Credit where credit is due, because the Republican Governor of Utah gets it:
The Republican governor of Utah on Monday said his party is blighted by leaders in Congress whose lack of new ideas renders them so “inconsequential” that he doesn’t even bother to talk to them.
“I don’t even know the congressional leadership,” Gov. Jon Huntsman Jr. told editors and reporters at The Washington Times, shrugging off questions about top congressional Republicans, including House Minority Leader John A. Boehner of Ohio and Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell of Kentucky. “I have not met them. I don’t listen or read whatever it is they say because it is inconsequential – completely.”
***Unlike some of his Republican counterparts in other states, Mr. Huntsman said he will not turn back any of his state’s share of President Obama’s $787 billion economic stimulus. But he said much of the spending is misdirected and more likely to bloat the government than boost the economy.
He said congressional Republicans failed to score political points for opposing the bill – only three Republican senators supported it – because the public saw them as objecting to being shut out by Democrats from helping write the bill rather than as taking a principled stand.
The governor said congressional Republicans are being frustrated by a lack of credibility on the party’s No. 1 tenet: fiscal responsibility.
“That’s why no one is paying any attention,” he said. “Our moral soapbox was completely taken away from us because of our behavior in the last few years. For us to now criticize analogous behavior is hypocrisy. We’ve got to come at it a different way. We’ve got to prove the point. It can’t be as the Chinese would say, ‘fei hua,’ [or] empty words.”
It still upsets me that this bill of a couple hundred billion in tax cuts (when did Republicans start opposing tax cuts?) and $4-500 billion in spending, mostly as stopgaps for state budgets and infrastructure spending, is characterized as wild spending, when the only reason for it is the horrible economy and there just isn’t a ton of “pork” spending in it. Regardless, it is nice to see that at least some Republicans out there get it- their problem is they simply have no credibility after the past eight years even if this WAS a larded up bill full of pork.
Put another way, it isn’t just dishonest, it is offensive. Having the party of Bush lecture you about out of control spending is like having a heroin addict chide you for putting too much sugar in your coffee.
Mazacote Yorquest
Help! I’ve been transported to bizarro world, where Republicans put forth clear rationales, common sense analyses, and use appropriate phrases from an Asian language, even that of a COMMUNIST COUNTRY, to elucidate their thoughts!!
Shuo that funky Zhongwen, bairen!
Zifnab
To be fair, none of the states currently turning down medicare and unemployment dollars are turning down the tax cuts.
Shame it can’t be all-or-nothing.
Of course, I wonder if the state legislatures will be as united in opposing the stimulus money. Would be funny to watch the Governors run around putting down mutinies in their own state legislatures for the next few months.
The Moar You Know
Why does Gov. Huntsman hate America?
Comrade Stuck
I wonder if Huntsman will now be subjected to the newest version of the GOP purity test. The GOP — We are Looking For a Few Good Wingnuts Semper Fi
Punchy
You’d better fucking believe Malkin is deep in her bunker, planning a CounterTop Raid Investigation like the world has never seen before.
And we’re only about 1.49 minutes away from RedState telling us just what a Liberal Loony Lesbo state Utah truly is.
amorphous
More like having a heroin addict chide you for eating poppy seed muffins and blaming his addiction on you.
JenJen
My goodness! Is it Opposite Day? I felt the same way watching Charlie Crist on Meet The Press; I was all, "He seems perfectly rational!"
I’m really looking forward to tonight, for a few reasons. First, it really hasn’t sunk in for me that Obama is actually the President, so seeing him standing before Congress, with Joe Biden and Nancy Pelosi behind him might finally do the trick.
Also, I can’t wait to hear the ovations. Mostly, though, because I am a little petty, I’m looking for the hand-sitters and the smirkers. Luckily for us, the camera operators always try to find the members of Congress who aren’t clapping, and who look grim. Should be fun watching Boehner, McConnell, and McCain tonight. :-)
Face
But it wasn’t. Quit playing the "well, Republicans said it, so I’d better accept it" bullshit.
gopher2b
It will be interesting to see what happens with the GOP as it basically splits into two parties (the South and Everywhere else).
My problem with the sitmulus has alway been its too small and it has stupid things in it (like the tax cuts that you need a Ph.D. in tax code to understand). I wish they had suspended the payroll taxes or cut them by 50%. It would have got people excited which should be half the goal of this thing.
kay
"We view the Senate now as the incubator of ideas," Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (Ky.) "We are road-testing Republican ideas on the floor of the Senate — in great numbers."
