A LOT of talk of Jindmentum from the usual hacks the last couple days. Joan Walsh correctly calls Jindal a “Southern Paul Ryan” (though I think Jindal is smarter than Ryan, to be fair), but to me that’s not the real point.
Bobby Jindal won’t be the Republican nominee anytime soon because he’s not gangster enough and because, while they may admire him, the NRO crowd will never masturbate to him. Mitt wasn’t Mr. Charisma either but at least he had shoulders you could land a 737 on and the ability to pop some caps in Rick Perry’s ass. Jindal has neither. I’m skeptical about Paul Ryan for the same reason, 3% bodyfat and sub-three-hour marathon times notwithstanding.
Raven
That’s right, as soon as I comment put up a new post! I got my eye on you.
Hill Dweller
The purported intellectual’s policies are a joke. Whether it’s his laughable voucher scheme or his regressive tax proposals, his policy platform consists of nothing more than ideological wet dreams.
schrodinger's cat
Plus his parents were not US citizens when he was born. He will have his own birther brigade.
Todd
Thanks for the soft-on, pal. It will take me an eternity to wipe the mental saltpeter of an NRO Jack and Jill off from my mind.
Death Panel Truck
I thought the “sub-three-hour marathon” thing was just another of Ryan’s lies?
Forum Transmitted Disease
He has all the charisma of a wet piece of cardboard. DOA.
schrodinger's cat
They will probably go with a Hispanic person, who is/looks white.
Doug Galt
@schrodinger’s cat:
I think it’s Rubio but hard to say, since you never know what’s in someone’s closet.
catclub
@Death Panel Truck: Yes. Doug was playing with your head.
Randy P
@Death Panel Truck: it was, along with the 3% body fat. Both probably numbers he made up on the spot, thinking they were plausible. That’s the point.
By the way, I can bench press 800 pounds.
schrodinger's cat
@Doug Galt: Plus his hairline is receding rapidly, in four years he may join the bipartisan Senate Toupee club.
NotMax
In need of a new acronym.
SINO
Smart In Name Only
comrade scott's agenda of rage
Remember, the lying sack of shit never ran a sub-3 hour marathon. Sub-4 hour, sure. That’s not hard for when he did it and if he adequately trained.
Yes, I’ve run a sub-3 hour marathon so get touchy when poser assholes like Ryan claim they did.
schrodinger's cat
@comrade scott’s agenda of rage: You is fast. I run at grandmotherly pace. I is jealous.
SatanicPanic
Republicans will tolerate dorks, but not his brand of dork.
Chuck Butcher
@Randy P:
I don’t know about Paul Ryan, but me and water have a difficulty if it’s above my head and too far to swim to shore, I’m specific density 1+ and float a bit better than a rock. That’s a lifetime of construction work and genes for you…
PeakVT
Joan Walsh correctly calls Jindal a “Southern Paul Ryan”
Jindal’s persona is much more fake, though. Ryan really is a clueless prick; Jindal goes out of his way to play a clueless hick.
comrade scott's agenda of rage
That was 17 years ago (1995 Marine Corps). I’ve moved up to ultra marathons, well, mainly a single 50K (31 miles) each year because the terrain is hilly and you don’t have to necessarily sprint on a flat stretch for 26 miles like you do on most marathon courses.
Oh, and he didn’t even break the 4-hour mark:
huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/01/paul-ryan-marathon-time_n_1848715.html
opie_jeanne
@Doug Galt: I saw a “Who Is John Galt?” sticker yesterday, on a Prius. Still trying to figure out why this feels so strange to me.
I mean, What Would Ayn Rand Drive?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Heh, just as I was reading this thread, I flip on MSNBC in time to see a tease for an “Exclusive” MTP interview with Paul Ryan. I guess he’s smart enough to pick the only Sunday morning host who’s dumber than he is.
Seems to me the only people Jindal excites are the hard core Catholics (I could be wrong), and I don’t think we’ve seen the last of would-be Cardinal Santorum in GOP preisdential primary, and the whole Kenneth the Page factor is a big strike against BJ. I expect Rubio to get a lot of media/establishment love from the cable-consultant class, but while I think he’s actually smarter than most Republicans, he has the charisma of a glass of milk, and still looks like he borrowed his dad’s suit for a job fair for graduating seniors. But I’m not his target demo and never will be.
Suffern ACE
I’m wondering if we shouldn’t wait until someone announces an exploratory committee before weighing in on whether someone is electable or not in 2016. It does seem that we’re starting the campaign season earlier and earlier. Maybe we need to offer to burn down the offices of the first pollster who releases a 2016 election poll if it is before 2014. Generic Dem beats Generic Rep, were the election held 4 years early!
PeakVT
@opie_jeanne: Nothing. She never got her driver’s license.
SatanicPanic
@opie_jeanne:
A rickshaw pulled by young male indentured servants
Rathskeller
It must be a real problem being a relatively smart person of color in the GOP. Not a problem I lose sleep over, of course.
Seanly
There are lots of folks who’ll get talked up & maybe even make a run at the nomination, but will never be allowed near the levers of power. The next R nominee will be just like all of the others – white & male.
That Obama bucked the system is part of what drives the R’s mad.
NonyNony
I think this is largely correct. Republicans of a certain stripe want swagger in their politicians, and neither Jindal nor Ryan have it. That’s why they loved Palin. And that’s also why they were chomping at the bit for Perry to get into the race and then quickly abandoned him when he got schooled – they thought he’d be tougher than Romney and when it turned out he wasn’t, they moved on. It’s also why Newt can keep hanging around – he’s got enough swagger to him that they keep coming back to him, even though they know he can’t deliver.
It’s the same thing that keeps bringing them back to Limbaugh too, and keeps idjits like Bill O’Reilly popular amongst that crowd.
comrade scott's agenda of rage
As stupid as it sounds, people still forget that a candidate’s likeability is important. Sheesh, everybody hated Rmoney, even most of his own people. Dubya, while inept and having essentially a corrupt-to-the-core administration, was likeable to a lot of voters.
Watch Jindal for any amount of time and you’ll fall asleep, he’s that dull. He’ll never last thru the primaries.
NonyNony
@opie_jeanne:
She’d take the train.
