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You are here: Home / Politics / Media / Overdone (Open Thread)

Overdone (Open Thread)

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When an elite media figure’s gross behavior results in a rare moment of personal accountability, his fellow aristocrats are irresistibly compelled to convert the tawdry tale into a Greek tragedy. The Times published a representative sample of the genre today: “The Undoing of Jeffrey Toobin: How a leading man of legal journalism lost his sweet gig.” Honest to Christ, that’s their actual title.

Here’s an answer to the question posed in that ridiculous title that doubles as an explainer for anyone who’s blissfully unaware of the Toobin saga: Toobin masturbated on camera during a Zoom meeting with colleagues and got fired. Now, I assume choking the chicken in front of coworkers is a firing offense at most reputable companies, but the Toobin incident requires a 10K-word rehab tour in the “paper of record” because reasons:

Now that name [Toobin] was a punchline, a headline, a hashtag (#MeToobin) — and a point of debate. For as many people were excoriating Mr. Toobin for lewd and inappropriate behavior in a virtual workplace, others were thinking, or even saying, “there but for the grace of God go I,” acutely conscious of all the private or potentially embarrassing moments they’d stolen in this odd new zone where we now meet our colleagues.

The false equivalence in that sentence is absurd, mind-boggling and daft. It’s also insulting to the hundreds of millions of professionals who’ve managed to keep working during the pandemic without “accidentally” jerking off in front of their colleagues.

I’ll believe our elite media is learning when they can resist the urge to convert literal wankers into tragic heroes. Meanwhile, here’s a clip that better represents the dislocation of our Zoom-haunted world:

Open thread.

Reader Interactions

169Comments

  1. 1.

    Major Major Major Major

    Screw him and his enablers. Metaphorically.

    Feels like I spend all day standing up and eating with my webcam off. Fortunately, I’ve been in a satellite office for two years, and am very used to remote work. There’s also only three of us on the team out here, and we are all used to working from home.

    Not once, ever, have I felt compelled to whip it out. I feel bad enough when I haven’t showered. This isn’t a difficult concept.

  2. 2.

    Boris Rasputin (the evil twin)

    Thank you, Betty. That video was beautiful.

    My brother Grigori asked me what I want for Christmas. We agreed we want Rush Limbaugh to live to see the inauguration, and before he can go on the air, die by spontaneous combustion.

    Hey, a pair of insane, alcoholic Staretses can dream.

  7. 7.

    Major Major Major Major

    We’re moving next month! Down two floors and to the right. North-facing, street view, sixth floor, not a heavily trafficked street. Bigger unit, in better shape. Should be an easy move. Samwise will be happy about the view.

  8. 8.

    gratuitous

    One response to the Breea Willingham tweet: “Maybe back in April, nowadays I just don’t even pretend.”

    As for Toobin, what is there to say? I have a copy of his book about the 2000 election debacle “Too Close to Call,” but I’ve never been able to finish it because when you know how it ends, it’s just too depressing. Now I’m never going to read it through. I have no idea why the Times decided his career needed a post mortem, but it makes me wonder if this isn’t the first faltering step on the road to rehabilitation for Toobin? If so, it needs to be stopped, and that right quick.

  9. 9.

    Tony Jay

    So, hang on, is the writer of that FTFNYT piece genuinely trying to suggest that the mass of people aware that Toobin had been fired for sexually gratifying himself on a group Zoom call was evenly split between people saying they disapproved and other people who sympathised because they themselves were always furtively masturbating in front of their co-workers?

    That’s revealing.

  10. 10.

    Leto

    @gratuitous:

    but it makes me wonder if this isn’t the first faltering step on the road to rehabilitation for Toobin?

    Because if it can happen to him, it can happen to any one of them!!! *hysterical screaming*

    They really will look out for one another and do their best to facilitate rehabilitation so they can be eagerly welcome back to the grift fold/ “polite” society. Mos Eisley is a veritable Shangri-La compared to that cesspit.

  11. 11.

    Boris Rasputin (the evil twin)

    @Tony Jay:  That’s revealing.

    I’d prefer not to dwell on the details, lest we all find ourselves plagued with nightmares.

  12. 12.

    Nicole

    Ugh. There are a lot, a LOT of creepy men out in positions of power. And I just don’t know what happens in their brains to make them think, “This is okay.” And then people who like what those men do for their day jobs try to defend them.

    Don’t whip anything out at work! Don’t pinch women’s bottoms when you’re posing for pictures with them! It’s not that difficult! And the rest of us, don’t brush it off as, “Well, it’s not Harvey Weinstein-level bad.” That’s not the point. Less awful =/= okay.

  14. 14.

    dmsilev

    Normal in the Zoom era: Having a coworker’s cat make a cameo appearance or hearing their kid doing band practice in the background. Not normal: pulling a Toobin.

  16. 16.

