Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Too often we confuse noise with substance. too often we confuse setbacks with defeat.

Dear media: perhaps we ought to let Donald Trump speak for himself!

Republicans choose power over democracy, every day.

The lights are all blinking red.

No one could have predicted…

Come on, media. you have one job. start doing it.

They love authoritarianism, but only when they get to be the authoritarians.

It’s all just conspiracy shit beamed down from the mothership.

I’d hate to be the candidate who lost to this guy.

Pessimism assures that nothing of any importance will change.

The real work of an opposition party is to hold the people in power accountable.

How any woman could possibly vote for this smug smarmy piece of misogynistic crap is beyond understanding.

Celebrate the fucking wins.

The fight for our country is always worth it. ~Kamala Harris

The next time the wall street journal editorial board speaks the truth will be the first.

Jesus watching the most hateful people claiming to be his followers

“Loving your country does not mean lying about its history.”

Sometimes the world just tells you your cat is here.

If you still can’t see these things even now, maybe politics isn’t your forte and you should stop writing about it.

GOP baffled that ‘we don’t care if you die’ is not a winning slogan.

There is no right way to do the wrong thing.

With all due respect and assumptions of good faith, please fuck off into the sun.

In my day, never was longer.

Dear elected officials: Trump is temporary, dishonor is forever.

You are here: Home / Elections / Biden-Harris 2020 / Open Thread: I’m Voting For This Man

Reader Interactions

240Comments

  2. 2.

    Baud

    I want Biden’s first medal of freedom to go to Hillary.  Cleanse the medal of the tarnish Trump has put on it and piss off all the right people.

  4. 4.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    On the one hand, I sometimes envy those countries where politicians’ spouses are barely public figures, on the other, can you imagine The Beast and The Courtesan Top Model sitting on the couch reminiscing about…. anything?

    The ad ticks all the boxes, doesn’t it? Joe and Jill, Obama and the Bromance, our dear friend Michelle, ol’ wily Joe even slips in “my cousin from Ireland”, in a reach for people like my cousins who have never been to Ireland and probably won’t go– the most Irish thing about them is probably their quest for heat on vacations– but fly the flag and have Irish-themed email addresses and tattoos.

  5. 5.

    Calouste

    I doubt we’ll hear the truth until they really can no longer hide it. Which will be shortly before the shitgibbon makes a horizontal exit from the hospital. If he recovers, we’ll never know what really happened.

  9. 9.

    Lord Fartdaddy (Formerly, Mumphrey, Smedley Darlington Mingobat, et al.)

    I love the guy. Yeah, he’s made a lot of mistakes, but he’s a decent guy who really gives a shit about people.

    I thought when I watched that clip, and he bent down and kissed Jill Biden, that here’s a guy who loves his family, and never cheated on his wife. Remembers his friends. Really cares about the welfare of other people, even if he gets things wrong sometimes.

    What a huge difference it’ll make to our country to have somebody like that in the presidency.

  10. 10.

    O. Felix Culpa

    Watching the video made me cry: the humility, decency, goodness, and loving humor on display. Made me cry a little more thinking about how novel those qualities feel after the last four years.

  11. 11.

    Wyatt Salamanca

    Let the lying begin and Fuck Trump.  I can’t wait for this gutless bastard to lose in November,

  12. 12.

    Immanentize

    @O. Felix Culpa: I totally recognize the jaw set Biden has up there on the stage with Obama.  It’s the facial freeze of a man moved to tears, but holding them back.

    It’s dusty here at my house!  Gotta quit cutting so many onions….

  14. 14.

    trollhattan

    @Baud:

    A damn fine idea. She has worked to improve and protect the country since graduating and has never ceased to give us her best. Which we don’t deserve but that never stopped her.

    And it would trigger all the right folks.

  18. 18.

    kindness

    If Trump were to die, Republican leadership would try to reanimate his corpse.  Zombie Trump.

  21. 21.

    brantl

    It’s pretty close to impossible to see Obama and Biden get together, and not see how genuinely they like and trust and befriended each other. Even the ‘thugs have this seep up one them, even when they try to belittle it, they envy it. Then you look at Stump and Dense, and think, “I bet that those two don’t even talk to each other, except when they have to….”.

  22. 22.

    PPCLI

    It’s amazing how lazy the Trump operation is. They release two photos.

    i) One of Trump at a conference table with no jacket, wood paneling behind him, signing a blank sheet of paper. Briefcase, telephones etc. across the table. Folders in front of him.

    ii) The second photo at a smaller table in a different room. White wall cabinets, potus flag and American flag behind him. Wearing jacket. Different stuff on table. Signing what appears to be another blank sheet of paper.

    The second photo was taken 10 minutes after the first.

  23. 23.

    Mike in NC

    Headline in local paper dated October 4: “Trump team tries to salvage campaign”. That cannot be an assuring message to send to the MAGA crowd. Sounds like it’s time for another boat parade!

  24. 24.

    J R in WV

    @Baud:

    I want Biden’s first medal of freedom to go to Hillary.  Cleanse the medal of the tarnish Trump has put on it and piss off all the right people.

    And one for Barack Obama, who really risked his life every day.

    ETa: I also found the video pretty emotional. We don’t have that level of leadership right now, but we can, maybe.

  26. 26.

    Immanentize

    @PPCLI: The second photo is pretty clearly a photoshop.  The image “reflected” is actually just the same image mirrored.  Which is why that weird “reflection” is happening on the table in the foreground in front of the folder.  It would be the mirrored part of his left hand (cuff and all) but the folder is clearly, at minimum, an addition.

  28. 28.

    Wyatt Salamanca

    Did anyone have the patience to watch the shitshow press conference from Trump’s medical team?

    I stepped outside for a few minutes after it began and by the time I returned it was over. I guess there’s only so much bullshit these doctors can shovel.

  30. 30.

    zhena gogolia

    @brantl:

    The neighbors across the street put up a Trump 2020 sign yesterday. Pence’s name isn’t even on it. For some reason that pisses me off even more than “Make America Great Again.”

  31. 31.

    Immanentize

    @CliosFanBoy: 
    I am actually on favor of retiring that particular medal entirely. Too sullied. Too much now a cheap political prop. Congress can create something wholly new — like the “Presidential Medal of Service and Sacrifice.”

  35. 35.

    trnc

    The medical chapter of the Liar’s Club was on. All great if you ignore –

    • “Expected” damage to the lungs, but nothing of “clinical” concern. Which sounds like a dodge of multiple other concerns
    • I didn’t catch the exact question about the happy talk, but Conley’s answer was “I’m just trying to reflect the upbeat attitude of the team.” I expect that to be the number one quote on twitter today.
  37. 37.

    trnc

    @sdhays: Apparently, President Dump “may” be discharged as early as tomorrow.

