Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

“Perhaps I should have considered other options.” (head-desk)

He really is that stupid.

The fight for our country is always worth it. ~Kamala Harris

Shut up, hissy kitty!

I’d hate to be the candidate who lost to this guy.

How stupid are these people?

Sitting here in limbo waiting for the dice to roll

We do not need to pander to people who do not like what we stand for.

Fundamental belief of white supremacy: white people are presumed innocent, minorities are presumed guilty.

Black Jesus loves a paper trail.

DeSantis transforming Florida into 1930s Germany with gators and theme parks.

Polls are now a reliable indicator of what corporate Republicans want us to think.

So very ready.

We will not go back.

’Where will you hide, Roberts, the laws all being flat?’

Republicans choose power over democracy, every day.

Hi god, it’s us. Thanks a heap, you’re having a great week and it’s only Thursday!

The world has changed, and neither one recognizes it.

Boeing: repeatedly making the case for high speed rail.

Fear or fury? The choice is ours.

Petty moves from a petty man.

Whoever he was, that guy was nuts.

75% of people clapping liked the show!

Nothing worth doing is easy.

You are here: Home / Open Threads / I can still hear you saying you would never break the chain

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208Comments

  13. 13.

    donnah

    Spoiler reference to the Logan film.

    The new health care disaster bill is like the new hybrid in Logan: soulless, cruel, massive, and meant to be indestructible. We fight back all day long, knock it down, punch and kick it as much as we are able, but even when we drop a tank on it, it comes back.

    We need an silver bullet to blow the head off this monster. We have to keep fighting because the alternative is unthinkable. Someone has to save the children and it has to be us.

  16. 16.

    Ridnik Chrome

    One of only two songs from “Rumours” (the other is “Secondhand News”) that I can still hear (pun intended) without wanting to throw myself out of the nearest window. For a while in 1977 it seemed like that album and the Saturday Night Fever soundtrack were the entire playlist for my local top forty radio stations…

  17. 17.

    jl

    @joel hanes: Holy galloping alots! I’m going to look for the the alot next time I go to the zoo.

    Edit: There’s supposed to be a herd of alots in Golden Gate Park, but every time I’ve gone by, they are hiding.

  21. 21.

    jl

    From news I’ve heard and read this morning, seems like the dissident GOPer Senators, the original vanguard, and the ones who jumped on the bandwagon after McConnell pulled the bill, are digging in deeper in their objections. Will be harder for them to cave, especially if people call their offices and tell them they will remember very well what their stated objections were.

    Collins, Caputo and Heller said the Senate cuts to Medicaid are a big problem and that has to be fixed. Let them know you will remember that.

    McConnell may be so cynical and so sure big wads of political bribes can solve all problems that he underestimated the electoral implications for individual Senators of a really crappy bill that is impossible to sell to 99% of the country once it understands what it does.

    I think a good idea to study up on what different GOP moderate dissenters have said about their problems with the bill and tell them you will remember whether their deeds conform to their words. If McConnell left some minor (in terms of $ for tax cuts) goodies off the table, like opioid treatment money, in hopes that they can be used as symbolic victories for the moderates as excuses to come back to daddy, he may have miscalculated. But the pressure has to increase on the moderates, and they need to know people are watching their words and deeds very closely, in order to see whether they are acting in good faith or not. And that what they say and do will be remembered.

  22. 22.

    Seanly

    There is a protest outside my window at work. It is along Front Street in Boise, Idaho (between Broadway & Ave B, maybe further). A fair number of folks honking horns in support of (not letting the Republicans gut) healthcare.

    For those of you who are saying to yourselves, but Idaho is as red as it gets, yes, it is a very red state if you just look at our idiot politicians (40% of whom are also LDS even though the population is only 20% LDS). Lovely Boise is purple – the bulk of the few Democrats in Idaho state politics represent Boise as well as the Boise mayor & council.

  23. 23.

    jl

    @jl: Oops, Capito, not Caputo.

    Edit: fact that states cannot be gerrymandered in same way House districts have been, may be important. House GOPers always have to balance risk in primary from reactionary nutcases versus relatively low risk general elections. Many senators have to worry about both in equal measure.

  24. 24.

    eclare

    Calling Corker and Alexander again this afternoon. Once again, AARP advocacy line: 1-844-833-9667. You enter your zip code and select which senator you want to talk to. Just trying to find a way to magnify my voice.

  25. 25.

    randy khan

    @jl:

    Edit: fact that states cannot be gerrymandered in same way House districts have been, may be important. House GOPers always have to balance risk in primary from reactionary nutcases versus relatively low risk general elections. Many senators have to worry about both in equal measure.

    This is an important point. Whatever you think of the Senate, the politics facing individual Senators are different than those facing individual Representatives.

  26. 26.

    The Moar You Know

    40% of whom are also LDS even though the population is only 20% LDS

    @Seanly: You don’t have a politician problem. You have a voter motivation problem.

  27. 27.

    Marcopolo

    Just finished being @ the local protest outside Roy Blunt’s local St Louis office. I’d estimate somewhere around 100-150 folks showed up. My sign read “Happy with my ACA Insurance. Mend it don’t end it.”

    I don’t underestimate McConnell’s ability to figure out how to get votes but this POS bill is stunningly unpopular and full of reasons for the average person to hate it. Did I see Capito say today that it would take more than just an opioid buyout to get her to yes? I hope to hell everyone in West by God Virginia is giving her a double earful.

  28. 28.

    jl

    @Marcopolo: I think important that callers say that they are tracking her words and deeds closely to find out whether she is acting in good faith for the welfare of her constituents, and they will remember very well what she says and does.

  29. 29.

    Mike in DC

    The best case scenario is that this drags out to the end of next month, and still fails. That throws a wrench intothe tax reform bill and the infrastructure bill timetables. We might get through Trump’s first year with zero legislative achievements.

  30. 30.

    Hal

    A summary of Trump and the Republican party and it’s most ardent supporters.

    To the far right, everything about Barack Obama and his administration seemed somehow alarming, as if his election had ripped a tear in the fabric of time. In August, the Department of Education announced that the president would be making a speech addressed to the nation’s schoolchildren, about what a good idea it is to stay in school and to study hard. The speech would be made available to public schools, on C-SPAN, educational channels, and the White House’s website. Jim Greer, then chairman of the Republican Party of Florida, said: ‘As the father of four children, I am absolutely appalled that taxpayer dollars are being used to spread President Obama’s socialist ideology.’ Hannity said, ‘It seems very close to indoctrination.’ A pundit named Michelle Malkin, appearing as a guest on Hannity’s show, added, ‘The left has always used kids in public schools as guinea pigs and as junior lobbyists for their social liberal agenda.’ Glenn Beck, a former talk-radio host who launched a show on Fox News the day before Obama was inaugurated, compared the president to Mussolini. Some schools refused to show the speech. Some parents kept their kids home that day. Here is the pith of the speech they missed: ‘No matter what you want to do with your life,’ Obama said, ‘I guarantee that you’ll need an education to do it.’
    Jill Lepore, The Whites of Their Eyes: The Tea Party’s Revolution and the Battle over American History, 2010

  31. 31.