    RandomMonster

    I always act as if my work laptop camera is on. Like when handing a firearm, assume it’s loaded.

  17. 17.

    The Very Reverend Crimson Fire of Compassion

    I’m sorry.  I’m still trying to wrap my head around the “there but for the grace of God” line.  Is this a common thing?  I’ve taught middle-school special education and college classes, tutored, counseled and attended innumerable mind-numbing meetings via google meet and zoom, and never once has it crossed my mind to masturbate during the proceedings.  Who gets aroused in that setting?  Why?  Is this like, a flasher thing?  I just . . . why?

  19. 19.

    scav

    The horror! The Horror! There are consequences even for journalists! Haul out the sackcloth, ululate, and declaim digitally about the endtimes on every opinion page!

  21. 21.

    sdhays

    @Tony Jay: That was my reaction too. It’s not that what he did was embarrassing. Suppose he went to the bathroom or was changing his clothes and accidentally showed little Toobin on camera. That would be embarrassing and disgusting, but not necessarily a firing offense.

    The firing offense was that he was jacking off during a professional call. If you’re sympathizing with that, then…you really need to reevaluate how you handle your professional calls.

  23. 23.

    dmsilev

    ?NEW On a Senate R call just now, @senatemajldr, @RoyBlunt & @SenJohnThune all pleaded with Senate Rs to NOT object to the election results Jan. 6. MCCONNEL: it’s a “terrible vote” for the GOP. They’d have to vote it down, which makes it seem like they are anti Trump, he said— Jake Sherman (@JakeSherman) December 15, 2020

    What are the odds that a Ron Johnson or a Rand Paul forces the vote regardless?

  29. 29.

    Tony Jay

    @Boris Rasputin (the evil twin):

    The writer doesn’t really give us that option. We’ve all got to think good and hard about how unfair it was that Toobin got yanked from his comfortable perch just because a lot of hypocritical wankers used their combined pull to finish off a good man.

    I’ll get my coat.

  31. 31.

    Elie

     

    I don’t understand the whole Jeffrey Toobin incident… How did he not know, even if he thought he was on another site at the same time?  Where is his head?  Obviously not on work.  Makes you wonder how often he did this…  Crazee world, no?  I always thought of him as kind of pompous,smug and light on real content beyond believing in his own specialness.  Yep the goddess Nemesis (she carries out punishment for hubris according to Greek mythology), strikes at her own timing…

  32. 32.

    mad citizen

    @Major Major Major Major: Of course!  Because he’s from Indiana, the Crossroads of America don’t you know.  From South Bend, which is in the north part of my beloved Hoosier state.

    I told my wife about the Toobin thing and she had no idea of the incident.    Disgust, and after 5 minutes tells me she wishes I had not told her about the story.  I said I thought it was common knowledge.  Normies!  Guess we are in the know here.

     

    And yes, not that hard–opps, wrong word–not that difficult to behave.

  35. 35.

    trollhattan

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Related, I read that pillows are being arranged for assuring Mrs. Turtle has a soft landing following her Transportation stint.

    U.S. Secretary of Transportation Elaine Chao could still have a post in Washington, once President-elect Joe Biden takes office next month.

    President Donald Trump announced on Tuesday his intent to nominate Chao, the wife of U.S. Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, R-Louisville, to be a member of the Board of Trustees for the John F. Kennedy Center for the Performing Arts.

    Chao also served as labor secretary from 2001-2009 under former President George W. Bush. Other posts in Washington include deputy transportation secretary and director of the Peace Corps, all for President George H. W. Bush, as well as being appointed by President Ronald Reagan to the Federal Maritime Commission, which she later chaired. She also spent four years as president of the United Way of America.

    She would be one of 36 trustees who are appointed by the president and was one of five people nominated on Tuesday.

  37. 37.

    mad citizen

    @Yutsano: It would have been nice if he had ran for Senate, but my state is about #5 to 10 in the line of idiocracy states, so it would have been a difficult road for him.  There are about 6  blue counties and 86 red counties.

  45. 45.

    Cameron

    Jeffrey, Jeffrey, Jeffrey – you’re supposed to know something about the law.  When a Zoom-bro asks “What’s in your briefs,” he’s asking what’s in your legal papers.  He’s not asking you to whip it out and whip it good.

  46. 46.

    Leto

    @Nicole: this dovetails in with the dumbshit English professor who insisted Dr Jill Biden go by “Toots”:

    Professors Sexually Harassed Me for 10 Years, You’re Goddamn Right I Go By ‘Doctor’

    – The same professor who presented me with two of my married male colleagues at a party a few weeks later and asked which one of them I would let “eat my pussy in hell.” Both of those colleagues laughed it off and had book deals by graduation.

    – The same professor who told a story to my classmates at a party in his home about a woman touching him inappropriately. To illustrate the inappropriate touching, he massaged my shoulders. When I told him I do not like to be touched, he threw a fit and made a show of doing the same thing to a male classmate in order to prove the touching was not sexist.

