I went to a massage therapist today, and after an hour of being brutalized by a 4’11” woman with hands of steel, I can honestly say I feel amazing and have no interest in reading the news.
My right shoulder feels the best it has post-injury. I was so relaxed that at one point I almost drool through the donut hole my pumpkin sized head was resting in. Going back in two weeks and also am trying out acupuncture with a doctor in Wheeling.
Corner Stone
Sounds like a happy ending.
John Cole +0
@Corner Stone: Not being in pain is a happy ending, indeed.
jl
I for one am very glad and happy that Cole is glad and happy tonight.
I guess too relaxed tor pet pix, but I am a typical never-to-be-satisfied always grumping BJ commenter. So, never mind little me.
No seriously, no problem at all.
I can’t own pets right now in my apartment…. (sniff).. sometimes I miss having the little buggers around… but.. it’s OK, really…
HR Progressive
Massages and Acupuncture? John Cole, DFH.
Hope Steve is remaining indoors this evening.
Anne Laurie
Good for you, John!
What works, works. What doesn’t, you won’t repeat. But you can’t know what will work until you try it!
P.S. Ignore the news. It’s all re-runs now, anyways.
jl
@HR Progressive:
” Hope Steve is remaining indoors this evening. ”
I hope so too.
Can some kindly commenter refer me to the post(s) where the ethics and philosophy, and whatever, of the indoor/outdoor pet cat issue was thrashed out?
If I had a cat, it would have to be happy as an indoors only cat, otherwise the cat would get a new home where the cat supervisor is a tougher person than I, who could live with outdoor cat risks. Cole seems to be of another school of cat supervision.
The Dangerman
I had a fine acupuncturist once; miss her greatly (she went and got married and moved … and so did I, I mean, the move thing). Finding a good one is the trick and, once found, treasure the practitioner.
andy
Got a backrub from this gal a couple winters back- she’s a high-functioning sociopath and was drunk at the time, so she went all out, forgetting all about simulating empathy. I could see her fingerprints on my arms for a week (and I don’t bruise easily), but boy, did I feel good the next few days.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
Do you mean post-injury?
p.a.
????? Qu’est-ce que c’est?
skerry
John, I am so happy to hear that you have pursued these alternative therapies. I agree that the right acupuncturist makes all the difference. If the first one doesn’t work, try another. The energy must be right. I had one guy for years that I loved and he moved away. I have yet to find another that works as well for me.
lamh36
It’s always good to not have to live with alot of pain if you can.
good you’re feeling better
raven
After I read this post I started to feel pain in my left shoulder. The I remembered I had a flu shot this afternoon.
raven
@skerry: What? He had a massage.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@jl: The dog I had growing up was an English cocker spaniel; he was an indoor dog 95% of the time. The other 5%, he would sneak out and try to raise hell (picking fights with bigger manlier-looking dogs like dobies and huskies, looking for ladies, and probably getting drunk).
mzrad
Ah, coming over to the hippy dark side of relaxation, peace, and pleasure I see. Nice. What took you so long?
Next, you’ll be telling us about how much you’re enjoying yoga. Which you should do, IMHO.
Keep up the good work and don’t lose any of your pets for a while, mkay?
MzRAD
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@p.a.: Sherlock Holmes’s description of himself in the new Sherlock series from Britain.
raven
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): We’ve been having some serious coyote action in the back yard lately. This afternoon I was working and heard the most god-awful shrieking. I ran down stairs certain the fucker had Lil Bit. I ran out and looked and then back in the house and she was on the bed. I was sure the coyote had dragged some little doggie into the kudzu, didn’t want to take a gun, so I crashed into the brush with a hammer. I found nothing and now, after listening to coyote’s on youtube, think it may have just been on shrieking on its own. Scared the shit out of me.
lamh36
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): just re-watched the first 2 eps of Sherlock 2 weeks ago and it still that good.
skerry
@raven: Yeah, and he is seeing an acupuncturist in Wheeling.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@raven: Lil Bit’s your cocker, right? She could probably hold her own if she needed to. Most of the fights Beau ended up in, ended with him hanging onto the other dog’s throat by his teeth. He was a Scarlet Pimpernel mofo; he was pretty with fluffy blond hair but he was also muscular as hell and aggressive as fuck.
lamh36
Welp, I’ve started counting down to my trip to Hawaii.
In 5 short weeks, I’ll be on a beach in Waikiki.
I still haven’t decided if I want to lei’d at the airport or wait until I get to my hotel room. Oooh, I wonder if I can get a specially made lei for my birthday.
raven
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): Nah, she’s so sweet and passive, unless the coyote had a cookie she wanted. Combined with her really bad vision I’m afraid she wouldn’t stand a chance.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@lamh36:
Well, don’t do it the street and frighten the horses.
lamh36
wow, Rugby players don’t play do they?
Maafu punches Tom Young
Botsplainer
@raven:
Hate those damn things. Deer and rabbits are thick this year; we’ll have a coyote resurgence in a year or two.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@lamh36: One ref, 30 players on the pitch. A certain amount of “self-policing” takes place. That looked like a sending off, though.
WereBear
YAY!
