My sister has a dog that she got off the streets of Pittsburgh and needs to find a home for because her current dog is pouting and upset. Here is the background:
She is really sweet and loving. She curls up in a tiny ball in bed and will wake up in the middle of the night look at you, wag her tail and give you a kiss before she falls back to sleep.
Basically she was a stray in a bad section of Pittsburgh and this rescue was trying to catch her. They asked the police for help and they told them that if they caught her they were going to euthanize her. A feral cat rescue finally caught her. She is about 5 months old. She barks at men when she first meets them, but will warm up very quickly and be kissing you in no time. She loves women. Is affectionate, but can hold her own with other dogs. She is about 18-20 lbs, is teeny, with a thick head, but a sweet little baby seal expression. I am already getting really attached to her.
Here is a pic:
If you are interested, shoot me an email. The dog is a pit bull, and I was informed I am a “dog racist” for voicing concerns. I’ll try to get some better pictures.
jeffreyw
Here are a couple more that would just love to be your good dog.
jeffreyw
These guys are busy, but can be right with you very soon.
Kanamit
Pitbulls are the sweetest dogs.
wenchacha
Is that a heart on the side of the doggie? People love that sort of thing!
Cuddly is always good, too.
asiangrrlMN
Cole, that dog looks so sweet. I hope you can find a good home for him. The sweetest dog I ever met was a pitbull.
@jeffreyw: All those little guys are cute, but the one standing in the pee really tugs at my heart.
Delia
I suppose you’ve got to be careful who you give pitbulls to. A male in my neighborhood who belongs to a pretty badly behaved guy got loose last summer and killed a cat. OTOH, I had my 10 1/2 year old mutt at the dog park last fall and he was doing his usual thing of trying to mount any dog who came by in order to get them to play with him. Most get annoyed and nip at him. A female pit came by and some women told me I’d better be careful cuz pits are so aggressive. She was the most passive dog I’ve ever seen and just started following my dog around.
Just raise ’em right and treat ’em with kindness.
edit: Another thing, I read somewhere that the reason they’ll fight to the death is that they’re desperate to please their masters. Heartbreaking twisting of a dog’s natural instinct.
asiangrrlMN
@Delia: I agree with this. It’s the owners of the pits who need to be screened, not the pits themselves.
JenJen
You know, your sister’s dog will get over the pouting after awhile longer. Most dogs do. Best thing she can do is start walking them together, every day. Make them feel like a pack, like a team. It’s worked for me every single time I’ve introduced a new dog to the house, and I’ve always been a two-dog gal, myself.
John S.
Some of the sweetest dogs I have ever known were either Rotties or Pit Bulls. It’s a damn shame what people do to them for the sake of having an “attack” dog.
Now you want to talk about mean, try the Bouvier. I have known several, and each one was more miserable than the last — especially the last one I knew, which tore my arm open and left me with a 3 inch scar for the rest of my life.
Violet
@JenJen:
Was thinking the same thing. How long has she had this dog? If it’s only been a few days or a week, that’s not enough time. Of course Dog Number One is going to pout. Just like the older kid when the new baby comes home from the hospital. If she is really falling in love with the dog, she can work on them being a team/pack and it should all work out.
Jules
Since Pit Bulls are hard to place and you need to be careful who you adopt them to, she might want to get in contact with one of the Pit Bull rescue organizations.
General Winfield Stuck
@Kanamit:
yes, they get a bad rap. sweet doggies if treated that way. Hope she finds a good home.
And Here be Charles, the Perfessor Pooch
#1
#2
geg6
Damn. Adorable thing, huh? Wish I could do it, especially since I’m so close by. I could have my John talk to the people who took in his daughter’s dog Cane. They have a farm, two little boys, and 3 dogs. They might want another. If you don’t get any other offers, John, let me know and I’ll get John to look into it.
Fleem
Awwwww. Want.
We got a pit/??ridgeback??? mix at 5 months old last May. He is, of course, the best doggie ever. He’d love a friend, but I suspect Mr. Fleem and the two geriatric pusses would object.
Neutron Flux
A couple of years ago someone dropped a Pit Bull at our place. I agree with the other commenters about the breed. They totally reflect the enviornment they live in. Mine is a sweet, sweet boy.
Nicole
Pitties are not beginner dogs, as they need consistency, but they are really amazingly funny, sweet, smart animals. I would adopt one in a heartbeat if our apartment building allowed pets.
robertdsc
LOL at “dog racist”.
Best of luck in getting that dog placed into a good home.
Litlebritdifrnt
Is she pure Pitbull or a mix? I am only asking cause she looks like she might have some boxer in her. Also, Pitbulls are actually banned in some places (thanks to the actions of some really, really despicable human beings), so that could be a problem. If you could pass her off as a mix it might help in the places where pitbulls are banned. Just sayin. BTW ditto on the Pitbull rescue places, they are absolutely dedicated in finding homes for them and are very strict when it comes to potential adoptive parents. I am guessing that top dog will come round any day soon and sis will end up keeping her. But that is just me.
asiangrrlMN
@General Winfield Stuck: Aw, there’s the sweetie Charlie.
And, Cole, good luck in finding HER a good home (sorry for the gender confusion), though it sounds as if she already has one.
Ben
Some of you people are idiots. Statistics are pretty clear in that Pits cause the most deaths. The primary issue I have with them is that if my Basset Hounds nipped at someone, a thump on the nose would send them running and pouting (hell, a dirty look or load voice would as well). A pit would bite and never let go… do you people think they fight them because they are “sweet”? Owners are part of the issue, but pits were bred to fight and kill other dogs and frequently attack children. Insane. Go get a nice dog. Don’t understand how any rational person (especially with children) could own one… also, good luck getting any kind of homeowners or renters insurance.
Thad
I will just reiterate what others have said. Pit bulls are the most gentle, loyal, lovable dogs. They are used for dog fighting partly because of that extreme loyalty to people, but also for various physical attributes (short hair, compact frame) that have nothing to do with their demeanor.
Our pit bull Abbey is the sweetest thing. She snuggles with and grooms our cat. She is gentle with other animals and with children. She absolutely loves every person she meets. It breaks my heart when someone reacts to her with fear, just because of her breed.
Yeah, ‘racism’ is a pretty good description of that sort of appearance based prejudice.
Kanamit
@Ben: You have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about.
BSR
My Pit is the sweetest girl you will ever meet. About a month ago two lap dogs tore her ear up badly at the dog park and drew a lot of blood. My pit rolled over on her belly and waited for me to rescue her. She reacted passively because I trained her to do so, she has learned that she is to never bite another dog, even if the other dog is playing rough.
