To friends asking "Aren't you terrified?" the response from (suitably) the Mark Rylance character in Bridge of Spies: "Would it help?"
— Eliot A Cohen (@EliotACohen) November 9, 2016
.
Apart from going to bed early to catch up on missed sleep, what’s on the agenda for the evening?
I was 20 when Reagan was elected. We thought it was the end of us. But the struggle continued and we've won a lot of battles since.
— Al Giordano (@AlGiordano) November 9, 2016
What democracy does democracy can un-do. We can make sure that there are only two years of this. But that's gonna take work.
— The Rude Pundit (@rudepundit) November 9, 2016
JMG
They’re all right. But it’ll take some time for the troops to recover. Best IMO to accept the holiday truce of ignoring politics most Americans give themselves every election. Winner gets first move, so you have to wait.
goblue72
Don’t see why we gotta wait. The GOP pre-committed to oppose Hillary’s SCOTUS nominations even before there was an election.
I see no reason why Dems shouldn’t pre-commit to oppose Trump in everything, before there is even an inauguration. Except for the usual lack of balls displayed by your average Democratic pol.
Corner Stone
BECAUSE EMAILS!!
Baud
I wanted to say how much I appreciate having you guys around.
Corner Stone
CHANGE ELECTION!! CHANGE!!
Corner Stone
I sure hope Comey is enjoying a really nice Cuban cigar.
celticdragonchick
@goblue72:
The filibuster gets nuked when the senate come back into session.
Democratic senators will have few tools to hold things up.
Major Major Major Major
Kurt Vonnegut
Mike R
Like a kidney Stone this too shall pass.
trollhattan
@goblue72:
Yeah, don’t see that happening.
“It takes weeks to build a barn and hours to knock one down.” This guy will get in and sabotage things that took decades, then leave a SCOTUS firewall behind him–one term or two. We’re in the soup.
goblue72
@celticdragonchick: Let them nuke it. If they are going to nuke it, they are going to nuke it. Pre-surrendering gets us nowhere.
humboldtblue
If you think that this Democratic party’s leadership is in any way shape or form going to have enough savvy or smarts to challenge for the house in two years you’re fooling yourself. Democrats can’t be bothered to turn out in off year elections and the Republicans control the statehouses. Democrats can’t be bothered to turn out this year for a monumental election between one party bent on burning all the shit down and the other standing there with an empty bucket and no water source.
Giordano is full of shit, there was nowhere near the sense of foreboding when Reagan was elected because Regan for all his fucking faults wasn’t a vile, ignorant buffoon who just conned more than 50-million Americans to vote for him. At least that conniving motherfucker had charm and a sense of elan. Democrats aren’t winning back the fucking house or the senate and party leadership, the same fucking gang of dipshits who couldn’t beat Donald Trump, are still right there in charge.
celticdragonchick
@Corner Stone:
We cannot get rid of him now because anybody AG Giuliani suggests as a replacement will be orders of magnitude worse.
Comey pisses off the GOP almost as much as he pisses us off. That is the only thing that may keep Hillary from being arrested since he shut down the investigation into the Clinton Foundation.
Quinerly
@Baud:
This blog has saved me today. Thank you. I have been heartbroken over my mother’s death. Had a flash of a thought today that I was glad that she didn’t live to see this.
Major Major Major Major
@goblue72: kos suggested this today. Even if it’s something we agree with like infrastructure, make them pass it with their own damn votes. Total opposition. Short of confirming Garland, fuck them and their fucking everything.
Baud
@Quinerly: I’m sorry about your mom.
rikyrah
Peanut called me at work. She was upset about Ferret Head and looked to me to give her assurance. 8 years old. I tried. ???
jacy
@Baud:
Ditto
J.
Thanks for posting these reminders, Anne Laurie. I remember being a young teen when Reagan was elected and thinking it was the end of the world. And I wish I could hold back the terror I feel. (It certainly isn’t helping.) Instead, I wrote about it in this Trumpian parody of Goodnight Moon, which I titled Good Day Gloom: A Post-Election Scary Tale. Enjoy!
goblue72
@Major Major Major Major: Worked for the GOP. They opposed everything included a vacant SCOTUS seat. And they won everything as their reward.
i realize that for Democrats the pre-surrender fetal position is now muscle memory and it takes a while to re-train that muscle to do something different. But its long past time we started.
celticdragonchick
Assumes that national voting rights restrictions and other measures do not permanently damage the electorate.
There is non zero chance that last night was the last POTUS election in our lifetimes. Sorry, but electing fascists has consequences.
Corner Stone
@celticdragonchick: He will not be in a Trump admin, may as well have some fun and nuke him during the transition.
Obama will not, because is a decent and honorable man. But still the guy (Comey) needs to be remembered for his actions.
J.
@Mike R: But man is it going to be painful.
Juice Box
@celticdragonchick: “That is the only thing that may keep Hillary from being arrested since he shut down the investigation into the Clinton Foundation.” That and a complete lack of any criminal activity.
Patricia Kayden
goblue72
@humboldtblue: Also too, when Reagan won, he only won the Senate. Dems had control of the House. It was tenuous, but Tip’s give ’em enough rope strategy was sufficient to drag things to the midterms when the Dems took back the Senate.
There’s a whole host of difference between Reagan in the WH without control over Congress vs. Trump and a Congress entirely controlled by the GOP with healthy margins. Esp when they know that the midterms favor them, since their opposition has assembled an electoral coalition strategy built around voting groups that are the least likely to turnout.
PsiFighter37
Just read that Sarah Palin is being considered for Interior Secretary. Good God.
Major Major Major Major
@goblue72: it’ll be harder without the filibuster but that might actually stick around since it only takes, what, two or three senators at this point to defect on the rules vote and there are reasons of process and grandstanding that senators might want it around. There’s also the possibility that folks like Sasse want some Trump-stopping leverage. McConnell has said that infrastructure and other things that might actually be beneficial for the country are low priorities compared to killing poors and cramming the courts full of judges, so without D votes Trump’s Great Wall and other fascist great works are going nowhere.
celticdragonchick
Hearing (seriously) that Sarah Palin will be put forward for Sec Interior.
JPL
@rikyrah: I tried also with thirty somethings sons. It’s tough no matter the age.
PsiFighter37
@Major Major Major Major: Schumer is almost certainly going to try and chum it up with Trump. If infrastructure comes before the Senate, it’s almost certainly going to pass with a lot of Democratic votes.
So depressing. I will miss Harry Reid, because that fucker would not compromise with Trump on anything at all.
JMG
@Juice Box: Comey will get fired. This will be stupid, as I sure hope he has enough Washington savvy to a thumb drive or two with him out the door, but Trump IMO is more likely to fight with Republicans than Clinton. He already beat her. She’s nothing to him now.
RaflW
It’ll take nerves of steel, and it may not work (but IMO it’s the only viable strategy), we step out of the way and let them step on their own dicks like crazy. As @rudepundit says, its’ only two years to the next House election.
Pelosi gives ’em one, and only one, assist, and that is on infrastructure spending. Other than that, it’s not total opposition (with what, anyway?), it’s just “please proceed” Trump (ie: pro-forma no votes by the Dem House, but that just makes every shitty GOP bill 100% theirs to won). He can’t deliver on what the base who elected him thinks he can.
If Dems oppose him at every move, he blames us for all the failures (and the press that ignored McConnell’s pure obstruction will not do the same for us). We not in Congress, we organize. We get in the damn streets and get people running for every school board, every taxing district, every US House seat, no matter how +R it is right now.
I’m sure many of you will disagree, or attack Susan Sarandon, or whatever. But that’s my thought for what we do. And part of my challenge to me is: much less time on twitter, FB and BJ. I’ll stop by, but I realize now what a luxury it is to be wanking along on social platforms. I’ve got people to go meet, organize, fudraise with, rally with, do shit with.
trollhattan
For my California fellow inmates, the propositions per the SoS office late morning:
51 passing comfortably
52 passing overwhelmingly
53 failing narrowly (keep eyes on this one)
54 passing overwhelmingly
55 passing overwhelmingly
56 passing overwhelmingly
57 passing overwhelmingly
58 passing with highest margin of all
59 passing comfortably
60 failing
61 failing
62 failing
63 passing overwhelmingly
64 passing comfortably
65 failing
66 passing narrowly (likewise to be watched)
67 passing comfortably
Every one I truly wanted to pass is, except the death penalty ban while the turbocharged death penalty is passing–a double-whammy telling me California still gets starbursts from executions. Shame on us.
khead
As the person who was the most vocal and (apparently) most delusional in saying “It will be ok” here at BJ as the election went up in flames last night, I just wanted to let y’all know that I will also be posting my NFL picks early Sunday so you can fade them. I am sure you can use the money.
Bill
This is a lovely sentiment, except that the Court is lost for another generation.
I didn’t think it was possible for America to be worse than I imagined. But apparently it is.
Keith G
It’s time to start the responce.
I want eveny executive agency and department to release all the data they can over the work they have been doing. This will be important for places like the HHS. The truth about Obamacare needs to be set free before the GOP embargoes reports that show success. The same all up and down the administrative departments.
I know Obama will stay the statesman, but golly do we need him to be an insurgent-in-chief.
GrandJury
Amazon and Washington post might have serious problems under a Trump presidency. They were super critical of him the whole election and he already said he wants to go after them.
This is what it’s going to be like for at least the next 2 years. Sending the IRS and DOJ after all his enemies. Repubs will probably let him get away with it to as long as he gives them the SCOTUS they want and the laws they want.
Patricia Kayden
@PsiFighter37: Well, she does love hunting and such so she’s a perfect fit, I guess. Rightwing logic.
Mary G
@Baud: @jacy: @Quinerly: Fourth. I finally got a couple of hours of sleep and I just can’t go anywhere online but here.
Obama should pardon Bill and Hillary, Huma, and everyone else who worked on the emails. If Ford can do it for Nixon…
Also Fahrenthold too. He is in major danger.
Peale
@humboldtblue: it’s been 1 day. If all the dipshits in charge left today…oh never mind.
Cacti
@trollhattan:
As someone who cut his legal teeth working in the California criminal court system, I can say that criminal justice is one area where the sunshine state is one of the most regressive in the country.
celticdragonchick
@Juice Box:
Lack of an actual crime will not stop Giuliani or Chris Christie.
They are going to punish people.
COINTELPRO is coming back…and liberal groups, BLM and newspapers are all going to be investigated, punished and prosecuted.
You heard it here…BLM will be declared a terrorist group or a criminal conspiracy and Deray etc are going to be indicted on God only knows what.
Jeffro
@goblue72:
Today I have been in a daze: tomorrow I put the anger to work organizing and writing. VA’s got a gubernatorial election coming up next year and I’m not going to see my state go down in flames like Michigan or Kansas or Wisconsin. Fu-u-u-u-ck that.
And after that, I want the House, and then 2020 is of course the main (final?) event for a host of reasons.
But right now one day at a time, and it starts with keeping these scummy Republicans out of the VA governor’s mansion.
cokane
@humboldtblue: theres a not impossible chance that Trump is so bad in his first two years, that we get a 2006 backlash.
MikeBoyScout
I’m numb, sad and angry. Through Friday I’m going to self care and care for those who need my help processing.
Come Saturday morning I’m going to build my plan.
See, while I am a white privileged male, I’m a fighter. I’m a Steelers fan who grew up on “Whatever it takes” and observed the results.
I’m a Hilz supporter who watched her get knocked down only to rise again.
I’m a Veteran who has been in fights before, and never shyed away.
I’m a proud member of the Democratic party.
And I’ll be FSM damned if I won’t meet this challenge!
And I will be asking for your help.
In it to win it.