    JCJ

    @satby:

    If you ever have a chance walking in to a Penzey’s store brings pure olfactory joy. Their main warehouse used to be very close to me and there was a store as well. The main warehouse has moved twice and is now in a much bigger building. The regular stores are still wonderfully aromatic.

  32. 32.

    jl

    @Hal: I remember a passage from a European’s journal of his trip to the US. Might have been Democracy in America, but not sure.

    Anyway, the visitor was reading a newspaper on the porch of an inn, next to a real American pioneer, who noted that it was interesting that this foreigner who had to larn himself English, also larned how to to read it. And the traveler asked the American if he knew how to read.

    “No, sir, I do not. But I wish I did, it has some use, It helps a person to pass the time so well.”

    So, there you go. What use is reading now, that we have TV, radio and computer games? Real American values.
    Make America Great Again!

  34. 34.

    jl

    @Marcopolo: I saw a pic of the result of his drive thru of the monument in the news. I think the guy is nuts. Lucky he didn’t kill himself. with that stunt.

  35. 35.

    Mnemosyne

    @Chris:

    Exactly what I was thinking. We need a heavily armed, superintelligent raccoon on our side right about now.

  39. 39.

    Mnemosyne

    @jl:

    As my cynical side says, IF this abomination ends up passing, it’s best if Pence is the tie-breaking vote so he gets smeared with the shit as well.

    But we need to do as much as we can to prevent it from passing in the first place.

  41. 41.

    Chris

    @HeleninEire:

    On the other hand, apparently Trump is visiting France for Bastille Day – accepting Macron’s invitation.

    I like to hope that Macron invited him in order to show him the whole story of Bastille Day and then go “you know what happens when you push desperate people too far? That.”

  42. 42.

    frosty

    @Ridnik Chrome: This was my favorite song from Rumours. It’s the pounding backbeat and Stevie Nicks. They had a couple of similar ones on the previous album and Tusk too.

  43. 43.

    Brachiator

    @jl:

    McConnell may be so cynical and so sure big wads of political bribes can solve all problems that he underestimated the electoral implications for individual Senators of a really crappy bill that is impossible to sell to 99% of the country once it understands what it does.

    This gets interesting. Every aspect of this bill ignores the electorate, or assumes that all conservatives primarily care about two philosophical issues, tax cuts and opposition to anything resembling socialized health insurance. McConnell and company assumed that gerrymandering and obedience to the Koch Brothers would insulate them from any negative repercussions for essentially screwing over the populace (for their own good, of course).

    The ironic push-pull is that Republican moderates appear to be listening to their constituents while the Freedom Caucus are adamant that the health care bill be even more punitive than the original house version. And the money men, the big contributors are insistent that the Republicans get things done. They want their tax cuts. This is what they have paid Congress to get done.

    The political bribery may end up getting the Republicans over the hump, especially if it allows the GOP to paper over deficiencies in the proposed bill. Unfortunately, the citizens will still end up getting the shaft in the long run.

  44. 44.

    jl

    @Brachiator: Would explain why WH and GOP have resorted to outright lying to push the approach of the House and Senate bills. Spicer put out a tweet implicitly asserting that the GOP bills would increase insurance coverage, using the US population that remains uncovered by the PPACA as evidence.

  47. 47.

    jl

    @jl: Spicer’s tweet might be another thing to bring up in calls to Senate: if the bill is any good, why is WH and GOP lying about it so much? And why is GOP Senator X not objecting to the baldfaced lying? Not even saying anything about it? Why implicitly colluding with the lies? That will be remembered come election time or the Senator’s future political career as well.

  49. 49.

    eric

    @jl: the worst part of the tweet is that of the 28 million, millions would be insured if GOP controlled states had adopted Medicaid expansion. Jump Fuckers!

  50. 50.

    Chris

    @jl:

    28.2 Americans are STILL WAITING under Obamacare and remain uninsured!

    Yes, because the Nine decided that Medicaid should be left up to the states, and those with right wing governments or strong enough right-wing opposition parties were able to prevent it from going through.

    This is, of course, Obama’s fault.

  53. 53.

    trollhattan

    @Ridnik Chrome:

    For a while in 1977 it seemed like that album and the Saturday Night Fever soundtrack were the entire playlist for my local top forty radio stations…

    “How deep is your hate how deep is
    your hate….?”
    You’re forgetting “Frampton Comes Alive”

    Luckily we also had Sex Pistols, Talking Heads and a few others to claw away at the soundscape and kick disco and stadium rock in the balls. What was that other band? Oh yeah, The Clash (since is Doug! post).

  54. 54.

    rikyrah

    In 2018, your constituents will ‘choose’ not to vote for you.
    This isn’t a healthcare bill, it’s a death sentence to those most in need. t.co/lMH1UlN2La
    — David Yankovich (@DavidYankovich) June 28, 2017

    Paul Ryan: 22 million Americans won’t be ‘pushed off’ insurance — they will ‘choose’ not to buy it t.co/P2sGhVUBjg pic.twitter.com/LJbpPscnzI
    — Raw Story (@RawStory) June 27, 2017

  55. 55.

    rikyrah

    Kellyanne Conway: Those on Medicaid who will lose health insurance can always get jobs t.co/xaceZ85Dhm
    — CNBC (@CNBC) June 26, 2017

    As someone who works in a nursing home, please explain how ppl 65-100 (yes someone here is 100) w/ dementia will work? t.co/gOL1n8tlvc
    — Beauty in Color (@PoCBeauty) June 28, 2017

  56. 56.

    rikyrah

    New Quinnipiac poll:
    —Just 16% of Americans approve of GOP health plan; 58% disapprove
    —29% approve of Trump’s handling of health care
    — Bradd Jaffy (@BraddJaffy) June 28, 2017

  59. 59.

    Brachiator

    @jl:

    Would explain why WH and GOP have resorted to outright lying to push the approach of the House and Senate bills.

    Here’s the thing. Trump promised to repeal and replace Obamacare with something that would be better and continue all the best aspects of ACA. Later, Trump promised or implied that Medicaid would not be touched. The GOP leadership never promised the same thing.

    And of course, now the GOP is emphasizing how Obamacare is going to collapse any day now, and they are using this to signal a false sense of urgency in getting the bill passed.

    The Koch Brothers and their ilk want this thing passed ASAP because they want to see the net investment income tax surcharge and the additional Medicare tax repealed, so that when the inevitable tax reform bill comes up later this year, all the increased taxes on upper income taxpayers will have been eliminated. As a bonus, Medicaid will have been scaled back tremendously. And ultimately, the health insurance market will become unfair, inefficient and generally shitty again.

    So, yeah, outright lying is absolutely necessary. And the dash for cash for a few pet projects to secure the vote.

  60. 60.

    germy

    You’re the top,
    You’re Miss Pinkham’s tonic;
    You’re the top,
    You’re a high colonic;
    You’re the burning heat of a bridal suite in use;
    You’re the breasts of Venus,
    You’re King Kong’s penis,
    You’re self-abuse!