It’s all up to the owner. Idiots like Ben know nothing, but think they know a lot. I don’t usually toss around remarks like idiot, but Ben does not seem to mind the word.
Litlebritdifrnt
@Ben:
I nominate this asshole as Troll of the Year, cause if you look up the stats (you know them pesky thingys) the most dangerous dog on the planet is (drum roll please) The Bassett Hound.
Piss poor attempt really, not even trying, what do we have to do to get better trolls around here?
MattR
@Ben: You seem to have some negative misconceptions of pit bulls. A properly trained pit bull is no more likely to attack another dog or child nor is it more likely to ignore their owner telling them to let go of another animal as your Bassett Hounds. The difference is that improperly trained pit bulls are much more dangerous and there a lot of people who are not interested in training them properly.
General Winfield Stuck
@Ben:
Bullshit. All dogs have the potential to be vicious if caused to be that way thru human mistreatment. Pit Bulls are just unfortunate they were born with a lot of power that unfortunately is exploited by those who promote dog fighting, or are just miserable mean sumbitches who like to abuse living things. Not the dogs fault in the least. And if given tlc will return it the same as any dog, cat, or other critters. You are the idiot.
edit – I see MattR has already covered it.
Dick
Judging from the picture and size, there is a good chance this is a Staffordshire Bull Terrier. They are often mistaken for small pit bulls, but hail from England originally where they are known as the “nanny” or “nursemaid” dog. Insofar as they are known at all, they are famous for a marvelous temperament with people and especially children.
As terriers they may have a strong prey drive toward other species. However, they can get along with other family pets such as cats. My sister had a Stafford who on two different occasions ran up and down from the basement until she followed him down whereupon he led her to the escaped pet hamster without harming it. However, nonfamily pets are a different matter – my sister’s dog nearly destroyed the family room in pursuit of an alien mouse.
Now primarily family pets, Staffords are also active in the show ring, obedience trials, doggy athletice events, and as therapy dogs. Like the pit bull, they were originally bred for dog fighting and can be, but are not automatically, combative with other dogs. When there is a problem, it is frequently due to the other dog starting something that he can’t finish; and the Stafford gets blamed. That requires a responsible owner, but there is no better family dog for anyone who understands the difference between that attitude and their absolute affection for people. In 30 years, I haven’t met one yet I wouldn’t leave my kids with.
Thad
Ben,
You are absolutely wrong. By nature pit bulls are gentle and loyal to people. Yes, physically, they can do more damage than a small dog, but the same is true of any larger breed dog like a german shepherd. It is all about environment and training. ANY dog can be made dangerous through abuse. Pit bulls are chosen for dog fighting only because of physical attributes like short hair, small ears, compact frame, etc.
It is only in the US and a few other countries that pit bulls are seen as a threat. Many other countries view them as the best dog for families and children. It used to also be that way in the US actually (the Little Rascals dog was a pit). This is a cultural perception that has nothing to do with the realities of the breed.
You attitude toward pits is no different than a person who assumes all people of a particle race are more prone to crime or violence.
asiangrrlMN
Ditto the rest of what the others have said to Ben. Agreed that pits can be more lethal, but that is only because they are more powerful. Unfortunately, the asshats of the world who have small pricks (and yes, most of them are male, another made-up stat of mine) choose pits and Rotties and train them to fight because it makes them (the owners) feel more manly to have such a fierce dog. So, yeah, the owners are at fault, not the dogs.
Jess
John,
Any idea how she is with cats?
Punchy
I support ya, JC. Pitbulls off the street is like playing the maul lottery. Plus a lot of communities, and most dog parks, wont allow ’em. Because they tend to kill when/if they attack.
Jess
Ben is not entirely wrong, actually.
Punchy
Here we go again. All of you so willing to ingore the statistics just because your anecdotal story is sooooooooooo the opposite of the trend.
Pit bulls tend to kill when they attack.
Wow, facts suck.
Punchy
@Litlebritdifrnt: Do you mean those pesky things that you didn’t provide any link to?
satby
OK, I have 2 pit mixes now (out of 5 dogs) and have worked with a lot of pit rescues. They are in general sweet loving dogs. But they have to be well trained and are very powerful, and that strong prey instinct can cause trouble with other family pets like cats. There have been high-profile dog fatalities due to pits (one a woman jogger in my neighborhood in Chicago) due to fighting dogs so the breed has a bad rep; but a 12 week old lab pup also mauled a baby to death in another high profile case, so any dog has potential to be “dangerous” in the right circumstances.
If your sister can’t keep the pup, tell her to work with a pit rescue, because many dog fighters pose as adopters on places like Craigs List and the municipal pounds to find “bait dogs”. And unfortunatly, this sweet girl is prime “bait”.
Lesley
John, this heart-melting video might change your mind about pit bulls.
Pitbull Sharky with Chicks and Cat
General Winfield Stuck
@Punchy:
No Punchy, they are all anecdotal stories on both sides of the issue. The point we make is there is no inherent predilection for pit bulls to attack more than any other dog, but we concede that when they do, yes, they are more powerful and do more damage. This is true for any large and powerful dog. It is what makes them individually vicious that usually is mistreatment of some kind. And this is why each individual dog should be evaluated that way by knowing it’s history before adopting it, especially if kids are involved. It is this blanket condemnation of an entire breed that we object to, as Pit Bulls raised from pups with TLC are sweet dogs. But people always should considered the size of a dog when taking one in.
satby
@Punchy33: And Punchy, your link goes into 10 year old statistics, including a dog fatality caused by a Pomeranian. Which really only proves my point: ANY dog no matter what breed, could potentially cause a fatality if the circumstances are right.
The responsible dog owner’s job is to keep that from happening.
Lesley
Remember the days when Dobermans were reputed and reported to be the most evil dogs? I remember being terrified of Dobermans because the press was filled with stories of them being vicious.
I can’t help thinking Pitbulls are getting the same rap. I know they are often exploited by drug gangs and psychos but I’ve met the most loving pitbulls so I’m not sure what to believe. Are they inherently vicious or are they bred to be this way?
Anne Laurie
LittleBrit has a good point — if ‘Sweetheart’ (work that patch!) is 20lbs at 5 months of age she can be passed off as a pitbull cross, which may help her find a good home. (Although she may just be malnourished and suddenly blossom now that she’s getting food & love.) If your sister can’t keep her, I’m sure she can find a dedicated pit-rescue group who can be trusted not to turn the poor thing over to a thug or an unprepared innocent… or automatically put her down for the crime of being the “wrong” breed.