    “Or we could have President Pence. I mean, who knows?” (Looks at beeper) “Gotta go.”

  39. 39.

    danielx

    Joe Biden is a decent man. That perception alone is enough to earn my vote although I think Joe has a lot more steel in him than Jimmy Carter, who also was (and is) a decent man.

    As was the case twelve years ago with Obama after eight years of Dubya, at this point all I want is competence and honesty. I think we can have both with Biden.

  40. 40.

    MomSense

    The idiots who are showing their support for tRump outside Walter Reed are playing Born In the USA.  WTF?  Would they understand the explanation of what that song is about? I hate how fucking stupid MAGAts are.

  42. 42.

    germy

    The President is going to show us how easy it is to beat this disease and all you need is a private helicopter, 12 of the best doctors in the world, and every single drug available at a moment's notice.

    — Adam Burke (@atpburke) October 3, 2020

  44. 44.

    MisterForkbeard

    @MomSense: They’re proud of it. Being ostentatiously wrong is part of the deal to them. I don’t know if you’ve ever seen it online, but the worst and and stupidest trolls do the “Ha ha, I tricked you into thinking I’m stupid” thing.

  46. 46.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @PPCLI:

    What person EVER has worn cuff links as a hospital patient? Okay, I can see casual shirt and slacks in place of the normal hospital gown if you feel up to it and the doctors are okay with it — but cuff links? REALLY?

    There’s not a single norm, no matter how trivial, that Trump hasn’t made less normal.

  60. 60.

    MagdaInBlack

    It seems to me that if he were doing so well, there would be a storm of tweets about the lyin’ press and thanking his Maga prayer circle etc.

    Just seems odd. Or have I somehow missed those ?

    Eta: Joe was not my first choice ( Kamala ) but I sure warmed up to him quick. He’s warm, human, decent and smart.

  62. 62.

    Salty Sam

    @O. Felix Culpa: Made me cry a little more thinking about how novel those qualities feel after the last four years

    So far, almost every clip I watch of Joe makes me choke up.  We have been living under the roof of a malignant abuser for 4 yrs, and seeing common decency is such a relief!

  67. 67.

    Salty Sam

    @rikyrah: what does that mean – health wise?

    Dexamethasone is a powerful corticosteroid- used to reduce serious inflammation.

    ETA: not a good sign…

  69. 69.

    sdhays

    I’ll just note that the Very White House has very capable medical facilities and staff in house, so whenever Dump is discharged, it will be with the knowledge that he’ll be able to receive a standard of care which would not be available to your average person.

  70. 70.

    Calouste

    @rikyrah: Not an expert in any way, but it seems that the recommendations are that that drug only gets prescribed to patients with severe Covid and/or in need of supplemental oxygen. So, a bad indicator.

  72. 72.

    Scout211

    @rikyrah:

     

    https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2020/09/studies-who-back-steroid-use-very-ill-covid-19-patients
    Updated corticosteroid guidance
    As a result of these studies, today the WHO updated its guidance for healthcare professionals and decision-makers on the use of corticosteroids in COVID-19 patients, according to a WHO press release. The organization recommends the use of systemic corticosteroids for treating patients who have severe or critical coronavirus illness but not for those with non-serious disease.

  73. 73.

    Bex

    @Scout211: Dr. Emanuel on MSNBC said that drug and whatever else he’s taking will knock out a fever, so it can be claimed, as  the spox Dr. did, that Trump has no fever.

  74. 74.

    Hungry Joe

    This situation in particular, and the Trump administration in general, can be summed up by William Goldman’s line about the inner workings of Hollywood: “Nobody knows anything.”

  76. 76.

    Ken

    @Calouste: @Scout211: Is there maybe a footnote to those recommendations that the drug is only to be used for severe or critical cases?  “Or if the patient is especially whiny”, perhaps?

  77. 77.

    Jay C

    @danielx:

    at this point all I want is competence and honesty. I think we can have both with Biden.

    And CREDIBILITY!  This ludicrous circus over Trump’s COVID illness is so sadly typical of everything this disgrace of an Administration has done since January, 2017: Despite (or worse, because of) all their efforts to “reassure” the public over the President’s health, we actually have no f—–g idea what is going on, and no reason to believe ANYTHING that is put out by “official” sources.

    What a change it will be (though I’m sure our “Mainstream Media” will be disappointed) to have a President who does not have to be reflexively “fact-checked” over virtually everything he says.

  78. 78.

    Tazj

    @zhena gogolia: A couple of people in my neighborhood had those Trump signs. The ones that are white with Trump’s name and 2020 in red and no Pence on it. They were way down the street so I just drive by them, but now I think someone has stolen them.

    Both houses still have their large Trump/Pence 2020 signs still up, and one has an additional flag with Trump riding on a tank. One had a big banner in 2012 saying “The government didn’t build this, I did.”

    It doesn’t mean much, and I’m in New York anyway but I’m seeing fewer Trump signs this election year. In 2016 people for Trump left their lawn signs up months after the election and I was tempted to snatch them on my evening walk.

  80. 80.

    cain

    @Mike in NC:

    MAGA people have been doing road parades down highways. Yesterday, saw a bunch of em traveling down I-5 in trucks with massive multiple flags. It seems that’s happening in other parts of the country.

    A house a few minutes walk from me had a gigantic wooden cross and a Trump flag. I was thinking poor neighbor – who seemed to be hispanic – and lo and behold just a few days ago – the neighbor also had a maga flag. Daaaang.

    My house is surrounded by democrats – our HOA doesn’t allow political signs, but the HOA next to me has em and I’ve seen a few joe biden campaign lawn signs. The folks in my HOA have been putting “Black Lives Matter” signs instead.

  81. 81.

    Ken

    @Hungry Joe: It’s possible they’re playing out the “cat on the roof and won’t come down” joke, to break it to us gently.

    Friday when he went in, they were saying he was fine and this was just a precaution.

    Saturday they casually drop the news that on Friday he had a 103 fever and his oxygen dropped several times, but he’s fine now.

    Sunday they say he had some damage to his lungs and was put on a critical-cases-only medication on Saturday, but he’s fine now and may be discharged on Monday.

  82. 82.

    Amir Khalid

    @MomSense:

    “It’s about a guy who is shipped abroad to fight in a senseless and futile war, and then comes back to an America that doesn’t give a damn about him.”

    You will hear their mental gears slipping and grinding as they try to process that.

