Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

‘Museums aren’t America’s attic for its racist shit.’

The jury literally has a bell they can ring to force Trump to show up on command. Greatest thing ever!

When do we start airlifting the women and children out of Texas?

I really should read my own blog.

FFS people, this was a good thing. take the win.

if you can’t see it, then you are useless in the fight to stop it.

“woke” is the new caravan.

The rest of the comments were smacking Boebert like she was a piñata.

This year has been the longest three days of putin’s life.

And now I have baud making fun of me. this day can’t get worse.

Accused of treason; bitches about the ratings. I am in awe.

They’re not red states to be hated; they are voter suppression states to be fixed.

Boeing: repeatedly making the case for high speed rail.

I might just take the rest of the day off and do even more nothing than usual.

Is it negotiation when the other party actually wants to shoot the hostage?

Seems like a complicated subject, have you tried yelling at it?

I’d try pessimism, but it probably wouldn’t work.

Damn right I heard that as a threat.

There are more Russians standing up to Putin than Republicans.

I’m sure you banged some questionable people yourself. We’re allowed to grow past that.

You don’t get to peddle hatred on saturday and offer condolences on sunday.

We need to vote them all out and restore sane Democratic government.

“I never thought they’d lock HIM up,” sobbed a distraught member of the Lock Her Up Party.

Speaking of republicans, is there a way for a political party to declare intellectual bankruptcy?

You are here: Home / Anderson On Health Insurance / Work requirements and pandemics

Work requirements and pandemics

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Healthy working age adults who are not clinically trained have a critical public health role to play in the COVID-19 pandemic.

Our mission is to create massive externalities that can be used to break infection chains. We do this by social distancing. Many universities and colleges are closing or severely limiting operations in order to minimize immediate disease spread. Non-critical, non-clinical personnel are being sent home. I’m working from home for the foreseeable future. I’m lucky, 98% of my work can be done almost anywhere in normal times and since no one else is in the office, I am not needed to move heavy things under the direction of people who are half my body mass.

Staying home and socially distancing is unlikely to produce readily internalizable mortality gains for myself or my immediate family. We’re very low risk. Instead, we are trying to break the infection chains that could lead up to a 73 year old cancer survivor getting or not getting infected. We don’t know who that person that we protect from our actions. But that is the job of healthy, working age adults right now.

And that is a damn difficult job to do if critical aspects of one’s life is dependent on public policy work requirements.

Those 700,000 folks will be facing a decision to go to work to eat OR engage in social distancing that gneerates highly needed externalities.

A lot of people will go to work as food is an immediate need while acting in a way that may or may not save someone’s faceless grandparent is much further along the hierarchy of needs.

The same logic applies to work requirements in TANF and Medicaid.

We as a society need to make it really easy for people to generate highly valuable externalities in a public health crisis.

Right now, we’re not.

Reader Interactions

54Comments

  1. 1.

    PenAndKey

    “Right now, we’re not.”

    It’s worse than that. Right now, we’re not and we have an entire political party that, as shown by the sick leave vote, is actively opposed to any attempts to change that.

  3. 3.

    MattF

    There are lots of things we should have at least started to do six to eight weeks ago, like making and distributing test kits. But actually knowing the numbers and rates of infection isn’t going to happen.

  4. 4.

    Soprano2

    I work for the sewer department.  Most of our workers can’t do their work from home, and we can’t stop servicing the sewers.  I guess the best we can do is practice good hygiene. I’m lucky, I have an office by the back door so I stay isolated from most people most of the day, but I still share common spaces.  I have a co-worker who was sick as a dog 3 weeks ago with “some kind of virus”, but of course she wasn’t tested.  No cases have been detected in my city yet, but I know it’s only a matter of time. We had a safety meeting on Tuesday, and it was about severe weather safety.  I think he missed a real opportunity to educate everyone in a factual matter, since I’m sure a significant number of my co-workers either watch Fox News or don’t listen to the news much at all.  One benefit is that since we work with the sewer, we do have a heightened awareness of the need for good hygiene practices.

  5. 5.

    The Dangerman

    Healthy working age adults who are not clinically trained have critical public health role to play.

    I was pondering a thought yesterday; only 6a local, so let’s see if I can type it out on limited coffee.