But expressing concerns about re-homing even the most loving baby pit bull doesn’t make John a ‘dog racist’ any more than saying President Obama had to work harder than John McCain or Mitt Romney makes me a people racist. Pit bulls are powerful, intelligent dogs bred for a strong prey drive and a great tolerance for pain. I have known and adored many of them, but they are NOT a ‘beginner’s dog’ or an all-purpose companion suitable for a busy family. Choosing to live with a pit bull, even if the dog itself is a perfect saint, does restrict one’s choice of apartments, neighborhoods, even cities. (I don’t think any states have successfully banned ‘pit bulls’ yet, but there are plenty of idiots making an effort to do so.) Pit bulls need regular exercise, more than they can get from a gentle stroll around an urban block or playing by themselves in a small yard… and every time a pit-bull owner takes the dog out in public, there’s a potential risk of, shall we say, social unpleasantness, much more so than for the ‘average’ dog, because people will make assumptions, whether that means screaming & snatching their child away or trying to kidnap the dog for their own vile purposes.
And because of their strength and speed, pit bulls are not always a good choice for a multi-pet household. A teenage pit bull might not intend to hurt the cat or the small dog or the old dog in the household, but if the cat darts after a bug or the old dog and the pit bull charge after the same dropped morsel, it’s not much consolation that P.B. didn’t snap the cat’s neck or put the old guy in veterinary intensive care deliberately. Same thing goes for children, squared — even a pit bull who loves kids may not fully understand how fragile they are, and a ‘correction’ nip that would barely discourage a pit-bull puppy from chewing on big brother’s ear may send a toddler to the hospital.
It does a good breed no favors to pretend that pit bulls aren’t a special challenge that should be reserved for people who know what they’re doing and what kind of commitment they’re making.
Jess
@Lesley:
Pitbulls are no more likely to be inherently vicious than any other breed–in fact, German Shepherds and Chows are the most likely to attack–but because they are physically powerful and bred to fight and not retreat, when they (and Rotties) do attack, those attacks tend to be more relentless and damaging. This is why they’re disproportionally responsible for fatal attacks, although actually less likely to bite than many other breeds. My cat attacks me on a regular basis, but of course it’s cute (and only a little bloody) when she does it. Imagine if she were pitbull sized…
Thad
@Punchy,
You don’t understand what you are reading with those stats. There is a difference between correlation and causation.
Breeds that are more often trained for dog fighting or to be guard dogs are obviously going to generate more incidents. This says nothing about the demeanor of the breed, just its popularity with a certain sort of despicable person.
If we spent the next 20 years training german shepherds for dog fighting instead of pit bulls, those stats would show german shepherds as the ‘dangerous’ breed. It is only in countries where dog fighting is popular that we see this sort of problem.
These stats reveal a problem with how we as a society value and treat our animals, not how our animals treat us.
Ruckus
As I am looking for a rescue right now I would probably take her but I’m about 2500 miles away. west coast sf area
She sounds like the dog I am looking for except that I have been look for an adult dog, but am not fixated on the age.
My general ideal would be 30-40 lbs grown, genial, calm, good with other dogs, kids and cats.
Thad
@Lesley,
They are not inherently vicious, nor are they bred toward viciousness. If anything, their breeding is to be very loyal and gentle toward people… it is only other dogs that they were meant to fight after all. In that regard, a pit bull can be trained to be aggressive toward other dogs, but it still requires abusive training. Under normal circumstances, a pit bull will properly socialize and be friendly with other dogs.
It is all about the owners. Dogs aren’t born vicious, they are made that way through abuse.
wonkie
Pit bulls were bred to be people social.
The breed was invented in England to replace bull baiting with dog fighting. They originated as a cross between bulldogs and rat terriers. The goal of the breeders wasa strong brave dog taht could hang on in a fight–but breeders tdid not want those skills to be turned on to people! Dog fighters need to be ablr break up a dog fightr witout being bit themselves so the dogs that turned on people were culled out.
As a result pits are one of the most people social breeds and one of the most dog agressive breeds. The AKA commissions temerament testing on breeds anually and pits consistatly score the same as golden reteivers.
So are pits in the top ten list of dogs that bite?
Because a biting dog is an unsocialized unneutered dog owned by an asshole and right now pits are the dog most frequently sujected to that kind of treatment. Thirty years ago the chained up backyard dog was a rottie. Before that a Dobie. Before that a German shepard. And whatever dog is the fad dog of choice of assholes is also the dog that gets promoted through the mass media s the scarey evit threat to people.
When dog abuse is reported the victim is mostl likely a pit.
When dog neglect is reported the victim is moslty likely to be a pit.
Pits are the breed most frequently exploited by back yrad breeders.
Only one in seven hundfred pits gets adopted from a shelter.
Dog fighting is amultimillion dollar business.
And WE are afraid of THEM?
All but one of the dogs rescued from Micheal Vick’s dog fighting operation were people social from the day of rescue.
The top ten dog breeds from reported dog biting incidents are: mixed breed, pit, shar pei, Great Dane, German shepard, rotties, dobies, akitas, huskies, and chows. Most of the dogs on that list are dogs bred to guard. In fact the only bred who have an inate breed tendency toward aggrssion to people are the dogs bred to guard– and then it is a matter of individual tmeprament and training. Pits were bred to be peoiple social and not to guard.
so why are they on the list? Partly due to sheer numbers–there are about eight million pits in America. They are one of the most common breeds. And they are the breed mostly likely to be abused, neglected or undersocializied because they have the misfortune of being the fad dog of choice for macho assholes..
Think about it: eight million pits and they share a place on the top ten biter list with only 70,000 sharpeis. Chows, akitas and Great Danes aren’t all that common either. That means the proportion of shar peis that bit is higher than the porportion of pits that bite. In fact the proportion of Great Danes that bit is greater than the porportion of pits that do.
And yet there are breed bans about pits all over and no breed bans for akitas of danes or german shepards etc.
Pits are victims of human malfeance compounded by human prejudice. I give theiryt five dollars a month to Missouri Pit Bull Resuce. I hope that some of the readers here will consider making a donation to a pit bull rescue.
ANd please excuse all the typos.
Ben
Statistics bitches.
From the website : http://www.dogsbite.org/bite-statistics.htm.
