Historic health care reform legislation, historic advances in marriage equality rights, Confederate flags coming down over statehouses, the best economy in the world…FUCK YEAH.
It’s why I have no patience with WHY CAN’T HE LEAD “centrist” assholes and the HE SOLD US OUT ON THE PUBLIC OPTION manic progressives. Progress is progress. There are those who say Obama’s been lucky, but luck is the residue of design and I would rather have a general who was lucky than one who was “good”.
UPDATE: I do think that saying that Obama was lucky or “didn’t live up to his potential” or so on, is, if not racist, at least a very typical rhetorical trope used to cut successful black people down, e.g. every great black player in the NBA or NFL is “God-gifted”, every white player who succeeds is a gym rat who stayed late after practice and spent hours in the film room mastering the complex playbook.
Baud
Fuckin’ A, DougJ!
trollhattan
Still unpacking the brilliance of the president’s eulogy last week. Possibly the most brilliantly constructed speech/tribute/sermon I’ve ever witnessed. Guessing he said “yessss” when learning of the gal taking down the NC capitol’s flag yesterday. Nice capper to the week.
Now let’s discuss Hillary’s many shortcomings so we can find a reason to worry about somebody from the two or three dozen Republican candidates.
rikyrah
Yes, the Black man who was ELECTED PRESIDENT TWICE….
is just “lucky”.
Get da phuq outta here.
JPL
@rikyrah: You know that’s not what Doug meant, right?
Kropadope
@rikyrah:
Considering the series of both unfolding disasters and ticking time-bombs he inherited, in addition to the complete lack of professional courtesy and cooperation he received from the other side in fixing these problems, I would say he is rather unlucky.
Fortunately, he is rather deft.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Most of the OBAMA SOLD US OUT crowd want a different country, they’re just too dumb to know it, and the WHY CAN’T HE LEAD crowd want him to turn fiscal policy over to Paul Ryan and foreign policy over to John McCain, they’re just too dishonest (including with themselves) to admit it.
No question Obama”s been lucky, mostly in his imploding opponents from Illinois to Sarah Palin to the 47% tape, but I could point to just as many examples where he’s been unlucky and his opponents have been nothing but spiteful.
piratedan
@trollhattan: that’s okay, we don’t have to do that. We can wait for the media to explain the minutiae of why her foreign policy might have issues in the Pacific Rim and how Israel might be uncomfortable with her economic support of various Arab states, whereas we’ll hear fuck all about the medieval ideas that the GOP has about health care and women and climate change and economic basics or infrastructure spending.
it’ll be full time character assassination and damn the policy, tried and true GOP tactics methinks… if they can only win all of the whitey vote.
trollhattan
Utterly OT but since it’s a DougJ thread, prog fans will be saddened at the passing of Chris Squire.
TG Chicago
When was the last time the US didnt have the best economy in the world?
He gets credit for healthcare. I think he was leading from behind on SSM and the traitor’s flag.
trollhattan
@piratedan:
It’s no small measure of glee I get from how badly they’re all stumbling over the many events of the last two weeks. Figure I can’t be alone in this….
And oh, John Oliver will light it up tonight.
DougJ
@TG Chicago:
We followed idiotic austerity policies less than just about any other country in the western world.
Kropadope
@TG Chicago: His administration’s lack of support for DOMA in court was a major step in the series of recent court victories and his vocal support for gay marriage during an election probably helped a lot to consolidate public opinion in favor of marriage equality.
Punchy
Ya know you’ve hit Peak Meme when Scalia goes Godwin to uphold Cleek’s Law to the 27%ers….
the Conster
Prezactly DougJ. Prezactly! Best.week.ever. for real progressives and Obots. Obama changed the country this week, virtually by himself. Charleston was horrifying, but it was like the obverse of firing on Ft. Sumter, and that eulogy was birthed in the Articles of Secession. If you watched that eulogy with Obama laying out the theme of Grace and didn’t feel all the feels as an American who knows its history, there’s a raisin where your heart should be. Then to see all the rainbows and happiness, and to see and feel freedom. Real American freedom. My favorite line from the president’s statement after the SSM decision was “when all Americans are treated as equal, we are all more free”. Plus affordable health care for all.
It is so ordered.
Germy Shoemangler
David Vitter responded to the SCOTUS ruling on SSM by taking a selfie of himself eating chick-fil-a in his car and posting it on twitter.
He got some amusing responses.
trollhattan
@Germy Shoemangler:
What color was his diaper? Did it clash with the car interior?