JenJen
Oh, and apropos of Utah (and because the editing window seems to close before the countdown lately), "Big Love" RAWKED Sunday night. I think it was my fave episode yet. :-)
John Cole
@Face: Hunh? I think I pretty clearly said it wasn’t larded up, then, to point out how little credibility they have on the issue, said “even if this WAS a larded up bill full of pork,” they would have no credibility.
You are not reading me accurately.
Comrade Stuck
@Face:
I think Cole was being hypothetically snarkish, not literal, unless I’m wrong.
**not wrong.
Dennis-SGMM
@Comrade Stuck:
The California GOP just voted to withhold party funds from those Republican state legislators who voted for the CA’s compromise budget.
Republicans eat their young.
kay
@JenJen:
They’re going to announce that Jindal is the Republican Obama, and then it will be so.
I’m reconciled to that. Beyond reconciled. I’m bored with it already.
amorphous
@gopher2b:
I just don’t see this happening. The two main factions that comprise the current GOP (the God Squad and SantelliNation) are both smaller than those people who self-identify as Democrats, and this is with all the infighting the Democrats seemingly have had for a while. Those small factions need each other, and they’re willing to acquiesce to the major demands of the other because it doesn’t distract from their own goals. The party may become further regionalized, due to the loss of moderates, but I can’t see it splitting.
Correct me if I am missing something.
jibeaux
He lost me at:
since when do Republicans talk like this?
Comrade Stuck
@Dennis-SGMM:
Reaching Peak Wingnut may be like pursuing the square root of Pi, but we are on that road fer sure.
JenJen
I just read that Attorney General Eric Holder drew the short straw for tonight’s address. For people that are interested in that kind of stuff. :-)
Joshua Norton
I think Ahnold is considering changing his party affiliation. He’s seriously pissed off at the more batshit GOoPers.
Some wingnut blogger was trying to claim the Governator was one of the ones turning down the stimulus funds. What he was really saying was if the assholes from the southern states didn’t want their cut then ship it to him in California.
Comrade Darkness
since when do Republicans talk like this?
That was exactly my thought. My god, he’s a mole!
TenguPhule
The GOP eggs have been left in too long, they’re dead and rotting.
theturtlemoves
@Dennis-SGMM:
No-one expects the GOP inquisition!! Now bring forth… the comfy chair!
Dennis-SGMM
@Comrade Stuck:
It’s been said here before:
"The ostracizing will continue until our numbers increase."
Lola
I really hope this Huntsman guy becomes president one day, assuming we have to have a Republican president again. He reminds me of Obama since he is good-looking, articulate, pragmatic and seems somewhat compassionate. I saw a picture of his wife and she does not look like your average Mormon either. They are definitely a cut above the Romney family. I wonder how many kids they have.
Comrade Darkness
"The ostracizing will continue until our numbers increase."
Failing that, we overhaul the purity tests.
Wile E. Quixote
"Getting it in Utah" sounds like a euphemism for some feelthy, feelthy sex act, but then again so does "Atanarjuat".
greynoldsct00
Ditto Michigan, some wingnut mentioned them too but I saw a clip on teevee of their governor saying she’d take whatever was coming their way.
gopher2b
@amorphous:
I agree with you at the national level they need each other but the local races will be very different and you will see two very different sets of ideas grow out of them. There are a lot of ex/reformed/whatever Republicans who voted for Obama, support him, and are truly hoping he succeeds but cannot stand, and never will support the Pelosis, Reids, Kennedys, etc.
Surly Duff
Is that like the purity dances or purity rings? Cause those things don’t work.
The Grand Panjandrum
It seems that if you are with the current Congressional Republicans 95% of the time you are still considered the enemy. That can only be bad news for the failed Obama administration.
Dennis-SGMM
@Wile E. Quixote:
I got it in Utah once. From a very religious young woman: she was a devout Whoremon.
JenJen
@Lola: Huntsman isn’t a bad guy, I agree. He used to be the US Ambassador to Singapore, I believe. He and his wife have seven kids, including two adopted children.
Also, the Utah Governor’s Mansion is the dopest Governor’s Mansion in the entire country.
Ned R.
@Wile E. Quixote:
Okay, I actually LOLed.