Dog bite deaths and maimings U.S. and Canada (1982-2009)
By compiling U.S. and Canadian press accounts between 1982 and 2009, Merritt Clifton, editor of Animal People, determined the breeds most responsible for serious injury and death:
The combination of pit bulls, rottweilers, presa canarios, and their mixes:
* 80% of attacks that induce bodily harm
* 69% of attacks to children
* 83% of attack to adults
* 68% of attacks that result in fatalities
* 74% that result in maiming
Read study highlights »
U.S. Dog Bite Fatalities (2006-2008)
DogsBite.org, a national dog bite victims’ group, recorded 88 U.S. fatal dog attacks between January 1, 2006 and December 31, 2008. Pit bulls accounted for 59% of these deaths.
* Of the 88 fatal dog attacks recorded by DogsBite.org, pit bull type dogs were responsible for 59% (52). This is equivalent to a pit bull killing a U.S. citizen every 21 days during this 3-year period.
* The data also shows that pit bulls commit the vast majority of off-property attacks that result in death. Only 18% (16) of the attacks occurred off owner property, yet pit bulls were responsible for 81% (13).
Now,
rationalize all you want to… or quit using anecdotal information to try to make your extraordinary “claims”. The facts just don’t back it up.
I’ve met many, many sweet pits… right up to the point they get pissed and attack. Nasty situation. Choose wisely. You people are making emotional decisions (cute dog, no chance at life, etc.) but not logical ones for for a family pet.
General Winfield Stuck
So you have met Many Many sweet pits until they attacked. Who? you?. I think you are lying about that, and being emotional and broadly fearful of dogs in general, and no one has said to not choose the dog that suits your family situation, and knowing the history of specific dogs you are considering.
Ben
@General Winfield Stuck:
I believe many of you don’t understand the depth of the breeding of pits to fight (Many generations). It’s now new and the breed has been over bred to weed out the week ones the that won’t fight or can’t win. comparing them to a normal dog, like a Basset, is insane. Basset’s have been bred to smell but there isn’t a mean bone in their bodies
THis discussion is about odds… those of you with pits, particularly around kid, hope you don’t end up on the front page of CNN with a maimed child. I know I Wont.
pit/non-pit discussion is right up there with the Israeli’s/Palestinians.
Ben
@General Winfield Stuck:
My PWT sister and husband used to breed pits… I was around them all the time, they were sweet, but they have this dark side that get’s set off by other dogs, kids, people, etc. and goes off at a moments notice.
Read every report about a pit attack and the family will tell you what a wonderful, sweet dog they wrere… until they went Hannibal Lecter.
My question to people is that there are hundreds of breeds… why that one, the one with known issues?
General Winfield Stuck
@Ben:
There are a number of pit owners on this very thread who dispute what you say. I personally would not have any large dog around small children. Not just pits, but that is me.
And this stat is useless unless you know more about how the dogs were treated before they attacked. I grew up in Appalachia and pit bulls were primarily kept by mean people mistreating them to purposefully be mean dogs. Per their reps that way. And they did attack and harm people more than other dogs. And I think that is true in most of the country, more or less. I still think you are blowing smoke up our ass with the many many sweet well treated pit bulls right up till they went vicious attack dogs. You won’t convince me otherwise, I just don;t believe you.
Michelle
If no one else will take her, I will.
She’s young enough to integrate with the two dogs I have that won’t kill her and I won’t let her near that one that would.
Let me know.
I have the long weekend open.
Danceswithwords
@Jess hit the nail on the head. They’re smart, powerful dogs with strong personalities, and that often works to their disadvantage. Caution with adult rescue pits is reasonable; they are, sadly, a breed that attracts a disproportionate number of asshole owners. Pit rescues are very good at assessing these dogs’ personalities, because they won’t adopt out unsafe dogs. And it is frighteningly easy for assholes to ruin dogs, especially pit bulls, since they are so eager to please and so focused on their people.
That said, this is a ~5-month-old puppy! She’s not inherently going to be aggressive, and she’s imminently trainable. Pit bulls don’t just turn into Cujo without warning.
PhoenixRising
I used to think that discriminating among breeds of dog was a form of racism. Then I brought home a chow/Golden mix from the pound.
We kept that dog until she died of natural causes, but my guess is that many people would have had her put down, as the practical alternative to the lifestyle changes that owning a dog-aggressive, man-aggressive biter brought us.
Like a PO Box, renters’ insurance…I could go on, but to summarize: Some dogs are deliberately bred to live with human families. Some dogs just happen, as the result of slapdash human effort and laziness. Some dogs, sadly, are bred with characteristics that make them advanced-practice for human handlers, and not all humans who want those dogs are (spiritually and practically) advanced.
It’s that last category that tends to contain dangerous dogs who will ruin your whole day. That’s not racism–dogs are a human creation. We bred them from wolves. It’s our fault. But discriminating against them is a reasoned judgment, not a condemnable prejudice.
Michelle
I took in a pup who is crazy. She’s a bird dog. She wants to kill the other dogs I have. She even attacked me to get to one of them — a chow mix who didn’t want anything to to with her until I made them — my mistake.
I have learned. I keep them apart. The Chow Chow now lives with a male mini pit bull. They are wonderful together. I could take on a little pit bull girl, I think. If there are no other offers.
PeakVT
No matter what the cause, there really is something kind of sick going on with pit bulls in this country.
Shell Goddamnit
Indeed, statistics. Please don’t handwave them away. Debunk them, take them with a grain of salt, but don’t ignore them.
http://www.dogbitelaw.com/Dog%20Attacks%201982%20to%202006%20Clifton.pdf
These statistics cover 1998 to 2006. They are not 10 years old. There is indeed a single incidence of a Pom killing an infant; I do not know how that is relevant to the contrasting **104** fatalities attributed to pit bull terriers during that time period. Rotties, #2 on the list, “only” killed 58 people during that time. Highest percentage was undoubtedly the wolf hybrids, which despite their tiny numbers and fearsome reputation managed to kill 18 people.
Read the Clifton. Seriously.
“Temperament is not the issue, nor is it even relevant. What is
relevant is actuarial risk.”
General Winfield Stuck
@Shell Goddamnit:
by all means, you are correct. Here are the stats. 3.5 million pit bulls in US,
And 59 percent of these were pit bulls, over a three year period, I believe.
You can do the math for the calculated risk.
Jasper
I don’t know about pits, but I”ve been attacked by a “sweet, loving 7 year old family rottweiller who was just the most gentle thing ever around the kids and other dogs” until it decided to attack me and my dog one day.
