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You are here: Home / Elections / Election 2012 / Early Morning Open Thread

Early Morning Open Thread

by Soonergrunt|  November 16, 20126:34 am| 151 Comments

This post is in: Election 2012, Open Threads, Teabagger Stupidity

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Hey, has anybody noticed that those restaurant chains that are talking about cutting hours on staff to keep them from eligbility for healthcare are all places no one with any taste wants to eat anyway?  And in many cases, it’s not the chains themselves, but the larger franchisees that are doing it.

The State of Florida has officially certified the election of Patrick Murphy to Congress.  Allen West has flat refused to accept reality (which trait is consistent with his teabagger politics) but once the election is certified, there’s not a whole hell of a lot the courts can do.  That’s why Kathleen Harris was so quick to certify the bullshit election of GW Bush back in 2000.

What’s everybody got going today?

 

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Reader Interactions

151Comments

  1. 1.

    Karmus

    November 16, 2012 at 6:43 am

    I’m planning on another day of schadenfreuding, with a side order of Colorado Delight.

  2. 2.

    Scott S.

    November 16, 2012 at 6:47 am

    Florida being the Stand-Your-Ground hellhole that it is, I think someone should start a betting pool on when Allen West gets shot trying to break into Patrick Murphy’s home — and how quickly the teabaggers wash their hands of him.

  3. 3.

    Jon Rockoford

    November 16, 2012 at 6:47 am

    Please, please, someone with a megaphone make this point:

    The restaurants that do not want to give health care to their employees are places where their employees prepare food for public consumption! And they are admitting that their employees neither have health insurance, nor will they get health insurance. They can stay sick while making food for you!

    Who the fuck wants to eat in a place where sick employees have to work with food and without the opportunity to heal? Why isn’t there a nationwide revulsion at eating at restaurants that essentially have been advertising that if their employees get sick, they should stay sick while making food for us?

    Why isn’t this a scandal in itself? Why would anyone want to eat food prepared in such unhygienic conditions? I don’t want Typhoid Mary making my pizza!

    Beyond the moral issue of not giving a shit about your employees health and well-being, this should be a public health issue and a marketing disaster for these asshole restaurant CEOs.

    I wrote Papa John’s: “For the record, I’d be happy to pay far more than a dime per pie to ensure that your employees have access to health care. Not only because it is the morally right thing to do, but because it’s far more hygienic to get pizza from a company that makes sure its employees can visit a doctor and remain healthy.”

    They never replied, but had enough mercy to remove me from their mailing list because I’m not eating Typhoid Mary pizza any longer.

  4. 4.

    mai naem

    November 16, 2012 at 6:50 am

    The Seattle Times has the photo that shirtless secret agent sent to the stalkee of the allupinmysnatch author. He looks like a doofus skinhead(yeah, I know that’s redundant)

    http://seattletimes.com/ABPub/zoom/html/2019688946.html

  5. 5.

    weaselone

    November 16, 2012 at 6:56 am

    Probably because most of the better places and chains know that trotting out a 15 cent increase in the price of a pizza or a 5% surcharge on the bill to cover health insurance makes them and the company look like Grade A asshats. Those type of statements don’t engender hatred of Obamacare, they raise questions as to why the company in question wasn’t already providing insurance to its workers. It’s reminiscent of the antifreeze companies refusing to add foul tasting chemicals to the ethylene glycol in order to save 2 cents a bottle.

  6. 6.

    kay

    November 16, 2012 at 7:07 am

    I’ve only read one of the low wage employers whines, but I don’t think they can get around the law by cutting hours. I think the IRS just adds part-time employees together to make full time employees so the company is still on the hook to either provide insurance or pay the government for subsidizing their employees health care.
    We’re subsidizing their employees health care anyway, it’s just now we can collect a sum- certain for reimbursement.
    Low wage employers have been relying on the social safety net a long time, because the fact is people can’t really survive on such low wages. It’s about time they started paying for it.

  7. 7.

    WereBear

    November 16, 2012 at 7:12 am

    @Jon Rockoford: Excellent point, and one I’ll be using.

  8. 8.

    arguingwithsignposts

    November 16, 2012 at 7:13 am

    @Jon Rockoford: This really is an excellent point. Sadly, we can’t agree that animal factory farms shouldn’t be polluting the watershed, or that inspectors should be funded to stop salmonella outbreaks because of these galtian types.

  9. 9.

    Elizabelle

    November 16, 2012 at 7:17 am

    @mai naem:

    The gentlemen to the right and left of Agent Hustings have a brighter future than he does.

    What would you do with an FBI agent with a rightwing “worldview”, who whistle-blows to rightwing congressmen when he perceives his agency isn’t scandalmongering fast enough?

    Snake inspections in Guam? Someone on Morning Joe suggested Alaska. Take him off investigations and have him count pencils at HQ?

  10. 10.

    bemused

    November 16, 2012 at 7:17 am

    Metz of Denny’s: I’ll be forced to put surcharge on meals due to socialist Obamacare. Customers can choose to tip the servers less.

    Classy all the way.

  11. 11.

    danielx

    November 16, 2012 at 7:19 am

    Allen West has flat refused to accept reality…

    And he has lots of company.

  12. 12.

    Older_Wiser

    November 16, 2012 at 7:19 am

    Years ago, county health depts required TB x-rays of all food service workers.

    Most restaurants don’t even require gloves or hairnets anymore. It might clash with the “ambience” I suppose. Do we really know what goes on in the kitchen? Out of sight, out of mind, while it’s the front staff they want attractive and part of the scenery.

    If we want healthy folks preparing and serving our food, in a country that seems to eat out more every year rather than cooking at home, shouldn’t we as consumers lobby our county health depts to require that owners pay for medical exams for their employees? And get the State to back it up?

    Those county health inspectors at food establishments worry more about the food temp, placement, etc. than they do about whether or not employees are spreading communicable diseases. And everyone knows when they’re going to show up. Like clockwork. I worked in a couple of grocery store delis in my retirement mode and I’m quite aware of what goes on. We did have to wear hair coverings (except for guys with short hair and male mgrs (they were always males)–sexist!) and gloves when handling food and most of us were careful (even w/o formal sanitary training), but still, there is no backup when an employee calls in sick and is told to come in or lose their job. Keeping the payroll slim (absolutely no O/T), keeping numbers of hours worked, is the bottom line the co strives for, no matter how it affects service–or health.

