Not much would compel me to turn into a news broadcast, but I am curious. How far will they stray from Pope Francis, or will they continue with his more liberal agenda? The Catholic church has a lot to answer for in bad behavior, but returning to a more restrictive, conservative pope would be discouraging. A lot of people follow the church’s lead.
Open thread
M31
Pope Guido Sarducci, you heard it here first
trollhattan
Given increasing odds of the first African pope, we could get a lesson on just how conservative African Christianity can be.
Glory b
Let’s remove Emily Feiner from the podium she was placed on after getting carried out of the townhall meeting.
She very proudly didn’t vote, saying there was no difference between Trump and Harris.
Her actions were performative and meaningless. When avoiding harm & taking action actually meant something, last November, she did nothing.
schrodingers_cat
@Glory b: Who is Emily?
schrodingers_cat
Will we have a non-white pope? If we do will he be more conservative or less conservative than Francis?
raven
@M31: Actually it was in the LAST thread!!!!
Glory b
@trollhattan: Oh, African Christianity is VERY conservative.
princess leia
There has been a seagull family on the roof near the chimney over the last two days- the mom was feding the chick when the white smoike started coming out. I hope that is a good sign.
MattF
Yeah, African conservative pope would be problematical. We shall see.
Fair Economist
It occurs to me that the quick selection might partly reflect that the Cardinals are Jonesing for their phones (they have to give them up during the Conclave) just like any of us would.
Perhaps this could be used to speed up overlong processes in general?
TaMara
@Glory b: If she had voted for Trump and then decided that democracy was at stake and was now protesting, would it matter? Would you be outraged or thrilled she finally realized what was at stake?
I’m not sure what you are trying to say. She’s only a hero if she voted for Harris and resisted?
In my opinion, resistance is resistance. Don’t care when or how you came to the moment. YMMV
Old School
Will Trump have to resign the presidency to be pope? Or can he be both?
bbleh
How far will they stray from Pope Francis, or will they continue with his more liberal agenda?
New Pope: still sweet? or more acidic like Pope Classic?
TaMara
@bbleh: Okay, that made me giggle.
suzanne
@trollhattan: Answer: very.
I am not Catholic and not a big pope-watcher, but I am led to believe that the Cardinal from the Philippines is in the Francis mold.
Guess they’re all sick of rawdogging.
scav
@Glory b: Absolutely no fun. Still, giving this timeline, maybe the best we can hope for is a few giggles as we watch the arch-conservative red-hat opus catholics embrace an infallible black man in supreme god-annointed power.
Trivia Man
@Glory b: thank you for the context. In some ways i am angrier at non-voters than a trumper who has been decieved and intentionally misled
Fair Economist
@schrodingers_cat:
I’d say more likely than not that he’s non-white. I think these Cardinals understand the symbolism.
It would be hard to get one less conservative than Francis. The question is will the next pope be problematically more conservative. Supposedly Francis wanted the next pope to be Pope John (24th, I think). A Pope John would be good, otherwise something of a concern.
Belafon
@schrodingers_cat: She’s the woman that was carried out of the town hall the other day.
No One of Consequence
@M31: Where may we deliver your Internets? I LoL’d.
He’s the Father I’d trust the most if I was so inclined.
-NOoC
trollhattan
@princess leia:
The BBC white smoke video features them prominently. “Hey, we’re hella famous. Strut!” seem to be their vibe.
“
Trivia Man
@Fair Economist: i like that meal portions start getting reduced after some number of days
Tony Jay
Like I told the Cardinals when they came to me, tears in their eyes, if nominated I will not stand, probably, and if elected I will not serve. Unless, you know, there’s good money in it.
Fair Economist
@Trivia Man:
Wait, seriously? LOL
No One of Consequence
@bbleh: And this was a nice follow-up. Two good chuckles so far in this thread. I has a pleased.
-NOoC
Glory b
@schrodingers_cat: EMilk Feiner, who got carried out of Mike Lawler’s town hall meeting the other day, waving peace signs.
trollhattan
@Tony Jay:
Gotta say, the Roman Catholic Church seems to offer vast beak-wetting possibilities. Plus, all that gold.
ETA, “Now that I’m pope, I want a list of the fifty hottest nuns by Monday.”
Butch
Either they’ve elected a pope or Snoop Dogg snuck in a lit up a big doobie.
Paul in KY
@trollhattan: I can be very, very conservative.
Tony Jay
@trollhattan:
Oh hell, yeah. They got their own Bank and everything. But you try and melt down any of those trinkets lining the walls and nuns are on you quicker than you can chant reddat tibi caesar.
Which, as you posit, isn’t a deal breaker.
TaMara
My favorite EV car guy:
Paul in KY
@Glory b: If she didn’t vote for VP Harris, then fuck her.
Edit: Any shmoe can protest. For whatever reason. The concrete thing would be to have voted against TFG (IMO).
bbleh
Not to get all secular here, but I AM pleased that New Pope has knocked the Not Really Very Big Trade Deal down from not just top story in the WaPo but to #3! Behind withdrawing Martin for USA – DC too! That’s gotta hurt …
Baud
@TaMara:
From the comment it sounds like she hasn’t realized her mistake.
trollhattan
“Oh, hey. I’m just the window cleaner.”
Central Planning
@Old School: Can he do the trifecta? President, Pope, and Speaker of the House.
trollhattan
What’s the bag limit on popes?
Paul in KY
@Tony Jay: You are a truthful soul…
trollhattan
Holy crap, a Yank!
Cubs, or White Socks?
Baud
@trollhattan:
Trump?
Jeffro
@Butch: Pope Snoop would be sooo, so cool
bbleh
@trollhattan: who did a lot of his work in South America
suzanne
Seems like he was a sleeper candidate.
Mike E
Leo XIV
Paul in KY
@Jeffro: P to the O to the P to the E, gonna smoke the finest to infinity…
raven
Chicago boy!
WaterGirl
@Baud: I’m coming in late to this. What comment did this Feiner person make that has people stirred up?
Baud
@WaterGirl:
I don’t know. I’m going off Glory B’s comment.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@suzanne:
Sounds like a protégé of Francis, or at least someone he trusted, from what I’m reading on Wiki. So maybe not so bad a choice? When I first read he was an American I was thinking, “Oh, great, probably a conservative asshole.” since US Catholic leaders tend to be very reactionary
Baud
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):
Most US Catholic leaders are really right wing. Hopefully he’s an exception.
WaterGirl
@Baud: If she voted for Trump, then it seems like an even better sign that she is protesting what is going on now.
Unless she released a statement that she is still pro-Trump or something.
Old Dan and Little Ann
@Glory b: That’s disappointing.
trollhattan
Whatever else Leo14 does, I want him to bring Justice Alito in for a private meeting and a little tune-up on what it means to be Christian.
princess leia
Supposedly a centrist, but conservative on doctrine. Which means conservative.
suzanne
SuzMom opined that all of the Cardinals look like they work at Chik-Fil-A.
Old School
A Pope from Chicago?
He must be on a mission from God.
Omnes Omnibus
@WaterGirl: She’s a “no difference between the parties” person who stands by her position.
Captain C
@trollhattan: “Donald Trump died yesterday as he attempted to seize the Papal Throne. As he walked toward St. Peter’s, he was struck by 100 bolts of lightning simultaneously, despite a clear sky. Then, he burned for a full hour, screaming the whole time “NO!!!! JUST BECAUSE I DIDN”T BELIEVE IN YOU AND WANTED TO STEAL ALL THE GOLD AND NUNS IS NO REASON TO PUNISH ME!!!! DON’T SEND ME TO THE BAD PLACE!!!” Afterwards, as the Swiss Guard swept up his ashes, a cloud formation saying “Try again, you idiots!” appeared in the otherwise clear sky.