Chris Johnson
Atanarjuat is actually a Middle Eastern psychic terrorist laughing at us. The name is an anagram for A Raja Taunt.
Mind you, it’s also At A Tuna Jar. Maybe he is actually Tunch?
TenguPhule
I believe it works like hymen checks, only with the other hole….or so I heard.
Montysano (All Hail Marx & Lennon)
@Zifnab:
Looks like Chuck Schumer is on the job.
sy
Joe Scarborough just shat himself. Huntsmann didn’t just refuse to drink the kool-aid. He told the rest of the true believers they didn’t have to either.
What do you bet the obstructionists in Congress have gotten over their tone deafness.
Blue Raven
Wait a sec. First a GOP legislator in Utah gets booted from his committee chairmanship because of anti-gay remarks. Now this. When did Utah find its brains?
Face
JC — my bad. Yup, misread.
/facepalm
TenguPhule
It borrowed them from Kansas, which wasn’t really using them anyway.
Nicole
@JenJen: I loved it, too. Well worth taking a break from the Oscars for it. Bill discovering he’d been left behind had me in stitches.
BDeevDad
He was on TV yesterday saying they need ideas on energy, healthcare, etc. Not just be an opposition party. I think he called out Cantor as well.
BDeevDad
@Montysano (All Hail Marx & Lennon): That’s going to hurt and the line item veto comment is right on.
Rosali
Every time I hear Charlie Crist making sense, I thank god that Jeb Bush is no longer the governor. FL is suffering from unemployment and the devastating housing crisis but I just know that Jeb would still be leading the pack with hypocrisy.
Martin
Not surprised. A friend of mine worked for one of the largest video streaming services that happened to get a majority of their revenue from streaming porn. Turns out that Utah consumed more porn per capita from their service than any other state.
What they do in their homes in Utah does not match what they preach from their meetinghouses in Utah…
Brian J
How much control over his state’s portion of the money does Huntsman get? If it’s a decent amount, and he wants to make a name for himself in a respectable way, he’d be wise to spend it in a responsible way.
That said, he’d be a fool not to support the money. The stimulus bill will help the economy even if people are paid to, as Keynes said, dig ditches, but it will help even more if the money is used for investments for the future. Regardless, according to this article, Utah is expected to benefit more than any other state from the bill. I don’t know how his state’s finances are, or how they will be affected by the increases in jobs and therefore revenue overall, but if it helps his state as much as possible, it could help him if he wants to run for president.
Anyway, he and others like Bruce Bartlett are right about the lack of credibility among Republicans based on their economic policies. In fact, since their claims, no matter how ridiculous, are usually treated as being as intellectually serious as those of the Democrats (i.e. tax cuts paying for themselves versus education spending to make a more educated and thus wealthier population), it just goes to show you how hollow they really sre.
John S.
I think it is due in part to the higher profile they have been enjoying lately.
The HBO show Big Love, Mitt Romney’s failed bid for the presidency and the backlash over the Church of LDS meddling in Prop 8 have all brought their little neck of the woods into sharper focus to the average American, and I don’t think Utahans(?) are pleased with how they appear.
The only remaining geographic regions left in this country that seem to revel in their ignorance are Appalachia, the Deep South and Alaska.
Johnny Pez
This is excellent news for John McCain.
Wile E. Quixote
@Chris Johnson
Hmmmm, has anyone ever seen the two of them together?
John S.
Me too.
I have never voted for a Republican in my life, but if Crist runs for the Senate in 2010 – provided that the Dems run a really shitty candidate like they did for Governor with Bill McBride – I may end up marring that record.
Crist is almost like a Republican version of Obama, who seems to value pragmatism over ideology. Which keeps making me wonder how long he will continue to have a home with the GOP.
JenJen
@Montysano (All Hail Marx & Lennon): Those comments from Schumer are most delightful! Haha, Jindal. The Stim isn’t a cafeteria line.
Tsulagi
I really didn’t need that visual.
Yep.
That too. But that still doesn’t stop Oxycontin Rush and the megaditto brigades.
Anton Sirius
@Lola:
Huntsman also supports civil unions. He definitely seems to be trying to position himself as the Last Sane Republican.
TenguPhule
Don’t forget Kansas!
SnarkIntern
Per War Games, the only winning move is not to play.
This is their game. No matter what you say to the lecture about sugar in your coffee, the adversary will take it and launch a new rhetorical attack.