  13. 13.

    kay

    November 16, 2012 at 7:19 am

    @weaselone:

    The health care bill allows small employers to compete with large employers on benefits because it offers tax credits for small employers and a guarantee of health insurance should you choose to leave your large employer and start your own pizza shop.
    So the worse thing that could happen is we get small, local restaurants to replace the giant chains who go Galt :)

  14. 14.

    amk

    November 16, 2012 at 7:22 am

    All this talk of adding ‘obamacare’ surcharge. How legal is that ? Or simply these nutters are just blowing smoke up their asses ?

  15. 15.

    Kirbster

    November 16, 2012 at 7:28 am

    If the internet and the multi-billion dollar right-wing noise machine had been around in the 1960s, we’d have seen the same sort of defiant whining from certain business owners in regard to employer funding of the new Medicare program. (Perhaps they’d have derisively referred to it as “Johnsoncare”.) The assholes have always been with us. They just have a bigger megaphone these days.

  16. 16.

    Hawes

    November 16, 2012 at 7:33 am

    I’m guessing Fieri won’t be offering benefits to his employees either then.

    I’m shocked to find out that pennies will be added to my Moon Over My Hammy in order to make sure millions of Americans don’t go bankrupt when they get sick or die sooner.

    The humanity profit margin.

  17. 17.

    R-Jud

    November 16, 2012 at 7:36 am

    There’s no November buffer holiday in Britain, so the German Christmas market is already in town: http://instagr.am/p/SFsKhiwW8k/

    I may have had a mulled cider and rum for lunch.

  18. 18.

    La Caterina

    November 16, 2012 at 7:37 am

    Going down to Coney Island to do disaster relief (legal services). This will be my first shift in this neighborhood and I’m a little nervous.

  19. 19.

    Kane

    November 16, 2012 at 7:37 am

    President Obama and Obamacare are simply the excuse du jour. In large measure these are the same people who are opposed to unions, raising the minimum wage, pay equity for women, workers rights and all the rest.

  20. 20.

    Stentor

    November 16, 2012 at 7:38 am

    I sincerely hope that Allen West spends all of his money on a pointless court battle, impoverishing him to the point where he has to start blowing hobos for food money. It couldn’t happen to a nicer dickbag. Wrap a fucking anvil around his neck & send him off to the dustbin of history. Good riddance asswipe.

  21. 21.

    j

    November 16, 2012 at 7:38 am

    That’s it. Just announced. The unions refused to accept their 3rd cut in pay and benefits since 2004, so Hostess locked the gates to all their plants and announced that they will start liquidating assets starting November 30. 18,000 people were just fired.

    Hostess has an appointment with a judge on Monday.

    Better stock up on Twinkies and HoHo’s.

  22. 22.

    Valdivia

    November 16, 2012 at 7:40 am

    Truly amazing piece about the techs who worked for the O campaign. Totally worth a read.

  23. 23.

    SiubhanDuinne

    November 16, 2012 at 7:42 am

    Is there a list somewhere of the restaurant chains that have publicly taken the “we’re forced to add a surcharge/raise prices/cut staff because of Obamacare”? Papa John’s and Denny’s I know about. What are some of the others?

  24. 24.

    Older_Wiser

    November 16, 2012 at 7:45 am

    Some locals are a whole lot worse. Like the seafood restaurant in NC where kitchen employees came in after hours and slaughtered a goat, winding up contaminating the kitchen, causing an e-coli outbreak which resulted in hundreds of people becoming ill and resulting in the death of at least one elderly customer. http://www.ecoliblog.com/e-coli-outbreaks/e-coli-cases-linked-to-slaughtered-goat-at-captains-galley/

  25. 25.

    Paul

    November 16, 2012 at 7:46 am

    They can do whatever the hell they want. On the other hand, I don’t have to eat there. As a result, I will never again eat at Papa Johns (what a shameful owner (the same goes for Payton Manning for doing an ad with them), giving away 2 million free pizzas, yet won’t pay for health care for his employees)) or at Applebees. The list keeps growing…

  26. 26.

    ronathan richardson

    November 16, 2012 at 7:46 am

    If there’s a better definition of a–hole than “person who complains that they have to pay an extra 40 cents for their meal at Denny’s so their servers can have health care”, i don’t know what it would be.

  27. 27.

    PeakVT

    November 16, 2012 at 7:52 am

    @amk: Why would it be illegal? Plenty of restaurants have a mandatory “gratuity” of 8 or even 15%. They may be required to disclose it somewhere on the menu or near the door, but other than that there’s nothing stopping them that I can think of.

  28. 28.

    R-Jud

    November 16, 2012 at 7:52 am

    @Valdivia: Holy shit, Harper Reed! I dated a good friend of his for a couple of years when I lived in Chicago, we used to hang out and play board games. And here I was thinking I’d done something with my life!

  29. 29.

    JPL

    November 16, 2012 at 7:55 am

    @j: Wow.. If only ordinary folks bought twinkies and wonder bread then the world would be a better place.

  30. 30.

    gf120581

    November 16, 2012 at 7:56 am

    I hope Allen West finally faces reality and throws in the towel, but given how unhinged the man is, I’m not holding my breath. In fact, I wouldn’t be surprised if this ends with him refusing to surrender his Capitol offices to Murphy in January and being dragged out of the building kicking and screaming by Capitol security.

  31. 31.

    PeakVT

    November 16, 2012 at 7:57 am

    @j: Can a bankruptcy judge order management to start production and order everyone back to work? I don’t know the details here, but liquidation usually means creditors get less than they would if the concern was kept going. The action by Hostess management may be punitive instead of necessary, and thus they are shafting the creditors more than would happen if they kept it going.

  32. 32.

    jibeaux

    November 16, 2012 at 7:58 am

    @mai naem: White men need to make the headshaving decision carefully. They might look like badasses, they might look like giant peeenises/Rick Scott. Choose wisely, white dudes.

  33. 33.