I’ve been exploring Zero Balancing, a very gentle massage technique, and… (flashback to Get Smart here) loving it.
mai naem
A few years ago, there was a mountain lion seen not that far from where I live. I live in Tempe, home of ASU. Anyway, this lion was walking around a condo complex. The 911 call that sounded like it was from a college student went something like:
Caller:Dude: I just saw a mountain lion outside my condo
911 operator(sounding not quite convinced): A mountain lion?
Caller(now sounding slightly panicked): Dude, I tell you it’s a mountain lion! It was walking right outside my condo!
911 operator finally starts taking the caller seriously. Apparently there was a lion spotted in the area. I’ve tried looking for a clip of the call and never found it.
TaMara (BHF)
Serious question to our resident military here on BJ. My niece, who is active duty, posted on FB a post disparaging the President for some perceived slight in his salute today
Could this come back and haunt her? Should I call her and remind her that he is her Commander in Chief or is not a big deal?
WereBear
Also, kitten pics!
Tristan Teaches Mithrandir the Magic Window
This kitten has chugged down the bottle marked Drink Me and has grown to a ridiculous size for a mere six months on this plane of existence. And he’s sweet and talkative and cuddly.
Mr WereBear is a real kitten-picking champ.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@TaMara (BHF): Yes, it could bite her in the ass at some point. A quiet suggestion that she take down the post is a reasonable thing. She is entitled to her beliefs and thoughts, but she has accepted some limitations on expressing them by joining the military.
ETA: The President is a civilian. He doesn’t need to salute, and some might argue that he should not. A nod or other gesture of acknowledgement should be enough.
lamh36
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): yeah, looks like the end of a game, it kinda looks like the first guy threw a punch, but the second guy, definitely laid him flat.
WereBear
Correct on all counts. And really, it’s a small thing.
It looks petty. And he outranks her… I believe that counts a whole big bunch.
John Cole +0
@TaMara (BHF): Email me your name on FB.
Botsplainer
@lamh36:
I’m 8 weeks from my next dive trip – going to Bonaire. Wife is going to Mozambique and South Africa for a couple of weeks ahead of that – she gets back the day after I leave for Bonaire. I’m pretty jealous though – she gets to dive Mozambique.
I’ll probably dive 4 times a day. Not a big deal to travel separate – since November, we’ve been to St Lucia, Belize and Jamaica on dive trips together, and she’s been to China, Thailand, Cambodia and Australia (and missed one trip to New Zealand due to some surgery). In January, she’s headed to Myanmar, and we’re planning to go to Tuscany and Saba (diving again) in the spring.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@TaMara (BHF): Ugh. That whole fucking presidential salute thing angers me.
You can send her this if you want to fight….
aimai
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): He’s stuck with it because Reagan broke the actual tradition of Presidents not saluting and started a new faux tradition. But g-d forbid that Obama “fail” to do this ridiculous thing in exactly the right way. SteveM has a great picture up of Bush the younger juggling a dog and looking like he might drop either the salute or the dog while doing it. This is another tempest in a tea pot.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@aimai: I know he is stuck with it; I like the old style. Besides, the only president who managed to return a salute properly (in a way that would not cause a drill sergeant to go into an obscene screaming fit) was Bush I.
Fluke bucket
Yes. The Obama non-salute will be the big story tomorrow.
TaMara (BHF)
@WereBear: BTW, your kitteh pics on FB make the whole thing bearable some days.
TaMara (BHF)
@John Cole +0: Done.
And thanks to everyone else for the info. I may send her a txt…unless my brother has already reminded her of the fact. He’s a vet himself.
TaMara (BHF)
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: OMG, that just made my night.
Matt
Newsmax headline in the sidebar:
Yep, Krauty, it sure is. There’s the sane persons, then there’s the bloodthirsty theocratic fundamentalists hell-bent on imposing their twisted misogynistic religion through global empire. Oh yeah, and then outside of the US there’s ISIS…
Hal
@TaMara (BHF): Wow. The comments on that story are precious. One commenter keeps arguing the President isn’t a civilian but an “honorary” member of the military, and someone else insists GWB looked every soldier in the eye as he saluted. How the hell would anyone ever know that?
Obama leaves toilet seat up at night! New scandal brewing. House committee will be convened to investigate!
Jim, Foolish Literalist
The Notorious RBG seems to be getting tired of some crap:
I love it that she’s breaking down the whole notion that the Justices are some kind of quasi-religious priesthood divorced from politics, personality and the real world, like the shock when Obama criticized Citizens United in a SOTU a few years back.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@TaMara (BHF): Within the military, it is supposed to be a gesture of respect. And it is supposed to be mutual. A salute from someone of lower rank is returned. As an officer, I took it seriously; I did a parade ground return salute and really didn’t like that some of my fellow officers were very haphazard about it. But, again, Obama is not in the military. His method of acknowledgment is not subject to the same customs and practices.
Violet
Glad you’re finding some things that help your shoulder, John. Acupuncture can be great but it doesn’t seem to work for everyone. At the very least it should be relaxing. Takes a few visits as they balance you over time. Glad you’re feeling better!
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: I really like that woman.
Wally Ballou
Pirates clinched a postseason berth tonight. Don’t anybody tell Cole.
The Tigers are trying to kill me. They take a 3-0 lead into the ninth, let the Chisox tie it up, then get a 4-3 walkoff in the bottom of the inning.
Mike J
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
When John Yoo gets appointed to fill her position she won’t have to see it.
