In case you’ve forgotten. pic.twitter.com/YQLgZYbxk9
— Charlie Sykes (@SykesCharlie) January 6, 2024
🌼 If you don’t want to click on the twitter link.
🌼
There is definitely not agreement within the ranks of the twitter legal eagles re: how the Supreme Court might rule in the 14th Amendment case.
I’m getting kind of tired of the folks who want to ignore the constitution and make up stuff that has to happen before the plain words of the constitution get to count. Whether we like the result of following the constitution or not, I believe that following it is the right thing to do.
🌼
Mike S
BJ had a video up of Ashli Babbitt unhinged rant in her car right after the insurrection but I can’t find it. Anyone have the link?
Baud
@Mike S:
After? She was dead after?
Baud
Could have ended right there.
WaterGirl
@Mike S: I saw that video at the time. Assuming you mean that you saw the video right after the insurrection. At first I read it as an unhinged rant after the insurrection, which of course wasn’t possible, since she had been shot.
That day feels like yesterday. So strange.
Marleedog
@Mike S:
Ashlii died during the insurrection, do you mean her mother?
WaterGirl
@Baud: Just a little sentence construction issue, I believe. I had the same first thought as you did!
WaterGirl
@Mike S: I believe this is the video.
Mike S
@WaterGirl: yes, that is the one. Thanks.
Sorry everyone else for my unclear question. I blame my lack of glasses while typing the question.
Marleedog
Lost the edit widow
Her unhinged rant was before Jan.6.
This is it, i think
https://thespacecoastrocket.com/ashli-babbits-angry-video-rant-before-being-shot-and-killed-storming-the-capital-building-yesterday/
A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan)
I encountered a quote on “Better Call Saul” which I think fits the issues of Trump, the Constitution, etc. right now: Let Justice be done though the Heavens fall. It goes back to Lord Mansfield in 1772
ETA: I interpret this to mean, Do the right thing, and fuck the possible political consequences. Good advice.
Bill Arnold
For Baud, a D.J. Trump “Sir” story involving pants:
[my transcript]
A few possibilities (there are more):
– “Sir” is really asking Trump if he puts his pants on one leg at a time, like humans do.
– Projection. That is a confession that there is a diaper changer/Trump-pants-putter-on-er on DJT’s payroll.
Tony Jay
@Mike S:
I kind of like the idea of MAGAworld’s cut-rate Horst Wessel crawling back out of the Capitol through all the broken glass, splintered wood, smashed statuary and smeared shit left by her fellow traitors so that she could bleed out on the front seat of her 2008 Canyonero while vomiting up one last unhinged love letter to America’s Stench.
I mean, on a scale of Hero to Zero, how MAGAlicious would that be?
Raoul Paste
@A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan): I think that ““let Justice be done, though the heavens fall“ is in the Oliver Stone, movie JFK.
SFAW
@WaterGirl:
She
seemsseemed nice.Also: did you notice her “I am woke!” comment near the end of the rant? I hadn’t, previously. Maybe Ron DeathSantis was the one who actually put out a “hit” on her? [OK, maybe it was actually Casey, but still …]
A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan)
@Bill Arnold: I have read recently (on Instagram, so take it with a grain or more of salt), that Trump has a raging Adderall addiction, can’t control his poops, has to wear a diaper, and smells foul all the time. Supposedly reports of him smelling terrible go back to his time on The Apprentice. I put it down to wishful thinking, but this reported anecdote fits into the narrative. So it would be irresponsible not to speculate, eh?
Baud
@Bill Arnold:
Unlike with me, the world doesn’t want to see Trump without pants.
RevRick
@WaterGirl: Unhinged doesn’t quite do justice to her insane rant. The ironic thing is she is furious about the mess in America that was happening under Trump’s watch. But erasing the reality of 2020 is all part of GOP efforts to create their fantasy history.
Another Scott
Reposted from downstairs – TeriKanefield.com:
I agree with her that it’s not as clear as we would like.
And I agree with her that lawyers are taught to be able to argue every side of any issue.
The “who decides” question is a good one.
But it’s possible to overthink this stuff.
If “officers” who swore an oath to the Constitution broke that oath by insurrection, then surely the leader and instigator of that insurrection also broke his oath and should be under the same sanctioning language. I dunno why they took the President and VP out of the earlier draft language of the amendment. Maybe that would help clarify things…
FWIW.
Cheers,
Scott.
Suzanne
@Bill Arnold:
To be fair, I’ve seen many Trump supporters who make me wonder if they own a mirror. I can see that this might be an earnest question for some of them.