Germy Shoemangler
@trollhattan: One of the replies was something to the effect that the chick-fil-a bag would make a good diaper.
Vitter really has no shame.
I’m more ashamed that I saw the original story on SALON than he is that he got caught playing diaper games with prostitutes.
Germy Shoemangler
Best response to Vitter:
Hal
Meh. Shonda Rhimes nailed it on Scandal:
“Rowan Pope (Morton) speaking to Olivia Pope (Kerry Washington), who has just been outed as the President of the United States’ mistress, forces his soon-to-be disgraced daughter to repeat back to him the mantra he has instilled in her since childhood. The Entertainment Weekly recap of the episode calls the statement a “family motto” and quotes it thus: “You have to be twice as good to get half as much.” But dig the full exchange:
Rowan: Did I not raise you for better? How many times have I told you? You have to be what?
Olivia: Twice as good.
Rowan: You have to be twice as good as them to get half of what they have.
More than simply a family motto, the sentiment is one with which almost every African-American of my generation and before is all t00 familiar. Notice the them and the they — that’s white folks. The you is every black kid who has ever brought home a bad grade or failed to study hard enough for a test being told by their concerned parents that they might never succeed if they don’t work harder and smarter than their white peers. (See: “Twice as Good: Condoleeza Rice and Her Path to Power.”) Maybe not everyone will accept this assertion as true, but in “Scandal’s” choppy ocean of absurdity, it felt like rock-hard reality.”
salon.com/2013/10/04/scandals_racially_charged_motto_you_have_to_be_twice_as_good_as_them/
Keith G
@the Conster:
One of the points I most admire about Barak Obama is that he would not think such a thing.
Jewish Steel
And if you’re a black guitarist…
trollhattan
“Jesus died for somebody’s sins, but not mine.” Patti Smith lives the dream and sings Happy Birthday to the Dalai Lama at Glastonbury.
mdblanche
By a margin that Europe now appears Hell-bent on widening…
Some people know how to create their own luck.
somethingblue
@TG Chicago:
Yes. He gives a terrific speech (when he’s not asserting that the government has to tighten its belt just like your family), and he’s been a better president than we probably deserve. But what exactly did he contribute to either same-sex marriage or getting rid of the battle flag of the pretended Confederate States–aside from getting on the bandwagon way, way late on the former and endorsing a move made by Nikki effing Haley on the latter?
I have been told for many years now that the bully pulpit is a fantasy and you can’t blame the president for anything except foreign policy, and now suddenly he’s responsible for the weather.
joel hanes
The best person to be President in my lifetime.
One of the smartest and most skillful politicians of his time.
The best President of my lifetime.
Incredible accomplishments.
But not perfect.
Arne Duncan is a complete disaster.
Goblue72
@TG Chicago: 2014, 2013, 2012…
We don’t have the best economy in the world. The World Economic Forum’s ranking of Global Competitiveness ranks us 3rd, behind Singapore & Switzerland. On a per capita GDP basis, using PPP and expressed via Geary-Khamis dollars, we are ranked 10th by both the World Bank and IMF. On a nominal dollar basis per capita, we are…10th.
During the Great Recession and out of it, several countries performed better than the U.S. – particularly Canada and Australia. Canada’s recession was mild – only 7 months. Australia didn’t even have a recession – and hasn’t had one in 24 years.
But let’s not let facts get in the way of national jingoism.
the Conster
@Keith G:
He’ll not get enough credit that’s for sure. He has just (mostly) guided us through a historical paradigm shift with that steady temperament and all the right words. I feel like I’ve borne witness to our Lincoln.
Yatsuno
Shit still getting real in Hellas.
Gimlet
What he showed this week at the eulogy was the leader he could have been.
Germy Shoemangler
@Goblue72:
In one his letters, James Thurber quotes the expatriated Charlie Chaplin as saying, “All that America can be proud of is a balanced cat diet.”
Robert Sneddon
@mdblanche: A couple of years ago I had to point out to a “U!S!A!” type that in fact the EU had the greatest GDP on the planet, exceeding the US’ GDP by a small amount. I don’t know if it’s still true.