Tommy
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):
In the 70s and 80s as a kid and a military brat people would step to attention and salute all the time when I was on base. I am not normally the conformity guy. Just doing something because the rules tell me to. But I found something about the gesture endearing.
Tommy
@TaMara (BHF): I have never served but spent my entire life around the military. In my experience it depends on her commanding officers. Some can be forgiving but others, if they want to be a pain in the ass can find a reg to go after her.
lamh36
Alright, has everyone seen Sleepy Hollow yet? Cause I gots to talk about the that beginning! I’m telling ya, I was confused as hell, but why was I soo happy at hearing one part of it that turned out NOT to be true, you IchAbbie shippers know what I’m talking about…lol.
maeve
@p.a.:
I’m not a psychopath, I’m a high functioning sociopath – Sherlock
Longer Version
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Tommy: That happens to this day. Enlisted soldiers salute officers, and officers salute higher ranking officers whenever they encounter one another outdoors in uniform. It does not happen in field conditions. Also, I had some soldiers who saluted when we were both in civilian clothing (they did not need to do so) – I would, of course, return the salute in that situation.
Hal
So I have one of those office desk jockey positions for a hospital locally where I live in NY state. Answering the main line, taking patient calls, acting as an answering service after hours. Not hard, not brain surgery, but; we are short staffed. There is only a handful of people in my office, and we are down two more. My bosses reaction to this has been to say the hospital used a consultant on staffing and actually says were are over staffed.
As a result, there are times when we do not get even a 15 minute break, though we are supposed to have 2 and a half hour lunch. If you work the over night shift, you get no breaks, and can only take quick restroom breaks.
Tomorrow because a co-worker is out, my evening shift partner is going to be working in the morning so my supervisor won’t have to bother answering the phones, which is supposed to be part of her duties. This means I’m by myself my entire shift, minus one hour, talking every call for a hospital. Just me in charge of calling codes if a patient is dying, etc.
I’m at a point where I’m seriously considering complaining to the labor board. My supes response is basically we have a desk job and can surf the internet between calls. Yes. Because we’re supposed to man the desk at all times. If no calls are coming in I suppose I could work on my cure for the common cold, but Facebook is my preference. I realize I have an easy job, and I’m grateful for not being homeless and living under a bridge, but I can’t help but think we are being taken advantage of also. Sigh. I need a new job. Or a lotto win.
mai naem
@Mike J: Yes, you think 16 Dem senators are going to vote for John Yoo to replace RBG’s seat on the USSC.
samiam
Why are you so relaxed General Cole? Obama is killing brown people with drones and tomahawks etc. Why are you not getting on your expert opinion soap box and whining about these things you know nothing about like you always do? You waiting for your marching orders from Commander Griftwald?
TaMara (BHF)
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):
@Tommy:
Also a military brat. I’ve never met an envelope I didn’t want to push or a rule I didn’t want to break. But I had respect drilled into me – polished shoes, sharp dress, proper hat and acknowledging the MP who waved you on base, Sir and Ma’am for everyone, and I’m forever grateful. It has enhanced my life in so many ways.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@mai naem: Simple majority vote. A few Dems could well say that a President has a right to appoint qualified people.
Tommy
@lamh36: Nope. Got rid of cable and not come up on Hulu yet. No spoilers please :).
With that said when I heard the concept of the show I was like I could never get into that. Then I found myself liking it more then I care to admit.
Now onto my Netflix DVD of Deadwood I am rewatching. I thought when I saw it on HBO it was maybe the best TV show I’ve ever seen. I know a bold statement. But rewatching I think I was right.
Yatsuno
@The Dangerman:
Mine is the husband of a good friend from college. So yeah, keeping him around for sure!
@samiam: Herp de Durf.
Chickamin Slam
I am not interested in reading the news either. Overcame a panic attack to attend first day of class. Deep breathing. Deep breathing. A friend talked me into registering for this quarter. I feel like I can do this.
Mike J
@mai naem: Why do you think 16 are required? It only takes a simple majority to confirm a nomination and I can think of 20+ dems who would vote for him saying they disagree with his views but is qualified. And probably 5 dems who agree with his views, or would be afraid to say they didn’t.
Violet
@Hal: If you’re by yourself and more than one thing happens that needs your attention and as a result a patient isn’t attended to promptly there will be hell to pay. For you, unfortunately, but also for the hospital because they didn’t have adequate staff to handle the situation. Is there anyone you could talk to who isn’t aware of that situation that should be?
eemom
60+ comments in, and nobody has a reaction to this Cole-image?
Sheeyit, if I had $$ and time, I’d have hired a cartoonist.
SiubhanDuinne
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Heh. I’ve been seeing that all over FB today but had no idea why. Had completely missed the Obama “latte salute” business until this thread.
Violet
@eemom: Meh. Cole’s a pushover. He lets his small dogs push him around. A 4′ 11″ woman is a giant by comparison.
JSinLA
A benefit of being a nuke submariner is that I can count on one hand the number of times I had to salute someone after boot camp.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@JSinLA: Well, you fuckers were indoors most of the time. The army tends to work outside.
lamh36
@Tommy: gotcha.
Yeah, I wasn’t sure bout the show either, but the “Fringe” crew sold me enough to begin to watch it (I LOVED FRINGE) add to that the chemistry between the two lead actors are off the charts good.