Fk racism! Fk Trump!
The arc of history bends towards justice, and I’m not going to die until I’ve applied maximum torque.
celticdragonchick
@Mary G:
This.
We are going to see actual political oppression very, very soon.
quakerinabasement
Visiting friends from India and Nepal to commiserate.
trollhattan
@PsiFighter37: @celticdragonchick:
James Watt without the brains, super! GCC denier for EPA transition team. It gets better and better.
Cacti
@khead:
(Hugs)
It’s not your fault. Dark times are when we need optimists the most.
Major Major Major Major
@celticdragonchick:
It went away?
celticdragonchick
@MikeBoyScout:
There is absolutely nothing in the historical record to support that idea.
History bends towards power and wealth for the powerful and hardship and death upon the weak.
We fight this as we can, but we fight entropy after a fashion.
Major Major Major Major
@celticdragonchick:
20th century? Modern standards of living? Medicine?
danielx
Speaking of music, I most def am Not Ready To Make Nice.
O. Felix Culpa
@humboldtblue:
Well, a small crack of light in contrary mode: we took back the state legislature and retained Dem control of the state senate in New Mexico, elected a Democratic Secretary of State, and returned our Democratic congressman in CD3. It was intentionally and explicitly a coordinated campaign all up and down the ticket. Maybe our Democrats is learning. I fervently hope so.
japa21
While Sarah as Sec of Interior isn’t bad. She is well familiar with wide open spaces, like the one between her ears.
And my wife thinks Christie should be the Secretary of Transportation.
quakerinabasement
@goblue72: I feel you. But when they did the wrong thing, they didn’t make it right for us to do the same thing.
trollhattan
@Cacti: My newish blue-county DA wrote an absolutely chilling Op-Ed on why we must keep and…er…improve the death penalty. And don’t tell her it doesn’t prevent murders, damnit, because reasons. And our sheriff is papering the county with concealed carry permits (something like a sixth of adult males or somesuch) and because he lost his House bid we’re stuck with him (never mind the sexual harassment settlements). Not sure what “blue county” means in real terms.
GrandJury
@Major Major Major Major: Almost never happens. There is usually at least a few Dems that cross the isle.
Dems just don’t have the taste for complete obstruction like Repubs do.
The US is basically a 1 party political system now. Not sure what the name is for that but it’s not “democracy”. Technically it still is but really just the illusion of democracy now.
celticdragonchick
@Major Major Major Major:
Dachau. Bergen Belsen. Rwanda. Nuclear weapons, Stalin, Pol Pot.
i could go on.
In most cases, justice as a concept is laughable when you examine the sheer horror of the 20th century. Certainly, most murderous dictators never encounter even cursory justice and continue to inflict their mayhem upon their hapless fellows.
Liberal rule of law is still an exception rather then the rule through most of the world and there is utterly no guarantee that democracy or precepts of the Enlightenment will be the final word in human governance. The body of human history suggests otherwise, in fact.
Patricia Kayden
@GrandJury: So Trump will be preoccupied with going after all of his enemies? Reminds me of someone. Hmmmm. Oh yeah. Christie shut down a bridge with thousands of commuters for multiple days to get back at a Democratic Mayor who didn’t support his gubernatorial candidacy.
What nice folks we have in charge of our government.
No One of Consequence
Today has not gotten any better. I have an unshakable sense of foreboding.
Could be there are repercussions of a steady diet of reality television and celebrity worship. Could be the dumbing-down of the electorate yields short to medium term electoral gains, but quite possibly at the expense or even the existence of the Republic. Could be our fellow Citizens are, in significant numbers, so filled with hate and resentment that they will be content to bring the temple down around their ears.
I wouldn’t mind that last thought so much, if we weren’t all of us standing under the roof.
What will incense me to no end, is the shear, simple fact that despite malfeasance, maliciousness, malign intent; despite indifference, ignorance, and infamy: these fuckers are not being punished… Heaven’s no. In fact, they are being rewarded.
Some solace from one who has passed into stillness:
“All right,” said Susan. “I’m not stupid. You’re saying humans need… fantasies to make life bearable.”
REALLY? AS IF IT WAS SOME KIND OF PINK PILL? NO. HUMANS NEED FANTASY TO BE HUMAN. TO BE THE PLACE WHERE THE FALLING ANGEL MEETS THE RISING APE.
“Tooth fairies? Hogfathers? Little—”
YES. AS PRACTICE. YOU HAVE TO START OUT LEARNING TO BELIEVE THE LITTLE LIES.
“So we can believe the big ones?”
YES. JUSTICE. MERCY. DUTY. THAT SORT OF THING.
“They’re not the same at all!”
YOU THINK SO? THEN TAKE THE UNIVERSE AND GRIND IT DOWN TO THE FINEST POWDER AND SIEVE IT THROUGH THE FINEST SIEVE AND THEN SHOW ME ONE ATOM OF JUSTICE, ONE MOLECULE OF MERCY. AND YET—Death waved a hand. AND YET YOU ACT AS IF THERE IS SOME IDEAL ORDER IN THE WORLD, AS IF THERE IS SOME…SOME RIGHTNESS IN THE UNIVERSE BY WHICH IT MAY BE JUDGED.
“Yes, but people have got to believe that, or what’s the point—”
MY POINT EXACTLY.”
― Terry Pratchett, Hogfather
Irony Abounds
And right on cue…
The GOP will be going for the killshot folks. This may be the one time when a horrible recession would actually do the country good because it might make it possible to take back Congress in 2018. Otherwise we won’t recognize what the US will look like in 4 years.
Major Major Major Major
edit: nm I have no interest in arguing about this
goblue72
@quakerinabasement: You are perfectly free to think its cute to play by Marquess of Queensbury rules. But if you have no appetite for bloodsport, get the fuck out of politics. If dirty is what it takes to win, fight dirty. Because in politics, the ONLY thing that matter is winning. The winners get to govern. The losers get the rogering.
Anne Laurie
@MikeBoyScout:
Thank you for that lovely phrasing!
GrandJury
Yea I don’t see 2018 getting any better. Not in an improving economy which will likely keep improving.
In fact it could very well get worse. Dems just don’t show up anymore for midterms and a bunch of Dem senators up for re-election in 2018. I think there were 7 million fewer Dem voters yesterday compared to 2012. Repubs only had 1million fewer. So those are not encouraging numbers at all.
Unless Trump screws up incredibly bad. Like 10x worse than Bush…which could happen, I don’t see any light at the end of this tunnel.
jharp
I too was 20 when Reagan was elected.
And we still haven’t fixed all the damage he did.
This is bad. Very very bad.
JPL
@japa21: Yeah..Neon Trump signs at the Grand Canyon
Patricia Kayden
@celticdragonchick: That’s not going to intimidate BLM or Deray from speaking up and protesting against police brutality. We’ve seen this film before during the Civil Rights movement and we see how that story ended. Black people don’t scare easily.
goblue72
@Irony Abounds: Which is why all the handwriting about “but, but, but if we oppose them, they might take the filibuster away” is just so much namby pamby Dem garbage. GOP is going to try to do whatever it can to maximize their power. Dems can act like a bunch of fraidy cats, or they can actually fight back by opposing everything.
Major Major Major Major
@GrandJury: stfu pantswetter.
Daulnay
@JMG:
You forget what a vindictive shit Trump is. He will settle scores, first with Republican ‘traitors’ and then with Clinton. She made him look hopelessly bad on national television. Winning the election wasn’t enough for him, it is only the start.
No One of Consequence
@MikeBoyScout: that last line is fucking awesome. Stolen. Not apologizing. Need the ammunition. My deepest thanks.
– NOoC
SiubhanDuinne
@humboldtblue:
His temperament was a polar opposite from Trump’s. He conveyed enormous optimism. No matter what you thought of his politics, his disposition was sunny and cheerful, and you couldn’t help thinking that one way or another, things were eventually going to work out just fine in Ronald Reagan’s world — whereas Trump’s world is a dark, scary, treacherous, menacing place, a deep German forest with downed tree limbs to trip you and wolves to eat you. Well, apparently that’s what the American people want, so I hope they get it good and hard.
goblue72
@GrandJury: Yeah, based on current conditions, seems more likely recession a few years out. But pretty high odds we get one before 2020 at some point.
Mary G
@khead: Thank you for all the cat pics, khead. And of course, your rescue work with them. That guy you posted with the “I Voted” stickers is a dead ringer for my Shiloh. I tried to get him out from under the bed for a photo, but he is a smart cat.
ETA: @MikeBoyScout: sign me up.
celticdragonchick
@Patricia Kayden: I agree, and I will not shut up either.
We should be aware that half the country elected people who want to see us in prison or dead, and they will not be stopped by shame or conscience.
Cacti
@celticdragonchick:
The three most prolific killers in human history were Mao Tse-tung, Josef Stalin, and Adolf Hitler.
Collective tribunals faced: 0
Collective days spent imprisoned for crimes against humanity: 0
D58826
For some reason Gregory Peck’s movie On the Beach seems l;ike a good one to watch tonight.
seaboogie
@humboldtblue: And so maybe the argument, and the tactics change. What if Dems act and work like gays and then the emerging identified – and more encompassing LGBTQ coalition – has done. Relentless persistence. Out and proud. Represent our humanity. I don’t care what the GOP or Trump’s agenda is – you can’t put that genie back in the bottle. I think that it will be loud, and it will be messy – at least I hope so. Trump has up-ended the whole process, so let’s use that.
I hereby give us all permission to be unruly, to shout and to bang drums, to make everyone with a heart take notice.
lamh36
My mother’s health insurance via People’s Health thanks to the ACA. I’ve told her to stay thinking about her contingency plan if the GOP gets it way and repeals portions of ACA that affect her. Like her congestive heart condition which means she has a pre-existing condition…if they repeal any part of ACA she could be affected
mcConnell said GOP will quickly appeal Obamacare
Daulnay
@Mary G:
Might as well add Stephen Colbert and Samantha Bee to the pardon list. Prescient?
ET
the president elect’s initials are DJT
idiot can be pronounced i-jit by those of a certain accent so….
DJT + i-jit = iDJiT
If I can remember this is what I am going to type instead of his name because I don’t think I can go 4 years without typing his name and I can’t type his name with giving myself ulcers or gnashing my teeth.
mm
I never want to hear an American politician talk again about how America is an exceptional country.
Cacti
@seaboogie:
The current GOP platform calls for mandatory “conversion therapy” for LGBTQ individuals.
This electoral result could quite literally have people fighting against coerced reeducation supported by tax dollars.
PsiFighter37
@JMG: Trump does not give two shits about actually governing. He cares about promoting himself and getting back at Obama and Clinton.
What will happen is a) full repudiation and rollback of any executive orders Obama ever put through; b) full repeal of Dodd-Frank and ACA via reconciliation; and c) passing Paul Ryan’s wet dream list of granny-starving items. Oh, and d) appointing a nutjob to SCOTUS.
Then they will get on to longer-term projects, like gutting the EPA and the Department of Education, opening up anything with drillable space for oil exploration, passing restrictive nationwide laws on abortion, defunding Planned Parenthood, passing a nationwide ‘Religious Liberties’ law, and almost certainly trying to legislate a ban on gay marriage. Yes, that might be too far, but the GOP is going to fucking ram it all down our throats. And we have to defend 25 Senate seats in 2018.
We are fucked…seriously fucked.
Major Major Major Major
@PsiFighter37: i don’t think Dodd-Frank can be undone in reconciliation. Nor can large swaths of Obamacare. They need either a filibuster proof majority or no filibuster.
ETA: reconciliation IIRC has to be directly related to the budget and has weird rules like “the bill can’t add to the deficit”
numfar
My frelling step-son voted for Trump.