    Hospitals are about to get swamped. For whatever reason (and it’s always kinda pissed me off), hospitals function with a LOT of volunteers. I don’t know the numbers and don’t know why they don’t just hire folks other than, hell, if someone wants to work for free, why hire someone?

    OK, thought continues. Those volunteers are typically of a demographic you don’t want near a hospital right now. Especially those with underlying conditions, obviously.

    I guess what I’m saying is the “system” that has been used for years (decades, forever) can’t handle a crisis like this.

    OK, decision time for me. Coffee or back to bed. Hmmmm. Back to bed, I think.

    Final thought: Today’s college kids have no memory of 9/11 and wonder what it felt like; this is what it felt like. There is “incoming”, people are being hurt/killed, and no one knows what’s coming next. And Trump is in charge (good grief).

  7. 7.

    joel hanes

    The deliberate cruelty and malevolence of Republican policies are about to kill a lot of Republicans along with their intended targets.   Bycatch, if you will.

    Republicans will not care.

    Davis X. Machina laid it out for us over a decade ago:

    The salient fact of American politics is that there are fifty to seventy million voters each of whom will volunteer to live, with his family, in a cardboard box under an overpass, and cook sparrows on an old curtain rod, if someone would only guarantee that the black, gay, Hispanic, liberal, whatever, in the next box over doesn’t even have a curtain rod, or a sparrow to put on it.

  8. 8.

    NotMax

    All in favor of Republicans taking up distancing.

    The surface of Pluto ought to be about right.

  9. 9.

    MomSense

    @burnspbesq:

    What infuriates me is that it is all so predictable.  Every damned time we have a Republican administration they sabotage our government, kill the economy, and sacrifice the most vulnerable human beings because they cannot let go of their adolescent going Galt fantasies.

    They need to grow up.  This is no way to run a superpower.

  10. 10.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @NotMax: Wasn’t demoting Pluto good enough for you?  Now you want to populate in with the GOP?  What did Pluto ever do to you?  Christ!

  11. 11.

    Betty Cracker

    One thing I’ve been watching in the C-19 coverage is the disparate approach of state and local governments. We’re effectively leaderless at the executive level. Reality-based states and municipalities are taking aggressive actions to “bend the curve” of the spread so their healthcare infrastructure isn’t overwhelmed.

    Then you have red state yahoos like Gov. DeSantis here in FL, who was arguing with Dr. Fauci about whether or not community spread is happening in the state and failing to take actions like shutting down gatherings because that would disrupt the tourism industry and other businesses.

    I salute the reality-based states/cities for their proactive approach. But I’m wondering if their efforts will be undermined, similar to the way local gun control initiatives are undermined, by their feckless red state counterparts. We’ll see, I guess.

  14. 14.

    gene108

    @Betty Cracker:

    Cancelling all large gatherings / events would be great, as long as it is combined w/ a bailout for employees impacted & businesses impacted.

     

    As it is, events are going on because the event organizers can’t afford to cancel, because of various contracted cancellation fees with hotels, food service providers, etc., along with the loss of income from not having the event.

    If the government canceled events, they could probably get out of cancellation fees, and then scramble to stay afloat until they get a chance to organize their events again.

    The economy is going to to take a hit, which well thought out legislation should hopefully be able to minimize.

    But that’s a fantasy world we don’t live in.

  15. 15.

    Skepticat

    An introvert anyway, I work remotely and live on a tiny desert island, so my personal situation is excellent (apart from having a pile of rubble rather than a home, that is). However, a number of friends are arriving from Florida today to work on the damage to their houses (there’s a 67-foot-long sailboat under one couple’s deck). I’ve gotten them supplies of fuel and ice, and I’ll pick them up at the ferry and get them to their places, but there isn’t going to be any hugging, and I’ll be scrubbing my hands til they’re raw. I need to develop new habits, and I’m not skilled at that (unless they’re bad habits, of course). I barely can imagine what it’s like for people in crowded areas.

  17. 17.

    Citizen Alan

    A lot of Republican economic policies become understandable when you realize that they don’t even believe that “externalities” is a real word.

  21. 21.