    It’s a power imbalance problem and it requires constant work to break because it’s been a part of our society/culture for forever. Also going to serve up Kimberly Guilfoyle and Clarence Thomas to this shitshow because it’s pervasive everywhere.

  47. 47.

    catclub

    @dmsilev: What are the odds that a Ron Johnson or a Rand Paul forces the vote regardless?

     

    low.  those guys a have pretty well tuned sense of self preservation.

  48. 48.

    Tony Jay

    @sdhays:

    @waspuppet:

    Reminds me of that fantastic bit Patrick Stewart did in Extras, playing a version of himself who was an out and out sexual deviant and voyeur.

    “It was too late, because I’d seen everything.”

    As far as complicated social mores go this one is easy. Don’t crack one off on camera, even if you’ve been asked to. Simple, easily achieved and cuts down on all kinds of problems. And laundry.

  49. 49.

    clay

    @Major Major Major Major: But… but…. but Raaaahhhhhhmmmmm!

    How will I stay angry at Biden if he doesn’t pick the guy who I worked myself into a lather over about him picking even though it was all baseless rumor in the first place?

  50. 50.

    Jeffro

    Betty, my kids LOVE that teacher Zoom clip – thanks!

    (Mrs. Fro thought it was real at first, LOL)

  51. 51.

    Jeffro

    Hey how about that Amanda Chase (GOP candidate for VA governor) calling for ‘martial law’ in response to trumpov’s er um not winning?

    don’t every change, VA GOP (and I mean that sincerely!)

  53. 53.

    Suzanne

    There’s forgetting you’re on camera and picking a booger, and then there is jacking off on a Zoom call, and there is a universe in between.

    Howev: Buttigieg for SecTrans! IT’S INFRASTRUCTURE WEEK, MOTHERFUCKERS!

  54. 54.

    Yutsano

    @catclub: Rand is a no. He can be an ass, but he really doesn’t care enough about Drumpf.

    Johnson however…he might think he’ll need Dolt45 voters to survive either his Senate election or his governor run, should he choose to go for that. And he’s just dumb enough to think he can walk that tightrope in golf spikes.

  57. 57.

    Elie

    This is a little interregnum until Joe is sworn in.  Rest up. Things look shitty right now in terms of what he is inheriting, but you really have NO IDEA how bad it is in some of our federal agencies.  Shit hasn’t been enforced and staffing not completed in numerous areas of the federal government for over four years!

    I have a friend who works with enforcing the regulations that monitor labs that do testing of all sorts.  One of these involve monitoring the labs that read pap smears for women to detect cancer, hopefully early.  Before CLIA (the reg that enforced quality control), a bunch of these path labs were cutting all kinds of corners to make money, resulting in misread slides and more importantly, undiagnosed cervical and other cancers. CLIA made them do righteous training and testing and monitored that the right protocols were carried out.  The delay in inspection would mean some number of poor outcomes from a cancer that no woman or very few women should die of any more.  Instead, there have been very few inspections of these path labs during the last four years.

    You also oughta see what they’ve done with mental illness

  58. 58.

    Leto

    @trollhattan: If you’re appointed by the president does that 1) make it a political appointment that 2) can be reversed by future presidents? They spent the past four years burning everything to the ground, fuck them for trying to not be held accountable for it.

    @Major Major Major Major: @Yutsano: I think this would be great experience for him at the federal level (combined with local/state level leadership experience) that could position him for a future Senate run, or other higher office aspirations. And it’s a cabinet level position, nothing to sneeze at there.

  62. 62.

    germy

    Gladwell’s response was amazing.  Gladwell pretends that Toobin was punished for just self pleasure, rather than self pleasure in front of a non-consenting audience.

  64. 64.

    mrmoshpotato

    Civil Assholes’ War!

    Once the party of Reagan's never-speak-ill-of-another-Republican credo, the current wave of GOP officeholders eating their own is now providing sentient Americans with the best kind of post-election pornography. t.co/jYX9fMogY8— David Simon (@AoDespair) December 15, 2020

  65. 65.

    Captain C

    I have by now have had dozens of Zoom and Zoom-style meetings since the start of the pandemic, and not once have I felt the need to Toobin myself (go Toobin’?).  There have perhaps been a few where I wished I had some recreational substances to relieve the tedium.

     

    Edited to add bad pun

  66. 66.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Major Major Major Major:

    When we lived in NYC (14th and 5th) we moved from an 8th floor one-bedroom to a 14th floor two bedroom. I promise you, the move was very nearly as challenging and exhausting as moving to ten states away.

    Good luck! Glad Samwise will have a nice view.

  67. 67.

    Dan B

    @Yutsano: Pete would have better luck running for Mayor in Spokane Valley.  Indiana had the largest Klan in the country at one time.  Pence is a centrist in Indiana – a “nice” Christianist and idiot, but centrist given the context.

