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You are here: Home / Open Threads / Open Thread: How the Classy Folks Do It

Open Thread: How the Classy Folks Do It

by Anne Laurie|  November 17, 20137:17 pm| 141 Comments

This post is in: Open Threads, #notintendedtobeafactualstatement

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spite house riverton utah

Via a comment link in a Slate-linked article, a… reply?… to Cole’s post. When you’re in Mormon Nice territory:

RIVERTON – Maybe it’s a hand flipping the bird – or it could be a cactus.

For three families, it’s just another dispute in a yearlong battle over a house being built along Reeves Lane in this southwest Salt Lake Valley community.

Owner Darren Wood described the vent covering placed Monday as decorative “abstract art” and a “cactus.” But his neighbors uphill say it’s a hand flipping them off.

“This kind of shows the attitude that we’ve been dealing with all along,” said Stan Torgersen, who added that the gesture is visible from every window on the back of his house….

Haven’t been able to find an update on the 2006 Salt Lake Tribune article, so I can’t tell you if the Torgersens ever settled their beef with Mr. Wood.

What’s on the agenda as we wind down on the weekend?

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Reader Interactions

141Comments

  1. 1.

    Culture of Truth

    November 17, 2013 at 7:22 pm

    What’s on the agenda?

    Republicans went on the Sunday political chat shows to say Obamacare proves Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid are part of an experiment to test a liberal “theory” which has failed, and it’s time to give up on “this basic idea that liberals and progressives have pushed for the last 80 years.”

    Wingnuts — they really know how to hold a grudge.

  2. 2.

    srv

    November 17, 2013 at 7:26 pm

    Food. Then window treatments.

  3. 3.

    Keith P.

    November 17, 2013 at 7:28 pm

    No thumb, no hand

  4. 4.

    Culture of Truth

    November 17, 2013 at 7:29 pm

    @efgoldman: Well, that’s a good point, but they’re sending surrogates out (writers for the Wall Street Journal) in an effort to work the ref.

  5. 5.

    Xantar

    November 17, 2013 at 7:32 pm

    Quantum computing is making progress.

  6. 6.

    raven

    November 17, 2013 at 7:33 pm

    The bride got back from a funeral in Virginia and just told me she had a bloody bowel movement. She can’t catch a break.

  7. 7.

    shelly

    November 17, 2013 at 7:37 pm

    and just told me she had a bloody b

    That could be for any number of reasons, not all dire.

  8. 8.

    raven

    November 17, 2013 at 7:40 pm

    @shelly: Yea, she’s on an anti-inflam for her awful back problems so maybe that’s it. We’ll get it checked out most rickey-tic.

  9. 9.

    max

    November 17, 2013 at 7:44 pm

    @Culture of Truth: test a liberal “theory” which has failed, and it’s time to give up on “this basic idea that liberals and progressives have pushed for the last 80 years.”

    “….SUCKERS”

    Well, that’s a good point, but they’re sending surrogates out (writers for the Wall Street Journal) in an effort to work the ref.

    “Bush? There was someone named Bush? When did that happe…. OH, you mean that LIBERAL!”

    Meantime, heeee’sssss baaaaaacccccccccccckkkkkkkk:

    Rick Perry is in transition again, wearing glasses, playing the elder and running just a tiny bit to the left of Ted Cruz and a notch or two to the right of Gov. Chris Christie of New Jersey.

    In a surprising twist, he looks like a conservative establishment candidate as the jockeying begins for the 2016 presidential race. He is still anti-Washington, still steeped in states’ rights and Tea Party rhetoric, still quite conservative, but not quite so eager to burn down the castle. He is turning into Mr. Cruz’s big brother: It’s the same family, but Mr. Perry wants to be the one you trust with the car keys.

    Joke all you want, but watch: The governor is pretty good at this sort of maneuver.

    He was a Democrat who loaned his time to Al Gore’s 1988 presidential campaign, when the Republican nominee was a Texan named George H.W. Bush. Two years later, as a Republican, Mr. Perry ambushed the state’s popular agriculture commissioner, Jim Hightower, a Democrat, in a statewide race that set the governor on his current political trajectory. […]

    Mr. Perry doesn’t appear to like President Obama’s health care law any more than Mr. Cruz does, but would have chosen other tactics. “Everybody gets to go out and do their thing,” Mr. Perry told The Dallas Morning News when asked about Mr. Cruz. “That’s his thing. My thing is governing.”

    Lest you think he has become a rogue liberal, he told ABC News on a recent trip to Iowa that Mr. Christie, who has a hot hand in politics after his recent re-election, might be no more than a local taste: “Is a conservative in New Jersey a conservative in the rest of the country?”

    And do not ignore the cosmetic change. The Texas governor put those glasses on to add a little gravitas to the cocky demeanor that was punctuated with that famous “oops” two years ago.

    “PERRY IN GLASSES 2016! The *sensible* alternative to that commiesymp Christie and that psycho Cruz!”

    max
    [‘SUNDAY! Sunday! sunday! CLOWNSHOW 2016 COMES TO A NEWSPAPER NEAR YOU! FEATURING HUNDREDS OF NITRO-BURNIN’ FUNNY CAR CONSERVATIVES IN AN ALL OUT RACIN’ ACTION….’]

  10. 10.

    shelly

    November 17, 2013 at 7:45 pm

    @raven:
    That’s too bad. Didn’t you mention that she had back surgery? Did that help at all?

  11. 11.

    MikeJ

    November 17, 2013 at 7:47 pm

    @max:

    “PERRY IN GLASSES 2016!

    Who will be the first to use Google glass as a TelePrompTer?

  12. 12.

    jeffreyw

    November 17, 2013 at 7:50 pm

    @MikeJ: …and who will be the first to have them hacked during an important speech?

  13. 13.

    WereBear

    November 17, 2013 at 7:54 pm

    @max: [‘SUNDAY! Sunday! sunday! CLOWNSHOW 2016 COMES TO A NEWSPAPER NEAR YOU! FEATURING HUNDREDS OF NITRO-BURNIN’ FUNNY CAR CONSERVATIVES IN AN ALL OUT RACIN’ ACTION….’]

    As always

    DOWN AND DIRTY IN THE BOG… BOG… BOG

  14. 14.