The divorce will be worth the pain of telling him off.
AnneW
@Corner Stone:
So since the emails are that fucking important, we’re going to see an investigation into Colin Powell and Condaleeza Rice any day now, right?
::crickets::
Paul in KY
@Baud: Always enjoy your comments.
lollipopguild
@Irony Abounds: It will not take that long. The first 100 days you are going to see everything they want crammed in to the agenda. Nothing to stop them. Everything they have talked about for the past 50 years will be at least tried. National parks sold off , Post office sold or closed what is not closed will be privitized to the max- airport traffic controllers for instance-weather service shut down etc. Kids in the candy store.
Helen
Sitting in a bar waiting for the purchasers of my apt to complete the final inspection. Closing is tomorrow.
About sleep: haven’t had much for 3 days. Finally fell off at 4 this morning. At 6 the WFT?? texts started from my friends.
But here’s some hope. Last night I disconnected my internet and TV. I just could not watch. I went to Time Warner today to hand in the equipment and the clerk said “can I ask why you are cancelling your account?” and I said “Cuz I am leaving the United States of America” and he said “OH MY GOD CUZZA LAST NIGHT, RIGHT?” I told him not really, it just worked out like that. And then he and I had an awesome, smart talk about politics.
So shorter Helen: there are smart, capable people out there. And some of them are even clerks at the Time warner store. Go figure.
We will be OK.
seaboogie
@Cacti: Yeah – if we let it. There are drums. And streets.
ET
Argh I have tried to post 3 times but my comments go poof! hopefully they all won’t show up later or you might think I am crazy.
the president elect’s initials are DJT
idiot can be pronounced i-jit by those of a certain accent so….
DJT + i-jit = iDJiT
If I can remember this is what I am going to type instead of his name because I don’t think I can go 4 years without typing his name and I can’t type his name with giving myself ulcers or gnashing my teeth.
satby
@Quinerly: I’m so sorry for the pain you must feel right now. Condolences on the passing of your mom.
SiubhanDuinne
@Mary G:
Wooh! Hadn’t even thought of that! It’s horrible to think of American journalists under an American fatwa (I suspect I’m misusing that word, but you know what I mean, Salman Rushdie and the Ayahtollah).
Only very marginally related: I saw that list earlier of Trump’s potential Cabinet picks (every one of which makes me want to projectile vomit), but haven’t heard any speculation on who will be his press secretary. I assume he’ll put Stephen Bannon in as Communications Director, but I kind of like the idea of Katrina Pierson briefing the WHPC every afternoon.
Paul in KY
@Quinerly: Very sorry for the loss of your mother. Mine is still alive & flabbergasted at her fellow Americans who voted for that POS.
goblue72
@Major Major Major Major: I think they will take a hard swipe at eliminating the filibuster. Might not succeed, but the GOP has proven that it far more willing to crush existing governing norms in its quest for power.
If only Democrats were that ruthless.
Quinerly
@Paul in KY:
Thank you for your kind words.
SiubhanDuinne
@Quinerly:
I am so very sorry. You have all my sympathies.
Quinerly
@satby:
Thank you for your kind words.
MikeBoyScout
@celticdragonchick: I’m old enough to have been a part of it. I refute your logic with the single (current) fact of marriage equality.
https://youtu.be/emKEFXWk4Yc
Quinerly
@SiubhanDuinne:
Thank you. I’m struggling today. This blog has really helped.
Keith G
@jharp:
Gawwww. Fuck it dude. Get over it. We lost an election, not the Battle of Britain. Some time ago, we figured Watergate and later Shrub/Obama2008 gutted the GOP for years to come. Nope.
Karl Rove in 2004 was the evil genius who was pushing the Democratic Party into the oceans. Nope.
The world is not static. It does not care a fuck for the hurt fee fees of Democrats. We got to get back up on this goddamned horse and get ready for the next challenge and the next set of opportunities….because…I promise you, that they will appear and likely sooner rather than later.
Major Major Major Major
@goblue72: I’m sure they’ll hold a vote on the filibuster. I’m not at all sure the rule change will pass.
Dog Dawg Damn
Well that was quick. Bernie Sanders is already extending an olive branch to work with Trump on issues facing be working class.
Script is already written folks. Remember Bush? Dems don’t do opposition.
PsiFighter37
@Dog Dawg Damn: Old white bros gotta stick together, dontcha know?
jharp
@Keith G:
When the going gets tough the tough get going. You are right.
Still. A huge loss.
SiubhanDuinne
@Paul in KY:
All through the last week or so, my mom, aunt, both grandmothers and an assortment of great-aunts were very much on my mind. I hope they would have approved of my volunteer work for Hillary. Then on Sunday, my cousin Martha died, just days after casting her absentee ballot for HRC. We knew she was near death but so wanted her to hang on until Tuesday so we could share the news of the first woman elected to the presidency. But I guess she was prescient and decided to check out before the populist shit hit the electoral fan.
Adria McDowell (formerly LurkerExtraordinaire)
@Quinerly: I am sp sorry. At least she won’t have to suffer with what we are about to go through.
More discussions with LGBTQ friends. They are legit scared. If nothing else, we need to provide support and cover for them. We need to take those steps immediately.
brendancalling
@goblue72: agreed. I know they won’t do it, but it would be nice to see the Democrats take up the obstruction cudgel.
Gelfling 545
@humboldtblue: I remember the Regan election as well. It was cause for grave concern, not outright terror for pur whole way of life.
Adria McDowell (formerly LurkerExtraordinaire)
@Dog Dawg Damn: wow. I wonder what the BernieorBusters will say.
mai naem mobile
Kansas Sec of State Kris Kobach is going to have a position in the Putins Bitch’s administration so you can expect more voting restrictions.
In other news Arizona passed a minimum wage hike prop and the Republicans said they will fight it’s constitutionality. So,yeah, bend over with no lube here.
Major Major Major Major
@Baud: You fucking jackals are the only website I’ve really checked today.
@Quinerly: Very sorry to hear that. Take care of yourself.
@Adria McDowell (formerly LurkerExtraordinaire): Yeah, I’m not looking forward to my/my husband/any woman’s first trip to a Catholic hospital after the First Amendment Protection Jesus Fuck Yeah Act is signed into law in February.
Keith G
@Dog Dawg Damn: It’s called legislation. It’s his job. He should try. I doubt he will be successful, but let’s say he gets through a bit and some policies get changed just a bit to the good side. Ya gotta try. That was the Obama model, after all.
PsiFighter37
Manhattan voted 87% for Clinton – so I know that by and large, I am surrounded by like-minded people. But now if I want to venture out to a red state to see the sites – I know that I am surrounded by white people who may not think they are racist but supported one on the ballot – and frankly become one by association. It makes me want to stay sequestered in the cities of the U.S., where it seems that there is sanity and diversity. And partially out of safety, because I didn’t have the good fortune of being born with white skin (I’m half-white, but I certainly don’t look it).
This must have been what London was like during the Brexit vote, but much, much worse.
PsiFighter37
@Keith G: Bernie’s been fucking useless at passing legislation for 25 years, but now he perks up at the chance to work with Trump. Right…glad he’s willing to play the useful idiot for the righties in passing regressive legislation.
Baud
@mai naem mobile:
As any party of the white working class would do…
bmoak
@goblue72:
Liz Warren has already issued a statement about putting aside their difference to work with Trump on rebuilding the economy for working people.
Davis X. Machina
@SiubhanDuinne: Chris Cillizza. The press will roll over for one of their own.
Baud
@Dog Dawg Damn:
@bmoak:
I blame Schumer.
dogwood
@brendancalling:
If the filibuster dies, how do Senate Dems obstruct?
Davis X. Machina
@mai naem mobile:
On what grounds?
Adria McDowell (formerly LurkerExtraordinaire)
@Major Major Major Major: me neither. And I am Catholic. I’ll be going to Canada if necessary. I already told my husband that I will not stand by as my rights and the rights of our daughter erode. He’s a first time voter, and I really don’t think he understood what was at stake.
PsiFighter37
@bmoak: I hope she enjoys voting against Paul Ryan’s budget, because that is the only thing they are going to get offered. I would not be surprised if Ryan simply ignores Trump’s infrastructure proposals – what will Trump do, insult Ryan on Twitter?
Dog Dawg Damn
@Keith G: You lay down with dogs….
FULL OPPOSITION. RESISTANCE. You don’t compromise with Fascism. Let them own it.
Corner Stone
@Adria McDowell (formerly LurkerExtraordinaire):
“If we ran Bernie he would be the one telling others what the legislative action plan was right now! Rawr!”
PsiFighter37
@dogwood: They can’t.
This is how democracy dies. I wonder what the Founding Fathers would think of how things turned out 240 years later.
Lurker Extraordinaire
@Dog Dawg Damn: I agree wholeheartedly. Each of us should find a way to resist in ways we can.
Corner Stone
If a Trump admin kills the new Cuba policy I am going to be seriously fucking pissed!
/wpp
hedgehog mobile
@Quinerly: Sympathies.
Helen
@Helen: So it looks OK except the purchasers wanted to know what the wire behind the bed was. Is it FIOS? No stupid young people. It is a wire from a hard wired telephone. Apparently from the stone age. Telephone. Not cell phone.
JFC they looked behind the one piece of furniture in the apartment!!!
EllenH
I’m pretty inconsolable. Inspired by others on this blog, and Al Giordano, I’ve been hosting phone banks and door to door canvassing out of my house for the past month. Before fucking Comey, we really had a shot at turning Arizona blue. I’m naturally optimistic so I hung in there believing the polls and all the chatter. Watching it all unfold after 4 straight days of GOTV, was unbearable. Today I’m just going through the motions. Don’t want to talk about it, but can’t talk about anything else. I remember how bad it felt in 2000 and keep telling myself that time will at least ease the pain. But this really is unprecedented. Not a single major paper endorsed this buffoon! Chris Hayes’ Twilight of the Elites really was prescient.
Lurker Extraordinaire
@Corner Stone: bullshit. The neo-Nazis were already bringing out the anti-Semitism towards the end.
Bernie knows damn well they aren’t gonna do anything for the working class. He has no power. That he folded so soon is a betrayal.
In other words, I get exactly what you are saying.
Gelfling 545
@japa21: I’m thinking Paladino for Secretary of Education.
Corner Stone
@Keith G:
What in the last 20 years has led you to believe that any legislation passed through compromise with an R majority is a good thing? They fucked Ted Kennedy on NCLB. You think the muddlepuss Bernie Sanders is going to be a better negotiator?
Fuck that shit.
Quinerly
@hedgehog mobile: @Major Major Major Major: @Adria McDowell (formerly LurkerExtraordinaire):
Thank you.
waysel
This should have gone in Toms earlier post, but things happened. For the record: Autopsy 2016 election: Roberts court GUTS THE VRA/ Rampant voter suppression in Rep controlled states. THE MEDIA: Billions worth of free air time for DJT/ normalization of his outrageous ideas/ almost no digging into his past endeavors. Heavy anti-Hillary bias 24/7, all sources. All pundits.Eyeballs and click-bait motivated. All about ad revenue. Most outlets have right wingers as owners. BERNIE: Killed trust of the Dem. party for most of his fans. COMEYS FBI: July 2016 statement with insane bias/ innuendo./ Oct statement 11 days prior to election, unfounded accusations. Prior ‘leaks’ to Gulliani/ campaign. Etc. WIKI/ PUTIN: ‘Nuff said. So can we stop fu*kin’ blaming the Dem. voters and/or Hillary Clinton? Just stop. And don’t even suggest to me that Bernie would’ve won it. I will not engage with anyone that tries that crap with me.
liberal
Apparently Ayotte conceded.
