to engage with any of us except under circumstances where they control the forum and the narrative.

  30. 30.

    Baud

    The reddit propagandists are trying to spread their “woe is us” attitude to young people in the hopes of killing their will to fight Republicans.

    Of course, one problem is that we wouldn’t be in this mess if more young men had voted for their wallet instead of for their penises.

  31. 31.

    Nukular Biskits

    @VeniceRiley:

    It’s about to get way worse. The US simply doesn’t have the shipyards to make up the shortfall. Please read the thread

    I can’t speak to commercial shipbuilding but I know for a fact naval shipbuilding is way behind, over budget and delivering crap ships.  And Senate Armed Service Chairman Roger Wicker (R-MS) wants to throw more money at those shipyards which can’t even deliver what they already are contracted to deliver.

  32. 32.

    Geminid

    @Nukular Biskits: From what I’ve seen, protests at politicians’ homes cut both ways with public opinion. I’m not saying people shouldn’t stage them, but they would do well to keep in mind that they could be generating sympathy for the politician, even among people who do not share the office holder’s political views.

  33. 33.

    JML

    How long do you think the “all these protestors are paid by Soros” excuse will hold? It has all the hallmarks of the eternal GOP complaint: it plays to grievance, there’s elements of bigotry in it, it’s difficult to disprove (applying logic does it nicely, but we know how that works on the MAGA)…

    GOP congressional strategy is to hide from the voters as much as possible; I’m sure the TV coverage if people start protesting at their residences will be “How dare the plebes bother us at our homes!”

  37. 37.

    Spanky

    @Betty Cracker: This is the correct response to all of the shit that we have no control over.

    It’s blowing pretty good out there and the temp is only 38 atm, or else I’d be out there watching the goings on at our feeders.

  39. 39.

    Nukular Biskits

    @Geminid:

    Understood and I think that’s a valid point, particularly given the lazy ass media I have here in MS.

    But … they refuse to hold town halls, they refuse to answer the phones, they refuse to respond to letters/emails …

    The list goes on.

    The real solution is to vote them out of office but, as cynical as this may sound, that’s not a realistic threat in red states like MS.

  40. 40.

    trnc

    @mappy!: Yesterday’s supermarket excursion, a dozen eggs new high, $11.99.

    Just under $5 here in central NC for a standard dozen of large or jumbo. Are you in a metropolis?

  43. 43.

    Geminid

    @Nukular Biskits: I think the town halls Democrats are staging in the those shy Republicans’ districts are effective. I saw coverage of one in Rep. Roy’s district; just the picture of a Democrat speaking next to a cardboard Chip Roy said a lot.

  45. 45.

    trnc

    @JML: ​
     

    How long do you think the “all these protestors are paid by Soros” excuse will hold?

    Forever, because there’s no disincentive to believe it. I expect most republicans to stick with it even after they start acknowledging some of the problems caused by the tariff insanity.

  48. 48.

    lowtechcyclist

    @JML:

    How long do you think the “all these protestors are paid by Soros” excuse will hold?

    It’s been hanging in there for 20 years.  I remember jokes on Atrios back in the Dubya era about how the Soros checks hadn’t arrived yet.

  50. 50.

    trnc

    @Geminid: ​
     

    I think the town halls Democrats are staging in the those shy Republicans’ districts are effective. I saw coverage of one in Rep. Roy’s district; just the picture of a Democrat speaking next to a cardboard Chip Roy said a lot.

    That’s good to see.

  51. 51.

    p.a.

    @trnc: It’s more than 27% that are effectively “information proof.”

    Congrats Fox & hate radio.  How’s it working out for THEIR stocks?

  52. 52.

    trnc

    @Baud: You don’t need a town hall to know their skin color.

    If red state reps are just going to disappear from public, maybe the DNC should start sending out press releases with “color adjustments” of them. After all, repubs did that with Obama.

  53. 53.

    YY_Sima Qian

    @Nukular Biskits: To your point (gift link to WSJ article below):

    The Warship That Shows Why the U.S. Navy Is Falling Behind China
    A blizzard of design changes by the military have put production of the USS Constellation years behind schedule and millions over budget. Labor shortages, old equipment and rising steel costs aren’t helping the industry.
    By Alistair MacDonald and Gordon Lubold
    March 20, 2025 at 9:00 pm ET

    A mere example of the completely broken weapons procurement system in the US, that has only served to keep the US MIC fat & lazy.

  54. 54.

    Matt McIrvin

    @JML: I think only the most committed of MAGA idiots actually believe the “paid protesters” stuff. Most of them are just saying it as an automatic trolling response. It’s hard to sustain when the protesters are your actual neighbors gathering on Main Street in your town.

  55. 55.

    Baud

    @Matt McIrvin:

    Yeah, the bigger problem is that people don’t care about the lies. They just see it as part of the game.

    Of course, what happens when you don’t call out lies is that, over time, the lies borrow into your lizard brain. It’s why the collective right wing mind has fallen since Reagan.

  56. 56.

    trnc

    @p.a.: Congrats Fox & hate radio. How’s it working out for THEIR stocks?

    They’ll recover, and I assume the big wigs have diversified investments, some of which can be shorted.

  57. 57.

    mappy!

    @trnc: Metropolis? No. The supermarket (nearest) is in what could charitably be called Suburban/Rural. The chain is known for high prices and in this case is the only game in town (8mi for me, next nearest for me is 13mi, nearest competitor 15mi).