And pay for the ticket out of her Social Security check.
NotMax
@opie_jeanne
Were she able, a Ford Escape.
Chuck Butcher
@comrade scott’s agenda of rage:
Hotshot training involved 7 mi of caterpiller run daily at 5K elv in logging boots, that’lll make you tough and is a perfect demonstration that you are lacking enough sense to be well qualified for the job.
Butch
Not that the worst can’t come to pass, but a field of presidential aspirants that includes folks like Jindal and Rand Paul gives me hope for 2016. The attack ads just sorta write themselves.
Frankensteinbeck
Yeah, Jindal worked out SO well for them last time…
NotMax
@NonyNony
Personal peccadillo button pushed.
Champing at the bit, not chomping.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@NonyNony: also, too, Christie. The same people who love Newt’s nastiness and Palin’s mean-girl sneer love the loud-mouth bully quality that I think would be his doom as a national candidate.
mdblanche
(though I think Jindal is smarter than Ryan, to be fair)
Twice nothing is still nothing.
Hunter Gathers
@Doug Galt:
Rubio’s too much of whiner. My 2 year old doesn’t whine as much as he does. He doesn’t produce any actual legislation but he whines like a little bitch when he gets beaten to the punch, which is constantly. Just wait until Obama drops his immigration bill. Rubio could have dropped his bill yesterday, but he’s to busy blowing the likes of O’Rielly and Hannity to produce a bill. He’ll cry like a little kid with skinned knee when Obama cock-blocks him again. Conservatives want winners, not whiners.
Omnes Omnibus
@comrade scott’s agenda of rage: That has always been the thing that strikes me as so fucking stupid about his claim… If you say you ran a marathon, people will, and should be, impressed. It is an accomplishment in and of itself. If you lie about it and get caught, the lie overshadows the actual accomplishment. Just stupid.
Violet
It’s Santorum’s turn. It’ll be Santorum and that will be the last hurrah of the crazy Christianists owning the Republican party. Santorum will pick Rubio as running mate and it’ll be Rubio’s turn the following election.
fasteddie9318
“Seventeen years and fifteen albums later, Spinal Tap is still going strong, and they’ve earned a distinguished place in rock history as one of England’s loudest bands.”
Marc
Fixed.
Chuck Butcher
If you were a GOPer, who the hell would you run? Off the top of my head, I’m coming up empty.
Raven
@NotMax: But pronounced chomp not champ!
Just Some Fuckhead
Bobby Jindal will never be a major party candidate for President. Take it to the bank.
Brachiator
@NonyNony:
Great point. This is why the Republican nominee could be a woman. The GOP is not nearly as addicted to “white and male” as some here want to assert.
Ryan seemed to have some pseudo-swagger, and was getting puffed by the NRO crowd even harder than was Romney.
@comrade scott’s agenda of rage:
And yet Romney was the GOP nominee. And I don’t think his core problem was a lack of likeability. It was that he couldn’t hide his contempt for the majority of the people.
That and his lack of authenticity. And the constant lying.
Raven
@Omnes Omnibus: People I know were impressed I ran the damn Peachtree!
NotMax
@Violet
When it comes to presidential races, Santorum is destined to be the new Harold Stassen*.
Won’t ever get within spitting distance of being nominated.
*entered the prez race 12 times
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Violet: Nah, Santorum even gives other bible thumpers (at the top level of the party) the creeps. When Santorum was the last of the loons to poll ahead of Romney, that’s when even conservatives were wondering, out loud and on TV, whether it would be Jebbie or Daniels who would ride in to save them, or if it was too late to bring Rick Perry back? But I do think he’ll make a run for it, and keep the crazy burning during the primaries.
@Omnes Omnibus: also, the way he played word games to make it sound like he was giving (lying about) his best time of the multiple marathons he’d run, instead of the time on the only one he’d run. He’s a complete fraud, and he knows it, and he knows how to play his audience– the dopey Beltway Centrists like Gregory and Ruth Marcus. But I really think he’s peaked.
redshirt
Follow my logic here, as it’s complex political analysis, from the Republican perspective:
1. America likes brown people nowadays (apparently! The polls said so).
2. Bobby Jindal is brown.
3. Therefore, if we run a brown boy with an R next to his name…
4. Profit!
Raven
BOSS HAWG:
“Former Mississippi Gov. Haley Barbour (R) said Friday that Republicans need to consider more carefully what they’re saying in order to avoid “stupid” and “offensive” comments that take a toll on the entire party.”
WereBear
I was thinking it was typical lack of foresight, not plucking a few avuncular actors and installing them as governors to create a candidate bank for the future. It worked so well with Saint Ronnie!
But maybe they have tried. Maybe what we are looking at is them trying their hardest!
That would be wonderful. For us.
Violet
@NotMax: We’ll see. The Republicans are kind of a mess right now and this time I’m not seeing that mess getting a lot better before primary season rolls around. I couldn’t believe Santorum was doing as well as he did in 2012. He obviously spoke to some voters.
The Republicans are going to want to look for someone that can appeal to new, young, minority, women, etc. voters. But the Christianists will sense they’re getting cut out of the deal and left behind. They won’t like that and they vote. No telling if those new voters will be swayed by, say, Marco Rubio or Bobbby Jindal.
Omnes Omnibus
@Raven: That’s my point. He was in a position to impress people with the truth, but he chose to tell a fairly easily refutable lie in order to seem more impressive. For most people, athletic, for a politician, is pass/fail. Dude ran a marathon and works out; he passes.
trollhattan
Run Bobby, run!
1. Dearly want to know more about the exorcism.
2. Kenneth the Page is now out of work, and rarin’ to go.
3. Profit!
gex
He’s performed an exorcism, for crying out loud. This can’t be the brain trust of the party. Well, it can. Ugh.
honeybooboo
Joan Walsh can be quite the hack herself.
jre
Yabbut …
Say what you will, Paul Ryan is a premise-checker.