    Schlemizel

    November 16, 2012 at 8:00 am

    @Jon Rockoford:

    Great letter – BTW Forbes magazine puts the cost at no more than 4.6 cents per pizza so the bastard can’t even tell the truth about that

  34. 34.

    amk

    November 16, 2012 at 8:01 am

    @PeakVT: Isn’t there a difference between a gratuity and an ‘obamacare’ tax or surcharge or whatever you wanna call them?

  35. 35.

    Schlemizel

    November 16, 2012 at 8:04 am

    @amk:

    Since they can charge pretty much whatever the customers will allow its legal. Not bright but legal

  36. 36.

    bemused

    November 16, 2012 at 8:05 am

    @Valdivia:

    Harper Reed: “I think the Republicans fucked up in the hubris department”.

    There seems to be a pattern here.

  37. 37.

    Maude

    November 16, 2012 at 8:05 am

    @j:
    Hostess can’t run the business without bakers.
    If they liquidate Monday, that’s the end of it.
    The union should negotiate. The economy is still bad and now, if Hostess goes out, the 18,500 will be out of a job.

  38. 38.

    Soonergrunt

    November 16, 2012 at 8:05 am

    @bemused: supposedly, he’s backing off the whole thing with a “it’s a misunderstanding that I represented myself as a whistleblower” kind of thing.

  39. 39.

    EconWatcher

    November 16, 2012 at 8:07 am

    Boy, elections do have consequences. Have you seen all the Republicans piling on the criticism of Mittster for his “gifts” comment? If he’d won, they’d be cheerfully and openly talking about how to disband the “moocher society.”. But instead, they have to pretend to be shocked by what they voted for. Consequences, indeed.

  40. 40.

    Schlemizel

    November 16, 2012 at 8:08 am

    @R-Jud:

    Suddenly I hate you!

    German Christmas markets are not to be missed. Seriously. Its as if they bring out the best chocolate and the best pastries and the best sausages that they have been hiding for months. & you can wash it down with all sorts of cider, chocolate and/or alcohol refreshments served hot.

  41. 41.

    Kane

    November 16, 2012 at 8:09 am

    It’s good business to have happy and healthy employees. There’s fewer sick days and less of a turnover rate, which means less time training new employees.

    If I were a local restaurant owner or owned a large franchise that provides healthcare to my employees, I would advertise how I care about the local community and my employees by providing healthcare to all of my employees. I would market my business as the family restaurant who cares about families.

  42. 42.

    bemused

    November 16, 2012 at 8:10 am

    @Soonergrunt:

    That’s how they roll. Reveal themselves as the greedy, selfish pigs they are and then say, “Never mind”.

  43. 43.

    Schlemizel

    November 16, 2012 at 8:10 am

    @j:

    I bet they enter bankruptcy & are allowed to start up again but with brand new, non-unionized workers making $8/hour with few benefits. Profits will soar, now is the time to buy shares.

  44. 44.

    PeakVT

    November 16, 2012 at 8:11 am

    @amk: I don’t see why there would be. It’s wrong to call it a tax, because it’s not being paid to the government. Calling it tax may be illegal, too, but who knows? I doubt many people do without looking it up.

  45. 45.

    Ash Can

    November 16, 2012 at 8:11 am

    @amk: Perfectly legal. A private business owner can charge whatever s/he damn well pleases for the product or service for whatever reason, and especially in the case of a non-essential product such as restaurant food, it’s entirely up to the consumer to respond by saying “Fuck you, asshole; your shitty food is overpriced as it is” and decline to pay the asking price.

  46. 46.

    JPL

    November 16, 2012 at 8:14 am

    @Schlemizel: Profits will share because people want Wonder Bread… Really? When was the last time you ate Wonder Bread or a Twinkie?

  47. 47.

    Valdivia

    November 16, 2012 at 8:16 am

    @bemused:

    I know, that should be the motto no? Loved the way he put it too, just simple and on point.

  48. 48.

    Gordon, the Big Express Engine

    November 16, 2012 at 8:16 am

    @Paul: i beg to differ. Peyton manning is a genius. He buys into a couple of dozen papa johns franchises (hence the ads) in Colorado months BEFORE they legalize pot!

  49. 49.

    PeakVT

    November 16, 2012 at 8:17 am

    @Schlemizel: Hostess is already in bankruptcy. The management is planning on moving from reorganization to liquidation (Ch. 11 to Ch. 7) on Monday. Some other company might buy all of the bakeries and restart them, but it would be a fundamentally different company.

  50. 50.

    Valdivia

    November 16, 2012 at 8:18 am

    @R-Jud:

    I love that you know him, even more that you used to play board games with him. :)

  51. 51.

    pluege

    November 16, 2012 at 8:19 am

    great to move on but its really discouraging that allen west could be close in any election.

  52. 52.

    jibeaux

    November 16, 2012 at 8:20 am

    Maybe the Hostess workers could make the Candy Cane JoJos for Trader Joe’s that sell out every damn year and get hoarded on the black market by unscrupulous people.

  53. 53.

    Kane

    November 16, 2012 at 8:20 am

    @EconWatcher: If one reviews the archives from the days following the 2008 election, the quotes from Republicans concerning what they needed to do moving forward as a party are almost identical to what they are saying now. But rather than adapt and modify their policies to a changing world, Republicans ultimately decided that all they needed was a new salesman and a catchy new slogan to sell the same failed policies.

  54. 54.

    amk

    November 16, 2012 at 8:20 am

    LOL

  55. 55.

    El Cid

    November 16, 2012 at 8:21 am

    Because mocking the low pay and benefits of your cooks and waitstaff with possibly undiagnosed and untreated illnesses always ends well for the customer, and fills people with confidence in selecting your company to buy food from.

  56. 56.

    Raven

    November 16, 2012 at 8:23 am

    Years ago I was in Sacramento for a family event. After the official doings we went to a Denny’s that had a bar. About 20 of us drank for four hours. When my old man got the bill his eyes bugged out, it was a tiny fraction of what it should have been. Being the cheap ass Norwegian he was he payed up, tipped big and we vamoused!

  57. 57.

    amk

    November 16, 2012 at 8:24 am

    @pluege: Dems made it only in 10/27 FL CD’s. It’s time dems ditched those old nutters and concentrated on TX and AZ.

