You betcha I held my own!
Lending more evidence to DougJ’s theory, I just heard Roger Simon on Hardball state that “Sara Palin held her own in the debate.”
If, by holding your own, you mean refusing to answer any questions you didn’t like, talking about random things that had nothing to do with the question, babbling about a grade school and winking at the camera, and then spent the rest of the time just lying about things, well, sure, she “held her own.”
Also, Biden mopped the floor with her in the post-debate polling, but, you know, those are facts that might conflict with Simon’s narrative.
GeneJockey
I’m pretty sure that’s what they think makes a good performance. Actually knowing shit, and even worse, being able to speak intelligently about it when asked, makes you an elitist.
Sarah Palin can do neither of those things, so she’s “real”.
DougJ
The soft sexism of lowered expectations.
Comrade Stuck
Just heard that too. Also, she did as well as GB in interviews before 2000 election. He was right though about Mccains statement that the economy was fundamentally strong as the financial walls were collapsing around us. Hard to out stupid that, even for Palin.
Molly
DougJ, ya know, not too far off the mark on that one.
Comrade Stuck
Best quote of day is about Gov. Sanford in The State paper.
The article is a riot as South Carolinians try some pop shrinkology on their nutty Governor.
JGabriel
OT, but there’s a new statement from Jenny Sanford:
Hmm. Hot Argentine mistress OR work, time, repentance, and difficulty? I wonder what Mark Sanford will choose?
Shorter Jenny: I’ll give him another chance, if he begs, but the rest of you can tell him to fuck off.
.
JK
Did Simon offer any comments along the lines of this?
h/t Andrew Sullivan
Dr. Rockso
As a liberal, no one scares me more than Sarah Palin running against Barack in 2012.
You hear that Bill Kristol? Make her the nominee, and you have a guaranteed victory. Her sassy style makes her virtually unassailable. No, really. Stop laughing!
Cat Lady
Considering how she was actually expected to perform, one could make the case she did hold her own. I thought she’d be a deer in the headlights. Making her own answers up to questions that weren’t asked was her only option, and an option that frankly didn’t occur to me – she just bullied and winked her way through it. She’s got some gonads.
Zifnab
Can I just say that, while I would never want to see Sarah Palin as MY President, I would absolutely love to see her as President of some parody country that I could perhaps watch reruns of on Comedy Central. I’m just say’n. She’s a laugh-freak’n-riot.
Adolphus
Ya’know.
Roger Simon was once a columnist in the Baltimore Sun like 20 years or so ago. He was critical, logical, skeptical, and very funny. His Simon Sez columns and annual haiku contests were hilarious.
I know of no other pundit or political journalist who’s evolution better typifies the career trajectory from critical outsider to accepted wisdom, stenographing Beltway insider than Roger Simon. What a disappointment.
JK
@Dr. Rockso:
Do you or anyone else truly believe that sex appeal alone can provide Sarah Palin with 270 electoral votes on Election Day 2012?
Won’t she have to demonstrate competence and an understanding of the issues?
I can’t believe winks, a folksy speaking style, and a tomboy image is enough
Adolphus
@Zifnab:
She’d make a great mayor of Reno.
Comrade Stuck
Yes, but they can only take you so far and are intellectually bereft. Ask George Bush.
Cat Lady
@Comrade Stuck:
George Bush was elected twice. Just sayin’.
Edit: Selected once, elected once.
demimondian
@JK: Sex appeal alone?
Why is that kind of sexist nonsense acceptable on this blog? Gov. Palin is an accomplished woman who happens to also be remarkably good-looking. It’s typical of you libtards that you focus on the superficial attractiveness (because you want fantasize about your PILF ‘er) over her meteoric rise from obscurity to world-famous word leader.
JGabriel
Zifnab:
Sarah Palin had to be made real. Any parodist or caricaturist that invented her would have been executed for extreme misogyny.
.
Bill E Pilgrim
@JK: I think that was a “don’t throw me in the briar patch” sort of thing by Rockso.
Brendan
The most outrageous bit of media nonsense last fall (IMO) came after the Palin-Biden debate. Roger Simon was on MSNBC with Chris Matthews as the public polling came in showing Biden to be the clear winner.
Up to that point, Roger had been furiously praising/spinning Palin’s performance. Even by Village standards, it was pretty shameless. Matthews pointed to the poll showing that the people thought Biden had won and asked Simon for his response.
Simon said “They’re wrong.”
It was breathtaking. Forget what you voters think! We talking heads have our own rubric. Would you rubes please be so kind as to keep up? Also, too.
SenyorDave
She performed much better in the debates than I ever thought possible. Of course, any thinking person realized what a joke her answers were. Gwen Ifill didn’t do her job. When Palin said early on that she might not answer the questions posed to her, Ifill should have told her immediately that she would keep both candidates on target.
Elie
I have such concern for our country if we cannot use our intelligence to accurately assess reality. As you say, how anyone could hear and see her evasions and winky smirks as anything but complete showmanship and nothing else is beyond me. Really — how stupid can so many in the MSM and right wing blogistan persist in being and still be able to breathe and swallow their spit at the same time?
They seem to live in a world where they don’t want to acknowledge the consequence of gravity and the hard rocky ground if one steps off of a cliff. I don’t know anymore what to say to it except to make sure that they actually jump off as many cliffs as I/we can get them to jump. Having that very strangely charasmatic but definitely also very limited Sarah Palin as a serious nominee for the office of President is as close to a cliff as I can think of for the remaining nitwits in that party.
JK
@demimondian:
Who sold buttons that read “The Hottest Governor from the Coolest State” at the Republican National Convention? What is being implied by this statement?
How come this very competent chief executive was left tongue-tied on several occassions when Katie Couric lobbed the softest of softball questions in her general direction?
Comrade Stuck
@Cat Lady:
Elect me once
shame on you
elect me twice
deep in doo
JenJen
Speaking of Palin, I found one of the more interesting tidbits in the Purdum article to be the Big Reveal of Mark McKinnon as the guy who coached her through the veep debate.