What was frightening and unforgettable and life changing was how nonchalant the attack appeared to be for the Rottweiler. The dog ran up to us with the wife screaming for the dog to stop (the dog “belonged” to the cop husband), I picked up my old little dog, and with no warning and no growl or bark or fuss, the Rottweiler jumped up and bit my dog on the hind rear, catching my arm and HUNG ON until the owner finally arrived. At that point, she let go and it was as if nothing had happened, except she’d mauled another dog and bit a human with no more apparent emotion than if she’d fetched a tennis ball.
It’s hard to express how disturbing that part of the attack was.
Shell Goddamnit
I will add: Clifton says that of ALL the serious bites and fatalities recorded in his stats: “In more than two-thirds of the cases I have logged, the
life-threatening or fatal attack was apparently the first known dangerous
behavior by the animal in question.”
This makes actuarial risk even more important.
I like dogs; I most recently had a Rottie I loved dearly; I had a German shepherd/huskie mix that was literally my best friend as an adolescent. The Rottie threatened me the first time I met him (we got better) and the GS mix had to be put to sleep after biting a child badly in the face (we think because of brain damage from a nearly-fatal rattlesnake bite but can’t know for sure). THESE THINGS HAPPEN. Choose as well as you can taking into account your experience and circumstances, train your dog – and don’t imagine it can’t happen to you.
Mnemosyne
@Ben:
Here’s an interesting little line from that website:
You’re not quoting from an objective website that just happens to have statistics about pit bulls. You’re quoting from the website of an organization whose express purpose is to outlaw pit bulls. Do you think that maybe they have some slight bias against that type of dog since the organization was founded to try and ban them?
wonkie
Some statistics about dog bite from the Humane Society: seventy percent of thedog bite incidents are children bitten by the familydog. most of the remaining incidents are children bitten by thenieighbor’s dog when thechild goes on the neighbor’s property. Dogs biting people in thepark or out jogging get a lot of publicity but are in truth very rare incidents. Its kind of like sex abuse: most incidents happen in thehome but thestranger danger gets all the publicity.
Can’t emphasize this enough: the dog that bites is nearly always an unsocialized, neglected dog. It doesn’t matter what breed. BTW Spain outlawed pitbulls for awhile. They recinded the ban because it didn’t work , Dog bite incidents actuallywent upafter the ban, only with a different breed as the main biter. The Spanish assholes switched to woning German shep0ards when they could no longer own pits and thier shepards did thebiting.
And German shepards have a stronger bite than pits.
The TIm Channel
I have two rescued pits:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3248/3053552656_48c632fe48_b.jpg
I also have a lot of experience with other breeds over the years. Here’s my two cents worth. They are dangerous. No two ways around it. I wish it weren’t so, but facts are facts. The smaller of the two pictured was hand raised from birth. The larger is a rescue from the Katrina hurricane debacle.
They are less dangerous to people than to other pets, but they are dangerous. Not all of them are as aggressive as others, but a higher percentage than many other dogs. They are certainly more prone to fight (it’s in their nature), and when they do, it’s a hideous nightmare to behold. I wouldn’t own them with kids unless they were the only breed of dog alive, and I love dogs.
Enjoy.
Punchy
This. Too many people here wont recognize the facts, b/c their pit bull hasn’t displayed these aggressive traits. I would add…….”yet”.
Stats are stats for a reason. Nobody said every pit will attack, but aggression has been bred into their nature for a long time.
Paul in KY
You need to wait awhile before giving up on the 2 dogs. The first ‘pouting’ dog will come to an agreement with the 2nd dog. There may be growling & more pouting involved, but they’ll figure it out.
Shell Goddamnit
One of the reasons I quoted the dog attack FATALITIES was to emphasize the difference between dog bites and major dog attacks. Most dog bites are the family dog. Most of them are not life-threatening. Those that ARE, tend to be particular breeds.
Dogs of particular breeds are often bred for behavior as well as body type. When behavior & body type come together – as in pits, and also in my beloved Rotties – you have a breed MORE LIKELY to do serious damage. Most family dogs are not particularly well trained. Pit bulls are fairly often family dogs. Ergo, a large percentage of pit bulls – besides the abused & neglected – are not particularly well-trained. This is not a recipe for reducing the number of damaging or fatal dog attacks, right?
The Clifton study’s analysis concludes that breed bans are not the right approach. It doesn’t specify what approach might work – it puts the onus on the rescue & humane community to come up with that – but clearly, pretending that pit bulls are not more likely to kill or maim is not working.
Nobody (well, hardly anybody; I’m sure some wolf hybrid owners can ignore facts – clearly, simply owning such a creature is proof they can) is pretending that wolf hybrids aren’t more likely to perpetuate a fatal attack. I fail to understand why people want to pretend that pits are not what the statistics say they are – a powerful, unpredictable animal that requires careful, knowledgeable training and handling.
It’s not just you & your family you are taking risks with, remember; it’s the kids next door, the little old lady with the yappy dog down the street, etc etc. The guilt after your dog attacks unprovoked is fairly intense, let me tell you, and it doesn’t really ever go away.
Jess
There seems to be a confusion between dogs that bite and dogs that kill/cause serious damage. According to statistics, Pits don’t seem any more likely to bite than any other breed, at least not before certain asshole owners get a hold of them. But if/when they DO bite, they’re not just going to bite and let go. They attack with the intent to kill, and have the power and determination to do so. That’s what makes them so lethal when they do cross that line, and that’s why there are so many attempts to ban them. (Of course, a similar argument could be made for banning large SUVs…)
Mnemosyne
@Shell Goddamnit:
I don’t think anyone is saying that pit bulls don’t need to be trained or that they’re never dangerous. In fact, people seem to be saying that one of the big reasons they can be dangerous is poor training and/or abuse, which to me would imply that they need more and better training, not that you can just blithely bring one into your house and not worry about it.
I have to fall on the side that’s arguing that we don’t have a pit bull problem, we have an owner problem. Very, very few owners train their dogs properly, even (or especially) when it’s a small dog. The fact that the consequences of that neglect are more often fatal with a large, strong dog like a pit bull or a Rottweiler doesn’t mean there’s something inherently wrong with that breed of dog. It means that the owners are not taking responsibility for training a dog that is potentially dangerous.
Neglecting to properly train your pomeranian is less likely to be fatal than neglecting to properly train your pit bull, but it’s not any better for the dog or the people/animals it encounters. We’re better off focusing on making all dog owners more responsible than trying to ban or restrict only certain breeds.
Thad
@Punchy,
This is bullshit. Aggression is TRAINED into fighting dogs. Their breeding is mainly as a cross between bulldogs and terriers with traits from both, and if anything they have been bred to be loyal and obedient to people.