I think I’ll reserve “Premise Checkers” for the title of an objectivist revival meeting.
feebog
@ Jim, Foolish Literalist:
I dunno, the Wingnuts love them some bullys. Plus, I think Christie will attract a lot of the Wall Street money. If he is re-elected, and given his favorables at this point, it is pretty certain he will be, then I think he will be quite formidble in the primaries
NotMax
@Raven
That Barbour escaped unscathed after being found with his hand in the fortune cookie jar in Hong Kong, re: campaign monies, still astonishes me.
handsmile
Well, sure, he’s got’s no shoulders, his hairline’s receding, and he’s dull and no gangstah, but Bobby Jindal has one distinguishing qualification sure to endear him with the GOP’s Christian zealots: he conducted an exorcism:
motherjones.com/mojo/2012/05/bobby-jindal-exorcised-his-college-girlfriend
Game on, Marco, Chrisco, Frothy, and Gilligan!
ETA: ah, gex, while I was typing….
schrodinger's cat
What about Rand Paul?
eemom
Aaaand, further to the last thread, I like Kris K’s version better than Janis J’s.
His is so sweet and wistful.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Chuck Butcher: I don’t know them all up close, but those I think could make a credible, non-laughable primary run: John Thune, Mitch Daniels, Jeb Bush, Susannah Martinez*, Kelly Ayotte (if Hillary goes for it, the R’s are going to be promoting women), Bob Corker. I think Kasich’s got the bug, but he wouldn’t last. Rubio and Christie could raise a lot of money and get a lot of press, but I think both would be doomed. Governor Trans-vaginal Probe in the same category for different reasons. Rubio I would think is on everybody’s short list for Veep, along with Martinez and Ayotte. I imagine there are a few governors who aren’t on my radar who could get through a Sunday morning interview without embarrassing themselves
I don’t know if she’s sufficiently pure on abortion? I know Kay Bailey Hutchison and Jodi Rell got passed over by McCain because they weren’t.
catclub
@Chuck Butcher: Jon Thune.
Empty suit. Respectable. Does not have heavy southern drawl
or jowls.
NotMax
@schrodinger’s cat
see: snowball, Hell
Omnes Omnibus
@eemom: I agree. I tend to like the writer’s version of most songs better than the cover. This is not to say that Janis didn’t do a great job.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@feebog: that’s what I mean, a pre-Sandy Christie was a first tier GOP primary candidate precisely because GOOPers love them a bully, and President Affirmative Action T Teleprompter would have been left whimpering in a heap on the stage if a Real Man stood up to him. But I think in a general, he couldn’t hide that “Somethin’s goin’ down tonight, sweetheart” streak, and it would be the end of him.
Gin & Tonic
@handsmile: I thought only clergy could conduct exorcisms.
Michael
Somebody should throw up a post about the ridiculous DC CIr opinion today basically demolishing the Presidential Recess power (likely to get en banc treatment and/or Supreme Court review).
Its well-timed given the cave on the fillibuster yesterday. Now the GOP can block nominations in perpetuity!
NonyNony
@Brachiator:
I think a white woman could do quite well with the GOP. As long as they think she can bully the liberals and the “takers” sufficiently. The group that loves the swagger would probably have a collective orgasm at the thought of a reincarnated Margaret Thatcher running for President on the GOP side. (I don’t think such a politician exists in the modern Republican party – which is kind of odd when you think about it.)
Yeah, but in real life Ryan can’t pull it off. They might have had starbursts going off in front of their eyes in theory, but seeing him on stage made it all fizzle.
He’s the kind of guy who is full of swagger on paper – he knows just how to stick it to the poor and the liberals when he’s writing up legislation – but put him in front of an audience and he can’t pull it off.
Lurking Canadian
@Brachiator: Well, he was authentic and honest about his contempt for the electorate. So that’s something.
Violet
@feebog: Christie is a very large man. Watching him in an interview where both the interviewer and Christie sit in chairs (like, say, The Today Show) is kind of jarring. Christie doesn’t fit in a normal chair and has to kind of lean against it. It does not look good on television.
Being that much overweight can lead to other health issues. Christie has had at least one instance of being short of breath or something and had to cancel an event because of it. Now imagine him having to stand on a debate stage for two hours. Or going to Florida any time except winter, or Iowa in the summer and walking around at the state fair. Sweaty and flushed will be a minimum of how that heat affects him. Can he even physically do some of the things he’ll need to do to get through the primary?
I’m not commenting on anyone else’s weight. I’m commenting on how American voters may perceive Christie. Christie’s weight is going to be a problem for him, and not just because of how he looks on TV. Any physical problems that can be tied to weight will be the subject of speculation and can lead to people thinking he can’t handle the pressures of the job.
SFAW
@Omnes Omnibus:
Al Green, or Talking Heads?
ETA: Leaving out The Dead, because their version sucks.
NonyNony
@NotMax:
I was trying to craft a response to this that included “road to hoe”, “begging the question”, “towing the line”, “he’s a trooper”, “I could care less”, “for all intensive purposes”, “a new leash on life” and “literally” (as a synonym for figuratively) all in one response.
Sadly I realized that I have actual work that needs to get done, so that idea has been tabled.
A Ghost To Most
@opie_jeanne:
Don’t look back, you can never look back…
/henley
Maude
OT
D.C. Circuit rules that the recess appointments while Congress is on break are no go.
Obama lost on this one.
? Martin
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Watch out for Ayotte. She’s not just VP material. She ticks off all the right GOP boxes and comes across as very not-bonkers, from a northern, libertarian oriented state. She’s Romney without the disconnect from broader society and at least an awareness of where her antiquated views will be trouble.
The only thing holding her back is nobody in the GOP is throwing money at anything but a white male. That may change.
SFAW
@comrade scott’s agenda of rage:
I’ve done a sub-3-hour marathon, I think. A marathon is 2 miles, right?
@Raven:
Fixed
Maude
@Violet:
#69
Taft.
SFAW
@NonyNony:
We appreciate your sacrifice, however.
Gin & Tonic
@Maude: Before teevee.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Gin & Tonic: and a time when a certain avoirdupoids was considered to reflect soundness of mind and solidity of character. Not that I’m bitter or anything….
Maude
@Gin & Tonic:
Ike was on TV. If there is a candidate people want to vote for, none of that matters.
People well knew Taft was heavy.
NotMax
@MaudeWho’s the cat that won’t cop out
When there’s danger all about?