  83. 83.

    debbie

    @Ken:

    No, this is the real tell: The WH doctor explained why he and Meadows’ statements yesterday seemed contradictory by saying he was trying to match the president’s “upbeat attitude.” Trump, upbeat? Never!

  84. 84.

    debbie

    @Amir Khalid:

    I wish one of these musicians would actually sue rather than ask the campaign again and again to knock it off.

    Maybe they should start their own class action lawsuit.

  87. 87.

    Geminid

    Mark Kelly and Martha McSally debate this Tuesday evening. And M.J. Hager debates John Cornyn Friday, October 9. That one should be good. I wouldn’t call Hegar a dirty fighter, but she’s not at all afraid to punch hard around the belt.    Last week M.J. Hegar announced that her campaign had raised $13.5 million so far this quarter.

  88. 88.

    Chief Oshkosh

    @Hungry Joe: It sounds like they are pumping him full of everything to get a very, very short term bounce so that he can get back to being as asshole for the next month.

    Kind of a GOMER approach to presidential politics.

  89. 89.

    Immanentize

    @debbie: They really can’t sue — the venues buy package licenses for huge musical catalogues and Trump’s campaigns rely on those to choose any song he likes.  Only in very specific instances — maybe the White House not using a sound vendor? — could anyone sue.  But the damages would be pennies.

  90. 90.

    cain

    @debbie:

    I think it is safe to say that they are all lying. The President isn’t remotely ready to be discharged tomorrow – that was just shit that he made them say. Given that we have moved past the “it is a mild case” – this virus is going to grind him for a few weeks.

    Regardless of what drugs they gave him – a lot of it still depends on the state of his immune system.

  91. 91.

    cain

    @Chief Oshkosh:

    @Hungry Joe: It sounds like they are pumping him full of everything to get a very, very short term bounce so that he can get back to being as asshole for the next month.

    That’s what I’m thinking, but it’s still putting a strain on his body chemistry. They’ll need to be careful though.. Everything we know about this virus says that there is a long road recovery if it gets past the mild stage.

  92. 92.

    Aleta

     

    @PPCLI:  I can’t look at those pictures without adding in the people who remain invisible to us, directing the shoot and assisting.  Choosing the room, bringing in the props, setting up the tableau.  Tweaking the angles.  Ushering him in and seating him.  Putting the sharpie in his hand, directing his eyes and hands.  Getting the shots, praising him, finishing up and feeling good about it.  I think about all the hidden people keeping him afloat and covering for him, who get job satisfaction from lying to us and adjusting the outer shell of a monster.

  93. 93.

    MazeDancer

    Between the hedging on lung involvement and the strange giving of immuno suppressing steroids right after immuno boosting experimentals, gotta assume scar tissue is forming in his lungs.

    So the boosters were just for show, but the lung stuff is real. No doubt, Trump demanded the experimentals – at the highest dose.

    Zeke Emmanuel picked up on the hokey lung involvement language. Said, to him, it pointed to lung involvement.

    Trump is alert enough that the doctors have to keep lying. But if the steroids don’t halt the lung involvement, that could change.

    The only reason Trump would be discharged tomorrow is because he demands it. Patients with deteriorating lungs do not leave the hospital unless they insist. You always have the right to deny treatment.

    If anything harms Trump’s recovery, it will be his arrogant directing of his own treatment.

  95. 95.

    Kent

    @Wyatt Salamanca:Let the lying begin and Fuck Trump.  I can’t wait for this gutless bastard to lose in November,

    Begin?  BEGIN?

    There is no beginning when it comes to lying and Trump.  He is the alpha and omega of lying.  We are trapped in an endless circle of Trump lies with no beginning or end.

  96. 96.

    Amir Khalid

    @debbie:

    Springsteen definitely could sue, if he were so inclined.  He personally holds the copyright to all his songs, instead of assigning them to a copyright org like ASCAP or BMI. But for decades now, his practice has been to issue a statement that he doesn’t support Republican candidate so-and-so and did not give permission to use his song(s).  The Democratic party gets to use his songs, e.g. at the convention, because he’s a lifelong Democrat.

  97. 97.

    Immanentize

    We all know that the virus doesn’t care who you are, what age, or what political party you belong to.  But if it could care even a bit, I image it would be knocking everyone down in its path to get to Bill Barr.

  100. 100.

    piratedan

    @Geminid: have no idea on what McSally can say or do to get back in the race… she’s already accused Kelly of being a shyster, a spy and a traitor and a liar and none of it has stuck.  She’s at the point of trying to hold one of his daughters hostage.  All Kelly does is show her ads and show her votes (against the ACA) and says that she’s not trustworthy on health care.

  101. 101.

    PPCLI

    @Wyatt Salamanca: At the next one of these medical press conferences, the first questioner should say:

    “Before we begin with the medical questions, we need to do a baseline test to calibrate the accuracy of your responses. The two large photographs I am holding up show crowds of people on the mall in Washington. Which one appears to you to be significantly larger?

  102. 102.

    patrick II

    @Immanentize:

    “Too sullied” is a word for the current presidency as well.  People in that office are normally treated with some decorum because of the huge institutional gravitas it has. It was the office first held by George Washington and such greats as Lincoln, Franklin and Teddy Roosevelt, Adams, and Jefferson.  Great men leading the country to be the greatest democracy in the world.  Then we have Trump, who doesn’t inhabit that institution, but rents it. Paid for in part by treachery with the goal to personally profit. He uses it to lie, profit from, steal children, ignore a plague tht kills hundreds of thousands because that is more useful to him while demanding people respect him because of the office he holds, not what he uses it for or the person he is.

  103. 103.

    piratedan

    @cain: what’s not mentioned is what the President was already taking, his current medical profile regarding daily prescribed medications and what OTC he was taking (supposedly addicted to) as well.

    All of that shit can complicate the response of any medications they use.  Kudos if you think the Trump staff was honestly forthcoming with what Trump actually inserts, not sure that they would be that honest, given their track record.

  104. 104.

    Geminid

    Arizona Senator Kyrsten Sinema unloads on Martha McSally in a new ad for Mark Kelly: “…but the worst lies [McSally] tells are the ones about her voting record,” says Sinema as she lays into McSally’s claims that she supports protecting coverage of preexisting conditions….”Arizonians know Martha McSally will say anything to get reelected.”     McSally ran a dirty campaign in 2018, and Synema has not forgotten.

  106. 106.

    Brachiator

    Shit. So Trump may be discharged tomorrow. I was hoping for a longer hospitalization and at least for some severe symptoms.

    Now I almost wonder if Trump really tested positive. Almost. I presume that Walter Reed doctors are not going to participate in a farce.

    I need for some infected GOP senators to go down hard.