    Keith P

    November 17, 2013 at 7:56 pm

    “PERRY IN GLASSES 2016!

    Goober Glass

  15. 15.

    MikeJ

    November 17, 2013 at 7:57 pm

    @jeffreyw: That would be the bestest thing ever. Particularly if it were Perry or Palin. I think it would take them longer to realise they were off the official script.

  16. 16.

    Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN)

    November 17, 2013 at 8:00 pm

    The Streak is over. Spotting North Dakota three goals in the first period proved to be not just a bad idea but a fatal one. The Gophers controlled the second and third periods but could only get two of them back. They had about a dozen good chances to get the third one and couldn’t get it to go in.

    That was a fun 21 months.

  17. 17.

    ruemara

    November 17, 2013 at 8:02 pm

    @raven: I’m sorry. I really hope it’s anomalous and that a break can be caught.

    I finished my gofundme page. Still not sure about it, but it is a bold new step in something or another. I’ve been trying to collect all the pictures I’ve taken in my prior position of the holiday fests. I had no idea I took so many. But this one is my new fave.

  18. 18.

    handsmile

    November 17, 2013 at 8:03 pm

    Flipped bird or cactus?

    Calling all apopheniacs! Or, “Why we can ‘see’ the house that looks like Hitler”:

    http://www.theguardian.com/science/2013/nov/17/why-we-see-hitler-house

  19. 19.

    feebog

    November 17, 2013 at 8:04 pm

    Perry has already demonstrated that he is a lightweight dim witted empty suit. The wonder is that after what was arguably the worst debate performance in the history of presidential politics he thinks he has any chance whatsoever. In the 2016 Republican Presidential Clown Car, he’s the clown chasing the car.

  20. 20.

    IowaOldLady

    November 17, 2013 at 8:07 pm

    @raven: Good that she’s getting it checked out. Let’s hope it’s nothing serious.

  21. 21.

    MikeJ

    November 17, 2013 at 8:09 pm

    @efgoldman: I got to do one for a fireworks show once. You get to be all basso profundo boomy for that, even if it’s not a monster truck show. For the FX I had to use a track called “blasting in a coal mine” because real fireworks sound like crap. Much more fun than seventy jillion Applebee’s donut tracks[1] I did.

    [1] for the non radio ppl, a donut track is when the agency sends you a jingle tape with singing at the beginning and end and an instrumental part in the middle where the local station does a voice over.

  22. 22.

    Roger Moore

    November 17, 2013 at 8:20 pm

    What’s on the agenda as we wind down on the weekend?

    Broncos/Chiefs.

  23. 23.

    Culture of Truth

    November 17, 2013 at 8:21 pm

    @efgoldman: She writes notes on her hand. No, really.

  24. 24.

    IowaOldLady

    November 17, 2013 at 8:21 pm

    Mr IOL went to China for a week. I plan to eat a lot of junk food that I won’t let him have.

  25. 25.

    SFAW

    November 17, 2013 at 8:23 pm

    @efgoldman:

    expensive foreign cars, million-dollar condoms (in the 80s!)

    I remember them costing like a buck or so – but a million dollars? THAT is why Obamacare shouldn’t provide “free” contraception, never mind the BC pills.

  26. 26.

    SFAW

    November 17, 2013 at 8:29 pm

    @Roger Moore:

    Broncos/Chiefs.

    And if KC wins, it will give me YET ANOTHER reason to whine about the Jets not picking up Alex Smith when they had the chance.

    With any luck, they’ll bring in Omar Minaya and Dan Duquette to run the front office. Now THERE would be a brain trust to beat Caribou Barbie – but not by much. (And it pains me to say that about a kid from Queens.)

  27. 27.

    MomSense

    November 17, 2013 at 8:30 pm

    @ruemara:

    Love that pic, too and not just because I was a dancer.

  28. 28.

    NotMax

    November 17, 2013 at 8:38 pm

    @max

    “Does these here specs really make me look all smart-like? Goll-ee!”

  29. 29.

    SFAW

    November 17, 2013 at 8:38 pm

    @efgoldman:
    Only if one wants to be saved.

    I thought you would have figured that out by now, at least as regards me.

  30. 30.

    cckids

    November 17, 2013 at 8:45 pm

    @ruemara: Make sure you throw a link up here. I love your “toes” pic.

  31. 31.

    schrodinger's cat

    November 17, 2013 at 8:46 pm

    Open thread needs a kitteh with herz mama.

  32. 32.

    raven

    November 17, 2013 at 8:46 pm

    @IowaOldLady: My best buddy is there for a year as a trainer with the CBA Bejing Ducks basketball team. He’s living in relative luxury in Bejing but the road is a bitch.

  33. 33.

    schrodinger's cat

    November 17, 2013 at 8:50 pm

    Did a ton of cooking for the coming week. A huge pot of chicken curry, ground turkey kebabs, lentil stew, broccoli, couscous, rice,hummus, pickled cranberries, green chili salsa, tamarind chutney, dill and onion chutney, mango smoothie and mint lassi.

  34. 34.

    Shalimar

    November 17, 2013 at 8:51 pm

    @max:

    Rick Perry is in transition again, wearing glasses, playing the elder and running just a tiny bit to the left of Ted Cruz and a notch or two to the right of Gov. Chris Christie of New Jersey.

    It’s funny that all these notches to the left and right are exactly the same beliefs; only difference is how much of an asshole you’re currently being to liberals. I have faith that no one is going to get to Christie’s right in that battle when he finally starts trying.

  35. 35.

    SFAW

    November 17, 2013 at 8:52 pm

    @schrodinger’s cat:

    ground turkey kebabs,

    Does not compute?

  36. 36.

    rikyrah

    November 17, 2013 at 8:54 pm

    CNN spends ten minutes comparing President Obama to crackhead Toronto mayor Rob Ford
    November 17, 2013
    By Anomaly

    I’m waiting for a Conservative or network to compare the Obamacare site to the Holocaust soon.We’ve heard everything else. On Saturday, CNN spent ten minutes comparing President Obama to crack head Toronto Mayor Rob Ford.

    They began with a split-screen image of Obama and Ford, because why not.

    ………………………….

    Lemon responded, “We know the two crises are both very different.But it’s about how do you manage those crises? That’s what we’re trying to figure out.”