  69. 69.

    Geminid

    @Yutsano: Indiana is a tough state for Democrats, but Joe Donnelly was Senator from 2012 to 2018. He lost reelection by about 6 points I think. The guy who beat him, Mike Braun, is up in 2024. Braun is dumber than a post. Maybe Buttigieg will give that seat a shot in 2024. He’ll have a good sense about whether it’s winnable.                                       In the meantime Buttegieg should be good at his new job. Infrastructure investment is an area where Biden may be able to get Republican buy in. We’ll sure need that kind of counter-cyclical spending. I heard that as mayor Buttegieg had good working relations with Republican state officials, including Mike Pence.

  70. 70.

    Elie

    @Elie:

    My point is, who cares about Jeffrey Toobin and his bullshit?  We have a load of shit ahead.  This is fluff entertainment.  I could give a shit about his wankering ass.  He deserves what he got — it was all his own actions that brought him this outcome.  Unlike all the innocents who will suffer from the effects of this horrible administration…

  71. 71.

    Tom Levenson

    So. I have lots of thoughts about the Times article, but I’ll leave just one here: What’s with using photograph’s Toobin’s wife and his mistress? They’re being deployed as props of uncertain meaning, and are, in essence, being publicly outed/shamed by association for no more than shits and giggles.

    Note: neither image was taken for this article, and hence is used here with the foreknowledge and consent of either woman.  Seems invasive, best–and is once again a subversion of the women in a man’s life as derivatives of him, and not actual people in themselves.

    Fuckit.

  72. 72.

    Major Major Major Major

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    I promise you, the move was very nearly as challenging and exhausting as moving to ten states away.

    Having done so two years ago, I’m pretty sure this isn’t true? Next month will look more like “moving some books on a dolly, putting some clothes in garbage bags” and less like “boxing up everything I own in a way that will survive months in storage, getting two street permits for moving trucks, and having my shit stolen”

    ETA our furniture consists of a bed, a desk, three chairs, three bookshelves, and a lamp

  73. 73.

    Leto

    @Elie: Michael Lewis covered part of this in his book, “The Fifth Risk”. It was a good book detailing what you’re talking about through various different agencies.

  74. 74.

    mrmoshpotato

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Feels like I spend all day standing up and eating with my webcam off. 

    I had my camera and mic off for most of the Thanksgiving late Zoom meetup, because I doubt all of you wanted to see me eating pizza.

    It’s really just courteous.

    Oh, and kids, don’t jerk it on Zoom.

  76. 76.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @dmsilev:

    What are the odds that a Ron Johnson or a Rand Paul forces the vote regardless?

    I was thinking Ted Cruz, but these guys are equally plausible.

    (Speaking of Rand Paul, I have a vague memory that his father was hospitalised with Covid-19 a few weeks ago. I guess he got better? Haven’t heard anything since, and someone would have mentioned it if he had died, I suppose.)

  78. 78.

    mad citizen

    @Geminid: I also think Braun is dumb as a post–at least that’s what he has displayed as he kneeled down before trump these last few years.  Yet I read about him one night–would you believe he has a Harvard degree?  I enjoy tweeting at my two senators.  The other one went to the Naval Academy.  Neither show much intelligence.  Braun was saying just last week that the Supremes should hear the Texas case.

  79. 79.

    germy

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    I didn’t know Ron Paul had COVID.

    A few weeks ago Ron had a stroke during a remote TV broadcast.  Lost control of his speech before the camera cut away.

  82. 82.

    scav

    @Elie: Probably the only people that really care are those journalists now opining. It’s a bit of a closed, self-referential terrarium they’ve got going.

  85. 85.

    Darkrose

    I’ve been actively using Zoom for three years now, including doing Zoom training sessions daily for three semesters pre-pandemic. I have never once felt the need to wank while in a meeting because I’m supposed to be at work. I feel guilty when I show up in my pajamas, even though my pj top is basically a t-shirt. Fuck Jeffrey Toobin and his entitled bullshit, and FTFNYT for trying to normalize it.

  87. 87.

    Leto

    @zhena gogolia: You mean you had two functioning brain cells, and a basic understanding of how cameras/mic’s work? I feel like the bar for basic human decency is subterranean at this point…

  88. 88.

    germy

    I like the way Toobin’s defenders in the article try to portray him as [orchestral music cue] an indispensible man.

    Rather than what he is, a glib commenter and writer about legal matters.

    He criticized OJ Simpson’s lawyers for playing the race card.

    I think it would have been malpractice for Simpson’s lawyers not to at least mention, even in passing, the LAPD’s  history in framing Black men.

    But Toobin is portrayed as some kind of vital voice our culture needs.

  91. 91.