Which is why it really cracked me up to go over to Daily Beast to see if McKinnon has responded to this allegation yet:
http://www.thedailybeast.com/author/mark-mckinnon/?cid=hp:morebeastblogs3
Sanford For President! Sanford Should Resign!
demimondian
@JK: Vendors sold them, of course — but it’s worth pointing out I’ve never seen a picture of any *officially licensed* vendor selling them.
demimondian
@JK: We have no idea what kind of distractions were being thrown at Gov. Palin during the interview. It’s been said, however, that there were offensive pictures being flashed on a back wall to distract her during those “softball” questions, in hopes of getting her to leave halfway through, thus allowing the talking heads to make hay of her cowardice. Instead, she stuck the interview out, remaining polite and diplomatic, under incredibly trying circumstances.
JK
@JenJen:
Nice to see that Purdum revealed McKinnon to be a liar.
I remember it being reported at one time, that McKinnon stated categorically that he would not work for McCain if Obama were the Democratic nominee.
Comrade Dread
Sarah Palin was and is George Bush’s lost twin sister.
The main difference that I can discern from only seeing either on TV is that I get a sense that Palin could be a lot more vicious than W.
[W. was vicious in an unintentional bumbling “oops, I completely shredded the Constitution and helped wreck the economy, but I was only trying to help” sort of way. ]
linda
i went back and read simon’s post-debate column — he was smitten with palin’s performance. he even mocks biden for his knowledge of the issues —
You betcha Sarah Palin can debate
By: Roger Simon
October 2, 2008 11:52 PM EST
ST. LOUIS — Sarah Palin was supposed to fall off the stage at her vice presidential debate Thursday evening. Instead, she ended up dominating it.
She not only kept Joe Biden on the defensive for much of the debate, she not only repeatedly attacked Barack Obama, but she looked like she was enjoying herself while doing it.
She smiled. She faced the camera. She was warm. She was human. Gosh and golly, she even dropped a bunch of g’s….
Biden was somber, serious and knowledgeable. And he seemed to think that debates are about facts. He had a ton of them. ..
GregB
Yeah, but Biden doesn’t look hot in spandex, bent over a flag and winking in his running shoes.
Leave Sarah alone!
-G
Martin
Well, the mistress is off the table since he flew down there to break up with her, remember?
Or am I going to be the only person who remembers that lie?
Comrade Stuck
There are some people who can bullshit their way out of about anything . Herein lies Sarah Serendipity’s one true talent. They always have another rabbit to pull out of their hat and never quit or give in. I will give her credit for this and with more basic knowledge and the ability to take some basic direction, she could be formidable, at least in conservative circles. The recent revelations however, paint her as not interested in either of those things, suggesting to me a narcissist, or other pathos mixed in.
geg6
Fuck Roger Simon. Seriously, man. I, too, will never forget his “They’re wrong” moment after the polling came in on that debate. Simon is an arrogant asshole who obviously is one of the “starbursts” crew when it comes to Sarah Barracuda. He should just shut his mouth and share his lotion and Kleenex with Lowry and Assrocket in the privacy of his secret basement room that he’s plastered with pictures of Palin in her red Naughty Monkeys and leave the rest of us alone.
John Cole
@linda: Some days it feels like it is a national imperative to get the press corps laid.
Cat Lady
@John Cole:
Have you actually looked at Roger Simon? Nah gah happen.
demimondian
@John Cole: I can’t see why. Today’s revelations about the WaPo Message Parlours clearly shows the occupation that the MSM truly pursues…
TenguPhule
@John Cole
Your unclosed post italics is bleeding all over the screen.
MattF
Palin held her own in the sense that Simon was ‘holding’ his own. And, presumably starbursts ensued, etc.
sdm
i think what he means is “during the debate, me and Rich Lowry and others ‘held our own,’ if you know what i mean.”
robertdsc
Love that top picture. So purty.
JenJen
@JK: That’s certainly the way I remember it. And yet, McKinnon spent the autumn working this “Oh, I love John McCain but I shall not unleash my vast powers upon the hapless Obama” angle. I think Morning Joe got sucked in pretty good.
It just really burns my ass when people like McKinnon play good cop to nobody’s advantage but their own, all the while being basically full of shit. Your basic “DWTFTW.”
@linda:I thought I’d read everything from that night, but somehow missed Roger Simon’s drool. OMFG yuck.
Elie
28 – Comrade Dread
Yeah, probably vicious but in the same predictable way that her intelligence tracks. She is probably incapable of true Machievellian scheming which requires depth but sure, she will claw your eyes out and lie through her teeth to “getcha”. Unofrtunately, as she lies through her teeth she can’t figure out all the downstream consequences of the lies which is why she needs a legal defense fund now. She was probably pretty effectively nasty when she was doing her game in the small pond of Alaska, but the national US game is 3-d and requires way more neurons and synapses than she has for her little evil shtick.
Demimondian –
Man, Sara wants it both ways. Why else do her beauty queen tart pose for the running magazine and yet expect everyone to think she has a serious intellect? Ah c’mon. Don’t you guys ever get sick of making up your own reality? Geez, the effort it takes to deny deny deny. Sheesh, she could actually GET smart if she used the effort pretending to be smart and actually tried to LEARN something!
Bill E Pilgrim
@Martin:
I’m not touching that hanging curve ball with a ten foot airplane ticket.
geg6
John Cole: No way any woman on earth would screw any of these assholes. I wouldn’t let them fuck my dead and rotting corpse.
Bill E Pilgrim
@MattF:
@sdm:
That’s a photo finish, that is.
JK
Thanks for that explanation. It reminds me of the court scene from The Caine Mutiny
Adolphus
@demimondian
Please, when democrats elect women they look like Babs Mikulski or Bella Abzug or at best Hillary Clinton, Ann Richards, or Elanor Holmes Norton.
Republicans are the ones who seem to insist that their female politicians (and journalists and TV pundits) be sexy before being competent. Palin, Bachman, Coulter, and every female on Fox.
demimondian
@Adolphus: “Please” yourself.
The reality is that you can’t understand why people would vote for Gov. Palin or any of the Democrat politicians you list, and so you project your own sexist preconceptions onto them, concluding, in her case that she’s a “tart”, and, in their case, that people are voting for them in spite of their genders.
demkat620
I’ll say it again. That woman has George Bush’s anti-Midas Touch. She’s toxic and there will come a day when the majority of the GOP will regret letting her in the door.