The only thing these stats are telling you is how popular a particular breed is among the criminals who abuse and fight dogs. In countries where dog fighting is not popular, pit bulls account for far fewer attacks than other dogs. In many countries, pit bulls are considered the best dog for children and is often used as a therapy dog.
In the very CDC study you cite, they explicitly state that “it does not identify specific breeds that are most likely to bite or kill”, and they recommend “generic non–breed-specific, dangerous dog laws can be enacted that place primary responsibility for a dog’s behavior on the owner, regardless of the dog’s breed. In particular, targeting chronically irresponsible dog owners may be effective.”
That is because they understand the difference between correlation and causation and realize their stats are telling them more about the pit bull owners than the dogs themselves.
It should be noted that in countries where pit bulls have been completely banned, it did not lower the number of attacks, it simply shifted them to a different breed. The way to fix the problem is to focus on the abusive OWNERS, not the dogs. Otherwise in coming years we will be talking about the problems with german shepherds or mastiffs or some other breed.
I don’t expect I’ve changed your mind… prejudice is like that. If you’ve had some bad experiences in your youth with abused dogs, I feel for you. I just hope this thread might change the minds of a few people on the fence, or at least encourage people to learn the real facts, and not just buy into the fear and hype.
Shell Goddamnit
Indeed to an extent better training of owners is going to be more effective, but the fact remains that there will be lackadaisical owners. I personally would rather not have lackadaisical owners blithely taking on pit bulls. I would not ban them, but to be honest a bit of scary demonizing isn’t exactly wrong.LetKs reduce the potential numbers, okay? And by all means put the blame for dangerous attacks where they lie – with the owners who chose to take on an aggressive breed.
Mnemosyne
@Shell Goddamnit:
Since that demonizing has led to perfectly innocent dogs with no history of bites or attacks being euthanized solely because they’re part of the “scary” breed, I’ve got to disagree with you that there’s no harm in fearmongering about a specific breed. It also lets bad owners off the hook — after all, since everyone knows that pit bulls are dangerous, it’s not their fault that their dog attacked someone because that’s just how that dog is.
We need to take all dog bites more seriously as a symptom of bad pet ownership, not just the ones by the “scary” breeds.
Shell Goddamnit
And as an aside my assumption was that breeds were stigmatized merely due to their numbers, or their status of scary dog of the week – until I saw the numbers and got more information.
Evinfuilt
@Dick:
Glad someone beat me to it. Love those breeds, great family dog and you can hype it up “who’s my lil bull terrier, you’re such a big strong dog” and then cuddle.
Now I get to say “I miss you Bentley”, he was a great dog. I miss him sitting in my lap being oh so vicious.
CounterSpin
These “statistics” being thrown around are trash. They don’t take into account training, abuse, or percentage of the dog population. The causes of 90%+ of all dog attacks are attack training, abuse, and unfixed males. Breed is just statistical noise.
Punchy
Ya think?
Jeebus, is this difficult! NOBODY is saying that pits are more likely to bite; they’re simply more likely to intend to KILL THEIR VICTIM when they do. I’ve showed you the data that supports that, you’ve shown NO data to support otherwise.
So pits are fine, as long as they never reach the attack threshold. But if/when they do, you’d better hope it isn’t against a small child, cuz it aint going to be just one bite the kid recieves.
Shell Goddamnit
The fewer pit bulls being kept as companion animals the fewer attacks by pit bulls – since those attacks are more dangerous on average than attacks by the average mass of dogs that’s a reduction in dangerous attacks. I’m sorry that blameless dogs are euthanized, but the demonization also attaches to people who choose to keep the aggressive breeds. I totally disagree that it lets people off the hook if “everyone knows how those dogs are” – yeah, everyone knows, and still you decided it was okay for you to have one. Or more, for the love of god.
Yes we need to take dog bites more seriously. It’s described as “an epidemic” and that’s not far off, and really MOST dog bites aren’t by scary breeds, because they are far outnumbered by non-scary.
But I’m gonna say it again – and I don’t think I’m speaking Chinese, though I may be wrong about that – that there’s a qualitative difference between a dog bite and a serious dog attack, and there’s a certain small number of breeds disproportionately responsible for the serious attacks and fatalities. And I don’t think it’s unreasonable for people to urge that folks NOT OWN THOSE BREEDS; and especially that they NOT KEEP THEM AS COMPANION ANIMALS.
I don’t think we should/can legislate, but GODDAMN – on a statistical level they are more dangerous than most other breeds. All these people who love on their pit bulls – I sympathize, I’ve liked a few myself, and certainly don’t think we should wrench them away and kill those dogs or anything like it, but I also don’t think it’s out of line to tell those people that they are fighting the odds, and next time they should consider maybe something else.
As long as it’s not a Scotty – now, there’s a biter breed. :D
Paul in KY
I think it’s obvious that when you get bitten by a pit bull/rottweiler (and a few other dogs), it will generally be a more serious bite than say one from a little lap dog.
We can all agree on that, right?
Shell Goddamnit
That is just bullshit itself. For 30 years or more Chows have been listed among the top biters. Are you telling me that more Chows are abused? More Chows are trained to attack? More Chows are unfixed?? That there are billions of hidden Chows in the population? What?
Of course dog bites are not the same as attacks – but my point is that breed differentiation is not bullshit. Are wolf hybrids in the same boat – only dangerous because of their circumstances? (the answer is NO, btw)
German Shepherds and their mixes outnumber pit bulls by 4-5 times – and they are often trained as attack dogs – and they are also frequently abused – and they also tend to not be fixed – and yet they are not represented in the dangerous attack column in anything like the numbers that pit bulls are.
Dogs are not people. They are NOT a blank slate. Anyone who has anything to do with dogs will tell you this.
Thad
@Punchy,
You said:
You have shown no such thing. All you’ve shown is that pit-bulls are more often selected by dog fighters and abused into being agressive. A german shepherd’s bite is as bad or worse than a pit bulls, and they can be trained into the same sustained attack habits. There is huge amounts of actual research on this if you would actually take the time research it with your personal filters turned off.
And exactly the same is true with many other large breed dogs, its just that they are not routinely selected by dog fighters and abusive creeps that want to keep them chained up as a ‘guard dog’.
I have a good friend who is a animal behavior specialist working for the Humane Society. She claims with considerable authority that pit bulls are not normally prone to more aggression or threatening behavior than any other dog of comparable size or strength. Quite the contrary, they have the loyalty and good nature quite common in the terrier and bull dog breeds from which they derive. The are only a threat when abused… something she is very familiar with as she very regularly evaluates dogs of all breeds that must be put down for being improperly socialized.