I haven’t driven down the Turnpike in a while. There was a farm on the south side whose owner decorated a hill on the property, just off to the side of the roadway, for Trump. It was, like, a Trump earthwork, spelling out his name in rocks. Because these are things that normal people do.
Dangerman
I think it’s becoming clear the Dude is seriously unwell in the head; I know, I know, always been the case, but he’s losing it.
Save us, Obi-wan Court, you’re our only hope.
gene108
Placing faith in this SCOTUS to do the right thing is a suckers bet.
A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan)
@Raoul Paste: Could be, if it originated with Lord Mansfield. I didn’t notice it in JFK, but it really struck me when I heard Saul Goodman say it, particularly with the air of quoting a well-known saying. So I imagine it is a well-known maxim in the legal community, although since IANAL, I have no idea really. But I really like it.
SFAW
@A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan):
“#TrumpSmells” is actually a thing. I first heard about it after Adam Kinzinger mentioned it somewhere, which then got picked up by various non-MSM outlets.
Suzanne
I should note…. I haven’t driven the eastern half of the Turnpike in a while. I drive the western part (up to Breezewood) fairly regularly. The Trump, uhhhh, mound is on the eastern side. Right after you get out of one of the tunnels. Can’t remember which one.
Mike S
It is awesome that she said “I am woke.” I did feel some compassion for her when I saw the unedited video of her being shot. The look of shock on her face as she faded away was extremely sad to me.
The Confederacy of National Socialists blames the left for her death but they are to blame. I have zero doubt that she had fox news on 24/7 and every station in her car was extremist hate radio. She wouldn’t be dead without joining that cult.
A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan)
@SFAW: OMG, it could actually be true? Ick.
noncarborundum
@A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan): It’s an English translation of the Latin maxim “fiat justitia ruat caelum”, which goes back at least to the 17th century. According to Wikipedia it can’t be traced directly to any classical source.
bbleh
@Suzanne: it’s still there. Flag on top.
But another thing I notice driving through MAGA Country to get to the Turnpike (specifically the Bedford Valley), ain’t but a VERY few TIFG house/lawn/whatever signs or banners out any more. The rocks might still be there, but almost all the other stuff has come down.
Mallard Filmore
@SFAW: Good thing Trump doesn’t fly commercial.
A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan)
@noncarborundum: Sounds like Lord Mansfield was quoting an earlier source and is not the origin of the phrase.
narya
@A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan): Noel Casler said something similar years ago; he worked on The Apprentice.
bbleh
@Another Scott: replied with a few thoughts at 157 — I don’t think it’s quite airtight, although IANAL either. I agree with the honorable Judge Luttig that the SC want to run away, run away fast, but unlike him I think they’ll find at least one way to do it.
Suzanne
@bbleh: Is it visible on Google Earth?! That shit is crazy.
Spawn the Elder was living at his dad’s house during the last election. He was living in a townhouse complex, and there were rules about no political signage. So one of their neighbors took their ass to the craft store and made a Trump wreath for the front door. Again, because these are totally normal things for people to do.
SFAW
@A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan):
Fortunately, I have no first-hand knowledge thereof.
dexwood
@gene108: I’d like that as a framed sampler to hang on my wall.
H.E.Wolf
Oh ho! It’s derived from Latin.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiat_justitia_ruat_caelum
My favorite example from that article was the 1933 decision by Judge James Edwin Horton, Jr., in an Alabama trial. (There’s a footnote that links to a lengthy piece about the trial and the Judge’s decision.)
Dorothy Sayers fans may recognize the latter part of the aphorism, although in Busman’s Honeymoon, it was in reference to quite a different situation.
ETA: noncarborundum (clearly a Latin aficionado) for the win! :-)
zhena gogolia
I watched the Luttig segment, and I disagree that he “predicted” the Supreme Court decision. He did say the language couldn’t be any clearer, but he declined to predict what the Supreme Court would do. He’s too smart for that.
Martin
So, Walter Benjamin said:
Trump gives people the freedom to express their anger. That’s what Jan 6 was, and his defense of them is some of his purer expressions of fascism. The public is angry – pretty widely – but about a wide range of things, some of the causes of which we don’t want to look at, some we don’t understand, some we simply fear the solution to, but that anger needs an outlet, and Trump provides that. He acknowledges their anger (something that Democrats would probably benefit by doing a better job of) and then steers it at the targets of his choice – Congress, trans people, Democrats, China, whoever. They’re very accommodating here – they can shift targets in a matter of hours. But the point is that Trump gives them permission to rough up protesters at his rallies, attack people, say some slurs, and so on. He doesn’t particularly give a shit who the target here is, he’s your cool uncle that lets you eat all the Cheetos and Mountain Dew you can tolerate because that’s what makes him the cool uncle in your eyes – he doesn’t give a shit what crap you eat. Giving them permission to attack congress makes him the popular politician.