Nothing in their game is about logic, fairness, honestly. It’s all about just keeping up the bitching. It doesn’t matter exactly what the bitching is about. It doesn’t matter whether the bitching makes any sense. It’s just about bitching.
And if you bitch about the bitching, you will get more bitching. You will be accused of bitching.
IMO the public, or at least about 55% of it, has figured this out. Most of the other 45% are the ones doing the bitching. There are some confused people in the margins who have no idea what any of it is about.
I believe that the era of government by the bitching people is drawing to a close. I think it has run its course. For now anyway.
Utah is a place where you have to sign up as a Republican to get elected, most likely. So you can get members there who are not true kool-aid drinkers. Arizona used to be that way but is slowly changing.
Ed Drone
Fixed it for you.
Ed
Dave
If anyone is curious, the reason Huntsman can throw out a Chinese line like that is because he did his Mormon mission in Taiwan. Dude speaks fluent Mandarin.
Ned R.
His wife is Chinese too, IIRC?
TenguPhule
Or having a serial killer complain that euthanasia for dying patients is a sin against Jebus.
Comrade Stuck
@Ed Drone:
LOLTZ – Yes
UnkyT
@Blue Raven:
Actually, that Utah Senator (the famous Chris Buttars) did not lose his committee chairs because his remarks were anti-gay. He lost the committee chairs because he had a prior arrangement with the leadership that he not speak publicly concerning the issue, and he did not keep his end. The leadership has since said that they actually agree for the most part with his statement.
So in the end he was punished not for showing once again what a vile bigot he is, but for not going through the proper channels to do so. Hurray for Utah!
valdivia
This post is pretty funny no? Here is a member in good standing of The Village gushing about the tweeter ability of the republicans and this great new revolution called the Tea Party. Declared a success even before it starts!
Brian J
@Comrade Stuck:
One can only hope that those senators are challenged through primaries. Not only will it drain resources that could be used in the general election, it could divide the party, making it easier for Democrats to win those seats.
Ron
@Lola:
I doubt he ever will. HE can’t survive the primary process. Not because of this, but because IIRC he recently came out in favor of civil unions.
Honestly, it is one thing to see GOP gov’s from states like FL and CA act fairly rationally. Statewide I think wingnuts would have a hard time winning those states. But Utah? For whatever reason that impresses me more.
Just Some Fuckhead
@Face: FYI, he detests being called "JC".
Cain
Jeezus, Dougj, your posts seem to be all over the blogosphere.. today. :-) stop improving the damn brand!
cain
Brian J
@gopher2b:
You almost have to hope that this is the case. If they can keep up the image of having two similar but ultimately somewhat different sets of plans, with Obama looking like the more reasonable one, it’ll work out for the Democrats. This is because there’s probably very little daylight between Pelosi and Reid and Obama, so if people support what they think is a distinct Obama program while Pelosi and Reid, who don’t have to worry about the entire country electing them, can work on getting stuff through congress.
I also wonder just how much longer the Republicans will try to drum up resentment and turn someone like Pelosi into a caricature like they did with Hillary Clinton. If they keep it up but the Democrats are successful at governing the country, anybody who isn’t a true wingnut probably won’t feel much hatred for her.
scruncher
I am *loving* this. I’d love to see Boehner totally marginalized. And the GOP divided into warring camps.
ET
The Washington TV media will never invite him on their shows!! Of course speaking in such a matter is likely to get him booted from super duper GOP superhero club.
ricky
As a fan of Big Love I can assure you that on my next trip to view the oil derricks at Bush-Arches National Park I plan to do all my home improvement shopping in Utah.
jprice vincenz
"It can’t be as the Chinese would say, ‘fei hua,’ [or] empty words.”
Pardon my French, but these F-ing Republicans are so used to making deals for Walmart with the Chinese that they actually speak the F-ing language.
On a similar note, imagine the sh-tstorm that would have arisen over at Malkin’s flying monkey headquarters if Huntsman had used Spanish instead of Chinese.
Joshua Norton
Uh oh. Bush suicidal? If the Globe (not the Boston newspaper) says it, then it must be true. They have at least as much credibility and Faux and Fiends.
gbear
..and Michelle Bachman’s district in MN.
TenguPhule
Uh oh. Bush suicidal?
If he takes out his own gene pool, so much the better.
gwangung
@Ned R.:
Hrm….A little too blonde, blue-eye and Florida born for that….