  58. 58.

    bemused

    November 16, 2012 at 8:24 am

    @Valdivia:

    One sentence sums up the GOP.

  59. 59.

    Trinity

    November 16, 2012 at 8:29 am

    Bwhahahahahahaha @ Allen West. May he choke on his way out.

    Also, too. Hostess sucks.

  60. 60.

    Schlemizel

    November 16, 2012 at 8:30 am

    @JPL:
    So you are saying nobody has bought a loaf of Wonder Bread or a Twinkee, Ho-Ho or other crap-cake in years? Well then how they not go broke years ago?

    NOBODY ever went broke overestimating American taste for junk food.

  61. 61.

    PeakVT

    November 16, 2012 at 8:32 am

    The AP has called CA-07 for the Dem. Still outstanding are CA-52, UT-4, AZ-1, and NC-7 (according to the NYT). LA-3 will be decided by runoff in December, but a Republican is certain to win as both of the top two were Republicans.

  62. 62.

    Schlemizel

    November 16, 2012 at 8:33 am

    @PeakVT:

    I assume that the carcase will be bought by the same group that is running it now. I have seen this done before. Not only do they get out of all their debt they buy the assets for pennies on the dollar & the bank even loans them the money to do it.

    The are freed of creditors and crush the union. The new workers (often the same people because where else are they gonna find work?) make quiet a bit less and have no protection.

  63. 63.

    JPL

    November 16, 2012 at 8:33 am

    @Schlemizel: You are probably right. When my thirty something son, first had a slice of wonder bread at the age of two, he thought it was a cookie.

  64. 64.

    NonyNony

    November 16, 2012 at 8:35 am

    @El Cid:

    Because mocking the low pay and benefits of your cooks and waitstaff with possibly undiagnosed and untreated illnesses always ends well for the customer, and fills people with confidence in selecting your company to buy food from.

    I think it’s fairly obvious that these Masters Of The Universe who run restaurants where they demand to be able to pay their workers a pittance with no health care to make food care as much about their customer’s health as they do their employees.

  65. 65.

    schrodinger's cat

    November 16, 2012 at 8:38 am

    @JPL: Never. BTW who owns Hostess, is it Bain by any chance.

  66. 66.

    Narcissus

    November 16, 2012 at 8:39 am

    I haven’t been to a Denny’s or Papa Johns in years.

  67. 67.

    schrodinger's cat

    November 16, 2012 at 8:40 am

    I have eaten at Denny’s once and never at Papa John’s. It would be interesting to see how this decision affects their sales.

  68. 68.

    PurpleGirl

    November 16, 2012 at 8:40 am

    @j: You want to bet that Hostess is owned by a hedge fund or a “private equity” fund? (Something like Bain Capital.)

  69. 69.

    double nickel

    November 16, 2012 at 8:41 am

    Off to Winnipeg to see Neil Young and Crazy Horse tonight. Good times!

  70. 70.

    hep kitty

    November 16, 2012 at 8:43 am

    I don’t want to hear about Benghazi from republicans.

    It took 3 years for the 9/11 Commission, which was formed one year after the attacks, to issue its final report which was a joke.

    I think republicans need to be reminded of this when they start whining about Benghazi.

  71. 71.

    hep kitty

    November 16, 2012 at 8:45 am

    @Jon Rockoford: This is an excellent point. My niece, who used to work in restaurants, had to go in sick in the past.

    Those ppl who care only about “me and mine” and screw the wait staff should care about that. Most of them eat at crappy places just like that.

  72. 72.

    jibeaux

    November 16, 2012 at 8:45 am

    We went to Denny’s once, for breakfast on the road with the two kids. Oddly, the waitress was phenomenally good, funny and patient with the kids, and quick and didn’t miss a beat. I would’ve hired her as a nanny on the spot.

  73. 73.

    jibeaux

    November 16, 2012 at 8:46 am

    @hep kitty: Going out on a limb here, but I bet the 9/11 Commission members attended security briefings too.

  74. 74.

    Belafon (formerly anonevent)

    November 16, 2012 at 8:46 am

    I view complaining about quality of restaurants in the same way I view criticism of music: People have wildly different tastes and comforts, and it’s really kind of pointless bashing things like that. A lot of people like chain restaurants because you can generally walk into one anywhere and know exactly what you are getting.

  75. 75.

    bemused

    November 16, 2012 at 8:49 am

    @Schlemizel:

    The Honey Boo Boo families of America.

  76. 76.

    PeakVT

    November 16, 2012 at 8:50 am

    @Schlemizel: Good point. One might think that kind of self-dealing would be barred, but apparently not.

  77. 77.

    magurakurin

    November 16, 2012 at 8:50 am

    @Jon Rockoford:

    Here’s the deal. If you eat a pizza a Papa John’s you deserve whatever you get. Fuck Papa John’s. I’d rather eat my own vomit than eat a Papa John’s pizza.

  78. 78.

    Jay in Oregon

    November 16, 2012 at 8:51 am

    @Schlemizel:

    Well then how they not go broke years ago?

    Acording to Wikipedia, Interstate Bakeries (the original name for Hostess) filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy in 2004 and spent five years there before emerging as Hostess. And Hostess filed for Chapter 11 again in January of this year.

  79. 79.

    NonyNony

    November 16, 2012 at 8:54 am

    @Schlemizel:

    So you are saying nobody has bought a loaf of Wonder Bread or a Twinkee, Ho-Ho or other crap-cake in years? Well then how they not go broke years ago?

    Tastes change. Wonder bread used to be a high-end brand when it first hit the scene back in the 1920s. Well off families bought Wonder bread. That changed over the decades to where Wonder bread is now part of the punchline to a joke about mayo and trailer parks.

    Twinkies, Ho-hos, and their other cakes are the same way. When they hit the scene they were a premium brand. They got hit on the one side by health consciousness and on the other side by changing fast/quick service food models. Why buy a Twinkie when you can stop by Starbucks and get a fresh(er) cupcake? Or Panera and get a cinnamon roll? Or McDonalds and get warm cookies?

    Hostess has been bleeding business for decades. If it had better management it could have adjusted by changing its portfolio of brands. But from what I’ve read, Hostess management has mostly been inept over the years and assuming that the American appetite for junk food would be endless.