We spend a lot of time saying that young people shouldn’t be mad about this, because we had it worse or because some other thing got better, or that poor whites in the south shouldn’t be mad about the outcomes of their own voting decisions, and so on, but the thing that actually matters is that they’re mad, and they don’t know where to channel that. It’s not helpful to tell people to deny their feelings, which politicians are hardwired to do. Trump doesn’t do that. He does the opposite. He gives them an outlet – he gives them their two minutes hate, he leads their ‘I’m mad as hell and I’m not going to take it any more’. That video of Babbit makes that clear – she’s pissed. About what? Who the fuck knows – she might not even in that moment know – but she sure knows where to go to express that. It’ll be wild.
zhena gogolia
@Tony Jay: You are a wordsmith.
zhena gogolia
@Raoul Paste:
Wikipedia:
noncarborundum
@A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan): Wikipedia credits William Watson in 1601 for “its first appearance in English literature”, 67 years before Mansfield used it.
dmsilev
(Fucking) Magnets, how do they work? Trump can’t tell you.
I think that last line needs to be repeated at the bottom of pretty much any random news story. Just because.
Also, I do actually know how magnets work. Also, too, they work fine underwater; I spent this morning troubleshooting a piece of equipment that depended crucially on a couple of magnets held under water, and that would have been kind of silly in Trump Reality.
Raoul Paste
@zhena gogolia: And I’m sure that’s all true but nonetheless, all I said was that this phrase was uttered in the movie JFK. It was said by Kevin Costner
Tony Jay
@zhena gogolia:
I like words. You can carry an infinite supply with you anywhere you go and they weigh nothing.
Recyclable too.
Baud
@dmsilev:
Unlike gravity.
MattF
Trump was simply doing anything he could think of to stay in power. The reason he finally called it off was that he’d lost. All other arguments about J6 are bullshit, trying to deflect attention from that basic fact. And it’s still true— any continued argument about J6 is deflection from the proposition that Trump should, right now, be President regardless of what the constitutional rules may say. Or whatever votes Biden may have gotten.
Cheryl from Maryland
@A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan): it’s also related to a section of the Bible, OT, Amos 5: 21- 23 – But let Justice roll down like waters, and righteousness like an ever-flowing stream.
NotMax
@Bill Arnold
“Waltine, come here, I need you. Chop chop.”
The Kropenhagen Interpretation
@Baud: Gravity works fine underwater. Buoyancy, however, puts in a lot more work underwater than it does in the air.
dmsilev
@Baud: The word “under” starts to become problematic if gravity doesn’t work.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@dmsilev: That’s up there with the Fox host who said the tide comes in and goes out and no one knows why.
WaterGirl
@SFAW: That really was unhinged, and she clearly believed a lot of disinformation. She’s screaming about CA, was she from CA?
zhena gogolia
@Raoul Paste: I wasn’t contradicting you. I was curious myself.
Urza
@dmsilev: Should just be clips of all those incredibly stupid sayings like airports in the Revolutionary war. String them together for ads, nothing but his own words. Let them pretend its AI generated but enough people saw it live and can go to other sources to see it.
NotMax
@dmsilev
Maglev trains run in the rain. No one can explain it.
//
dmsilev
@Dorothy A. Winsor: Bill O’Reilly, if memory serves.
(Googles). Yep, it was Bill.
MattF
@Dorothy A. Winsor: Bill O’Reilly. Tides go in, tides go out.
smith
@dmsilev: I’m sure the phenomenon of magnets going dead under water has something to do with how the windmills kill the whales.
What I’ve wondered about for a while is whether his minions, cultists and GQP enablers ever actually pay attention to his words or if they only pay attention to his tone. I don’t see how any of them could function in everday life if they actually forced themselves to listen and then willed themselves to accept his senile blatherings as the truth.
bbleh
@dmsilev: @NotMax: @smith: also, how do compasses work, out in the ocean, on all that water? Nobody really knows. Sailor comes up to me, big guy, tears in his eyes, says “sir, we still don’t understand how the compasses work out there, can you help us?”
scav
@H.E.Wolf: I think it also plays a role in Laurie R. King’s Justice Hall. I forget if it’s written on the dome or merely inspires the decoration.
