So tonight is the annual Alfred E. Smith Memorial Foundation Dinner, one of those anodyne quasi-political events which become news only in years when the politics are particularly inflamed. Since His Eminence Cardinal Timothy Dolan is a notorious trimmer who, some people say, was rewarded by Pope Benedict with the plum NYC residency for hiding Church assets from lawsuits by survivors of clerical abuse, and who has since made a prominent pest of himself encouraging hardcore fellow Talibangelicals to resist civil laws protecting reproductive rights and same-sex marriage, reportorial hopes are high for this year’s event. Per the NYTimes:
… On Thursday night, Hillary Clinton and Donald J. Trump will appear together again for a ritzier gathering, delivering remarks at the white-tie Al Smith charity dinner at the Waldorf Astoria in Manhattan.
In most presidential campaigns, the dinner, which benefits Roman Catholic charities, functions as a welcome respite, a forum for levity and self-deprecation in the throes of a heated election.
This year’s may be more complicated.
Convened less than 24 hours after the caustic final debate on Wednesday, the event would appear, on paper, to be nothing less than a high-society nightmare for Mr. Trump…
The Clinton campaign has in recent days been forced to navigate its own turmoil after the hacked correspondences of top aides appeared to include messages criticizing Catholic conservatism…
Which reminded me that I wanted to share a remarkable Gail Sheehy article from back in 2000, a Vanity Fair piece on a related NYC event, “When Hillary Clinton and Rudy Giuliani Did Battle for a Senate Seat”:
Tonight is Rudy’s night. It is the annual New York spectacle known as the Inner Circle, where reporters skewer the mayor in cute, amateurish skits, and Hizzoner has the chance for rebuttal with his own skit. Since nobody upstages Rudolph Giuliani, his will be a Broadway-class show, perhaps his final bravura performance before November 2000, when he hopes to be turned out of the mayor’s office by virtue of his election to the United States Senate.
This evening, however, the ravening city media corps is not his chief target. Instead, it is Hillary, formerly Hillary Clinton. The two have been circling each other with the wary menace of prizefighters in the opening round, but it’s been a year now, and still they have not been in the same room. Tonight’s spectacle at the Hilton in midtown Manhattan has drawn an unusually large crowd, 1,300, including poohbahs representing every fissure in New York’s unstable political ground. They are all packed into the grand ballroom, hoping to witness the combatants touch gloves for the first time.
Enter the First Lady, looking like Cleopatra in full regalia, gowned to the floor in a pyramidal coatdress of black satin. Her neck is girdled in a collar of jewels. Her golden hair, swept high, shimmers. Most often, the whispers in her wake these days are beautiful. This is a woman who for many of her 52 years never cared a fig about her appearance, but in the chrysalis of transformation from political wife to independent woman, the jawline has been chiseled, the dominatrix eyebrows weeded, the weight dropped, and the result is a woman who obviously enjoys for the first time being called beautiful. Three old birds, Democratic regulars who refer to themselves as jaded, admitted after seeing Hillary speak in a suburb of New York, as one of them put it, “We weren’t prepared to be impressed, and we are impressed. First, the physical package. The polish. I would kill to get ahold of her hairdresser and makeup person. Kill.”…Tonight is yet another rite of passage for Mrs. Clinton. A woman of grand ambition whose original choice was to channel her political aspirations through her naturally gifted husband, she is stumbling through the learning stage of candidacy for elective office. No out-of-town tryouts. She’s opening in New York.
For the first half of the interminable evening she watches the press show, Livin’ la Rudy Loca, where the mayor is called Mr. Mean, but the gags about her are meaner. The Hillary character jumps on a subway to Shea Stadium, “where I can watch my favorite team, the New York Yankees!” When an annoyed straphanger educates her that the Yankees play in Yankee Stadium, the Hillary character trills, “We live in Chappaqua now, you know. That’s Indian for ‘The Land of Separate Bedrooms.’ ” Necks swivel in unison toward Table 28. She’s laughing! Then she’s hit with the lyrics “If she could handle Monica, would Rudy cause her pain?” Heads whirl toward Table 28. “How does she look?” “Wan.” In a skit where the Hillary character is jailed by the Mayor Giuliani character, she finds herself sharing a cell with Sean “Puffy” Combs and his girlfriend, Jennifer Lopez. Bill Clinton shows up with “soft bail money,” but instead of springing his wife, he feels Jennifer’s pain and strolls off arm in arm with the halfnaked songstress.