A few hours later, JD Vance was found dead in the back of a furniture store, apparently having been dragged there and pummeled to death by at least six couches. Around the same time, Squeaker Johnson was also found dead, wearing three wetsuits and with a cactus up his bum. New President Marco Rubio quickly named Kamala Harris as his Vice President and then promptly resigned, saying “I want no part of this, just give me my pension!”
Captain C
@Butch: Pope Snoop?
Bruce K in ATH-GR
Auntie Beeb says the new Pontiff is an American, Robert Prevost. Wikipedia just changed Prevost’s article title from Cardinal Robert Prevost to Pope Leo XIV.
No One of Consequence
@Jeffro:
@Paul in KY:
Solid ‘Oh HELL No’ from me. Snoop played Trump’s inaugural wank fest or some such shit, after dissing those that bent the knee and played for him before. Used to love that guy, but hate hypocrites wherever they sprout.
YMMV,
-NOoC
TaMara
@Baud: IMO, the mistake is believing that in order to want to protect Democracy, someone has to believe the way we do.
Maybe she’s a solid old-school Republican who believes in freedom of speech and holding elected officials to account. And the damn Constitution. Maybe she would never vote for Trump. Maybe she actually didn’t like Harris’s policies?
So to all these people who need a purity test in order to publicly resist injustice, I say, enjoy losing your Democracy.
To just wipe away her actions because she did not vote the way you think she should is…JFC
trollhattan
@Old School: Is there a band to get back together?
Sadly, St. Aretha will not be available.
Captain C
@trollhattan: “My wayward son, please follow these Dominicans. They have some instruments to show you.”
Jeffro
@No One of Consequence: ok ok ok
(but it would be funny for a day, right?) =)
trollhattan
@Captain C:
Praise the Lord.
rekoob
Here’s the updated Wikipedia page (still being revised, of course):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Leo_XIV
CaseyL
Comment on on Sky about the new Pope:
So…. maybe not so bad.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Baud:
This isn’t good, but we’ll see, from his Wiki page:
Baud
@TaMara:
She got tossed out for her actions. Nothing can take that away from her. But unless she changes her views, she isn’t going to help us remove Republicans from power.
Jay
@WaterGirl:
Ms. Feiner asked, at a Rethug town hall, what her Congress critter was doing to stand up to DJTdiot’s Constitutional violates, kept pressing the matter when she got non answers and was dragged out of the Hall by NY State Troopers and Private Security.
Now it turns out in an interview that she didn’t vote, because “Both Sides”.
Baud
@CaseyL:
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):
Sounds like a mixed bag.
TaMara
@CaseyL: One can hope
kissel
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): not any different from the last pope.
raven
The dude is Pope, temper those hopes.
Tony Jay
@Paul in KY:
Just saying, maybe if Jesus had kept a few denarius tucked away for a rainy day, even a few sestertius from fish sales to grease the right palms with, he might not have ended up falling prey to Wilhoit’s Law.
Chetan Murthy
@Baud: @TaMara: Baud, can we agree that we’d say a kind word for her in the House of Commons?
Baud
It’ll be interesting to see if an American Pope takes on Trump to some extent.
Central Planning
@Baud: Isn’t asking her rep a question at the town hall and speaking truth to power helping us?
Like TaMara said, we don’t need a purity test for people trying to get rid of Trump.
Formerly disgruntled in Oregon
Person does a good thing.
Other people get excited – wow, good thing!
Then other details about the person come out – is this person good or bad? (binary choice req’d)
Other people argue about the person’s virtue, and stop talking about the good thing that started the conversation…
~
Maybe we should treat people as the complex, imperfect animals that we are.
Put effective actions on a pedestal, not people!
Old School
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): I am going to assume SNAP did not endorse any papal candidates.
Trivia Man
@trollhattan: South Sider so im guessing Sox
Shalimar
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): He’s 69 years old. It was hard to find anyone in Catholic leadership who wasn’t awful 40 years ago. As long as he isn’t still a shitheel now, he might be the best they could find on child abuse too.
Dorothy A. Winsor
Holy crap, the pope is from Chicago.
Paul in KY
@TaMara: But to say they’re ‘all the same’. That’s just stupid as shit and so damaging to our side.
MazeDancer
An American!
Go, Leo!
Trump didn’t want Mr. Biden to get publicity for being on The View. So, he announced his concepts of a deal with the UK which changes nothing.
The Vatican: Hold my chalice
ExPatExDem
Somewhat surprised that they chose an American.
But as a non-religious never Catholic person, I acknowledge the limits of my insights.
My only hope for any man who holds the position is that they do minimal harm, given that the institution they preside over is fundamentally reactionary.
Baud
@Central Planning:
Sure, if you look only at that bit.
Remember Cindy Sheehan. Republican who opposed the Iraq War after her son died. She was good for a while but then turned on Dems, I believe.
raven
@Trivia Man: Best hooper I ever played with went to Quigley South.
schrodingers_cat
@TaMara: People who sat out the election knowing what was at stake don’t get a pass from me. Not in 2016 and absolutely not in 2020.
Trivia Man
@CaseyL: and head if the Augustinians – is that a good sign?
TaMara
@Baud: Seems to me she was trying to hold her Republican elected official to the values she believes in. And if that doesn’t work, she’ll look for someone else to support?
Isn’t that how it’s supposed to work?
I hear people here all the time dissing the influential Republicans who are resisting what their party has become because they don’t suddenly become full-throated Democrats. They are accused of being part of the problem. Or doing it for the money. Or this or that. Nothing is enough unless they believe exactly how they want them to believe.
That’s not a democracy.
It gets old.
Jay
@Central Planning:
It’s a FAFO moment for her.
How many constituents just asking questions have ever been dragged out of a Democratic Party town hall by the Gestapo?
But both Parties are the Same.
Paul in KY
@Tony Jay: Pharisees were notoriously expensive to bribe…
The Pilate too, rich Roman and all that.
Baud
How old is this guy? His wiki photo makes him look young?
Kirk
Allegedly Vance and Vermeule are not fans of the man elected to be Pope – too “soft”. This gives him a step up in my opinion.
ExPatExDem
@Baud: The danger is if he was selected for the opposite reason.
To suck up to the reactionary elements of US politics.
I mean, let’s be honest about it. There’s rarely been a right authoritarian governing movement where the church wasn’t there holding its hand.
Trivia Man
@Paul in KY: especially if she doubles down and says she is proud she didn’t vote for Kamala
ETA fine to praise the action and encourage others. But careful of elevating her voice to a lace of prominence
Paul in KY
@Central Planning: It’s great that she did that protest. Yay for that. However, her ‘both sides’ shit is (in the long run) much more damaging to our democracy and just soooooooo stupid to boot.
suzanne
@Formerly disgruntled in Oregon: I will also note that a FU attitude toward the “both sides!” people like this doesn’t encourage them to join our side. It makes me crazy, too.
But, like…. I want to win things.
TaMara
@Paul in KY: And that right there is the problem. Fucking sides.
How about just believing in Democracy first?
Baud
@TaMara:
She didn’t have to be a Dem. But if think it’s wrong for one of us to say both sides are the same, then it’s wrong for her to say that. She’s tarring us if, even now, she’s still saying we’re no better than Trump is.
columbusqueen
@Baud: i think that might be why they elected him, as a slap down to Trump’s arrogance.
princess leia
@Old School: OOOHH that is good.