    We can totally understand this analogy. Ford, caught on video threatening to kill a ‘mother fucker’, used racial slurs, smokes crack, talks about oral sex with his wife, may have had relations with a prostitute and may have abused his wife, is just like President Obama because HealthCare.gov is glitchy.

    http://freakoutnation.com/2013/11/17/cnn-spends-ten-minutes-comparing-president-obama-to-crackhead-toronto-mayor-rob-ford/

  37. 37.

    Baud

    November 17, 2013 at 8:55 pm

    @rikyrah:

    Jesus. Going Godwin would actually be an improvement.

  38. 38.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    November 17, 2013 at 8:56 pm

    @SFAW:

    expensive foreign cars, million-dollar condoms (in the 80s!)

    Them are condoms made to DOD specs by a defense contractor.

  39. 39.

    schrodinger's cat

    November 17, 2013 at 8:57 pm

    @SFAW: Why not?
    One example here

  40. 40.

    catclub

    November 17, 2013 at 8:59 pm

    @efgoldman: “That means the crazy TeaHadis probably won’t coalesce around one of them to give us the best nominee EVAH! ”

    Well, I was thinking that Cruz is definitely wrapping up the teahadis early, which will be how to stop Christie. I guess now we will wait to see.

  41. 41.

    schrodinger's cat

    November 17, 2013 at 9:02 pm

    @efgoldman: Responding to SFAW who thinks you can’t make kebabs out of ground meat.

  42. 42.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    November 17, 2013 at 9:06 pm

    @efgoldman: So you’re saying I should have double quoted it? I thought about that, too busy.

  43. 43.

    Omnes Omnibus

    November 17, 2013 at 9:09 pm

    @SFAW: You can get a 40 pack at Costco for about $9.00.

  44. 44.

    Litlebritdiftrnt

    November 17, 2013 at 9:23 pm

    Have ya’ll seen this piece of awesomeness?

    http://www.upworthy.com/a-senator-said-voter-registration-was-confusing-watch-a-12-year-old-clear-that-up-for-him?c=utw1

    Madison for Governor in however many years!

  45. 45.

    srv

    November 17, 2013 at 9:26 pm

    I thought we had commenters from the midwest – is everybody OK out there?

  46. 46.

    catclub

    November 17, 2013 at 9:26 pm

    I thought the expression was ‘Minnesota nice’. The Mormons, via the Romneybot5000, have had the wrong spokesdroid for their tribe recently.
    Didn’t I see a lot of posts about Mormons having no problems being serious assholes towards those outside the tribe?

  47. 47.

    Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant)

    November 17, 2013 at 9:31 pm

    Almost Human was pretty good. Think I’ll give it a go.

  48. 48.

    Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant)

    November 17, 2013 at 9:37 pm

    @rikyrah: Lemon should start going on air in blackface, for authenticity’s sake.

  49. 49.

    hells littlest angel

    November 17, 2013 at 9:39 pm

    @max: When I see Perry wearing those specs, I immediately think of the old Simpsons episode in which Homer starts wearing a pair of eyeglasses he found in a toilet bowl.

  50. 50.

    Geoduck

    November 17, 2013 at 9:51 pm

    @Roger Moore:

    It’s somewhat bizarre as a Seahawk fan to realize if the ‘Hawks to make it back to the Super Bowl, they are likely to be playing one of these two teams, when they used to be divisional rivals.

  51. 51.

    Ash Can

    November 17, 2013 at 9:52 pm

    @srv: Speaking for Illinois, the Chicago area was pretty much unscathed. Most of the wreckage was downstate. It looks like the tornadoes avoided the most heavily populated areas, fortunately, but that’s no comfort to the small towns that did get whacked.

  52. 52.

    Mike in NC

    November 17, 2013 at 9:54 pm

    @raven: Name it Eric Cantor.

  53. 53.

    Mandalay

    November 17, 2013 at 10:00 pm

    @rikyrah: Your post makes about CNN comparing Ford and Obama makes it sound awful…but it is actually far worse (from watching the video at the link you gave).

    The clinical psychologist assures us that it is fair to make a comparison “between the two crises” because “both of them are in trouble”. Then the earnest host asks “Who are we more likely to forgive: Rob Ford or President Obama”? The clinical psychologist proclaims that “President Obama seems to want to be forgiven whereas Ford just doesn’t give a rat’s behind”.

    Mindless drivel of the highest order. CNN is worse than Fox News. At least Fox coherently pushes a distorted agenda. CNN just get a bucketful of shit and offal and rub it on their faces in front of a camera.

    I’m surprised that CNN didn’t point out that neither Ford nor Obama have admitted to physically abusing their wife. How could they overlook such an obvious parallel?

  54. 54.

    normal liberal

    November 17, 2013 at 10:06 pm

    @Ash Can:
    Also in Illinois, several towns around Peoria got major damage and one fatality so far. I’m a bit further to the east, where we had lots of downed trees and branches, flooding, and some structural damage, thanks to the wind.

    This was the worst storm I’ve seen in a long time. The wind was truly scary, and kept gusting for hours after the line of heavy rain, hail and tornadoes came through.

    This doesn’t usually happen in November.

  55. 55.

    Eric S.

    November 17, 2013 at 10:11 pm

    @srv: on the north side of Chicago. All good here. Mom lives in Cincinnati. She and the cat had to go to the basement for a while but reports all is clear.

  56. 56.

    Kyle

    November 17, 2013 at 10:18 pm

    @catclub:

    Didn’t I see a lot of posts about Mormons having no problems being serious assholes towards those outside the tribe?

    It’s an accepted part of their doctrine that it’s OK to lie to non-Mormons when it advances the interests of the religion.

    Mormon businessmen in my experience are at least as big sacks of shit liars as non-Mormons. And that specifically includes Thrifty rent a car agency at SLC airport.

    Rmoney certainly didn’t break the impression that no higher ethical standards are evident.

  57. 57.

    Villago Delenda Est

    November 17, 2013 at 10:25 pm

    @MikeJ:

    I think the Snowbilly grifter’s already done that.

    Oh, wait, she was reading the Obama teleprompter jokes off a teleprompter…

  58. 58.

    catclub

    November 17, 2013 at 10:30 pm

    @Villago Delenda Est: very meta

  59. 59.