Delia
My sister, who is a liberal Dem and non-Mormon, lives in Utah. She says Huntsman has been quite a good governor all around, making the best of a bad situation as the general economy went to hell, trying to preserve things like education and public services.
In general, even though Utah’s very conservative, it’s not wingnutty the way the South is. The state rejected No Child Left Behind because it was hurting the public schools, no matter what the Bushies said. They’re going to be quite irate about any policy that seems to hurt their children.
And you have to remember that deep down, most wingnuts think that Mormons are heretics, so I think Utahns as a whole are going to be a little hesitant about riding that bus all the way to the end of the line.
BDeevDad
Here’s the video I saw with of Huntsman with Norah O’Donnell.
Delia
@ricky:
I think you’re going to have a long wait for the oil derricks. I believe Ken Salazar canceled the deal, earning Robert Redford’s undying gratitude.
Krista
That might explain it, then. Spending a lot of time in another culture does tend to give one perspective, empathy and a bit of humility, all of which tend to be grossly lacking from your average Republican.
barkleyg
I read that Huntsman is termed out in Utah, and is trying to make his national debut. He has stated that he wants to represent the "real world" wing of the Repugs. He will probably be the only rep on this side of the Republican aisle.
So, what we have is an early look at the 2010 Repugs primaries. Huntsman trying to represent those that still live in the same country as the rest of us against the Creationist wing trio of Huckabee, Jindhl, and Romney and the Neo Hooverite wing of the Party, Stanford and Pawlenty.
Xecky Gilchrist
What they do in their homes in Utah does not match what they preach from their meetinghouses in Utah…
As it has ever been. When cable TV was first introduced here, people waxed pious about how horrible and sinful it was – and as soon as they buried the cable so you couldn’t see which houses had it, they all bought it.
John S.
That’s pretty much what I was driving at.
Mormons strike me as a rather pragmatic sort rather than purely ideologically driven (not to say that they don’t have their own ideological bent). They actually have some of the best overall marketing of a religious brand I have ever seen, and I think they are keenly aware of public opinion. They also seem to genuinely care about the social welfare of people (well, their people anyway) as evidenced by the extensive network of food banks they maintain and operate.
That along with the pragmatism probably contributes to their pariah status within Greater Wingnuttia.
Delia
@Krista:
My son is in the diplomatic corps. He says there are, in fact, quite a few Mormons in the Foreign Service who learned their first foreign language while they were on missions . He says they are not what you think of as the usual , shall we say, culturally blinkered sorts, and many of them are very interesting and intelligent people.
les
@TenguPhule:
Tacky and offensive, but unfortunately accurate. Sigh.
Jay
The heroin junkie/too much coffee line is doubly ironic because junkies crave sugar for some physiological reason.
amorphous
@Brian J:
For as long as she has a vagina. Yes, I think it is that simple.
UnkyT
@barkleyg:
There are no term limits in Utah, he did however commit to serving only 2 terms.
ImJohnGalt
Completely off-topic, I was just told by my doctor to go buy a neti pot. She was flabbergasted that I knew what it was.
Hopefully it’ll work.
Comrade Darkness
@Joshua Norton,
The notion that Bush actually understands something of what is happening is utterly impossible, so I don’t buy it. But it’s a nice thought that he might suffer some pang of human conscience since it’s the only punishment he’ll ever get.
Xecky Gilchrist
@John S.: Mormons strike me as a rather pragmatic sort rather than purely ideologically driven (not to say that they don’t have their own ideological bent). They actually have some of the best overall marketing of a religious brand I have ever seen, and I think they are keenly aware of public opinion. They also seem to genuinely care about the social welfare of people (well, their people anyway) as evidenced by the extensive network of food banks they maintain and operate.
Agreed. I think Mormons are, on the whole, very good-hearted people. Just not, sadly, very bright, and they’re authoritarian down the marrow.
That along with the pragmatism probably contributes to their pariah status within Greater Wingnuttia.
I dunno – the whole "even microscopically different God from mine" is enough, I suspect.
Mrs. Peel
He was probably already that way in the WH.
Sorry, George can’t come to the phone right now. He’s up on the roof threatening to jump again.
Zifnab
@amorphous: To be fair, Al Gore doesn’t have a vagina and they didn’t exactly go easy on him.
