I’ve transited through four countries since June 19th and I am not quite certain what time or day it is, but sources converge on it being Friday morning UK time.
Just going to throw up an open thread featuring this very amusing post by Senator Patty Murray (D-WA):
I am almost through my work backlog and will have more to say later about my first, very brief, visit to the US during Trump II. Meanwhile, good morning or whatever; talk amongst yourselves.
Jay
Glad you got in safely and then managed to escape.
montanareddog
They did not check your social media on arrival in the US, then?
Jay
@montanareddog:
Apparently it’s 1 in10 for US Citizens, higher for non-US Citizens, with some being pre-selected based on CBS/HS/ICE pre-searches of social media posts.
JoyceH
@Jay: Wait, they’re checking social media of US citizens?! WHY?
sab
@JoyceH: Because they can.
Jay
@JoyceH:
Intimidation/Thought Police. In the past few weeks CBSA sent out a tweet that their mandate also includes having “dangerous ideas” cross the Border. It’s a random search 1:10 roughly, so far.
For Foreign travelers and Foreign students, requiring a visa, it’s much worse. Part of the new Visa rules is you have to give access to your social media when applying. Some are simply denied the visa, some, CBSA set’s a trap, arrests them and sends them to ICE “custody” where eventually after days, or weeks or months, they are deported.
For those Foreign travelers that currently don’t need a visa, once again it’s a random search, about 1:5.
And of course, there are 34 countries, so far (not ruZZia), mostly Africa, where there is a travel ban.
It’s a great big fucking “Not Welcome Sign”, signed by Timu Gobbels.
Betty Cracker
Well done, Senator Murray.
sab
What a world and a country when a highly respected senator ( Murray) has to mock and parody the president ( good job there she did) just to be heard.
Elizabelle
Welcome back, Rose. Rest up!
And Patty Murray is brilliant to take this tack. More Democrats and Trump opponents should do so. Thank you very much for … you know the drill.
MagdaInBlack
Oh boy. Taco Don gonna be big spittle-flecked mad at Senator Murray. Looking forward to the show
p.s. it’s 78 feels like 84 at 4:30 am in NW Chicagoland.
What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?
@sab: The First Amendment says they can’t but I guess they’ve decided that is optional too, along with the 5th. And they’re monitoring certain people stockpiling weapons so even the 2nd won’t last beyond the point when ICE agents face armed resistance should that point be reached. I’m sure SCOTUS will give us shadow docket rulings saying it’s all OK without any explanation because they can’t be bothered to show their work anymore. Also because they can’t explain away Invalidating the Bill of Rights with arguments people won’t laugh at. The laughs would be bitter but still they don’t want to be laughed at.
A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan)
My husband and I were in London for 10 days recently (flew home May 16) and there was no scrutiny or trouble coming through Immigration. I had put a password on my cellphone out of an abundance of caution, but it wasn’t needed. Of course, we are 70+ yo white people native born citizens, coming through SFO, so our privilege is pretty immense. Still, it was a relief to get through. Note: The agent didn’t say “welcome home” the way they always have in the past
ETA Patty Murray rocks!
Baud
@A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan):
At least he didn’t say “Get out while you can!”
Mr. Mack
Good morning. My phone has been ringing non-stop. The random stops of “immigrant looking” people has arrived here in my deep Red, mostly agricultural county. I get calls from guys looking for work because they cannot drive to their work, or are afraid to be on a job-site if they are dropped off. I was able to keep a couple busy and earning but the fear is growing and I am worried that people here were lulled into a false sense of security because we are not a Blue State City. Some have returned to Mexico. Other waiting it out. Local economy is starting to feel it.
J.
Brilliant. Hope Murray’s post gets through to people. And safe travels to you, Rose.
raven
@Mr. Mack: I’ve contacted our painter to schedule a house painting. The guy is Mexican but his workers are a mix on Mexicans and Salvadorians and I’m wondering how they are doing?
Mr. Mack
@raven: If memory serves you are in North Georgia? We were just in Helen a few weeks ago, and I happened to strike up a conversation with a local who told me they have not felt any shift in his area.