    Keith P

    November 17, 2013 at 10:37 pm

    Damn, dunno if anyone here watches Eastbound & Down, but the finale was AWESOME. First season of it was absolutely perfect, with the subsequent seasons not being nearly as good (although I liked the original series finale from S3). But this one tonight put a smile on my face. And the cameos….the awesome, awesome cameos (including – SPOILER………………………….Alexander Skarsgard as Toby)

  60. 60.

    polyorchnid octopunch

    November 17, 2013 at 10:42 pm

    Peter Watts publishes an elegy to one of his rescue cats: http://www.rifters.com/crawl/?p=4538

  61. 61.

    catclub

    November 17, 2013 at 10:46 pm

    I knew there was something I was going to predict: In six months or less, someone who takes advantage of the right to buy their shitty old insurance policy will complain when their insurance company screws them. They will then get on TV and Blame Obama. The press will aid in this idiocy. “Why couldn’t Obama protect these people from such crappy insurance?”

  62. 62.

    Yatsuno

    November 17, 2013 at 10:49 pm

    @catclub:

    In six months or less, someone who takes advantage of the right to buy their shitty old insurance policy will complain when their insurance company screws them

    Not taking that bet. In fact, that’s a Republican aspiration at this point.

  63. 63.

    John O

    November 17, 2013 at 10:57 pm

    My niece, her husband, and their 3 boys under age 10 lost everything they had in the storms in IL today. The house is flattened. Gone. They were incredibly lucky to be away when the storm hit, because their big old 100+ year old farmhouse that had seen its share of storms now looks like this. It is happenstance that they’re all alive.

    I need to bleg and don’t know how to do it.

  64. 64.

    YellowJournalism

    November 17, 2013 at 10:59 pm

    @handsmile: Funny, the image in the lady’s grilled cheese from that article really does look like The Madonna to me, only not the holy one.

  65. 65.

    SFAW

    November 17, 2013 at 11:00 pm

    @efgoldman:

    Well, it was my typo, but you can pick on SFAW all you like.

    Your typo? I’m hurt. And after all we’ve been through together.

  66. 66.

    Anne Laurie

    November 17, 2013 at 11:01 pm

    @catclub: ‘Midwestern/Scandinavian/Morman Nice’, as I’ve seen it used, usually implies a nasty passive-aggressive streak under the social politeness: “That’s not a rude gesture, it’s an abstract of a cactus. It’s ART, you dirty-minded NotOneofUS person…(heh, heh)”

    Like all of Willard’s so-called “jokes”, eg, pointing at overweight passersby and telling his staffers ‘There’s your date for tonight.’ Why so offended? He said it was a joke!

  67. 67.

    Violet

    November 17, 2013 at 11:02 pm

    @John O: That’s awful. I’m so sorry for your niece and her family. At least they are all okay, but that’s still an awful thing to have happen.

  68. 68.

    John O

    November 17, 2013 at 11:04 pm

    @John O:

    Two kitties missing, as well, but the dog Suna saved by a heroic effort from Mom. No insurance, but at least they were only renting.

    We’re counting our blessings.

  69. 69.

    Hill Dweller

    November 17, 2013 at 11:05 pm

    @catclub:

    I knew there was something I was going to predict: In six months or less, someone who takes advantage of the right to buy their shitty old insurance policy will complain when their insurance company screws them. They will then get on TV and Blame Obama. The press will aid in this idiocy. “Why couldn’t Obama protect these people from such crappy insurance?”

    These idiots are just delaying the inevitable. They’ll be in the exact same position this time next year.

    Hell, they’ve had years to get a policy that met the ACA minimum coverage standards.

  70. 70.

    MikeJ

    November 17, 2013 at 11:08 pm

    BTW, if you ever wanted to run away and join the circus, DVR alert. La Strada is on TCM at 11 tonight. I love love love this movie.

  71. 71.

    NotMax

    November 17, 2013 at 11:09 pm

    @handsmile

    Back when blogged regularly, had an intermittent sub-head called Pareidolia On Parade that tracked such instances of idiocy.

  72. 72.

    danielx

    November 17, 2013 at 11:10 pm

    @Culture of Truth:

    “… it’s time to give up on “this basic idea that liberals and progressives have pushed for the last 80 years.”

    Because free markets. And because it’s so much more desirable for people to be hungry and suffer from curable disease.

    Weather got a little sporty today, but we were lucky – everything went north of us or south of us. People in Illinois got hit pretty hard around Peoria, Pekin, Normal…

  73. 73.

    NotMax

    November 17, 2013 at 11:12 pm

    @MikeJ

    The movie is unquestionably good, but (IMHO) Nino Rota’s score is even better.

  74. 74.

    MattR

    November 17, 2013 at 11:12 pm

    @John O: OMG. Very glad they were not home at the time the storm came through. Hope you find the kitties.

    Do they at least have somewhere to stay tonight as well as access to sufficient funds to allow them to buy the basic necessities – food, toiletries, change of clothing, etc?

  75. 75.

    SFAW

    November 17, 2013 at 11:13 pm

    @schrodinger’s cat:

    Never saw hamburger kebabs before. As it turns out, not surprising, since most of the kebab references I found relate to un-ground meat(s).

    As far as “can’t” vs. “don’t usually”: there are plenty of things in this world that one can do. Doesn’t mean any/all of them is a good idea. You can probably make chicken liver kebabs, but given the shit they put into chickens these days, probably not something of which I’d want to partake. (Which pains me, in a way, because my beloved grandmother used to make great gehackte Leber – something I’d look forward to having for lunch at school. But that was many years ago. And I digress.)

  76. 76.

    John O

    November 17, 2013 at 11:18 pm

    @MattR:

    Thanks, Matt, yes, they’re set up with the in-laws who live in the same town but were relatively unscathed, and have their short-term needs covered by friends and family, at least so far. Food and shelter are covered. Electricity is not, however, since the fire dept. said a week at least.

    But they got out with only the clothes on their back (and the dog), are a young couple with 3 young boys, and are going to be starting from ZERO. It’s an all-around nightmare except for being alive.

  77. 77.

    SFAW

    November 17, 2013 at 11:21 pm

    @BillinGlendaleCA:

    Them are condoms made to DOD specs by a defense contractor.