Intermission. Hillary gets up, laughing ostentatiously, and announces, “I’m still standing.”
Before Round Three begins, one of the mayor’s men approaches Hillary’s press secretary, Wolfson, and asks to take the First Lady backstage. “Why should she go backstage?” snarls the handler, a stain of fear spreading across his formal shirt.
“Tra-dish-shun!” sings the mayor’s man.
Backstage, Hillary again approaches the unsuspecting mayor from behind and delicately lays a hand on his shoulder. He turns around. She faces him down with flattery. “Well, I hear you’re the real star.”
Giuliani stutters a reply: “We’re gonna see, we’re gonna see. I like doing it.”
“I can’t wait to see it.”
Her charm offensive seems to rattle him. When Rudy’s smile is forced, the lips turn down, and his deathly white face resembles that of the Phantom of the Opera. Regaining his edge after she leaves, he gets off a few sarcastic remarks to reporters: “I’m very, very encouraged at the fact we’re drawing lots of out-of-towners to this performance of mine.”
Of mine.
But it is Hillary’s star power that radiates to every corner of the ballroom. New York bigwigs, such as financial-media impresario Michael Bloomberg, attorney and labor mediator Theodore Kheel, and District Attorney Robert Morgenthau, crane to see her. An informal receiving line forms three-deep around her table. Powerful men who might be expected to support the mayor but who cannot get a phone call returned from him are drawn to meet Hillary. One is Harold Levy, the interim New York City schools chancellor, who is about to be slapped down by the mayor for daring to work out incentives with the teachers’ union to avert a crisis in the city’s summer-school program; his crime, failing to recognize the real schools chancellor—Rudolph Giuliani. Another enemy the mayor can’t afford, Michael Long, chairman of the Conservative Party of New York State, waits his turn. The tall, hefty man with a kindly Saint Bernard face holds a minimum of 350,000 votes in his pocket, but Giuliani won’t talk to him. They sat down nearly a year before, and Long told the mayor his party was open to considering an endorsement. By summer, when Long hadn’t heard back, he joined with New York governor George Pataki, who at the time was said to be unofficially promoting the candidacy of Rick Lazio, a young and likable Long Island congressman. “I told the mayor, ‘Don’t take it personal,’ ” Long recalls…
Just in case you might be wondering why Giuliani seems to be taking his attack-dog role as Trump surrogate… so personal.
Nom de Plume
And people wonder why Trump doesn’t scare her. He’s the junior varsity.
bystander
I forgot about Giuliani running for the Senate. Didn’t he have to abandon the campaign because he had prostate cancer? I love seeing him hitch his star to the Titanic.
Schlemazel
@bystander:
He is already on board the Titanic but he quit the senate race when it was apparent he could not win
David ?▶️Bad Hombres▶️? Koch
@bystander: he used the cancer as an excuse. His various affairs, including one with his own press secretary, were revealed during the campaign and splashed all over the dailies and he sunk like a stone in the polls.
bystander
When HRC was running for the Senate, a client who was as plugged into NY politics as anyone could ever be said that the consensus was that she was not a team player and would never be able to do the unglamorous work of a junior Senator. At the end of her term, even repubs stepped forward to talk about how hard she worked and what a determined, self-effacing Senator she was. I was happy to see Al Franken following the same path. Compare and contrast Ted Cruz.
debbie
I’ve come to believe Rudi doesn’t like women at all, not just Hillary. He is Trump’s Mini-Me.
debbie
@David ?▶️Bad Hombres▶️? Koch:
Seeing the change in your nym, have there been any protests in Trump’s use of that word last night?
bystander
@David ?▶️Bad Hombres▶️? Koch: I did not recall that part. It did launch Donna Hanover’s acting gigs on Law and Order.
WaterGirl
@debbie: Did you mean “like” or “respect”? :-)
I have no idea on the like front, but I’m definitely thinking he doesn’t respect women or have the ability to see them as full equals. (or his betters!)
cmorenc
Today was the first day of early voting in N.C., and at Lake Lynn community ctr early voting site I went to in north Raleigh, the line to vote was an hour and a half long (!) Despite people on their way out who had already voted informing people newly walking toward the line how long the wait was, very few newcomers were discouraged into leaving to try again another day – most people stuck it out.
BTW: just by coincidence, MSNBC conducted an interview with the Rev. William Barber (MSNBC reporter was Chris Jansing) barely five feet away directly in front of my momentary place in the voting line. Rev. Barber is a good man personally, but physically he’s a walking heart attack waiting to happen.