SHAFT!TAFT!Right On!
They say this cat Taft is a bad mother
SHUT YOUR MOUTH!
I’m talkin’ ’bout Taft.
THEN WE CAN DIG IT!
trollhattan
@schrodinger’s cat:
Loved this, on Herr Reichsmarshall Paul.
kentucky.com/2013/01/25/2489964/joel-pett-jan-25.html
Those who live near him know him best.
handsmile
@eemom:
“Kris K”? Kris Kristofferson!? Lordy, is Friday “Bingo Night” at your facility? (Sadly at mine, we only get seconds on pudding.)
Also too, I must say this casts your recent remarks about The Clash is a whole new light.
SFAW
@NotMax:
My braims just ‘sploded.
You’re an evil person.
eemom
These post titles are totally keeping my mind off the actual subjects. Win-win.
SFAW
Big deal. I have doorknobs smarter than Paul Ryan.
Seanly
@Michael:
Huhh? Isn’t the recess appointment power enumerated in the main text of the Constitution? (looked it up – Article II, Section 2)
I guess there is the intrasession vs intersession argument which maybe this ruling affects?
Omnes Omnibus
@SFAW: Ooooh, tough one. Both versions are great and I am more of a TH person in general, but I will give it to Al.
Brachiator
@PeakVT:
I don’t know. Jindal appears to be trying to call out the GOP on their cluelessness, and yet his lack of energy and charisma, and inability to shake the complacent GOP out of its stupor, is making him look even more unready than when he first tried for any national attention (from a recent Yahoo news story).
Right now, the GOP is floundering, almost on the verge of self-destruction. This makes it especially hard to see who might be able to head the party’s ticket.
JPL
@Maude: If elected will Christie want taxpayer money for new bathtubs?
Forum Transmitted Disease
@schrodinger’s cat: Oh yeah, was going to respond to this earlier.
Nonsense. You have to be a Democrat to have your legitimacy for President questioned. Republicans always get a pass.
handsmile
@Gin & Tonic:
Under canon law, church officials sanction exorcisms (and will conduct those so designated).
But all of us I believe have the moral responsibility to intercede when a loved one is being possessed by demons. Which is what impelled young Piyush to act.
eemom
@handsmile:
Well, as I have mentioned before, I am approaching 100.
Hope you had a good time at the inaugural festivities last weekend!
For myself, I damn near died in the traffic on Sunday.
schrodinger's cat
@Forum Transmitted Disease: May be if his parents were Norwegian. A lot of the birther crap was motivated by racism, and Jindal will have the same problem with at least some of the Republican base.
NotMax
@SenlyShort version is that the ruling was that the Congress was in session, even though it was daily pro forma gaveling in and gaveling out primarily intended to be used as a block to recess appointments.
JPL
@schrodinger’s cat: IOKIYAR
schrodinger's cat
@JPL: Republicans are not going to nominate him as their Presidential candidate. Period.
Omnes Omnibus
@Michael: I looked over the decision fairly quickly. The parts about the Senate being pro forma sessions and thus not on recess are defendable – not saying that I agree but I can see the reasoning. The egregious part is where they say that the power exists only when the vacancy occurs during a recess not just one that is in existence during a recess. This has got it get en banc review quickly.
Violet
@Maude: Taft was President a century ago. How many sit down interviews with Matt Lauer or the ladies of The View did he have to do on TV?
gene108
@Raven:
Where I went to eat lunch, CNN was on. Barbour was talking about minority outreach being a must for Republicans in 2016.
He said Democrats succeeded at getting minority votes by giving stuff to minorities via expanding government, but Republicans will have an alternate strategy to show minorities they don’t have to rely on government hand-outs or some such.
He did go onto talk about some stuff Jindal said, but I tuned out.
He’s clearly in over his head, with regards to minority outreach.
Insulting a group of people as to why they vote for Democrats won’t get them on your side.
Another Halocene Human
@NotMax: Meh, I hate special horse vocabulary.
Made a point of annoying a coworker last week by referring to geldings as “fixed”.
JPL
@Violet: I’m trying to imagine that. The View has a sofa so the ladies can sit closer to one another but opposite Matt in a chair…hmmm
Actually, I think Christie is to moderate for the republican party.
johnny aquitard
@Chuck Butcher: Your in the right place then, IIRC. Nothing but stock tanks as far as open bodies of water go, ‘cept for Lake Malheur and that’s only hip deep.
@SatanicPanic:
It’s not the dork they won’t tolerate, it’s the dark.
Violet
@? Martin: Re: Here’s something about Kelly Ayotte that ought to undermine her legitimacy as a Serious Person:
She talked to Piers Morgan about the testimony? Doesn’t that disqualify her from ever being taken seriously about anything?
Another Halocene Human
@Hunter Gathers: He looked good (and not too embedded in scandals) by Florida Republican standards, not national stage standards.
The Florida GOP is a racket intended to separate GOP donors from their money for the benefit of the erm, treasurers of said kitty.
I’m not sure the big corps really bother with the individual pols (except for a few really dumb ones, like Keith Perry) prefering to spend the big money on lobbyists during session. One GOP idiot is as good as another.
Michael G
@schrodinger’s cat: Yeah, I think Rand Paul is their best bet right now. All the Ron Paul guys would fall into line, and as shown at the recent hearing, Rand has the exact right amount of ignorant swagger that Republicans love to see in their candidates.
Brachiator
@schrodinger’s cat:
And yet, the smart money said that the GOP base would never accept a Mormon presidential candidate. But the base came around.
Conservative racism is complicated. If you are a flag waving conservative, and if you come across as being frankly pro-Real White American(tm) values, you get some cover despite your ethnicity.
That Jindal is popular in Louisiana already defies some of the conventional wisdom. And he spouts traditional American values and is Catholic. You see a similar reaction to Nikki Hayley.
PeakVT
@Brachiator: Jindal’s academic record indicates that he was pretty bright at one point. Too much early success and the anti-intellectualism of southern-fried conservatism may have blunted his functioning to a significant degree, however.
Violet
@JPL: The worst one I saw was at the convention. Christie is just sort of leaned on the edge of this stool because he couldn’t actually sit on it. Lauer could sit on the stool like most people can.
gex
@NonyNony: Some women are world class misogynists and they take that.