    You’re the arch
    In the Rome collection;
    You’re the starch
    In a groom’s erection.
    I’m a eunuch who has just been through an op;
    But if baby, I’m the bottom, you’re the top!

    (Cole Porter)

  61. 61.

    rikyrah

    FYI, the Senate Finance Office is tallying calls from people who want a public hearing of the healthcare bill: (202)224-4515. It’s v. easy.
    —
    Heather & Jessica (@fuggirls) June 27, 2017

    Just say you’re calling to be added to the tally of people who want a public hearing for the healthcare bill and they’ll take your zip code.
    —
    Heather & Jessica (@fuggirls) June 27, 2017

  62. 62.

    rikyrah

    Trump’s embrace of ‘fake news’ takes an embarrassing turn
    06/28/17 10:21 AM
    By Steve Benen

    Donald Trump boasted a few months ago that “nobody” has been on the cover of Time magazine more than him. He made a similar claim, for reasons that still aren’t clear, at CIA headquarters two months earlier. The assertion isn’t even close to being true – Richard Nixon holds the record – but the president just keeps repeating it anyway.

    It’s possible, however, that Trump actually believes he set the record because he counts fictional Time magazine covers that feature his face. The latest gem from the Washington Post’s David Fahrenthold ran yesterday:

    The framed copy of Time magazine was hung up in at least five of President Trump’s clubs, from South Florida to Scotland. Filling the entire cover was a photo of Donald Trump.

    “Donald Trump: The ‘Apprentice’ is a television smash!” the big headline said. Above the Time nameplate, there was another headline in all caps: “TRUMP IS HITTING ON ALL FRONTS … EVEN TV!”

    This cover – dated March 1, 2009 – looks like an impressive memento from Trump’s pre-presidential career. To club members eating lunch, or golfers waiting for a pro-shop purchase, it seemed to be a signal that Trump had always been a man who mattered. Even when he was just a reality TV star, Trump was the kind of star who got a cover story in Time.

    It is, however, a fake. It’s not clear who made the bogus cover, or whether Trump realized it’s a fake or not, but a spokesperson for the company that publishes the magazine confirmed it’s not real. That cover didn’t exist on that or any other date.

  63. 63.

    germy

    @Brachiator:

    McConnell and company assumed that gerrymandering and obedience to the Koch Brothers would insulate them from any negative repercussions

    He’s a great obstructionist (probably the best) but can Turtle actually legislate?

  64. 64.

    germy

    @rikyrah: Check out Judd Legum’s twitter (he’s from thinkprogress) on how TMZ became Trump’s official cheerleader.

  65. 65.

    rikyrah

    How the debate over pesticides unfolds in Donald Trump’s ‘swamp’
    06/28/17 10:47 AM—UPDATED 06/28/17 11:02 AM
    By Steve Benen

    ……………..

    The Trump administration’s top environmental official met privately with the chief executive of Dow Chemical shortly before reversing his agency’s push to ban a widely used pesticide after health studies showed it can harm children’s brains, according to records obtained by The Associated Press.

    Environmental Protection Agency Administrator Scott Pruitt’s schedule shows he met with Dow CEO Andrew Liveris on March 9 for about a half hour at a Houston hotel.

    About three weeks later, Pruitt ignored the findings of his own agency’s chemical safety experts to allow the use of Dow’s chlorpyrifos pesticide on food. The AP’s report added that EPA scientists concluded “ingesting even minuscule amounts of the chemical can interfere with the brain development of fetuses and infants.”

    A spokesperson for Pruitt’s agency said that when he spoke to Dow Chemical’s CEO, the two did not discuss the pending decision on the pesticide. The timing, apparently, is supposed to be seen as a coincidence.

    A separate AP report noted in April, “Dow Chemical chairman and CEO Andrew Liveris is a close adviser to President Donald Trump. The company wrote a $1 million check to help underwrite Trump’s inaugural festivities…. When Trump signed an executive order in February mandating the creation of task forces at federal agencies to roll back government regulations, Dow’s chief executive was at Trump’s side.”

  67. 67.

    jl

    @Brachiator:

    ” Trump promised or implied that Medicaid would not be touched. ”

    Just to clarify, Trump repeatedly and explicitly promised not to cut the big three social insurance programs (social security, medicare and medicaid) during the campaign. Polling indicated it was one of the main reasons the knucklehead vote supported such a toxic fool for president. I believe it. I heard a radio news spot with an interview of a woman who said she voted for Trump because she thought the Dems and GOPers would cut those programs and she was ‘hoping for a miracle’. Senators who don’t think the repeated Trump promises will show up during the next few election cycles in ads against them are complete fools. Or think that Koch money will be buy enough ads to keep the lies going.

  69. 69.

    rikyrah

    Public support for Republican health care plan reaches new depths
    06/28/17 01:12 PM—UPDATED 06/28/17 02:29 PM
    By Steve Benen

    The Kaiser Family Foundation has been publishing regular reports on the Affordable Care Act’s public support for several years, and last week, it found something new. For the first time, a narrow majority of the country – 51%, to be exact – expressed a favorable view of the health care reform law. This is roughly in line with other polling showing “Obamacare” reaching new heights in popularity in recent months.

    It’s against this backdrop that Republicans are trying to replace an increasingly popular law with a strikingly unpopular alternative.

    Just 12% of Americans support the Senate Republican health care plan, a new USA TODAY/Suffolk University Poll finds, amid a roiling debate over whether the GOP will deliver on its signature promise to repeal and replace the Affordable Care Act.

    In the survey, taken Saturday through Tuesday, a 53% majority say Congress should either leave the law known as Obamacare alone or work to fix its problems while keeping its framework intact.

  70. 70.

    divF

    @Jim Parene: My unfortunate association with Fleetwod Mac was the Penguin album, during their Bob Welch period. I had a housemate the summer after it came out that was playing it incessantly, while I was laid up with a bout of ulcerative colitis.

    In other news, I turn 65 today. Hurray, I guess.

  71. 71.

    trollhattan

    @rikyrah:
    Pruitt will kill more people than Sessions will manage to. Hate the bastard–thanks, fvcking Oklahoma..

  72. 72.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @germy: He’s a great obstructionist (probably the best) but can Turtle actually legislate?

    I was thinking of this last night, as MSNBC played at least twice that clip of Lisa Murkowski, all wide-eyed frustrated pragmatism, wondered rhetorically however we got to this point, oh me, oh my!, where we weren’t even talking about bipartisanship? Heavens to Betsy! Gosh, golly and even darn it all!
    I was thinking, Well, Leese, that would have been in January 2009, I’m pretty sure before Obama’s inauguration, when Mitch McConnell laid out the strategy of complete non-cooperation, the one you went along with for eight straight years, right up to the end (Merrick Garland). None of the MSNBC hosts or guests, that I saw, made that point.

  73. 73.