Fair Economist
@TaMara:Gotta back up Tamara here. Politics is all about getting people who aren’t good to do good things. Shows up all the time, like with the logrolling needed to pass the 13th Amendment ending slavery. She had a good moment on media and made the Republicans look bad. Take the win.
Baud
@ExPatExDem:
Yeah. I’m not too trusting. We’ll see how it plays out.
TaMara
@Baud: Okay, so if I don’t believe how you believe, I’m not allowed to protest.
Good to know I can stay home now.
Kirk
@Trivia Man: Depends a bit on how well he follows the Augustinian Rules. Which are very much the antithesis of prosperity doctrine, fwiw.
Trivia Man
@Baud: 69
Noice
Paul in KY
@TaMara: Democracy is a participatory process, as you well know. The most fundamental part is to vote. To dismiss that with the ‘both sides’ bullshit (to me) outweighs her great protest at that meeting. YMMV.
Chetan Murthy
@Paul in KY: It’s true that
Stalinshesigned the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pactdidn’t even bother to vote in 2024, but nowhe’s opposed to Hitlershe’s standing up and resisting just like we are. Nobody said we had to welcome her with open arms. I doubt Liz Cheney got any policy concessions for her endorsement of Harris, and Cheney’s done a fuckton more.Baud
@TaMara:
I didn’t say that at all. She can do what she wants. I can criticize her when she says both sides are the same.
Fair Economist
@Baud: Leo XIV is 69, which is youngish for a new pope, although fairly old in an absolute sense. He looks pretty well-preserved, though.
NotMax
@M31
If nominating the deceased, better yet Francis Mulcahy (M*A*S*H).
pieceofpeace
@Tony Jay: lol…
CaseyL
@Trivia Man:
All I know about the Augustinians is what I just read on Wikipedia.
Seems they go in seriously for community service, and their vow of poverty is less about being individually poor than it is about sharing what they have with the community. At least, that’s what I get from the article.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Baud:
Speaking of Sheehan:
Turned into an utter piece of shit
ETA: You guys should really read that open letter. It’s a prime example of a total lack of self-awareness where she talks about the genocide against Palestinians all the while casting the genocide against trans people as a “a mater of legitmate debate within the Left.” and compares attempts to combat bigotry to McCarthyism
And yes, those misspellings are in the original letter
ExPatExDem
And speaking of the new Pontiff whose birth name is Robert:
Not choosing Pope Bob I is a missed opportunity.
CaseyL
OMG: Cardinal Prevost dissed JD Vance on Twitter!
ETA: Not a Twitter link; it goes to Radley Balko on BlueSky, who is in turn quoting the tweet.
Baud
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):
She might’ve always been that. The Iraq war may have been her one thing.
columbusqueen
@Baud: Yeah, I can’t stand the both sides BS. Fuck her for her stupidity.
Forgive me the saltiness, I’ve got a nasty toothache.
JoyceH
Geez, the pope is younger than me. So – expected to continue Francis’ reforms. Sounds good. American but spent most of his career in Peru and is a Peruvian citizen. So presumably speaks Spanish. Spanish and English covers a lot of territory. I think this is sounding like a good pick.
Gin & Tonic
@raven: Wise counsel.
Fair Economist
@Kirk: Scanning discussions in various places he seems to be good on economic and environment issues but bad on sexual abuse and LGBTQ issues, and presumably women in the church. So, yeah, mixed bag. Not a MAGAT. Of course it’s not unknown for popes to have been masquerading to get promoted.
Baud
@CaseyL:
I just he remember what Vance did the last time he met a Pope.
Paul in KY
@suzanne: ‘Both Sides’ people are crazy as shit or ratfuckers or just too too ignorant to exist in modern USA (IMO). I don’t care why or how you pull the level for ‘D’ (in this day and age) But I’ll be damned if I give kudos to some crazypants who thinks that Kamala Harris is basically the same as TFG!
RevRick
@schrodingers_cat: @bbleh:
His choice of Pope Leo XIV is a foretaste of what direction he wants to take the Roman Catholic Church since Leo XIII is known as the “Labor Pope” and developed the social teaching of the Church. He probably represents a continuation of Pope Francis.
brantl
@TaMara: anybody willing to carry their own bucket to this Dumpsterfire is OK with me dump it on the fire and let’sgo get another one.
Paul in KY
@TaMara: There is only one side that is ‘Democratic’.
NotMax
So long as his first act is excommunicating Vance, don’t much care who ascends to be king of The Holy See.
Trivia Man
@Kirk: interesting read
rule 3 sounds a lot like socialism!
WaterGirl
@Omnes Omnibus: Oh. Thank you for clarifying.
p.a.
Left the church long long ago, figure the new guy will be to the right, don’t know how much just because of return-to-the-mean, but also, c’mon, how much sclerosis is there in a 17 century old institution? (Assuming institutionalization beginning with Constantine.). 1,700 years, there aren’t so much guardrails as guard-mountains. Gotta think there’s a “we’ve been around this long, we got this. Thanks for your thoughtful concern and advice, bless your heart, world.”
rikyrah
He has a degree in Mathematics. – the new Pope
Prevost speaks English, Spanish, Italian, French, and Portuguese, and can read Latin and German.
Tony Jay
@Paul in KY:
Everyone needs trained woodworkers, those crosses don’t erect themselves, but he was always more interested in promoting his Personal Spirituality courses and growing his ‘Messiah’s Meals’ Fast Food business.
Never a thought for the future, that boy.
Paul in KY
@Chetan Murthy: It’s not the ‘not voting’. It’s the reason for the ‘not voting’.
Hopefully, she is reassessing her opinion vis a vis the 2 parties.
CaseyL
@NotMax:
Considering how much the Catholic Church has cozied up to, outright supported, and turned a blind eye to, the evil that Catholic rulers get up to, if the new Pope excommunicated a politician for being a stain on the religion (not to mention a waste of protoplasm generally), that would be a Bidenesque BFD.
Baud
@rikyrah:
Liking him more and more.
suzanne
@Paul in KY: You don’t have to give her kudos. I would hope that we (royal we) could potentially find an effective way of persuading her to our side, though.
Berating people — even if they deserve it — has never been effective toward that end.
Chetan Murthy
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): People can change. Not everybody is Stalin.
An example: Bloody Bill Kristol:
2015: https://studentreview.hks.harvard.edu/bill-kristol-cant-teach-us-anything/
March 4: https://bsky.app/profile/billkristolbulwark.bsky.social/post/3ljknmapzxk27
Tom Nichols wrote about this phenomenon: about how people with no particular views on things like LGBTQ rights, or gun laws, would adopt the RWNJ positions, simply b/c they associated with the RW on economic issues, or foreign policy issues. And that the opposite would happen when they started associating with Dems.
I mean, c’mon, this is Bloody Bill Kristol we’re talkin’ about here, and he’s runnin’ around in a Che Guevara t-shirt and waving to us from a float at the Pride Parade.
Trivia Man
@brantl: agree
Just be careful who you look to for leadership in bucket dumping strategy. “Both sides bad” ain’t the path. But “thanks for your help” is in order.
eclare
@CaseyL:
A good start…
Baud
@suzanne:
@Chetan Murthy:
And I hope she changes. But today she insulted us.
HopefullyNotcassandra
@RevRick: yes. Maybe even a touch more liberal this Pope Leo. I hope so. We shall see.
ExPatExDem
@CaseyL: For instance, Hitler was never excommunicated.