I’ve heard too many horror stories of child abuse and social violence from that state to really write it off as bad apples. There is a strain of religious fundamentalism that’s just as bad as the Ted Haggard / Oral Roberts / James Dobson variety. But Utah doesn’t seem to have the bad streak of Norquist government bath tube drowning that states like Alabama and Tennessee cling to.
burnspbesq
@Ron:
Huntsman has the freedom to say and do the right thing that a net worth with a large number of zeroes at the end can provide. Huntsman Chemical is the family business.
The Grand Panjandrum
@Zifnab: The Mormon Church and its acolytes were some of the biggest supporters of California’s Prop 8.
Waingro
I lived in Utah for a while and the above quotes generally match my experience with Mormons. Granted, I lived in that den of sin Salt Lake City, not Utah County (voted for McCain 63%!).
Mormons are generally not right-wing in the same way the aggressively stupid and mean wingnuts are in Texas. It’s a more genteel vibe that comes when the LDS effectively owns the state- you don’t have to be pushy or aggressive. A bit how a fish doesn’t notice water.
They’re generally perfectly nice people who have extremely bizarre beliefs. Now excuse me while I munch on my Jesus crackers and wash it down with his blood.
YellowJournalism
Loved all of the subtle "National Lampoon’s Vacation" references, including visiting Cousin Eddie’s wife and the dead relative’s remains on the car roof.
Chris Johnson
When all of them together have half as many followers as Wil Wheaton, tell me about them again.
That said, I went to the TCOT Report (pub twitter homepage) and was well pissed off. Top center is a big logo which says ‘revolution is brewing!’. I’m like, fuck you people. Haven’t you done ENOUGH fucking damage? It’s just depressing.
So they’re going to engage in bloody (alright, tweety) revolution, overthrow the grown-ups, stomp back into Washington and… what? ‘profit’? So sorry, please, so sorry…
Fuck these people and the rail they were run out of town on.
Ash Can
I can’t remember who said it, but I recall a BJ commenter recently predicting that the resuscitation of the GOP was going to come at the hands of the sane Republican governors, and I’m betting that prediction is spot on. It would be quite the irony indeed if, years from now, yet another item on Obama’s presidential legacy list is an indirect assist in the GOP regaining its place in American politics as a legitimate and effective party.
Face
His own initials?
liberal
@John S.:
Same remarks apply to other extremist religious groups like Hamas, so I don’t think it’s really a sign of overall virtue.
Mike in NC
Bring it on! Got the beer and popcorn ready. It’ll be better than the Super Bowl seeing the Republicans acting like petulant children while Obama plays adult.
Just Some Fuckhead
@Face: I know it sounds crazy but he doesn’t want to be confused with the two commenters who go by "JC" and "A Different JC".
gbear
@The Grand Panjandrum:
Bears repeating. the Mormon Church’s leadership took great efforts to repeal equal legal protection for a large number of CA families and citizens.
gwangung
This is neither a good thing nor a bad thing. If he’s more like Warren Buffett or Bill Gates (either Jr. or III), then it’d be a good thing for him to become prominent on the national stage.
Dennis-SGMM
@Chris Johnson:
Republicans: "The revolution will not be televised – it will be Twittered."
Who will be the first of them to start calling himself Commandante Tweet?
John S.
This HAS to be spoof.
I don’t think even the most unhinged gay-rights activist would equate Mormons with a terrorist organization like Hamas – never mind the fact that one is an actual religion and the other is not.
EDIT: Damn you great Gizoogle!
At least my hunch was in the ballpark, since it seem only unhinged wingnuts – like Debbie Schlussel, Front Page Magazine and the Freepers – seem to think the two are the same.
Laura W
@Just Some Fuckhead: IIRC, his family calls him "JG", so even more offensive to be so phonetically and alphabetically close…yet so very far away.
TenguPhule
Yep.
Sorry about that.
John S.
Sorry, but this sounds an awful like the nonsense myiq1/2xu peddled all throughout the primaries.
It would be wise to steer clear of HIS brand of logic, no matter WHO or WHAT it applies to.
valdivia
@Chris Johnson:
Chris I too made the mistake of checking out the tweeter feed and had my head explode.
My scorn is still mostly piled at cooper for being such a nitwit.
Dennis–My question is will Comandante Tweet wear one of those black masks that cover the face and smoke a pipe a la Marcos?