  80. 80.

    jurassicpork

    November 16, 2012 at 8:56 am

    I decided to get with the times and do what any self-respecting novelist does in the innertubz age: Set up a dedicated blog to my novels and try to drive up a reader base. This is better than inflicting my literary musings as a readership that comes to Pottersville looking for political content. So far, I have four posts up and plan on publishing excerpts, reviews, articles about writing and the publishing game and perhaps even interviews.

  81. 81.

    lol

    November 16, 2012 at 8:56 am

    Saw a similar kind of bellyaching in Seattle when we passed a law mandating a small amount of paid sick leave for restaurant employees. Some restaurant owners screamed to the press that they were going to have to cut hours, etc. Amounted to nothing.

  82. 82.

    R-Jud

    November 16, 2012 at 8:58 am

    @Valdivia: I have never been so humiliated playing Scrabble before or since. It was me and the then-boyfriend against Harper and his roommate, who was a professional juggler with a geology degree, and they just blew us away. I did, however, clean up at Boggle a couple of times.

  83. 83.

    Seanly

    November 16, 2012 at 9:02 am

    @amk:

    The thought is that the old couple who tips only $0.50 will drop their tip to $0.25 when their Denny’s bill goes from $20 to $20.10.

  84. 84.

    MomSense

    November 16, 2012 at 9:03 am

    The owners of these chain restaurants and companies like WalMart are the real “moochers” or “takers” or whatever the hell the correct term is in Galtian parlance.

    Their business model depends on taxpayer’s assistance for the TANF and Medicaid and food stamps that make it possible for their employees to subsist while earning piss wages.

    Having worked near one of those Hostess bakeries for a number of years I will tell you that whatever they were baking inside smelled awfully good and made you want to pig out on donuts. I feel terribly for the workers.

  85. 85.

    Dork

    November 16, 2012 at 9:05 am

    blowing hobos for food money

    I smell a great band name.

  86. 86.

    RSA

    November 16, 2012 at 9:05 am

    @NonyNony:

    I think it’s fairly obvious that these Masters Of The Universe who run restaurants where they demand to be able to pay their workers a pittance with no health care to make food care as much about their customer’s health as they do their employees.

    A couple of years ago my wife and I had burgers at a bar and grill, a local franchise. We had a bit of stomach upset afterwards and so we called the place to let them know; we weren’t asking for any compensation, but were thinking that they might want to know–we liked the place. The manager argued that it couldn’t have been their food, because they’d had no other reports.

    So we came away from that experience with three lessons. First, we weren’t going back to that place. Second, some businesses are defensive about their product to the point of being jerks about it. Third, it’s probably really hard to prove that you got bad food somewhere, unless you get very sick and have your stomach pumped.

  87. 87.

    Schlemizel

    November 16, 2012 at 9:08 am

    @Jay in Oregon: @NonyNony:
    Yet they are still selling crap. Maybe not as much crap as 40 years ago but there is still a market.

    Given the shelf life maybe they can move operations to China & ship the crap here. That would reduce the price & help them move more crap.

    But having worked with vendors who went through the bankrupt/buy-self-back route thats my guess

    As for who owns them – Ripplewood Holdings has a 50 percent equity stake with lines/loans by GE Capital, Silver Point Finance and Monarch Master Funding.

    BTW – they also make Dolly Madison, Natures Pride and a couple of other lines so its not all wonder & ho-ho. MY personal favorite of their other brands though is BIMBO – which if you have been to Mexico you may have seen. My younger son has a BIMBO soccer jersey!

  88. 88.

    Schlemizel

    November 16, 2012 at 9:10 am

    @Schlemizel:

    Ripplewood Holdings
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ripplewood_Holdings

    an American private equity firm based in New York, New York[1] that focuses on leveraged buyouts, late stage venture, growth capital, management buyouts, leveraged recapitalizations and other illiquid investments.

    WHAT A SURPRISE!

  89. 89.

    Guess Who

    November 16, 2012 at 9:11 am

    Papa John is now living the American Dream thanks to intelligence, hard work, and determination. He is of course everything envious Marxists hate–wealthy, powerful, successful, self-reliant.

    He even has his own private golf course by his mansion! Boy, that must REALLY piss you off.

    He is also from my area originally–southern Indiana, just outside Louisville. And nothing hits the spot like an extra large with extra cheese and pepperoni w/Papa’s garlic sauce! Mmmm Mmmm MMM! Best pizza around.

  90. 90.

    PurpleGirl

    November 16, 2012 at 9:11 am

    Yup… Hostess is owned by a private equity firm, looks like it’s Ripplewood something. Their website has been shut down; go to it and you get “This website is unavailable”.

  91. 91.

    R-Jud

    November 16, 2012 at 9:11 am

    @Schlemizel: They opened here yesterday and are in town through the 22nd of December. I shall have many more sausages this holiday season.

  92. 92.

    Schlemizel

    November 16, 2012 at 9:17 am

    @R-Jud:
    HATEHATEHATEHATEHATE!

    8-{D

    you lucky busterd

  93. 93.

    schrodinger's cat

    November 16, 2012 at 9:17 am

    If finance is the life blood of an economy, the financial sector has now become a cancer on the economy, if we don’t treat it aggressively it will devour the entire economy, again.

  94. 94.

    Jamey

    November 16, 2012 at 9:18 am

    @Jay in Oregon: Which, of course, means that everything is the overpaid line-workers’ fault… (qv: Pontiac Aztek.)

  95. 95.

    PeakVT

    November 16, 2012 at 9:18 am

    @Schlemizel: According to Wikipedia, BIMBO is an entirely separate baking multinational.

  96. 96.

    Paul

    November 16, 2012 at 9:19 am

    @Guess Who:

    Papa John is now living the American Dream thanks to intelligence, hard work, and determination. He is of course everything envious Marxists hate—wealthy, powerful, successful, self-reliant. He even has his own private golf course by his mansion! Boy, that must REALLY piss you off.

    Marxists? Why am I not surprised at the name calling from people of your ilk. Actually I am a strong believer in capitalism and free markets. This also means I believe that people have the right to boycott who ever they want. What Papa John said is not much different than your pal Romney’s disgusting comments last night.