The perception of pit bulls being ‘dangerous’ is entirely a result of their popularity with abusive owners. That is all your ‘stats’ are showing. There is a huge amount of research from animal specialists as well as stats from other countries that back this up. Abused german shepherds exhibit the same dangerous behavior, right down to the same sustained attack risk. It is only because they are not as popular for dog fighting that we are not now arguing about that ‘dangerous’ german shepherd breed.
Jess
Remember that dogs are predators. They’re also pack animals, which is what makes them great companions, but they are PREDATORS, evolved to bite and kill and eat things. Even fluffy little laps dogs and Cuddles the friendly Pitbull. Pretending that they only have the one part of their nature (pack companion) and not the other is just plain silly.
Mnemosyne
@Shell Goddamnit:
In other words, it wasn’t any errors in training or treatment on the owner’s part — it was their error in owning a dangerous dog.
That’s exactly what I’m talking about. Most of the dangers of a pit bull or pit bull mix can be greatly mitigated by proper training but if you don’t even talk about owner responsibility — not their responsibility in what kind of pet they chose, but their responsibility after choosing that pet — then you’re letting the owners off the hook because you’re not pointing out that they had a responsibility to properly train and supervise that dog. You’re shrugging your shoulders and saying, “Well, you shouldn’t have gotten that kind of dog in the first place,” even though they probably would have gotten the same result from a cocker spaniel.
Mnemosyne
@Jess:
What’s interesting is that a lot of the worst dog attacks have actually been roving packs, not individual dogs jumping on someone out of the blue. If one poorly trained pit bull gets out of the yard, it’s usually not a huge deal. It’s when two or three get out together or team up with other dogs in the neighborhood that the real nasty things happen.
Again, poor supervision and training by owners leading to really, really bad results.
Thad
@Shell Goddamnit:
You said:
Yes, it is unreasonable and not at all based in the facts or science of dog breeding/behavior. Despite the disinformation thrown around here by some, the facts show that German shepherds are prone to the same attack problems when abused in the same way. It is only that they are not (because of physical attributes) as popular for dog fighting that keeps their attack numbers down. Because of their reputation, a person is more likely to buy and abuse a pit bull or rottweiler if they want to chain up a guard dog in their back yard. This is a reputation created by the dog fighting industry, but the behavior must still be created through a sustained program of isolation and abuse.
Whether you believe it or not, you are adding to the unfounded fear and hype that is leading to the slaughter of innocent animals. I’ve seen it happen first hand… a paranoid neighbor who sees a dog with a wagging tail and even doing an obvious submissive ‘play bow’ while barking. He calls the police and has the dog taken away and put down even though it had never even left its own fenced yard! This was the friendliest dog you would ever meet, raised as pup by some friends of mine. The entire family was devastated when their family member was wrenched away and murdered for the crime of essentially shouting “hey, come play with me”.
This is the hysteria that you are feeding, the pain you are causing, all while essentially ignoring the actual root of vicious dog attacks: abusive owners. Your thinking actually makes the problem worse, by providing people with a false sense of security that if they just get rid of the ‘bad’ breeds the problem of abused dogs will go away.
Its not much different from the fallacy of racial profiling at airports. By focusing mostly on people with Muslim sounding names or obvious Arab attire, you take resources away from the sort of systemic fixes that are really needed. Furthermore, you actually create a new weakness, as now terrorists can put effort into matching a ‘counter-profile’ that is least likely to be screened.
That is what is happening here. By assuming trained behavior is somehow endemic to the breed, we are taking our focus away from the systemic abuse and owner responsibility that is at the heart of the problem.
There is a reason many here are comparing your attitude to racism. I could use all sorts of ‘stats’ to make some very racist arguments… using the consequences of generations of systemic racism as a way to justify racist stereotypes and attitudes. That is essentially what you are doing when you look at the consequences of system abuse by the dog fighting industry and then use it draw conclusions about a breed. You are turning cause and effect on their head, with horrible consequences for innocent animals.
Shell Goddamnit
Mnem – It may be a different error. Still an error. Compounded, to the sensible, by the lack of appropriate training & care.
This is a three-legged stool. I don’t think we can ignore training etc – it can mitigate the risk, certainly. But THE RISK IS STILL GREATER WITH A TRAINED PIT THAN A TRAINED AVERAGE-OTHER-BREED. If/when the training breaks down – and on occasion it does, no one will ever tell you that anything in this life is certain, and dogs are not even in the top 10 of certainties – you still have a greater chance of a dangerous attack.
And you have not shown that the numbers should not be taken at face value. You are making assumptions. I used to make the same assumptions, you know. But facts are stupid things etc etc.
The point is not that pit bulls necessarily display more aggressive behavior all the time, or at all. But they do perpetuate dangerous attacks more often. The reasons for that have not yet been determined with any certainty. We are working with numbers here, not guesses & rationalizations.
I would like pointers to this research please. There is a huge amount of pure-dee noise out there and I don’t really want to wade through acres of sentimental apologetics to find said research if you have it to hand. I think I already have the indictment part covered though, thanks.
Mnemosyne
@Shell Goddamnit:
A greater chance, yes. You also have a greater chance of having a fatal accident if you hit a smaller car with your SUV. Should we outlaw SUVs and insist that everyone drive the same size car to mitigate that risk? Or should we recognize that driving large SUVs makes you dangerous to other people and hold you responsible when you injure or kill someone?
If pit bulls were not the dog of choice for dog fighters, drug dealers and various other abusive assholes, I absolutely guarantee you that the number of attacks would plummet. Would they be zero? No, no more than you can guarantee a Pomeranian would never attack and kill a baby. But they would go way down, because you would no longer have that large pool of abused and neglected animals that lash out. As other people have said, when one “dangerous” dog declines in popularity, another one immediately takes its place and is demonized in exactly the same way.
I remember when doberman pinschers were the dangerous dog of the week that we all had to be wary of and for the exact same reason — because they tended to be owned by abusive assholes who trained them poorly, if at all, and they were large, strong dogs that could do a lot of damage. Then it was rottweilers, then German Shepherds, and now pit bulls.
We don’t have a pit bull problem. We have an owner problem. You’re proposing that we fix the owner problem by not letting people own potentially dangerous dogs, which is a really dumb way to go about it.