They totally make the show and it’s craziness soo much better
maeve
@p.a.:
Sherlock – not a psychopath, a high functioning sociopath
also longer version: http://youtu.be/2JYjCIN61M0
mai naem
@Hal: I know NY’s labor laws are way better than AZ but in AZ the breaks are not mandated by law. Min. 30 min. lunch is mandated by law. Somebody at my workplace called the labor board a few years ago – not sure about what but the supvsr approached all of us nonchalantly trying to figure out who had called the labor board. Ended up it was somebody who had quit after being there around a month. Anyhow, my co. gets away with paying the on call person, per minute, only for being on the phone. They get nothing extra unless they go to the office to do something. Not even a measly $100/ week to be on call all week long after hours. And this is legal in this state. Blows my mind.
Tommy
@TaMara (BHF):
Same here. Exactly! I can’t explained how what you just said has served me so well in my life. And really when you think about it pretty basic things. But when I still do them people seem almost taken aback. Another thing pounded into my head was to always open a door for another person. At 44 I still do it because it almost just a reaction. I don’t even think about it.
Did it a few hours ago and the stunned look on the lady was all I needed to keep doing it.
Hal
@Violet:
Yep. I’ve made the point several times that it is a coverage issue, not a matter of how “busy” were are. Relying on one person to man the phones at all times just seems like a bad idea for a hospital. There are higher ups, but I’m hesitant. Seems like people should already know, but I suppose it’s possible they don’t. I’ll have to figure out who exactly is a good person to go to.
Bill E Pilgrim
Weird. That’s actually exactly how it felt to me reading a David Brooks’ column this morning.
Then, glutton for punishment that I seemed to be, today at least, I also read Roger Cohen. Who dispensed his insider wisdom about France which amounted to spouting cliches that anyone watching FOX News could garner in an afternoon (they’re lazy, they don’t like work, austerity hasn’t increased unemployment, not having enough austerity is what’s increased unemployment, and on and on). I always assumed his pablum about France was that of an occasional visitor; reading today that he had a house there for 20 years astonished me. He sounds like a weekend tourist, repeating what other Anglos at the hotel bar were saying.
Now that was a morning’s mental workout.
Howard Beale IV
@Wally Ballou:
It’ll be a fucking miracle if the Tigers make it to the post-season.
Ruckus
@TaMara (BHF):
I may not be the best person to answer your question. I was in the navy and my salutes were pretty poor. I figured if my hand in anywhere near my forehead and had more than one finger showing I was good to go. I just didn’t give a shit about it and rarely got corrected. Most of the officers didn’t rate a salute even if their uniform did. But I was in during Vietnam and I’d bet the percentage of people not wanting to be wherever they were was pretty high. Oh well, water/bridge.
But this day and age, I’d bet being publicly disrespectful to the pres might not be a good career move.
JSinLA
Outside as a submariner is generally not good.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@JSinLA: I don’t blame you; I can only hold my breath for so long.
jl
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): Is that typical cocker spaniel behavior? From my experience with cats, it may have been a large cat in a cocker spaniel suit. Not there would be anything wrong with that, if you were happy with the critter.
mai naem
@Mike J: Because I think it would end up being a filibuster. I think you could get a whackjob for a Scalia replacement but not an RBG replacement and sure as hell not John Yoo.
A Humble Lurker
@lamh36: I don’t know the specific thing you were talking about, but I KNEW he was still in that box. And yay for Jenny. I was worried about that.
Howard Beale IV
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): Those who serve in the Silent Service are definitely wired differently-especially when they train them in sonar (“hello, Tommy, I’m a tugboat, my pitch count is 245.”)
Tommy
@Hal: I don’t think I have ever mentioned this to you here. Last year my mom was in the ICU for a month. At least in the ICU only one nurse for two rooms. All rooms were single beds. We were not supposed to be there 24 hours a day but they let us. Brought us blankets. Beverages. Food. I can’t speak to other hospitals because thankfully I’d not been in many, but it was the best service I’ve ever seen.
Bill E Pilgrim
I’m going through a whole flip-book of mental images trying that one on. Mostly coming up with this.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@jl: Uncut male cockers are very friendly with people but very aggressive and dominating with other dogs.
Jay
A strip club masseuse will punch you straight on in the spine…
Mnemosyne
@Hal:
You should check your state labor laws about lunches and breaks, because they vary from state to state. Here in California, it’s a minimum of one 30-minute lunch and two 10-minute breaks per 8 hour shift, and the state is very vigilant about enforcing that.
As far as the current situation goes, I think the word you need is “coverage.” As in, “I need to know who can cover the desk if I have to deal with (situation that takes your attention away).” It will help to have specific examples so you can make your supervisor do the problem-solving for you.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Jay: How exactly you know this is something about which we shall refrain from asking.
JSinLA
Omnes Omnibus (sorry, generally lurk, not hip on how to link) – anyway, always amused by how different my military experience was from my siblings, in-laws, and father who were in the surface navy, marines, air force, and army. The concept of military discipline was so different on a sub. Yes, you followed orders, said yes sir, no sir, etc. But, for a $20 donation to the rec committee, you didn’t have to shave while on patrol, ‘uniforms’ were personalized, and you wore tennis shoes for god’s sake. Glad I chose that path, fit my personality well. Not sure I could have survived in an environment that required greater conformity.
rikyrah
Lamh,
Talk about Sleepy Hollow. I Love me some Sleepy Hollow.
jl
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): I don’t have much experience up close at all with cocker spaniels. I did not know they were mean on other dogs.