    The carton prices seemed to be hovering around $7.99-$9.99 for the past few weeks. The $11.99 would be a new observed high for me. The Co-op prices are better than this, but still in the $8.99 range (non organic ; – )

    Interesting town (with the supermarket), usually a predictable solid dark red blot on the voting landscape, went almost two-to-one for Harris.

  58. 58.

    prostratedragon

    @Baud:  Part of the importance of art, including good pop art, is to help one find and clean out those little nests.

  59. 59.

    Nukular Biskits

    @Geminid:

    Oh, I think that’s a good idea as well and I’d really like to see that happen as well (Cue the “Be the change you want to see” mantra in 3, 2, 1 …).

    You’re presuming that local media would cover it.  I’m not convinced.

    For example, the local TV station (WLOX) had several stories, including one on the march in Gulfport Saturday. The local mullet wrapper (The Sun Herald), however, has not a single mention.

  60. 60.

    Another Scott

    @YY_Sima Qian: OTOH, …

    This stuff isn’t easy.

    The US military (USM) wants to reduce the number of people needed to run these things.  The USM wants dominance in any potential conflict.  The USM wants decades of longevity.  The USM wants lean, efficient production systems.  The USM wants new technologies fielded as quickly as possible.  The USM wants secure, robust, domestic production with surge capability.  The USM wants minimal spares and storage to reduce present-day costs.  The USM has a wishlist about 3x as large as their budget.  The USM has facilities that have tens of billions of dollars and decades in needed maintenance and upgrade backlogs.  The USM has responsibilities decreed by Congress – they have to find ways to complete the missions even when they don’t have enough people, equipment, etc. (witness the ship collisions a few years ago).

    And the USM has to justify its budget every year, even for programs that take decades, even when administration policies whipsaw back and forth.

    It’s not all just greedy defense contractors or greedy generals wanting to put all the rest of us out on ice floes.  Though there certainly is some of that, especially compared to other parts of government…

    FWIW.

    Best wishes,
    Scott.

  63. 63.

    trnc

    @Matt McIrvin: I think only the most committed of MAGA idiots actually believe the “paid protesters” stuff. Most of them are just saying it as an automatic trolling response. It’s hard to sustain when the protesters are your actual neighbors gathering on Main Street in your town.

    How many people does that apply to, though? The number of repubs who see and recognize even 50% of the protesters in their town is probably a statistical blip, and I would expect that most repubs aren’t scanning the crowds to begin with because that might endanger their sense that the protests aren’t real. That is not hyperbole.

  64. 64.

    trnc

    @mappy!: ​
     

    The chain is known for high prices and in this case is the only game in town (8mi for me, next nearest for me is 13mi, nearest competitor 15mi).

    Ah, OK. Practically a food desert. I have 3 grocery stores within 2 miles and 2 more just a few more miles out.

    Interesting town (with the supermarket), usually a predictable solid dark red blot on the voting landscape, went almost two-to-one for Harris.

    Cool! Also, Arrrrrrrgh!

  65. 65.

    Nelle

    @Nukular Biskits: Oddly enough, I’m getting substantive responses from Grassley’s office.  A lengthy on on DRC, Rwanda, and rare earth minerals (about four intelligent paragraphs) and about five paragraphs on Social Security.  Some staffer has taken me on.  Ernst never responds.  Used to have good responses from Congressman Nunn (he went to Kiev and also sponsored the bill funding Ukraine.  Called me at home to discuss it.)

    I call a lot.  Several times a week.  I do the chatty grandmother thing with staffers.  I also share stories about my father growing up in Ukraine, about my sister living in Kinshasa.  I’m courteous to the staffers, always, trying to establish a personal connection with them.  That said, I don’t expect much.  I just keep courteously pushing and pushing and pushing.  Raindrops on rocks.

  69. 69.

    There go two miscreants

    The entire GOP leadership is expected to attend, along with rank-and-file members, big dollar donors from out of town and DC-based lobbyists.

    If I were a praying person I’d pray for the giant meteor, but God has such bad aim.

  70. 70.

    Nukular Biskits

    @Nelle:

    I’ll get replies to emails (meaning, something submitted via the official congressional webpage) from Senator Wicker, although they almost always are boilerplate, ending with something along the lines of “I will keep your concerns in mind …”. Which is absolute bullshit.

    I have NEVER received a response from Senator Hyde-Smith. Ever. And it is her offices throughout the state that seem to never have time to answer the phone, something that started around 20JAN this year, strangely.

    As for my US Rep, Mike Ezell, the only response I’ve had from his office is an automated one received two weeks ago in response to something submitted via his official webpage.  That is the first and only one I have from him.

  75. 75.

    UncleEbeneezer

    @JML: It’s funny how often people point to some sort of Jewish conspiracy theory and puppet-master, whenever someone disagrees with them.  Palestinians in Gaza have been protesting Hamas and demanding they surrender to end the war and give up power.  Of course the response of Hamas (in addition to killing one of the protest leaders, creating “death lists” of protestors and threatening anyone who speaks out with deadly violence) was to accuse them all of being Israeli operatives.

    Egyptian peace activist Dalia Ziada was forced to flee her country and is having her citizenship possibly revoked and accused of being an Israeli spy simply for condemning Hamas’ 10/7 massacre and calling for peace in the region.

    And I’ve seen firsthand, countless examples of similar smears against anyone who advocates for any form of two-state solution both online and in campus protests.  Sadly it’s the logical endpoint of the BDS movement and the Soviet, Anti-Zionist propaganda that was happily ingested by the Global Left for the past fifty+ years.