  108. 108.

    Ohio Mom

    Aleta @92: Don’t forget, the handlers also arranged for that crisp bright white dress shirt. It helped mask how pale he looks, being sick and without his usual slathering of bronzer.

  109. 109.

    Amir Khalid

    @Immanentize:

    What bugs me is that Bruce took down the video of American Skin (41 Shots) — shot for the Live in New York City DVD — from his Vevo YouTube channel, and replaced it with an edited-down version that lacks the power and gravitas of the complete version.

  110. 110.

    Kent

    So yesterday I drove up I-5 with my daughter from Camas WA up to the Monroe/Sultan area north of Seattle along Stevens Pass to help her look for housing.   She has a winter job lined up at the ski area up there to kill time and have adventures until the economy starts to re-open for newly minted college grads in the spring.

    Anyway, along I-5 between Longview and Tacoma we ran into the biggest car and truck MAGA rally I have seen to date.  Literally hundreds of them lined up for miles with their pathetic MAGA and Trump flags on the backs of their trucks and just a huge menagerie of other racist shit from the blue lives flags to some weird new jolly roger styled Trump flags that I have never seen before.  These filth are really into their flags.  I don’t remember any previous GOP campaign being so flag-obsessed.

    I tried to google it up to see what was happening but got nothing.  It must have been some dark web Facebook organized silliness.    I guess MAGAts gotta MAGAt   It’s not like WA is remotely in play.  But we do have an enormous redneck element, especially along that stretch of I-5 between Portland and Tacoma which is pretty white, redneck and racist.   I was somewhat surprised at how many there were though.  The caravan went on for miles.

  111. 111.

    Steeplejack (phone)

    A doctor reviews the press conference (thread):

    Impressions of today's Walter Reed presser:

    a) Conley's mea culpa: “I was trying to reflect the upbeat attitude of the team. Didn’t want to give any information that would steer the course of his illness.” Trump's fingerprints.

    But even so, today was only slightly better. (1/8)

    — Bob Wachter (@Bob_Wachter) October 4, 2020

  112. 112.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Brachiator: So Trump may be discharged tomorrow.

    He also may not be discharged tomorrow.  I would wait until he is discharged to believe that he was discharged.

  113. 113.

    MomSense

    @MazeDancer:

    I mentioned yesterday that my son was put on a course of decadron (the brand name) when he was hospitalized for a severe respiratory infection.  What I didn’t talk about was that he got chicken pox right after he went off the decadron and had such a severe case we ended up back in the hospital.  They would not prescribe that medication unless his lungs were in bad shape.

  114. 114.

    Goku (Amerikan Baka)

    @Brachiator:

    Shit. So Trump may be discharged tomorrow. I was hoping for a longer hospitalization and at least for some severe symptoms

    There’s talk of him being prescribed dexamethasone, a strong corticosteroid and immunosuppressant that’s recommended for patients with severe COVID-19 illness. On top of that, they admitted lung damage and involvement

    He may be discharged tomorrow (probably AMA), but that doesn’t mean he won’t have a relapse. I think they’re lying

    As for the Walter Reed doctors not going along with the farce? I wouldn’t think so either and it’s possible they were lied to at first and are facing political pressure from the GOP and WH

  115. 115.

    Kent

    @Immanentize:@Amir Khalid: Springsteen’s copyright position is so frustrating!  I want some songs off the Nebraska album on youtube!

    You mean you want to hear his stuff for free without paying for it?  Is that what’s frustrating?

  117. 117.

    The Moar You Know

    Regardless of what drugs they gave him – a lot of it still depends on the state of his immune system.

    @cain: I bet that the SARS-COV2 in his system is dying a horrible death from multiple infections of chlamydia, herpes, and syphilis, while also being overdosed on Adderall, benzos, cholesterol and whatever that crap is that makes his face orange. He’ll be playing volleyball by Tuesday.

  119. 119.

    Kent

    @Goku (Amerikan Baka):

    There’s talk of him being prescribed dexamethasone, a strong corticosteroid and immunosuppressant that’s recommended for patients with severe COVID-19 illness. On top of that, they admitted lung damage and involvement

    He may be discharged tomorrow (probably AMA), but that doesn’t mean he won’t have a relapse. I think they’re lying

    As for the Walter Reed doctors not going along with the farce? I wouldn’t think so either and it’s possible they were lied to at first and are facing political pressure from the GOP and WH

    Would you rather see him in the hospital for the next week?

    Or seem him released, try to get back into the campaign saddle looking weak and sickly, and then collapse on live TV?

    Either one works for me.  And the virus doesn’t care.

  120. 120.

    Goku (Amerikan Baka)

    @Kent:

    I truly don’t understand the need for these idiotic parades. All of this Trump merch will hopefully be wasted money to these goons when, knock on wood, Trump loses this next month

  123. 123.

    Hungry Joe

    Calculating all of Trump’s and GOP senators’ possible medical conditions, and all the possible political results emanating from each one, I have worked out 717 potential timelines for the next four months — 729 if I factor in an asteroid. In one of them, George Takei becomes President. (That’s my favorite.)

    To repeat: “No one knows anything.”

  125. 125.

    Amir Khalid

    If any of my fellow fans of Englische Fußball are interested, the once mighty Manchester United have just suffered a humiliating 1-6 defeat to visitors Tottenham Hotspur. Up next is the last match of the Sunday programme: Aston Villa vs Liverpool.

  128. 128.

    Kent

    @Jean:@Omnes Omnibus: My read today is that the election is over (assuming we vote in numbers reflected in likely voter polls).  Discharge or no discharge.

    “The war situation has developed not necessarily to Japan’s advantage.” -Emperor Hirohito, August1945

    The election isn’t over until it’s over. But this certainly blows out of the water the entire Trump campaign strategy of lies and denial and changing the subject to anything but covid.

    But eyes on the prize folks.  It’s not about schadenfreude, it’s about winning hundreds and hundreds of different races on November 2nd.

  129. 129.

    Fair Economist

    @Ken: Dexamethasone, and other steroids, are beneficial in that they reduce inflammation and consequent lung damage, but detrimental in that they reduce immune system activity. Steroids were considered a “two edged sword” in treating SARS1 because of this, and that was the indication in uncontrolled studies. A controlled study for dexamethasone in COVID actually showed that on average patients with significant lung involvement (needing supplemental oxygen) benefitted from dexamethasone, but patients overall didn’t, and patients not needing supplemental oxygen tended to do worse (IIRC not actually statistically significant).

    So based on theory + that trial the standard treatment is now dexamethasone or similar steroids for patients needing supplemental oxygen, but no steroids otherwise.