How can that be, they are so darned cute.
To be honest, I only have personal experience on any prolonged basis with mutts and the mighty dachshund. Dachshunds are nuts, so not sure how well that experience generalizes to other dogs.
Edit: I did not properly register ‘uncut male’. I probably winced and it left my mind for a moment.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@JSinLA: I could jump out of perfectly good airplanes, but being underwater woud freak me out. We are all different and necessary (except for the Air Force which should be split up among the other services and abolished).
Howard Beale IV
@JSinLA: This ought to bring back memories…..
“Prepare for ultra quiet”
Tommy
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): Funny. My dad worked for the Air Force for 30+ years and he often told me “why would you jump out a perfectly good plane?” I have a few times in my life and he always says that. But then he broke both his legs in military high school jumping out of a plane and isn’t a fan of the concept.
Yatsuno
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):
Even the Coast Guard has its own pilot corps. The Air Force is redundant especially considering all the branches except the Army have their own air divisions.
skerry
@Tommy: I had a child in ICU some years ago. The rule was you could be there 24/7, but you could not sleep there. The hospital, Johns Hopkins, had a sleeping room for mothers only (I think there were 6 reclining chairs/beds and a shower). Fathers slept in the lobby. It was brutal. I’d wait until I was on the edge of passing out and go sleep for a couple of hours get up and check on her; rinse and repeat. Her father ended up going home at night, but I stayed in the hospital the entire time with the exception of going home once to get some clean clothes. Kept the suitcase in my car.
But the nurses were the absolute best. I could not have made it through it without the nurses. I brought them chocolates and flowers when my daughter finally moved to a regular surgical unit. They helped me maintain my sanity during a very difficult time.
ETA: Her surgeon was Ben Carson, but it was when he was brilliantly practicing medicine and had not come out as a RWNJ.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Tommy: When I joined the army out of college, I had two goals: completing OCS and getting jump wings. Unfortunately, I did the two things in my first year in the service. The rest of my time was just work. I did love jumping though.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Yatsuno: The army, which gave up its air corps to found the air force, still has a shit load of rotary wing pilots and a few fixed wing folk.
Tommy
@skerry: We slept there. My direct family is small. My mom, dad, and brother. We never wanted her to be alone so at times when we were pulling 24/7shifts (for lack of a better word/phrase). We got tried. I sleep there a lot. Not sure if that was “official” hospital policy but nobody seemed to care. Looked after us.
Howard Beale IV
@skerry:
He always was a RWNJ-he just hid it when he was still in practice.
Tommy
@Howard Beale IV: My grandfather was a really, really good doctor. Far right. He never seemed to take politics into the practice of his profession.
skerry
@Howard Beale IV: Exactly. That’s why I said “come out”. He was still in the RWNJ closet.
At the time, I could not have cared less about his politics. My kid needed a pediatric neurosurgeon and he was arguably the best in the country. He saved her life. But I certainly don’t feel like I own him anything. The bills were outrageous. Nearly 7 figures. Thank God I had the absolute best of the best medical insurance and her dad had DoD insurance as a secondary. We didn’t paid a dime out of pocket. We did have to argue with the insurance about covering the air ambulance. It had not been pre-approved. But they ended up paying.
Howard Beale IV
@Tommy: @Howard Beale IV:
Those in the medical profession who have a shred of ethics don’t inject their beliefs into their practice of medicine.
Jack the Second
100+ comments in and I’ve got to be that guy–
There is essentially no scientific evidence that acupuncture works. Blinded studies have at best returned “it kind of sort of helps with subjective pains in some cases”, and looking at the total body of research paints it pretty dim. Moreover, it is not a risk-free treatment (it breaks the skin at the very least, which is an avenue for infection, and in some cases acupuncturists have pierced organs and killed people): http://whatstheharm.net/acupuncture.html
No proven benefit + risk of side effects = not worth it.
Some people do have positive experiences, but keep in mind regression to the mean (you go for treatment when you’re feeling bad; if you feel better later it is easy to attribute it to whatever treatment you just received) and that just interacting with a person who cares about your well being tends to improve your subjective, ineffable feelings, regardless of any physical benefits. A classic example involved some placebo treatment for asthma: people reported feeling better even when objective measurements of their lung function showed no improvement.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Jack the Second: So what? If Cole gets a placebo effect and feels better, should he care?
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Jack the Second:
Your statements did not establish equation you posit.
ETA: I think acupuncture is weird and probably ineffective. I still don’t think you established your point.
Gian
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):
I expect that George Washington, Grant, Andrew Jackson, JFK, Ike, and teddy roosevelt off the top of my head knew how to salute.
IIRC correctly the army manuals discuss when you don’t need to I think they referenced grocery bags and babies, but a dog would be close enough. (and that was for enlisted dealing with officers seems like they army had to make rules for officers who wanted people to drop a baby to salute)
(said as a kid who read field manuals)
Jack the Second
What is to be proven? First, do no harm.
Mnemosyne
@Jack the Second:
Cole is pursuing acupuncture for pain control and addiction recovery — IOW, primarily psychological states. That’s quite a bit different than expecting it to cure AIDS like the stories on the website you linked to. If he was hoping for it to cure a disease or a physical illness, I would agree with you, but he’s not.