TaMara
@Paul in KY: Well, good to know that only those people who act according to your values are allowed to stand up for fundamental rights given to us by the Constitution.
:
RevRick
@Trivia Man: He is a Cubs fan!
Also, Villanova U will now experience a surge in applications ( he majored in math).
Archon
I’m glad shes on the team now and I don’t know her past views but thinking both sides are the same in 2024-25 isn’t just illogical it’s borderline insane.
Ferd of the Nort
@Old School: smoke was not orange. Safe!
JoyceH
@RevRick: I saw him mentioned as a possibility on the CNN coverage as someone who would follow Francis’ lead and not be a repudiation, so I think it’s good.
And BTW, CNN has just been blanketing Rome the last few weeks! Anderson Cooper has the Big Death beat apparently – he moved to London a few years ago to cover the Queen’s death.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Chetan Murthy:
Oh I understand people can change. Unfortunately, Sheehan changed for the worse and became a crank and a bigot
Gin & Tonic
@RevRick: Maybe he will bless his three fellow ‘Nova alums on the Knicks. Although they are already crushing the hated Celtics without his blessing.
RevRick
@CaseyL: @NotMax: Ex communication is generally reserved for violation of Catholic doctrine, not loathsomeness.
But I understand that desire.
Chetan Murthy
@Baud: Oh, now I see that I’ve mixed-up two threads. I thought we were talking about Feiner, the woman who got booted from that Lawler town hall. But you and @Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): were talking about Cindy Sheehan, from long, long ago.
I don’t know whether Sheehan has used her fame to stand against Trump. No idea at all. I was only talking about Feiner. I see she threw away her vote in 2024, which is …. ugh. But at least she got religion eventually.
Jacel
@Fair Economist: This is the first Pope to be younger than me. I suspect this will be the case going forward.
Chetan Murthy
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): I’m sorry, I misunderstood and thought you were talking about Feiner (even though you -wrote- “Sheehan”). Sorry.
Betty Cracker
RE: Emily Feiner, the retired social worker who got tossed out of Lawler’s town hall, the MoJo article I linked in the post says she’s a peace activist who has voted for Dems and Repubs “in the past,” not that she doesn’t see a difference between the parties now. She didn’t vote for Trump or Harris — she wrote in the name of a Palestinian child who was killed in Gaza.
That’s not something I would do these days, but New York isn’t a swing state, and I don’t it makes her a bad person. I admire Feiner for standing up to Lawler and endorse her message: SHOW UP.
But the one thing I learned from this? Y’all don’t read the linked articles! ;-)
Captain C
@RevRick: Wouldn’t extramarital relations with a couch count?
Baud
@Chetan Murthy:
We’re talking about both, but mostly Feiner. She did a good thing, but she apparently equated Trump and us, and still thinks that’s valid. So mixed bag right now.
Steve LaBonne
@CaseyL:
You know who else was an Augustinian?JoyceH
Perhaps not the right thread for this but just saw a news item where Bill Gates accuses Elon Musk of “killing the world’s poorest children” and I’m loving it. Let’s not weasel-word it – Musk KILLED those kids!
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@suzanne:
I have to agree. While it disappoints me that Emily Feiner is a Both Sides non-voter, it doesn’t change that she showed up to a Republican town hall to call out her congressman for not standing up to Trump and got removed for her trouble when she demanded a real answer from him.
Someone like that could still be won over
ETA: And as BC noted above, she lives in NY, which is hardly a swing state, so her vote/non-vote didn’t really affect the outcome
Jay
@Archon:
She’s not on the team, she’s still Team Both Sides.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Chetan Murthy:
No problem
Anyway
@Gin & Tonic: Big Game 3 Saturday afternoon!
Jacel
@ExPatExDem: Pope Bob I? Would being selected as Pope be a promotion or a step down for J. R. “Bob” Dobbs?
RevRick
@Gin & Tonic: I’m a UCONN basketball fan, but will offer wholehearted support to any Big East team. Also, we drive through the Villanova campus whenever we go to visit our daughter and her family.
brantl
@Paul in KY: Any move to the good is a move to the good we need all of them we can get.
catclub
It starts to look like: people who get arrested for vocally/actively opposing something are often those who oppose lots of things. Not joiners.
Baud
@Betty Cracker:
Thanks. Her not voting isn’t great but I was more taken aback by the report that she still thought both sides were the same. I didn’t read the article.
NotMax
The papacy is cluttered with complications.
Both Christopher and the original Stephen I were removed from the church’s official roster of popes, although those decisions remain in dispute in some ivory tower quarters.
ironcity
@suzanne:
“Thank You”
“My Pleasure”
RevRick
@Jay: Part of the holier-than-thou purity squad.
catclub
is this A: “You people should read the linked articles, you might learn something and it would also delay your spouting off your ignorance.”
or B. ” Never read the comments.”
I think it is A.
RevRick
@Steve LaBonne: Augustine?
Glory b
@trollhattan: Funny, although I read somewhere that he spent most of his career as a missionary and teacher in a deeply poverty stricken area in Peru.
NotMax
@RevRick
Ach du leiber!
:)
Paul in KY
@Tony Jay: Want to congrat Liverpool on their great Premier League triumph! Well done! Far and away the best team in the league this year. Will be rooting for City in FA Cup. Crystal Palace has been a thorn in our side over the years. Know they will be frothing at the mouth to get some silverware.
Hope you got to see those Inter/Barca matchs! Football at it’s best.
Archon
@Jay: So shes insane.
The Audacity of Krope
It’s ok to make purity demands of run-of-the-mill voters, just don’t dare make any such demands of politicians…
Old School
From the Dr. Demento Show Facebook page:
Hee hee. Ha ha.
Baud
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):
Honestly, that doesn’t matter to me. We have no business giving geographic dispensations to people. Would you feel differently about her if she were in Pennsylvania?
Another Scott
@Trivia Man: Hey, when it once took around 3 years, then you have to have procedures to make sure it doesn’t happen like that again.
Best wishes,
Scott.
Chigail
@raven: Not Chicago. Southsuburbs.
Dorothy A. Winsor
A Chicago pope. What a shame John Belushi isn’t here to make what he can of that
Paul in KY
@CaseyL: That would be so so so so great!
Baud
@The Audacity of Krope:
Which politician do we allow to vote for Trump? Or not vote because both sides are the same?
We essentially blacklisted Lieberman out of that party for endorsing McCain.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Shalimar:
You’re probably right
eclare
@Paul in KY:
#YNWA
Matt McIrvin
@Dorothy A. Winsor: He’s on a mission from God
Paul in KY
@suzanne: I hope we can. She should be persuadable (if not a ratfucker). Given the evidence and all that…
The Audacity of Krope
@Baud: This woman did not vote for Trump and if a Republican Congress-individual who presumably voted for Trump decided today to switch to the Democrats, we would be singing Hosannahs.
Omnes Omnibus
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): Find a someone senior in the Catholic Church who isn’t a little dirty in the abuse cover-up. I’ll wait.
Baud
@The Audacity of Krope:
I edited my comment.
And I would be singing Hosannas if she joined us. But she hasn’t yet.
NotMax
I’d like to see Pope Popey McPopeface.
@Dorothy A. Winsor
Pope Scarface I?
//
Paul in KY
@Chetan Murthy: There’s alot of strange strange shit that has happened in the last 10 years…
Jacel
@Old School: “Hee hee. Ha ha.” And on the B-side, “.ah aH .eeh heh”
Jay
@Archon:
We will see. She did the FA in 2024, got the FO in 2025, maybe she will learn.
r/Leopards Eating Faces threads are getting quite full.