    Iowa Old Lady

    @Brachiator: He promised to replace the ACA with something better, yes. It would cover everybody and the care would be better. What’s more, it would cost less, which is preposterous on the face of it. How old are the people who believe crap like that? Do they also believe the Easter Bunny brings them free candy because they want it?

  74. 74.

    rikyrah

    Mitch McConnell’s Sinister Role in the Russian Hacks
    With the normalization of Trump’s antics, it is unfortunately all too easy to overlook the sheer rottenness of Mitch McConnell.

    by Mike Lofgren
    June 28, 2017

    Recently, I broached the “T” word (treason) with respect to Donald Trump’s actions. Strange and wonderful to relate, the heavens did not fall and lightning did not strike, regardless of the Polynesian taboo that seems to prevail in polite society. (At most, the prestige media will venture with the tiresome word “collusion,” which is unfortunate, because there is no legal sanction against collusion; the word they are looking for is “conspiracy.”)

    This chasteness on the part of enlightened opinion follows from the unspoken assumption of good faith on everybody’s part unless there is overwhelming and incontrovertible evidence to the contrary—and sometimes not even then. But a glance at American history shows that accusations of treason, and even the overt deed, have been inextricably bound up with our politics.

    Every school child has heard of Benedict Arnold, whose mischief imperiled the very birth of the republic. The founders were terrified of potential sympathy for monarchical Britain or revolutionary France, and Washington’s farewell address was a fervent admonition against “a passionate attachment of one nation for another,” which be believed “produces a variety of evils.”

    ……………………………………………

    But what about a persona as different from Trump as oatmeal from a Serrano pepper? Unlike the presumed novice Trump, Addison Mitchell McConnell Jr. has been a U.S. senator since 1985, and has served as the majority or minority leader since 2007. This means that for the last 10 years, McConnell has been briefed on the most sensitive national security issues, topics not accessible even to other senators; he is no tyro on national security matters.

    In October, we began hearing rumors that McConnell directly or indirectly threatened Obama that he would make it a partisan issue if the administration went public with the full extent of what it knew about Russian interference in the presidential election. A month after the election, the Washington Post published what should have been a bombshell, but was surprisingly disregarded at the time.

    In the the Post’s account, in September the administration sent James Comey, former Homeland Security Secretary Jeh Johnson, and Lisa Monaco, Obama’s counterterrorism and homeland security adviser, to Capitol Hill to brief congressional leadership plus the chairmen and ranking members of the two intelligence committees.

    “According to several officials, McConnell raised doubts about the underlying intelligence and made clear to the administration that he would consider any effort by the White House to challenge the Russians publicly an act of partisan politics.”

    Now, eight months since the election, the Post has published the fullest account to date on the Obama administration’s discovery of the Russian hacking and its early, fumbling attempts to respond. It reiterates the Republican role in pushing back against the revelation of Russian interference, and McConnell’s role in particular:

    The meeting devolved into a partisan squabble.

    “The Dems were, ‘Hey, we have to tell the public,’” recalled one participant. But Republicans resisted, arguing that to warn the public that the election was under attack would further Russia’s aim of sapping confidence in the system.

    Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) went further, officials said, voicing skepticism that the underlying intelligence truly supported the White House’s claims. Through a spokeswoman, McConnell declined to comment, citing the secrecy of that meeting.

    Key Democrats were stunned by the GOP response and exasperated that the White House seemed willing to let Republican opposition block any pre-election move.

    While it is frustrating that Obama seemed to handcuff himself into avoiding aggressive action, and that he even appeared to fall for Republicans’ “concern trolling” that going public with the allegations would somehow play into Putin’s hands, there is no question that the villain in this saga was McConnell.

  75. 75.

    Brachiator

    @frosty:

    This was my favorite song from Rumours

    I’ve been watching some Fleetwood Mac performances on YouTube. Some good work over the years, and I’ve come to appreciate Lindsey Buckingham’s guitar work more.

    One gem: Buckingham doing Tusk and Go Your Own Way after an interview at USC. The marching band puts in an appearance.

    Also interesting to see that Buckingham and Christine McVie have been collaborating on new music. During a BBC interview, McVie noted that she’s 72 now. The years have sped by.

  76. 76.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Chris: No, not necessarily. He seems to like going abroad when things in the playpen are getting a little to embarrassing.

    Yeah, but the French will protest against him just because there’s nothing else to protest against that day. At least I hope so.

    Then again, maybe he heard something about a grotesquely oversized palace, with a hall of mirrors. A beautiful, beautiful hall.

  77. 77.

    jl

    @Iowa Old Lady: Trump has said several times that single payer works very well in some European countries. I think he mentioned Sweden. So it could be done. Not the only way to do that trick, but one way. But not by the GOP.

    Edit: And Trump admitted Australia has better health care. Medicare for all! Make America Great Again!

  79. 79.

    rikyrah

    Governors Led the Revolt Against the GOP Health Care Bill
    by Martin Longman
    June 28, 2017 9:46 AM

    In the New York Times, reporter Alexander Burns does a nice job of detailing how a bipartisan group of governors, led by Republican John Kasich of Ohio and Democrat John Hickenlooper of Colorado, teamed up to kill (for now, at least) Mitch McConnell’s effort to pass a health care reform bill that would cripple Medicaid and leave tens of millions of Americans medically uninsured. The most significant thing I learned in reading the piece is that the governors hatched their plot way back in February, long before they had any way of knowing the details of what would be in the House or Senate versions of the bill or how the process would proceed.

    Mr. Hickenlooper said in an interview that he and Mr. Kasich had agreed to team up after a February meeting of the governors’ association in Washington, where state leaders heard an alarming presentation about the potential consequences of a federal pullback in health care.

    Within weeks, Mr. Hickenlooper said, both Mr. Kasich and Mr. Sandoval had sought his help in taking on their own party. Mr. Kasich, the Colorado governor recalled, expressed confidence that he could find other Republicans who would “take a pretty strong stand that coverage shouldn’t be rolled back.”

    A tentative game plan emerged: They would assemble a nimble, informal group of governors, from the right and left of center, who would publicly express concern about health care legislation drafted in the House and Senate. The governors would press for a slower, less disruptive and more public legislative process, and insist on protections for states that had greatly expanded their Medicaid rolls.

    Joining Mr. Kasich and Mr. Sandoval on the Republican side was Mr. [Charlie] Baker [of Massachusetts]. On the Democratic side, Mr. Hickenlooper recruited Steve Bullock of Montana, John Bel Edwards of Louisiana and Tom Wolf of Pennsylvania.

    Whatever was in that presentation must have been compelling, and it must have been easy even in February to read that Medicaid would be on the chopping block of any foreseeable bill. Therefore, before anything really happened in Congress, the governors already knew that they’d be able to criticize both the House and Senate versions of the bill, and to criticize the secretive and hasty process.

    What’s also interesting is that this bipartisan group of governors is united in thinking that the Democrats ought to be central to any reforms.

  81. 81.

    TenguPhule

    @Chris:

    On the other hand, apparently Trump is visiting France for Bastille Day – accepting Macron’s invitation.

    Any chances of a live reinactment?