ETA: If your criteron is “Do no harm,” what is more harmful for someone in addiction recovery to use for pain relief, acupuncture or opiates?
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Gian: I have been out of the army for 22 years and I still overload my left hand when I carry things.
Also, you may want to read my comment in context. Most presidents did not salute. Reagan was the first who did.
(said a person with historical knowledge)
Bubblegum Tate
I see a massage therapist every two weeks. Have been going for more than a decade now. Tomorrow is massage day. So stoked. Massage therapists are glorious people.
Anne Laurie
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):
English cockers or dogs from field lines, sure. You don’t wanna know what the desire for “more sweeping coat” and “deeply dished foreface” has done to the AKC-registered Cocker Spaniel… or as the handlers & trainers refer to them, the “American Shi-Tzus”.
BillinGlendaleCA
@Jack the Second: Also, western medical treatment isn’t the best in pain management.
Emerald
@Jack the Second: Exactly. I’d call acupuncture “pseudoscience” but it has no claim to anything scientific. Here’s an excellent overview of the actual science on Science Based Medicine.
Also, go to iTunes and look up a podcast called “Skeptoid” (not my fave for several reasons, but when they do episodes like this you can pretty well trust ’em, and plus you can look up their evidence). Either this week or last they did an episode on acupuncture that was really eye-opening, especially on the history of it (hint: it turns out that it isn’t ancient at all, although something being ancient isn’t exactly a positive claim–they didn’t know much in ancient times and generally stuck to magic). Here’s the transcript.
A nice placebo effect can be had from plenty of things that are not dangerous. Skip the acupuncture, go for something like Therapeutic Touch if you think magic will help you. At least they don’t actually touch your body with that silliness, and only harm your cashflow.
Gah. It’s unbelievable that only this far down the thread do we get somebody warning against this nonsense. We on the left had better clean up our own act if we want to keep blaming the wingnuts for being anti-science.
Jack the Second
@Mnemosyne: “Acupuncture or opiates” is a false dilemma. At the very least, there are three options: acupuncture, opiates, or doing nothing. Doing nothing isn’t always the worst option.
That’s not to mention the other options, eg, therapeutic massage. Pick the least bad, not the not the worst.
BillinGlendaleCA
@Anne Laurie: I’ve had(and currently have) an American Cocker and a Shi Tsu. They are quite different. Right now, in addition to the Cocker, I’ve got a Yorkie/Pomeranian mix, she’s really aggressive.
ruemara
congrats. It does work. I’ve been hoping to afford a massage for a few years now and some acupuncture. It makes you feel so much better.
@TaMara (BHF): It is not a big deal, the custom of a salute is recent and she should watch her damned mouth considering this freakout has only come about because it is the black president doing it.
Gian
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):
I’m clear on RWR thing. I still think presidents like JFK what with the whole naval academy PT109 thing might have known how.
RWR liked to put on a show.
your strong left arm plays into my comment that they had to write a rule about dropping groceries and babies. freaking petty tyrants.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Anne Laurie: As I mentioned in my earlier comment, Beau (short for the name on his papers) was an English cocker, not one of the push-faced American cockers. There is a difference. If someone suggested there were no difference, Beau would have been on the front lines fighting that observation. To be fair though, he would have been on the front line fighting anything. For or against. But that was never our issue. Ultimately, he would have been with me when the revolution came, because he was my boy and I was his.
Mnemosyne
@Jack the Second:
Cole has already talked pretty extensively about being in so much pain he wasn’t able to sleep. So in your opinion, acupuncture is so dangerous that it’s better for him to be in constant pain than to try something that might give some pain relief, even if that relief is 99 percent placebo?
@Emerald:
We have a recovering alcoholic in major pain who can’t take opioids and is probably severely restricted on both Tylenol and NSAIDs because of existing liver and pancreas damage. So far, the only option you’re giving him is, Suck it up, loser.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
Huh?
Mnemosyne
@ruemara:
HEY YOU! Go here. There are several blogging/marketing/website jobs listed, including some in the Bay Area.
ruemara
@Mnemosyne: skedadling, ma’am!
BillinGlendaleCA
@Mnemosyne: I’ve tried acupuncture and while I was skeptical found it helpful in reducing pain.
Mnemosyne
@BillinGlendaleCA:
From what studies I’ve seen (and I do not claim to be a doctor, or even to play one on the internet), pain management is very individual, what works for one person doesn’t necessarily work for another, and a lot of it has to do with how in control the patient feels. Like you said, conventional medicine doesn’t have a whole lot of answers for chronic pain, so it’s hard for me to get on my high horse when people decide to use marginal treatments for it rather than continue to suffer.
Trying to treat cancer or AIDS with acupuncture? That’s fucking stupid. But chronic pain that can’t be controlled with conventional treatment? I honestly don’t see the potential harm of acupuncture of being greater than the potential harm of untreated chronic pain.
ETA: Just a note — I have never had acupuncture and never would, because Needles. But some people I know who are in recovery claim that it works for them, and if it keeps them away from using booze and pills to treat their pain, I’m all for it.
Emerald
@Mnemosyne:
Is that a serious comment? Read the links I provided: acupuncture does not work and can be dangerous.