    Patricia Kayden

    “If you have people exposed to lots of other people, who are also unable to access their health care and yet feel pressure to be at work, that is literally a toxic combination,” says Rachel Sulkes, communications director for Unite Here Local 11.— Douglas Rivlin ?? (@douglasrivlin) March 12, 2020

  22. 22.

    WereBear

    The only bright spot I can think of is that the virus didn’t START here. I can only imagine where we’d be in such a case, but it’s mini-series worthy.

  23. 23.

    Chris Johnson

    @Baud: Why would it? They know what they did. The ‘markets’ have been profiting off disaster capitalism and the ruin of ordinary people for decades. Now, we have a pandemic that can destroy all manner of revenue streams, and the only thing that can stop it is… well cared for and well educated ordinary people.

    ‘the market’ should heed the call of the famous sign, ‘JUMP, you fuckers!’ because in a realistic sense it caused this and it is not going to get out of this one.

  24. 24.

    Aimai

    Im a clinical therapist at an outpatient clinic for people with psychotic disorders. My building houses three homeless shelters which we serve but don’t control. This is a clusterfuck of mammoth proportions and management is not doing a good enough job of protecting staff and patients. I’m unilaterally going out on leave today, calling and cancelling 30 patients that I see on a regular basis. I may not be paid. Don’t really know. Can’t work from home either because most of our patients don’t have access to higher tech and insurance won’t cover it. My husband can work from home. My daughter comes back from Smith on sat (I drive to get her) and my other daughter’s girlfriend is moving in now that Harvard is closing its grad student dorms. But that daughter is living/worjing in DC so we get the girlfriend without the daughter. I’m overwhelmed and frustrated.

  25. 25.

    Betty Cracker

    @WereBear: Yeah, we were saying last night this isn’t a bad place to ride out a pandemic. We’ve got canned goods, a well, a fresh water spring nearby, a vegetable garden, plentiful fishing and lots of social distance. Kiddo’s college put all classes online as of yesterday, and if things really go to shit in the city, she’ll come stay with us.

  28. 28.

    The Dangerman

    OK, more sleep isn’t happening, might as well brew the strong stuff and get going.

    I’m sure fucking glad that Trump calmed the markets last night. Asshole.

  29. 29.

    joel hanes

    @Baud:

    Unfortunately, Biden could say that this is a national emergency, which it absolutely is, but that statement would not have the same legal effect as if Trump declared it.

    Which he hasn’t.

    I wonder if he ever will, or if his defiance disorder will prevent him from *ever* doing so.

  31. 31.

    oldster

    Dow opening down 8.5%. Holy moly that’s a drop.

    It’s a reaction to last night’s drugged-up, mumbling incoherent speech in which Trump offered nothing and got the details wrong.

  32. 32.

    PenAndKey

    @joel hanes: Like a stubborn child Trump won’t declare a national emergency until he’s forced to. He has committed himself to the idea that it’s not one, despite the fact that apparently it’s severe enough that he unilaterially, and without notice, banned travel from the EU over it (I’m still floored he has the power to do that, btw).

    Biden may not have any actual power here, but by setting the right tone and making the right moves he will provide a clear alternative. It’s little short term consolation, but if Biden can show himself to be the leader capable of handing this that will have a calming influence on both society and the markets. Will it be enough to make a difference? Maybe, maybe not, but one thing it will certainly do is drive Trump even further from responding accordingly. When challenged he’s never made the right choice, and I don’t expect him to now, especially if he thinks Biden is making him “look bad”.

    @oldster:

    My parents are in the process of withdrawing funds from their 401k to handle an unexpected major medical bill. I just found out last night that Wells Fargo is doing the transfer today. That’s…. swell.

  34. 34.

    chopper

    We’re very low risk. Instead, we are trying to break the infection chains that could lead up to a 73 year old cancer survivor getting or not getting infected.

    right. i’m not worried about myself, wife and kids (tho getting sick with this would suck for a few weeks), i’m worried about my 70 year-old neighbor getting sick with it.

  35. 35.

    Jinchi

    @Gin & Tonic: Dow down 1600. The market is speaking.

    Wow. That’s 7000 points down over the last few weeks. Trump has almost erased all the gains since he took office.