    • Wrong-think on any issue gets you branded by Republicans and Nazis as an agent of (((George Soros))).

    • Wrong-think on I/P gets you branded by Progressives as an agent of some global, Zionist conspiracy (and also (((George Soros)))).

    The parallels/overlap are deeply disturbing.

  76. 76.

    RevRick

    @Ramalama: Unless they engaged in massive short-selling, they are losing like everybody else. And since they backed Trump that means they didn’t believe he’d really do tariffs, except as a ploy.
    And it’s hard to buy on the dip when you don’t know where the bottom is.

  77. 77.

    YY_Sima Qian

    @Nelle: Supposedly, the DRC is trying to reach a minerals for securities deal w/ the US to contain the eastern rebels that are Rwandan proxies, because the PRC & other powers have declined to do so. Biden also did commit US investment to refurbish the so called Lobito Corridor railways to ferry Congolese minerals to the Angolan coast to be exported.

    However, doubtful that MAGA will come through for the DRC in the end, at most PMCs on US payroll would secure the mines & leave everything else to anarchy. A big issue is that Cobalt, of which the DRC has the largest reserves in the world, may no longer be a key material for batteries of the future. LFP batteries have advantages in safety, life, charging curve & cost, compared to (Li-)NCM batteries,  & its energy density (where NCM batteries have the advantage) has been improving rapidly. Sodium ion batteries do not need cobalt, either, & the tremendous coming demand for BESS will likely be served by the even cheaper sodium batteries. Neither does solid state batteries.

    The DRC is also well endowed with/ copper, but that is a much more widely available metal.

  78. 78.

    Melancholy Jaques

    @Matt McIrvin:

    Even before he crashed the market, 52% disapproved of Trump’s handling of the economy & his plan for tariffs, the same one he blabbered about all during the campaign.

    So please, pundits & everyone else, don’t ever tell me again that Democrats lost because of “the economy.”

  79. 79.

    Melancholy Jaques

    @Baud:

    I hate when people give Dems messaging advice, but I wouldn’t mind seeing the message “You can’t trust Republicans with your money” getting out there.

    I am pretty sure that one’s been tried a couple times, but people won’t believe it.

  81. 81.

    Melancholy Jaques

    @lowtechcyclist:

    I remember jokes on Atrios back in the Dubya era about how the Soros checks hadn’t arrived yet.

    I made that joke here several times more recently than that. Of course, this is back when there was anything to joke about in politics.

  83. 83.

    Geminid

    @trnc: The nifty thing about the cardboard Chip Roy is that the Texas Republican is himself much like a cardboard figure: a faux cowboy who was born in Bethesda, Maryland and grew up in the Virginia suburbs of D.C.

  84. 84.

    The Thin Black Duke

    @Melancholy Jaques: It’s early yet, and other than the hardcore MAGA loony nutjobs, the “moderate” Republicans who aren’t completely blinded by their political ideology understand that the money disappearing from their 401Ks isn’t coming back. Thankfully, their growing discontent with Trump’s moronic trade war will be fueled by their selfishness.

  85. 85.

    tobie

    The health news in my family is so bad right now that I haven’t had the strength to follow the news much, but there are two things I don’t get: both foreign and domestic markets seem to have stabilized after an initial market sell off. Have they just factored in a world without the US consumer? And, why the fuck is our aim to compete with poor(er) countries to makes widgets and gizmos? If that’s our aim, then we have to accept we’ll have the same standard of living as people in those countries. I guess that’s good for the rich. Lots of cheap labor available for them.

  86. 86.

    YY_Sima Qian

    @Baud: The PRC Embassy in DC is trolling on X by posting a video of Ronald Reagan inveigling against tariffs (video through the link):

    Chinese Embassy in US@ChineseEmbinUS

    Ronald Reagan vs. #tariffs : 1987 speech finds new relevance in 2025

  89. 89.

    Jeffro

    @VeniceRiley: On April 17th the U.S. Trade Representative’s office is expected to impose fees of up to $1.5M per port call for ships made in China and for $500k to $1M if the ocean carrier owns a single ship made in China or even has one on order from a Chinese shipyard.

    So…it’s a protection/extortion racket, only one imposed by complete morons?

  91. 91.

    Geminid

    @Spanky: Rep. Roy takes it further than W did. He bellows like some angry ranch foreman out of Lonesome Dove. I wouldn be surprised if  Chip Roy walks bowlegged.

  96. 96.

    tobie

    @Jeffro: @VeniceRiley: All this means is that China will ship things to a third country, which will then transfer the goods to a non-Chinese ship. If the Trump admin notices this, they’ll slap duties on the third country. It’s likely they won’t. This is just for show for their base, which is eating this shit up. Prices will rise all the same.

  97. 97.

    TS

    @Nukular Biskits:

    And Australia had a contract with France for submarines & our RW prior government threw it away to sign a new agreement with the US – what chance we ever see any ships. Can’t imagine France want us back.

  99. 99.

    jonas

    @tobie: I’m sorry to hear about your family — best wishes that everything works out ok. To your point about trade, though, that’s exactly it: Trump supporters in particular (but also American voters generally) are under the impression that if these low-wage manufacturing jobs (stuff like toys, clothing, tools, etc.) come back to the US, they’ll provide high-paying jobs and revitalize rural economies, but your kids’ shoes will still magically cost $15 or whatever they do at WalMart these days. No, they’re going to cost $50 unless those workers are making $1/hr like they do in Vietnam.

    Which ain’t gonna happen.