Heh. I dropped a big dime on Hassan. Only bright thing for me.
Major Major Major Major
@dogwood: @PsiFighter37: Let’s say Trump wants some infrastructure built. It would also be a good make-work/stimulus proposal. McConnell has already not-so-subtly indicated that he’s not going to try very hard to pass any infrastructure spending. No D votes for that kills it. In the House, too.
So that’s the mechanism. Should they? I dunno.
Tazj
@Quinerly: I’m very sorry for the loss of your mom, it’s hard. My mom died in April and I selfishly wished she was around last night to cheer me up, which she could always do. She was a proud Democrat all her life and so happy to vote for Obama and have the ACA pass because of all the health and insurance problems my oldest sister had.
Mandalay
@Keith G: The most sanguine post I have read here in the past 24 hours. Kudos.
Enough of the bed-wetters, doom-mongers and crybabies! And for those patriots who are planning to leave the country on the basis of the election results, you can’t fuck off soon enough for me. And please, don’t come back. Ever.
Emerald
@mai naem mobile: @dogwood:
Walk out maybe? No reason for ’em to be there, after all.
Dog Dawg Damn
@PsiFighter37: yes they can! They were in a WORSE position 8 years ago and they resisted. Now they have Trumpenfuhrer and full control. We can do the same. Opposition works. We will be rewarded for gridlock.
bmoak
@dogwood:
Clog the toilets in the House men’s room.
gogol's wife
@Keith G:
Thanks for that. I’ve got to step away from this blog for a while for my sanity.
Baud
Any stats on millennial voting?
liberal
@Keith G: again, some things are irreversible. If they give all that federal land back to the states, it’s never ever coming back.
JPL
@Corner Stone: Cuba is safe because he wants a hotel there… silly person
PsiFighter37
@Dog Dawg Damn: The difference is that the GOP these days has zero fucks to give about killing the filibuster. I guarantee that it is gone before Trump’s first 6 months across the board (and especially for SCOTUS first).
Another Scott
@JMG: I agree that he’s not going to waste his time going after Hillary now (but with Trump, who knows…). She’s beaten, so there’s no benefit to him continuing to go after her.
I do think that something that might actually work in our favor is Trump’s love of revenge:
He wants to completely remake the GOP and he wants everyone in Congress and the courts bowing down to him rather than fighting with him. He’ll want Ryan’s scalp. He’ll want to make sure that McConnell always does what he wants. The Teabagger Congress is afraid of him, but they also are afraid of giving up their own considerable power. If he pushes too hard, they’ll push back.
Donnie isn’t known for self-restraint. As we know, Ryan and McConnell are holding on by the skin of their teeth and have been incompetent at doing the most basic things (like passing a budget) because the lunatics in their caucus won’t permit it. There’s likely to be battles over lots of things.
The Courts are jealous of their role and traditions as well. Changes in the courts take years even when they have a majority.
Donnie and his team have a tiger by the tail. They’ve promised a lot of impossible things, they’ve promised change is coming quickly, they’ve promised to “drain the swamp”, they’ve promised to double economic growth. Their voters are going to be upset if the “change” in social issues is window-dressing, if the giant tax cuts are only for the rich, and the reshuffling of the federal bureaucracy that doesn’t really change anything for them.
I’m skeptical of the “giant infrastructure spending” plans. I have a feeling that it’s mostly going to be selling off assets for toll roads and the like if we’re unlucky. Democrats shouldn’t sign on to such things.
But we’ll have to wait and see…
:-(
Cheers,
Scott.
Cacti
@liberal:
But some things aren’t just a simple matter of giving it away to the states.
The Nevada state constitution specifically disclaims the lands that are managed by the BLM.
Dog Dawg Damn
@PsiFighter37: Oh absolutely. It won’t do any good in the short term but we won’t be tainted in long term. Also, Trump is for a rude awakening from some Republican Senators who hate him. We only need a few to stop legislation. That may be enough. He’s not a dictator. He won’t get everything he wants.
Comrade Scrutinizer
We were taking bets today on when the next real/fake terrorist attack would lead to Trump’s own version of the Enabling Acts. I said 18 months.
liberal
@Major Major Major Major: heh.
dogwood
@PsiFighter37:
I know. There is nothing to stop the republicans without a filibuster. People demanding obstruction can’t be that clueless. Or can they?
hovercraft
I’m so depressed right now. I’ve lost my faith in the decency of my fellow Americans. That this number of people could be this fucking stupid is just staggering, what the hell is wrong with them? I’ve stayed away from the intertubes and cable news since late last night when it became apparent that there were enough morons in this country to elect a racist, misogynist, moron as president. On the one hand I want to chat with my fellow Juicers about what just happened, but on the other hand I just don’t want to talk or think about it. I keep trying to stop thinking about it but it just keeps popping back into my head, that this is real, it really happened.
For all you people who bitch about my bitching about the likes of Tweety, Chuck, and the rest of the idiots on MSNBC, you will be happy to know I have not, and do not plan to tune into a bunch of white guys on TV telling me that this happened because democrats neglected the needs of the WWC by focusing on minority outreach. That’s bullshit, period, white people are more dependent and get many more benefits from every single government program. The fact that many of them apparently resent that any piece of the pie is going to anyone else, is disheartening. I know that much of this is in response to the fact that they feel they have or are “losing their country”, to the rest of us. This may be a massive set back to us right now, but in the end we will get there, there is no turning back no matter how hard they try. I told my kids this morning that no matter how many times you suffer setbacks, you must get back up and keep fighting.
So we’ve lost a devastating battle, but we must fight on, we can and must win the war.
JMG
Nope. What democracy does, it can undo. All that stops us is us. OK, us and them, too. We are disheartened, demoralized, undone and longing for the comforts of home. Our opponents (read: enemies) are counting on us giving up. Well, fuck that. I might take a rest period, but give up, no, Not ever.
Keith G
@PsiFighter37: Your argumentation is straying a bit. Sanders is not my hero, but he has a job representing his state in the Senate. He seems to have done okay with that. As a lefty independant, he has spent most of his time in federal legislatures run by conservatives. He was not going to write a lot of legislation. I imagine that Democratic Senators will find areas to try to influence. By doing so, I imagine that the noble among them are trying to find a way to mitigate the damage.
liberal
Jesus Christ, my 7 yo is listening to a computer voice read something about MLK, and it just quoted him on hate. My god.
Corner Stone
@JPL: Supposedly, those Cuban Americans that came out strong in FL for Trump did so because they vehemently disagreed with the Obama admin’s softening to Cuba.
Are you saying Trump may not be dedicated on delivering what he promised his supporters? At the exchange of enriching himself and his fucking shitbird demented evil ass children?
Dog Dawg Damn
@Keith G: Respectfully, that is a losing strategy. Trump doesn’t have full confidence of his Senste contingent. We sow division by opposing. Helping him will only demoralize the GOP opposition–which does exist.
Helen
@Baud: Yes. Did I tell you how much I missed you when you got all selfish and went on vacation? No? Well I asked the whole blog. “Where the fuck is Baud?” Once or twice.
I think I said it a buncha times. But then I got all sentimental about leaving the USA and said something like “I love this blog with its assholes, curmudgeons, and academics. And Baud.”
dogwood
@Dog Dawg Damn:
Trump might not get everything he wants, but Congressional Republicans will get everything they want.
Keith G
@Corner Stone: One might try. Lack of effort has a known result. I stated my doubts about success upfront. Did you miss it?
Major Major Major Major
@Dog Dawg Damn: I think I might have identified the next intra-party fight! Fun!
Dem senators (and Bernie too) will work with the Trump administration. Will the House?
Omnes Omnibus
@MikeBoyScout: Co-sign (except for the Steeler stuff).
seaboogie
@Quinerly: I am so sorry for your loss.
dogwood
@Dog Dawg Damn:
How is this opposing supposed to work?
Omnes Omnibus
@O. Felix Culpa: Get them out there as tutors.
Mandalay
@Dog Dawg Damn:
This x 1000. Nothing would give Senators Cruz and McCain et al greater pleasure than delivering a well delivered kick to Trump’s nuts at every opportunity.
He needs them far more than they need him right now.
Davebo
@Dog Dawg Damn:
It seems more likely they’ll get everything they want which honestly scares me more than Trump.
Dog Dawg Damn
@dogwood: our base is PISSED. we show strong opposition. Make him deal with his own party. Make them turn on be selves. It ain’t gonn stop them from doing nasty stuff, but we will have a better position in midterms because we will have taken a stand against him and his policies. It’s Mitch McConnell 101 game theory and it works.
Mnemosyne
Here’s what I’ve come to realize since last night:
The GOP greased the skids after Obama’s win in 2012. They made sure to get voter ID laws passed in the “blue wall” states to suppress our votes. They had no idea that Trump was going to be their nominee, and there was no way to stop what they had set in motion for the election once he clinched it.
Now he’s their monster. I am going to rub his every action in the damn faces of the people I know who voted for him in WI and MI, and say, See? This is what you wanted. This is what you chose.
GrandJury
On a brighter note, there will be no shortage of material for political satire.
Keith G
@Dog Dawg Damn: Oh I think the GOP’s divisions are real and meaningful. For a bit, they will be papered over, but as a force for legislation, the GOP loves having arguments with itself.
Time to attend to catheter and incision issues for the night. Some of you think you are experiencing pain….you have no idea. Cheers and peace.
Dog Dawg Damn
@Keith G: Keith hang in there! Thanks for conversation.
Mary G
@Quinerly: I am so sorry for your loss. It must all just feel like too much to bear at once. I’m glad Balloon Juice gives you a bit of help.
@SiubhanDuinne: Condolences on the loss of Martha. I’m glad she got her vote in.
Davebo
I was up at 3:30AM yesterday for a work project so obviously I didn’t make it to the concession last night.
I woke this morning to a Facebook post from my love who is from Scotland living here in the states. She was in shock and despair at the result. Then I went to CNN and couldn’t believe it.
I’d been telling her for days, don’t worry. There’s no way America elects this douce bag. And yet, we did. I still can’t explain it to her because I can’t believe it myself.
JPL
@Corner Stone: hahahahahahaha
The protests in NYC cause me joy. Unlike Obama and Hillary, I’m not ready for this unity crap. fk em..
I have been numb all day, but just now walked the dog and asked him, if he was fired up and ready to go.
Trump’s negatives have to be driven down, or he is going to enact all this shit
The dog agreed..
Felonius Monk
@Omnes Omnibus:
I don’t think anyone here will be offended if you substitute the Packers. :-)
I’m not particularly fond of the Steelers either, but I admire his overall sentiment.
Mnemosyne
@rikyrah:
My co-worker’s son is about the same age. He cried this morning when she broke the news to him.
As I said in the other thread, thank God I live and work in Southern California. If I had had to pretend to be happy today instead of totally shell-shocked like everyone else at work, I would have blown a gasket by lunchtime.
Corner Stone
Man, that video of Barron Trump. That shit is some real Children of the Corn kind of action. Fucking spooky.
EBT
As a disabled trans person living in a conservative pit (Sacramento) I am finally looking at gun ownership. Sure does suck to have to violate your principles to have a modicum of perceived safety.
Darrin Ziliak (formerly glocksman)
Just got an email from a friend who is a Republican.
Apparently it’s the Democrats fault that Trump won.
I don’t even know how to respond other than “BULLSHIT. GET YOUR HEAD OUT OF YOUR ASS” at this point.
Quinerly
@Mnemosyne:
Great post. Thank you.
What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?