    Leto

    @mad citizen: people have a tendency to shit on community/public colleges, but I feel like we have an overwhelming amount of evidence that “elite” colleges have produced some of the worst people. I know the two don’t go hand in hand, but I feel like every Barack Obama we get like 10 of these douchebags. Maybe one day someone will analyze that data set.

  92. 92.

    Steve in the ATL

    @Tony Jay: years ago on a snowy, icy Sunday, the wife and I watched “Napoleon Dynamite”, then binge-watched “Extras”, and closed out the evening with “Borat”.

    That was WAY too much cringing in one day. But “Extras” was our favorite of them all. So many great cameos.

  96. 96.

    Mike in NC

    @trollhattan:

    This circles back to the vile Trump shit that’s been passed off as “locker room banter.”

    I’d bet those locker rooms at Bedminster and Mar-A-Lago often featured unlimited hookers and blow. After all, the initiation fees are six figures!

  97. 97.

    different-church-lady

    The odd thing is he never seemed nuts. When Farwell fell, for example, it seemed like it was just the inevitable inevitablating. But Toobin? Dude, I can’t imagine going that far off my rocker no matter how much rum I drank before the meeting.

  98. 98.

    Kent

    @Major Major Major Major:

    I can support Mayor Pete for Transportation. I had him pegged for Commerce, which is a more techie-agency. But DOT is OK. The main issues with DOT are going to be bending the funding formulas away from highways and towards transit, increased fuel efficiency for vehicles, and all the transportation-related climate issues.   DOT is likely to be a leading agency on climate.  Or it can be.

    In the past I think Transportation, VA, and DOD were the agencies most likely to get a token Republican. I can get behind Pete about 1000x more than Ray LaHood who was Obama’s token GOP cabinet appointee.

  99. 99.

    different-church-lady

    @Darkrose: My rule: I wear the same thing for the Zoom meeting as I would for a physically-present meeting. Than includes the area below the desk. (Okay, maybe I’m barefoot, but that’s it at the most.)

  100. 100.

    feebog

    I have been using Zoom for large meetings (30 to 60) and Cisco Webex for work. Both platforms make it easy to participate with the camera OFF. In other words, if Toobin absolutely, positively could not wait until the end of the meeting to jerk off, he could have done so without detection.

  101. 101.

    Lyrebird

    @Tom Levenson:

    Right as usual.

    And I suspect the answer to your question goes right alongside Josie’s comment:

    @Josie:

    I think that sentence says more about the author of that piece than it does about Zoom users at large.

    The kind of creep who thinks “aww poor Toobin” is the kind of writer  – or photo editor or whatever – who thinks it’s fine to drag them into this mess.

     

    @Suzanne totally said what I was thinking, only better:

    There’s forgetting you’re on camera and picking a booger, and then there is jacking off on a Zoom call, and there is a universe in between.

    Yuck.

  104. 104.

    germy

    @Kent:  The main issues with DOT are going to be bending the funding formulas away from highways and towards transit, increased fuel efficiency for vehicles, and all the transportation-related climate issues.

    This is my hope.  Sensible transportation policy.

  105. 105.

    Kent

    @different-church-lady:@Darkrose: My rule: I wear the same thing for the Zoom meeting as I would for a physically-present meeting. Than includes the area below the desk. (Okay, maybe I’m barefoot, but that’s it at the most.)

    I wear khakis and dark polo or broadcloth shirts pretty universally (teacher uniform) at home during the work week so I’m never not zoom-ready.  Same clothes I wore while teaching in person.  Shrug.  It’s not really that hard.

  106. 106.

    Steve in the ATL

    @Leto:

     

    people have a tendency to shit on community/public colleges

    I thought the TV show “Community” changed all that

  107. 107.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Different people, different amounts of stuff, different experiences. Part of it could have been that we did the in-building move on our own, whereas IBM and GTE respectively organised our long-distance moves.

  108. 108.

    jonas

    Not having followed Toobingate too closely, I’m wondering, did he basically just whip it out in front of everybody during a Zoom meeting and start going to town? Or did he think the meeting was over or something, so it was safe to engage in a little private stress relief?

  110. 110.

    Calouste

    @mad citizen: You can pretty safely assume that if a politician or someone in the political sphere is as dumb as a post, they have a degree from Harvard. People don’t suddenly get smarter because their parents can write larger checks. The power of Harvard of course is that those people believe they are smart, and a lot of other people believe that about them as well.

  111. 111.

    mrmoshpotato

    @Suzanne:

    Howev: Buttigieg for SecTrans! IT’S INFRASTRUCTURE WEEK, MOTHERFUCKERS! 

    We’re gonna need an Infrastructure Month for all of the shit these shitstains let break over the years.

  113. 113.

    PJ

     

     

    @Steve in the ATL: I am not a big Ricky Gervais fan, but the Extras episode with Bowie killed it.

    Gervais asks Bowie, whom he has just met, to sing an impromptu song.