    This is what happens when you have a country of low-information voters electing buffoons who reflect their ignorance back at them reassuringly and blow everything up as a result.

  101. 101.

    tobie

    @jonas: It’s just crazy. I listen to my neighbors who listen to Joe Rogan, Jordan Peterson, and Lex Fridman all day and then listen to FOX at night, and they sound like cultists. Or smack addicts. The choice is clear: $50 for a pair of kid’s shoes or slave labor wages to keep prices down. Meanwhile things that did power the economy like research funded by the NSF and NIH have been hollowed out.

  102. 102.

    Geminid

    @MattF: Yeah, Bethesda boy and U.Va. “Gentleman.” I bet Roy didn’t talk like this when he was walking around the Grounds. He probably was more like Leslie Howard in Gone With the Wind.

  103. 103.

    Belafon

    Trump keeps talking about how Americans will have to endure short term pain for long term gain, but it just shows that he cannot think of people other than himself as independent actors. All of the other countries can just use his mantra to divest themselves of their dependence on the US as a customer. Not that the US won’t be a customer, they just won’t need the US to stay afloat as they find other consumers.

  104. 104.

    Spanky

    Hmmmmm, the Dow’s up 3%, Nasdaq up about 3.5% “on hopes of tariff talks” is how Reuters is framing it.

    Whatever. I’m sure our nightmare economy has not yet found its bottom.

  105. 105.

    Nukular Biskits

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques:

    @Nukular Biskits: I assume this is part of the shortage of skilled workers that’s going on with the rest of the defense industry.

    Largely. The graying of the workforce along with the commensurate loss of decades of experience is a problem throughout the aerospace industry.

    Couple that with a lot of younger people can find jobs with as good or better benefits/pay (or at least they could until recently) and the “Great Resignation” where a lot of people reassessed their work/life balance.

    Down here, we lost a lot of people due to Katrina … a lot of folks said “Fuck that” and moved far from the Coast.

    Other factors as well, I’m sure.

  107. 107.

    Geminid

    @YY_Sima Qian: Turkiye is developing a robust naval shipbuilding capacity. They used to get their frigates from the US and their submarines from Germany. A recent Middle East Eye article reported that Turkiye’s shipyards have 27 warships under constructiion. These include a second corvette for Ukraine and a 60,000 ton aircraft carrier.

  108. 108.

    Jeffro

    @Geminid: oh gross, really?? (re: UVA)

    Roy, RFK Jr, Ingraham…the list of extremely undistinguished alums is growing and resembles a Batman rogues’ gallery…

  109. 109.

    Soprano2

    @Melancholy Jaques: The reason they disapprove is because he didn’t do what he promised, which was to immediately lower prices and end inflation. That doesn’t mean they didn’t vote for him because of the economy, it actually reinforces that idea because that’s the reason they’re unhappy with him. If they had voted for him for other reasons than what’s happening with the economy and prices wouldn’t matter that much to them.

  110. 110.

    Spanky

    @Spanky: Oh yeah, and Reuters put this out about 50 minutes ago:

    WASHINGTON/BEIJING (Reuters) -The United States called China’s retaliation against its tariffs a “big mistake” on Tuesday, as a global trade war ignited by President Donald Trump’s sweeping levies showed few signs of abating, even as global markets steadied after days of carnage.

    Doesn’t sound like the talk that investors would want to hear.

  111. 111.

    Josie

    @Geminid: ​
     As a dyed in the wool Texan, I laughed out loud at this mental picture. Chip Roy embarrasses me more even than Ted Cruz as a representative of Texas.

  115. 115.

    Spanky

    @Josie: Yeah, and it doesn’t speak well of Texans that they prefer the imported variety of Texan to the native kind.

  116. 116.

    tobie

    @Geminid: Apparently it takes Germany 120 months to produce the cranes used to make ships. Germany is the only country that manufactures them. I don’t know if Turkey is aiming for an all-Turkish shipbuilding capacity but none of this is quick business.

  117. 117.

    Belafon

    @Doug R: It’s because of US weapons that Ukraine could coordinate roaming missile launchers that could all target a Russian troop division many miles away and then be roaming again before Russia could respond.

  118. 118.

    Jeffro

    @Belafon: Trump keeps talking about how Americans will have to endure short term pain for long term gain, but it just shows that he cannot think of people other than himself as independent actors

    yup, 110% this.

    “We’ll just trade with each other, you ignoramus” – Europe, China, etc

    “We’ll just throw your party out of office, you putz” – American voters in 2026

    I hope Dems start talking about prosecuting everyone in his maladministration who commits crimes (and make a point to include those like DOGE and Musk who are stealing data and $$$ from us)

  119. 119.

    Spanky

    @tobie:

    Apparently it takes Germany 120 months to produce the cranes used to make ships.

    Um,  that’s 10 years. That can’t be right.

  122. 122.

    WTFGhost

    Analysis by Aaron Blake: Amid a stock market-busting tariff gambit that has cost many of them substantial wealth,

    …billionaires, and others who said YES YES YES to fascism, are having second thoughts, which begs the question: what the eff were their first thoughts, and did they happen before or after they were dropped on their head?

  123. 123.

    They Call Me Noni

    @Betty Cracker: None here yet but I have put out the first feeder so I’ll know when they start arriving.  Not really anything in bloom yet to otherwise attract them.  I expect to see activity soon though.  At the height of season I put out four feeders on the back deck and we have phlox and other assorted flowers for their dining pleasure.  We’re surrounded by woods so they have tons of nesting options.  They are so entertaining to watch.