Suzanne
Patty Murray might be the first Democrat to make me LAFF since last November. (I’ve scornfully laughed at much of the GOP.) Good on you, Sen. Murray!
Dorothy A. Winsor
I see Kos is apparently being targeted by the administration. They’re raising money for a legal defense fund.
tobie
Saucy Senator Murray is the best Senator Murray. I’m high-fiving her.
I’m amazed, Rose, that you had the time and energy to post at all after all that travel. Thanks for the thread. Rest up.
NotMax
@A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan)
Should that welcome happen, do not respond, “Muchas gracias, amigo.”
//
Professor Bigfoot
@NotMax: Whenever I came home from an international trip— hell, ANY interaction with ANY “law enforcement official” I put on my very best Midwestern American White Guy accent.
”Hey there officer! Yeah, just back from New Delhi— you wouldn’t believe how insanely hot it is right now! My next trip will wait ‘til winter!”
Officer smiles, agrees, waves me through
”Hey, thanks, appreciate it! You stay safe, now!”
(hustles the fuck outta there)
What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?
@tobie: Yeah more Dems need to mimic Trump’s style back at him. Honestly I think the thing that one thing that helped sink the Democrats this past election is people just tune out standard politician-speak these days. They hear the cadence and attempted sloganeering and just tune it out. Trump has been a politician for a decade now but his main strength is not sounding like one. It’s the source of his unfounded “tells it like it is” credibility.
Suzanne
@Professor Bigfoot: As a Vagina-American, any interaction with law enforcement results in me sounding like the stereotypical French maid. “Yes, sir! Of course, officer! Thank you so much, m’lord!”.
If I had more huevos, I’d call one of them Big Daddy and see what happens.
Bruce K in ATH-GR
@Jay: When I went to the US for my surgery, I just disabled the biometric unlock on my phone while travelling. I went through without incident, probably because I have the face of a “Real Murikan” rather than the face of a Scary Brown Person who’d be about one percent as likely to be an actual threat.
Suzanne
@What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?: Agree. There’s a lot of style and performance stuff that we struggle with. Part of that is due to shifts in media, like YouTube and podcasts favor these longer, off-the-cuff conversations rather than scripted addresses.
tobie
@What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?:
You are so right! That’s a powerful insight. I knew something was happening with political rhetoric but couldn’t figure out exactly what it was.
Baud
@What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?:
Trump spent most of his life as an celebrity entertainer.
I don’t think you’re wrong, but it’s rare for real political leaders to develop that skill set.
YY_Sima Qian
Total “banana republic” sh*t:
Shades of the Empress Dowager Cixi diverting funds earmarked for modernize the Qing Navy toward constructing a new Summer Palace (after the old one was torched by the invading British & French troops during the 2nd Opium War). The only boat built was a stone pleasure boat on the lakeside in the Summer Palace.
This is aside from whether the hundreds of billions of USD to modernize the U.S.’ nuclear triad is the right utilization of precious resources.
I have seen people draw the parallel between the current U.S. & late Qing Empire or the late USSR in its decline & dysfunction.
wenchacha
I have some anxiety for my DIL, a Japanese national with green card. She is an artist who promotes peace and love of nature. Last week, she held a workshop with immigrants to do collages of their experiences. Not political, but who knows? They come thru LAX or SFO, so probably okay, but seriously, fuck this shit.
NotMax
@Suzanne
Howzabout Mr. Big?
:)
tobie
I gather that Karoline Leavitt came to the press briefing room prepared to smear the reporter Natasha Bertrand. She read from a page in her binder just like Pam Bondi did when appearing before the Senate. Bertrand is a good reporter with great sources. I’m actually worried about her. The new McCarthyism on display aims to destroy the reputation of any reporter who has the temerity to ask questions about this admin.
Trivia Man
@Professor Bigfoot: i had a friend in the 80’s who traveled extensively. He was a nurse and volunteered to provide medical aid in some real hot spots like Afghanistan.