MobiusKlein
I’ve got a number of friends unhappy with B.O. for not being progressive enough, etc.
anything that happens good, he didn’t do it fast enough.
magurakurin
@Germy Shoemangler: maybe an even better response to Vitter
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Yeah, not to start the old flame wars (I’m all for Hillary till somebody shows me the stronger candidate), but there were any number of times when Obama ignored the CW when HRC, under the tutelage of “political mastermind” of a husband (impeached but not convicted! He knows how to fight Republicans and win!) would have embraced it. The calls to join McCain in “suspending my campaign” (in ’08) to stop picking on Wall St (’12) come to mind.
Jesus fucking christ. You’d think that was the only speech he ever gave the way the Disappoint Junkies flog it. And in your mind it cancels out the more than one trillion dollars (including the auto bailout, which he did alone) in deficit-spending stimulus.
magurakurin
but the real issue at hand here….Is the “A Guy” troll a DougJ parody troll?
catclub
@Jewish Steel:
Tim Duncan may be an exception to this rule. The Big Fundamental, can’t jump over a sheet of paper, as his coach says.
magurakurin
@somethingblue: basically, the liberal position on Confederate Flag or battle flags has been opposition to their flying on government property since, you know, forever. That you suggest Nikki Haley is leading the charge against something liberals having been calling a disgrace for decades….hmmm cough cough ratfucker cough cough
Elizabelle
I heart Joe Biden. He was a surprise guest at Mother Emanuel this morning. NY Times story.
catclub
@TG Chicago:
2008 comes to mind.
somethingblue
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Yeah, it was just the State of the Union address. In 2010. No biggie.
mai naem mobile
Barack Obama really is a once in a lifetime candidate and its it huge pity that the GOP has not only massively overly obstructed him but they’ve frothed up their base into a Frankenstein monster that they can’t even control.
somethingblue
@magurakurin: Can you point me to a statement Obama made on the topic before the shooting?
Happy to wait while you google.
DougJ
@catclub:
Kareem was a slow nerdy guy who wore glasses and could barely make it down the court towards the end but was also possibly the greatest offensive player ever.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@somethingblue: and the Stimulus could have been bigger if he really wanted it! We had sixty votes! I’ve been betraaaaayed. Shit sandwich! Veal pen! Under the bus!
Is this the part where you tell us you personally won Virginia, California or Florida for Obama? Or that you stayed home in righteous and noble Disappointment over Donnie McLurkin?
Give our love to Fire Dog Lake.
DougJ
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
And he should have used reconciliation.
Kropadope
@somethingblue:
Can you tell me an office that Barack Obama held where the Confederate flag displayed on government grounds? If not, why is this a particularly relevant issue for him?
Suzanne
This NBA playoffs, actually, there was a striking counterpoint to this. And DougJ is right, and it was so rare that I noticed. The sports commentators Would. Not. Shut. Up. about Steph Curry’s work ethic, how he practices every single shot over and over and over, from all over the court. This was the first time that they made comment on a black player’s work ethic, even though they all must be fanatical in order to get that great.
I love Steph Curry. Not in small part because I love Riley.
Geoduck
@DougJ:
” I think you’re the greatest, but my dad says you don’t work hard enough on defense.
And he says that lots of times, you don’t even run down court. And that you don’t really try… except during the playoffs.”
“The hell I don’t! LISTEN, KID! I’ve been hearing that crap ever since I was at UCLA. I’m out there busting my buns every night! Tell your old man to drag Walton and Lanier up and down the court for 48 minutes!”
DougJ
@Geoduck:
One of my favorite scenes ever!
somethingblue
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Dude, I said that he’s been a better president than we probably deserve.
He is not Jesus, and he did not bring us same-sex marriage (there are a lot of other people who deserve our thanks for that). Nor did he contribute particularly to the disfavor in which the Confederate flag is, as of this past week, held. (And thank heavens, since apparently shooting nine innocent people is what it took to do it.)
As for Nikki Haley, I yield to no one in my distaste for her. ‘Kay?
Now, if you’ll excuse me, those rats aren’t going to fuck themselves.
different-church-lady
Look, don’t even waste your energy. They are going to stop their little feet and hold their breath until they’re blue and leave the party once a month no matter who does what. Yeah, a little “told ya!” feels good, but it isn’t going to change their minds one single bit. Because in the end it’s not about Obama — it’s about them
DLC +1 really strong one
ETA: And I’m saying this as someone who thinks he’s actually getting too much credit for the marriage equity win.
the Conster
@Gimlet:
What he described at the eulogy was the path to take if we’re ever going to reconcile our history. But sure, blame Obama for not making everyone follow him.