AND just like Mark Sanford, she will not go away.
kay
I watched Biden, because I thought he had the harder task.
He could do the debate end, he knows the answers, but he had to strike just the right tone.
We all know they were waiting for any slip-up that could be declared sexism, and, in my opinion, there’s still a societal unease around any rhetoric that could be perceived as beating up on a younger, less experienced female. I don’t like that it exists, but it exists.
He couldn’t roll over, but he couldn’t hector, and he absolutely couldn’t patronize.
Anyway, he did beautifully on tone, and that’s all he had to do. He has a big mouth, he’s quick, can be genuinely funny, and that combo could have been tragic. I was amazed he pulled it off. Good job.
I don’t remember whatever the hell she said, although the wink made me laugh out loud. She both bores and horrifies me, alternately.
JenJen
@JohnCole, top: Speaking of that CNN post-debate poll:
“84 percent of the people polled said Palin did a better job than they expected”
I’m just saying, but, seriously, couldn’t you put a monkey in a jester costume on that podium, in front of a nationwide audience, and 84% would say he did better than expected?
13% would say they were disappointed in the monkey-jester’s performance.
More troubling, still, 3% would answer, “I Don’t Know.”
anonevent
@JGabriel: I’ve been reading that Jenny is the only reason Mark has gotten as far as he has. She’s his Karl Rove. And she knows that in Republican circles, the two of them staying together will pay way more dividends toward him moving up than him going off to his sweetheart. She won’t let him go until his career is over, which will either be when he gets impeached or gets voted out of office.
Adolphus
Demondian:
But i did vote for some of the Democrats I listed.
Tsulagi
What, you’re saying she’s no stranger to a dirty sanchez? Maybe that’s what the wink is for. Code.
Facts are for atheist ACORN commies. They have faith in their feelings. See their number-free budget and healthcare plans.
ksmiami
Agree with Comrade Dread – I think Bush lacked a empathy, but he wasn’t an intentionally evil guy. Palin, if given the tools, would launch the inquisition among any reasoned scientist, atheist, Dr., or former high school enemy who say went off to Dartmouth and was a ‘litist… And that is why she absolutely scares the fucking shit out of me – she is the current no-nothing, blame liberals for everything base that is the Republican party.
JK
When Palin gave her first public speech after being selected as McCain’s running mate, she credited Hillary Clinton for helping to break the glass ceiling. Months earlier at a political forum, Palin criticized Clinton for whining and stated that her comments set back the cause of women in politics.
@Elie:
Great point. Why indeed?
demimondian
@Adolphus: And you focused on how you were voting for them in spite of their looks, just like you said, above.
How can that not be sexism?
anonevent
@demimondian: “Democrat politicians.” You just lost the debate.
demimondian
@JK: Help me here. Who called in a “beauty queen tart” pose — her, or you? Who was projecting their own lewd thoughts onto her?
Elie
Adolphus —
Not sure that you aren’t saying that somehow women politicians and journalists can’t be both attractive AND smart.
But if you want to BE smart, you have to be open to learning and actually modify what you think and see to new information. THAT is the piece that both Republican men and women do not do. They have a view of reality and damned if it is ever modified by any new information. That does not represent any kind of living and dynamic intellect but more or less makes them into life sized wax dummies or at best animatronics robots. They are going to march right into the wall when wound up cause they cannot – will not adapt to the reality of the wall. The wall is just so “socialist”
JGabriel
Adolphus:
You forget: Maria Cantwell and Kirsten Gillibrand.
It’s just that our hot Dem women also have brains.
.
binzinerator
@GregB:
Hoo-boy, on first read I thought that said:
It is a lot funnier that way, tho.
JGabriel
@demimondian:
You say that like it’s a flaw. The truth is, most reasoning people have trouble understanding that one.
.
JK
@demimondian:
Why is it so difficult for you to acknowledge that sex appeal is a factor in Palin’s popularity with the Republican base? And also a factor in her popularity with media types like Chris Matthews, Joe Scarborough, etc?
demimondian
@JK: Because I’m no fan of baseless slanders. Why is that so hard for you to accrpt?
geg6
Demimondian: It was called that because that’s what it was. Just like her bikini and rifle pics. She’s perfectly happy to be the Playboy centerfold for doughy, old Goopers to beat off to. Janet Granholm is just as attractive and thirty times smarter than Governor Staple for a Bellybutton. But funnily enough, she hasn’t had to strip down or wear well-known stripper fuck me pumps to get ahead in politics. The GOp and their enablers are nothing but adolescent boys who haven’t ever gotten to third base with a smart, attractive woman. And boy, does it show.
linda
@John Cole:
aint that the truth — and, hence, the forever obsession with bill clinton and his wandering dick. that column is actually extremely offensive for another reason — and that’s his complete dismissal that facts and discussion of issues have any place in a political campaign. seriously.
hahaha… the ‘starbursts crew’.
demimondian
@geg6: Obviously, you’ve never seen a picture of Jenny Sanford.
Elie
59 —
Get real. Black sheer stocking with running shoes and tight shorts, hands on hips. Yeah, MY lewd thoughts.
I didn’t pick the pose, she did. You are again doing the Republican wall denial thing. The pose was not tart like, according to you, it was others who MADE it a tart pose. Palin is just an innocent little snow flake who while smart as a whip (according to you), does not have the power, ability or the desire to manipulate her own image at all according to you.
Trollhattan
Good lord, if you question how akklomplushed and smrt Gov. Palin is—she of the six-colleges-to-one-degree edyoukashun plan—yur sexist?
Also.
In that case I’ll defer all commenting on the snowbilly to my bride. You definitely won’t like what she has to say. (Oh, got it, she’s just jealous.)
OTOH, anybody who would seriously consider giving her Dick Cheney’s job and place her first in line behind a 72-year-old cancer survivor to become the head of state must be flat-out unAmerican. What sort of lunacy did we really avoid last November?
JK
OK, not her most serious mistake in the debate, but at one point Palin praised Jill Biden’s work saying that teaching is a great thing to do and that “she’ll get her reward in heaven.”
Considering that Biden’s first wife died tragically in a car accident, I think the line “she’ll get her reward in heaven” was pretty fucking offensive and tasteless.