  82. 82.

    rikyrah

    We Don’t Let Black Boys and Girls Be Children
    by Nancy LeTourneau
    June 28, 2017 12:29 PM

    In the Trump era, we’ve been reminded that outright hatred of African Americans still exists. White nationalists like Richard Spencer have been given a platform, and some even occupy high level positions in the White House.

    But we also can’t dismiss the way that racism infects the entire culture in a way that can affect all of us. The phrase “unconscious bias” is being used lately to describe that form of racism. Recent research explains one of the ways it is manifest.

    The report from Georgetown University law school’s Center on Poverty and Inequality, released Tuesday, found that black girls, particularly those age 5 to 14, are seen as more sexually mature and know more about adult topics than white girls in the same peer group. The result, authors Rebecca Epstein, Jamilia J. Blake and Thalia Gonzalez wrote, is that black girls experience “adultification,” and are not afforded the same childhood benefits as whites.

    “What we found is that adults see black girls as less innocent and less in need of protection as white girls of the same age,” Epstein, the center’s executive director, wrote in a statement…

    “Ultimately, adultification is a form of dehumanization, robbing black children of the very essence of what makes childhood distinct from all other developmental periods: innocence,” the authors wrote. “Adultification contributes to a false narrative that black youths’ transgressions are intentional and malicious, instead of the result of immature decision-making—a key characteristic of childhood.”

  84. 84.

    TenguPhule

    @Mike in DC:

    The best case scenario is that this drags out to the end of next month, and still fails. That throws a wrench intothe tax reform bill and the infrastructure bill timetables. We might get through Trump’s first year with zero legislative achievements.

    Hate to be a downer, but next month is also the deadline for the federal debt ceiling raise and must pass budget funding.

    Otherwise bad shit is going begin raining in August and this time its not going to end after 40 days and 40 nights.

  85. 85.

    swbarnes2

    @jl: What are the odds that Trump decides to be ‘unpredictable’ and veto whatever health bill Congress passes?

  86. 86.

    rikyrah

    Protesters are being arrested outside of Sen. Pat Toomey’s office as they chant “kill the bill, don’t kill me.”#ProtectOurCare pic.twitter.com/1dnUHORWbF
    — Caroline O. (@RVAwonk) June 28, 2017

  87. 87.

    rikyrah

    Texas made $350 million in Medicaid cuts, leaving special needs kids without speech, occupational & physical therapyhttps://t.co/XsMrHU6NuX
    — Bradd Jaffy (@BraddJaffy) June 28, 2017

  88. 88.

    Steeplejack (phone)

    @rikyrah:

    [. . .] a 53% majority say Congress should either leave the law known as Obamacare alone or work to fix its problems while keeping its framework intact.

    Dumb-fuck America finally realizes Obamacare is a good thing—but only right before it’s about to get blown to smithereens.

  89. 89.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    apparently this line is already jammed since this was posted a couple hours ago, but give it a shot anyway

    Heather & Jessica‏Verified account @ fuggirls
    FYI, the Senate Finance Office is tallying calls from people who want a public hearing of the healthcare bill: (202)224-4515. It’s v. easy.
    2:20 PM – 27 Jun 2017

    something for those folks with all blue representation to do, too

  90. 90.

    Betsy

    @jl: Just like the Republican criticism (back at the end of 2013 or whenever it was that the Exchanges were first set up) that the ACA was terrible because the website was so popular that it crashed all the time.

    ETA: Unfortunately, this “argument” or criticism finds some traction among the purity ponies who trash ACA because it didn’t go far enough.

  91. 91.

    jl

    @swbarnes2: Can you tell me who the last person in the room will be before he decides? My gut says chances have to be close to zero and also completely unpredictable. Seems like both can’t be true, but here we are.

  92. 92.

    Bex

    @Mnemosyne: OT, but late on a thread last night I asked you if you’ve read “You Were Never In Chicago” by Neil Steinberg, a Sun-Times columnist. I think you’d enjoy it.

  93. 93.

    LurkerNoLonger

    @rikyrah:

    Kellyanne Conway: Those on Medicaid who will lose health insurance can always get jobs

    Kellyanne Conway: Ugly on the outside and the inside.

  94. 94.

    germy

    In the Cole Porter lyric I quoted above, Miss Pinkham’s Tonic is mentioned.

    In Lydia Pinkham’s time and place the reputation of the medical profession was low. Medical fees were too expensive for most Americans to afford except in emergencies, in which case, the remedies were more likely to kill than cure. For example, a common “medicine”, calomel, was in fact not a medicine, but instead a deadly mercurial toxin, and this fact was even at the time sufficiently well known among the skeptical to be the subject of a popular comic song.

    In these circumstances, there is no mystery why many preferred to trust unlicensed “root and herb” practitioners, and especially to trust women who were prepared to share their domestic remedies, such as Lydia Pinkham.

    I predict some personal fortunes will be made by 21st century snake oil salesmen. Unaffordable medical care plus the evaporation of any regulatory governmental power.

  96. 96.

    Cheryl from Maryland

    @Marcopolo: He did this as well in 2014, went into the courthouse, yelled bad things about President Obama and then spit on the President’s photo. He’s nuts; I think since he was yelling “Freedom” that Mel Gibson’s Braveheart curdled his brain, that and RWNJ radio talk.

  97. 97.

    TenguPhule

    @LurkerNoLonger:

    Kellyanne Conway: Ugly on the outside and the inside.

    Her head is going to look much better on a spike then on her neck at this rate.

  98. 98.

    Librarian

    @germy: Professor Wagstaff: She isn’t? Well, she drinks like one! …Let me see… Is it “Sturgeon”?
    Baravelli: Aw, you-a craze. A “sturgeon”, he’s a doctor cuts you open when-a you sick. Now I give you one more chance.
    Wagstaff: I got it! “Haddock”
    Baravelli: ‘At’s a-funny, I got a “haddock” too.
    Wagstaff: What do you take for a “haddock”?
    Baravelli: Sometimes I take an aspirin, sometimes I take a calomel.
    Wagstaff: Say, I’d walk a mile for a calomel.
    Baravelli: You mean chocolate calomel? I like-a that too, but you no guess it.

  99. 99.

    trollhattan

    @LurkerNoLonger:
    Heard an interview this morning with the head of Providence Healthcare who did a wonderful job countering that “argument.” The guy would make a great national spokesman in this discussion. I did not realize half of all children born in the States are covered under Medicaid, and more than half of nursing home residents.

    “Get a job, MOOCHERS.”

  100. 100.

    Chris

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    Then again, maybe he heard something about a grotesquely oversized palace, with a hall of mirrors. A beautiful, beautiful hall.

    This is a controversial opinion among other French people, but I totally believe that if Donald Trump had been born 300 years earlier and French, the palace at Versailles is exactly the kind of thing he would’ve built. My. God. SO. MUCH. BLING. SO in-your-face. You come away thinking “not only do I see how the public decided to cut all these people’s heads off, but I can’t understand how it didn’t happen earlier.”