RSA
And hard work. Here’s a brief history of an idea that I think best comes across in dialog:
Jim, Foolish Literalist
But first you felt compelled to make that stupid, sniveling reference to “tighten out belts”, and then you repeated it, and still can’t acknowledge any anti-austerity measures, because you’re an asshole-Disappointment junkie.
@Gimlet: Yes. A better speech would have made Joe Lieberman a holy crusader for single payer. Two better speeches would have made Claire McCaskill appoint Krugman as her top economic adviser.
Tommy
@somethingblue: I don’t want to start a pissing match but what you said. Obama didn’t do many of the things we saw in the last week. People far better than myself decided to fight and they did. Then things happened. Not sure Obama can take credit for them.
redshirt
Yeah this is all great but I STILL don’t have a unicorn.
CaseyL
This week was a balm: so much good news, so much schadenfreude, so much laughter (thanks, CNN!). FSM knows we needed a few important victories to energize for the next go-round.
Another week of really good news would be nice. Just sayin.
different-church-lady
@redshirt: This candy isn’t going to poop itself.
the Conster
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Wouldn’t you know that Obama’s best week ever would bring out all the “if only he’d done it exactly my way but he didn’t so he’s a failure” fucktards. You know what fucktards? Run for president and report back after you’ve done it better.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@the Conster: DougJ posts do seem to draw them out. A twitter thing maybe?
Hey, dumbfuck asshole @somethingblue: how did you get here, if you don’t mind my asking?
somethingblue
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Also I’m looking at you funny. :-p
As to your last question, I’ve been a (very) occasional commenter for some years. While I don’t share your idolatry of BHO, we are, ultimately, on the same side. Be well.
Punchy
@DougJ: Ummm…no.
Gin & Tonic
Just finished a (very) late dinner. Seems like time for pie.
Penus
@DougJ: You drag Lanier up and down the court for 48 minutes!
Penus
@Geoduck: Dammit. Full credit.
Origuy
@Kropadope:
Barack Obama hasn’t fixed the pothole in front of my house. Some leader HE is!
Tommy
@Penus: I am 5’4 on a good day. I played every sport. Parents thought basketball would be a good idea. I was not so good at it. Did I say I am 5’4. Oh and I can’t jump much.
different-church-lady
@Origuy: What I want to know is what about the squirrels?
Gin & Tonic
@different-church-lady: Did you notice Chicago has black squirrels? Coincidence?
ruemara
Can’t read all of this stuff, still recovering from kickboxing, but I will say, Doug, the amount of times I’m considered very astute for someone with no college degree, is often amazing.
FYI, I have a double major BA and attended NYU. Um, yeah, thanks for the compliment. And it’s not even an intentional backhand.
different-church-lady
@efgoldman: No, the squirrels! I’ve called the city five times, and they don’t do anything about them!
Kerry Reid
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Thank you. Very well put. The horrifying levels of obstruction and hate and racist rhetoric thrown at him more than overshadows, IMO, for whatever luck he had in opponents. And let us remember that he defeated the Clinton machine in 2008. Yes, she had some serious missteps — but she was hardly a lightweight.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@different-church-lady: and my red Swingline stapler
Ben
@Origuy:
You jest, but somewhere there is a manic progressive in Chicago who will blame Obama for his potholes BECAUSE RAHM!!!
Cervantes
@Tommy:
And to be fair, it’s not that he’s trying to take credit for them.
different-church-lady
@Cervantes: He goes out on the TVs and says they are good things and IT’S JUST THE SAME AS!
Gin & Tonic
@different-church-lady: THE SAME AS!
Made me think of this weirdness. (What sounds like “is” to Americans is the word “as”.)
Omnes Omnibus
@Tommy: He appointed two of the Justices who decided the Supreme Court cases.
Tao of Nope
This post. X 1000.
Thanks Doug. I may bookmark this for days to come.
somethingblue
@Omnes Omnibus: A fair point. There have been plenty of areas where he’s been disappointing, but SCOTUS appointments are not one.
Cervantes
@Omnes Omnibus:
Sure, and by that token you-know-who-else deserves credit for those decisions.