    I blame either Clinton or Obama for both emasculating our Armed Forces and making disease prevention so expensive for them. Or something.

  78. 78.

    catclub

    November 17, 2013 at 11:29 pm

    @Yatsuno: I am also wondering how the now extended shitty policies will deal with things like recission. Are they exempt from those new parts of the law? Pre-existing conditions? Lifetime maxima?

  79. 79.

    burnspbesq

    November 17, 2013 at 11:31 pm

    Pope Frankie continues to amaze.

    http://www.theamericanconservative.com/dreher/pope-francis-beats-all/

    This is how to handle Dolan: just keep giving him more rope with which to hang himself.

  80. 80.

    burnspbesq

    November 17, 2013 at 11:33 pm

    @danielx:

    No Republican believes in a social safety net … until they need it to catch their family. Then it can’t be big enough or strong enough.

  81. 81.

    Yatsuno

    November 17, 2013 at 11:34 pm

    @catclub: I would think those are all forbidden now, but with grandfathered policies who knows. There is absolutely nothing keeping the insurance companies from cancelling these policies at any time either, it would just be under Obama’s rules they couldn’t blame ACA. Which I think is a fair trade-off.

  82. 82.

    SFAW

    November 17, 2013 at 11:37 pm

    @burnspbesq:

    This is how to handle Dolan: just keep giving him more rope with which to hang himself.

    I’m either missing something, or just not that smart (maybe both?): how did that article relate to Dolan?

  83. 83.

    SFAW

    November 17, 2013 at 11:42 pm

    @burnspbesq:

    No Republican believes in a social safety net … until they need it to catch their family. Then it can’t be big enough or strong enough.

    Well, of course, silly! It’s because THEY are deserving of help, not like the poors and browns (and poor browns). Because all those poors get fat sucking at teh government teat.

  84. 84.

    MattR

    November 17, 2013 at 11:42 pm

    @John O: Renters insurance by any chance? Sounds like no :( And insurance doesn’t eliminate the hassle of having to replace everything (or the trauma of losing it).

    Unfortunately, I have no idea what the rules/laws are for getting state or federal assistance. Maybe contact the Red Cross and/or FEMA (or the Illinois version of it)?

  85. 85.

    Original Lee

    November 18, 2013 at 12:04 am

    Went to see a local production of The Pajama Game and now have this song stuck in my head. Should be updated for the push for raising the minimum wage, don’t you think?

  86. 86.

    burnspbesq

    November 18, 2013 at 12:08 am

    @SFAW:

    It didn’t, at least not explicitly. But I would have thought that the parallel was fairly obvious: in a situation where you can’t actually kill your opponents, kill them with kindness. Muzzling them is the worst thing you can do. Let them keep talking until their folly becomes obvious to even the most obtuse.

    The thing that Frankie has going for him in the current theological debate is that the vast majority of the faithful want to belong to his Church, not to Dolan’s. Make the choice obvious, and trust the faithful to figure it out.

  87. 87.

    burnspbesq

    November 18, 2013 at 12:10 am

    Like it or not, Larry Summers is one smart mutha, and he’s onto something very important here.

    http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/11/16/secular-stagnation-coalmines-bubbles-and-larry-summers/?_r=0#more-35994

  88. 88.

    Steeplejack

    November 18, 2013 at 12:15 am

    @burnspbesq:

    I saw that. Very interesting piece, with some huge implications that will take some time to think through. But it’s comforting to hear that some of the big brains are thinking outside of the conventional box.

    Even though it’s “just” about economics (allegedly), Krugman’s blog has become a daily stop for me. Always good stuff, although I’m not crazy about all of his “Friday Night Music” selections.

  89. 89.

    SFAW

    November 18, 2013 at 12:18 am

    @burnspbesq:

    OK, thanks for explaining. I haven’t been following a lot of Church doings. I kinda-sorta knew that Dolan was/is more conservative (to put it tactfully). And I really like a number of the things that Pope Francis has done. I don’t remember John XXIII – although I remember when he died – but my sense (from my meager reading) is that he and Francis had/have a lot in common – in a good way. I just hope Francis doesn’t go the way of JP I, that would suck.

  90. 90.

    Hill Dweller

    November 18, 2013 at 12:19 am

    @Steeplejack: I love Krugman’s blog. Watching him discover “indy music” has been one of the more entertaining aspects of said blog.

  91. 91.

    Yatsuno

    November 18, 2013 at 12:23 am

    @MattR: FEMA should be involved here, and even renters are eligible for loans & disaster assistance. FEMA should be showing up here soon if not already.

    Also: Mnem alert!

  92. 92.

    Villago Delenda Est

    November 18, 2013 at 12:25 am

    @Yatsuno:

    They’ll blame ACA regardless, and the teatwits will lap it up.

    They’re despicable people, to the last one.

  93. 93.

    bemused senior

    November 18, 2013 at 12:25 am

    @schrodinger’s cat: Pickled cranberry sounds yummy. Recipe?

  94. 94.

    Mnemosyne (iPhone)

    November 18, 2013 at 12:30 am

    @SFAW:

    Ground meat kabobs are pretty common in Middle Eastern cooking — they’re usually called kofta or a similar name.

  95. 95.

    Mnemosyne (iPhone)

    November 18, 2013 at 12:37 am

    @Yatsuno:

    Our office’s potluck theme this year is “A Jolly Holiday with Mary Poppins.” Yes, we iz all geeks.

  96. 96.

    Origuy

    November 18, 2013 at 12:41 am

    @SFAW:

    Never saw hamburger kebabs before.

    Ground meat kebabs are called kefta (kofta, kofte, other spellings) kebabs. Usually minced lamb, sometimes other meat.
    ETA. Refresh, then post. Mnemosyne beat me to it.

  97. 97.

    SFAW

    November 18, 2013 at 12:44 am

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone):

    they’re usually called kofta or a similar name.

    Yes, I see/understand. I sometimes call shawarma “shashlik,” in much the same spirit. Of course, too much spirits, and I might end up calling it/them “brats.”

  98. 98.

    Origuy

    November 18, 2013 at 12:45 am

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone): Mary Poppins is a Time Lord.

  99. 99.