Still, so far, I have only seen one admission by a MAGgot/Stein voter who admitted they “learned” something.
And that is only because when she told her tale of woe online, the people she thought were her “tribe”, shit all over her and the people she had been shitting on, online for years for being Dems, gave her comfort, support and guidance on how to deal with her Husband being ICEd.
Sure Lurkalot
@TaMara:
I see your point but grifters like Rick Wilson and Steve Schmidt actually do harm the mission. They scoop up money and oxygen, don’t move the needle. Partners in resistance, but not allies, actually opponents, in things we support.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Omnes Omnibus:
I mean, you’re right, but I still wish some pope could make some real reforms on that issue. Maybe this one will surprise us, who knows
Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony
@TaMara: I Agree.
Paul in KY
@TaMara: I’m not saying that and I think you know that. I am glad she protested against TFG and his lickspittles. I would not be glad if she protested for TFG and his lickspittles. She does, of course, have the right to peacefully protest either way.
To me, her odious views about our party and our nominee overshadow the act of protest she engaged in.
The Audacity of Krope
@Baud: A partisan culture of rigid judgment toward non-voters continues to look very ugly to this reliable but still skeptical Dem voter.
I thought this was supposed to be the compassionate party…
Elizabelle
WaPost interviewed a conservative Catholic family from NC, who are visiting Rome. They wanted an American, but not this American.
That seems promising.
NotMax
@Paul in KY
Obligatory?
;)
Glory b
@catclub: I read her Bluesky comments.
Her own words.
JoyceH
@Elizabelle: Ha! And my reaction in the run up discussion was, if it’s an American I hope it’s this American.
Baud
@The Audacity of Krope:
It turns out that being compassionate to people who hate us has not worked to our advantage.
I hope she ends up not hating us.
Eolirin
… Unless Feiner hangs out here, I don’t know why we’re talking about her at all.
It’s an awful lot of energy to waste on someone we’re never doing to interact with.
@Baud: It would be different, yes. Protest votes when the election is not even going to be close can be a deliberate choice to raise an issue without affecting outcome, or just because you have moral issues and the cost of the protest vote is minimal. It’s very different if every vote counts like it does in the low margin states because then you’re directly complicit in the outcomes, and any moral analysis has to include helping the worse option win.
Jay
@The Audacity of Krope:
She got exactly what she “didn’t vote” for.
And FFS, she’s supposedly a Social Worker.
Maybe it will be a learning experience, but I doubt that.
Prometheus Shrugged
@Jacel: Since he’s American, why not Pope Jim-Bob I ?
Omnes Omnibus
Why does Feiner have to be either a hero or an idiot? She did a good thing wrt the Lawler townhall, but doesn’t seem very realistic about politics in general. Let’s not lionize her in general but still praise her actions at the Lawler thing. Is that so hard?
The Audacity of Krope
@Jay: @Baud: Just saying this attitude is among the foremost things on my mind in my deepest moments of doubt about Democrats. “They don’t want to be any better. They’re just entitled.”
Baud
@Eolirin:
Ok. We disagree. I can’t tell people in swing states that have fewer options than every one else.
Baud
@The Audacity of Krope:
I’m not accepting insults for votes. If that means people willfully destroy this country to make me pay, so be it.
schrodingers_cat
@Glory b: Thanks for the info.
Baud
@Omnes Omnibus:
No, some people think true Dems roll over when insulted (unless insulated by a centrist, then they don’t care about pushing people away).
Eolirin
@The Audacity of Krope: Why anyone would conflate the commentators on BJ with the Democratic party, it’s messaging, or the core activist groups that do organizing for it, is beyond me.
We do not have reach, we are not read by the normies in volume, we do not speak for officials, we definitely don’t speak for the party. Don’t extend anything that happens here out to broader conversations and outreach.
It’s a perfectly valid critique to say the people holding those stances are being dumb, mind, but they’re not going to affect The Conversation in a way that’s going to affect election outcomes. Ever. These are all intra-community conflicts with no real chance of spillover.
Bupalos
@Trivia Man: On the other hand, actually getting “both sides bad” people to help us save the planet, reduce inquality, and rebuild communities is literally the entire mission here.
Personally I’m pretty heartened to hear that someone like that it rabble-rousing against Trump. More heartened than I would be to find out she’s voted D her whole life.
Betty Cracker
@Baud: Wait, she hates “us”? Are we still talking about Feiner here? I don’t see any evidence of that. (Maybe I’m confused and y’all are still talking about Sheehan, whose views I’m not familiar with…
@Omnes Omnibus: Seems sensible. Your proposal will therefore be rejected. ;-)
lowtechcyclist
@Shalimar:
The first pope who’s younger than I am!
Ceci7
Does Feiner deserve zero credit for her protest action? No. But yikes, a white lady getting heaps of attention and praise from other white people is pretty fucking irritating once you know she didn’t vote for Harris in November of 2024. The context matters.
karen gail
Been offline; must have hit my head and didn’t notice since have been house cleaning rather than checking to see what is going on in world.
So new pope; an American one. How long before Trump takes credit and how long before Trump starts trying to bully him into doing what he wants?
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: As someone who went through a lot of hardship to get the right to vote I do not understand people like Emily who throw away their vote.
Especially after Jan6 anyone who says with a straight face that both parties are the same is not a serious person and a dictionary defintion of white privilege.
Baud
@Betty Cracker:
If she said both sides are the same, then since the Republicans are fascists, I interpreted that as hatred towards us.
If she didn’t say that, then I’d have to see what she actually said.
Eolirin
@Baud: Privilege comes in many forms. Living in a blue state gives you a kind of it with regard to being a dumbass on voting.
It’s freeriding on being around enough other people who are responsible, but I view that as a lesser evil than being in a position where you might be the deciding vote on something and opting to sit on the side lines.
You don’t have to agree, and I get where you’re coming from, but I think it’s a coherent and reasonable position.
Formerly disgruntled in Oregon
@Omnes Omnibus: No, she did something that made the news, so let’s judge the shit out of her. How dare she?
/s, obv
The Audacity of Krope
Sorry I’m not understanding this. Explain?
If Democrats want to understand why they’re losing votes, they could do worse than to pay at least some attention to the wavering marginal D voters and figure out where those breaking points exist.
Granted, we are an idiosyncratic and diverse group.
Baud
@Eolirin:
No worries. I agree it’s an unearned privilege, which is why I don’t honor it.
NotMax
@Prometheus Shrugged
In for a penny, in for a pound.
Bubba I.
//
Baud
@The Audacity of Krope:
Happy to pay attention to a lot of people. But there are limits.
schrodingers_cat
@Eolirin: Upstate NY is very red. How did she vote down ballot?
Formerly disgruntled in Oregon
@Ceci7: Who is asking for credit? We’re talking about this person like they are running for DNC chair or something…
Paul in KY
@Betty Cracker: You got me! I did not read the linked article.
Baud
I wonder if people would still look on her kindly if she said she could vote for a black woman instead of (supposedly) saying both sides are the same.
The Audacity of Krope
Yet I hear these same views echoed by TV mouthpieces and certain popular alternate media celebrities all the time.
We talk to people who talk to people who talk to people. “My small contributions don’t matter” also matches pretty closely to the attitudes of many of these lefty non-voters so many here love to deride also. Consistency is key.
Besides which this blog has more influence than its small size suggests. A few writers here have grown to bigger roles and we’ve had live conversations with at least one Congressman.
Miss Bianca
@TaMara: Someone who believes in democracy fucking votes. That’s literally the first requirement of a citizen in an alleged democracy.