    So Bowie sits at the piano and starts playing and singing: “Pudgy little useless man, why do you exist? ”

    Stops playing.  “No, there’s something wrong about that.  What if I try a Bb?”

    Singing slightly different tune: “Pudgy little useless man . . .”

    Stops.  “Oh, yes, that’s much better.”

    (I paraphrase from memory, but it’s Bowie’s delivery that totally sells it.)

  114. 114.

    Geminid

    @mad citizen: A certain kind of intelligence can get you into Harvard. But good judgement and good sense seem to be distributed independently of IQ. And Braun may just play dumber in public than he actually is. Indiana has trended red the last couple decades, but trends can be dynamic, not just linear, and Braun may be beatable in 2024. I think he will at least be easier to beat than Todd Young, who is up in 2022.

  115. 115.

    Calouste

    Would Mayor Pete be the first same-sex married Cabinet Secretary? Maybe even the first openly LGBT one?

  116. 116.

    mad citizen

    @Calouste: Yes, agree with this and the two other posts.  I also don’t subscribe that any institution confers smarts onto anyone.  Was just thinking about Kamala’s educational path.

  118. 118.

    Ken

    @dmsilev: What are the odds that a Ron Johnson or a Rand Paul forces the vote regardless?

    If they do, I hope Democrats take notes, since it will mean that it is possible to force a vote even if the Majority Leader doesn’t want one.  Though if the process requires a majority vote of the chamber, McConnell + Thune + Blunt should be able to prevent it – I can’t see any of the Democrats signing on.

  120. 120.

    SiubhanDuinne

    No openly LGBT person has served as president or vice president of the United States or as a justice on the Supreme Court of the United States or as a secretary in the Cabinet of the United States. Richard Grenell, however, briefly served in 2020 as acting Director of National Intelligence, which is a United States cabinet-level position.

    ETA source: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_first_LGBT_holders_of_political_offices_in_the_United_States

  121. 121.

    Steve in the ATL

    1. Harvard: both the smartest and the stupidest people I know have degrees from there
    2. Country club golfers: most are not vile in that way historically, but so many are Trumpalos now that it may be true
    3. Zoom:

    It was post election litigation strategy, that they were talking about

    hey now–save that kind of talk for Balloon Juice After Dark!

  124. 124.

    M31

    KEEP YOUR TOOB IN,

    NOT YOUR TOOB OUT.

    (New HR posters brought to you by the Office of Institutional Equity and the Don’t Be a Piece of Shit Board)

  126. 126.

    debbie

    @Nicole:

    Don’t tell a young interviewee how much you enjoyed working with her recently deceased father on statewide advertising promotions and then start fondling her breasts.

  127. 127.

    Leto

    @Steve in the ATL: The Pillow Fort Ken Burns-esque Civil War episodes… omg… or the Paintball episodes… I swear if my wife’s community college, where she works, was like that I’d be an eternal student :P

  131. 131.

    Darkrose

    @different-church-lady: I used to do that, but I’ve gotten lax during the pandemic because this isn’t normal, and I’m too exhausted to try to act like it is. I don’t have a proper office; I’m on my bed with a back pillow and my laptop desk. My cats wander through, and these days, I’m usually wrapped up in my slanket because the temperature control in our apartment is shit. I usually don’t bother to wear a bra, since I’m on a laptop and my boobs really don’t show. Having to wear a bra for 10 hours a day, five days a week is honestly going to be one of the most difficult parts of going back to work in person.

  133. 133.

    Steeplejack (phone)

    @Betty Cracker:

    LOL. I was thinking of that Willingham video as I read the post, and then I scrolled down.

    ETA: Unicorn cat is not amused.

  137. 137.

    sab

    @Calouste: I always thought the distinguishing feature of Harvard grads (law, mba) is they are encouraged to be insanely competitive, so in any normal workplace they are simply toxic.

  140. 140.

    Capri

    @mad citizen:  My read is that Braun is a pretty smart guy. He has to polish Trump’s nob to stay viable in Indiana so he’s a gutless weasel. But quietly under the radar he’s working on climate change issues and health reform. If the GOP wasn’t a crazy cult he’s been seen as a reasonable person.

    As for the Toobin thing – I think a great many people whack off in front of their computers. The man I work with who I would guess to be the most likely culprit for doing this in his office (based on his creepy, harassing behavior in public) put tape over his camera so ” they can’t spy on him.” I once got a spam email claiming they had taped me pleasuring myself in front of the computer and if I didn’t send them a large sum of money they’d email the tape to everyone on my contact list. It was nonsense in my case, but they wouldn’t do it if they didn’t get a lot of hits.

  141. 141.

    PJ

    @Nicole:

     

    @debbie: Toobin is a mediocre guy with a media presence.  I’ve never heard him say or write anything particularly insightful, and I’ve never heard anyone say that they thought he was particularly insightful.  But there are a surfeit of mediocre guys with a media presence (cf. Gladwell), and I’m guessing they support Toobin because they know the only thing that prevents themselves from being discarded like he was is their own media presence.