Send your friend to an actual doctor. Try several doctors if the first can’t help him. I assure you that real science is going to be your friend’s only hope.
And again, if you think magic, or rather, “alternative medicine,” can help then by all means go for it, but try to chose a remedy that isn’t dangerous. I’m actually not being completely snarky about that: the placebo effect, while it usually only results from regression to the mean, also can be psychological. If your friend believes in the “therapy” it might help for a short time. Please just pick a “therapy” that isn’t dangerous.
I too have an alcoholic friend whom I love dearly, so I sympathize.
(edited for clarity)
Anne Laurie
@BillinGlendaleCA: Yeah, that’s not really fair to Shi Tzus, or even the poor Cockers. But if you’ve seen the show dogs, with their long hair sweeping the floor & their ears bundled up in rubber bands, you can see where the slur came from.
Cockers have been so popular for so long, even apart from the overrefined beauty-contest models, there’s too many miserable offshoots from the shallow end of the gene pool making themselves & everyone around them miserable. Dogs with horrible skin conditions, eye problems, liver & kidney issues — and worst of all for a breed intended to be a good “companion” dog, weird brain-chemistry problems. I helped with “household pet” obedience classes for years, and the saddest dogs I met were petshop cockers who would literally scream, soil themselves, run in circles, and try to bite any human or dog within reach, all at the same time. So I’m prejudiced, even though I know it’s not fair. (Feel the same way about Labrador Retrievers, for the same reason — except the problem Labs tended to be happy, at least. Dumb, uncontrollable, and dangerous just because they were too big to know their own strength, but cheerful!)
Mnemosyne
@Emerald:
Acupuncture therapy has been helping her for at least eight years, both with her neck pain (leftover from a car accident) and with her alcoholism. But in your opinion, acupuncture is so dangerous that I should advise her to risk her sobriety and do something, anything else?
Keep in mind that we’re talking about alcoholism here. Right now, the medically approved treatment for alcoholism is AA meetings and … that’s about it. And even AA meetings have a very high failure rate (though my friend has been very successful with meetings).
So, again, we’re talking about areas where conventional medical treatment is failing a lot of people and doesn’t offer many viable solutions. That’s why people turn to things like AA or acupuncture in the hope that maybe it will help — because doctors basically say, Well, there’s not much I can do for you.
Mnemosyne
@ruemara:
This is the one that caught my eye for you — Content Strategist. It sounds like pretty much exactly what you’re doing now, but pays better and (hopefully) has a less crazy boss.
andy
@p.a.: self-described, though she called herself a christian sociopath…
Howard Beale IV
@Mnemosyne: With any kind of liver impairment, acetaminophen should never be in the mix at all.
Chet
It seems the shit is staring to hit the fan again in Ferguson.
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/tensions-mount-in-ferguson-again-after-michael-brown-memorial-burned/
John Cole +0
I think there is some confusion here. I am not doing massage therapy or acupuncture to help with my sobriety. As far as I am concerned that is a non issue. For now, I have it beat.
And now that I have said that, here will come 100 people telling me it stays with you forever and that I need to talk to random people in group sessions and 500,000 other suggestions, all well meaning, all ignoring every fucking thing I am telling them that I don’t need any of that. I just don’t drink, I don’t crave it, I don’t miss it, I am healthier, happier, more stable, more productive, and there is simply no desire to return to that lifestyle. Maybe one day I will need to make changes and start going to groups or whatever else, and if so, I will deal with shit on my own terms like I do everything else. But right now, my attitude is if it isn’t broke, don’t fix it, so when people start in on that stuff, again, no matter how well meaning, my eyes glaze over. For some reason, on this topic, people seem to throw out the whole concept that EVERYONE IS FUCKING DIFFERENT. My dad smoked for thirty years, a pack and a half a day, and one day said “I quit” and has never smoked again. That was thirty years ago.
I am going to massage therapy and acupuncture for pain relief. I don’t drink, which served as my self-prescribed pain relief for a long time, I absolutely LOATHE narcotics and simply refuse to take them other than for a few days after a traumatic injury. I don’t care for OTC pain relievers other than an advil here or there. I don’t do tylenol because it just destroys the liver and it provides me no pain relief whatsoever. I take an 81 mg enteric coated aspiring every day, but that is not for pain relief. Aspirin also does nothing for me in terms of pain relief.
I know those things work for some people, but not me. What does work for me is the following (re: pain relief), in no particular order:
1.) stretching
2.) mild to moderate exercise (mowing the lawn, cleaning, walking, very light weight lifting)
3.) icing with my Bledsoe cold machine at night, hot showers in the morning with a high pressure nozzle
4.) eating a good diet with foods that do not add to or, even better, reduce inflammation
5.) drinking lots of water with lemon or drinking anti-oxidizing teas
6.) good rest on a solid but comfortable bed
7.) staying in motion- the stiffness sets in when I am sedentary
8.) using essential oils in a diffuser
And now I can add massage therapy, because it really worked. Hopefully, I will get similar results from acupuncture. And even if it is not scientifically proven (more accurately, not scientifically disproved), if it is all a placebo effect, so what? I am not one to overthink things like this. If it works, I don’t really care why or how it works, I just know it works and I will repeat it.
Y’all can get wrapped around the axle about that kind of shit. I try to keep things simple in my increasingly complex life. If something works, I keep doing it. If it doesn’t, like a dead toaster or broken microwave, I throw it out and replace it with something that does work.