  101. 101.

    germy

    @Librarian:

    And when it came to STDs, many treatments involved the use of mercury, hence giving rise to the saying: ‘One night with Venus, a lifetime with Mercury’.

  102. 102.

    TenguPhule

    @Chris:

    You come away thinking “not only do I see how the public decided to cut all these people’s heads off, but I can’t understand how it didn’t happen earlier.”

    A fucking men.

  103. 103.

    trollhattan

    @Brachiator:

    Also interesting to see that Buckingham and Christine McVie have been collaborating on new music. During a BBC interview, McVie noted that she’s 72 now. The years have sped by.

    I can recall when she was merely Perfect.

  104. 104.

    jl

    @Chris: I read that aristocrats would have huge feasts of fabulous ornate food back then, with the hungry plebs behind barricades watching. After the aristocrats were full, they would leave the table, the barricade gates would open, and the big shots would laugh at the hungry masses scrambling and fighting over the leftovers. Louis XIV got the ceremony going, and became quite a thing in France.

    Might make for a good ad against GOP Senators up for re-election in 2018 and 2020.

  108. 108.

    Ian G.

    @Marcopolo:

    I want to start a GoFundMe page for this guy’s legal bills. Fuck these stupid fucking monuments. 5 of the Commandments are utterly worthless outside of a church. One is highly context-dependent (if Uday, Qusay, and Lolita had an ounce of humanity, they’d refuse to honor their father), and of the four that make sense, what society has ever condoned murder, theft, perjury, or adultery?

    Someone ask one of the Yahoos who support these monuments if they support the serial adulterer, perjurer, and thief in the White House.

  110. 110.

    ruckus

    @rikyrah:
    As you know, someone 65 or over who did not save /steal/grift a million for each year they planned to live in retirement do not deserve to live at all after they retire.
    /republican

  111. 111.

    jl

    @Ian G.:
    ” what society has ever condoned murder, theft, perjury, or adultery? ”

    Well.. um… that’s getting pretty close to home, ain’t it?

  112. 112.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Chris: This is a controversial opinion among other French people, but I totally believe that if Donald Trump had been born 300 years earlier and French, the palace at Versailles is exactly the kind of thing he would’ve built

    maybe, but it probably would’ve collapsed by now

  113. 113.

    germy

    @jl:

    the barricade gates would open, and the big shots would laugh at the hungry masses scrambling and fighting over the leftovers.

    Future generations will watch Black Friday footage of obese shoppers pushing their way into crap stores for Thanksgiving “deals” and feel the same sense of wonder.

  115. 115.

    Brachiator

    @jl:

    I heard a radio news spot with an interview of a woman who said she voted for Trump because she thought the Dems and GOPers would cut those programs and she was ‘hoping for a miracle’.

    The sad thing is that this woman bought into “both sides do it” BS, since the Democrats clearly were more interested in protecting these programs than were the Republicans. But yeah, Trump was playing on his outsider status to get people to believe that he was on their side.

    Senators who don’t think the repeated Trump promises will show up during the next few election cycles in ads against them are complete fools. Or think that Koch money will be buy enough ads to keep the lies going.

    They’re counting on that sweet Koch money and the ability of the GOP to hide under Trump’s “fake news” tropes.

    @Iowa Old Lady:

    How old are the people who believe crap like that? Do they also believe the Easter Bunny brings them free candy because they want it?

    Trump sold himself hard as the regular rich guy who was the only one who would do right by the American people. And obviously, enough people bought it.

    Sadly, people still want to be fooled. Trump talks a good game about being a master deal maker, but I don’t see any evidence that he was deeply involved in any discussions over health care reform. In fact, he seems to get distracted quickly, and bores easily. And like a little kid, he is desperately looking forward to the victory celebration after anything gets passed, anything that he can take credit for. Whether or not it accomplishes anything real is irrelevant.

  116. 116.

    TenguPhule

    @LurkerNoLonger:

    All employers are looking for the skills only an infant or a disabled senior citizen can bring to the workplace.

    Not all of them. Just the White House.

  117. 117.

    Mnemosyne

    @germy:

    It’s not the greatest biopic in the world, but Edward G. Robinson is pretty good in Dr. Erlich’s Magic Bullet as the guy who came up with the only pre-penicillin cure for syphilis.

    ETA: And, yes, a bit part of the debate in the movie and at the time was whether or not they were condoning immorality by curing a venereal disease. Obviously, Dr. Erlich came down on the side of curing patients.

  120. 120.

    germy

    @Mnemosyne: I’ve never seen it, but I bet the censors had a field day with it:

    “You’re not allowed to mention sex. You’re not allowed to mention V.D. Good luck!”

  122. 122.

    efgoldman

    Totally off topic
    Local police where my son in law was brought up called him a couple of hours ago: His mother (our daughter’s MIL) was found dead in her car this morning. No more details.
    They were estranged. She had, shall we say, bad character flaws. She never got to know her wonderful daughter in law or her incredible granddaughter.
    Only time we ever met her was at their wedding weekend in 2009. She was on her best behavior, but the problems were obvious.
    She wasn’t quite 60 yet, I don’t think.

  125. 125.

    Mnemosyne

    @germy:

    They show it on TCM quite a bit. Warner Bros was able to make an argument to the Breen office that it was one of their “social problem” pictures, so they got a couple of waivers.

  126. 126.

    The Moar You Know

    what society has ever condoned murder, theft, perjury, or adultery?

    @Ian G.: The people in charge of the region at the time: The Romans. You had to be in the right social class to get away with murder or theft, of course. The other two weren’t even considered crimes.

  127. 127.

    gene108

    @donnah:

    We need an silver bullet to blow the head off this monster.

    Silver is too soft a metal. Maybe a diamond tipped bullet?

  128. 128.

    Mnemosyne

    @efgoldman:

    Whoa. Your family is having a run of very bad luck right now. Condolences to your SIL and your daughter. His feelings are going to be very complicated, to say the least.

  129. 129.

    Tazj

    @trollhattan: Yes, the facts about Medicaid and healthcare have to explained over and over again. Too many people don’t understand what Medicaid is. They think that it’s just for MOOCHERS and that they or their family will never need it.

    @rikyrah: Republicans, the pro-life party of Lincoln.

  132. 132.

    efgoldman

    @Mnemosyne:

    His feelings are going to be very complicated, to say the least.

    He has had professional help, and we’ve always been there for him FWIW.
    But yes, “it’s complicated” is a huge understatement.
    BTW we never thought of her as “our family.”

  134. 134.

    Brachiator

    @Mnemosyne:

    And, yes, a bit part of the debate in the movie and at the time was whether or not they were condoning immorality by curing a venereal disease.

    Not much has changed. Look at the idiots who oppose sex education and contraception because they insist that it only encourages “the yoots” to want to have sex.

  135. 135.

    Patricia Kayden

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Chris Chinchilla

    Comedy gold. It’s these kinds of jokes that keep me reading BJ despite all the Republican-driven chaos. Now every time I see the increasingly odious and useless Cilliza, I will think of chinchillas and chuckle.

  140. 140.