Comrade Stuck
We needs a “Lewd Thoughts” filter Cole. Can’t have Bozzell sniffin’ around for those little devils.
geg6
Um, actually I have. She’s okay. Just okay. And I don’t think she’s ever run for office or anchored on FOX. So not really on point. But we actually don’t really know that Sanford ever got to third base with her. Having children is not evidence that sex has actually taken place. Exhibit A: one Michael Jackson.
Pasquinade
Krauthammer on Palin: Platitudes and clichés not enough
Said Charles Krauthammer last night on Fox News:
Now, as to Palin, I agree entirely with what Mara said. She is—she has star power without any doubt. She has an extremely devoted following. But she is not a serious candidate for the presidency.
She had to go home and study and spend a lot of time on issues in which she was not adept last year, and she hasn’t. She has to stop speaking in clichés and platitudes. It won’t work.
It could work for eight weeks if you’re the number two candidate, as she was last year. But even so, she got singed a lot in that campaign. You cannot sustain a campaign of platitudes and clichés over a year and a half if you’re running for the presidency.
http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0709/Krauthammer_on_Palin_Platitudes_and_cliches_not_enough.html
gnomedad
Or, to paraphrase one of my favorite lines from The Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy, this must some strange use of the phrase “held her own” I wasn’t familiar with.
dr. luba
@TenguPhule: The italics are kind of pretty, though…….
Pasquinade
Palin in a towel….
http://www.google.com/#hl=en&q=Palin+in+a+towel&btnG=Google+Search&aq=f&oq=Palin+in+a+towel&aqi=&fp=K0T0PTDylw0
Comrade Stuck
@Pasquinade:
Shit, I was expecting to see an 8 by 10 glossy Pasquinade — to project a lewd thought, or two.
You’re going on report to the Disappointment Police.
JGabriel
Geg6:
Oh, c’mon. That’s not fair! Comparing the Sanfords to Michael Jackson is just a little beyond the pale (err, no pun intended). They’re just not that strange.
Jenny Sanford:
Oh. Never mind. Carry on, Geg6.
.
chuck
@GregB:
You’re begging for a very disturbing photoshop, aren’t you?
gnomedad
@Pasquinade:
She knows where her towel is?
JK
@demimondian:
You and I inhabit parallel universes. With Balloon Juice, John Cole has created a passageway within the spacetime continuum to link these 2 universes together.
Hopefully, sanity and rationality will prevail in your universe meaning that Sarah Palin never gets within a sniff of the Republican nomination and therefore never holds the reins of power in my universe.
John McCain’s name should live in infamy for inflicting Sarah Palin on the cosmos.
ChrisB
@geg6:
I’d probably draw the line there too.
maya
You know, that’s pretty neat, come to think of it. Always have the bible handy to read quotations out of to describe what you’re feeling, what’s going on in the world, explain away your, or your spouses’, fu’s, what plan of action you’ll be taking and so on and so forth.
Obama and Gibbs should start doing that with the WH briefings. Wonder how it would go over with the press corps?
Fencedude
@demimondian:
You appear to be on the wrong internet.
Dusty
Accusing CBS and Katie Couric of “offensive pictures being flashed on a back wall” during an interview isn’t a “baseless slander”?
Mike in NC
“Country”“Cosmos First!”Amy
Right after it, Simon said Palin WON the debate
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1008/14234.html
He was virtually the only one who thought she actually did great. That’s what we’re dealing with.
demimondian
@Amy: She did win the debate.
You all are talking about the details of her performance six months later, dwelling on the minutia of her actions — you can’t even remember the one feeble joke that Biden essayed at her expense. Any PR type will tell you that is a win.
Dusty
Snap polling done immediately after the election showed voters didn’t think she won the debate; they thought Biden did. At best, Palin didn’t do anything tremendously embarrassing, but she didn’t do all that much to reform her image in the minds of voters either.
demimondian
@Dusty: W00t. I’m thrilled.
My claim stands as fact — her performance was so memorable that you, her political opponents, are still talking about it months after it happened. The snap poll? It was forgotten the next morning.
Dennis-SGMM
All the better. Palin/Bachman 2012.
Bubblegum Tate
Now’s a good time to dust off the ol’ Sarah Palin debate flow chart and have a good laugh.
demimondian
@Dennis-SGMM: Nah. Bachmann’s from another Northern state. You need someone who can capture the base in the South. I’m thinking Katherine Harris, myself.
Palin/Harris 2012
Comrade Stuck
@demimondian:
I still remember standing in Portland Or. watching Mt St Helens blowing smoke a month after blowing her top/ And that was twenty nine years ago. Palin’s debate performance was not altogether un-similar.
Demi’s smoking the holiday stash. the good stuff tonight.
JGabriel
demimondian:
Any statistician will tell you that the winner of a political debate is the person whom the public (aka, the polis, i.e. the latin root of political) chooses as the winner.
And the polls (note that latin root again, demimondian) taken directly after the debate said Biden was the winner.
Exactly what reality do you inhabit? Are the skies a different color there too?
.
chuck
If your object is to be talked about instead of actually being respected, yes. We still talk about Dan Quayle sometimes too. Also.
Why is Palin suddenly in the news again? Is it just echoes from Letterman or has she said or done something actually relevant lately?
Dusty
Actually, we’re talking about how out of touch Roger Simon was for thinking Sarah Palin did well when voters clearly didn’t agree.
And memorable doesn’t equal “good.” Bentsen’s Jack Kennedy line was far more memorable than anything Sarah Palin did and Dukakis lost.
Biden wasn’t there to destroy Sarah Palin. He was there to give voters a look at Joe Biden (the family talk, the blue-collar stuff, the knowledge and experience), to stay on message about the Obama platform and to not commit any major gaffes or do anything that could be interpreted as sexist. He accomplished all that.
media browski
Halp!
Is demimondian a real wingnut or just a spoof? My snarkdar thinks demi’s either ignorant or hilarious!
Dennis-SGMM
@demimondian:
LOL! Jiggling for America!
demimondian
@JGabriel: Remind me not to let you direct any marketing campaign I need run.
Rosali
The Vanity Fair article is making us remember how fun it was last fall.
JGabriel
demimondian:
You know, people still talk about George H. W. Bush throwing up in the lap of a Japanese official, but no one calls that a WIN.