When he was coming back through Houston from Nicaragua, a good old boy at the border and narrowed his eyes. “Why would you go to nicaragua?” My friend looked around furtively, lowered his voice, and replied, “just between you and me, i went to get me a couple of commies.”
Loud guffaw, slap on the back, and waved through.
Trivia Man
@Suzanne: dont forget to giggle
Suzanne
@Baud: Well, that’s exactly the problem, right? Most politicians come up through law school and some via business, and they don’t learn performance skills. They don’t learn imagecraft. They don’t learn how to command attention. But these are elements of success.
I have noted here for months that Trump beat every other Republican racist he competed against and that we here underestimated the value of those skills. We’re just randos with no power, so that’s fine, but I hope that the high-priced Democratic media strategists and campaign consultants are refreshing their damn skills.
Baud
@Suzanne:
I think most of us have operated under the fantasy that policies and achievements matter more, and that performative skills are mostly relevant in deciding between two similar candidates.
ETA: We also obsess about the content of messaging, but ignore the importance of delivery.
Suzanne
@Baud: Policies and achievements matter primarily to weirdos like us.
NotMax
@tobie
One wonders if she sings Those Were the Good Old Days as a lullaby for the newborn infant she has at home.
//
Jay
@Bruce K in ATH-GR:
DHS/CBSA/ICE are not looking for actual threats, they are not following the law, and they are ignoring the Courts.
Soprano2
@Suzanne: I think one of Schumer’s problems is that every time I see him speaking he’s looking down through those glasses, reading off a piece of paper. It comes off as robotic, as if he doesn’t know what to say unless he has something written down. I think people definitely tune that out.
MrPug
Yes, please more of this Democrats. If we are going to live in a bad sequel to Idiocracy you might as well communicate with the electorate we have not the one you would want.
tobie
@Suzanne: Litigators have pretty good performance skills. Good litigators are quick on their feet. Jasmine Crockett credits her time as a trial attorney for her sharp verbal style. Former prosecutor Dan Goldman is among the most effective Dems at hearings. Ditto for Jared Moskowitz who knows how to play James Comer like a fiddle. I actually think there are a lot of good communicators on the Dem side. Politically attuned Dems tend to be very critical of their own and that combined with the rightwing media Wurlitzer makes it tough for any voice to break through.
Soprano2
@wenchacha: The owner at one of the Chinese restaurants we go to had a sign up saying they will be closed the week after July 4th. I asked him if he was taking a vacation, and he said no, some of the cooks have family coming here to visit from China since they went there last year (they were closed almost a month last summer). I wished him luck. I’m not sure he understood why I said that, although I’m sure they’re fully aware of the problems immigrant travelers face in the U.S. these days. I hope their visit goes off without incident.
Geminid
@tobie: Hegseth’s weird press conference yesterday is getting a lot of attention. Turkish reporter Ragip Soylu expressed solidarity fellow journalist Jennifer Griffin.
Soylu posted this with a clip of Hegseth bullying his former Fox News colleague.. Then he posted a picture of Hegseth trying to look fierce, with the question:
Responses ranged from the straightforward “May Allah destroy this kaffir,” to “He acts like someone with rabies.” One wag chimed in:
Baud
@tobie:
That’s true too.
Soprano2
@Baud: We’re desperate to believe people care more about ideas than appearances, but we’re wrong. People care more about “vibes” and how they feel about someone than they do about their policies or what they’ve actually done for people. The past presidential election proved that to me. People trust their “gut feelings”, which aren’t always right.
tobie
@Geminid: That final jab is priceless. Whoever came up with “Karen Jinn” should copyright it. Good on Soylu for defending a colleague.
Suzanne
@Soprano2: It doesn’t just come across as robotic to read off a paper or a teleprompter, it comes off as fake. And cautious. It feels practiced and thus insincere.
@tobie: We have some good ones, yes. IMO, we don’t do a great job selecting for good public performers, though. We see it more like the cherry on top of a resume. For example, for years, some commenters here have said, with some degree of dismissiveness, that Obama was primarily good at “speechifying”. But, like, Obama was clearly good at connecting emotionally with people! He has a critical skill. That’s the foundation of political capital!