    Laura

    @germy: The Attractions used to be a cover band called clover. They played my High School Dances in 1975 but then split up. All but the singer moved to London. The singer formed a new band called Huey Lewis and the News.
    My ex bil is Huey’s tour manager.
    Small world.

  141. 141.

    Brachiator

    @Iowa Old Lady:

    I keep having the feeling that even though Trump has power as president, there’s a hollow space at the top of the government and everyone else is learning to work around it.

    Oh, for sure. The GOP love/hates Trump. They are afraid of the illegal and goofy stuff he pulls, but realize that they need him to get their agenda passed. And they have figured him out. They love staging empty celebrations where he can grin like a fool and bask in the adulation of the GOP leadership. Even when he paused and called the health care bill “mean,” he quickly fell back into a near stupor interrupted by the occasional Twitter flash. At times he seems to be little more than a petulant, low attention span president. The GOP can’t believe their luck.

    Unfortunately, this leaves the rest of us to suffer.

  142. 142.

    germy

    @Laura: The Attractions were a British band. They replaced Clover as Costello’s backing band. Two different bands.

  143. 143.

    ruckus

    @Tazj:
    States have renamed Medicaid, to give them space from the federal program, either to disconnect them or because they thought people would take the federal program/state programs as being one and the same thing. But as the effect of Medicaid is dependent on what the state does with it, it did somewhat make sense. Right up till the ACA.

  144. 144.

    rikyrah

    Fox News host argues stripping coverage from millions is no biggie since “we’re all going to die” t.co/BqFFAn0T6Q pic.twitter.com/dsWhaeGClK
    — ThinkProgress (@thinkprogress) June 28, 2017

  146. 146.

    rikyrah

    Here is a new summary of the health bill the Senate is considering passing.
    RT if helpful. pic.twitter.com/EHlBf158AL
    — Andy Slavitt (@ASlavitt) June 27, 2017

  147. 147.

    germy

    @rikyrah:

    Fox News host argues stripping coverage from millions is no biggie since “we’re all going to die”

    They really are nihilists. Anti-life.

  148. 148.

    hedgehog the occasional commenter

    @rikyrah: Oh, good God. So is she giving up her health insurance in that case? /headdesk/

  149. 149.

    Gelfling 545

    @germy: I had an aunt who took the stuff to treat infertility. They advertised “a baby in every bottle “. I figure it was mostly alcohol.

  150. 150.

    jl

    @rikyrah: That’s a natural development of an argument they’ve been making at Fox News for a long time.
    The poor should be happy for getting anything at all from society, and they are ungrateful for what modern civilization has brought them. After all, they aren’t living in caves, eating bark, roots and berries, wondering when lightning will strike and where their next fire for heat will come from, are they?

  152. 152.

    TenguPhule

    @germy:

    They really are nihilists. Anti-life.

    Coming soon on FOX: “Concentration camps aren’t a problem, they’re a solution!”

  153. 153.

    NoraLenderbee

    I thought “Rumours” was a great album when I was 14. I listened to it a couple of years ago and . . . there was nothing there. It was as if the songs had all crumbled into dust.

  155. 155.

    The Moar You Know

    Fox News host argues stripping coverage from millions is no biggie since “we’re all going to die”

    @rikyrah: And the GOP segues without batting an eyelash into “life unworthy of life” and “useless eater” territory.

    I do Nazi a problem with this!

  159. 159.

    Mnemosyne

    @efgoldman:

    Yes, but your SIL is part of your family, and this is going to be very painful for him, so it is happening to your family.

    Reminds me of a conversation G and I had with my dad after G’s father died.

    My dad said, “Are you sad your father died?”

    G said, “Yes, I am. It’s kind of a relief because he was suffering, but I’m still sad.”

    My dad said, “Okay, I just wanted to make sure. I hated my father and I was happy when he died.”

    My dad was very big on letting people mourn the way they needed to. ?

  160. 160.

    Laura

    @efgoldman: Holy cow EFG! Do you suspect that it was at her own hand, or the realization that her son is likely to be convicted?

    You’ve had one hell of a time and I hope for the best for you.

  161. 161.

    Patricia Kayden

    @Ridnik Chrome: BJ commenters are so dang picky. I’d really love to hear what y’all think are great songs because that album is terrific imho. Dang liberal Yankee elitists!!

  164. 164.

    TenguPhule

    @rikyrah:

    Here is a new summary of the health bill the Senate is considering passing.

    That’s a bit longer then “Fuck off and die, losers!”

  166. 166.

    TenguPhule

    @Patricia Kayden:

    I’d really love to hear what y’all think are great songs because that album is terrific imho. Dang liberal Yankee elitists!!

    Country sucks. J-pop rules.

  167. 167.

    hedgehog the occasional commenter

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Got right through just now. Very pleasant staffer (“I’d be happy to mark you down!”) They just ask for your ZIP code. Let’s keep the nice lady busy, shall we?

  168. 168.

    germy

    @Mnemosyne:

    Warner Bros was able to make an argument to the Breen office that it was one of their “social problem” pictures, so they got a couple of waivers.

    I remember an old Marx brothers movie where Eve Arden steals a wallet and stuffs it down her bra.

    Groucho breaks the fourth wall to tell the audience “There must be some way to get that wallet without getting in trouble with the Breen office.”

    (paraphrased from memory)

  170. 170.

    Mnemosyne

    @germy:

    And IIRC Costello has basically re-formed the Attractions minus the one guy that he hates (and who hates him). I don’t remember the guy’s name, but Costello wrote a song about him called “How to Be Dumb.”

    Note to self: never piss off Elvis Costello to the point that he writes a song about me.

  172. 172.

    germy

    @Mnemosyne: They both wrote books, as well. Two wordsmiths dripping vitriol. (I haven’t read either memoir, just a few excerpts here and there)

  174. 174.

    jl

    @Iowa Old Lady:

    “Are there no workhouses? Are there no prisons?”

    Need to change that now. Scrooge was a commie. Need some taxpayer dollars for those

    “Are there graveyards?”

    Shorter, too.

  176. 176.

    Chris

    @rikyrah:

    Fox News host argues stripping coverage from millions is no biggie since “we’re all going to die”

    Remind me again what’s wrong with abortion, even if it does kill people?

  177. 177.

    IdahoFlaneuse

    @Seanly: I was at that protest for an hour or so. I had other plans for the day, but I couldn’t miss the opportunity to say “Not in MY name!”

  178. 178.

    patrick II

    I was just thinking about the people who gave up a job with insurance “knowing” that they could get Obamacare. Now, a few years later, maybe they have started a new business, or stayed home with the kids or whatever, they are learning that you can’t really trust the government for anything. A country doesn’t go from having a useful government into anarchy in one step, and the republicans have, even with this failure, have tore down the trust one needs for a functioning civilization one more degree.

  180. 180.

    eric

    @germy: same is true for tax cuts….we are gonna die, so what difference does a few extra bucks make. “No gonna die, No tax cuts!”

  181. 181.

    J R in WV

    @efgoldman:

    Oh, man, I’m sorry to hear that. No one should ever get that phone call. On top of other crazy shit your family is dealing with.