    If you are going to insult your customers, don’t be surprised if they take their business elsewhere as I have already done. As a matter of fact, I found a local pizza place just around the block whose pizza is better tasting than Papa John’s. Capitalism in its truest form. You should try it some time.

  97. 97.

    Guess Who

    November 16, 2012 at 9:21 am

    @Paul:

    Drop in the bucket. Papa John will remain very wealthy and extremely successful. Jealous?

  98. 98.

    Schlemizel

    November 16, 2012 at 9:22 am

    @PeakVT:

    eh? maybe they sold it – BIMBO was part of the company in the mid-00’s I know. I suppose I could wiki it but thats haaaaard.

  99. 99.

    magurakurin

    November 16, 2012 at 9:22 am

    @Guess Who:

    Best pizza around.

    of course, this is coming from a guy who likes to lick buffalo ass, so, you know, your mileage may vary.

  100. 100.

    MattMinus

    November 16, 2012 at 9:22 am

    I’ve never run a restaurant, but I have managed other types of shops, and I have to imagine that all this talk of moving to an almost entirely part time workforce is bullshit. Hiring costs money, and part timers aren’t going to stick around as long as full timers. I’d have to imagine that your training costs go up, both due to increased churn and the fact that you’re doing the same job with more people.

    There are probably about a billion more reasons why this is stupid, but if staffing with part timers was such a great thing, they’d be doing it already.

  101. 101.

    Guess Who

    November 16, 2012 at 9:25 am

    BTW, local pizza places are even more likely to have Republican, conservative owners. They hate ObamaCare even more than the big boys. Producers will almost always be rock-ribbed Republicans.

  102. 102.

    magurakurin

    November 16, 2012 at 9:26 am

    but if staffing with part timers was such a great thing, they’d be doing it already.

    exactly. The reason this asshole is whining so loud is because he is stuck like a pig. He’ll have to comply with the law or shut down his shitty business. His choice. I’ve never eaten his shitty pizza and I never will and his employers will find work at the next pizza shop that fills whatever void he leaves. Fuck him.

  103. 103.

    Guess Who

    November 16, 2012 at 9:27 am

    @magurakurin:

    Papa John makes more money in a day than you will make in a lifetime. :)

  104. 104.

    Ksmiami

    November 16, 2012 at 9:28 am

    @Jon Rockoford: my servsafe teacher made the point that you should only eat in places where employees earn a living wage and healthcare if not for moral reasons but for your own health!!!

  105. 105.

    magurakurin

    November 16, 2012 at 9:29 am

    @Guess Who:

    local pizza places are even more likely to have Republican, conservative owners.

    except when they don’t.

    Pizza man power lifts Obama

    hahahahahaha. what an asshole you are. Don’t you have some goats to fuck or something?

  106. 106.

    PurpleGirl

    November 16, 2012 at 9:29 am

    @MattMinus: My local Key Food grocery store apparently has moved to all part time cashiers and only a few of them at that. I imagine that the owner thinks he’s saving money but, yes, he’s had turnover in staff and people who can drive to other stores do so and therefore his overall revenue is down. Stupid is as stupid does (and I dislike that movie so much, but that line is so true and applicable).

  107. 107.

    magurakurin

    November 16, 2012 at 9:30 am

    @Guess Who:

    Maybe if your lucky, Papa John will let you toss his salad. I mean you can dream, right? hahahahahahaha. asshole.

  108. 108.

    bemused

    November 16, 2012 at 9:31 am

    @NonyNony:

    Tastes do change when you have stopped eating “food” products with a lot of preservatives and who knows what all. When we attend benefits, graduation parties, etc. and hit the food table, I can immediately smell an awful odor from rolls, buns that are loaded with this stuff and want to gag.

  109. 109.

    Schlemizel

    November 16, 2012 at 9:31 am

    @MattMinus:

    Many already run on PT help. Truth be told kitchen help can some of the most difficult there is to manage. Stable, reliable, cooks are a gift from FSM.

    But the slop shops we are hearing from don’t really have professional staff anyway. They mostly rely on kids & undocumented workers. There is a huge turnover (my kid went from line cook to kitchen manager in one well-known chain in about 8 months while working PT & going to college FT simply because he was willing to work & stayed through the constant churn of people coming & going).

    Those places, the big chains, make money by serving consistent if uninspiring food as cheaply as possible. Quality is not high on their agenda & the formulas for churning it out don’t suffer all that much when the staff is inexperienced (speed does though). They just don’t care. The crudest example is McDonalds. They did not sell trillions of brown cow-like things because they care about quality they did it because you can get the cow-like stuff very cheap and any kid who does not want to churn it out for minimum wage & personal abuse can be replaced by one who will put up with it for a few months.

  110. 110.

    Ksmiami

    November 16, 2012 at 9:34 am

    @Maude: of course hostess should have gone public and expanded to Asia a long time ago so their management is obvious the suck!

  111. 111.

    Scott S.

    November 16, 2012 at 9:34 am

    @Guess Who: Herman Cain would like a word with you.

  112. 112.

    Kane

    November 16, 2012 at 9:41 am

    Hostess got Bained.

  113. 113.

    dmsilev

    November 16, 2012 at 9:49 am

    @Guess Who:

    And nothing hits the spot like an extra large with extra cheese and pepperoni w/Papa’s garlic sauce! Mmmm Mmmm MMM! Best pizza around.

    As knowledgeable about pizza as you are about electoral politics.

  114. 114.

    jake the snake

    November 16, 2012 at 9:49 am

    Papa John’s comments are bullshit, because the great majority of the workers are already part-time.
    He is blowing smoke, unless he is will the gamble that
    reduction in service will be blamed an the ACA and
    not on the individual restaurants.
    @ Guess Who
    Rent-seekers are indeed mostly Republicans, producers are mostly Democrats.

  115. 115.

    j

    November 16, 2012 at 9:50 am

    @Maude: Hostess is demanding that the employees take another 8% pay cut (on top of the other 2 they agreed to in 2004 and 2009) plus the employees have to pay more for health insurance, which will offer less than they are now getting, plus the employees have to say goodbye to their pensions, which they have been paying into for years.

    It’s only the bakers union that is on strike, but the rest of the employees are backing them.

    Why won’t Hostess management take a pay cut?

  116. 116.