@Dog Dawg Damn: I think this is just a ploy to keep the spotlight on the fact that Trump isn’t doing any of the things he promised the working class stiffs who voted for him and drive a wedge between Trump and Congressional Republicans (who want none of that) or between Trump and the people expecting jobs. Don’t know that it will work but that’s the only play right now. At the very least it deflects blame from the Dems if none of those things happen – they can say they offered to work with Trump on those issues but his own party and laziness is standing in the way.
Hurling Dervish
@quakerinabasement: I agree, Quaker. Loyalty to the good of the country should always go first.
Major Major Major Major
We had an all hands on deck meeting at work to discuss what comes next (we take Ed Dept. money) and have a chat about our feelings after last night, thus confirming my suspicion that zero of sixty-five of us are trump supporters.
Darrin Ziliak (formerly glocksman)
@EBT: If you do buy a gun, get some real training. Also, consider the moral issues involved. I have no moral issues with shooting someone who poses an imminent lethal threat. Others might. If you do, don’t get a gun.
toocanAnj
@danielx: This. De lurking just to agree.
Felonius Monk
@bmoak:
Since the House R’s are all so full of shit, I don’t think they’ll need any help in this regard.
toine
Obstruction isn’t the answer right now. The media will never let Democrats get away with it the way they let Republicans get away with it. As much as it sucks, let the Republicans be responsible for every last bit of the next 2/4 years. Meanwhile, organize and try to take back as many local and statewide positions as possible. Own the re-districting process in 2020. This should be the first priority.
PsiFighter37
@Major Major Major Major: Something the whole team can bond over!
A very strained attempt at seeing the glass half-full, I know…
Corner Stone
J.D. Vance can go somewhere and fuck himself. Or maybe go somewhere with Thomas Frank and pleasure each other as it suits them.
Major Major Major Major
@EBT: @Darrin Ziliak (formerly glocksman): a gun is also not a good idea if you have any (any) suicidal ideation.
Johannes
@RaflW: This.
Dog Dawg Damn
@What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?: Probably but as a starting bid it’s weak sauce.
JMG
The candidate and the President must talk unity. It’s their duty. Not mine. I read the comments on this board and I see we’ve moved past despair into anger. Good! Now from anger into thought. PS: I got no thoughts yet, but I’m trying.
Darrin Ziliak (formerly glocksman)
@Major Major Major Major: True. I forgot to mention that bit. Thanks.
JPL
@Quinerly: I am so sorry for your pain. Reading the blog today taught me to appreciate what I have. We’ll get through this, but it won’t be easy.
Take care.
Hal
Rebecca Traister on Chris Hayes looks so stunned and shaken to her core.
dogwood
@Dog Dawg Damn:
OK. I imagine we will be opposed to what they’ll do. But Bernie’s all ready nixed obstruction, so one member of the caucus ain’t on board and never will be. I imagine others who are up for re-election in red and purple states will do what they always do. Cooperate with Republicans in a futile attempt to save their seats.
Dog Dawg Damn
@dogwood: And then we primary them from the left. That is the model. It works.
EBT
@Darrin Ziliak (formerly glocksman):
Absolutely. If I can’t accurately use it then there is no point to having the tool. I need to be able to hit my target (and only my target) in addition to being able to service and maintain it myself. If it was just myself I may well forgo it. But I have a loved one who is now that much more in danger from the plurality of the country that just plain hates faggots and trannies. If I am going to get bashed I will go down fighting, if only so I can leave one good example for this world.
@Major Major Major Major: A risk I simply have to take I am afraid.
guachi
It’s discouraging that Democratic politicians are already cozying up to Trump. Losers.
Kathleen
@goblue72: Never mind.
MomSense
@JMG:
I don’t feel like I can wait because I can’t push this out of my head and because I think the bastsrds behind trump have been planning and waiting for this for a long time. The cabinet choices so far,even if not confirmed, are absolutely terrifying in what they reveal about his approach. Authoritarians move fast while people are in shock.
Omarosa and Conway have both said he is keeping an enemies list (Conway said list of people he thinks have slighted him) and he plans to get revenge. I find this horrifying.
Also too can we just say no more fucking White House correspondents dinner ever again?
SenyorDave
@Gelfling 545: I remember the Regan election as well. It was cause for grave concern, not outright terror for pur whole way of life.
The current GOP is so far to the right of Reagan he might as well have been a blue dog Democrat.
Omnes Omnibus
@JMG: I am in a very blue city, but my hometown is much less so. I am going to volunteer for and donate to local races there. Taking WI back one city council seat at a time starts now.
JPL
I love the protests..
Fired up and ready to go..
Peale
@Dog Dawg Damn: it really all depends who didn’t vote. If it turns out that it was a combination of Bernie fighters it’s one thing. If it turns out that there are a lot of Dems who don’t like negative campaigns and like the the idea of reaching across the aisle…well what can you do.
The good news, if there is any, it’s that without the Filibuster, there really isn’t any reason for the GOP to work with Dems and we won’t have to vote for crap just so it passes. Trump is not going to be popular. He’ll get a bounce at first (because the jcoking presidents always do), but I don’t think it will last. But there is no reason why Dems have to be taken down with him.
MomSense
@goblue72:
It may have worked for the Republicans but it harmed their constituents. We have vulnerable people who need all the protection we can muster.
debbie
@Baud:
And I’d like to thank you for all the times over the past year you’ve cracked me up. All the days of getting up too early to go to a job I hate, a snark-filled chuckle helped get the day going.
OGLiberal
@liberal: Still doesn’t give us the Senate and the two pickups and holding Harry’s seat are nice. Bayh and Feingold, massive fails.
Miss Bianca
@goblue72: you have no idea how much I hate to find myself agreeing with you for once. I am in a dark, dark place right now.
Mike in NC
Our next door neighbors used to own a condo in Charlotte that we would use from time to time. To get there required passing through quite a few small dying towns where there was a shuttered mill or factory. Closed for many years to judge by the rusty fences and weed-choked empty parking lots. Trump promised the aged idiots that once worked at these places that he would reopen them on his first day in office, and they actually believed him.
Mnemosyne
@MomSense:
See my post at #173 — they planned for this back in 2012, but had no idea Trump was going to be the nominee. Even if they had wanted to stop his momentum, they couldn’t have once he realized that making openly racist appeals was going to get his voters to show up.
The GOP created this monster, and made it easy for him to take power because they were intent on beating the next Democratic presidential nominee. Gerrymandering the electoral college.
SenyorDave
@Gelfling 545: I remember the Regan election as well. It was cause for grave concern, not outright terror for pur whole way of life.
The current GOP is so far to the right of Reagan he might as well be a blue dog Democrat.
Helen
So finally this bartender bought me a drink.
Darrin Ziliak (formerly glocksman)
@OGLiberal: Speaking as a Hoosier, Bayh came in as an outsider (which he was) and ran up against a well oiled PAC machine that painted him as such. Coats won in 2010 despite his similar past because the Dems didn’t paint him like the PAC’s did Bayh, and 2010 was a Rep wave year.
I don’t miss Bayh. I do miss Feingold.
JPL
@Omnes Omnibus: As I mentioned before, I live north of Atlanta. I actually got involved in the local level. The big fight was over high density zoning. You work with folks that have no idea that zoning is regulation. The good news is that we replaced three seats.. You just have to work with those who you want to say Are you a fking idiot.
waysel
Have I something in moderation?
Major Major Major Major
@Mike in NC: and failing that he also promised them that at least they could call people n—–s and faggots again.
JPL
I have to say, that I haven’t watched news since last night. I just put it on to watch the demonstrations, and I am loving it. March, March, March….
MomSense
@celticdragonchick:
Yes this is going to happen and fast. We have to organize now but offline.
AliceBlue
@Corner Stone:
The Bernie or Busters have been taking victory laps at DKos all day/
OGLiberal
Key takeaways:
*The majority of this country, a pretty clear one, voted for Clinton to be our first woman president
*In key, normally blue Midwest (I’m including PA here) swing states, white voters – male and female – voted to send a racist, sexist, xenophobic, paranoid, germophobe serial sexual assaulter to the White House and probably toasted their actions with fellow travelers at the bar…”yeah, eff that b**ch!”
F**k all, y’all.
True deploreables.
BillinGlendaleCA
@Baud: Baud!2020!, it’s never too early.
Quinerly
@JPL:
Thanks for all the kind words in this thread. They help.
toine
@Hurling Dervish:
Unfortunately, that is how you end up with a President Trump….
Miss Bianca
Fuck. Arguing politics with my Libertarian buddy – who doesn’t hold himself responsible for any of this stuff cause hey, *he* didn’t vote for the bastids – but who is tolerant enough to let me rant and rave and sob – we have killed almost an entire bottle of gin.
Martinis. Whatever gets you thru’ the night. And the next four years.
@Quinerly: sorry to hear about your mum. I dreamed last night that I was running thru’ the streets looking for my dad – thinking, I’ll move in with him again. Woke up this morning and remembered he was dead – no refuge there. We never get over losing our folks, it seems. Condolences to you.
Mnemosyne
@OGLiberal:
Addendum, because it’s today’s hobbyhorse from me:
JPL
@Quinerly: It truly is a safe area. I firmly believe that we care for each other
Omnes Omnibus
@Mnemosyne: Over 300,000 eligible voters in WI were not able to get a “valid” ID. About 10 x the margin here.
Mnemosyne
@AliceBlue:
Did anyone mention that a Jewish Socialist would not have fared well against an anti-Semitic white supremacist, or were they too far off in fantasyland to understand why that might be?
Major Major Major Major
@JPL: this is seriously like the only place on the internet I checked today, and now that our troll infestation is gone (for the moment) it’s so comforting to be here.
Mike in NC
@Major Major Major Major: That’s a feature, not a bug!
/ Retired SW Engineer
Omnes Omnibus
@AliceBlue: They’ve been around here too.
Mnemosyne
@Omnes Omnibus:
Thank you. People were trying to argue with me this morning that the Voter ID blocks didn’t explain the lower turnout by minority voters compared to 2012.
Didn’t Walker also close a bunch of DMVs in Black neighborhoods, or was that in Alabama?
ET
@MomSense: I think in this Republicans like the current Speaker have real cause to worry.
Omnes Omnibus
@Mnemosyne: Probably both.
OGLiberal
@Omnes Omnibus: Why not? Seriously, want to know why. Getting this should be as simple as provividing a doc that show “here’s where I live,”
Cacti
@Mnemosyne:
No way.
Bernie who has previously gushed fulsome praise for Fidel Castro would totes have won over that angry Cuban vote in Florida.
Helen
Someone needs to figure out how ALL the polls were so incredibly unfuckingbelievably HOLY MOTHER FUCKINGLYUNBLIEVABLY wrong. Really boys, it math.
EBT
@Major Major Major Major:
This place and Wonkette are the only two places I am going to on the internet for a while. Maybe the LP archive as well, because there is no forum or comment section or anything besides a collection of Let’s Plays.
Corner Stone
@AliceBlue: Anyone ask them if they thought Bernie would have done excellently against the R candidate who was endorsed by the KKK? The actual fucking KKK. Not a euphemism to refer to other R infrastructure. The guys in the hoods.
Omnes Omnibus
@OGLiberal: Read this.
TL;DR version: WI voter ID law is unbelievably strict.
Mnemosyne
@OGLiberal:
Sure, if the purpose was to provide voters with a handy ID to bring to the polls with them. However, the actual purpose of the laws is to prevent minority voters from being allowed to vote, so there are many, many hoops to jump through.
Major Major Major Major
@Helen: I’m sure that will happen in time, because seriously wtf?
My mom says that Colorado did something… kind of idiotic. They set it up so you could vote at any precinct (so far so good) then set it up so that you would look up a voter’s information through the Internet on a centralized service that the SoS ran. Naturally the SoS site was down for 30-60 minutes, halting voting statewide.