    Hang in there, it’s all you can do.

  182. 182.

    joel hanes

    @efgoldman:

    She had, shall we say, bad character flaws.

    Just want to point out the quiet tact in this statement.
    efg had an opportunitly to slag the woman, but had too much class to do so

    Condolences to efg’s SIL. Survivor guilt is a damnable thing;
    I hope he’s too wise to have much of it.

  183. 183.

    efgoldman

    @Laura:

    Do you suspect that it was at her own hand, or the realization that her son is likely to be convicted?

    We only know what I posted. mrs efg assumes carbon monoxide. I make no assumptions. She was in poor health, might have been a heart attack or a stroke, like that. But I know no trufacts.

  186. 186.

    Librarian

    @rikyrah: That’s not just any Fox host; that’s Kennedy, formerly of MTV, who’s famous for being a right wing moron.

  188. 188.

    J R in WV

    @rikyrah:

    We are all going to die, but some of us are in more of a hurry than others…

    The Republicans think everyone else should get on with it, leaving them with everything.

    But then, who would refine their fuel, plant their grain, mill their flour? NO one. When their bug-out survival supplies run out, they will join the rest of us in death. If we don’t take them with us.

  189. 189.

    TenguPhule

    @Chris:

    Remind me again what’s wrong with abortion, even if it does kill people?

    It lets women avoid pregnancy. And that offends men and women who hate sexy time.

  191. 191.

    TenguPhule

    @jl:

    Need to change that now. Scrooge was a commie. Need some taxpayer dollars for those

    “Are there graveyards?”

    Shorter, too.

    Soylent Green.

  192. 192.

    J R in WV

    @germy:

    We found a really old empty bottle of Lydia Pinkham’s stuff around the old house when we bought the farm. Mostly broken, every bottle bought since 1895 or so was still there. It was a little bit lavender from UV in the sunlight. We still have it on the windowsill above the kitchen sink.

  194. 194.

    Yutsano

    @TenguPhule:

    And that offends men and women who hate sexy time for others without consequences

    Abortion for me but not for thee. They have no problem sending Buffy to Mexico to take care of that little “problem” she didn’t really have.

  196. 196.

    Kathleen

    @rikyrah:

    This chasteness on the part of enlightened opinion follows from the unspoken assumption of good faith on everybody’s part unless there is overwhelming and incontrovertible evidence to the contrary—and sometimes not even then. But a glance at American history shows that accusations of treason, and even the overt deed, have been inextricably bound up with our politics.

    He neglected to mention that protocol applies only to Republicans.

  197. 197.

    Fair Economist

    @germy:

    In Lydia Pinkham’s time and place the reputation of the medical profession was low. Medical fees were too expensive for most Americans to afford except in emergencies, in which case, the remedies were more likely to kill than cure. For example, a common “medicine”, calomel, was in fact not a medicine, but instead a deadly mercurial toxin, and this fact was even at the time sufficiently well known among the skeptical to be the subject of a popular comic song.

    That was actually not totally nuts, as toxic heavy metals are sometimes more toxic to chronic parasites than they are to people. It wasn’t that people didn’t know these treatments were toxic, it was more that they were willing to risk that for a chance of curing or controlling a lethal, otherwise untreatable disease. With the arsenic cure, this was actually developed to a science where they really did have a good chance of a cure with a low chance of killing the patient, although patients were still really sick for months or even years. And, yes, there was a little mercury in one of the versions of the arsenic cure they eventually ended up settling on.

    Now that antibiotics are starting to fail we may be using things like that again soon.

  198. 198.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @ruemara: she’s been playing that schtick long enough for latter-day Murphy Brown to have a character based on her, a conservative Gen-Xer named “McGovern”, cause Murphy Brown was clever that way. I think she’s been drifting in and out of the Fox stable since then, kind of like a lower-profile Tucker Carlson

  199. 199.

    Kathleen

    @efgoldman: My condolences to your family. I’m sure this will be a tough time for your daughter and son in law. Blessings to them. You and Mrs. EF have had to deal with so much these past few years. Blessings to you both as well.

  201. 201.

    Kathleen

    @jl: Years ago I heard either a guest or one of their regulars refer to the poor as “parasites”. (I was at the Y – which was the only time I subjected myself to Fox).

  202. 202.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Major Major Major Major: @Kathleen: I think it’s Tbogg has a tweet up that CNN is going to re-build their “brand” around Chris Cillizza. I thought it was pathetic and bizarre when I saw that Andy Lack planned to do the same with Brian Williams. In world (theirs) where grown-ass adults talk about the number of “Pinnochios” and degrees of “pants on fire”, I guess it makes sense.

  203. 203.

    Patricia Kayden

    @rikyrah: Wowzers! That anyone would open their mouths and say something like that is astonishing even for Rightwingers.

    Some good news from your link though:

    An NPR/PBS NewsHour/Marist poll released Wednesday finds that the Senate bill is just as unpopular as the House version, with an approval rating of 17 percent.

  204. 204.

    Chris

    @TenguPhule:

    It lets women avoid pregnancy. And that offends men and women who hate sexy time.

    THAT IS ABSOLUTELY CORRECT! We’ve got a winner!

  206. 206.

    ruckus

    @Fair Economist:
    People who really need a strong blood thinner sometimes get prescribed Warfarin. Which is a rat poison. Being taken off it all at once was what killed my friend.

  207. 207.

    StringOnAStick

    @patrick II: My husband almost did exactly that; he was planning on becoming a contractor for his company and cutting back to 3 days a week, then he got diagnosed with a chronic form of leukemia. If the ACA is still in place, then we can afford insurance for us; if not, then we are looking at 5 figures for each of us, who at age 59 obviously have a pre-existing condition or two. I can’t get insurance through my job since I would have to be 32 hours/week and there aren’t enough dental chairs or demand for me to be there full-time, plus I have some carpal tunnel syndrome issues like pretty much very older RDH and working 32 hours a week isn’t doable anymore. If he had made this decision and quit last year before his diagnosis it would have been a bad, bad thing. We both have a decade or so of being treated for orthopedic issues, obviously those are all now pre-existing conditions that no one will insure us for either on top of his leukemia if this ACHA/BCRA crap pile passes.

    We have a friend who nursed the family engineering business through the 2008 collapse for as long as he could before closing the firm so it wouldn’t bankrupt him personally. He made the comment that the way the US runs health insurance makes it basically crazy for anyone to start a company since one personal health care disaster when you can’t afford insurance and your firm and you are bankrupt. Why risk starting a small business when health insurance is as unstable as it is right now thanks to the rethugs? How about the growth of the gig economy, how are those people supposed to afford insurance? This thing they are trying to pass may lead to such a loss in business and consumer confidence that a recession starts before they even get the arm twisting done, just because of all the uncertainty the process is creating. The economic expansion is already long in the tooth and the last two months of durable goods orders have been bad, so a recession may already be afoot; this created chaos over the entire health care and health insurance system is just the sort of thing that can get the recession ball rolling.

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