Just Some Fuckhead
@Laura W: Still, who worries about being confused with two other JCs but not fifty other Johns? I’ll tell ya who: someone from a state where nicknames are more than just a convenient way of referring to someone else.
Thank you, thank you.
Zifnab
@The Grand Panjandrum: It’s worth noting that while the state is dominated by the church, not all citizens act in lockstep.
From what I’ve seen, Utah has been more willing to embrace government social programs than its southern neighbors. But their still mired in the same anti-woman, anti-gay bigotry that their religion dictates. Of course, I don’t know how long public opinion would last against a substantial "blame the socialists" ad campaign. But, unlike the Limbaugh die hards that would proudly embrace full blown anarchy for a tax cut, Utah has historically had a bit more sensibility.
AnneLaurie
To quote Samuel Johnson, nothing so concentrates a man’s attention as the prospect of being hanged in the morning.
Any Repub with more than three functioning braincells is looking at the "public faces" of his party and feeling his sphincter tighten (and not just because so many of those faces look like a Tex-mex dinner 12 hours later).
Cyrus
@Just Some Fuckhead:
Not to mention that famous fictional character with divine powers and a strict, old-fashioned moral code who had those initials… that’s right, you know who I’m talking about. Jesse Custer.
And Re: Mormons, maybe comparing them to Hamas is a bit much, and of course you can find nice individuals in almost any group, but giving the church as an organization credit for being "generally not very right-wing" is going too far in the other direction, especially after Proposition 8. A quasi-political organization peddling reactionary politics and providing a cover for bigotry under the guise of blind dogma is a contemptible thing, regardless of whether or not its members are encouraged to do a little
Amway salesrecruiting overseas.Brandon T.
This is what comes from conflating Mormons and the rest of the God-squad social conservatives (Southern Baptists, etc).
Mormons tend to be more affluent and business-minded, and also tend to but a high value on education (although most still buy the anti-evolution arguments). The fact that a large percentage of them go on Missions also means that they have a broader perspective than the simple stereotype of "southern/midwestern social conservatives".
Zifnab
@Zifnab: Can someone explain why the hell my last post was temporarily blocked? I can’t find anything in it that could be considered capable of triggering the moderation filter.
Never mind. I found the naught word. Never say "socialist" on your initial post.
Zifnab
Wait. Let me give this a shot.
Socialist.
John S.
Gee, you think?
Too bad you then totally reverse course with your litany of caveats that follow. I think you should keep in mind that what the LEADERSHIP of a religious organization does is not necessarily reflective of its members, just like how the LEADERSHIP of a country is not necessarily reflective of its citizens.
Or perhaps you think it was fair for to be judged as an American based on the actions of the Bush administration?
opium4themasses
I know it’s late on the response here, but I have a better analogy from the original post.
It’s like a heroin addict lecturing you on drug use when you are on a morphine drip awaiting surgery.
Indylib
@Delia:
I grew up with a bunch of non-Utahan Mormons, as individuals they were mostly decent, normal people, but the more of them you put in one place, the goofier they got.
The town I grew up in had about 9000 people and the local Mormon church probably had about 1000 members. I went to school with these people, played on a Mormon girl’s softball team, my childhood babysitter was Mormon and not one of these people ever attempted to say a word to me about becoming a Mormon. The contrast was 2 tiny little towns 15 miles to the south of us that were 80% Mormon (and have been since sometime in the 1800’s) and the people who lived there were flat out crazy, insular, suspicious, not to mention sanctimonious and self-rightous. I’m sure this wasn’t just a function of their Mormonness, but great FSM these people were nuts. On a 1 to 10 scale of religious crackpottiness they were at least a 20.
Comrade Darkness
I suspect he also detests having his name spelled in any manner by use of *Roman* letters.
Delia
@Indylib:
Yeah, this tends to be true. I grew up in a Mormon family in Utah (although I’m not anymore.) But my family was a lot more educated than most. I think what makes most people think the Mormons from small isolated towns are so nuts is that they’re so isolated from mainstream culture and so completely insular. A lot of them really have no idea how to behave around outsiders. Mormons who live outside the Utah-Idaho-southern Nevada homeland have pretty much adapted to the mainstream culture.
Genine
Well, its good to hear some sense from a republican. I hope more and more sane republicans voice their thoughts.
Good for Huntsman!
Kelly
When I lived in Taipei, "Fei Hua" was always translated as "bullshit" rather than "empty words." Fits better in this context as well!