  124. 124.

    JML

    there’s so much evil in corporate America that I’m sure there are CEOs sitting back thinking “if we can weather this for like a year, we’ll be able to drive up prices on a bunch of stuff, they’ll bring the tariffs down quietly so our costs go down and we can keep the prices artificially high while winning everyone back with a 10% cut and still keep raking in an 20% price inflation! now, how much can we cut worker pay to cover this in the next year to fund our stock options…”

  125. 125.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    @JML:

    Clearly you’re a plant here from numerous corporate boards and just let the inside words become outside words.

  126. 126.

    tobie

    @Spanky: It really isn’t quick business. My husband who follows this stuff tells me it’s 5-7 years to make these cranes. You make them or buy them for the long haul, I guess.

  127. 127.

    YY_Sima Qian

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques: Eh, the US MIC during WW II (that took down Imperial Japan & helped to take down Nazi Germany) focused on good enough & cheap, too, especially on land.

    Whatever the driving motivation, there is no excuse for the litany of failed programs, or programs w/ dramatic delays & cost overruns. This is especially bad in the USN surface fleet: CG(X), DDG(X), LCS, Ford CVN, & now the FFG(X).

    What the PLA & the PRC MIC does do sensibly, from a program management perspective, is rapid evolution through rapid iteration (build, test, modify, repeat, in relatively small batches, until a satisfactory design that is not overly ambitious is fixed & then go nuts on production), & never taking on too much technological risk in any given iteration. The US DOD Procurement is the opposite, always adding to & changing to the requirements, not letting the designs to be frozen & tested in prototyping, & ending up w/ bloated & overprices designs that the DOD cannot afford to purchase in volume, which then result in further cost spiral because there is no economy scale.

  128. 128.

    Geminid

    @tobie: The Turkish government decidedto build up its defense industry ten years ago, and part of that was developing their domestic naval shipbuilding capacity. Once they’ve filled out their own navy, the Turks intend to build for export.

    They’ve moved similarly in aerospace, and are now test flying a second Kaan 5th generation fighter. That should go into mass production by 2027. One limiting factor could be production of turbo jet engines. That is an older technology, but the technical requirements for manufacturing high-end jet engines are challenging.

    And Turkish drone manufacturer Baykar is the world’s leading manufacturer of combat drones. Both of the Bayraktar brothers who run Baykar earned advanced engineering degrees from US. institutions, one from Columbia and one from M.I.T.

    The U.S. MRLS systems that were referenced earlier in this thread were preceded in Ukraine by similar systems manufactured by the Turkish company Roketsan. Turkiye keeps its arms supplies to Ukraine on the down-low, but they’ve been substantial.

  129. 129.

    MisterForkbeard

    @Spanky: Stocks up quite a bit this morning, yeah. Because nothing. apparently?

    A few countries did say they’d abandonmtariffs if Trump would get rid of his. Those tariffs were minor at best. and the Trump administration rejected those overtures. Trump also says everyone wants to talk to him about giving in.

    Cant find anything else. I guess just like yesterday, stock market is finding any slim hope Trump isn’t a moron and hitting the gas?

  130. 130.

    Librettist

    @Nukular Biskits:

    The putinist right has propagandized that this is a function of a lack of will among young white males and “DEI”.

    That bullshit won’t change U.S. workforce demographics.

  131. 131.

    WTFGhost

    @Melancholy Jaques: Friend, there’s always something to joke about in politics. Might be times you’re not in the mood for any effing humor, and that’s understandable.

    But that doesn’t mean there’s not humor. Sometimes, it’s not very “hahaha it’s funny, just because!” but there’s always something that will touch your emotions, just right, to get a laugh, sometimes, from the right person.

    Sometimes, the only joke is the mythical Trump Supporter, wearing his or her “REAL MEN wear DIAPERS!” branded merchandise, because that’s the only thing that still rings true about the new romance novel in the DTRUMP series,  “DTrump and the Ketamine Addict.”

  132. 132.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Jeffro:

    Roy, RFK Jr, Ingraham…the list of extremely undistinguished alums is growing and resembles a Batman rogues’ gallery…

    My alma mater, Trinity College in Hartford, Connecticut, had a student body of ~1600 students when I was there, which is a small fraction of U.Va’s student body.  But we’re responsible for both George F. Will and Tucker Carlson.  We’re punching above our weight in the rogues’ gallery of graduates.

  133. 133.

    WTFGhost

    @JML: As long as Fox News keeps pretending Trump is A-OK, and Republicans, en masse, support him, they’ll continue to pretend all protestors are paid.

    That might change if there are mass protests in front of homes – while the FN coverage will be “how dare these leftist terrorists…” it’s pretty hard for a professional politician to see that many people who knew their names and addresses, and not think bad thoughts about their re-election chances. It won’t help with the Senate, of course. so Fox News might try playing that up.

  135. 135.

    Kristine

    @jonas: Wall Street spent decades separating the concept of “worker” from that of “consumer.” Job cuts were great—the market would go up. But wait, consumers are using more credit than before/defaults are rising/bankruptcies/ why is this happening? Must be Democrats doing…something.

    So now folks who think all the jobs coming back to the US is great news don’t take the next step—that in order for workers to earn all the promised great wages, prices will need to rise. A lot.

    This is part of what shook up some folks about the Biden economy. That if we’re at full/ almost full employment and wages are rising, prices will go up as well.