    But since the bar is so low to get one of these jobs, I don’t understand why these guys can’t do the bare minimum (ahem) in terms of acceptable behavior to make sure they keep them.  (Of course I know why, they think they are all exceptional geniuses for whom exceptions should be made.)

  142. 142.

    PJ

    @Steve in the ATL: Around the time of the election in 2016, I met a guy who had done a job for a CEO of a major corporation, whom he thought, because he was white, rich and Republican, would be a Trump supporter.  But he asked the guy, and it turns out that he couldn’t stand Trump and would never vote for him; they had played golf together, and Trump had cheated.

    They may be a dwindling number, but there are still rich, powerful, white men out there who love tax cuts but for whom cheating at golf is beyond the pale.

  145. 145.

    SFBayAreaGal

    @Leto: The area I live in has three community colleges within 5 to 19 miles of each other. Easy access to them. Each one offers diffetent areas of study and fun classes to take.

    I am looking forward to being able to go back to the classroom when it’s safe for everyone.

  148. 148.

    Suzanne

    @Darkrose:

    Having to wear a bra for 10 hours a day, five days a week is honestly going to be one of the most difficult parts of going back to work in person. 

    Oh yeah. Fuck. It’s gonna be terrible.

  150. 150.

    Tony Jay

    @Steve in the ATL:

    I haven’t rewatched it in years but yes, so many hillarities. A lot of British-centric ones at the start (Les Dennis – “If it’s up there I’ll give you the money myself.” And the sublime self-skewering of Ross Kemp’s ‘hardman’ image – “Do you know what S.A.S. stands for?”) but once it got a reputation they were queuing up to play versions of themselves.

    Bowie humiliating Gervaise’s character in the bar. Stewart’s pervert. De Niro with the cheeky pen.

    Right. I’m going to have to watch that show again, despite the frequent cringing (I feel you there).

  151. 151.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    Toobin masturbated on camera during a Zoom meeting with colleagues and got fired

    ROFL, talking about sticking one’s dick in it.

    Still, one would think if this was a one off (stop that snickering) because the guy was at home so much he forgot this wasn’t the World War Craft forum his employer would just tell Todd just cut it out.  Or does Todd have a history?

  153. 153.

    Tony Jay

    @Juju:

    Cole handles my tab for accidental spray damage. Just drop him an e-mail with your details and don’t forget, open with an insult and make it ALL CAPS. 8-)

  154. 154.

    Brachiator

    When an elite media figure’s gross behavior results in a rare moment of personal accountability, his fellow aristocrats are irresistibly compelled to convert the tawdry tale into a Greek tragedy.

    Damn. Missed this thread earlier.

    I don’t think what Toobin did was a big deal. He apparently did not know he was being viewed.

    Anybody who says that there are ironclad behavior rules for remote work is making things up.

    Less famous people have accidentally filmed themselves using the toilet while on a Zoom call. Other mishaps have happened.

    Americans’ fetish for puritanical behavior rears its ugly head again.

  157. 157.

    ballerat

    @Elie: Where is his head?

    Damn you Tony Jay. Can’t read poor Elie’s straight-up comment without a pervy double entendre popping up.

  158. 158.

    laura

    @Brachiator: Toobin’s behavior is a sex crime. He committed the crime while “at work” but well beyond the scope of employment. He deserved to be placed on administrative leave until the New Yorker could go through the process of dismissal for cause and cash him out, or accept his resignation as part of a settlement agreement.

    My first couple of years as a Union business agent were an unending stream of disciplinary actions related to sexual activity on the job. So much porn, so much masterbation, so many handsy pushy huggy boner contact. Silkwood showers required after so much evidence of conscious transgressive behavior. Included in the statutory list of standard charges was theft of time added along with discourteous treatment, and prohibiting offensive conduct against protected classes. It was painful sobering work and the worst was when someone knew they would have to explain the unpaid suspension or dismissal to a spouse and the why’s and how’s of it – some just completely fell apart emotionally and others just cried and asked if I could explain to their wives for them.

    Jeffrey Toobin is yet another of many, many mostly men who are thrilled to engage in sexually explicit activity in the workplace and are then surprised when their conduct has inconvenient consequences. Excusing or minimizing his behavior to return him to a status he neither deserves or respects, denies every single qualified striver of a merit-based opportunity and that’s the bullshit that stokes the fires of Villago Delenda Est. Sure, it’s not the most pressing story in the big scheme of things, but it’s a tale as old as time and one familiar to just about every women in every workplace ever – and some guys.

  159. 159.

    ballerat

    @different-church-lady: My rule too.

    How difficult is this to not play with yourself while at work? “Gosh! Look at the time! It’s nearly 10:30….<zip>…time for my wank break!”