BillinGlendaleCA
@PsiFighter37: Drill Baby Drill. Just shoot me now.
Omnes Omnibus
@Corner Stone: I am sure he could have talked sense into a few of them.
Fuck the haters. We ran the best candidate we had; she ran hard and well. A bunch of our fellow white people decided rub shit all over the walls.
JPL
@Helen: I’m not a mathematician, but I think Comey depressed turnout. There was also something else going on, and that’s Trump’s message ” What difference does it make. ”
That’s an easy message, if the economy is leaving you behind.
Other than that, I don’t know.
I do love the protests though.
Bill E Pilgrim
@Helen:
With the popular vote, it’s going to end up more accurate than the 2012 election polls were.
Polls were definitely off, but they were more off that time.
Mnemosyne
@Helen:
What I’ve seen so far is that the polling companies didn’t take the Voter ID thing into account when doing the polls, so they overestimated the minority vote, plus there was a small but significant increase in white exurban and rural voters who had not voted in 2012 but showed up yesterday. Those, by the way, were the straight-up white supremacist voters that Trump and Breitbart.com called forth.
toine
@MomSense:
it harmed the people who vote for them… it didn’t harm their constituents…
that’s the problem with being a Democrat. the 2 are the same. Hard for Democrats to come up with a winning strategy that effectively sacrifices actual constituents as opposed to voters…
EBT
@JPL: I would love the protests more if they could possibly result in anything beyond some young leftists being bashed and left with criminal records.
Corner Stone
When we move to Canada my son has decided he will change his name to Benjamin* Duckworth. Partially in honor of newly elected IL Sen Duckworth.
*His first name now is not Benjamin but he felt that fit. Gotta admit, it’s got a ring.
Miss Bianca
@bmoak: You know what? I’m tired. Fuck this shit. I’m tired of extending a hand to Republicans to draw back a bleeding stump. Yeah – I’m quickly passing from denial to anger.
David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch
Wow. Zephyr Teachout lost by 10 pts.
but, but…
SiubhanDuinne
@Major Major Major Major:
Copying that message and at some point posting it on FB. Once I get rid of my own personal trolls over there.
It’s a lovely quote. Thanks.
Shalimar
@Dog Dawg Damn: It isn’t an opening bid at all. What specifically helps working families is undefined and Sanders isn’t committing to do anything. It is doubtful anything Trump would propose would actually help working families without hurting some minority subset of the whole.
Omnes Omnibus
@Miss Bianca: This appears to be the transition thread for a good number of people.
ET
@EBT: You stole my initials…….
Omnes Omnibus
@SiubhanDuinne: You have FB trolls?
sukabi
@Daulnay: he’s going to start with the repubs first…that just might give some of his fans pause…
Or it will be like chumming the water and spawn a feeding frenzy.
It’s going to be ugly for quite a while.
p.a.
@Quinerly: Sorry for your loss.
debbie
@Omnes Omnibus:
Ohio’s is poorly punctuated. When the rules first came out, there was a bulleted list of acceptable forms of ID, something like this:
* a,
* b,
* c, and
* d
A woman fought with a poll worker at my precinct about whether she had to show a, b, c, or d, or a or b or both c and d.
WarMunchkin
@goblue72: I don’t really agree with an obstructionist tactic that you and kos have advocated. It’s not that I don’t want to play hardball with Rs – seriously, by all means, fuckemup, electorally speaking, it’s that we have a dual responsibility of both making a winning argument and protecting our constituencies.
Republicans could obstruct because their constituents are, on average, well-off compared with ours, more ideological compared with ours and largely don’t give a shit. If we don’t take care of our groups, we will be well and truly screwed. And doing that means working with these R majority legislatures to try to get provisions and amendments passed that protect our communities on the margins – because again, we have a lot to lose. And in order to keep protecting these communities, shows of good faith like voting for a final bill with an amendment or series of amendments will make sure that we can continue that work. Which means that obstructionism isn’t a viable strategy.
Yes, I want to mess up these Rs pretty badly, but just cause we’re in the minority doesn’t mean that a good faith (D) should be prevented from attempting to govern at the margins. It’s worth it for people who are counting on us.
Miss Bianca
@hovercraft: everything you say, sister. everything you say. I am so sorry. America has shown its ugly white ass to the world, and the rest of the world has the sense to be horrified. But the ugly white asses who did this are hugging themselves like they just did something really clever.
Major Major Major Major
@debbie: I’m a programmer and that list just made me cringe sooooooooooooo hard
Mnemosyne
I keep thinking about this 2010 exit poll that Kevin Drum wrote about, where there was a small but quite significant increase in Republican voters who had not voted in 2008, but they turned up in 2010 to thwart the Democrats.
This election’s results feel quite similar.
Adria McDowell (formerly LurkerExtraordinaire)
@hovercraft: Tell it.
Miss Bianca
@O. Felix Culpa: dearie, it’s stuff like that that makes me think about relocating to NM.
Mnemosyne
@Miss Bianca:
Interesting anecdote my BFF told me today: her brother in Michigan (who is himself a strong Democrat) said that his friends voted for Trump because they blamed Obama and Hillary for Black Lives Matter.
But it was all about economic anxiety, riiiiiiight …
Helen
@Corner Stone: Did he decide you all would move to Canada or did you? Move to Ireland with me, why dontcha?
Shut up Omnes. Love and kisses, Helen
Omnes Omnibus
@Helen: I have family here since the early 1600s and people in WI since before it was a state. I am not going.
schrodinger's cat
@hovercraft: Preach it sister.
Hill Dweller
Stan Van Gundy’s(Pistons coach) righteous rant about electing Trump echoed what a lot of people are feeling. He also ripped Evangelicals. I’m sure Gundy will catch some heat, but I don’t think he gives a shit.
Major Major Major Major
@Mnemosyne: I have met a nontrivial number of millennial (white) men for whom things like feminist twitter are the defining issues of our time.
Omnes Omnibus
Lip Sync Battle time!
JPL
@EBT: If the media covers it, Trump’s numbers will be in the tank before he takes office. If that makes me selfish, so be it.
I’m fired up and ready to go.
NMgal
@O. Felix Culpa: Yes. Balm that helps ameliorate the burn from seeing La Tejana Martinez returned to the gov’s office last time.
Still dazed and not ready to make a plan for what to do next. But I filled out my passport renewal form and intend to get that mailed in next week, even though the passport is good into 2018. I just don’t trust these fuckers.
MomSense
@Quinerly:
I am so very sorry. Too much to mourn and grieve. Sending you hugs.
dance around in your bones
I’m off to read a dystopian science fiction novel called Virus: 72 Hours To Live. It feels kinda apropos. Oh, and I ran across a free kindle ebook the other day called “1600 Trump Avenue……Against All Odds – A Political Prophecy” by Lew Petersen. (edit: Lew Pendleton! oops)
It seemed an amusing thought experiment at the time. It sits there in my kindle kind of radiating at me.
(I might have said this before….my mind is sort of reeling and foggy all at once.)
Bailey
@PsiFighter37:
@Helen:
When people don’t show in massive numbers, it throws off the polls. They assumed we’d be dealing with something close to Obama numbers. Instead we go the tepid John Kerry level of voter support.
MomSense
@Omnes Omnibus:
Ha!! My son loves that show. I’ll look for it.
Miss Bianca
@Mnemosyne: And a FB friend whom I love, when I started ranting about white privilege, said “well, you should read this thing about Why White Rural People Feel So Left Behind”, and I’m all like, “no. no. No fucking way. *I’m* rural white people, thank you, and I’m not buying this shit.” If you’re not a stone-cold racist and you voted for Trump, then you’re OK with *his* being a stone-cold racist, misogynist, xenophobic MF.”
Corner Stone
@Helen: We have three choices we’re looking at. Canada (mainly because most of my work is centered in North America at the moment, but that could change), Ireland because I have always wanted to live there (XOXO), and Iceland because he is fascinated by geothermal energy and other cool shit going on there.
Omnes Omnibus
@MomSense: It is on Spike.
toine
@WarMunchkin:
I think that is what has me saddest today… Repubs have shown that this doesn’t work. You will not be rewarded for this. Sad, but that seems to be where we are. Let the repubs be responsible for screwing us over. Being screwed over a little less at the edges isn’t a winning strategy. The screwed over will not love you any more… :-(
Helen
@Omnes Omnibus: Yes we have this conversation. From the bottom of my heart I say good for you. Fight on. See me at #92.
debbie
@Omnes Omnibus:
Does your family trace back to Salem, MA?
Adria McDowell (formerly LurkerExtraordinaire)
@guachi: no worries, I’m taking names.
Omnes Omnibus
@Helen: I know. I get where you are coming from. My stiff-necked Puritan ancestors make me stubborn.
@Corner Stone: Are you really considering the move?
Major Major Major Major
Did I mention they’re floating Ben Carson as secretary of education?
JPL
@Miss Bianca: The term Trump often used is them.. Them refers to lots of losers
according to our next President though. fkfkfkfkfkffkffkfkfkfkfkfkfk
We are the majority and we have to stay Fired up and ready to go, but after last nights defeat, it is hard. .
Omnes Omnibus
@debbie: Yes.
Corner Stone
@debbie:
Almost, but I think they do trace back to the near village of Snobtown, MA. All portraits from that period have citizens there depicted with their pinky in the air as they sip their afternoon tea.
Jeffro
@hovercraft:
This and then this.
58M kkklowns don’t speak for the other 280M including so many kids who can’t vote and deserve a better future. Which leads us to the second part of your statement, the big finish: we have to fight. And we will.
p.a.
Hope tRump’s enemy list is topped by the press. Attacking them directly (not talking general MSM is lieberal pablum) is the only thing that makes them stand on their hind legs.
Adria McDowell (formerly LurkerExtraordinaire)
@MomSense: I’m in.
Zinsky
Two thoughts: First, Bernie or Biden could have won this. Second, to use a baseball analogy, the Democrats have no farm club. Quick, at the state level, can you name one Democrat who is young, vibrant and ready for prime-time? Didn’t think so….
Omnes Omnibus
@Corner Stone: None of us would ever stoop to Snobtown. Pretentiouselitestton, though, is another matter.
debbie
@Omnes Omnibus:
Wow. Have you read Stacy Schiff’s book about the witch trials?
MomSense
@Mnemosyne:
They started in 2010. I think they tried to do this in PA for 2012 but we managed to beat it in court. My memory is a bit fuzzy but I think that’s what happened. I am so oisse st the pundits and the trolls and Bernie busters who are saying that we weren’t fired up and ready to go. Some of the problems in NC with fewer early vote days, one location for a whole county, etc say it may have shaved 8.5% of the early black vote. That’s a fucking lot. And then FL no longer allows the restoration of rights for former felons which has taken a huge toll. It goes on and on. We have been systematically disenfranchised and had our votes suppressed to bring this election result. I’m furious about it and I’m furious with all the lazy ass reporting and opinion sting that would rather be that the first woman candidate just couldn’t excite the base. It’s bulkshit and sexist and I’m not having it.
Kay
Great! Corey Lewandowski can stay on at CNN and continue to collect two paychecks.
I can tell we’re going to get rigorous and tough media coverage – with a far Right rubber-stamp Congress it’s one Party rule from now on. No checks on Mr. Trump. He’s in charge now.
Which one of the kids gets a Cabinet position? I pick…Tiffany Trump. She seems like the smart one.
Helen
@Corner Stone: AHHHH so should we keep in touch via this blog? Seems tenuous. Oh wait.
Tell your son that Iceland only a few Euros away from Ireland.
dance around in your bones
I may have tempted the YOU SHALL NOT EDIT! gawd just now. Shit.