Suffern ACE
@gene108: “I recognize that you have problems, but why you don’t want us to stack the rules so you’ll never solve them is part of the problem. Be part of the solution. Learn to enjoy your problems!”
Another Halocene Human
@Raven: Like he’s one to talk, racist SOB.
NotMax
@Violet
Almost expect to see a ludicrous ‘analysis’ from Politico about how Ayotte’s showing up back in New Hampshire demonstrates her presidential intent.
SatanicPanic
@gene108: The minorities I know all love to be told how stupid and/or brainwashed they are for voting the wrong way.
Tonal Crow
Meh. Republicans easily could have nominated Herman Cain. They have no problem with token minorities, as long as they know their “place” in the party. Everything I’ve heard about Jindal indicates that he’ll stay quietly on the plantation, so I think he’s a very plausible nominee. I expect Rubio to be the 2016 nominee, though, because Republicans think he’ll appeal to Hispanics. According to Republican orthodoxy, all Hispanics loathe Castro. Break out the popcorn.
gene108
@Brachiator:
It’s not racism per se, but rather a form of cultural bigotry. People, who reinforce their cultural biases – regardless of race or gender – can become popular with conservatives.
It’s not as narrow focused on purely race as liberals want to believe.
This is why I think it is so easy for Republicans to demonize Democrats like Nancy Pelosi and Ted Kennedy, because they represent a different cultural group than rural Southern/Western voters and those voters are more than happy to associate Pelosi as a threat to their values.
Cassidy
@handsmile: Someone talking shit about the Clash?
West, Kasich, Jeb, Jindal, Ryan, Haley, Santorum and Brewer will run. Haley will get thh nomination.
Christie knows that he won’t make it and that his future is sustainable for a long term right where he is; he’s found his niche.
Gingrich made plenty last time. I don’t think he’ll have run out of cash by then.
Tonal Crow
@Cassidy:
No Rubio? Why the heck not?
Violet
@Cassidy: You think Nikki Haley will get the nomination? Can’t wait for those infidelity rumors to start up again.
Maude
@Raven:
You got sleet down there? Georgia State Parks are closed.
David in NY
I suspect it’s apocryphal, but there was the story about Taft needing to take a train from an Ohio town where the passenger trains stopped only irregularly. He had the station master telegraph up the line that a “large party” wanted to board a train, and when the next train stopped and asked for the “large party,” Taft said, “Here I am!”
Cassidy
@Tonal Crow: I think Rubio is smart enough to bide his time and try to distance himself from the batshit crazy. He’s young and has a long future in Florida.
@Violet: If she runs, yes. She’s just as much a minority as the Republicans will tolerate, and she’s smart enough to run circles around the clown car of males the GOP has in the wings right now. She may be Bachmann, but she lacks the crazy eyes and has a better mouth filter. Secondly, I think the GOP is going to try real hard to find someone not white and not male and she can count as both. And infedelity has never bothered them if it’s one of their own.
SFAW
@Omnes Omnibus:
Normally I would give it to Al on GP, but I think the Heads’ version is superior.
On the other hand: WGAS?
gene108
@Cassidy:
Haley is loathed in her state. She is an unpopular governor. I don’t see her getting serious big money banking, because if you can’t win re-election in your state, why would anyone think she can be President.
Jindal, on the other hand, is quite popular in his state. He’s not inherently stupid. If he can put together an effective national organization, he may be an effective candidate.
Suffern ACE
@David in NY: i’m thinking that even in the days of your, the Presidents and VPs would have their travelling secretaries deal with station masters. I’m going with “Old Vaudeville Yarn” on that one. Tah dum dum. I’m here all week.
JPL
@Maude: not Raven but light rain just north of Atlanta. All the school districts north of me closed because of the danger of ice. The roads through the mountains can be pretty treacherous.
MikeJ
@Raven:
The favorite phrase of Republicans is “I know it’s not politically correct to say this but…” followed by something stupid and/or offensive.
Cassidy
@gene108: True, people don’t like living with her, but I guarantee that your typical midwestern/ southern male republican voter would love to fuck her.
Seriously, though, I think she has the right mix of photogenic charisma, hate the poors and minorities, and speaking ability to win it.
schrodinger's cat
@gene108: I have lost the count of the articles I have read by “conservative intellectuals”, telling me that Asians voted for Obama because they are too stupid to realize that Democrats are the “real racists”.
FlipYrWhig
@Chuck Butcher:
Scott Walker. Close to big Koch, I mean money of course, and a track record of stomping liberals who try to come after him. Also might have potential to change the map by flipping a midwestern state. No charisma, no intelligence, but a pleasing story of conservative “success.”
People like Thune and Ayotte are attractive ciphers, which is fine in one way (not being openly crazy has its perks), but a drawback in another. What kind of story can they tell? Without that, it’s not going to work. Ask Tim Pawlenty.
handsmile
@eemom:
Yes, but up until now I never had any reason to suspect it might be true.
I read about your traffic travails, while going through BJ threads upon my return on Tuesday. Wish I had read it sooner: on Sunday night, my wonderful friends had arranged to hold a dinner at the Bombay Club restaurant, located at Connecticut Ave. and I St., i.e, a few blocks from the White House. For a 6:00pm reservation, we finally arrived at 7:30pm. Perhaps not the most foresightful choice; great place though, if Indian cuisine appeals to you and eefamily.
Being on the Mall on Monday was indescribably magnificent, a lifetime memory. (And thanks to last-minute tickets from a Congressional staffer acquaintance, we were able to celebrate just behind the Reflecting Pool.)
I gather that the Sunday afternoon meet-up was cancelled due to an infestation by football fans. As for making acquaintance, that’s very much reciprocated.
Another Halocene Human
@gene108: It’s not racism per se, but rather a form of cultural bigotry. People, who reinforce their cultural biases – regardless of race or gender – can become popular with conservatives.
You’re right about the cultural bigotry part, but that’s not incompatible with racism (if we’re defining racism not as an atavistic xenophobia but as a fixed belief that certain groups of people are less intelligent/moral/capable/worthy). Since GOP leaders are basically figureheads/puppets, they’re quite willing to vote for a symbolic leader who makes them feel good even if they don’t think he (or she) is terribly bright.