.
Demo Woman
Lowry and Simon were masturbating at the time so they did not really have the time to listen to her answers.
Sarah Palin for President, better than the Playboy centerfold.
Comrade Stuck
@media browski:
More like “go ahead, pull my finger, see what happens”
JGabriel
@demimondian:
Is that you, Sarah Palin?
.
media browski
@demimondian: as a PR-type, I can assure you that Palin’s debate performance was indeed memorable, much like Miss Teen South Carolina’s comment on Americans and geography was memorable.
Really, are you a spoof? Either way I love you so much!
JGabriel
Chuck:
You know, the same question has been bothering me too. As amusing as it is to revisit old comedies, I haven’t the slightest idea why Palin is back in the news now.
Rosali is probably closest to correct, but it still seems somehow incomplete.
.
Nellcote
Palin is a lying bitch. From the first day of the campaign with the stopped-the-bridge-to-nowhere nonsense to the latest interview wherein the SS supposedly kept her big fall from being reported, she lies about things large and small, of importance or totally trivial. She’s just a flat out liar. It’s offensive that she thinks no one notices or cares.
maya
demimondian;
My brother once got so drunk at a wedding reception he puked on the bride while dancing with her.
Yes, everyone still talks about that one – years later, but, strangely, no one can remember what was served for the dinner that encored.
Ash Can
Based on what I’ve read of Demimondian on this blog, I’m thinking either s/he’s having a jolly good spoofing time tonight, or someone’s hacked into Demi’s account.
Nylund
Unless you’re an undergrad at the university I work for. Then, Palin one. And that was truly scary to see. So many young kids with so much future ahead of them, already brainwashed into believing one side was right, even when prevented with clear evidence that that side could not even coherently explain a single idea, and purposefully, willfully, and outrightly avoided actually answering any questions and had absolutely zero problem telling a straight up, not even the slightest bit true, bald faced lie.
eemom
I could be wrong, but I THINK the reason we’re still talking about this tired old corpse of a vice-presidential debate farce all these months later is that some schmuck chose to resurrect it in VF this week and everyone in bloggerdom has latched onto his article like a wink on a youbetcha.
I have 2 permanent takeaways from that debate: (1) the woman revealed her true, non-human, sub-reptilian, nature when she failed to respond by so much as a nanosecond pause to Joe Biden’s remarks about his dead wife and child; and (2) anyone who still takes Rich Lowry seriously in any capacity after that unprecedented post-debate display of public jerk-off-dom is just, ya know, hopeless.
JGabriel
Nellcote:
That’s so uncool. What did the female gender of the canine species ever do to you that would justify associating them with Palin? Huh?
.
Dennis-SGMM
Real Feminists understood that Palin’s RW pic was a tribute to Catherine Bach’s portrayal of Daisy Duke.
JGabriel
demimondian:
Then how does everyone here remember it?
.
media browski
@demimondian: You’re right, I hope more men focus on thinking about women’s looks when making hiring decisions so as to avoid even the mere whiff of sexism.
Cat Lady
@maya:
#I just wet my pants#.
Comrade Stuck
@maya:
I bet the bride remembers
JGabriel
Ash Can:
I’m thinking you may be right. Also, we don’t have accounts here.
.
JGabriel
Comrade Stuck:
Or at least her dry cleaners.
.
Mike in NC
Perhaps it ties in with the recent deaths of Farrah and Jacko: media fixation on celebrities whose lives were often slow motion train wrecks. At this point Sweet Sarah is merely dead from the neck up.
JK
@Dennis-SGMM:
Palin/Bachmann 2012 would be the greatest comedy goldmine of all-time.
Comedy Central would need to start Comedy Central 2 to document the once-in-a lifetime non-stop train wreck campaign of Palin and Bachmann. Stewart, Colbert, Letterman, and O’Brien would need to hire more writers.
Comrade Stuck
Why do people rubberneck bad accidents?
demimondian
@JK: And that, of course, is why I think Palin should select someone with a more solid foundation in executive experience, who has a proven track record of delivering elections, like fmr. Florida Sec’y of State Harris.
JK
If the presidential thing doesn’t work out for her, I’m sure there are cable execs just dying to create a Sarah Palin reality show.
Joe Lisboa
“who has a proven track record of delivering elections, like fmr. Florida Sec’y of State Harris.”
… aaaand we have a parody, ladies and germs. Too bad, was hoping Brick Oven Bill finally ponied up the cash for the sex change op and was posting under a different handle. Oh well.
Joe Lisboa
[ this blank intentionally left spaced ]
demimondian
@Joe Lisboa: Katherine Harris has never lost an election for an executive post. In 2006, running against the Bush/Rove machine, she sill won the Florida Republican primary. In November, however, she was unable to buck the anti-Bush tide, the devastating effects of the Mark Foley scandal, and the active work of the White House staff against her, and lost the general.
Joe Lisboa
You’re not fooling anyone, demimondian. Your reference to Harris “delivering elections” is the red flag. You’re either the best spoof I’ve seen on this site or a certified fool. I’m not going to take the bait either way. Good day.
ruemara
@demimondian:
Really? I’m a PR type. I say that was a huge, epic loss. You must be confused between a good memory vs a seared in the human conscious disaster that takes a rather large dose of doctrinal purity and mainlined tequila to forget.
Biden’s humanity, smarts and his discussion of his wife and his tears lasted.
Madam Palin, with her winky mcstarbursts, are mock worthy for ever.
2 different “wins”.
Digital Amish
@demimondian:
Come on now, admit it. You’re just fuckin’ with us now, aren’t ya?
demimondian
@Digital Amish: Why would I do that? I consider Katherine Harris one of the most underrated Republicans on the scene right now — and I consider her demonization to be largely based on one ill-considered pose during an interview, in which it appeared that she was flaunting her bust. She’s been elected several times in Florida — and not just in Florida, but in Central Florida, which is the part of the state where Republicans must win if they are to win statewide. She’s got solid conservative credentials, and is as much in tune with the heart and soul of the modern party as anyone, including Gov. Palin.
She has legal credentials, having successfully defended Florida’s vote count in the 2000 election, and having prevented the theft of Pres. Bush’s victory — a victory that even the liberal New York Times eventually grudgingly acknowledged.