Omnes Omnibus
@somethingblue: There has never been, and will never be, a politician who has/does not disappoint me one some way. If one judges on that scale everyone ever is a failure.
cmorenc
Progressive purity ponies about the ACA vs single payer conveniently forget that in addition to the entire Republican senate caucus being quite deliberately treacherous and uncooperative while health care reform was being considered back in 2009, but Obama had to put up with treacherous assholes like Joe Lieberman, Ben Nelson, and Blanche Lincoln within his own party. Plus a chairman of the critical Senate Committee handling the legislation, John Melcher, who was not only in the pocket of the big health insurance companies, but getting his ass repeatedly snookered by the GOP senators on his committee pretending to work toward a consensus. And that because of the unfortunately timed death of Ted Kennedy and the astoundingly incompetent campaign Martha Coakley ran against Scott Brown to replace him, the ACA would never have become law had Brown not somehow been coaxed to get on-board. Did I mention that Joe Lieberman was a treacherous snake who undermined his own caucus’s efforts to reach consensus at manly critical points along the way, excepting only the final version that passed? I think I did, but it bears repetition since purity ponies seem to to be stubbornly resistant to remembering and acknowledging that.
SINGLE PAYER WOULD NEVER HAVE PASSED CONGRESS IN 2009 – that’s the irrefutable reality. And so we are lucky as fuck that the ACA, with all its imperfections, has turned out in the end to work as splendidly as it has.
Omnes Omnibus
@Cervantes: Sure, he appointed one guy who occasionally manages to do the right thing, but he also appointed one who never does.
cckids
@Cervantes:
Also too, I do give him credit for standing back & letting momentum work. Given the torrent of “if he’s for it I’m agin’ it” that rains down whenever the President takes a stand, it probably helped that he wasn’t the loudest voice in the room.
different-church-lady
@cckids: Still waiting/hoping for him to take that stand against drinking drain cleaner.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
a staffer to the chair? which was Baucus, no? if memory serves, and it used to, Baucus originally proposed a plan that included a public option, and let that plan die because he didn’t want to hurt his great working friendship with Grassley, who was already babbling about pulling the plug on Grandma. By the time the bill got out of committee, hadn’t Baucus turned on the public option?
Also, I’d only disagree with you about Lieberman, Nelson and Lincoln. Lieberman, I believe, was acting out of spite. I think Nelson and Lincoln were (are) quite sincerely stupid.
Kerry Reid
@cmorenc: I believe even Bernie Sanders acknowledged that there were, at best, maybe 8 votes in the Senate for single payer. Oh, and Obama didn’t campaign on single payer. And Canada took 30 years to evolve their system and it didn’t happen overnight.
FlipYrWhig
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: the woulda coulda shoulda I go back to is this: after Grassley made an ass-ley of himself, why didn’t the energies of the progressive blogosphere and like-minded entities go into DEFEATING GRASSLEY IN IOWA A STATE OBAMA WON TWICE. Aargh.
slag
@somethingblue:
I’m curious just who you think nominates justices to the Supreme Court. Diana Ross?
NobodySpecial
@Omnes Omnibus:
Ah, but here’s the rub: If one mentions, say, that President Obama has disappointed on one issue or another, you are buried under a tidal avalanche of posts about unicorns, ponies, and hippie-punching. The only reason I don’t expect better from a large swath of the commentariat is because I realize that they were the ones voting against folks like Mondale in the 80’s. Gets a bit old after a while.
Omnes Omnibus
@NobodySpecial: Oh, that’s complete bullshit. I have posted numerous comments about my disagreements with Obama on education policy and now on trade. No one has done that to me. On the ACA, the administration got the best result possible under the circumstances. And anyone who still has not accepted that is rather blind to reality. FWIW, I am not a Democratic convert. But I am willing to take a win. We’ve had some wins recently. Is there room for improvement? Sure. Should we fight for that improvement? Fuck yeah. Is this a good weekend for the good guys? Fucking aye! Take the wins, enjoy them, and then move on to the next fight. Honestly, your delicate feelings don’t matter all that much.
policomic
If there were a way to sort of slip that last paragraph under the door of some of my “progressive” Facebook friends…
J R in WV
@ruemara:
Good one, Ruemara! Very good one!
You were probably lazy, too, like me… that’s how to get onna Dean’s list, right? /snark
I have a ton of respect for the things I know about you and your work ethic.
And I have a truck-load of respect for the work and bravery President Obama displays every day of his life in the D.C. Because he is in danger every minute while the despicable Republicans rage with falsehoods and bigotry about his proposals and work.
Tree With Water
“It’s why I have no patience with WHY CAN’T HE LEAD “centrist” assholes and the HE SOLD US OUT ON THE PUBLIC OPTION manic progressives. Progress is progress”.