I suspect there are a lot of people out there who are just more into protesting “The Establishment, Man!”, than taking actual responsibility for maintaining a democracy.
So, my take is that this lady is an idiot, but I’ll accept her as a useful idiot, for now.
They Call Me Noni
@Jay: To me it is a lame excuse and means you paid zero attention because in 2024 both parties were definitely not the same.
Trivia Man
@Baud: he was on my shit list for A) kneecapping gore in the recount process and B) gutting a slim senate “majority” with his prancing pony posturing
Andrya
@RevRick: Speaking as BJ’s token Catholic, you are absolutely correct. Leo XIII wrote the encyclical “Rerum Novarum” which requires a welfare state sufficient that the poorest people are not immiserated, as well endorsing the right of workers to form labor unions. JD Vance will NOT be happy about this.
Formerly disgruntled in Oregon
@Baud: Why are we deep-diving into this person’s politics?
Paul in KY
@brantl: True. If she is ‘moving to the good’ and well away from the ‘both sides’ BS.
schrodingers_cat
@Miss Bianca: Well said. It is the basic duty of a citizen. Step Zero of citizenship.
Baud
@Formerly disgruntled in Oregon:
We’re talking about whether, because she did a nice protest, we should look the other way to the extent she opined that May 8, 2025, there are no differences between Democrats and Republicans.
Suzanne
@The Audacity of Krope:
Most importantly, we talk to people, out in the world. And whether or not we are appealing, inclusive, attractive, aspirational, good people bears on how the political “tribe” is perceived.
I am none of those things, so I stay in my house a lot. You’re all welcome.
Trivia Man
@Bupalos: yes
as a helper, not a leader
cain
@TaMara:
I think it’s purple kush, hybrid sativa/indica.
Baud
@Suzanne:
Same.
Eolirin
@The Audacity of Krope: We’re not “The Democrats”. That kind of work is way above our pay grade. I’m sure the party has people trying to do that. And I’m sure it’ll factor into their outreach, messaging and campaign strategies.
But we’re going to have nothing to do with any of it. And people being personally irritated at whatever they’re irritated at here ultimately doesn’t matter in any way except in how it affects this community.
We fundraise for GOTV organizations. That’s pretty much the extent of our contribution to outcomes as a community.
Jay
@The Audacity of Krope:
Gaza ”supporters” are still protesting, (checks notes) Democrats.
But not Fetterman.
Every 4 years I have to hold my nose and vote strategically.
Did I want to vote a couple of weeks ago, for a Liberal?
Nope, we had a perfectly good and talented NDP MP, but, she was polling 3rd, and the Con was second, and the margin between the Con and the Lib were too damn close.
And a Lib minority, (better) or Majority, (worse), was better than the train wreck that would be a Con minority, (nothing would get done) and the utter disaster a Con majority would be.
IMHO, if you don’t vote, you can’t whinge about The Goberment.
True, you didn’t vote “for” that, you didn’t vote.
Jay
@Betty Cracker:
She (Feiner) went on BlueSky and did some media interviews after she got “Internet Famous” to trash the Democratic Party with the “Both Sides” BS.
Baud
@Eolirin:
Sadly, we subject to the rule of collective responsibility, so the worst Democrat one encounters (from one’s perspective) becomes the embodiment of all Democrats.
It’s what happens when you’re not the party of the default demographic.
Jay
@schrodingers_cat:
She didn’t.
Eolirin
@The Audacity of Krope: None of those congress people are taking our calls on how they run campaigns, and they’re not trolling the comment threads for messaging strategies.
Tone policing people here isn’t going to affect election outcomes. Even if their tone is shitty and needs policing, as all of us occasionally do.
Expanding out the scope makes the argument come across as ridiculous. It’s enough to say being hostile over this stuff isn’t a good look personally, in your opinion, without trying to invoke consequences that literally do not exist.
People can be prickly here without risking the Republic.
The Audacity of Krope
Democrats are probably Gaza supporters’ best chance of getting support. They aren’t going to gain that support by sitting aside saying nothing.
This shaming isn’t meant to persuade anyone, it is meant to ossify the status quo.
Formerly disgruntled in Oregon
@Baud: If she hadn’t made the news with her good political action, would we be talking about her not-so-good political views? Is she running for office or seeking a leadership position of some kind?
I don’t assume that everyone at a protest shares my exact political views. Heretical opinions are all around us. There shouldn’t be a card check or litmus test to fight against the fascists…
If she was here on Balloon Juice espousing that crap, I would push back. But this is different IMHO.
Fair Economist
@Jay:
Boy, that’s telling.
Baud
@Formerly disgruntled in Oregon:
I don’t understand your point. She became a public figure because of her protest, and she’s making statements. That’s why we’re talking about her.
Great. Then what I say about her won’t stop her from fighting fascists.
Betty Cracker
@Baud: I think you left a contraction off a word there, but as far as I know, no one has substantiated the “both sides” claim. Maybe I missed it. All I know about Feiner is from what I read in the article I linked to provide context and that her message, SHOW UP, is a good one.
WaterGirl
@Betty Cracker:
LOL. You didn’t really think they do, did you?
WaterGirl
@catclub: I read it as A.
Chetan Murthy
@Baud: Baud, before I say anything, I want to say that you’re one of the consistently funniest and driest commenters here, and I really appreciate your comments. And if you run, I’ll vote for you in the general!
I’ve been chewing over this situation: of people who are resisting[1], but aren’t in alignment with what we feel are our -core, core, core- values. Stuff like Feiner saying “both sides” fits that. And I thought of an analogous situation: one of the critiques made of single-issue purity-pony voters (e.g. on Gaza), is that they can’t understand that their vote matters, and that when they say “I couldn’t vote for Harris b/c of Gaza [or whatever]” what they’re really saying is they can’t bring themselves to stand with that candidate/ticket/party on the most important issue (who controls the government) b/c of issues that we would regard as secondary. [also, sigh turns out Feiner voted for Hind Rajab, a Palestinian girl who was killed in Gaza, overlap there, sigh].
And I thought to myself: I don’t have to like her, I don’t have to invite her over for coffee[2], but if I decide to vilify her, isn’t that somewhat like those voters above? Just as we would say to those Gaza-and-only-Gaza-matters voters to “grow the fuck up”, shouldn’t we be saying the same to ourselves? Again, I’m not gonna be -friends- with somebody who thinks that the Dems are as bad as the G(r)OPers. But do I want my party to reach out to those people? If they’re gettable votes, -yes-.
OK, as @Eolirin: said, it ain’t like we’re gonna influence The Conversation ™, so maybe this is all moot.
[1] setting aside the possibility that she only appears to resist, so let’s assume she’s genuine.
[2] To be frank, to be completely frank, I would go to listen to Jennifer Rubin speak. But Bloody Bill Kristol? Uh …. no. It’ll take a good many years before I’d attend an event with him. It is what it is.
Baud
@Betty Cracker:
Yes. That should be “couldn’t vote for a black woman.”
If the “both sides” thing isn’t substantiated, then I’ll drop this. I don’t want to waste time on hypotheticals, and I don’t have time to do the research.
ExPatExDem
@Prometheus Shrugged: Jim Bob sounds more particular to rural America or the southeast. Bob is about as generic American as a male name gets (no offense to any resident Bobs).
Jay
@The Audacity of Krope:
They aren’t protesting Republicans.
They aren’t protesting Fetterman.
And right now, there is not a single fucking thing the Democratic Party can do, about the situation Gaza, not for at least 2 years, maybe 4, maybe never. You might never have another election.