Trentrunner
@cmorenc: Weird comment about Barber’s weight. I’m pretty sure he’s aware of it. Anyone who’s seen him is aware of it. Why are we talking about this? Any evidence that fat-shaming helps anything?
SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch
(Cross-posted, more or less intact, from downstairs thread):
It’s not a big priority for me, and I haven’t even checked yet to see how I might watch it on the iPad, but if anyone happens to know–or, better, if any front-pager wants to put up a link so we can comment, laugh and point in real time–that would be nice.
Mnemosyne
I probably rode this hobbyhorse into the ground last summer during Highlightgate, but that’s why Highlightgate was so stupid and probably only increased the gender gap. Every woman has trouble with her hair and ends up paying what is objectively “too much” money to get it done the way she likes.
For a woman in the public eye, spending hundreds or even thousands of dollars on your hair and makeup isn’t an indulgence — it’s an investment. And most women aren’t going to look down on someone for spending whatever she needs to spend to look good. (This is also why Michelle Obama is popular even with women who hate her husband’s policies.)
Spending a ridiculous amount to look bad, like Anne Romney … that’s a different story.
dogwood
I have two routes out of my neighborhood when I go out and about. Either choice passes by a house with a Trump yard sign. This morning I took route “A” and the Trump sign was gone. It could have been stolen, defaced, or perhaps they’re embarrassed.
debbie
@WaterGirl:
I meant not liking, which also includes not respecting. He’d tolerate women because his religion tells him to, but deep down, they’re clearly inferior to him.
I lived in NYC during his prosecuting days and left right before he was elected mayor. There were plenty of news clips of his sneering, demeaning ways, and don’t forget how he announced his separation to his wife and the world at a press conference. Couldn’t even stand to tell her to her face.
He’s just despicable.
waysel
@dogwood: Same thing in my area. Not many Trump signs, but yesterday one of them was gone. I’m hoping they got discouraged and won’t bother voting. There were lots of Romney signs here during that race, so the lack of Trump signs may be a good sign.
Ian
Someone here earlier compared Rudy to Gollum. I am liking it more and more.
Aleta
(Put this in the wrong thread, so again here.)
Today the janitor, life long Repub, retired career military, who likes to stop by to talk about outer space research, came by to say he had just voted for Hillary. He wasn’t exactly happy, but he felt he had to vote against Trump.
WaterGirl
@debbie: Wow, I had forgotten about the public announcement that he was leaving his wife. That is despicable.
cmorenc
@Trentrunner:
This isn’t fat-shaming so much as concern that Rev Barber may at some time in the foreseeable future be incapacitated by cardiovascular health problems. I realize in his case the situation is compounded by his arthritic condition of ankylosing spondylitis, but even taking that into account, he’s not a healthy-looking man in person, even though his eloquent mind shines through in every sentence he speaks.
Schlemazel
@Trentrunner:
A weird comment but I am going to assume it was a poorly worded message of concern about his health. I think we all wish him a long and glorious life and worry about him
dogwood
@Mnemosyne:
Anne Romney looks fine. She’s an attractive, well-groomed 65 year old woman. Why do you even bring her up?
Feebog
Anecdotal, but interesting discussion with the Mrs. last night. She went out with a couple friends to celebrate a birthday. One friend is completely non-political and basically votes the same as her husband, who is a retired Union guy and mostly votes liberal, with a few exceptions now and again. The other friend is not very political either, but has always held pretty conservative views as long as we have known her (like for 35 years). During lunch friend number two revealed she is voting for Clinton. She is completely turned off by Trump’s boorish behavior and comments about women. I was pretty flabbergasted, if that is happening across the country, Katy bar the doors.
Schlemazel
@WaterGirl:
Don’t forget that he brought his side-piece to Gracie Mansion where his wife and kids lived with him.
‘Ol 9/11 makes low life scum look like decent people
p.a.
@dogwood: Doesn’t embarrassment imply self-awareness? Must’ve been stolen.
tangental doggie psychology point: I’ve always thought of goldens as smart dogs because I swear they look embarrassed with people around when they squat to #2.
Mnemosyne
Also, too, if you hadn’t seen the poll results, the next Movie Club film is Preston Sturges’ Unfaithfully Yours. Our gracious hostess is frantically packing for her imminent move, so I will try to have my essay posted tomorrow morning.
WaterGirl
@Schlemazel: Ugh.
Mnemosyne
@dogwood:
Because she’s a terrible dresser. She has very poor taste.