  137. 137.

    prostratedragon

    I’m sitting in the newly-remodelled Cardiology waiting room at Big U Hospital (routine stuff). The two 48-inch tvs are OFF.

     

    Bliss.

  138. 138.

    Citizen Alan

    @lowtechcyclist: i’m curious to see if the “Soros paid protester” idea will persist even after george soros eventually dies. He is quite old, after all. Will they pick a new target for their antisemitic paranoia, or will they crank it up to eleven and say that george soros faked his own death?

    “The protesters are all being paid by the cryogenically frozen head of george soros!”

  139. 139.

    Geminid

    Bloomburg reports that Italian PM Georgia Meloni will travel to Washington to directly negotiate tariffs with Trump.

  142. 142.

    Harrison Wesley

    @Geminid: Good luck with that. Apparently she’s not aware of how he treated Trudeau or the ever-shifting provisions of the Ukraine natural resources “deal”.

  143. 143.

    Belafon

    @Kristine: The thing we have to watch out for is thinking that wages will cause all the price increase. As it has been shown, providing workers with a living wage, health insurance, and vacation only drove the price of a big mac in Europe up about 50 cents.

  145. 145.

    TF79

    @MisterForkbeard: Real-time hedging/copium by folks hoping that “an adult will step in and fix this” – and who knows, maybe they’re right.

    But ”Deals” will be hard to find too, since the tariffs have no rational foundation and the different factions in the admin whispering in Trump’s ear all have different rationalizations for them. The folks who think they’re a brilliant negotiating tactic may like a deal to lower tariffs, but the folks who think tariffs are needed to “bring back jobs” will not, and the folks who want to “bring back jobs” will like deals to move a factory to the US, but the folks who want to tariffs to bring in lots of revenue (presumably to finance upper class tax cuts) will not, etc.  Musk is already calling Navarro an idiot in public (which is true), so it seems like the pain will continue given how hard it will be to thread that needle.

  146. 146.

    tobie

    @prostratedragon: I’ve been reading a lot more novels these days. I need to lose myself in something. I hope your treatment is going okay. This can’t be easy on you.

  147. 147.

    Bokonon

    @Nukular Biskits: I have NEVER received a response from Senator Hyde-Smith. Ever. And it is her offices throughout the state that seem to never have time to answer the phone, something that started around 20JAN this year, strangely.

    I used to work as a low-level staffer for a US Senator.  Because of that, this tactic of silence and non-responsiveness from elected officials really, really bothers me.  These Senators HAVE resources, but they are choosing not to engage or respond to their constituents because … now that they are elected, and now that they have power, they are RULING you.  Not REPRESENTING you.

    It is very telling about their attitude.  They aren’t even doing fake town halls with pre-selected party loyalists, or sending you responses that tell you what you OUGHT to be thinking instead of your viewpoint.  Just imperial and arrogant silence.

  148. 148.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    @Geminid:

    Meloni is probably aware of how shit Senators like Grassley got “carve outs” during Trump 1.0 for those poor, hurting farmers in IA.

    Hair Furor will negotiate (give away) just about anything if pushed directly like this, thus, I see her doing this on a national scale.  He’ll love it.

    What. A. Clusterfuck.

  150. 150.

    frosty

    @Betty Cracker: ​I’ve put out a seed feeder and suet feeder but I’ve stayed away from nectar. I don’t want to get in the middle of a vicious hummingbird fight.​

  151. 151.

    prostratedragon

    @tobie:  Thanks. No, it’s not, but it’s a long term thing that forced me to stop ignoring it a decade ago. Pretty stable now, but with frequent monitoring. Goes better when that dragon stays down, which isn’t easy these days.

  153. 153.

    frosty

    @Nukular Biskits: The real solution is to vote them out of office but, as cynical as this may sound, that’s not a realistic threat in red states like MS.

    It’s not a realistic threat in Confederate Pennsylvania either. Scott Perry survived another election, this time against the best challenger he’s faced.

  155. 155.

    cain

    @sab:

    It’s fun that they elected a legislature that doesn’t listen to their own voters. Of all states, Ohio is the weirdest one with how crazy their lawmakers are.

  156. 156.

    Sheila in nc

    @trnc:

     

    have 3 grocery stores within 2 miles and 2 more just a few more miles out.

    You must live near me.

  158. 158.

    Steve LaBonne

    @sab: They’ve partially backed off, providing a smidgen more funding than last year without restoring the existing funding formula. Not good enough. The sad thing is that Ohio has been a national leader for the quality and funding of our libraries for many years. Present day Republicans are nothing but vandals.

  159. 159.

    frosty

    @YY_Sima Qian: PRC (ok, I know that one) DRC  PMC LFP MCM BESS … Maybe you could write them out the first time?

    Every time I see ROW I wonder what the Right-Of-Way has to do with your topic. I finally figured this one out though. Rest Of World.

  160. 160.

    Soprano2

    @Kristine: This is part of what shook up some folks about the Biden economy. That if we’re at full/ almost full employment and wages are rising, prices will go up as well.

    Lots of people don’t seem to understand this concept at all, or at least they don’t understand how it actually works. I can’t make my prices go back to what they were in 2019 unless I can make the pay go back there too, as well as what I pay for everything else.

  161. 161.

    Ramalama

    @Kristine:

    Wall Street spent decades separating the concept of “worker” from that of “consumer.”

    To mangle a quote by the late great Toni Morrison, when did Americans or American citizens start getting referred to as mere “consumers?”

  162. 162.