Here is a stupid thing, when we had the War in the Woods, we protested MacBlo, we protested the Socreds, we put up blockades that were a PITA for the logging crews,
But we had meetings, not protests with the NDP, the Green Party, the IBEU, the Indigenous Nations.
WaterGirl
@Elizabelle:
“And ye shall know them by their enemies.”
If that’s not in the bible, it should be.
Elizabelle
@JoyceH: We are both pleased. So far.
I like the decades of serving in Peru. That seems significant.
Paul in KY
@NotMax: Red Buttons was a great performer back in the day!
WaterGirl
@Omnes Omnibus:
No, it is not. Or at least it shouldn’t be!
Paul in KY
@Omnes Omnibus: I can get with that.
janesays
@schrodingers_cat: I don’t think it’s unreasonable to hold people accountable for sitting out elections, but equating them with Trumpers is bullshit. Humans are complex creatures and not all people with problematic past behavior are equally bad.
Suzanne
@Baud: I have said before, but it bears repeating….. “your annoying niece with blue hair who goes to Oberlin” affects people’s perception of the Dems. It sucks, but it is real: people want to associate with the people they like.
So, whatever, we can let off steam here at BJ, because that “both sides” bullshit is really frustrating. I hope we (royal we) can figure out ways to be persuasive to the people we encounter who are like this, though.
Betty Cracker
@Jay: Well, Gaza activists did protest against Fetterman. They did protest against Republicans.
schrodingers_cat
@janesays: Where have I compared her to a Trumper?
Falconer
@TaMara: It’s a day late and a dollar short…
janesays
@Baud: If the worst thing Lieberman had done was endorsed McCain, it wouldn’t be that big of a deal. Obnoxious as shit, sure… but the thing I think we should actually be pissed at him about is his role in watering down all of Obama’s legislative efforts, most notably, the ACA.
Betty Cracker
Okay, I laughed…
Suzanne
@Betty Cracker: LMAO. Hot damn.
Baud
@Betty Cracker:
Best endorsement Leo could receive.
janesays
@Chetan Murthy: I love your pragmatism, and I mean that with complete sincerity.
Jay
@Betty Cracker:
2024, spring. Since then, nothing.
A year ago.
OAC’s townhall, last week.
Formerly disgruntled in Oregon
@Betty Cracker: That’s hilarious – and very lyrical!
Formerly disgruntled in Oregon
@Baud: I don’t know, but the pile on rubs me the wrong way.
Tony Jay
@Paul in KY:
On behalf of the team, without whose efforts Arne and I would not have been able to play our respective roles in guiding Liverpool FC to Title 20, I thank you very much. We were never Klopp Majestic, but damn it if we didn’t reinvest that saved energy into being very, very, very hard to get points off.
I’m saying nothing about City vs Palace out of respect, except that you’ve picked a hell of a time to refind form, and if we scoop up late period De Bruyne for a season we will have got a hell of a bargain. What a bloody player.
Chetan Murthy
@janesays: I’m not gonna pretend I like these idiots who decided to resist only -after- the fucking house started burning (hell, after their bedroom caught fire). Just like I’m not gonna pretend I like Bloody Bill Kristol (IIRC the reason he got called that is b/c of his promotion of the Iraq War), and I’m not gonna pretend I don’t remember that he gets most of the credit for picking Sarah Palin, the ur-Trump. I could go on and on and on about all the things about Bloody Bill Kristol that I will not forget.
I’m not gonna forget any of those things, not a one. Compared to Bloody Bill, Ms. Feiner is a piker.
But sure, I’ll give him a kind word in the House of Commons.
The Audacity of Krope
@Betty Cracker: If you ignore it, it didn’t happen. Like some kind of perversion of a famous zen koan.
Baud
@Chetan Murthy:
You shouldn’t vilify her. You should criticize her for saying something wrong or insulting, just like people will criticize you for saying something they think is wrong or insulting.
None of that leads to electing people to exercise political power. Voting is a whole different decision paradigm than deciding what to criticize people over.
jimmirabob
Chicago? Holy Pizzadogs!
raven
@jimmirabob: Holy Italian Beefs!
Baud
@jimmirabob:
Sunday mass will now be postponed so people can watch Da Bears.
Chetan Murthy
@jimmirabob: Is it a bad thing that the only contender whose name I knew was Pizzaballa, and …. for the obvious reason? *grin
Omnes Omnibus
Also, people have the right to do a great many things, but I think many of those things are a bad idea. Feiner had the right to do what she did with her vote, but, man, it was a dumb thing to do.
raven
@Chigail: Yea because NOBODY else from the burbs are said to be Chicagoans.
satby
@Baud: Chicago Archdiocese is (and has been) pretty progressive since Cardinal Bernadine. For a Catholic organization, anyway.
Baud
@satby:
Thanks!
Another Scott
@TaMara: +1
After she did this sensible act of resistance, one that should inspire others no matter where they are in the political spectrum, if we want to strengthen representative democracy, we know that if she had been Mother Mary herself, the monsters would have found something to complain about. “She didn’t keep her kid under control. And where was her husband, anyway?? No wonder her son died so young…” :-/
She supposedly is/was a “dues-paying member of the Working Families Party” so she’s participating in elective politics. And maybe she is participating there because she doesn’t like the major parties. That’s fine. She’s doing her part.
She’s not in the news because she’s somehow representative of all retired voters (or non-voters) in that district – she’s in the news because she acted. We need action now.
We can let the other party beat up on folks who are doing good things to support democracy, IMHO.
Thanks.
Best wishes,
Scott.
The Audacity of Krope
@Another Scott: Fully endorse this statement.
Suzanne
I wonder if the cardinals picked Cardinal Prevost because they wanted to raise a middle finger to FFOTUS.
“OUR CURLY GOLD STUFF IS ACTUAL GOLD, MOTHERFUCKER.”
Baud
@Suzanne:
That’s the hope. Apparently, Leo retweeted Chris Murphy on gun control.
schrodingers_cat
@Jay: So she contributed to putting the guy who had her hauled in office. Own goal.
Citizen Alan
@They Call Me Noni: In my experience, neither the Democrats nor the Republicans wish to completely abolish capitalism. Ergo, they are the same by the only metric that matters to the Greens, the DSAs, and the other pampered cosplay Marxists.
JoyceH
We’ve had over a decade of American catholic conservatives complaining that the pope wasn’t poping right. So now I imagine them rolling their eyes and throwing up their hands “not another works with the poor type!” – and I get a kick out of it.
Montanareddog
@Betty Cracker: just a reminder that Loomer is Jewish; and would be screaming anti-Semitism from the rooftops if a liberal goy was critical of the Chief Rabbi or the like.
Tim C.
I’ve become a big fan of Schnorkels on Bluesky…. that’s not a sentence that would have made any sense a decade ago, but here’s what he thinks.
https://bsky.app/profile/schnorkles.bsky.social/post/3lookudu4r22y
Suzanne
Tempted to go drop in on Rod Dreher. Hopefully he’s having a stroke.
ETA: No stroke, but he seems disappointed. Wrote on Xhitter: “Have the sense that this was a Mark Carney election among the cardinals.”
Good. Get fucked, Rod Dreher.
Socolofi
Ya know friendts, maybe ders some hope for Da Pope, Leo Swersky XIV. Da Pope!
Let us just pray dat he can reform da popacy so dat he can sport a proper stache, and bring aid and comfort to da downtrodden… da marginalized… dose dat have been beaten up for so long, dey don’t know what it feels like to feel hope. You know… Democrats!