    Odie Hugh Manatee

    November 16, 2012 at 9:52 am

    @magurakurin:

    Only after he fucks the buffalo though.

  117. 117.

    Schlemizel

    November 16, 2012 at 9:53 am

    @Kane:

    Well I think, as others here have pointed out, that they are just on the wrong side of the market right now. People want actual taste in bread and are avoiding the huge caloric loads of sugar filled with whipped fat.

    That the vultures should now swoop in & pluck the carcase insuring the worst possible outcome for the workers, the creditors and the shareholders while fattening their own greasy parasitic bodies is just SOP in todays America.

  118. 118.

    PurpleGirl

    November 16, 2012 at 9:59 am

    @Schlemizel: the shareholders

    The shareholders are the private equity firm and their own investors; Hostess such as it is doesn’t have separate shareholders. It’s wholly owned by the private equity fund and they want to get all the cash out of it that they can at this point.

    ETA: What we are seeing here is exactly what Romney and Bain did to the companies they owned, screwed and then closed.

  119. 119.

    Jamey

    November 16, 2012 at 10:04 am

    @Paul: I guess if somebody has to feed the trolls, it should be with Wonder Bread and Poopoo John’s pizza.

  120. 120.

    peorgietirebiter

    November 16, 2012 at 10:06 am

    @Guess Who: I get the feeling you think great wealth is required to fully realize your god given “assholiness” potential. Carefull what you wish for, wealth is a double edged sword and the road is littered with the wealthy who’ve “settled” for the human condition of occasional “assholiness” often followed by reflection and remorse. You may want to focus on staying in the present- you’re quite the asshole just as you are, enjoy it.

  121. 121.

    Schlemizel

    November 16, 2012 at 10:09 am

    @PurpleGirl:

    only 50% of the share holders. Their half will do OK but the other half . . . no so much

  122. 122.

    Judas Escargot, Bringer of Loaves and Fish Sandwiches

    November 16, 2012 at 10:17 am

    @Jon Rockoford:

    I don’t want Typhoid Mary making my pizza!

    Now there’s a good bumper sticker…

  123. 123.

    KXB

    November 16, 2012 at 10:19 am

    @Maude:

    Hostess has not introduced new snack products in 40 years. By contrast, Nabisco & Frito-Lay are always introducing new snacks, and if they don’t sell well, they stop making them. Hostess’ problems are the result of market competition and consumer tastes, not the unions. I have not eaten a Hostess product since I was 10, because they taste like a factory floor.

  124. 124.

    hep kitty

    November 16, 2012 at 10:26 am

    @Guess Who: I’m not the one going to Hell so I’m not particularly jealous

  125. 125.

    Judas Escargot, Bringer of Loaves and Fish Sandwiches

    November 16, 2012 at 10:27 am

    @Guess Who:
    “If you want to know what God thinks of money, just look at the people he gave it to.” (Dorothy Parker)

  126. 126.

    shortstop

    November 16, 2012 at 10:39 am

    @Schlemizel:

    BTW Forbes magazine puts the cost at no more than 4.6 cents per pizza so the bastard can’t even tell the truth about that

    And probably lower than that. Who could have predicted the juvenile grandstanders would also be liars?

  127. 127.

    Roger Moore

    November 16, 2012 at 10:40 am

    @Schlemizel:

    The crudest example is McDonalds. They did not sell trillions of brown cow-like things because they care about quality they did it because you can get the cow-like stuff very cheap and any kid who does not want to churn it out for minimum wage & personal abuse can be replaced by one who will put up with it for a few months.

    I think this is actually missing an important point. Companies like that stay in business precisely because they can produce food of acceptable quality in spite of the problems you describe. The ability to make consistent food despite completely inconsistent staff is their real specialty. McDonald’s* isn’t the worst hamburger out there because they’re incapable of cooking; they’re the worst hamburger out there because they define the minimum quality standard. Your mom-and-pop place can’t match McDonald’s for price, so if you can’t beat them on quality you aren’t going to stay in business for long.

    And if you crave a fast food burger and have it available, go to In-n-Out. They not only make an excellent fast food burger, they do it while treating their staff decently.

    *Or whichever chain you think is the absolute worst; no arguments about McD vs. White Castle.

  128. 128.

    TR

    November 16, 2012 at 10:41 am

    Wow, I’m amazed that such a progressive chain as Denny’s — you know, the one that was notorious for its racism against black customers — has acted in this way.

  129. 129.

    Roger Moore

    November 16, 2012 at 10:43 am

    @dmsilev:

    As knowledgeable about pizza as you are about electoral politics.

    At least Brick Oven Bill cared about decent pizza.

  130. 130.

    shortstop

    November 16, 2012 at 10:44 am

    I heard Allen West is so depressed he’s spending the day slumped in a corner booth at Denny’s.

  131. 131.

    TR

    November 16, 2012 at 10:44 am

    @Guess Who:

    Papa John’s pizza is cardboard and ketchup.

    You’re from southern Indiana? Well, no wonder you like it. You probably think Chef Boy-ar-Dee’s canned ravioli is the tastiest pasta in the world too.

  132. 132.

    shortstop

    November 16, 2012 at 10:46 am

    @dmsilev: I know a Twinkie-lover when I see one. Probably has Ho-Hos on the sly, too.

  133. 133.

    James K. Polk, Esq.

    November 16, 2012 at 10:49 am

    UNLIMITED CORPORATE PIZZA!

    BOOKMARK IT LIBS.

  134. 134.

    jonas

    November 16, 2012 at 10:49 am

    @kay:

    Low wage employers have been relying on the social safety net a long time, because the fact is people can’t really survive on such low wages. It’s about time they started paying for it.

    This times a million. Eric Schlosser really hit home this point in Fast Food Nation — part of the “fast food” business model is to foist off expenses such as training, health care, workman’s comp, etc., onto the individual worker or society and pocket the profit. So if a slaughterhouse worker gets injured, you don’t work to increase safety, you just fire the guy and let Medicaid take care of his maimed arm.

  135. 135.

    kathleen

    November 16, 2012 at 10:49 am

    “Katherine” Harris, hon. I’m picky about who I share my name with.

  136. 136.