Jay
I went to Tyler Bucket’s you tube channel where he talks in a flip way about the Canadian Boycotts from an American POV. Like the Eastern Seaboard Governors who went to New Brunswick to meet with the Atlantic Province Premiers, to beg Canadians to “come back”, he just doesn’t get it.
In the comments, over 1200 Canadians , some Europeans, Asians and Australians pointed it out to him. It’s not the tariffs (FFS), it’s the threats and insults. The US cannot be trusted, on Trade, on Human Rights, on Law, on Defense, on Global Security.
The Boycotts are grassroots and started in January.
And as many commenters pointed out, we have found Canadian and other Countries products just as good, or better, often cheaper, and once Brand Loyalty is lost, it almost never comes back. Canadian purchase of US wines is down 97%. Tennessee Bourbon and whiskey, 100%.
Funny thing about Bourbon, it’s only Bourbon if it’s made in the US. Otherwise it’s just Corn Whiskey aged in Oak barrels, and Canada has some global award winning “corn whiskeys”.
NotMax
@Suzanne
I have no problem with people reading from a piece of paper. I do have a problem with people like Schumer presuming it effective at projecting gravitas.
Baud
@Soprano2:
IMHO that’s why Dem self hate is so destructive. Kills the vibes.
Scout211
Yes! I have been thinking about posting that in a comment for weeks. Not only does that half-glass looking down to read a statement look robotic, it also looks pompous, like he is looking down at his constituents.
I usually am reluctant to comment on appearances so I have actually deleted a comment about his demeanor twice. But I am upvoting your comment now since at least you see it, too.
I have no idea if this is even an issue for others, but for me, the half-glasses forcing him to look at the camera and audience with his head down is not a good look. And reading his statement every time is also not a good look.
Someone, please get him regular bifocals so he can look directly at the camera and audience.
ETA: I realize this is not a big issue compared to what else is happening in our democracy, but as the spokesperson for the Senate Dems, it’s really not effective enough. IMHO.
And what Suzanne said at #48
TONYG
Good message from Patty Murray! But it still has too many words with more than one syllable, and she should have included some crayon drawings. It needs to be dumbed-down a little more to be comprehensible by the GOP.
Ramalama
I spent a month in California, traveling from Montreal, going through border protection via Toronto. Not a lot of people in the airport going to Los Angeles. The lines were very small to get through security. Before flying out of Canada my flight changed three times, whittling people down into one flight that day. I don’t know if it was one flight per day to LA but since the dates kept changing, I’m thinking they were reducing it to one flight per week. My plane was nearly full.
Removed social from my phone and laptop. Removed fingerprint security. Black woman border guard. I’ve passed through border security literally a thousand times (via land when I commuted weekly to Montreal ), I assume a face and tone that gets me through but I am a white lady.
And then I proceeded to eat my weight in Mexican food because in Quebec it’s limited.
Saw family, a college friend. The landscape is a marvel, driving a thousand miles. People talking about how lame they thought the governor has been but how good he’s been stepping up against ICE and Trump in LA.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: Going on anti-Semitic and racist podcasts is the new ticket for up and coming politicians who want to run as Democrats in the general election. Just offer free goodies and you are golden.
tobie
@Suzanne: One of the beauties of the idea of a shadow cabinet is that it would put some of the most convincing Dem speakers out there to speak to the public. Jamie Raskin, for example, should be the voice on Constitutional issues. I’d actually like to see Stacey Abrams in some role because she’s been a favorite of mine for some time, brilliant and eloquent at once, but I gather that’s not a view universally shared. Anyhow, a shadow cabinet would be good, and might ease some of the tension between those who have a handle on parliamentary procedure, and those who move people with their words.
Betty
@Suzanne: Well, but lawyers who do trial work do have to have good performance skills to be effective. Maybe most lawyer politicians weren’t trial lawyers or those who were feel that showmanship isn’t appropriate for a politician.
Baud
@schrodingers_cat:
I don’t know what you’re referring to. I don’t do podcasts.