And Go Bears! Da Pope Da Pope Da Pope!
Baud
@Suzanne:
Yeah, what little I’m seeing suggests that the right is disappointed. So an early win for us.
Miss Bianca
@Betty Cracker: I think “Woke Marxist Pope” might be my new band name.
me
@Tim C.: https://cdn.bsky.app/img/feed_fullsize/plain/did:plc:q325ug6pkcr6crqhe5lvhomr/bafkreiappot2v5zsraqmpy5cmpovqkgzey2o7quhby5vg5x7lkwr2syzze@jpeg
Russian orthodoxy I bet.
jackmac
As a native of Chicago’s South Side, my first thought about the new pope was to wonder if he’s a White Sox fan. And maybe he could use some divine intervention to resurrect that pathetic team that’s once again worst in the American League.
tam1MI
“Voting strategically” seems to be a concept that American leftists are incapable of grasping.
satby
@Baud: seen on bsky, and true:
Jonathan W. Gray @elmcitytree.bsky.social
· 1h
You mean to tell me that Chicago gets to claim Michael Jordan, the first Black President AND the first American Pope? Good lord you ain’t going to be able to tell them NOTHING.
Jay
@jackmac:
Remember what happened the last time the White Sox won?
The Audacity of Krope
@tam1MI: I understand strategic voting just fine. The term describes most of my voting behavior.
There are lines, though, and different ones for all of us.
Sometimes I find myself wondering if highly partisan Democrats understand the concept of principles.
me
@Jay: 2005? What happened? You mean the Cubs in 2016?
Suzanne
@Baud:
YAY!!!
lowtechcyclist
@Omnes Omnibus:
Apparently. This isn’t the stupidest thing we’ve ever had a long back-and-forth on here, but it’s up there.
lowtechcyclist
@Jay:
When did they reappear? I’ve been told over and over again here that they’d vanished from the face of the earth ever since the election.
The Audacity of Krope
Not the first back and forth on this subject either.
tam1MI
Speaking of excommunication…
Catholic Church to excommunicate priests who comply with child abuse reporting law that requires them to violate the sanctity of the confessional
The Audacity of Krope
Betty provided links; demonstrating they have been protesting Republicans (and Fetterman). Both were prior to the election.
We have several live examples on Balloon Juice, myself included, that show people are still invested in this issue. AOC had someone protesting her for not doing enough on Gaza the other day.
So these categorical statements; that they aren’t protesting anymore and that they don’t protest the other side; turn out to be false, like most categorical statements.
Tim C.
@The Audacity of Krope: Yeah, I fell for this too. My observations here in a very blue city is that I don’t see anywhere near as much performative Gaza protesting. On the other hand, a lot of it is simply no longer helpful to Republican Trumpers it just isn’t getting promoted nearly as much.
The Audacity of Krope
@Tim C.: Also, too, not much to be done with the nearest election about 18 months out (for most of us).
Suzanne
@The Audacity of Krope: Because it’s so much more important to punch hippies who don’t vote the right way.
The fact that the Palestinians are about to be the victims of ethnic cleansing, on top of everything else they have suffered, merits no discussion.
The Audacity of Krope
This. This. This.
It’s much more important that we not be inconvenienced by a decrease in services.
The deportation issue is more salient within the country, but I don’t think it reaches the moral scale of the Palestinian issue.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@Betty Cracker:
You’re just learning this now?
tam1MI
Probably because, thanks in part* to the actions of their so-called advocates in the US, there isn’t sweet fuck-all we can do about it.
* – But only in part.
Miss Bianca
@The Audacity of Krope:
I understand the fucking principle that “voting for the lesser of two evils” is voting for LESS EVIL, period, and that anyone who doesn’t understand that isn’t nearly as “principled” as they think they are.
The Audacity of Krope
@tam1MI: I don’t endorse both sides framing in most cases; but on Palestine, the only difference between the parties is the occasional statement that the ethnic cleansing might be a bit too fast/aggressive. Both sides have no problem paying for it.
On the issue of Palestine, less evil is not on the table with our ossified two party elections.
Torrey
@Suzanne:
Wait, so he’s claiming that The Orange Man has now lost two national elections AND a papal one? The heads of the Southern Baptist Convention and the Happy Bakers’ Tuesday Night Cookie Swap of Cuyahoga Falls had better watch out!
schrodingers_cat
@Miss Bianca: Her district is a purple district and she if she didn’t vote at all she helped elect Lawler and make Johnson the Speaker
Electing Republicans helps Gaza how exactly?
The Audacity of Krope
Simple. It doesn’t.
Does electing Democrats help Gaza?
Suzanne
@tam1MI: You will get to argument from me that much of the pro-Gaza protest was counter-productive and destructive and I wish they were smarter. But that is all small-ball in comparison to the much bigger issue.
schrodingers_cat
@The Audacity of Krope: Biden was better than Trump is on Gaza and Kamala Harris would have been better for Gaza than Trump.
So electing Ds is better.
The Audacity of Krope
@schrodingers_cat: Typical a cat would prefer playing with/torturing their kill rather than doing it quickly.
ETA: I voted for Harris. I was actually glad to. But last year is the last year I give any politician any latitude on this issue.
PatrickG
@Betty Cracker:
Not true! I twice read the word “the” in the sentence above, an article linked directly in your comment!
schrodingers_cat
@The Audacity of Krope:
This makes no sense. I try to engage with you in good faith and this is what I get.
lowtechcyclist
@The Audacity of Krope:
The claim that I questioned was that Gaza protesters are still protesting Democrats. Have these jackals been protesting Democrats over Gaza since the election?
That’s all????
I realize ‘they’ is used by nonbinary persons and the like as a third-person singular pronoun, but in the context of this discussion, it’s still plural. You haven’t proven anything false that I’ve said or implied.
Jay
@schrodingers_cat:
He does not understand the dynamic.
Israel has agency.
The US has “defense” agreements (Treaties) with Israel.
The “Israel” “Block” has an outsized impact and influence in the US.
Biden/Harris, Harris/Waltz’s only ability, given everything , is to act as moral scolds while maybe, getting Israel to “let up on the gas” a little, and get regional actors onboard.
DJTdiot doesn’t give a shit about Gaza except he get’s first dibs on the current oceanfront mass graveyards for his “Trump Gaza”.
Jay
@lowtechcyclist:
117 Democratic Party town halls, events and offices have had “Pro-Palestinian” protests since Nov. 6, 2024.
0 for Fetterman since April 2024.
0 for Rethugs since April 2024.
brantl
@Chetan Murthy: That’s all true, but he’s still a full-boat dick. And still as condescending as hell.
brantl
@RevRick: I think killing innocent oeople makes you an appostate.
Paul in KY
@Tony Jay: Yeah, he’s one of the greatest to ever play PL. Hope he does sign with y’all!
Paul in KY
@tam1MI: It sure does.
Paul in KY
@The Audacity of Krope: We do. The Principle Of Keeping The Fucking GQP Out Of Power.
It’s quite a principle…
Paul in KY
@Suzanne: Not voting the ‘right’ way is what gets shitheels like TFG in office. Sorta the ‘prime reason’, IMO.
Paul in KY
@Miss Bianca: They are too principled!! LOLing!
Paul in KY
@The Audacity of Krope: Just wait, oh principled one…
Paul in KY
@The Audacity of Krope: Yes, as unfortunately you and I will see.
Paul in KY
@schrodingers_cat: Nuking Gaza would be more ‘humane’ to those getting nuked or something like that.
Paul in KY
@Jay: He understands it.