  130. 130.

    Kent

    @Goku (Amerikan Baka):I truly don’t understand the need for these idiotic parades. All of this Trump merch will hopefully be wasted money to these goons when, knock on wood, Trump loses this next month

    I wonder how much of it is made in China!

  131. 131.

    Goku (Amerikan Baka)

    @Kent:

    Would you rather see him in the hospital for the next week?

    Or seem him released, try to get back into the campaign saddle looking weak and sickly, and then collapse on live TV?

    Either one works for me.  And the virus doesn’t care.

    The second one seems like it would be the most politically damaging at first glance (and the most amusing for me), but I do worry some morons would give him a sympathy vote. I don’t want to leave anything on the table.

    The first one would take away campaign time for him when the election is only a few weeks away and people are already voting, so I guess that’s preferable. I think either way Trump is probably going to have long-term health effects from this, so him collapsing could happen in this scenario too

  132. 132.

    Ken

    @Hungry Joe: I have worked out 717 potential timelines… In one of them, George Takei becomes President.

    Is there some way I can help?  A butterfly to kill, or to re-position so its wing-flaps cause a thunderstorm in Dixville Notch on election day?

  134. 134.

    Matt McIrvin

    @Jean: We still have to vote (most of us, at least)! I hope the news isn’t distracting low-info people or making them think it’s already over.

  137. 137.

    MisterForkbeard

    @Goku (Amerikan Baka): A big chunk of it is that they need to be visibly assholes, I think. It’s what they like about Trump – everything he does flips off the nation and moral people.

    Ostentatiously supporting him does the same thing. It’s a big fuck you to everyone else.

  138. 138.

    Uncle Cosmo

    @Chief Oshkosh: Kind of a GOMER approach to presidential politics.

    GOMER as in, Get Outa My Emergency Room?!?!

    To me it seems like another House of God reference: Buffing and turfing. But hey, what do I know, I haven’t even stayed in a Holiday Inn recently…

  139. 139.

    Aleta

    I hate that they’re starting to use the hospital story to keep the media saturated.  He might come home tomorrow.  Will he?  (Segue into new speculation.  How will doctors decide. Debate. Describe the dangers.  What do different people think …)

    As in 2016, every story takes space from other candidates and from scandals.  Voting suppression in TX, sudden order to replace voting machine software in GA.   The HS Dept., the FBI, McMaster.  Russian agents looking for MoCs who might assist them.  Chad Wolf telling Brian Murphy to hold an intel notification.   The Trump family’s anti-life behavior.  (Not to mention Melania as Christmas resistor :) ) .

  141. 141.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    All I can say is it doesn’t look to me as if Trump is tweeting. There are a couple of bland tweets about great doctors and let’s work together, etc. If he’s not bored enough to tweet, he’s sick.

  142. 142.

    rikyrah

    @Geminid:

     

    Every Democrat in a debate with a Republican needs
    1. To be 15 feet apart from them
    2. Needs to bring their own protective cone like Jamie Harrison

    And , it begins with Kamala on down.
    They don’t respect science.
    You gotta protect yourself.

  148. 148.

    debbie

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    Thank you. I had no idea that politicians were shielded. Google was of no help in telling me whether that was part of the law all along or a recent revision.

    I wonder if this extends to a politician stealing an iconic image (ie, Indiana’s Love) to incorporate into their materials.

    Also, odd that the article is dated as 2015, yet they mention Trump.

  150. 150.

    Kent

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    @Hungry Joe: Well, I threw out all the outliers. Ted Nugent on the Supreme Court, for example. That seemed like a stretch.

    Really?

    It’s his age.   He’s 71.

    A 49 year old Kid Rock on the Supreme Court is the more likely scenario.

  151. 151.

    Brachiator

    @Kent:

    The election isn’t over until it’s over. But this certainly blows out of the water the entire Trump campaign strategy of lies and denial and changing the subject to anything but covid.

    Trump’s past practice has been to push forward with lies and bullshit. I’m not expecting any change.

    We will see if he gets back out on the campaign trail and changes any behavior. And also whether his supporters wise up.

    Meanwhile I hope this incident has peeled away more of his support. Maybe some early voters were nudged to pick Biden.

  152. 152.

    RandomMonster

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: Yup. If he was in any shape to be discharged tomorrow, he would be tweeting about the burly marine on the helicopter who saluted him with tears in his eyes saying, “Sir, the Oval Office needs you, America needs you…”

  154. 154.

    Mai Naem mobile

    I remember one of the doctors Conley or Jackson saying that he was on an anti cholesterol drug and aspirin. I think that’s what the hippie looking guy said as well. Conley’s med list on Thurs or Fri(prehospital didn’t even have that.) I find it hard to believe his cholesterol went down but find the aspirin missing interesting being that there were rumors of the stroke earlier this year. If he’s on plavix or eliquis or whatever than I am pretty sure you would stop the aspirin.  Whatevs. They need to stop lying. I am just tired of this man and the drama. I just want to move on and fix this country.

  155. 155.

    Aleta

    This sounds like Barr is refusing to quarantine:

    “Barr’s refusal to quarantine after exposure is not ‘toughness,'” tweeted University of Michigan Law Professor Barbara McQuade, who’s also a former U.S. attorney. “It is arrogant, irresponsible, and reckless behavior from our nation’s attorney general.”

    Andrew Weissmann, a longtime Department of Justice (DOJ) lawyer turned legal analyst, said Barr’s decision was “fitting” for an “enabler of presidential fictions and denier of facts.”

    ETA:

     (NYT) Attorney General William P. Barr, the nation’s top law enforcement officer, has decided not to self-quarantine, despite potential prolonged exposure to the coronavirus.

  157. 157.

    MattF

    @Brachiator: I think people are underestimating the physical wear and tear in campaigning, particularly in a national campaign. Trump’s attitude may be daunting to his doctors, but presidential campaigning while physically weak from serious lung damage isn’t realistic.

  159. 159.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    I would call this “tempting fate”, but they’ve been doing that for years. “Coming Soon”

    Christina Wilkie @christinawilkie 
    The White House Gift Shop is selling a “Donald J. Trump defeats Covid” commemorative coin. You can pre-order it now for $100.

    It’s being offered as a “historic moment in history”. Not by the campaign, by the White House gift shop

    ETA:

    Title: “PRESIDENT TRUMP DEFEATS COVID”
    with
    KEY ICONS OF PRESIDENT DONALD J. TRUMP’S
    Entire First Term as
    45TH PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES
    Giannini Narrative Art Coin Series
    Chronicling in Narrative Coin Art the Presidency of Donald J. Trump

    again, not the campaign, the White House gift shop

  162. 162.