Suzanne
@tobie: Agree bigtime. We have some people who are good at this stuff, too, and the shadow cabinet approach would serve to elevate their profiles. The career development aspect is just as important for our long-term success as the visible opposition aspect.
prostratedragon
@Professor Bigfoot:
From Sorry to Bother You
raven
@Mr. Mack: Yea, Athens is officially “Northeast Georgia” and we have a large poultry processing plant.
zhena gogolia
@Baud: I think this refers to the Brian Tyler Cohen (?) video WG posted yesterday about reaching out to Joe Rogan and somebody else I never heard of. This was also Ari Melber’s line on MSNBC the other day.
Belafon
@Soprano2: if I were in his position, I would have to have a piece of paper with the list of things to talk about because I would forget more than two.
Baud
@zhena gogolia:
I didn’t see it. The advice about going on Rogan is hardly new. I believe it’s also a point of agreement between white male centrists and white male lefties.
Baud
I wonder if our politicians should get face deforming plastic surgery and spray on orange tans too.
Suzanne
@Betty:
I understand that some people might feel this way, but I submit that we are going to lose a lot if we don’t compete on that field.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: Neither do I. Some of these podcasters/YouTubers were used in ads by the winning candidate of the Dem primary.
Exhibit I
This guy makes Swastika Art as a “joke”
Exhibit 2
This guy wears T shirts that say 9/11 was an inside job. I am sure that’s a “joke” as well.
Jay
@Baud:
I doubt that going on Joe Rogan would be effective outreach. He’s insipid and pretty dumb.
He just realized the other day that Mass Deportations at Taco Don’s rallies meant “deport them all” and is shocked, shocked, I tell you, despite having Nazi’s and Rethugs on his show for years saying “Deport them All” and that raids are going on at Home Depot, farms, Bodega’s, etc and that War Hero’s and hard working honest people are being rounded up and sent to Concentration Camps.
Steve in the ATL
@NotMax: or, worse, “salaam, habibi!”
Matt McIrvin
@Suzanne:
And yet, I remember often hearing him described as “aloof” or introverted, because he didn’t really go for some of the kinds of elite schmoozing that political-media people demanded. I think he could also come off as having an intellectual, professorial air that pissed off right-wingers, especially if they saw a Black man doing it. People who act like that aren’t supposed to win Presidential elections, period.
Baud
@schrodingers_cat:
Thanks. At least he didn’t talk democracy with Liz Cheney!
schrodingers_cat
@zhena gogolia: I didn’t get it from Cohen. Its just in the air. Make nice with bigots and offer free stuff. Throw minorities that don’t toe the socialist line and/or and fawn over their socialist betters under the bus.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: Indeed.
Now they are dreaming of ousting Jeffries and Schumer.
Baud
@Jay:
I don’t know. I’m making a concerted effort to avoid opining on what works because I have no clue.
Jay
@Matt McIrvin:
Joe Biden had the same skill, but,…………………..
Baud
@schrodingers_cat:
Schumer isn’t up until 2028 and may not run again anyway.
Layer8Problem
@Baud: Not enough of the political equivalents of soft-shoe routines with straw hats and canes, or standing in WWF rings hitting Republicans with chairs. Guess you have to go to politics with the voters you have, not the voters you want.
Trivia Man
@tobie: and Pete for transportation. Not to say the shadow cabinet can never comment in other issues, but my vision is give the lazy media an easy soundbite. Make Both Sides an easy hook for their lazy stories. Be intentional about who they go to first. Instead of a back bencher from a safe district, make sure our most coherent and disciplined voices get asked to comment every time.
Matt McIrvin
@Jay: Biden was *great* at schmoozing, but he wasn’t a golden speechifier unless you consider that he was compensating for a lifelong stutter. He was good at connecting with people and could do the down-home “look, here’s the deal, no malarkey” explanation, though. One of his greatest moments, I thought, was before he was President, when he explained to Congress in words of one syllable how tax brackets worked because apparently some people were trying really hard not to understand.
I think the years just caught up with him in the end, made it harder for him to project that though his mind was fully intact.