Punchy
I await a link to your data that shows that german shepards are as likely to kill (or attempt to, resulting in a serious injury) the victim of their attack as a pit bull is, exactly what I’ve been arguing for days now.
Please show me that data.
Mnemosyne
@Shell Goddamnit:
Also, Shell, I think you’re vastly underestimating how much dog fighting is going on out there and how many pit bulls end up entangled in it. The ASPCA has some good information about it.
Jess
ONCE AGAIN, the issue is NOT that pit bulls attack more frequently than other breeds (German Shepherds are more likely to attack), but that when they attack, they are more likely to kill or seriously injure their victim, not just bite and let go. That is what they are bred to do, and in a fight/attack situation, their breeding takes over. Just like a retriever’s breeding takes over when you throw a ball, or a sheep dog’s breeding takes over when they have critters to herd. It doesn’t mean that pit bulls are naturally vicious, just that they are bred to be exceptionally ferocious when they go into predator mode. And any dog will go into predator mode when the situation calls for it–they are, after all, PREDATORS. Why is this so hard to accept? I guess we want our dogs to be people, not dogs…
Mnemosyne
@Mnemosyne:
Also from the ASPCA, here’s why the CDC doesn’t support breed-specific bans:
Mnemosyne
@Jess:
You’re leaving out a big chunk of their breeding though: they’re bred to be animal-aggressive, not human-aggressive. A cat or smaller dog is in much more danger from a pit bull than a human is because the dogs have been bred (and often trained) to fight other dogs but not turn on their handlers. A dog that’s been bred as a watchdog, like a German Shepherd, is more likely to be human-aggressive.
You may not be able to tell the difference between a dog and a human, but most dogs can. Yes, a random roving pit bull — especially one that has formed a pack with other roving dogs — can be very dangerous to humans as well as other animals. I think we can both agree, though, that roving dogs are dangerous to humans, period, whether it’s a pit bull or another breed. Which, again, is why I keep emphasizing that the onus is on the owners to properly train and handle their dog and minimize the chance that their dog will harm other people or animals.
Anne Laurie
@Mnemosyne:
True, that. Of course, the same parameters hold for teenage boys…
Shell Goddamnit
Where did this come from?? You are addressing me, but you are addressing things I have not said and in fact that I have EXPLICITLY REPUDIATED.
Let me make it more clear: I do not support, recommend, pine for, etc., any breed-specific ban. I do not want to take people’s doggies away from them.
I do want to let people know that their SUV might decide to run over someone they love one day out of the blue, if they don’t treat it with care, so that they know they need to either treat it with care or get a damned Honda Accord.
Oh um, I mean… well sheeit.
Shell Goddamnit
I don’t get it. We’re talking about pit bulls’ aggression toward humans – i.e., severely damaging or killing them. Even if we’re just talking bites, not severe attacks or deaths, pit bulls bite waaaaaay more often. I’m willing to attribute a lot of those to those dogs’ circumstances, but they are still displaying human-aggressive behavior.
They may be bred for dog-aggression, but you know, breeding is not fine-tunable. You breed a dog for hard-wired explosive aggression, and it works on other dogs, and also on anything else that it decides needs an aggressive response. That’s generally not its owner, but it certainly can be other humans. Even human-directed evolution has to work with the material it is given, and the results are reasonably unpredictable. Those Bernese Mountain Dogs – fine fine dogs. They have a lifespan of about 7 years. That’s a side-effect of their breeding, but it’s not easy to breed out, because by the time you find out your dog dies early, it’s already got three generations of puppies carrying those die-early genes.
So, you know, it’s really hard to breed your dog for explosive dog-aggression only with no residuals, and backyard breeders – which is where probably a majority of pits have been bred, for quite a long time – are pretty hit-and-miss in the skills dept.
Thad
@Punchy:
You said:
OK, here is some information directly from the Amercian Humane Society:
http://www.americanhumane.org/assets/docs/protecting-animals/PA-resources-pit-bull-myths.pdf
The quote that jumped out at me was this:
In short despite the tens of millions of dogs (millions of them pit bulls) in this country, we have very, very few fatal dog attacks in this country (on the order of dozens) in any given year. The number is so small that scientists essentially say you can draw no conclusion on breed specific animal behavior from the numbers.
This point was made in the very study YOU used as evidence. Let me again share some quotes from that document. They declare specifically of their study:
Yet you decide to draw the very conclusion that they say it does not support. You are misreading the study and confusing correlation for causation (i.e. confusing the symptom of abuse as a trait of the breed). They also go on to say:
Why not believe the report that you claim to be using as evidence?
For another perspective, including data from other studies over the years, here is one article that brings together research from a variety of sources:
http://www.thedogpress.com/Columns/Jade/07_Dog.Bite.Stats_09.htm
Even better, I recommend you pick up breed specific literature from the American Dog Breeders Association or The American Kennel Club Breeders, or consult directly with an animal behavior expert (your local Humane Society can probably provide a referral).
Mnemosyne
@Shell Goddamnit:
Actually, they’re not more likely to bite than other dogs. They’re more like #5 or #6 on the list, if that. What they are is more likely to deliver a serious bite. You can get a whole lot of information from the CDC about this. Over 4 million people are bitten by a dog every year, but only 800,000 of them seek medical treatment for it. So, really, you’re looking at less than one-quarter of the people who are bitten by a dog in the first place, and even then pit bulls aren’t the most likely to bite.
Yes, there’s a qualitative difference between being bitten by a cocker spaniel and a pit bull since the pit bull is more likely to inflict serious damage, but the fact remains that you’re more likely to be bitten by the cocker spaniel. It’s yet another example of humans being very bad at judging risk.
Thad
@Shell Goddamnit:
You wrote:
The facts don’t back that up. Other dogs (especially smaller breeds) have a much larger history of biting. Heck, even many of the pit bull haters agree that small dogs bite more. Their counter argument is usually to claim that when pit bulls do attack they are more likely to kill. The problem with that argument is that the number of dog attack fatalities in this country is so vanishingly small compared to the dog population that you can make no statistically valid conclusion about breed specific behavior based on the data.
Let me state this loud and clear.
There is no scientifically valid data to suggest that pit bulls are inherently more dangerous than any other large dog breed. That is not just me saying that, the CDC, ADBA, AKC, veterinarians, and animal behavior specialists all say the same. This ‘dangerous pit bull’ hysteria is just another one of these myths manufactured by a media industry that loves to jump on and amplify horrific but rare occurences in our society. You are at more risk from SUVs and your own tap water than rogue pit bulls.
I’m not joking. Look up the statistics those.