WaterGirl
@gene108: That’s my concern.
I was listening to Harry Litman today, and he was going on about this new hotshot attorney Trump just hired for the 14th amendment case before the Supreme Court.
Litman was talking about how this case will really get the attention of the SC because of what a hotshot this guy is.
I started having flashbacks to Bill Barr and the Rapey Supreme Court justice and my next thought was to wonder if this case will be decided a certain way because this new member of Trump’s team is a member of the prestigious boys club. God help us.
Miss Bianca
@SFAW: There’s a part of me that hopes this story is true and gets a lot of traction, and there’s a part of me that’s just too grossed out to want to hear any more about it.
Baud
Baud! 20XX!: Continence is key!
MattF
@Baud: But holding it in has consequences.
WaterGirl
@zhena gogolia: I didn’t want to say anything up top because I didn’t want to influence what anyone else thought, but I watched that and I didn’t feel like he made a prediction, either.
I hoped to hear reactions in the comments so I could decide whether i had missed something somehow.
Dangerman
BTW, don’t get me wrong. I think Trump loses.
It will be because it’s rigged doncha know; then, we have another 1/6.
It’s time this Circus and its Clown get put down.
Hoodie
@Martin: She was mostly mad that she was Ashli Babbitt.
WaterGirl
@Martin:
THIS.
Another Scott
@dmsilev: +1
There’s also anti-submarine detection stuff going back to the 1930s…
Meanwhile, someone downstairs mentioned that there’s a topline budget agreement… RollCall.com:
IOW, they’re basically agreeing – once again – to the numbers they agreed to months ago, before the GQP threw their tantrum.
Lots of the GQP people were saying that they weren’t going to accept the $69B agreement because it wasn’t written into the text. Looks like they’re going to be forced to eat their words, or Johnson is going to go around the Rules Committee and go for a 2/3 vote again.
Remember, also too, that Johnson said there wasn’t going to be another CR.
IOW, it looks like the GQP is mostly going to get rolled again, but it’s not over until it’s over.
Fingers crossed.
Cheers,
Scott.
zhena gogolia
@WaterGirl: No, a couple of times he said, “IF the Supreme Court holds it to be so.” He knows they’re going to weasel out of it. He’s just going on record.
Harrison Wesley
Wow, this thread takes me way, way back. I mean, I remember when “Trump Stinks” was a hit for the J. Geils Band. Or maybe I remember that wrong.
zhena gogolia
@WaterGirl: Well, I’m mad too. Where do I go?
WaterGirl
@Dorothy A. Winsor: I will never stop laughing about that.
I even made it a rotating tag awhile back.
Hoodie
@WaterGirl: He offered what he thinks is the right interpretation and said it would be difficult to avoid that conclusion, but predicted the Court will try its hardest to dodge the issue, which I assume would keep trump on the ballot. He also seemed to make a distinction that the 14th amendment disqualifies trump from hold office, but shied away from say whether he can be on the ballot. He’s aware of the nature of this court, but left the political part unsaid.
Mo MacArbie
I chuckled at #TrumpStinks at first, but I have since become concerned. Yes, concerned, I tells ya. If it’s true, we know the guy will embrace it rather than back down, and this, in turn, will compel his followers to emulate it. Shitting oneself will become the new power move. And that is not the change I want to see.
bbleh
@zhena gogolia: concur. almost a slam-dunk for them. also keeps their houses from being firebombed.
WaterGirl
@dmsilev:
I will never get tired of this, either.
smith
The GQP is still sweating between the same old rock and hard place. On the one hand, they need to posture about spending cuts and the poisonous policies they want to ram through, on the other, they can’t afford to take the heat for a shutdown in an election year. My guess is they will go along with the agreement and then just lie about accomplishing the other stuff
ETA: Reply to Scott above
zhena gogolia
@WaterGirl: I love that one. I say it all the time.
ETA: I remember it coming in handy when we had a choice of teaching on Zoom or in person.
Baud
@smith:
IIRC, none of their shutdowns has ever been in an election year.
smith
@Baud: Funny how that happens.
WaterGirl
@zhena gogolia: Yes, I took note of the “IF the SC” part more than once, too.
I didn’t interpret that as him knowing they will weasel out.
I think he is saying to anyone who will listen that the words are very clear – I think he is doing everything he can to put them in a position where they cannot weasel out. He is putting them on notice.
We’ll see if it works.
Miss Bianca
@Urza:
That could be fun, actually. Put out the real Trumpisms with some AI-generated ones and ask people to play “spot the (real) lunacy!”