    Eljai

    @rikyrah: I think new cases from the superspreader event will continue to come to light this week.  And who knows how many secondary cases after that?

  163. 163.

    Emma from FL

    @debbie: That’s actually in my wheelhouse. Copyright protects the rights of the owners. If you sell or transfer your copyright, you may be the author but you no longer own your work. You cannot imagine how many University professors are surprised when the corporation owning the rights to their work charges them to use it as part of classwork.

  164. 164.

    Kent

    @Brachiator:

    Trump’s past practice has been to push forward with lies and bullshit. I’m not expecting any change.

    We will see if he gets back out on the campaign trail and changes any behavior. And also whether his supporters wise up.

    Meanwhile I hope this incident has peeled away more of his support. Maybe some early voters were nudged to pick Biden.

    Oh, if course he’s going to TRY.  He doesn’t know anything else.  But I expect this whole episode has pulled back a bit of the curtain to use a Wizard of Oz reference.   Elections are won and lost at the margins.  There is literally NOTHING that could happen to push Trump below say 40%.  But if this drops him from say 45% to 42% that  is enormously consequential everywhere across the country in every close race.

    What is really telling is that the Biden campaign pulled all their negative ads and still had plenty of great content to put up.  The Trump campaign couldn’t do that because they literally had NOTHING to put on the air that wasn’t negative fearmongering and lies.  They literally have ZERO positive ads or messages.

  165. 165.

    Ceci n est pas mon nym

    @realbtl: Maybe an animatronic dog that’s a secret plant by Putin or the Lizard People, that’s secretly a device to listen in and to convey orders.

    That’s a more plausible plot line than the current one.

  166. 166.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    also coming to the White House gift shop:

    COMING SOON!
    In this department of the White House Gift Shop, you will find apparel, gear, and collectibles both tactical and patriotic designed or selected solely for members of U.S. Secret Service Uniformed Division, Law Enforcement Officers both States and Federal, as well as gifts and products for First Responders. Some of the products coming soon include tactical lights, Surfire lights, jackets, pants, shirts, gloves, hats, headwear, boots, BDU style apparel, Thin Blue Line gifts, and more. You can also special order products not offered online at significants reduced prices by writing to giannini @ whitehousegiftshop.com Some of the special products require state or federal “direct” law enforcement community membership.

    Collectibles both tactical and patriotic. Thin Blue Line gifts.

    I’ve never been to the White House gift shop, but this seems…. odd.

  169. 169.

    Kent

    @MattF:@Brachiator: I think people are underestimating the physical wear and tear in campaigning, particularly in a national campaign. Trump’s attitude may be daunting to his doctors, but presidential campaigning while physically weak from serious lung damage isn’t realistic.

    That’s true.  I’m much younger and healthier than Trump and I still get exhausted by plane travel.  It just wears you out.  I expect AF1 is a lot more comfortable, but still.  Just running around is exhausting. Whether it is campaigning or shopping the mall with your wife.

  171. 171.

    Kent

    @Aleta:

    “Barr’s refusal to quarantine after exposure is not ‘toughness,’” tweeted University of Michigan Law Professor Barbara McQuade, who’s also a former U.S. attorney. “It is arrogant, irresponsible, and reckless behavior from our nation’s attorney general.”

    Andrew Weissmann, a longtime Department of Justice (DOJ) lawyer turned legal analyst, said Barr’s decision was “fitting” for an “enabler of presidential fictions and denier of facts.”

    The more MAGA filth he can infect the better.

  172. 172.

    debbie

    @Emma from FL:

    Thank you. Did all these artists and professors not realize when they sold or transferred? I guess I’m surprised so many of them would have.

  173. 173.

    Kent

    @JaySinWA:@?BillinGlendaleCA: Once years ago travelling between Seattle and Portland my electronic watch reset as we passed the cooling towers. Spooky.

    That was years ago.  The Trojan nuke plant was mothballed in 1993 and demolished in 2006.  But all the paper plants spewing toxic fumes in Longview are still there.

  177. 177.

    trnc

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Title: “PRESIDENT TRUMP DEFEATS COVID”
    with
    KEY ICONS OF PRESIDENT DONALD J. TRUMP’S
    Entire First Term as
    45TH PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES
    Giannini Narrative Art Coin Series
    Chronicling in Narrative Coin Art the Presidency of Donald J. Trump

    If he doesn’t beat covid, it can easily be repackaged as his life flashing before his eyes and probably sell a lot better.

  180. 180.

    PJ

    @danielx: Biden has 36 years of experience in Congress of actually getting legislation passed that Carter did not have.  That, and a Democratic Congress (FSM willing), will mean that we get real forward progress on voting rights, health care, climate change, courts, you name it.  Joe Manchin will be the biggest roadblock he has to deal with.

  183. 183.

    MazeDancer

    @MomSense: 

    If they are giving Trump steroids – big if, because liars – then def lung problems.

    Which implies this should be Day 7, or 10, not Day 4. And Trump has been positive for awhile, spreading disease.

    But if he has lung problems, they don’t clear up in one day, especially so early in the disease.

    So, with all the lying opportunities, no way of knowing anything.

    Sorry your boy had to go through that.

  185. 185.

    Zzyzx

    The White House gift shop has no official connection to the White House. We’ve mocked their merch before but then we learned that.

  186. 186.

    Ohio Mom

    Jim, Foolish Literalist @166:

    I have a vague memory of the White House Gift Shop’s inventory coming up before.

    If my memory serves, it is a private enterprise, not affiliated with any office of the White House or the National Park Service, or any other public entity that might have some standards. It’s just a tacky souvenir joint.

  187. 187.

    Another Scott

    This stuff about the President maybe being discharged from hospital does not fit with the list of medications he’s gotten/is getting.

    More messaging from/for the Audience of One?

    — Helen Branswell (@HelenBranswell) October 4, 2020

    Yup.

    Oh, come on. Then he’d better be [released from WR on Monday], and if he isn’t you’re screwed, and if he returns you’re screwed. https://t.co/CcPsKPYmz1

    — Richard M. Nixon (@dick_nixon) October 4, 2020

    Yup.

    “You cannot surge trust.”

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  190. 190.

    zhena gogolia

    I’m trying to watch the SNL debate skit. Jim Carrey isn’t bad (Harrelson was better), but what does “[Biden’s] inner Whitey Bulger” mean? What the hell does Biden have to do with Whitey Bulger?

  192. 192.

    charon

    @Another Scott:

     

    Definitely audience of one.  Trump is emotionally fragile, this is to pacify him

     

    The medications they disclose say otherwise, he is in poor shape.