Btw, GOP pols are graded on a curve: W was “regular”, Palin was “brilliant”, Newticles == “Einstein peeing his pants smart”
Also, too, they distrust a pol who comes across as too clever. Romney’s talking down was some of his worst moments. The base wants a Daddy who tells them what to do but they don’t want a naggy Mommy/Teacher who makes them feel stupid.
David in NY
@Suffern ACE: Well, glad I’ve got your attention. Shouldn’t be hard to top that last one…
(I think I’ve got a lot of crap stored up in my head due to reading the Reader’s Digest avidly at about the age of 8. Too late, I learn that one reason old folks can’t remember stuff is that too much of their neural pathways are being used to store old junk.)
Another Halocene Human
It’s also interesting that Herman Cain played the part so perfectly and wasn’t done in by one white woman–that just confirmed their own prejudices and preferences–he was done in by the mistress. He had a relationship with a white woman? Over many years? Oh, hell no.
It ripped the mask off his shuck’n’jive act and the disillusioned GOP masses wandered away.
Scott de B.
A Buick Enclave, surely.
Belafon (formerly anonevent)
@NotMax: Specifically, the court decided their own definition of recess appointments:
As someone pointed out, Earl Warren and William Brennan were appointments that did not occur during intersession recesses. So, Brown v. Board could be affected by this decision.
Maude
@JPL:
Ice is scary. We here in NJ are expecting some snow. It’s 22, so no rain ice, wintry mix.
They close schools here is there’s going to be slick roads. Some of the roads in the rural areas are tests for heart attacks.
MikeJ
@handsmile:
Technically speaking you were just behind the Reflection Pool, unless you were at the other end of the mall where the Reflecting Pool in is front of Lincoln.
I mention it only as stupid trivia, not as a reproach or even with the slightest idea that anyone should actually care.
Ruckus
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
I would say Jeb, but then I saw a recent picture of him and he is looking more and more like the shrub every day. Him on TV is going to bring up some nasty memories for a lot of people and I think that may knock him out.
David in NY
@Belafon (formerly anonevent): Warren was. Brennan was not on the Brown court.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@Omnes Omnibus: I agree with you and eemom on that. As for writer’s version preference, for me that’s even true with Warren Zevon songs.
schrodinger's cat
It could be Ryan, after all this is GOP and it is his turn.
Villago Delenda Est
@Randy P:
Not only am I a secret Hapsburg, Hohenzollern, Bourbon, and Romanov pretender to various thrones of Europe, I can also press 5 metric tons.
Also, too, my wife is…Morgan Fairchild. Yeah, that’s the ticket!
And still I’m less of a liar than Paul Ryan or Bobby Jindal.
Chris
@feebog:
This.
Belafon (formerly anonevent)
@David in NY: Your right, I pulled names from the post I read. Brennen was recess appointed, though, and imagine the court decisions if he had not been there.
SFAW
@Belafon (formerly anonevent):
One hopes you were making a joke by posting that. You DO realize, don’t you – although “someone” apparently does not – that being CONFIRMED to the Supreme Court is not the same as being a recess appointment, right?
ETA: Yes, Brennan was originally a recess appointment, but he eventually went through the confirmation process.
handsmile
@MikeJ:
Whaddaya expect from a tourist? I did manage to refrain from being photographed beside a Barack/Michelle cut-out. If there’d been a Jill Biden, though…
Another Halocene Human
@handsmile: Good for you on going. I wanted to go but decided against it. I don’t know if that was the right decision or not.
I wasn’t really in line to get tickets because although I volunteered a lot I didn’t make appointments and then show up. I dropped by when the stars aligned, mainly making calls to identify volunteers during the summer (when volunteers were thin on the ground, so I feel I did do something right), also bringing in donations they’d asked for and distributing campaign literature in the community. So yeah, I didn’t look that good in the computer system. It never occurred to me until after the election that that might hurt me later.
Also, I kind of fucked up in that I had blocked off the days before the election to do something for AFL-CIO, but they needed me to travel and my f*@king car broke. I guess I should have been doing GOTV with OfA. Fuck me.
I’m so stupid. I was the same way in school. I thought the point was to learn new things and master the material and never paid attention to grades. Took classes because they were challenging, not for GPA.
Meh. So I gave up on going to the inaugural. Plus I felt guilty about just running off to DC while everyone stayed home. I guess I made productive use of my time here, and it wasn’t like the ultimate whatever that I was missing. I went to see Michelle speak during that campaign. That was pretty awesome. I guess that’ll be good enough.
Another Halocene Human
@handsmile: Oh, I totally got photographed with the President[‘s cutout] in the summer and texted it to like everyone.
Chris
@Brachiator:
Yes. You just have to remember your place. As Herman Cain found out when he mildly objected to the use of the N word in the name of Rick Perry’s ranch and found himself targeted by a firestorm of conservative rage until he meekly apologized for having made white people feel bad. Different people can be okay, but only if they recognize and abide by the hierarchy.
Elie
@NotMax:
Not agreeing with you there. Neither boy is that smart but I think that Bobby has an instinct for gaff and misjudement seconded only by Romney. Really — who would allow himself to be associated with cutting HOSPICE care for the poor? Seriously?
Johnnybuck
I think if Mike Huckabee wanted to run he could win the nomination fairly easily. I think he could have beaten Romney and seriously challenged the President. I mean, for a crypto-facist, he’s a pretty likeable guy which I think they’re all convinced is needed to win anyway. He’s smarter than W, more folksy charm than any of them, doesn’t get far out there with rape talk, suitably hawkish and a preacher. How could he lose?
schrodinger's cat
@Chris: That means there is a glass ceiling for anyone who is not white, not Christian, not male and not heterosexual. So no Haley or Jindal or Ayotte. For all her popularity Palin did not even run. She probably figured that she would not go too far in the good old boy party.