    Citizen Alan

    @Nukular Biskits: One of the biggest regrets in my life was once shaking hands with Roger Wicker with a big smile on my face and saying what an honor it was to finally meet him in person.

    Because we were in a parking lot at night, and in the dim lighting, I mistook him for a prominent judge who he somewhat resembled.

    I washed my hands as soon as I realized the truth.

    I have never been in the same county as Cindy Hide-White, and don’t think I ever could be without seeking her out to scream obscenities at her.

    Can’t wait until April 17, after which I will be in Jim Costa’s (Dem) district instead of Tom McLintock (Moron).

  163. 163.

    Steve LaBonne

    @Soprano2: People want services without paying taxes, and goods without paying the people who produce them. As it ever was.

  164. 164.

    Steve in the ATL

    @frosty: same with ROW!

    PMC is private military contractor

    DRC is democratic republic of Congo (which should not be in your travel plans—unless an you are a PMC

    The others I’m pretty sure he made up just to mess with us!

  167. 167.

    Citizen Alan

    @jonas:

    No, they’re going to cost $50 unless those workers are making $1/hr like they do in Vietnam.

    Which ain’t gonna happen.

    It might. If, you know, we bring back slavery, which every MAGA secretly or not so secretly wants to do. Some of them are openly talking about.

  169. 169.

    cain

    @Nukular Biskits:

    I think then the best thing to do is do your own town halls. Self organize them. Invite out of power or retired republicans and democrats.

    Protesting doesn’t play well when it looks like harassment. We aren’t at the stage of the game where things are really burning down yet.

    But doing “shadow democracy” and getting the press to show up and write articles and it covers missing republicans is a much more effective tool than running around with signs at people’s houses.

  170. 170.

    Citizen Alan

    @Nukular Biskits:The real solution is to vote them out of office but, as cynical as this may sound, that’s not a realistic threat in red states like MS.

    If you ever needed proof of this, simply note that Brandon Presley, cousin of Elvis and the most popular Democratic candidate Mississippi has seen in the last quarter-century, lost handily to Tate Reeves, who had been embroiled in a scandal where he effectively embezzled from Medicaid funds earmarked for children to curry favor with an ex-NFL star.

  173. 173.

    cain

    @Nukular Biskits:

    For example, the local TV station (WLOX) had several stories, including one on the march in Gulfport Saturday. The local mullet wrapper (The Sun Herald), however, has not a single mention.

    You have to assume that the MS media market is geared towards protecting republicans. So, you have to find another way to get it out there. Word of mouth advertising, democracy road shows. You know these people are frustrated because they can’t talk to GOP lawmakers – start doing those roadshows, show democrats listening. Start growing crowd sizes. Get them to change their affiliation to independent. (not democrat)

    You might not be able to get them to switch allegiance, but you can make them switch to independent and find independents to vote for instead. Depend on republican protecting media to start sounding the alert.

  174. 174.

    Citizen Alan

    @Soprano2: Half the country can barely read at the 6th grade level. When you think about it, expecting them to have an understanding of economics superior to that of the average 12yo is kind of naive on our part.

  175. 175.

    Citizen Alan

    @Ramalama:when did Americans or American citizens start getting referred to as mere “consumers?”

    I imagine around the same time workers started getting referred to as “human resources.”

  176. 176.

    Trollhattan

    Amid a stock market-busting tariff gambit that has cost many of them substantial wealth, some of President Trump’s most prominent billionaire backers and others who entertained his tariffs are breaking with him in a major way

    A little late don’t you think, you pack of squirrelbrains.

  177. 177.

    Geminid

    @comrade scotts agenda of rage: I’m not sure if Meloni knows about Grassley, but she’s a smart cookie who pays plenty of attention to Trump, and paid him a visit at Mar-a-Loco last summer.

    Meloni is also tight with Turkish President Erdogan, and the Sultan may have let her in on some of his tricks for dealing with the Yankee Barbarian.

    Erdogan and his Foreign Secretary Hakan Fidan seem to have gotten Trump’s number during his first term. Remember the time Erdogan visited DC, and Turkish embassy guards ran out and punched up some protesters? At the time I thought that was just a random display of  brutality.

    Then I read up on Hakan Fidan, who was Erdogan’s intelligence chief at the time; a very shrewd man. Now my theory is that Fidan and Erdogan staged the attack in order to impress Trump, and I think their plan worked.

    Ed. Yesterday Trump was talking about how he likes Erdogan: “…he’s very tough and he’s very smart.” It was kind of funny, because Trump was sitting four feet away from Benjamin Netanyahu, and both men know Erdogan hates “Bibi’s” guts.

  181. 181.

    Baud

    Dodgers Pitcher Brusdar Graterol posts “ In my Brown House 🥰” on his Instagram Story the day his Dodgers Teammates visit the Trump White House

  182. 182.

    Baud

    Tim Walz – “It’s okay in America to be successful, we should celebrate that. My beef is once you get successful, don’t be a greedy bastard and not pay your taxes. What we should demonize is people like Elon Musk.”

  183. 183.

    Jeffro

    omg KEN PAXTON is a UVA Law alum(!)

    ugh

    On the other hand…Sheldon Whitehouse?  UVA Politics alum

  184. 184.

    surfk9

    @Citizen Alan: I am sorry that you had to live in McClintocks  district. He is a waste of skin.  My in-laws who live in Jackson have him for a rep. He is truly a piece of shit. Hopefully he will get voted out for his support of the destruction of the National Park System as well as T***p’s tariffs which will end up screwing over California’s farmers. The people who depend on the tourism and farmers are a  significant chunk of his voters.