  193. 193.

    Aleta

    @Another Scott: And just yesterday the press was told he’d be there for a few days.  Are the warring factions in the WH fighting over PR control of his body?  What a sitcom.

  194. 194.

    Sloane Ranger

    a) Conley’s mea culpa: “I was trying to reflect the upbeat attitude of the team. Didn’t want to give any information that would steer the course of his illness.”

    So, didn’t want to give info that would steer the course of his illness – because loose lips sink ships and if the virus learns about the doctors treatment plans it might change its strategy!

  195. 195.

    CarolPW

    @JaySinWA: The Satsop plant was not completed, so there was never nuclear material there. The site was the equivalent of a nuclear ghost town and had an eerie quality all its own despite the lack of radiation.

  196. 196.

    Zzyzx

    Seen a few Trump ads on the Seahawks’ game. Black NFL player trying to sell that Trump is the best president ever for the community. It’s an interesting approach for sure.

  200. 200.

    Brachiator

    @MattF:

    I think people are underestimating the physical wear and tear in campaigning, particularly in a national campaign. Trump’s attitude may be daunting to his doctors, but presidential campaigning while physically weak from serious lung damage isn’t realistic.

    I don’t know what problems Trump has or may have. I just wanted to see him hospitalized with at least serious problems.

    Other than that, I am curious to see how he juggles lies about the pandemic and his own brush with it, and whether he continues to offer up his staff and supporters as sacrifices to his ego. And also whether his supporters continue to be suckers (I expect they will).

    Democrats need to bring back all their ads, especially the “negative” ones and continue to go at him and to rally their own supporters.

    Get out the vote and vote Trump out.

  201. 201.

    Kay

    Sherrilyn Ifill
    @Sifill_LDF
    ·1h
    I have insisted that the legal profession will need to have a reckoning at the highest levels for complicity, silence & participation in unraveling the rule of law & the legal foundation of our democracy. But I’ll tell you the medical profession will have some work to do as well.

    It’s a shame. I knew the legal profession failed when faced with Trump, but up until now I felt like the medical profession was holding up well.
    He ruins whatever he comes in contact with. Either that or all our institutions were weak and we just didn’t know the extent of the foundational rot that had been spreading before he arrived on the scene.

  202. 202.

    Wyatt Salamanca

    @Kent:

    To clarify, by “Let the lying begin” I was simply referring to the start time of today’s sham press conference.

    Trump has clearly been lying and bullshitting his way through life ever since he first learned how to talk.

  203. 203.

    Kay

    Nate Cohn
    @Nate_Cohn
    ·3h
    The new YouGov number in PA–Biden+7–is pretty familiar, and it’s an improvement for Biden over their prior polls there. We’ll see Monmouth this week, but if you’ve got Monmouth, ABC/Post, NYT/Siena x2, and YouGov with Biden well ahead in PA, that’s devastating for the president

    Thank fucking God. If these people remained in power another term there wouldn’t be a profession, institution or person who had any credibility left. Even I’m shocked at how much damage they’ve done.
    We have a lot of work to do after they’re gone.

  204. 204.

    Kay

    No one knows the physical condition of the President because the President and all the people he hires are dishonest and lie constantly. Not one of them can be trusted.

    One more month of this. Keep your fingers crossed :)

  205. 205.

    Jean

    @Kay: I totally agree.  If we win, I hope I don’t have to hear about Trump and (as you say) his whole garbage family every day of the year.

  206. 206.

    Amir Khalid

    Liverpool pulled one back with a Mo Salah goal, and then Villa scored again. 3-1. Oh shit.

    ETA: Aston Villa 4-1 Liverpool. Fuck.

  207. 207.

    JaySinWA

    @Kay: I’m not sure when there was a golden age of transparency around any President’s health. Wilson, FDR, JFK, Reagan, and Donnie’s bizarre series of doctors. I sure there were others. We were always lied to. Of course this is now so blatant that we all see it in realtime, and so badly done that it isn’t ignored.

  208. 208.

    Eljai

    @MazeDancer: I have questions about when trump was actually infected too.  Nothing adds up.  His symptoms are “mild” yet he’s been given oxygen and treated with, what, 3 drug treatments now?  And all this happened just 2 days (allegedly) from diagnosis.

  209. 209.

    Jinchi

    @RandomMonster: he would be tweeting about the burly marine on the helicopter who saluted him with tears in his eyes saying, “Sir, the Oval Office needs you, America needs you…”

    Didn’t you hear? That’s the bastard who gave him corona in the first place. All these big burly men who can’t resist hugging and touching DJT.

  210. 210.

    Emma from FL

    @debbie: In academia, publishing is the primary path to tenure. Get enough articles published and discussed, get invited to do presentations which are then collected into volumes, and you get the golden ring of forever employment. They publish as a means to tenure. Some of the lucky or seriously expert ones get book contracts (ahem, Levenson) but nobody gets really rich on them unless (ahem, Levenson) they hit the best sellers list. It’s mostly a good deal.

    The problem arises when a faculty member wants to, for example, prepare a reading packet for a class. Permissions must be obtained for each author’s work to be used. There are good solid academic (i.e. teaching and research) exceptions but they are devised to not let one penny flow in any way to anyone other than the publisher. That’s why libraries invented Reserves; each student makes their own copy of the articles kept on the Reserve room shelves for a class. But even then you can run into issues.

  211. 211.

    Tony Jay

    @Amir Khalid:

    Villa are playing smart. Aggressively blocking our channels to cross or pass into the box and when they get possession flooding forward with numbers and speed to crack our back line, and then great finishing.

    We look slow and wheezy, while they’re well worth their lead. Their coach has clearly worked out the weaknesses in our system and they’re taking the risks necessary to exploit them. Klopp is going to be tearing skin off in strips at half time, but without Mane’s skills and lacking the passing accuracy that Alcantara was brought in specifically to provide, it’s a matter of the players ut there needing to do what they’ve been doing – just better.

  212. 212.

    trollhattan

    @Eljai:

    He has been around the virus daily since…a long time so we cannot know when he might have been infected. Incubation is said to be 2 days minimum, 14 days maximum and 5 days on average. That range adds much uncertainty to their not telling us when he was first diagnosed.

  214. 214.

    MisterForkbeard

    @Eljai: My understanding is that it’s possible to get severe symptoms quickly IF you get a truly massive viral load, but it’s rare.

    Trump probably had this for a week or so before admitting to it. And attended a fucking debate while he was sick… and probably knew he was sick, unless they were also lying about his testing regimen.

  215. 215.

    Miss Bianca

    @MattF: Good thread, thanks for posting.