    Fuck Toobin. So unprofessional. So icky. He deserved to be fired and ostracized. And it creeps me out how the NYT tries to defend and mainstream that behavior. Makes me wonder how many more of these entitled media shits are into doing that.

  161. 161.

    ballerat

    @laura:

    asked if I could explain to their wives for them

    Wow. A contemptible weasel cherry on top of a shitty dirtbag sundae.

    Still blown away by how many do not think it’s a bad idea to wank or watch porn at work.

  162. 162.

    laura

    @ballerat:  it’s not just that. Here is the point:
    It is the thrill of performing a sexual act or activity with a captive or unknowing audience AND the thrill of the risk of being caught performing a sexual act or activity. It is not inadvertent or an accident-it is performative. Jeffery Toobin’s conduct was so much naked under the raincoat flasher business. He felt entirely comfortable with the risk of masturbating in the presence of his coworkers without consent because he’s a special important guy.

  164. 164.

    Brachiator

    @laura:

    Toobin was at home and supposedly did not know that he was observed.

    Anyone claiming that this was unreservedly “the workplace” is making things up.

    People doing remote work have been known to dress only from the waist up. People have had slip ups where they have taken their laptops with them into the bathroom.

    Hell, I would like to see the rule that states that a person cannot continue a smartphone conversation while in a restroom. I have been grossed out by people continuing to talk business while entering a restroom. I am grossed out by people texting from a restroom.

    ETA: Toobin may have felt comfortable because he was at home, not because he felt that he was important.

  165. 165.

    J R in WV

    @Tom Levenson:

    Seems invasive, best–and is once again a subversion of the women in a man’s life as derivatives of him, and not actual people in themselves.

    Fuckit.

    Well said, Tom. Despicable coverage of a despicable person by other despicable reporters.

    To quote a great jackal:

    “Fuck ’em” all ~!!~

  166. 166.

    ballerat

    @laura: I understand why they get thrills out of it. I guess the part I had trouble wrapping my head around what just how fucking entitled these special important guys must think they are.

    That, and there are so many of them. By your experiences and by the NYT’s defense of Toobin, there are far more than I would have ever guessed.

  167. 167.

    ballerat

    @Brachiator: I got to disagree with that. If I am working at home, I am actually at work. It is the workplace now.

    But I do get it that home and work can become more easily entangled — as we see with kids, pets, shots of dirty laundry etc accidentally getting into the zoom.

    I do my video conferencing in a designated work-only room in my home. But I once in the past had my own business and so for tax reasons I had this kind of separation of spaces and later with the dawn of the video conferencing/wfh era I realized it can have other benefits. It’s still not perfect but it can really help with defining our physical and above all mental spaces we inhabit (or should inhabit) when we are “at work” and “at home”.

    It also helps to keep to a schedule. 8-5 “I’m at work now”. Then I’m done for the day and after 5, “I’m at home now”. Mixing them up also breaks down boundaries and so people never can shut off work. Not healthy, IMO.

    I would like to see the rule that states that a person cannot continue a smartphone conversation while in a restroom.

    I’m totally down with that. Both for hygiene’s sake and for respecting the privacy of others in the bathroom, as well as respecting the dignity of the person you are talking to, even if you don’t have any.

  168. 168.

    Brachiator

    @ballerat:

    I got to disagree with that. If I am working at home, I am actually at work. It is the workplace now.

    I totally understand where you are coming from. I have been working remotely for a few years.  But my home is still not my workplace. Not entirely.  For one, as an employee, I get no tax deductions for any of my work related expenses.

    And here is a very recent issue that still grills me a bit. I did a remote training session earlier this week as part of my job. The person conducting the training wanted to see everyone’s faces, part of team building, but also to see who might not be paying attention.

    I begged off, blaming a buggy camera. There was absolutely no reason this person had to see me. I had not anticipated this and past training sessions I only had to have a good microphone. I am a guy and had not shaved in the past two weeks and I was wearing some scraggly looking comfortable sweat clothes.

    At one point during the session, I was picking my nose. Sorry. Possibly gross. I would never do something like this in a conference room meeting. I might have done it on camera. But the plain fact is that remote work is a hybrid situation.

    I do have an area that I use exclusively for business, but I don’t always use that area when I am doing long webinars and certain types of Zoom meetings. I might even have a class of wine, which I would never do at work.

    I would absolutely avoid behavior that I thought might be impolite and certainly would avoid behavior that might be offensive. But I have seen and heard of all kinds of behavior, usually accidental, that probably would not happen at work just because we are used to behaving differently at work.

    I think we are developing a new set of rules for remote work. But I don’t think those rules have been clearly established yet.

  169. 169.

    MaryRC

    @laura: Well, he claims he didn’t know he was visible to the Zoom meeting while he was switched to another call.  Make of that what you will.

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