Jay
@Baud:
The Pod Boy’s and some of the Consultant class are pushing Rogan and other “influencers” as a means to “reach the yutes”.
Rogan and the other leading young male “influencers” basically sell Toxic Masculinity, veiled Racism and Misogamy, not exactly the Democratic Party “Brand”.
Meanwhile, Zohran Mandami shows how it is done in NYC. Low turn out election (35%), record number of young males and young women turned out to vote for him.
Baud
@Layer8Problem:
I don’t assume that mimicking Republicans will work for Dems. But since I don’t know what will work, I’m not in a position to tell anyone else they’re wrong.
Trivia Man
@schrodingers_cat: “offer free stuff” is a lazy and incorrect framing. Helping void predatory student loans for people who took public sector jobs is often pitched as “free stuff” or a bribe for votes. Its the right thing to do.
I vehemently disagree that spending tax dollars on stuff that benefits people directly is “free stuff”.
Suzanne
@Matt McIrvin: The “noun, verb, and 9/11” quip was one of Joe’s finest moments. Funny, smart, and unpretentious.
Jay
@Matt McIrvin:
I think that President Joe Biden wound up being “managed”. When he was on his own in a crowd, or one on one, or impromptu, he was great. When he was behind a podium, as President, he seemed “inauthentic”.
Maccheerful
I can proudly say I voted for Senator Murray when she was just a state senator. Hero of the Shoreline School District Matriarchy.
For those who live in the Seattle area I repeat a notice of last night. There will be a screening of a film Searching for Nika, at the Seattle Film Festival tonight, Friday, at 7 pm. You can order tickets online here or go to the door.
https://ukrainedefensesupport.org/ev/searching-for-nika-fillm-screening/
There will be Ukrainian food! The director will be there! You can ask him about cinema. Or the War. Or about dogs.
Proceeds go to buying medical supplies and nonlethal military equipment (portable power generators, night vision binoculars, drone repair parts, etc.) for Ukraine.
Suzanne
@Trivia Man:
100%.
Republicans have long called public goods and the social safety net “giving away free stuff”. Fuck that framing. MOAR “FREE STUFF”, paid for by higher taxes, please!
Soprano2
@Scout211: To me this isn’t commenting about “appearances”, it’s about whether or not he can get the message out in an effective way. Like it or not, learning how to be an effective communicator on video is an important skill for a politician to have now. Used to be it didn’t matter that much, but now it does. If he weren’t Senate Minority Leader it wouldn’t matter as much. He might be a great manager, which is a skill you need in that position, but he’s not a good communicator in the video age.
Professor Bigfoot
@Trivia Man: I owe that man a beer. 😂
Soprano2
@Belafon: I don’t have a problem with having notes. My problem is with looking down and reading off the paper as if he has no idea what he’s going to say. It looks bad, like it’s insincere.
Soprano2
@Baud: Oh God NO!!!
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@YY_Sima Qian: Don’t you think comparing the Trump admin to the Qing is slandering the Qing?
Suzanne
@Jay: I am a believer that going to some of these toxic dudebro places is a net positive. Look at Pete B going on Andrew Schultz’s podcast, that was a huge win for him. I don’t think Dem absence is interpreted as some sort of principled stand. I think it just leaves a vacuum for a lot of people, which is then filled with more toxic bullshit. We want our message to break through, and that’s necessarily going to entail going to some unfriendly spaces. So what? That’s literally the mission.
NotMax
@Baud
What, no ear cozies and diapers? “In for a penny, in for a pound.”
//
NotMax
@raven
Northeast Georgia. Isn’t that akin to saying southern South Carolina? (I keed, I keed.)
:)
YY_Sima Qian
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: Not if you know how bad the late Qing decades were.
Miss Bianca
@Suzanne:
Yeah, well, “funny, smart, and umpretentious” IS Joe Biden. Too bad so many people decided that “old” was Joe Biden.
Suzanne
Oh look, here’s that leftist radical Bill Kristol, on the topic of Mamdani supporting “free stuff”:
Moar free public college, please.