  36. 36.

    chopper

    @Aimai:

    my wife is a clinical therapist/trainer for CBTp for psychotic disorders and hoo boy, it’s a mess here as well.

  42. 42.

    satby

    @Aimai: I’m going out on a “vacation” for the next two weeks from the market after Saturday, which I may extend if I need to. People aren’t taking this seriously, or have a faux religious “if God wants me he’ll take me” view around here. One confirmed case in this county, which means there’s certainly many more.

  45. 45.

    Barbara

    @Betty Cracker:

    Then you have red state yahoos like Gov. DeSantis here in FL, who was arguing with Dr. Fauci about whether or not community spread is happening in the state and failing to take actions like shutting down gatherings because that would disrupt the tourism industry and other businesses.

    Cutting off European travel to the U.S. is going to disrupt tourism in Florida by quite a bit I would imagine.  Here, in the Nation’s Capital, we are heading into peak spring season (“Cherry Blossom Time”).  I was seeing loads of buses earlier this week and last week, but it seems to be slowing down.  I am going to look around today and tomorrow to see what’s going on, because I suspect that many tours are being canceled.  People’s willingness to countenance the risk of harm changes sharply when it switches from being an abstract to an entirely realistic possibility.

  46. 46.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @Gin & Tonic:

    Dow down 1600. The market is speaking.

    I think Trump will reverse the travel ban because it’s damaging the metrics he uses to determine how great he is.  I’m not 100% sure like I was with the cargo ban, though.  That one would also have his rich buddies yelling at him.  He may be able to avoid directly facing anyone’s anger over this, so his cowardice might not kick in, and it does fit with his asshole trade war delusion.  That and white supremacy seem to be the only two political beliefs he cares about.

  47. 47.

    ArchTeryx

    @joel hanes: That no longer factors.  It’s now literally “dying of whiteness.”  They intend to take their bigotry straight into the grave with themselves and their families.

    The problem is all the other innocents they are going to take with them, cheering and wearing their Fuck Your Feelings T-shirts straight to the gates of Hell.

  48. 48.

    satby

    @WereBear: Fortunately, I can maintain enough social distance there, and I have people I promised product to. But the refusal of so many here to face facts doesn’t bode well for the future. And business is down by quite a bit, but they won’t close.

    And my allergies have been kicking up and making me slightly paranoid. I have to go but a thermometer after I leave here, because I don’t know where mine went.

  49. 49.

    gvg

    A bunch of spring Festivals are still scheduled here in Florida.  The weather is gorgeous and I love those festivals. I won’t be going.  I imagine I am not the only one. The vendors tend to be in the at risk age group so not sure how they will react because I am sure they need income.  What I think though is some of the events that continue are going to be empty and lose money, then the rest will face up and cancel.

    UF changed to online in effect by next monday which is good, but looking around town and campus, I think we should have also explained to these youngsters that this means they should hole up somewhere not roam around with their friends. Explain that they can be carriers and get relatives killed etc.

    Gator Nationals drag racing starts today and they are claiming no change except more hand sanitizer.  Not happy about that.

  51. 51.

    Baud

    @satby: I have allergy symptoms too.  Gone today.  I read that about 80% of people with Covid-19 are basically asymptomatic.

  52. 52.

    MattF

    @satby: Yeah, I got it in an email from my BIL, who is normally smart but has various health issues. And his daughter-in-law is an Assistant Commissioner in the NYC health care system, specializing in epidemiology. Fear makes people stupid.

  53. 53.

    artem1s

    We don’t know who that person that we protect from our actions. But that is the job of healthy, working age adults right now.

    I’m trying to get this very fact thru the thick heads of the bean counters who decided that they only need to worry about the student and faculty getting sick and their containment efforts stopped at setting up remote classrooms.  They have decided we should continue to come to work; even those of us who could easily work from home.  All because they want to maintain their illusion of control and decision making power.  They’ve wrapped their decision up in a veneer of ‘fairness’ because there are staffers who have to physically come to work.   Never mind that everyone one of us who comes onto campus increases the risk factor exponentially. As long as we all are equally at risk of catching it then that’s “fairer” than lowering all our risk, but not necessarily equally?  It’s stupid and idiotic.

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