And please note that I am not criticizing her physical attributes. I’m criticizing her poor taste in clothing.
danielx
@bystander:
Also, too, compare and contrast Marco Rubio.
redshirt
@waysel: My area is just the opposite. Way more Trump signs then Romney signs in 2012.
And I, too, have been hoping to see some disappear out of some sense of shame, but nope, only more, and bigger!
I’m making a list…..
Percysowner
Whoa! Tweety just shut Trump’s surrogate, Steve Cortez, down cold! He wouldn’t let him get off topic. He wouldn’t allow him to misrepresent Trump saying he won’t accept the result of the election. He finally told the guy, this isn’t going to work and moved on to someone else, I don’t know if they shut his mic off, but Tweety was NOT having it.
Mnemosyne
@dogwood:
Exhibit B.
As someone’s granny said, money can’t buy good taste.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Mnemosyne: Ah good you’re here. I ran across this forum about old LA. It’s got a lot of links to older movie locations, why I though of you. It also has pics of Satan*’s former HQ.
*Satan, aka my former employer.
debbie
@Mnemosyne:
Ooh, sounds good. Where do you post?
NotMax
Lots of info at the link, but this stood out:
dogwood
@Mnemosyne:
There isn’t a single woman who is in the public eye, where it is required that you never wear the same thing twice, who hasn’t worn something that doesn’t work.
Villago Delenda Est
“Catholic conservatives” looked the other way when Jews were being herded into the delousing showers.
Fuck them.
redshirt
@?BillinGlendaleCA: Wolfram and Hart?
Mnemosyne
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
I have something for you as well — the Society of Architectural Historians is doing a tour of the restored Glendale Air Terminal — details here.
(I don’t need a tour because I can wander around and gape at it during business hours.)
SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch
@Percysowner:
Heard that just now in the car. I didn’t recognize the guy’s voice, although I’ve heard Cortez a few times before. I generally loathe Tweety, but I have to laugh and cheer when he gets the bit between his teeth like that.
Mnemosyne
@debbie:
It will be there on Schroedinger’s Cat’s website. She was gracious enough to invite me to blab about movies there since we have similar thematic interests in very different movies.
guachi
@NotMax:
I’m in the military. Most of them are really stupid when it comes to politics. I’d care not a whit what people in the military (as a whole) thought about a Presidential candidate.
SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch
@Mnemosyne:
Yikes!
Now I can easily see a scarf in that print to set off a neutral or solid-colour suit jacket (although I’d prefer a fabric other than that awful shiny sateen or whatever it is). But an entire dress, or even blouse? Uh, no.
opiejeanne
@Mnemosyne: There is a phrase, advice about wearing the dress, and not letting it wear you. She likes large patterned fabrics in bright colors, and so do I but it’s hard to pull off for most of us and that includes Ann Romney.
This is the example I remember that struck me as being a poor choice: http://cdn.styleblazer.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Ann-Romney-1000-Shirt.jpg?x74375 The figures are birds, but my first impression was that the one on the front was a fish. It cost $990 and for that money she could have found something that showed her off instead of being a distraction.
Bottom line: she just needs a stylist. (Don’t we all)
?BillinGlendaleCA
@redshirt: Look at the pics. It’s worse, much worse than that; an oil company.
opiejeanne
Oh drat, I forgot about the naked links and my comment is stuck awaiting moderation.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Mnemosyne: Thanks, I’ve walked past and taken some pics in the past month or so.
opiejeanne
@Mnemosyne: Oh gah!!! I forgot about that one.
trollhattan
@Mnemosyne:
But she could really rock that 2008 Rafalca.
redshirt
@?BillinGlendaleCA: I did. I must confess I love LA. Especially old school noir LA.
WaterGirl
@SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch: @dogwood: @Mnemosyne: I’ve gotta go with Mnem and SD on this one. That dress is one of the better things I’ve seen Ann Romney wear.
I do agree with dogwood on the general point that everybody famous makes a bad choice now and again – even Michelle Obama has worn a few things where I have to wonder why she could have ever chosen that, and I almost always love what she wears.
opiejeanne
@dogwood: That’s not the problem. Ann is consistently wrong in her choice of clothing and the way it fits. Yes, she is lovely, but she needs a stylist.
opiejeanne
@Mnemosyne: There is a phrase, advice about wearing the dress, and not letting it wear you. She likes large patterned fabrics in bright colors, and so do I but it’s hard to pull off for most of us and that includes Ann Romney.