    SFAW

    November 18, 2013 at 12:50 am

    @Origuy:

    Of course, this (i.e. responses from schrodinger, Mnem, and you) raises the question: as ‘Muricans, are we really allowed to eat stuff that all those browns and/or Moooslims eat, and not lose our citizenship? (For what profiteth a B-J commenter, if he/she gain some good victuals, but lose his/her something-or-other?)

  100. 100.

    cokane

    November 18, 2013 at 12:50 am

    am i the only one whose ring finger is longer than their index?

  101. 101.

    Spaghetti Lee

    November 18, 2013 at 12:53 am

    Trying to get down the introductory parts of my book so I can start the interesting parts. Off the top of their head, can anyone recommend a variation on/alternative to “Kid stealthily sneaks halfway down stairs to hear Mom and Dad talking worriedly about the kid; kid realizes that parents actually are worried and aren’t just being dictators for the hell of it; kid tries to stop being such an asshole?” I think I need something like that to happen to get the plot going, but that exact setup is so hoary I figure there’s got to be something better to do with it.

  102. 102.

    SFAW

    November 18, 2013 at 12:55 am

    @cokane:
    Why does the porridge bird lay its egg in the air?

  103. 103.

    SFAW

    November 18, 2013 at 12:57 am

    @Spaghetti Lee:

    Are you reading the book, or writing it? Wasn’t quite sure, don’t want to assume.

  104. 104.

    Villago Delenda Est

    November 18, 2013 at 12:58 am

    @Spaghetti Lee:

    How about the kid overhears a phone call between one of the parents and a grandparent?

    No need for both sides, just the local end. Comes home early from school or something, unexpectedly.

  105. 105.

    Spaghetti Lee

    November 18, 2013 at 12:59 am

    @SFAW:

    Writing.

  106. 106.

    Mnemosyne (iPhone)

    November 18, 2013 at 12:59 am

    @Spaghetti Lee:

    Honestly, I’d skip over it and get straight to the plot. You can always go back and write that scene later when you know where the plot’s going.

  107. 107.

    Spaghetti Lee

    November 18, 2013 at 1:03 am

    @Villago Delenda Est:

    Phone call might be a good idea. Dad (or Uncle in this case: non-traditional family structures yay) is a cop, so he’d have reason to be on the job late at night. I’m not sure ‘kid comes home unexpectedly’ would work because Mom would just cut the phone call short when she hears the door. Right now the situation is at the end of two straight days of mother-daughter hostilities, Mom at her wits’ end asking Cop Uncle for advice. Despite what the roles would suggest, Mom in this case is probably more of a disciplinarian than Cop Uncle: he usually plays the peacemaker between the two, but it’s getting to the point where peacemaking isn’t enough and someone’s gotta give.

  108. 108.

    Villago Delenda Est

    November 18, 2013 at 1:13 am

    @Spaghetti Lee:

    Mom is so wound up in the phone call that she doesn’t hear daughter entering the house.

    Or the daughter is operating in the stealth mode entering the house and is extra quiet (phone call precipitated by daughter storming out, perhaps?)

  109. 109.

    ? Martin

    November 18, 2013 at 1:16 am

    @Spaghetti Lee:

    I’m not sure ‘kid comes home unexpectedly’ would work because Mom would just cut the phone call short when she hears the door.

    We realized that the daughter learned that looking through the texting thread on mom’s phone was a good way to see what mom and I were discussing. No need for temporality – kid just needs a creative excuse to borrow mom’s phone in the car when mom can’t supervise what she’s looking at.

  110. 110.

    srv

    November 18, 2013 at 1:22 am

    @Spaghetti Lee: I’m still finishing something for botsplainer, but,

    The house was old, with wood floors, steel heater venting and acoustical dynamics of a concrete bunker. Kyle knew when the pace of the conversations from downstairs were quietly urgent but could not make out the words wafting up the stairwell, that something concerned him. Or should concern him.

    The secret was knowing exactly which steps creaked, those which must be skipped, and those whose complaints could be mitigated by stepping on the inside of the outside of the tread. This was a practiced maneuver, almost a ballet, now preferable to the out-the-window roof jump which had begun to incur a toll to his little sister, should she notice. And she always did. He had come to believe Laura never slept, as the toll was often coming and going.

    The middle landing of the stairwell was the magic point. Any farther, and the risk of exposure by visual or acoustic means rose exponentially. It povided a failsafe should someone become suspicous – more than once he perceived the speakers concern and bounded noisely down the bottom stairs, prepared with some nuanced question on school or desire for a late night snack.

    The other attribute of the landing was that by rising or lowering your head, you had access to every frequency in the house. Every gurgle of a pipe, every whisper of a fan, the buzz of the porch light, the sounds of his sister’s iPad game – it was like being dialed in to the breathing of the house.

  111. 111.

    Spaghetti Lee

    November 18, 2013 at 1:27 am

    @? Martin:

    Story set in the mid 90’s. Otherwise I’d go for that.

  112. 112.

    Spaghetti Lee

    November 18, 2013 at 1:28 am

    @srv:

    I’m confused-are you offering this prose for me to use, or just showing a good example of how it could be done?

  113. 113.

    srv

    November 18, 2013 at 1:28 am

    Oh, variation.

    The kids just taps his iphone for the spy app he’s installed on their phone and listend in. Or the family computer in the kitchen. Or the re-purposed baby monitor they think is in the attic.

  114. 114.

    srv

    November 18, 2013 at 1:31 am

    @Spaghetti Lee: Oh, 90’s….

    Unless they’ve got a NeXT, I’m not sure about turning a remote mic on.

  115. 115.

    Spaghetti Lee

    November 18, 2013 at 1:32 am

    @srv:

    Setting is about 15 years too early for the first two, and anyway creatively re-purposing technology like that would be out of character for this girl.

    I don’t want to sound like I’m shooting everyone down here. Honestly I’m grateful you all care so much and are offering so many ideas.

  116. 116.

    Spaghetti Lee

    November 18, 2013 at 1:36 am

    @srv:

    Don’t know much about that computer, but a quick Wiki scan makes it seem like it was expensive and had a “for Silicon Valley, by Silicon Valley” kind of ethos. Mom and uncle are two working-class civil servants raising a kid in small-town rust-belt Pennsylvania. Probably would seem out of place.