Finally, in the particular case of a Palin/Harris ticket, Rep. Harris would provide excellent geographical balance, in addition to her other assets.
Comrade Stuck
@demimondian:
Ok dude, now your channeling BoB. Step away from the Bong please/
Svensker
@eemom:
Yep. You done nailed it.
demimondian
@ruemara: Fooey. Oscar Wilde put it right: “Say what you will, but spell my name correctly.” Gov. Palin faces a daunting challenge — continuing to lead her state as its chief executive, while keeping her name known and talked about in the lower 48.
Her surprising performance in the Vice Presidential debate has served to do just that. You can sneer all you like — you’re merely reinforcing the truth: that she gave a memorable performance against a flat and forgettable Joe Biden that night.
Svensker
@demimondian:
OK, you have just outed yourself as a complete spoof. Case closed.
demimondian
@Svensker: And, once again, we see a member of the Democrat Party deriding a woman because she’s attractive. And the Republicans are the party of dirty old men, somehow?
Dusty
Where did Svensker call Katherine Harris attractive?
Elie
I just finished reading the Vanity Fair article on Palin…
She strikes me as beautiful, talented in a certain way, but having gotten many of the breaks and opportunities in her life through her looks and killer instinct in a small, relatively slower environment…
She has never had to work for it in the big fishbowl. Never needed to really prove herself beyond a superficial, vindictive kind of ruthlessness. She has never had to play the sustained inside game with players above her skill and power level. That game requires mentors who are retained — not cast off like empty shells. It also requires a capacity for work and diligence — for putting your head down and doing the work…
Her initial foray into this school has taught her wariness rather than an appetite for the fight. She doesnt really seem to be invigorated or have a stomach for the serious fight. She worked hard to keep a small band next to her — not really to expand her range and pursuade the doubters. She takes to only those who already believe.
I see her as a fading star. Her enemies have taken her measure and wait — knowing that she really has nothing beyond the appeal to the bible thumpers. She knows it too. Despite her sex appeal, personal beauty and a measure of magnetism…she can’t run with the pack. Yes, it is intellectual and cognitive but also a personal character issue. Doing the hard work and building the respect and the chops is just not something that she ever learned or has the capacity to undertake in my opinion. She just doesnt have it. There is a hole…
Darcy
@demimondian:
Okay, long time lurker here. I seem to remember a rational, funny demimondian who posted here a fair amount during the campaign. (S)he was not a fan on Palin at the time. I call a sick fuck parody troll here, one whose name is linked to a blog where last post concerns the health of the author, from October. The author also identifies himself/herself as a software engineer. Whatever else you are, demiblah, you are a lying hack pervert, and you should just go away.
oh really
Yeah, but she kicked Biden’s ass in the Winkathon. And that’s what voters are looking for.
Man, Palin would get Ahmadinejad across a conference table and she’d start winkin’ at him, and she’d wink and wink and wink, and he wouldn’t know WTF had hit him. He’d be wondering if she had something in her eye, or just an annoying tic, or was he seeing the symptoms of a serious neurological disorder.
Pretty soon, he’d be so distracted and unnerved that he’d give up the nukes (real or imagined), renounce Allah, and sign up for a half a dozen US military bases in Iran all in return for a promise that he’d never have to look at Palin again.
(I know this because it’s exactly how I felt after watching Palin in the debate — except I don’t have nukes, don’t believe in Allah, and don’t have enough room in my yard for US military bases — in fact, not even a PX.)
And all Obama has is some half-assed evil eye.
wonkie
“demimondian
@Dusty: W00t. I’m thrilled.
My claim stands as fact—her performance was so memorable that you, her political opponents, are still talking about it months after it happened. The snap poll? It was forgotten the next morning.”
I guess that’s the difference between a liberal and a conservative. The conservative thinks debates are won on style. Liberals think that are won by the use of facts and logic.
And the winking. God. Pure narcissism. No woman with a brain would compete for the second highest post in the nation by flirting.
Dusty
But that would never happen, because that would involve sitting down with Ahmadinejad without preconditions. You gotta think these things through.
Zuzu's Petals
@Darcy:
Heck, Demi wasn’t even a fan of Palin two days ago:
kay
@Elie:
Biden didn’t have to do anything at that debate to win, so he didn’t, and he won.
The Obama campaign never engaged with Sarah Palin. She wasn’t a threat, and any engagement with a lunatic carries risk. They sat back and let her bury herself. Safer and smarter.
They went head to head full-on with Clinton, because she was a threat. That’s the difference between the two woman. One of them was a real competitor, and it wasn’t Sarah Palin.
Imagine Al Gore launching a silly campaign to get David Letterman fired. You can’t, because he won’t. That’s the difference.
mcd
@ksmiami:
I couldn’t put it better myself. The thought of this person being near any sort of power is truly frightening. Evokes memories of the antagonist in King’s The Dead Zone.
Tonal Crow
@JK:
Um, Bush almost won in 2000 and 2004 without demonstrating competence at anything but lying and without any significant understanding of any issue other than, perhaps, anti-abortionism.
demimondian
@Darcy: And you don’t like being led around.
Fair enough.
Welcome to Balloon Juice. We have a long-standing tradition here of spoofing. In fact, one of the front pagers made his name that way; DougJ’s spoof postings are still legendary. Sorry that I upset you; it’s a part of the game, but it’s not fair to play with people who don’t know the ground rules. It’s no excuse, but I didn’t realize you didn’t understand.
For the record, yes, I’m a liberal Democrat in real life. I am the same demi who posted way back when, and yes, Bohemian Paris is still my blog, even though I’ve had nothing to say for months. And, yes, I’m still a software developer, and, yes, I…well, my most well known creation is still affecting people’s lives.
And, yes, you’ve heard of it, and, no, I won’t name it. It would identify me.
Comrade Stuck
@demimondian:
Well, you had me fooled. Right up to the having your same handle part. (rolls eyes)
demimondian
@Comrade Stuck: Given that I didn’t mention you, I’m surprised you felt the need to respond. But I’m glad to see that you have the humility to publicly admit your error; you, at least, should have known better.
Tonal Crow
@media browski:
Well, you’ll just have to keep guessing, won’t you?
Comrade Stuck
@demimondian:
Pull my finger, go ahead, pull my finger Mr spoof genius.