I am now done ranting.
Steeplejack
@John Cole +0:
Right on, Cole!
BillinGlendaleCA
@Steeplejack: Agreed.
I should also note that my doctor, you know the one with the fancy diploma on his wall that says “Doctor of Medicine”, is also an acupuncturist.
CASLondon
Totally disagree with the comment re evidence for acupuncture. Its one of the alternative medicine that has some statistical support.
I had a plantar fasciitis running injury that resisted all treatment for over a year, and I had an ex-army doctor rated by The Times of London as a “UK’s top doctor”, who runs the British Medical Acupuncture Society clinic (). It took well over 3 months of weekly sessions (with electrical stimulation added to the needles) but it worked. My doctor is especially interested in muscular skeletal pain and injuries, and there is plenty of evidence.
The key is to find a serious practitioner with some medical training as well, as there is plenty of Chinese-type needling that would worry me as ineffective or worse, or at least hit or miss. Get recommendations.
Poopyman
Now there’s a sentence I never expected to read. This may wind up as another one of Cole’s disaster stories.
Lee
I had a pulled muscle in my back that tormented me for years.
Two things helped. I went to a chiropractor and they had a massage therapist. The chiropractor did jack-shit, but the massage therapist would give me really good deep tissue massage and stretching and then hook me up to a TENS machine.
The massage/stretching and TENS machine did amazing work on my recovery. Ask if they use a TENS machine, if not find someone who does.
Emily68
Before you try the acupuncture, read up on it in ScienceBasedMedicine.org I’m just saying….
Violet
@John Cole +0:
I have an older male relative who did the same thing! About thirty years ago, I’d guess. Just quit. Never smoked again.
Completely agree with you–people are different and different things will work for different people. In fact, as science learns more in the next 20 years or so I think we’ll start to see more “personalized medicine” based on genetics, family, micrbiota, etc. What will work for one person just isn’t going to work for another. That already happens but doctors shrug their shoulders. What we need is something that can help is know ahead of time who’s in which camp.
Do what works for you. Glad the massage works and hope the acupuncture helps too.
Mnemosyne
@John Cole +0:
Sorry, I didn’t mean to harp on the alcoholism string so much, but I was going in the same direction: you don’t want to use the commonly prescribed or recommended painkillers for various reasons, so acupuncture is something else to try since right now conventional medicine is pretty much pills and that’s it when it comes to pain management.
I’m getting ready to try a FODMAP elimination diet to see if it helps my IBS. It has some pretty decent scientific backing, but a lot of gastroenterologists would still prefer to prescribe me a pill than advise me to change my diet, because saying that different sugars can affect people differently sounds like woo when you first hear it.
PNW_WarriorWoman
Superb move. Maybe massage twice per week…then come back and tell us how your body looks and feels in 6 months? You might consider and Rx of Zipsor 25 mg. gel caps. A sort of designer Ibuprophen. Also known as Diclofenac Potassium in tablet form. Gelcaps work better for me. Just an idea for the idea file.
BlueNC
@ruemara:
I have no idea where you are located, or what sort of job you are looking for, but I ran across another content strategist job less than an hour ago:
http://opportunities.matrixresources.com/job/web-content-strategist/6651c281-3f82-11e4-b3dc-bc764e1066ce/627f1491-4408-11e4-8fb2-bc764e11339f/false#.VCLyPl5RIXs
This is almost certainly with Blue Cross Blue Shield of North Carolina.
HTH.
JR in WV
@John Cole +0:
John,
I have many of the same issues you do, shoulder wise, and I find that one of the best treatments is hydrotherapy – a hot tub. A big wooden tub is best, we had a 6 by 4 red wood tub for years, til some boards began seeping at the bottom, and that got me to work many mornings.
We’re on mini vacation right now, and the B&B has nice Jacuzzis outside each cottage – worth every penny!!
I imagine Bethany’s PE department has one, try it out. If you can get a jet on the sore spots, it kinda hurts at first, but then get so much better.
Best of luck!
J R in tropical island paradise
Sterling
@Mnemosyne: Conventional medicine is the stuff that’s proven to work. The rest is just make ’em ups and hope.
John Cole +0
@Mnemosyne: Don’t sweat it. I just keep seeing it come up over and over from lots of different people.
Mnemosyne
@Sterling:
Right, but keep in mind that we’re talking about subjective states here. Pain is subjective. Right now, there is no scientific way to measure how much pain someone is in. If someone subjectively reports that acupuncture helped their neck pain, how do you scientifically prove that they didn’t actually get any pain relief? You can do double-blind studies to show that their pain relief is probably due to a placebo effect, but there’s no way to prove to that individual person that the pain relief they reported didn’t actually happen.
As I said above, I’m all on board with pointing out that acupuncture doesn’t do a thing for actual disease states — it is not going to cure cancer, or AIDS, or really anything that has an actual traceable cause. But it does seem to help some people with their subjective perception of pain when other pain treatments don’t help, and it’s hard for me to tell people that they should stop doing something that helps them cope with their pain because there isn’t scientific evidence that their pain hurts less.
@JR in WV:
Yes, but would Cole be able to get himself in and out of a hot tub without managing to injure himself in a new and spectacular way? Enquiring minds want to know.