Just wanted to say the one ray of sunshine in my no good, awful, terrible no good VERY BAD DAY has been my daughter, who saved my iPhone from being disabled, restored my contacts and pics, and loaded IOS 10 on the phone before she put it in the mail for me! She’s a gem, a brilliant gem :)
seaboogie
@Zinsky: One thought: Go fuck yourself.
debbie
@Major Major Major Major:
Good grief. I see much laughter through tears if these are the kind of appointments we’ll see.
Mnemosyne
@JPL:
I’m having soup for dinner (because dental work) and then I’m watching Blazing Saddles and having a German chocolate cupcake.
I’m hoping that will make me feel slightly better.
Omnes Omnibus
@Zinsky: No to Bernie. A Jewish socialist against white supremacists? Sure thing.
Biden’s son died and he did have his heart in it at the time he would have needed to get going. Also, he has always been an also ran in every primary.
Corner Stone
@Zinsky:
One thought, GFY.
Major Major Major Major
@Omnes Omnibus: he’s also a deeply compromised moderate centrist, which people always seem to forget when they rhapsodize about him instead of Hillary.
@debbie: Yeah, well, you won’t have to work with him.
Mnemosyne
@Zinsky:
Please explain how the Jewish Socialist wins against the anti-Semitic white supremacist.
schrodinger's cat
@Omnes Omnibus: Can the voter suppression in Wisconsin be challenged in courts?
Another Scott
@Zinsky: Scott Surovell fits your criteria.
All generalizations are false – including this one. ;-)
Cheers,
Scott.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
No, and maybe.
If you don’t live in Illinois, you probably never heard of Barack Obama until the summer of 2004. We’ll see what happens.
p.a.
@MomSense: Not disagreeing, just wondering in all the fulsome praise of our ‘ground game’, GOTV efforts, where this news went? It couldn’t have been forseen? A shock on the day of??!!
Omnes Omnibus
@debbie: I have not. I’ve read a number of books on them and my dad owns a copy of the complete court records, if that counts.
MomSense
@Mnemosyne:
I have really appreciated your pushback on this. I’ve tried to as well because we should all be furious at the anti democratic means Repubkucans used to disenfranchise people in one of the most consequential elections of our lifetime. Maybe we should start a fucking movement against taxation without representation.
Elie
It will not be ok and I believe that the first place that will be the case is in foreign policy. Obama has received a lot of criticism for the state of things not just in Syria, but all over the world, particularly Europe where the unresolved Syrian debacle asserts itself. The reality is that there is NO real solution that makes that region at least somewhat peaceful without the significant commitment of troops and material. There is not easy, quick in and out solution there or anywhere in the middle east unless we again try to become the world’s cops — at the expense of developing our economy and trade. Trump is ignorant and naïve. His people will be led down the garden path pretty quickly by the neocons who got W into Iraq and other adventures. He will be spinning, further misdirected by Putin who will be having fun slapping him around at the behest of the Shia of Asad who are his client state.
Our country is in for it I am afraid. Expanding war, economic instability and civil unrest here at home. Trump did not win in a landslide — indeed did not even win the popular vote. I hope, but am not totally convinced that the Democrats have a true war time consiglieri — cause this should be war to fight for the soul of this country. I dunno though. I understand for Obama and Hillary to sound a conciliatory tone in their speeches today, but I don’t think those speeches prepare us for the times ahead with the right frame of mind. Its war… make no mistake. There will be no elastic rebound to a normal state after this one. My only question is who will lead us?
Corner Stone
@Helen: Honestly, he is only 12 but we talk a lot about real adult life things and he is devastated by this electoral outcome. It’s been heartbreaking to try and explain what happened, especially when his mom’s side of the fam are all white, ignorant, racist MF’ers.
So he’s having a reaction I’m going to have to navigate for a bit. But he actually suggested Canada and when I asked him about other choices he said Iceland with no hesitation. Sooo…interesting. I guess.
Mnemosyne
@Major Major Major Major:
There was one troll earlier today who was whining about Hillary’s warmongering and saying that he would have voted for Biden. He didn’t seem to like it when I reminded him that Biden not only voted for the exact same AUMF that Hillary was receiving the sole blame for, Biden also participates in our ongoing drone war. Plus Biden was deeply enmeshed with the banksters when he was the senator from MBNA.
But, of course, the real answer was that Biden has a peni$ and Hillary doesn’t, so everything that was evil in Hillary was forgivable in Biden.
Mandalay
@Miss Bianca:
That pompous condescending tone from some Democrats is one reason white working class people turned out in droves for Trump.
Republicans have won the white working class vote in 9 of the past 11 presidential elections. You might want to ponder that. Calling them racists solves nothing, and harms your cause.
Omnes Omnibus
@Major Major Major Major: Senator from MNBA.
MomSense
@p.a.:
We talked about it on this blog even and these laws were challenged in court but I honestly feel like I didn’t do enough. I donated to vote riders but maybe we all should have been holding vigils, protesting, organizing legislation and/or referenda. We totally fucked up and now we just want to blame the woman who put herself on the line for us.
debbie
@Omnes Omnibus:
It all counts!
Reading the book, I couldn’t get over the parallels to the Tea Party. After all this time, we haven’t changed a bit.
Another Scott
@Major Major Major Major: I thought the DoEd was one of those that the GOP always said they were going to abolish?
Ooops! (1:22)
Cheers,
Scott.
Helen
OT but how come refreshing at F5 brings me to the top of the blog?
Omnes Omnibus
@schrodinger’s cat: Has been multiple times. Always wins at trial and gets kicked on appeal.
Felonius Monk
@David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch:
She never had a chance.
Another Scott
@Another Scott: Moderation, again? Really?
(sigh)
Cheers,
Scott.
Major Major Major Major
@Mnemosyne: @Omnes Omnibus: all that and the patriot act was basically his bill from the 90s with white-out over the name.
ETA: @efgoldman: McConnell was pretty dismissive today when he gave trump’s infrastructure and border ideas a big “we’ll see.”
debbie
@MomSense:
It’s not about GOTV. It’s about changing hearts. Which today feels impossible.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Mnemosyne: and as late as the 08 primary was bragging about having co-written the Iraq AUMF with his good friend John McCain, and Hagel (Bush wanted basically unlimited authority– read, Iran– an those three limited it to Iraq, IIRC). Biden was also very Law’n’Order in the 90s, he called that ’94 crime bill “the Biden Crime Law” and looking at Wiki to confirm that last I found this
Kay
@Zinsky:
What is the point of this? I mean seriously. This woman was bashed by the Right for 30 solid years. She fought hard against an absolute lying asshole and his vicious followers who were joined by cable news, Wikileaks and the FBI. She lost. Isn’t that enough? Are we supposed to denounce her candidacy? Burn her at the stake? What would be enough of a pile-on to punish her sufficiently for winning a primary?
Mnemosyne
@Mandalay:
And the other reason is racism.
See my above anecdote about Trump voters in Michigan being pissed off, not about the economy, but about Black Lives Matter.
It was the racism. Trump ran as an openly anti-Semitic white supremacist, and white voters flocked to him, including college-educated whites of both genders — he won a small majority of both.
White Republican voters are racist. Face the truth.
MomSense
@Elie:
I read an article today in WaPo about how ISIL, al Queda, and Salafist jihadis are balky Trump won. He will be good for recruitment and will engage foolishly in he ME. Basically they think he is going to bring us down.
Of course China and Russia are pleased too. He is not up to the task. Can you see him holding his own at international summits?
Helen
@Corner Stone: Trying to remember your posts about him. He sits at his Mom’s parent’s Thanksgiving table and asks simple quiet political questions. And his grandparents cannot for the life of them counter that.
Is this the boy you are talking about? Welcome to Ireland!!!
Peale
@Major Major Major Major:
bankruptcy reform act of 2005.
Look who voted Yea and who was nay. Because we can’t have people discharging medical bills and credit card debt too easily, even schemer didn’t vote for that.
Felanius Kootea
I’m not sure why, but the fact that she won the popular vote makes me feel a little better.
How do you nip fascism in the bud? Find some sane Republicans who are just as repulsed by Trump (they do exist) and try to strategize with them. There are many Republicans who are not happy with this outcome. Capitalize on that.
Peale
@MomSense: basically, the guy who said out loud he’s leaving the Geneva convention so we can bring back the torture again is hardly going to be lecturing them on liberal human rights abuses.
Felonius Monk
@Zinsky: U-R-A-TWIT.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@MomSense: I’ve been wondering about his ramping up of bombing in Syriaq blowing back on Europe, and of course, us.
Kay
I guess we’re not getting any oversight on the FBI. They’ll pick a candidate every cycle now. Why not? Apparently no one in our new banana republic has any interest in any concept of fairness or due process. They won! That’s all that matters. On to the tax code!
Miss Bianca
@Helen: a few Euros, and a ‘c’ instead of an ‘e’!
@JPL: Oh, and *then* this kid, who is the son (or would it be daughter? Since he claims cross-gendered status) of friends, accuses me of projection and white privilege. Because s/he voted for Jill Stein, and is pure. I’m afraid I told him/her to DIAF, for being a self-righteous little shit who would take no responsibility for what was to come. Because I am a Bad Person.
Omnes Omnibus
@Mandalay: If a group is racist, why should I not say so?
EBT
@ET: Doubtful! Been using EBT for over a decade on the net.
Helen
@Corner Stone: So come to Ireland. Really.
Miss Bianca
@Mandalay: Oh, so the truth is being “condescending”? Oh, that’s right – it’s you. The apologist for Democrats for White People. Bernie Bros are so damn thin-skinned about being called on race issues, they’re almost like Trump voters. Weissheit Uber Alles.
ETA: Interesting that you use the term “my” cause. Not “ours”. “Who are you really working for, Johnson”?
Major Major Major Major
@Omnes Omnibus: White feelings must be considered at all times.
Mandalay
@Peale:
Heh. But Harry Reid did! Also interesting to see that a certain (D-NY) was “Not Voting”. It was too risky to be for or against that bill.
Mnemosyne
@Miss Bianca:
I hope she enjoys her upcoming electroshock therapy to cure her of those silly “transgendered” notions, courtesy of our new VP Mike Pence.
(I’m assuming you mean she’s M-to-F. I couldn’t remember the non-gendered terms.)
@Omnes Omnibus:
I think the thinking is that calling someone a racist is inherently rude, and a non-racist person will be so incensed at being called a racist that they will immediately go out and vote for a white supremacist just to prove they’re not really racist.
Corner Stone
@Mandalay:
Them actually being racists doesn’t really help my cause, either. They are racists. That’s it.
EBT
@Miss Bianca: Just so you know The way you were using pronouns is really insulting, if you don’t know tactfully ask.
WarMunchkin
@Mnemosyne: The way I see it is that white anxiety means that they’re flipping the script on political correctness. So the framing then becomes, “be politically correct when you talk about racists”.
CaseyL
If Palin get Interior, they’re going to open the national parks for trophy hunting. All those moose, bear, deer, foxes, the successfully re-introduced wolves… all will be hunted down.
Somehow this is hitting me particularly hard.
Major Major Major Major
@CaseyL: drill baby drill.
@WarMunchkin: this.
Miss Bianca
@EBT: Just so you know – you have no idea what my relationship is with this kid. So, please, fuck off. That being said – point taken.
Helen
Good night all. Going home to my sold, inspected NY apt. that has NO internet!!!!! See you all on the other side of this sale at the JFK Hilton.
Omnes Omnibus
@Major Major Major Major: I’m white as an albino’s corpse. But I know that this discussion is about the 60% or so of dipshits, not the minority who are willing to treat everyone as an equal and are trying to not fuck up and be too clueless when dealing with POC and other minorities.