JGabriel
demimondian:
Clap! Clap! Clap!
Good show, Demi.
.
Brachiator
@Elie:
I think you have absolutely nailed Palin’s current track. She has obviously done well enough to satisfy the citizens of Alaska, and her beliefs aside, no one can point to major policy gaffes that she has made there. It was probably her competence in a low-challenge environment that led McCain to incorrectly think that she was ready for the big leagues.
But for some reason, supposedly intelligent neo-cons won’t let it go. Bill Kristol seems to believe that he can play Karl Rove to Palin’s incarnation as a feminized Dubya with strong appeal as the GOP standard bearer.
But as you so astutely note, her enemies seem to understand her — and her limitations — far better than do her supposed friends.
Here, I think you underestimate Palin. Alaska doesn’t strike me as being thick with bible thumpers. Parts of it may be conservative, but I get the impression that Alaskans also have a wild and also a pragmatic streak, as you have to possess in order to survive in an often harsh landscape.
When Palin came to Southern California, a lot of people, especially women came out to see her. And the rally wasn’t held in Orange County, where presumably her appeal to conservative women would be strong, but in Central Los Angeles. And while Hillary Clinton can be seen as a feminist trailblazer, a part of the history of the women’s movement, Palin has a real appeal to younger, contemporary women.
And those who think that Palin’s stance on abortion and other issues don’t make her an authentic voice for women should keep in mind Hillary Clinton’s attempt to re-invent herself as a hard-drinking Annie Oakley type in order to appeal to blue collar voters in Pennsylvania and Ohio. Palin effortlessly has this stuff covered.
I agree with you about Palin’s limitations and she doesn’t appear to want to do the hard work to really become a national figure. However, it took a tremendous amount of drive and ambition to rise from a small city mayor to governor of the state, a feat that she largely achieved by letting people take her for granted and then springing on them with an unexpected understanding of state issues.
I don’t think that the Democrats need to stay awake at night worrying about her, but I don’t think that she can be completely dismissed.
Maus
Lolllll for all the rightist hatred of affirmative action, her accomplishments were few, and her abilities small. She was thrown into prominence because of her looks, and to a lesser extent, her charisma. She has cunning, but not much in the way of smarts. See, how she’s managed her campaign for examples of both.
amk
@demimondian:
world famous “word” leader ??? Yeah, you’re right about that. That woman owns the world of word cloud. Also.
JGabriel
Brachiator:
I don’t know that I’d go that far, best wait to see if she gets re-elected. Last I checked, Palin’s favorables were down to 55%, and that was a month or two ago. I wouldn’t be at all surprised if she was under 50% soon.
.
JK
@Maus:
I wish Palin supporters could own up to this fact and stop trying to wish it away.
demimondian
@JK: Again, that’s a terrible misjudgement. No, Sarah Palin is not Blanche Lincoln, not Olympia Snowe, and not Hillary Rodham Clinton. She is, however, adept at getting people to underestimate her.
It’s certainly true that her starburst-inducing figure is a big part of her appeal, but it is not all there is. Always keep that in mind.
JK
Thank you very much for conceding this point. I appreciate it.
I wouldn’t go as far as to suggest that Palin is the least intelligent politician currently holding office in the United States. She did strike me as someone who was remarkably unprepared for the 2008 campaign in terms of mastery of issues. She left a lasting impression with me of someone who has no desire whatsoever to put her nose to the grindstone to learn the issues. She seems to me to be someone who thinks she can win the presidency by sheer force of personality alone.
Comrade Stuck
She reminds me of a female version of the George C Scott character Mordecai Jones in The Flim Flam Man
demimondian
@Comrade Stuck: She reminds me of every two-penny grifter I’ve ever read about. I look at Sarah Palin, and the hair stands up on the back of my neck. She is, as far as I can tell, amoral and completely exploitative; she has no interest in the truth, except as something which she can slice and dice to demagogue some point, and she is completely vain and untrustworthy.
I never *trusted* Bill Clinton — and I voted for him twice for governor and twice for President — but even he didn’t set off my stay-away-from-this-person sense as much as Sarah Palin does.
JK
@Comrade Stuck:
That sounds like a movie worth checking out.
JK
Thankfully, Alaska is a very long distance away from states like Iowa and New Hampshire. If Palin seeks and wins re-election for governor, the logistics for running for president will be difficult given the long hours required to fly back and forth to the lower 48.
Comrade Stuck
@demimondian:
To me, what makes her dangerous is the possibility that she might hook up with someone she trusts enough to listen to, and smart enough politically to become something like a Bush/Rove part deux. She has the gift of bullshit better than Bush imo, but is about as raw and undisciplined as is possible right now, and the compulsive lying doesn’t help. And she may have already left such a lasting impression of amateurishness that can’t be overcome. But it would be a mistake to write her off completely, I think.
And Jk. I liked the movie when it came out, but I was 14 at the time. It is whimsical and campy, but Scott is a better comic actor than people give him credit for. IE General Turgidson in Dr. Strangelove.
JK
@Comrade Stuck:
A truly classic performance.
@demimondian: @Comrade Stuck:
As someone who finds Palin extremely repulsive on many levels, I try to find comfort by recalling the expression “You never get a second chance to make a good first expression.” I’m hoping that Palin made a sufficiently disastrous impression among enough people that no amount of extreme makeover advice from Karl Rove, Bill Kristol, or Mark McKinnon will be enough to win her the presidency.
TenguPhule
“One of these words does not belong. One of these words is not like the others…”
Phoebe
I think Sarah Palin is going to hear from God that she shouldn’t run for preznit, and I really don’t know if that makes me happy or sad. I’m going to go with happy, because I cannot stand her voice. That is just pain.
I do not believe she would get the nomination, so it wouldn’t last forever, but last September and October were already too much. I had my finger on the mute button every time I watched the tee vee. It’s easy to forget this sometimes.
asiangrrlMN
@demimondian: Good god. Don’t do that to me. By the end, I was convinced that someone had taken your name. You know why? Because the people who believe in Palin have said the exact same thing you just did (I read the Mudflats). In other word, you were causing me flashbacks to the election and all their screaming of sexism.
I need to catch my breath.