  117. 117.

    srv

    November 18, 2013 at 1:39 am

    @Spaghetti Lee: If a tomboy, she’d have an out-the-window plan. Maybe half-way down the tree instead of stairs.

    Otherwise, late evening, no wind, open windows, a little drinking, adults never have a clue how far their conversations are traveling. We always knew what was going on, unless we were asleep.

  118. 118.

    Spaghetti Lee

    November 18, 2013 at 1:53 am

    @srv:

    Drinking, heh. Hadn’t considered that. “Haven’t cracked into the bourbon since last Christmas. Hoping I’d get to save it for when I got promoted, but looks like I need it sooner.” She’s definitely an out-the-window-and-down-the-tree type tomboy-good guess*. Too early in the spring for late evening with the windows open, though. I think I’m leaning towards “walks in unnoticed on a phone conversation, stays out of sight to hear it through.”

    *- What started the fight is that the daughter is fairly obsessed with always being outdoors and exercising and getting more physically fit, and mom would prefer that she spends more time doing schoolwork, but as a gesture of goodwill offers to sign her up for a YMCA-type basketball camp. That actually makes her angrier-she thinks that she’s being condescended to by an offer to join an all-girls league and wants to know why she can’t keep playing against the boys, even as she enters high school-this after she got her clock cleaned by an older teenage boy with ten inches/eighty pounds on her at the local park. Her unusual thoughts on sex and gender differences (namely that she’d rather ignore their existence) are a big driver of her character, and her mom is starting to worry that, at age 14, it might be more than tomboyism and some gender identity disorder/bigorexia, or maybe some deep psychological denial issues that she’s not prepared to deal with as a parent, financially or emotionally. What I’m trying to get to is that the daughter backs down and joins the girls’ league, which is when the plot wheels start really turning.

  119. 119.

    jenn

    November 18, 2013 at 1:53 am

    @John O: Holy toledo. I’m so sorry. Please pass along my best wishes to your family. And I’ll keep my fingers crossed that the kitties only used up one of their 9 lives, and will turn up a little shaken, but safe and sound.

  120. 120.

    jenn

    November 18, 2013 at 1:57 am

    @Spaghetti Lee: Parents are talking downstairs with the music on, so the daughter can’t hear them from her room (maybe over a cup of coffee or glass of wine?) – not realizing it also meant they couldn’t hear her sneak down the stairs?

  121. 121.

    jenn

    November 18, 2013 at 2:02 am

    @Spaghetti Lee: This internet break is brought to you by writer’s block. Well, not standard writer’s block, more the Roadblock of Ignorance. I’m writing a history, and I’ve hit a topic that I need to do more research on, that needs a bit more than a superficial google. Ah, well, what can be better than an excuse to buy more books?!

  122. 122.

    jenn

    November 18, 2013 at 2:03 am

    And now I appear to be talking to myself!

  123. 123.

    srv

    November 18, 2013 at 2:07 am

    @Spaghetti Lee: Rust belt PA, what else do they do but drink?

    Did mom’s worry about gender identity in the mid-90’s?

    I’m partial to girls volleyball over bball, but I don’t know what they do in PA.

  124. 124.

    Spaghetti Lee

    November 18, 2013 at 2:13 am

    @srv:

    Hey now, that’s not nice.

    Did mom’s worry about gender identity in the mid-90′s?

    Well, there probably won’t be a character who refers to it as such, and I’m not going to go nuts with the psychoanalysis as the third-person narrator-it’s a novel, not a psychology textbook. Around town, more of a general feeling of, to paraphrase Hank Hill, “That girl ain’t right.” (Small-town might have been underselling it: it’s a made-up town, but about the size of Syracuse or Hartford, in Appalachian Pennsylvania. Not Deliverance country, but not the most hip and happenin’ place either.)

    I’m partial to girls volleyball over bball, but I don’t know what they do in PA.

    Like many kids born in the 80’s, she fell victim to Michael Jordan idolatry when she was old enough to start paying attention to sports, thus the basketball fandom. The fact that he’s taking his sabbatical during the events of the book only adds to her turmoil: If Mike walked away, what chance do I have?

  125. 125.

    ? Martin

    November 18, 2013 at 2:21 am

    @srv: I went to a college in central PA in the early 90s with a quite large LGBT community. Roughly ⅓ of the girls soccer team was gay/bi.

    @Spaghetti Lee: Yeah, basketball was popular as well.

  126. 126.

    max

    November 18, 2013 at 2:25 am

    It stopped raining, so the connection stopped crapping out!

    @MikeJ: Who will be the first to use Google glass as a TelePrompTer?

    None of those guys. They’d look too smart. Don’t wanna look smart, just don’t want to be accused of being Louie Gohmert.

    DOWN AND DIRTY IN THE BOG… BOG… BOG

    Yup. They used to run those commercials for a place called Yellowbelly Speedway, which was chock full of the kind of folks that would be serious methheads these days. The R nominating process reminds me of that place.

    In 20 years of broadcasting, i always wanted to do one of those commercials. Never came close. You didn’t hear them much on classical music stations.

    We didn’t do commercials! I’m not sure the mixer board had reverb on it. (The turntables were nice, and together they were probably worth more than all other equipment and furniture in the control room combined. The nuke green carpet that glowed and apparently was recycled from a bowling alley wasn’t worth anything at all. Probably have to pay someone to haul it away.)

    @MikeJ: I got to do one for a fireworks show once. You get to be all basso profundo boomy for that, even if it’s not a monster truck show.

    I always faked reverb on air as a joke because I could get the boomy thing going.

    @efgoldman: ETA: No-one on the station staff, except the owners, could ever afford any of the stuff for which we read commercials.

    So you understand!

    @feebog: Perry has already demonstrated that he is a lightweight dim witted empty suit. The wonder is that after what was arguably the worst debate performance in the history of presidential politics he thinks he has any chance whatsoever. In the 2016 Republican Presidential Clown Car, he’s the clown chasing the car.

    Don’t underestimate his abilities in terms of wingnut politics. He’s not smart, but he’s politically far more smart than a Mittens. Plus he’s dirty as hell and totally underhanded and just doesn’t have any principles whatsoever. (Romney had more money.) Kind of the Saddam Hussein of America’s Governors. Not smart, but wily.

    @Shalimar: I have faith that no one is going to get to Christie’s right in that battle when he finally starts trying.