Chris
@Another Halocene Human:
There’s a lot of overlap between different prejudices. Racism is different from sexism which is different from homophobia which is different from intolerance for other religions which is different from xenophobia and anti-immigrant prejudices, but all these things find a home in the GOP. Many of their voters hold most or all of these prejudices at the same time, some don’t. Occasionally you’ll still see Muslims voting for the GOP out of homophobia or gay people voting for the GOP out of Islamophobia.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@Cassidy:Oh, eemom mistook Soft Cell for the Clash, to great amusement on some of our parts. It was a while ago, but that’s sort of like a week in Balloon Juice time:
I expect that when she actually turns 100 she’ll live it down; if not, then shortly thereafter.
opie_jeanne
@NotMax:
Why that particular vehicle?
(That was what we drove until a month ago.)
Chris
@Another Halocene Human:
But they also crave “their” “intellectuals” to go up and prove that conservatives are just as smart as liberals. It’s a weird fucking dynamic, but there’s not too much in the GOP these days that isn’t.
Elie
@handsmile:
I do hope that we have another meet up in the Northern VA area. It just got confusing trying to figure out what the plan was.
I enjoyed the inauguration parade on Monday and loved seein O and Michelle walk down PA Ave… good times!
Elie
@Chris:
that’s right.. New logo: “GoP — the home for hate”
gwangung
@gene108:
To be honest, this is true.
The part that Republicans forget, though, is minorities HAVE TO GET SOMETHING. If they’re left with bupkis after a policy, they’re not going to give Rs credit for trying—they’re gonna remember that a Republican policy gave them jack shit.
Republicans, you don’t prove yourself superior with a more elegant ideology—you prove yourself superior by results. And you;ve got nothin’…..
Mike E
@Scott de B.: I dunno, I would see her tooling around in a Fury.
trollhattan
@Johnnybuck:
At this point I think Huck has too much baggage–on tape–to have a legitimate shot at the nom. Hell, zombie Lee Atwater couldn’t resist coming back to make just one more Willie Horton ad, even if Huck’s a Republican.
IMHO it’s too early to handicap the thing. The money men are going to be more careful who they back and I’d not be surprised if it doesn’t go to some under-the-radar governor who’s proven adroit at gaming redistricting and voter suppression.
Chris
@Johnnybuck:
The conservative base distrusts Huckabee because they see him as soft on crime (those criminals he pardoned who went on to kill again) and soft on immigration (he actually said that Hispanic immigration gave Americans a chance to prove they’re not racist by accepting them).
The conservative elites distrust him because he sometimes says things that imply that he would be something other than a complete and total slave to the banksters (his “Wall Street vs Main Street” rhetoric).
He might be able to survive pissing off one of these two if he could count on the support of the other. But without the base and without the elites, he’s dead meat. (Which doesn’t mean that other people who share his most despicable traits couldn’t do perfectly well in a primary).
There’s also a personal theory of mine that a sizable chunk of the conservative base, even if they care about “Christianity” as a tribal identity and a justification for their power, like being able to sin enough that they’re not entirely comfortable with the thought of their pastor running the nation – and that this partly explains the poor showings Mike Huckabee and Pat Robertson had in their respective Republican primaries.
Chris
@schrodinger’s cat:
That’s probably true, but to be fair, I think that was at least as much due to the fact that Palin is a tremendously lazy POS who couldn’t fathom doing the work the presidency would require. Better to make a living grifting as Fox News’ version of the Kardashians.
Cassidy
Sarah Palin impregnated by an AA rapper. I might tune in to that.
handsmile
@Another Halocene Human:
I gotta run, but many plaudits to you for working on behalf of the AFL-CIO. The Inauguration may not have been the “ultimate whatever,” but in my 5+ decades, it was certainly in the realm.
Also too, in this one man’s opinion, there are few commenters on this blog for whom the word ‘stupid” applies less.
UpisDown
What about Brian Sandoval, Hispanic Gov of NV? I think the only strike I’ve heard against him is he won’t sign on as a Norquist blood brother but I didn’t take the time to check on his pro-life creds.
Also think Susana Martinez is a real contender. Pretty much for the same reason as Sandoval — Hispanic and a Governor.
I would think that if they expect Hilary to be the Dem nominee, they’ll want to be able to caterwauling about her (relative) lack of executive experience, and hopefully be at least smart enough to have someone of their own with more exec experience than Palin had.
Also, would it really surprise anyone to see Scott Walker in the mix? He gets consistently high marks from the trike force at RedState.
cckids
@Johnnybuck:
This. Also goes, in many ways, for Christie. If you don’t look at most of his actual policy views, he comes across as a straight-shooting, tell it like it is guy. Sure, he’s got some extra pounds, but who doesn’t? Many, many people vote based on how they feel about the candidate, they don’t bother to check out history or future plans. This worked in Obama’s favor, a bit; Christ knows he was immensely more likeable than RoboMitt.
Christie is scary, electorally. Don’t know if he can really get through a R primary against the crazies, but lots of blue-collar types like him.
cckids
@Chris: She couldn’t do the work to check out what it would take to RUN for president. Form a committee, fundraising that didn’t just fill her pocketbook, etc. Plus she gets off too much on being a vengence monkey on Facebook, screeching about any & everyone who she imagines has it out for her & her imaginary “Real America”.
I don’t like her much, if you can’t tell.
NotMax
opie_jeanne
Escape loosely ties into the whole going Galt thing.
Johnnybuck
@Chris: Well, the base swallowed pretty hard and picked the father of Obamacare, so who can say? guy won 8 primaries in ’08 and finished second in 15. Nobody presumptive for ’16 can match that.
It’s a long shot, but none of them seem to be able satisfy all the factions, so why not the likeable guy?
Chris
@gwangung:
Exactly. And not only are they not doing anything, they’re actively trying to hate on them even as they’re bewildered that they’re not getting their votes.
A lot of the “ethnic whites” that were hated the last fifty years were receptive to the conservative message, but first the conservatives had to stop relentlessly beating the horses of “these people aren’t really American and will never be” and “they’re agents of the Pope sent here to destroy us,” and allow them into the coalition. Right now anti-immigrant hysteria is higher than it’s ever been since the 1920s, but the modern equivalents of the Klan sincerely don’t understand why it’s not getting them immigrant votes. Go figure.