    I don’t know why I can’t stop reading about this shitshow. It’s like searching some animal’s entrails for portents. In fact, reading animal entrails for portents would probably give me a more accurate picture of what’s actually going on than trying to parse WH spokespuppets’ “statements”.

  217. 217.

    debbie

    @zhena gogolia:

    I took it to mean be a tough guy (not to the point of killing people).

    Today’s walk was 36 minutes with a yard sign count of 51 Biden to 2 Trump (the same 2 yards as always, signs still cowering amongst the shrubbery). Walk was a bit longer than planned because of the need to make an unplanned u-turn due to a turkey vulture in the middle of the road eating roadkill.WTF???

  219. 219.

    debbie

    @Emma from FL:

    Huh, I used to layout a couple of journals and edit academic articles and also a couple of books, but I had no idea that getting published involved losing your rights to your writings. I’m not sure I’d be very happy about that.

  222. 222.

    Eljai

    @trollhattan:

    @MisterForkbeard:  I seem to recall reading something about how the rapid testing method they were using at the White House can have a significant number of false negatives so, yeah, that would add to the uncertainty.  And these jackasses thought that testing alone would keep them safe even though all the experts were saying you still need to take a layered approach and mask-up etc.

  223. 223.

    Emma from FL

    @debbie: It’s the standard in academia. Of course some profs are savvy and hold on to the copyright but that happens only after they have enough of a reputation to negotiate that kind of contract.

  224. 224.

    What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?

    @Ken: I mean, there’s no way it’s safe to discharge him tomorrow unless that Regeneron stuff completely cured him, in which case thank God we have something that works

    This thing…there are tons of descriptions of cases where people started feeling better for a day or two and then had serious relapses. Some of those cases people were a week out of hospital and then the case took a sudden fatal turn. If he’s been on oxygen, steroids etc. he should be in the hospital for a week or so yet to be safe. Letting him out tomorrow…like I said maybe that antibody treatment knocked it out, but if not he’ll still have to be confined to the White House and its medical facilities for at least another week.

  225. 225.

    Wyatt Salamanca

    Nice to see how Trump surrogates are staying classy:

    (I can’t wait to see Jason Miller and the other Trump scum swept into the trash bin of history after Election Day)

     

    A top adviser to President Donald Trump’s campaign on Sunday ridiculed 2020 Democratic presidential nominee Joe Biden’s mask-wearing even as President Donald Trump remains hospitalized with Covid-19.

     

    Speaking with ABC’s “This Week,” Trump campaign senior adviser Jason Miller was asked about Trump’s comments on masks at Tuesday’s debate. Trump ridiculed Biden for frequently wearing a mask in public and defended having large rallies with many maskless attendees.

     

    “I don’t wear masks like him every time you see him he’s got a mask,” Trump said. “He could be speaking 200 feet away and he shows up with the biggest mask I’ve ever seen.”

     

    Miller claimed the campaign “hasn’t been cavalier at all” about the virus, pointing to temperature checks and mask giveaways, but criticized Biden for his frequent mask-wearing.

     

    “Too often he has used it as a prop,” he said. “Mask is very important but even if — he could be 20, 30 feet away from the nearest person and he could still have the mask on. That’s not gonna change anything that’s out there.”

     

    “We can’t all just stay in our basement for the rest of our lives,” Miller said, mentioning what’s been a Republican point of mockery of Biden for holding virtual events during the pandemic. “We have to get out there and live our lives and take this on … You can’t just stay hidden in your basement the entire time.”

     

    h/t https://www.yahoo.com/news/top-trump-campaign-official-ridicules-142300974.html

  226. 226.

    What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?

    @MisterForkbeard: Yeah from what I’ve read symptoms this severe usually show up around day 10 or so. Given that they won’t say when he last tested negative (should be easy to answer because by rules of the debate venue he should have had to have had a negative test that day to participate) I think he probably caught it last week Saturday at the earliest. And they lied about testing him before the debate. And lied about testing his entire entourage.

  227. 227.

    Barbara

    @MomSense: Steroids in Covid cases seem to be useful only where your immune response is making things worse — otherwise, they risk weakening a healthy (if unpleasant to experience) immune system working to combat the disease. From everything I have read, they are counterproductive for mild to moderate symptoms.

  229. 229.

    Martin

    So, my read here is:

    1. Trump is sicker than we’re being told, based on the meds being administered.
    2. The possible discharge tomorrow is because Trump is losing message control and wants to get out of the hospital, not because his condition is improving. Doctors always want to keep a patient in hospital because that gives them the most tools and the best response time.
    3. The doctors are tailoring their press messages for Trump, not the public, because Trump panics and because Trump is a belligerent patient who will try to leave AMA.
    4. Trump will refuse any effort to transfer power to Pence. Should he lose consciousness and power need to be transferred, it’ll be chaos ala Reagan shooting, because nobody will actually know what’s going on, and what needs to be done.
  230. 230.

    Amir Khalid

    Aston Villa are now 7-2 up. Liverpool last conceded seven goals in 1963, at home to Tottenham Hotspur. Jürgen Klopp was born in 1967.

  234. 234.

    MagdaInBlack

    @Martin: Do we even know if he is well enough to call the shots or argue?

    I smell Jared in this bs. Where HAVE he and Ivanka disappeared to?

  235. 235.

    James E Powell

    @Zzyzx:

    I saw the same ad. It’s total bullshit, but what else can we expect?

    He’s not fooling anyone with this argument.

  236. 236.

    James E Powell

    @Kay:

    The legal profession at the highest levels does despicable things all the time. It’s how lawyers get to the highest levels. Professor Torture Memos is one glaring example.

  237. 237.

    artem1s

    @Martin:

    I think that Dump’s more worried about who’s talking about invoking 25 than he’s worried about his election numbers right now.  he knows what he would be doing behind the scenes if he had an enemy stuck in the hospital who couldn’t respond quickly to a contract take over.  Now if the dumbass doesn’t walk out of the hospital tomorrow or the next day, the press will be in a feeding frenzy about who is going to take over the west wing and how soon. There is blood in the water now and it’s about to get really ugly.

  238. 238.

    Skepticat

    @Luciamia: Can it be from out of a cannon?

    Of all the great comments here, this has been my absolute favorite of the day. Thank you.

  239. 239.

    EighthCousin

    @Steeplejack (phone):

    De-lurking to recommend everyone read the twitter thread that Steeplejack linked at 111 above. The writer is Bob Wachter, Chair of UCSF Dept of Medicine. He goes through the probable sequence of treatment…and mentions the problem of an uncooperative patient. Last statement: “No way he’s ready for discharge tomorrow.”

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