NotMax
@YY_Sima Qian
“No Qings.”
/couldn’t resist
Steve in the ATL
@NotMax: dude. Not cool!
YY_Sima Qian
@Suzanne: A small step forward in de-financialization of necessities for human welfare: education, housing, health care, utilities, etc.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@YY_Sima Qian:
That’s from last night. Yes, I’m the former military intel guy, civilian, first worked for the Navy, then DIA assigned to the Joint Staff at the Pentagon. My main area was China and North Korea navies but also did Warsaw Pact navies before the collapse and eventually did China Air Force and North Korean missile exports.
Was also the main DIA guy on the Spratlys (actually putting my MA in Geography to use in a professional setting!)
I was *always* lefty. None of this “I used to be a libertarian until…”, or “I believe in public education ‘in theory'”, or “Government shouldn’t do anything to somebody’s private property” crap. Self-identified Dem since before I was eligible to vote.
In the intel business, at least during my tenure (85-96), politics didn’t color the work. Most people there were politically conservative but we all felt a more diverse background and outlook helped make our intel analysis better…and that it better served decision makers no matter who they were.
My friends who were still in after I left on our cockamamie journey to Central Misery to be innkeepers always told me that ethos I just described went away in the lead up to Dubya’s Great Mesopotamian Adventure.
That being said, other agencies, namely CIA, always had their own agenda. I spent many a morning doing the J2 briefing at the Pentagon deftly telling them to pay no attention to wtf CIA was saying.
Suzanne
@YY_Sima Qian: I am a huge fan of free stuff — and literally every time in my life that the choice has been presented to me, I have voted to increase my taxes. My kids attend public schools, my husband works in them, I attended them. Public libraries, public parks, improved roads and bridges and transit, bike lanes, healthcare, public housing, childcare and elder care, cleanup of polluted areas….. sign me up for every bit of it. Free at the point of transaction. Free stuff.
Geminid
@Suzanne: I think most elected Democrats at the Congressional level have good political skills in their own right, independent of consultants and strategists. The good ones keep practicing and building them, particularly those who have challenging districts; Rep. Sharice Davids (KS) for example, or former Rep. Abigail Spanberger (VA).
Rep. Davids hardly ever shows up on national news sites, but a look at local and state news sources shows that when she’s not in Washington, Davids is retail politicking almost full time. She’s interacting with constituents at all kinds of venues and events, building knowledge and building skills
Davids was a newcomer to politics in 2018 when she ran for Congress and won, but she had aptitude and a work ethic and those are qualities she did not get from consultants. And while Davids might read a strategist’s memo laying voters’ concerns as reported by polling, she can measure its conclusions against her own interactions with voters. To a large extent, Sharice Davids’ best consultant and strategist might be Sharice Davids.
Like Davids, Abigail Spanberger was a political newcomer who flipped a Republican seat in 2018. Spanberger’s district was even tougher than Davids’ district, and she had to work really hard to win her first election and the two following, And Spanberger being a smart woman, I expect she learned a lot in the process.
Now that Spanberger is running statewide, for Virginia Governor, she neccesarily must rely on consultants and strategists because there are ten times as many voters in the mix. But she’s already developed the skills that led Bill Bolling to describe her as “a formidible politician” in 2023, when she announced her run for Governor. Bolling might know what he’s talking about. The former Lt. Governor is a shrewd observer who won eight of eight races in his career, including two statewide.
I have not paid that much attention to Spanberger’s campaign so far, partly because there’s been so much going on elsewhere but also because there’s little suspense as to the outcome. But I’ll make some time this summer and fall to follow her speeches and appearances in order to see how Spanberger has progressed in her trade and craft of politician.
I might end up following the New Jersey Governor’s race more closely because I think it will be a real fight. This race features another Class of 2018 member, Rep. Sherrill. Like Davids and Spanberger, Sherrill was a political newcomer when she flipped a Republican seat in that year’s Blue Wave.
Now she’s running statewide against a strong opponent. Sherrill ought to be able to win this, but she’ll have to bring her A-game to pull it off and I think she knows that. I’m interested in seeing how good Sherrill’s A-game is.