    Schlemizel

    November 16, 2012 at 10:52 am

    @Roger Moore:

    I agree with your point. A part of the problem is people accept really awful burgers (its not just mickie Ds) because they are cheap and dependable. Those are two admirable qualities but hardly a gold standard when it comes to food.

    The modern American supermarket is full of tasteless shit simply because it is cheap and dependable. There is a reason you can have a tomato in January in Minnesota and it is inexpensive. The price you pay is the cardboard container the tomato was shipped in cost more to produce and tastes as good.

  137. 137.

    Schlemizel

    November 16, 2012 at 11:00 am

    @jonas:

    Its not just the food industry any more. CBS SUnday morning did a bit about a manufacturer in NV that was having problems finding workers capable of handling the skills needed for their plant. Had to read blue prints & do complex math. Not really that difficult but enough I guess. They got the State to run a training program – 16 weeks of remedial training after which they hired a few . . . for $12 an hour.

    Not that long ago a factory worker could get by with less skill and still make enough to buy a house, raise 6 kids, help them with college and retire with dignity (thanks dad). Today he would have to know trig, have a working spouse and still qualify for the earned income credit. SOmething is deeply wrong in this society & it ain’t the government!

  138. 138.

    Roger Moore

    November 16, 2012 at 11:05 am

    @Schlemizel:
    Privatize profits and socialize costs. It’s the essence of modern crony capitalism.

  139. 139.

    Soonergrunt

    November 16, 2012 at 11:09 am

    @Guess Who: You are a stupid motherfucker. 60% of small businesses provide health insurance to their employees.
    Here’s one such right here:
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/15/papa-johns-obamacare-ians-pizza_n_2133050.html?utm_hp_ref=mostpopular

    And I for one don’t mind paying a little bit extra. If an extra 3 to 15 cents is what it takes to help John Schnatter be a good Christian, that’s my duty.

  140. 140.

    MaryRC

    November 16, 2012 at 11:22 am

    Even the customers are getting into the act. From one of the more hysterical wingnut blogs:

    We are leaving the following on a business card at all restaurants starting January 1
    Barack Obama and YOUR TIP:
    We are sorry to inform you , that due to the cost of OBAMACARE, your normally 20-25% tip has been adjusted to the amount you see reflected . We will now have to put the amount that would have otherwise gladly gone to you, towards paying our increased taxes. Unfortunately, OUR “fair share” now results in YOUR decreased tip. We hope that, if you voted for the current president, if nothing else, this will be “food” for thought. If you didn’t, please share this with other like-minded people, so they can see the results of such disastrous policy in action.

    Fair enough. Just don’t think of going back to that particular Denny’s again.

  141. 141.

    Origuy

    November 16, 2012 at 11:27 am

    Twinkie fans will have to smuggle them over the border.

    Despite its troubles, Canadians need not worry about Hostess products disappearing anytime soon.
    __
    Saputo holds the rights to the Hostess brand in Canada and operates it as a separate entity.

  142. 142.

    Jay in Oregon

    November 16, 2012 at 11:28 am

    @MaryRC:
    The GOP goal for the next four years is to simply punish everyone who voted for Obama.

    Or may have voted for Obama.

    Or shares a skin tone with the President.

  143. 143.

    peorgietirebiter

    November 16, 2012 at 11:35 am

    @Schlemizel:

    Had to read blue prints & do complex math.

    When I graduated high school in 1970 – the ability to read bluprints or schematics and do complex math, with no other experience,would get you hired at my old man’s tool & die shop. He would probably start the kid at $7.75 per hour & bump him to $12.00 after a year of solid, reliable work.
    Over time after 40, one week vacation, health insurance and dental if you wanted to pay for it.

    This was 1970 and the old man was a Goldwater Republican. He hated unions but believed you paid for a persons time- properly and promptly.

  144. 144.

    LanceThruster

    November 16, 2012 at 11:39 am

    This always worries me in these situations because the individual franchisee and corporate are not necessarily in lockstep. Just like with “punish the oil companies” boycotts, it’s usually individual station owners who bear the brunt of the anger however unjustified.

  145. 145.

    shortstop

    November 16, 2012 at 11:42 am

    @MaryRC: Please. Like one of these motherfuckers ever tipped 20-25 percent. I know these people from my table-waiting days in college, and from being related to a couple of them now. They leave a buck for a $50 check when eight of them eat at Denny’s.

  146. 146.

    priscianusjr

    November 16, 2012 at 11:45 am

    Allen West needs to take a vacation. A permanent vacation.

  147. 147.

    bemused

    November 16, 2012 at 11:49 am

    @TR:

    Best pizza around? This has to be Doug playing troll.

  148. 148.

    j

    November 16, 2012 at 11:59 am

    Just heard on the Stephanie Miller show that that wingnut franchisee in New York who owns a shit load of Denny’s restaurants and was going to charge an “Obamacare surcharge of 5%” got a “friendly, persuasive” call from the corporate offices and he is now “walking it back”.

    I guess Denny’s doesn’t their brand being stunk up by some asswhole. That guy could lose his franchises for this stunt.

  149. 149.

    Felonius Monk

    November 16, 2012 at 12:00 pm

    @Schlemizel:

    MY personal favorite of their other brands though is BIMBO – which if you have been to Mexico you may have seen.

    Interesting. Are you talking about the BIMBO that I buy in my local grocery store made by BimboBakeriesUSA? They also make SaraLee baked goods, Entenmanns, Arnold, Thomas, etc.

    BimboBakeriesUSA

  150. 150.

    j

    November 16, 2012 at 12:02 pm

    ANOTHER deep sea oil well just blew up in the Gulf. 4 injured (being flown to a hospital) 2 missing, presumed to be blown out to sea.

  151. 151.

    Another Halocene Human

    November 16, 2012 at 3:32 pm

    @amk: But it’s the party that sucks, and FWIU, the Tex Dem Party is actually worse.

    The Fla AFL-CIO is pretty active and doing good things. They’ve got a 10-year plan to flip state house seats, plus the FairDistricts law, so this gerrymandered situation will not be eternal. Well, except for Corrinne Brown.

    If you want to see Florida turn blue, I would suggest donating to Fla AFL-CIO’s COPE Committee instead of to the Florida Dem Party or the DCCC. Because they suck.

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