    I have been trying to get my congressman to hold town halls in that district.

  185. 185.

    Steve in the ATL

    @Citizen Alan: economically speaking, we should not have access to bananas here.  They grow only in certain tropical climates and have a very short shelf life.  It’s totally, um, bananas.

  186. 186.

    Emily B.

    @Citizen Alan: A friend of mine works for Soros’s Open Society Foundations. During the past couple of years, they’ve had various cutbacks, including layoffs.

    I guess the right wing would say that’s because Soros has been paying so many protesters….

  187. 187.

    TerryC

    @trnc: Just under $5 here in central NC for a standard dozen of large or jumbo. Are you in a metropolis?

    I just picked up day-fresh a dozen XL, a dozen Jumbo and a half-a-dozen duck eggs for $20 (total including a tip) at the Fletcher Farm down the road a mile or so.

  188. 188.

    Geminid

    @Emily B.: Huh. I wonder if Tom Periello got laid off. Last I checked, the former VA05 Congressman was working for Soros’s Tides Foundation.

  190. 190.

    Citizen Alan

    @surfk9: Eh. I would have lived in Costa’s from the start, but I had a day and a half to find an apartment, and the kitchen in the apartment I looked at in the 21st District was too small for my needs, and I figured it would only be for a year or two. I really wanted into Valedeo’s district so I could vote against the little weasel.  After the 17th, I’ll be living in a 3BR, 100yo house in the arts district, so it’s all good. (Well, that part of life is all good. The rest of the nation is still a dumpster fire.)

  191. 191.

    Citizen Alan

    @Citizen Alan:  I would add, on a personal note, that the “Leopards eating faces” meme is my first direct encounter I am aware of with the Mandela Effect. Because I not only thought the meme originated with an Onion post, but I believed it so thoroughly that I thought I’d actually read it and can still clearly picture the headline on the Onion website in my head.

  194. 194.

    Citizen Alan

    @Steve in the ATL: I have been told that California’s water shortage would cease to be a problem if we simply banned the cultivation of 2 or 3 highly profitable ag products that could only be cultivated here if vast sums of water were used to irrigate them. IIRC, it’s almonds, alfafa, and one other.

  195. 195.

    Scout211

    @Citizen Alan: Can’t wait until April 17, after which I will be in Jim Costa’s (Dem) district instead of Tom McLintock (Moron).

    Noooooooo!  You can’t leave me here all aloooooone!

    Just kidding! I’m actually very happy that you get to move into a Dem district.  I wish I could get rid of the curse of McClintock.  But sadly, there’s not much hope of that.

  196. 196.

    Belafon

    @Citizen Alan: Domino’s has been running ads touting their new stuffed crust pizza, with people who supposedly remember the last time Domino’s had one, something it has never done before.

  197. 197.

    surfk9

    @Scout211: You’re not alone! My in-laws live in Jackson have that POS as their rep as well.  My in-laws are very liberal and very open about it in public.

  199. 199.

    Scout211

    @surfk9: You’re not alone!

    That’s always good to hear.  There’s just not enough of us, sadly.

    Weird that just here in the comments, we’ve got voters in Amador, Calaveras and Fresno counties in his district.

  200. 200.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Citizen Alan:

    I imagine around the same time workers started getting referred to as “human resources.”

    Last several years I was working, even the ‘human’ part had dropped off, and we were just ‘resources.’

  201. 201.

    karen gail

    @Citizen Alan: Let’s not forget all the people; not only are there more people living there than the naturally occurring water can support but they waste huge amounts of water.

  202. 202.

    Matt McIrvin

    @Nukular Biskits: To the credit of our two local news outlets (the Eagle-Tribune and public radio station WHAV, which also runs a news website), they did cover our demonstration, with pictures. When I was there I saw a lady making what was probably a TikTok video where she asked “where are the local media?” and there was no TV van, but we did get coverage.

  203. 203.

    Citizen Alan

    @karen gail: Watering your lawn, while perhaps wasteful, is still nothing compared to what is needed to grow alfalfa in order to feed cows. The intertubes tell me that 80% of California’s water goes to agriculture, and 1/5 of that 80% goes to alfalfa.

  204. 204.

    Darkrose

    @Baud: He has more guts than anyone on that team, especially fucking Dave Roberts. I don’t want to hear Jackie Robinson’s name out of his mouth ever again.

  205. 205.

    YY_Sima Qian

    @Steve in the ATL: Thank you for spelling out some of the acronyms I used.

    @frosty: LFP = Lithium Ferrous Phosphate, NMC = Nickel Magnesium Cobalt, these are the two common battery chemistries for EVs. NMC was once dominant due to higher energy density (since range anxiety was/is the main obstacle against EV adoption), & generally still preferred for higher end models. LFP has now become dominant in more affordable mass market models, due the advantages stated, especially lower cost (the other main obstacle for EV adoption), & better charging curve & improvements in energy density & charging speed had mitigated its disadvantage in range.

    BESS = Battery Energy Storage System, this is the utility/grid level deployment of battery storage to is critical to alleviate the intermittent nature of solar/wind power & increase their share of electricity generation over the more steady fossil fuel burning power plants. Here, the much lower cost of sodium ion battery chemistry is critical to deployment at the gargantuan scale needed, as energy density (thus, weight & space) is not at a premium as in transportation (such as passenger EVs).

    Sorry, I sometimes forget that acronyms that might be obvious in my mind may not be to others.

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