Jay
@Suzanne:
It’s not a case of not going to hostile spots, it’s about not going to bonehead spots. If the podcaster is intelligent, asks tough questions, that’s just fine.
Rogan does not do that and he does not appear to “learn” anything from his “interviews”.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@Jay:
Exactly.
Professor Bigfoot
@schrodingers_cat: I dunno anymore.
Maybe it takes a white dude going to white dudeland and saying white dude shit to get through to white people.
“It’s a bold move, Cotton. Let’s see how it works out for him.” 😉
(give the devil his due, Governor Hollywood HAS been lighting up Trump and ICE, so there’s that)
Suzanne
@Jay: I don’t care about Rogan specifically, although I do think that anywhere there is a large audience, there is a compelling reason to get in front of it. I also think that a smart and skilled performer can find a way to make themselves look good in any situation. Even if a politician comes across as genuinely likeable or personable, even if there is no explicitly political content at all, I think that accrues points in favor. The 21st century version of baby-kissing and eating the Iowa State Fair food and other dumb shit that has been part of politics forever.
ETA: Remember that it isn’t really talking to Rogan or Theo Von or Andrew Schultz or whomever. It’s talking to the people listening and watching. That’s the job. Turning away from it isn’t proving to be effective.
Professor Bigfoot
@prostratedragon: First I guffawed. When Mrs. B looked quizzically at me, I played it for her and SHE guffawed.
An’ I sez ta her, I sez, “see, this is why I hang out at that joint!”😉😂
Other MJS
Murray should have waited a bit and started with “HAPPY INDEPENDENCE DAY TO ALL, INCLUDING TRAITOROUS AND SADISTIC MAGATS WHO WROTE THE BIG UGLY BILL THAT KICKS PEOPLE OFF HEALTH CARE …”
Denali5
Yesterday I saw a sign – Let’s Go, TACO. I thought it might catch on.
jimmiraybob
I assume by now that we all realize that “90 deals in 90 days” is about deals with the devil for chucks of our national soul. I assume the White House has an auxiliary branch at the Crossroads.
artem1s
Being able to look the voters in the eye while they are telling bald face lies and winging their latest hot take, also seems to be a preference of the White male “vibe is everything’ advocates (left and right). Much more effective than reading prepared statements and making sure you are getting your facts straight and not underbussing your colleagues. /s
Matt
Re: NYC – the corpo-centrist wing of the party has decided on a reaction to the result. It’s double-down on the anti-Muslim bigotry:
https://abc3340.com/news/nation-world/new-york-democratic-senator-kreistin-gillibrand-calls-on-mayoral-candidate-zohran-mamdani-to-denounce-intifada-comments-eric-adams
I predict we’ll see more and more of this leading up to November; these people are utterly terrified that somebody might actually get elected and implement useful policies. Folks like Gillibrand would prefer to sit around collecting bribes from crypto companies and playing the Washington Generals role for fascism than ever, ever, EVER admit that a socialist idea might be good.
YY_Sima Qian
@comrade scotts agenda of rage: Fascinating! Thank you sharing!
artem1s
@Jay: How quickly we forget his masterful denunciation of MAGAt during his SOTU address. It was probably the best SOTU I’ve ever heard. And he routinely set the Senate floor on fire on behalf of Obama for 8 solid years. He routinely slapped down the snot nosed Turks and chewed up the media who tried to spin those smack downs as ‘gaffs’.
Yep, he was no JFK, thank the FSM.
trollhattan
YOU GO, PATTY MURRY! I APPROVE THIS BIGLY MESSAGE BIGLY.
MAKE AMERICA LESS ILLITERATE AGAIN! CAN PEOPLE READ FIVE WORDS PRINTED ON A RED FIELD? CAN THEY PROCESS A DOUBLE-NEGATIVE? ASKING FOR A DIM FRIEND.
Trivia Man
@Professor Bigfoot: he is still an amazing humanitarian. Frequently walked the walk instead of just talking about compassion.