    Yeah, and then Perry or someone just like him will start talking about Christie being one of Those People from Neeew Yorick and I’ll betcha some old school ethnic slurs will come back into fashion. And then Christie will lose.

    @hells littlest angel: When I see Perry wearing those specs, I immediately think of the old Simpsons episode in which Homer starts wearing a pair of eyeglasses he found in a toilet bowl.

    And then the other residents of Springfield making up the right-wing echo chamber will be impressed by how he’s all learned up now.

    max
    [‘Oh, this will be funny. In a scary, Deliverance kind of way.’]

  127. 127.

    srv

    November 18, 2013 at 2:25 am

    @Spaghetti Lee: Ok, I’m good with a girl who fights with boys and people wonder what’s up with that. As long as she’s already drinking at 14.

    I’m good with bball. Soccer nutism didn’t really get going until later 90’s.

    > Not Deliverance country

    Well, there’s just a lot of scary parts of PA and I wouldn’t know which parts are which.

  128. 128.

    Mnemosyne (iPhone)

    November 18, 2013 at 2:30 am

    @Spaghetti Lee:

    In mid-90s small town, mom’s not going to worry about “gender identity,” she’s going to worry that her daughter is a lesbian. I guarantee you that a girl like that would probably have been called a “dyke” to her face at least once by age 14.

    Did you ever read any of R.R. Knudsen’s “Zan” books from the 1970s? Your story sounds a little similar, except that Zan did get to play on the boys’ team.

    (And Knudsen was a lesbian, which now makes total sense in retrospect, but is not something I would have gotten as a 10-year-old kid reading the books in the 1980s.)

  129. 129.

    LosGatosCA

    November 18, 2013 at 2:50 am

    A little bored tonight. 49ers lost, Stanford lost. Weather today was great though.

    So . . . I thought I’d go NSA on this Mormon Nice feud.

    Put in the defendant’s name, street/town reference in the Google. Here’s another picture – of the plaintiff:

    https://thetfp.com/tfp/general-discussion/107618-naughty-neighbor-window-shaped-like-middle-finger.html

    Then I went to Zillow, put in the same address and looked for a property in the neighborhood with that roof line and a white fence behind it. Bingo.

    Actual street is Whatta View Place and it looks like the Mormon Nice guy sold out in 2007 via Re/Max (picture on their site) – with the offending feature removed – likely for resale value maximization.

    That took 5 minutes – while chomping pretzel chips and swigging Diet Cherry Pepsi. Imagine if I had some security clearance and access to a drone pool.

  130. 130.

    piratedan

    November 18, 2013 at 2:54 am

    @LosGatosCA: and with that effort, you’ve surpassed what most of the Beltway media has done in the last month and you should be gunning for Lara Logan’s job…. kinda sad isn’t it?

  131. 131.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    November 18, 2013 at 3:03 am

    @LosGatosCA: I got bored one night a few months ago and looked up where Howard Jarvis was buried. One of the commenters here wanted to piss on his grave. Turns out his crypt is about 4 miles from here.

  132. 132.

    LosGatosCA

    November 18, 2013 at 3:08 am

    @piratedan:

    Don’t hate on Lara Logan. She probably doesn’t have access to pretzel chips and may have a phobia about Diet Cherry Pepsi. And without the right fuel, the brain waves never reach critical mass. The fingers can never punch in the magic Google words that lead to ‘the truth.’ Even if you spend a year staring at you computer screen

  133. 133.

    LosGatosCA

    November 18, 2013 at 3:11 am

    Have a great week!

  134. 134.

    scav

    November 18, 2013 at 3:14 am

    @Spaghetti Lee: For what it’s worth, old house in my family had one open, preumably for heating grate in the floor / ceiling that fascinated us as kids. Went straight through, no ducts, nothing, we could drop pennies on people answering the phone below or attempt to get them to land in the candy dish next to them. Physically, that would work, so long as it’s an old house. Massive bathroom in it too, clearly a regular (still largish) room repurposed. We don’t know what they were thinking though as it also was the one with the only door to the interior stairs. Anyone took a bath, you stayed put.

  135. 135.

    NotMax

    November 18, 2013 at 3:40 am

    @Yatsuno

    That potentially absolutely ghastly.

    Hope the memo included, in ALL CAPS, the notice that a bag of sugar and a package of plastic spoons will not be accepted as a contribution.

  136. 136.

    Amir Khalid

    November 18, 2013 at 3:56 am

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone):
    There’s a Disney movie coming out, about Uncle Walt, P.L. Travers, the Mary Poppins movie — and, from what I’ve read, why there’s just the one Mary Poppins movie. Absolutely no relation to the office potluck, or did someone from corporate HQ suggest an, ahem, appropriate theme?

  137. 137.

    fuckwit

    November 18, 2013 at 4:06 am

    First of all. Logan keeps her job because she’s cute smoking hot (just checked image search, cute is not even close), and that still counts way too much on TV.

    Secondly, she keeps her job because for fuck’s sake she was raped in public in the line of duty covering the Egypt revolution. That was probably a first for network TV, and one would hope it’d be the last too. So, the network feels guilty for that happening to her on their dime, and they will cut her a lot of slack just because of that.

    And finally she keeps her job because the corporate media are right-wing shills, all of them, and they have no problem with spinning or outright lying to make Democrats look bad. Ever. Even if they get caught, they will do it again and again.

  138. 138.

    NotMax

    November 18, 2013 at 4:08 am

    #142 meant to be @Mnemosyne (iPhone)

    Sigh.

  139. 139.

    Anon

    November 18, 2013 at 8:13 am

    @LosGatosCA: The ‘window’ came down a week after the original SLT article: http://www.sltrib.com/utah/ci_4229135 .

  140. 140.

    LanceThruster

    November 18, 2013 at 12:04 pm

    I thought property rights trumped all. It’s their window, they should pretty much be able to do what they damn well please.

  141. 141.

    ranchandsyrup

    November 18, 2013 at 1:18 pm

    Another one of these middle fingers is on Hwy 82 right outside of Aspen (very near to Hunter Thompson’s home). Wife got the house and the barn in the divorce. Husband kept the plane. Barn is right by airport. She put a middle finger on the barn so he’d see it. #Aspenproblems

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