Mandalay
@Miss Bianca: Yes, keep on shrieking that white people are racist. See how well it works out for you when Democrats lose the white college graduate vote as well.
The Democratic Party has been losing the white working class vote for years, and screaming “Racists!” at them is the best possible approach I can imagine to make things worse in every way.
Omnes Omnibus
@Mandalay: What would you call them? Tolerance challenged?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@CaseyL: I wouldn’t say I’m optimistic about, well, anything, but it seems to me that’ the kind of thing that can be– not will, can– be blocked in court?
Major Major Major Major
@efgoldman: we’ll see. I dunno.
Irony Abounds
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: We are already well beyond the summer of 2004 relative to 2020 and the Dems have zilch, with the possible exception of Maggie Hassen who has served as Governor and will serve as Senator. But I know nothing about her, nor does the vast swath of America. It is really remarkable how little the Dems have in terms of Presidential material, particularly in California and New York. The Dems couldn’t even dig up a credible Senate candidate in Florida to deal with Little Marco. Ironically, the changing demographics have actually pulled the country to the right and energized the white bigots, thereby giving them more power than in the past. Wait until you have a Federal Voter ID. The POC vote for 2020 will be suppressed bigly.
Corner Stone
@Helen: He does do that! But he has a natural smartmouth so he does it really innocently. It gets AWKWARD real fucking fast. Which I am fine with but his mom breaks into the cold sweats.
He went to dinner with them tonight and we were talking about how he should just be cool and not say anything. But then he says Paw Paw always brings up politics. And I asked him if he wanted to stay home. And he took a breath and said, “No. No, it’s going to be fine.”
That fucking kid.
Major Major Major Major
@Omnes Omnibus: I wasn’t talking about you.
dogwood
@Omnes Omnibus:
The problem with all these “senator from mbna” memes is that they are the ultimate in insider elitism. The online liberal community is only a fraction of the base of the party. Millions more exist who don’t know a single Charles Pierce cutesy name. Those people love Joe Biden for all the right reasons. They don’t have time to analyze every vote he ever took or check his ideological credtials. He’s a great retail politician who loves people.
Elie
@Kay:
Amen!
I think she would have been a marvelous President in every way — a tough but sensitive leader. We will never have her and I am still in pain because I see what is ahead… We will miss her leadership but unfortunately, its absence won’t truly be appreciated by way too many.
The world is not in a good place. Sure, for some she was boring and A WOMAN — but in my view she had the exact mix we would need through this very challenging world transition. Instead, we will have not only an inexperienced clown, but a clown without any real structural organization or ability to lead it. I see chaos ahead as the Republicans try to “manage” him for the abilities he will need and his own very difficult personality. The Chinese must be just laughing and shaking their heads as well as Putin.
We – meaning us JB-ers… need to think about our money — our assets and what we are going to do in the times ahead. I am sure you are laughing at me — which is fine and I don’t care — but once this interim 100 days is done, we have the “real deal”, Jurassic era in our poitical and economic reality. We need to start thinking ahead and protecting ourselves. The entire republican party is unfit to lead and Trump, specifically unfit. You know that Paul Krugman stated today in his column (albeit I am sure he was depressed), that things may not get better economically, and indeed may get a lot worse….
I don’t want to be a crepe hanger, but we had better get ourselves ready
CaseyL
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Who knows? Maybe they’ll ignore the courts, or fast track everything to their New & Improved SCOTUS.
The plan coming into view is much worse than “mere” reactionary politics: it’s like they’re taking revenge on everyone for everything.
Miss Bianca
@Mandalay: White racists are racists. Oh, but please…let’s not call them that. Because…? Oh, because it hurts their *feelings* It makes them *uncomfortable*. It makes them turn to Republicanism, because then they can be *comfortably* racist. And because we’re supposed to use honey, not vinegar, to catch flies. Fuck that bullshit.
SiubhanDuinne
@J.:
That’s dark, but very fine. Thank you.
Corner Stone
@Mandalay: You don’t even really know what just happened in this election, do you?
Omnes Omnibus
@Major Major Major Major: I know. That was my point. When people bitch about white people and voting, I know they aren’t talking about me. When people bitch about white people and x, I need to think about how I handled x. If I don’t do x, they aren’t talking about me. If I do do x, I need to think about my shit.
Mandalay
@Irony Abounds:
Right – Murphy was literally not credible after he (rightly) got skewered for lying on his resume. What an incredibly dumb thing to do in 2016.
EBT
@Miss Bianca: You are welcome and eat it.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
five months? just a tad bit overstated, maybe?
Kamala Harris, Seth Moulton, Kirstin Gellibrand, Gavin Newsom (?), I don’t like Cory Booker but he impresses some people. Jason Kandar already holds statewide office in Missouri and I think Jay Nixon is done. The Castro brothers, remember them? Catherine Cortez Masto came from behind to beat a heavily favored retired general in a purple state. Again, Barack Obama was longest of long shots as late as the 2008 primaries. It all looks like it was inevitable in retrospect. It wasn’t. Q for Ohio folks: Have we really written off Sherrod Brown?
Omnes Omnibus
@dogwood: But those things would open him up to attacks. I like the guy. But he has a lot of baggage too. My only point.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
They didn’t in the 2008 primary, and it’s easy to get a lot of love from your own party when you’re not running for anything and, even more so, when no one’s running against you (see Bernie Sanders), and I don’t think Charlie Pierce came up with that one
Irony Abounds
@dogwood: The other question that has a simple answer is who would you rather be taking over in January, Trump or Biden? And anyone who thinks Biden would have done worse than Hillary is simple deluded. 8 years of being Obama’s loyal VP earned Biden lots of love among Democrats, and despite being the Senator from MBNA, which honestly most reasonable people can accept given that legislators are supposed to represent their constitutents, he didn’t have hundreds of thousands of $$ in speech fees from bankers, a private email server whose use and existence was bungled badly, or a multi-million foundation that, given how Doug Baud and other Clinton cronies handled it, created a perception, no matter how undeserved, of a conflict of interest. And even if sexism was the main reason Hillary lost, well, I don’t see how the cause of women has been advanced one wit by her losing. In fact, given the position the GOP is now in, the cause of women in this country is headed back to the ’50s QED.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Irony Abounds: the great thing about counterfactuals, you can never be proven wrong
EBT
There is also probably a lesson to be learned from Bianka and my little action as well. I didn’t even have to call her transphobic, just point out she said a shitty thing. She even saw it from my point of view, and still the sub-conscious lash out. People simply hate being called out, even in the best cases. Of course a lot of people are ultimately capable of buyers remorse and that combined with empathy will level out things in the long term. The short term will suck, and people will die however.
Omnes Omnibus
@Irony Abounds: Biden didn’t run. Dead son and shit. Counterfactuals are fun and all, but she was the candidate left standing after the primaries. I thought and continue to think that she was a good candidate. YMMV.
Major Major Major Major
@Irony Abounds:
Unless that legislator is Hillary Clinton, of course. HER support for banks is unconscionable.
Irony Abounds
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: 5 very important months that get far more focus than the first year and a half after a general election. If Obama hadn’t given the convention speech he never would have been considered a possibility in 2008. Kandor has possibilities, but losing doesn’t help. I love Gillibrand, but I doubt she is viewed as a heavyweight (for sexist reasons). Kamela Harris wins in California, but how much national exposure did she garner? I couldn’t pick her out of a lineup. I remember the names of the Castro brothers, but I can’t remember why I should be excited about them. Believe me, I hope to hell I’m wrong, because otherwise the abyss is very very deep.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Omnes Omnibus: as I said earlier, who are the points of comparison for her qualities as a candidate? Barack Obama? Bill Clinton? Al Gore (who was tarred as a phony environmentalist because his mother owned stock in an oil company)? John Kerry, who voted for the Iraq War and had the nerve to treat Howard Dean like a serious rival?
Irony Abounds
@Major Major Major Major: No, her support for banks as a legislator is perfectly understandable. Her taking huge speaking fees from banks as a private citizen shortly before announcing her run is unbelievably bad judgment. If you can’t see the difference I don’t know what to tell you.
3Jane Tessier-Ashpool (formerly known as Lorinda Pike
I lurk here all the time, but rarely comment, the trolls had been getting to me lately, but it’s really nice right now. I needed some sanity, and I have found it. (As an aside, I have immersed myself in dystopian fiction for what seems like forever, so I’m toying with the name chance from “It Can’t Happen Here” to the crazy-rich-clone lady from “Neuromancer”. Just to update my dystopia, you know. We are probably heading in that direction, at least for a while, but I am also determined to bend that arc toward justice too. And I live in the deepest of the deep red, so it’s definitely a struggle.)
Maybe we should head north (hubby has family in Maine) to at least be in a bluer area. I don’t like thinking the next tat-covered skinhead might want to shoot me because of my progressive liberal t-shirt, and I like hockey and winter…
Jim, Foolish Literalist
that’s a very important standard you just made up.
Well, it is all about you.
Irony Abounds
@Omnes Omnibus: I don’t disagree about the counterfactuals, and what is done is done. I’m just still in the pissed off stage and my wife is fed up with it so I have to blow off steam somewhere. I don’t mean to offend anyone, I just have to get this out of my system.
Mandalay
@Irony Abounds:
Maybe so, and maybe he could have won, but he could also have done better than Clinton and still lost.
The media endlessly intoned that American voters wanted change for a reason: there was solid polling data to back that up. Biden represented change even less than Clinton. So folks can blame Wikileaks and racism and sexism and emails and the media all they want, but apparently the Democrats were just offering more of the same in the minds of the voters.
Omnes Omnibus
@Irony Abounds: The candidate was good. Not perfect, but good. I suggest that you vent your understandable ire elsewhere. YMMV.
dogwood
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
I didn’t say anything about Joe for president.
Miss Bianca
@EBT: You call me “transphobic”? Hah. Deep hah.
But maybe there’s something to what you say. I don’t see it that way. But then, I come at it from the POV of a woman who, in all honesty, identifies more male than female. Envy of that freedom, which was denied to me, and harshly punished? Perhaps.
Who resents, yes, the way young white men like my young friend decide they can identify as “female” when they will never, truly, have to deal with the restrictions that are placed on the female body, and yet – they feel free to lecture *me* on issues of gender, sexuality and reproductive rights. Who have been in the trenches battling on these issues longer than they’ve been alive. Why do I see that as more male privilege at work? I wonder…hmm…I wonder…
Old dogs, EBT, Old dogs. I grok your point. There are limits and blind spots to tolerance. Even I will have to acknowledge *that*.
EBT
@Miss Bianca: I didn’t call you transphobic. I was just pointing out that even with no ad hom, it’s super hard to point out to someone that something they do or think or say hurts others. And yes transmale erasure is an awful thing that has led many people in to existences that they feel is false and empty.
EDIT: not to mention all the shit that people who don’t want to exist on one fixed point in the gender binary.
Miss Bianca
@EBT: This is a surprisingly painful topic for me, I will confess it. I apologize for any perceived dis.
ETA: I guess like any guy, I can be a bit of an insensitive lout. ; )
EBT
@Miss Bianca: I understand and if I have unduly caused you pain I apologize for my doing of such. That said it isn’t ever too late to be who you want to.
Steve in the ATL
Just encountered a boisterous “not my president!” march on the Las Vegas strip. Well done, strange and scantily clad people!
Omnes Omnibus
@Steve in the ATL: Woohoo!
jeannedalbret
@Mandalay: @Mandalay
Ruby Sales, AA social activist, happens to share your view:
href=”http:///www.onbeing.org/program/ruby-sales-where-does-it-hurt/8931/audio?embed=1″>
(listen to the end…and read comments!)