Elie
Brachiator:
Her weakness is that underneath the electricity and raw charisma is self doubt. She is being dared to go to the next level – to raise her game. Its not a matter of underestimating her — If she took the challenge she would be a force to be reckoned with. My take however so far, is that she either doesn’t read the opportunity correctly or is unable to rise to it. If that changes, we had better watch out.
I guess I think of the match race between Seabiscuit and War Admiral — the beautiful, perfect race horse. He gave Seabiscuit a hard first part of the race, and remember he was undefeated – but when Seabiscuit pulled up to him and looked him in the eye — War Admiral couldnt bring it. Obama did that to McCain. Can Palin do that? Not down deep in the way she needs to in my opinion. She will always be a fighter, and will always have the resentment that is so attractive to certain folks…
I don’t believe that is enough…
JGabriel
JK:
Not so much. The AK lege only meets for 90 days/year. The entire population numbers about 690,000.
It’s not a really demanding job.
.
jcricket
Especially considering it’s a socialist state whose residents get big kickbacks b/c they live on top of oil. So when oil prices go up, the residents go “whee! free money!”
That Sarah Palin thinks this is somehow a result of her governance (or that any Alaskans think it’s a result of their own hard work or independence or what-not) is fucking mind-boggling.
Brachiator
@Elie:
Yep, I suspect that you are right here. While other Republicans at least make a half-hearted attempt to take on Obama’s policies, Palin’s running magazine appearance and her challenge to out-jog Obama is absurdly comical, and only reinforces the image that people have of her as not ready for primetime.
But this kind of thing makes it harder to understand why GOP strategists continue to support her.
Zuzu's Petals
@demimondian:
You turkey! You had us all in a tither!
Wile E. Quixote
Hey, is she winking at me, or giving me the evil eye?
Johnny Pez
The thing is, demi, when you do a wingnut spoof you’re supposed to come up with a wingnutty name like “The Wrath of Lubbock” or “Sven Nukeson” or “Tank McBlast”. Spoofing under your usual handle just leads to confusion.
Calouste
@JGabriel:
It’s the first 90 days of the year though, peak primary season. And Palin has made enough enemies in the lege that there will be a very audible noise when she doesn’t show up for work.
Darcy
@demimondian:
Well, I feel sheepish (baaaaaa).
Sorry about forgetting the rules, I did know them once. I’m not taking back lying hack pervert, cause it was fun to type (true too!). And I mean it in the best possible sense.
Blue Neponset
@Dr. Rockso:
It is a mistake to underestimate Sarah Palin. She is just as smart as Dubya. All she needs is a good handler and she could be very dangerous.
Also, remember this….Palin’s husband belonged to a political party that wants to suceed from the Union. The press thought that “Obama ordered Orange Juice” was a more important story.
We should all be loosing sleep about Sarah Palin. She could be the 2012 Republican nominee for Prez and if the stars align properly she can beat Obama. That scares the shit out of me.
kay
@Blue Neponset:
I think the comparison to former President Bush is wrong-headed. President Bush pretended to be a come-from-nothing governor, but he wasn’t.
He’s a third generation politician. His father was President, for God’s sake. The Bush family have been palling around with the powerful for 100 years. They are as politically connected as it’s possible to be in this country.
Bush had a lot of help, and he was and is a professional politician. Three generations.
The thing that stuck out to me about Palin’s rise in the VF article is how she dumped each and every person who promoted her, the minute they were no longer of use. That’s just stupid, and it’s a mistake Bush (or the Clintons) would never, ever make.
Blue Neponset
That wasn’t the point I was trying to make. My point was Bush & Palin are both very poor politicians who, despite their huge flaws, have succeeded. If Palin gets a half way decent adviser and she starts listening to this person she will go very far. That is scary. If you haven’t seen Bush’s Brain you probably shouldn’t until after 2012. Palin is a Karl Rove away from the Presidency. We all need to remember this and tremble.
Bulworth
And John McCain pretty much “held his own” with Obama in the election results. Except for, you know, the actual election results.
Bulworth
@Adolphus:
Yeah, I can’t believe this is the same guy I enjoyed reading in the late ’80’s.
kay
@Blue Neponset:
I don’t think Bush would have succeeded to the extent he did without his vast and extensive familial political connections.
You have to have something to make up for the lack of…talent, and competence, and brains. That’s what he had, and it’s huge.
She’s missing that. She hasn’t even been able to maintain the network she once had. She screws her political patrons over, and they all end up hating and resenting her.
We probably just disagree on a more basic point because I never bought the Karl Rove-is-a-genuis “truth”.
I think President Bush probably succeeded the old-fashioned way: he inherited a vast political network from his family. Rove rode on Bush, in my opinion, not the other way around.
I know I’m supposed to think Rove’s a brilliant magician. I just don’t. I don’t think anything that happened post-election points to that conclusion.
Surreal American
Actually Palin won the debate against Biden using the old metric of “can I grab more attention, say more one-liners, and be more memorable than my opponent”
However she and other Republicans did not discover until it was too late that the debate rules were different in 2008. The looming economic meltdown required more substantive answers from the candidates in general and Palin simply could not deliver the goods.
I don’t hold it against Roger Simon if he didn’t have a copy of the new playbook at the time. Lots of talking heads were blindsided by the debate results. That said, Simon’s failure to reassess his initial verdict is a mixture of stubborness and the usual punditiocy prevalent in this age.
Surreal American
Of course the debate rules could revert back to 2004. Meaning that the majority of American men could vote for Palin because she’s the candidate they would most like to buy a drink for “to have a beer with.”
Surreal American
Reposted with strike outs:
Of course the debate rules could revert back to 2004. Meaning that the majority of American men could vote for Palin because she’s the candidate they would most like
to buy a drink for“to have a beer with.”Bony Baloney
I’m too geeky for my hat, but… a certain contrarian (who thinks chicks wearing uncomfortable but comely gear amounts to a war crime) is a dead ringer for a Usenet troll from the Roaring Nineties. I think she’s a tribute troll. The real deal was human, and her heart would have blown up like a grapefruit by now.
You’ve seen Big Love? The female polygamist brides show way too much skin, and wear disgustingly femme clothing in any case, not to mention the multiple coats of makeup. That’s the kind of perspective you guys are fencing with.