Chris
@Johnnybuck:
Yes, but they wouldn’t have if Wall Street, the party establishment and the rest of the big shots had been as suspicious of Romney as they were. They’re the reason Romney stayed in the race and a credible candidate for as long as he did.
Like I said, I think you can survive the distrust of either the base or the elites, but not both.
Ruckus
@Chris:
He’s not always their preacher. I think when discussing religion in politics one needs to keep in mind there are sub blocks, different churches in the make up. Just because you have to be at one with god, in may not be the “correct” god. They may accept someone outside their church as long as they feel the distance is not too great or the other choices aren’t better. Mittens survived the religious test but barely.
schrodinger's cat
@cckids: Christie is not just 10 pounds overweight, he is morbidly obese.
Villago Delenda Est
@gwangung:
This is the problem they face. They can’t come to terms with the fact that their ideology does not produce the results they claim it will. It only makes matters worse, particularly for minorities.
Ruckus
@schrodinger’s cat:
If you look at pictures of Taft, he is large, but does not look nearly as obese as cristie. I think that this will hurt his chances. That and being an asshole doesn’t seem to play as well in many places as it has for him. OTOH I can see why some people like that sort of person, someone who is crude and seems to stick it to the man. That is a description a lot of people aspire to.
That is another thing, it seems that a lot of people want to “stick it to the man”. Their lot in life is crappy because of “the man”. I think a lot of the rethug support comes from people with this attitude. People with this view might just feel “successful” people are so because they have gotten over on the “man”.
Chris
@Villago Delenda Est:
Almost, but I think what they can’t come to terms with is the fact that their not producing results suddenly matters again. Since 1980 they’ve lurched from fuckup to fuckup, epically lowered the standard of living for the American public, and gotten away with it because so many Americans simply didn’t care about that at the ballot box. Now, they’re faced with a public that doesn’t just roll over when you speak Angry White Conservative shibboleths and is actually asking “yeah, I know you hate fags and bitches, but what are you doing to perform the job I pay you for?”
That’s never happened to them before and they simply don’t have the first idea how to react to it. They’ve grown up their entire lives in a world with no accountability, where all they had to do to get elected was find the right worship-words and scapegoats. So now they’re fumbling around looking for new worship-words and scapegoats that will make the new voters ignore their incompetence the same way their traditional base does. They just can’t process the fact that voters might actually now expect them to work for a living.
Chris
@Villago Delenda Est:
FYWP, though I can’t complain in this case –
Almost, but I think what they can’t come to terms with is the fact that their not producing results suddenly matters again. Since 1980 they’ve lurched from fuckup to fuckup, epically lowered the standard of living for the American public, and gotten away with it because so many Americans simply didn’t care about that at the ballot box. Now, they’re faced with a public that doesn’t just roll over when you speak Angry White Conservative shibboleths and is actually asking “yeah, I know you hate the sluts and Teh Ghey, but what are you doing to perform the job I pay you for?”
That’s never happened to them before and they simply don’t have the first idea how to react to it. They’ve grown up their entire lives in a world with no accountability, where all they had to do to get elected was find the right worship-words and scapegoats. So now they’re fumbling around looking for new worship-words and scapegoats that will make the new voters ignore their incompetence the same way their traditional base does. They just can’t process the fact that voters might actually now expect them to work for a living.
jefft452
“(though I think Jindal is smarter than Ryan, to be fair),”
The soft bigotry of low expectations
West Oakland original
Would you people stop calling Piyush by his American name?
His. Name. Is. Piyush.
Also, he isn’t smart. Stop giving him credit. He’s shrewd, but not highly intelligent.
Brachiator
@gene108:
RE: Conservative racism is complicated. If you are a flag waving conservative, and if you come across as being frankly pro-Real White American(tm) values, you get some cover despite your ethnicity.
No, in the case of Obama, it’s racism. You see it clearly in the continued claims that Obama is not “qualified,” and that his academic record is phony. You see it in the claims that somehow Obama is “a joke” and that he and his family are somehow polluting the White House by their presence there. And you see it in the claims by wingnut racists that he hates white people, and the sick comments that always pop up attached to news stories about Obama that he is looking to get some unspecified revenge against America or white people for wrongs done to his father. You also saw it in the strange accusations coming from the Romney camp that Obama could not adequately represent “Anglo Saxon” values.
This kind of stuff has nothing to do with cultural differences that you might find in reactions to a Pelosi or a Kennedy.
And yet, again the smart money was that fundamentalists and others would never accept a Mormon as their presidential candididate. If the Republicans nominated a nonwhite person for VP or even president, it would cause huge dissonance among many racist conservatives (and yes, not all conservatives are racist). I don’t know how many of them would grudgingly accept the candidate. But it would be funny to see. Might even happen one day. I know Democrats who had to deal with their earlier assertion that America was not ready for a black president when Obama became a serious candidate.
@Chris:
But this is where the tension lies. There is no way that any nonwhite person, or any woman, can run for president and also maintain a subservient place in American society. There is no asterisk next to the title commander-in-chief. It’s not like somebody could say that a nonwhite president has to sit in the back of Air Force One.
This is, again, why the most pathetic racists get so incensed seeing Obama exercise presidential authority, or to be seen as respected by other foreign leaders. It contradicts every sick thing that they believe and have ever been taught.
@West Oakland original:
Now, here’s a statement with racist overtones. How is it that Jindal is not intelligent? And why the emphasis on what his name is “supposed” to be?
Chris
@Brachiator:
The only potential caveat is that there’s a class of 1%ers who see politicians, even in the White House, as overpaid servants. Not nearly as much as in the Gilded Age or Roaring Twenties, when it was considered lowering oneself for a dude like Roosevelt to run for political office. But I could still see some people like Murdoch or the Kochs viewing a black politician like that.
But yeah, that definitely doesn’t apply to Joe Conservative Sixpack, so your point stands. If nothing else, Cain’s candidacy proved that their standards for how to treat a black politician, even one of theirs, are a lot lower than a white one.
opie_jeanne
@NotMax: Ah. Thank you.
I am still a little bit in mourning for that yellow Escape. We live near Seattle so we bought a Subaru. We laughed two years ago when mr opie_jeanne’s co-workers told us that we’d be driving one once we moved here from Anaheim.