WaterGirl
@zhena gogolia: Exactly. I could do a rant about all the things I think are fucked up, but I’m pretty sure I couldn’t pull off the unhinged part.
SiubhanDuinne
@dmsilev:
Say whut now?
bbleh
@WaterGirl: “practice, practice …!”
Bill Arnold
@SiubhanDuinne:
Pretty sure he’s talking about electric magnets, and how they can be ruined by inundation of the coils with water. Unlike old-style steam, used in old aircraft carrier steam catapults. Dowse steam with water, and it just becomes water, and the steam-making-machine makes more steam.
The Navy is reasonably competent about electric things on ships, and about keeping such things dry enough to work.
zhena gogolia
@WaterGirl: Narrator: It won’t work.
Another Scott
@Bill Arnold: That sounds plausible.
But, if true, it shows, yet again, he can remember a few words but not understand the basics of what his briefings were trying to convey.
Like the “invisible” F-35…
Cheers,
Scott.
different-church-lady
@Bill Arnold: No, this is a man who can’t see the sarcasm in, “Dude, how do you manage to put your pants on every morning?”
M31
@Another Scott: that whole “invisible F-35” thing made me think of the Spongebob characters “Mermaid Man and Barnacle Boy” who had an invisible BoatMobile that they kept losing, because it was invisible.
The voice actors were Tim Conway and Ernest Borgnine, who were brilliant.
WaterGirl
@zhena gogolia: I hold out a tiny bit of hope. But I know it will only happen if the 6 of them on the SC feel that it’s in their best interests to let things stand however they stand in the courts just below them.
TBone
The Supreme Court of Colorado, at least, cemented in the record that the ball gargling thunder twat committed insurrection in their opinion. That’s huge.
Uncle Cosmo
Mirrors are of scant use for those who don’t have reflections in them. (Not intended to disparage the rank and file, most of which are dupes [if nothing else, of their own prejudices], but the leadership, ohellyeah…)
Chetan Murthy
@Uncle Cosmo: If anything it’s disparaging towards vampires, a known minority. The MAGAts, they signed up for this ride, knowing where it led: hell, they signed up for TFG’s ride *because* of his bullhorn fascism, misogyny, white supremacy. If they’d wanted the dog-whistle version of all that, they had to go was go with Jeb! (please clap) or any of a dozen other contenders. But they chose TFG, and for a reason: they see themselves in him. They are fully morally culpable.
Quadrillipede
Trump 2024: Better out than in(?)
The Kropenhagen Interpretation
@Quadrillipede: Trump 2024 will take a dump in the swamp.
NotMax
@M31
The Star Trek scene (0:00 – 1:45).
Also too, always kind of curious where Wonder Woman obtained invisible jet fuel.
:)
Quadrillipede
It’s a dirty job, but someone has to do it…
bbleh
@Chetan Murthy: They are fully morally culpable.
And not just that, but they are absolutely frantic with resentment over being called out for it, even if gently via law and policy rather than in person. They want to be bigoted, selfish assholes and get away with it, just like he has, and now he has not just validated that but celebrated it. He is a leader and an exemplar, and for people who don’t want to deal with complexity or difference, someone like that is a savior. (It ain’t no accident the fundies love him.)
RevRick
@Martin: Benjamin’s observations, while interesting, are not historically accurate. Hitler came to power, not be winning the laboring class, but the shop keepers, clerks, and small business people. Hitler didn’t shrink the vote of the Social Democrats. He hoovered up the right. If he hadn’t, he wouldn’t have gotten Hindenberg’s tacit okay.
Hitler appealed to those who lost their savings in the postwar hyperinflation and were furious both at the allies demanding reparations while stripping Germany of its industrial heartland and at the politicians who allowed this to happen ( Nevermind the fact that Ludendorff basically left the Socialists holding the bag). He appealed to those alarmed by the decadence of the Weimar Republic. He appealed to those who wanted to make Germany great again. He had more in common with the Frei Korps thugs than with factory workers.
Now, did Hitler understand the power of spectacle? Of course! He was creating the Church of Hitler.
But let’s remember that his primary appeal was to those who had some measure of power and felt it slipping away.
Trump’s primary appeal is to those for whom white supremacy matters more than anything else. (And white Evangelicals practice white supremacy with some Jesusy language slathered on it).
Formerly disgruntled in Oregon
@Martin:
Then maybe they should go to a punk rock show and stop expecting that experience in the voting booth.
Paul in KY
@Mike S: No problem. I just like thinking about her being dead.
Paul in KY
@Hoodie: I’d have been mad too.