This is the example I remember that struck me as being a poor choice: Expensive blouse
The figures are birds, but my first impression was that the one on the front was a fish. It cost $990 and for that money she could have found something that showed her off instead of being a distraction.
Bottom line: she just needs a stylist. (Don’t we all)
WaterGirl
I voted last week, or maybe the week before? Now I just ask everybody “have you voted yet?” Amazing how many conversations that has started that begin with “I want to vote but I don’t like either of them”. I try not to immediately go to “yeah, but only one of them is a psychopath”, but i usually get there sooner or later.
opiejeanne
@SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch: That dress cost a lot and whoever turned it into a dress, especially in that style, should be shot.
opiejeanne
@?BillinGlendaleCA: Gorgeous photos.
Soylent Green
@Feebog: I wonder how many women have told their husbands, “Yes, honey, of course I’m voting for Trump.”
SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch
@opiejeanne:
Ann’s a nice-looking woman, but she looks upholstered in that fabric. LESS IS MORE!!
Gin & Tonic
@efgoldman:
You could always vote absentee. You don’t have to give any reason. Unfortunately the deadline for requesting a ballot was two days ago.
Mnemosyne
@dogwood:
Well, we’re never going to agree. I think that fashion choices — which are under the wearer’s control — are up for criticism when people are in the public eye. You don’t. That’s life sometimes.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@redshirt: Then that’s a great forum for you to look at, it’s 1800 pages so it’ll take a lot of time.
@opiejeanne: They are, I’d never seen the interior shots of the Richfield building(though I’ve seen the elevator doors since they’re standing next to the old ARCO Tower). I think I probably saw the Richfield building twice, the first time at night and the second as they were demolishing it(though it didn’t stand out enough for me to have a firm memory(I was 8 or 9)..
Chip Daniels
Being a Californian, I was paid only scant attention to Hillary’s Senate run and missed this story.
So it her skill this time makes even more sense- she has been battling heavyweights for all her professional life, and now is faced off with an oafish barroom bully who managed to deck a couple of drunks and thinks he’s Muhammed effing Ali.
Mnemosyne
@opiejeanne:
Yeah, I’m not saying Mrs. Romney is Worse Than Hitler because she has bad taste in clothing. But the fact is that she does have bad taste in clothing, and she spends a lot of money for that clothing when (IMO) she could look a lot better by making better choices.
p.a.
@efgoldman@Gin & Tonic: I believe we also have an Alec-written voter i.d. law now. Halitosis Hall strikes again.
The Pale Scot
@SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch: C-span
p.a.
@Chip Daniels: The diff between a brawler and a boxer: the boxer is used to getting hit and can take punches. A brawler might take one or two max. tRump isn’t even disciplined enough to be a brawler. Hilz has 20+ years experience in the ring. Against cheap shot artists too. You KNOW Putin doesn’t want her in the big chair.
Percysowner
@efgoldman:
He’s willing to accept the results of the election if he wins. Other than that he’ll concede ONLY if HE’S convinced there has been no funny business. His surrogates are trying to push the idea that he walked it back, but not really.
debbie
@WaterGirl:
My mom used to get very snippy about Cindy McCain’s St. John’s suits which she frequently wore. My mom was for McCain, but there was something about those suits that set her off.
debbie
@Percysowner:
He was going for the cheap laugh, but it’ll bite him in his ample butt before this is all over.
Mnemosyne
@SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch:
Jessica Walter used to play a similar type on “Arrested Development.” But she has better taste in real life.
workworkwork
@WaterGirl: We had a technician out to fix my wife’s wheelchair and he started talking about voting third party (because #BothSides).
I said, “We’ve already voted so this conversation is irrelevant.”
I’m not sure why I phrased it that way but this election gets my wife extremely upset ( to the point where she starts yelling) and I wanted to shut the topic down ASAP.
She’s already dealing with a lot of issues (M.S., spinal fusion, catheter, in respite care while I heal, etc.)
WaterGirl
@workworkwork: Sounds like you protected your wife, shut down the conversation, and didn’t even call the guy an idiot. I call that a win!
Slappy Kincaid
@cmorenc: @workworkwork: I early voted in downtown Raleigh and the line was around the block at 11 a.m.
The good Rev. Barbour actually has an unusual illness that affects bone growth. I think he said that it caused bones to fuse together and is a source of chronic pain. That explains his unusual posture and stiff movements. His health certainly is not the greatest.