You want to hear hosannas sung by a 50 state choir that will ring through the land in praise of….. a politician. I would think the votes accrued by Obama that secured him a second term should have been praise enough. But you want to see him hip-hip-hoorayed by adoring supporters because you love the guy that much. Which is a ridiculous expectation, given the decades worth of two party dysfunction that ran has the country into the ditch we currently find ourselves in. People views about presidents and politicians have been crushed by bitter disappointments and outright betrayals for too long for it to be otherwise. And that’s not going to change anytime soon, is it? Certainly not in the next 16 months.
AxelFoley
@JPL:
rikyrah’s actually agreeing with Doug.
Omnes Omnibus
@Tree With Water: You, sir, are a bit of a moron. Just sayin’.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Myself, I’m only interested in a realistic debate based in the realities of our political system, and our politics, not infantile screeching or counter-factuals based in cult-of-the-Presidency fantasies that make Ron Fournier look smart. Obama did once say something stupid about “tightening our belts”, after he signed an $800 billion dollar stimulus bill (that was the biggest that could get through a Dem controlled Congress), and single handedly committed another (IIRC) $250 million to bailing out the auto industry, a move that saved, if not the entire American economy, a great many jobs; and jobs are the point of stimulus, not scoring political points or being able to make your right-wing brother-in-law or uncle as mad as you were (I was) in the Bush years. Single payer, a robust public option, fine things, but there were by my count at least twelve Democratic senators who were never going to vote for even the PO, much less SP, and more than a few more who were grateful that those twelve saved them from having to vote. “Banksters in jail”? should’ve happened, I think, but that’s assuming a great deal about prosecutors, grand jury, trial jury, appeals process, lawyers…. etc.
My own biggest disappointment with Obama has to do with the NSA/FISA/domestic spying, call it what you will. I can’t for the life of me understand how the “devil’s advocate” provision threatens national security. I don’t think of it in terms of transparency, but accountability. I want a paper trail, even if it’s one that I as a civilian can’t see; I want checks and balances. I think putting even chained CPI “on the table” in the quest for a grand bargain was bad politics and bad policy, but it wasn’t “shredding the New Deal”, and we don’t know what Obama would have gotten in return. I think Republican intransigence saved him from himself there, as with Keystone, where I think he was also too willing to cut a deal. People who know more about the issue than I say Arne Duncan and ‘race to the top’ suck. Same with TPP: People I trust and respect say it’s a bad deal, but I don’t think Obama’s arguments are completely without merit.
If you, or anyone, have a problem with Obama, fine. I’ve got a couple myself, but typing a few buzzword-laden phrases (public option! the stimulus was too small! banksters in jail!) or name-checking the Evil Ones (Geithner, Summers, RAHM!)… these are not arguments, IMHO, they are tantrums.
what issue? One ought to mention something besides that thing Obama said that time, or that thing he didn’t say, or if he had made a speech, or, god help us, as I once saw posted at Eschaton and I truly don’t believe the poster was kidding, if Obama had used FBI and NSA files to blackmail members of Congress… Tell me what could have been different. Tell me what bill could have gotten a different vote.
RK
“Historic health care reform legislation, historic advances in marriage equality rights, Confederate flags coming down over statehouses, the best economy in the world…FUCK YEAH.”
You’re funny or drunk. Obama came out late for gay marriage, has nothing to do with the Confederate flag (maybe you want to temper your enthusiasm considering a mass murder is involved) and best economy for whom? As to health care, credit is due because it passed but any Democrat with that super majority could’ve, and would’ve, done the same.
Bobby Thomson
@TG Chicago:
The key turning point was when his DOJ took the position that restrictions on gay marriage should be subject to strict scrutiny. One can legitimately fault him for the DOJ continuing to defend DOMA long after its sell date, but in the end he got to the right place.
robert
Celebrating what happened last week isn’t about Obama per se. It’s about building momentum and enthusiasm for our side. Jumping in to say “not good enough” every time we have a victory isn’t helpful. Positivity is more powerful than negativity.
notoriousJRT
@somethingblue:
I think PBO is a silk purse. You keep on with your mission to turn him into a sow’s ear. But your reasoning is both tiresome & unconvincing.
David Koch
notoriousJRT
@Bobby Thomson:
Let’s not forget the ending of “don’t ask. Don’t tell” and open service. Gay and lesbian individuals serving openly (and marrying) was a big step in bringing along public support for marriage equality. Not done by fiat as Dan Chow may have wanted, but done in a way that made it no big wup. Acceptance rather than crippling backlash. And we kept moving forward.
David Koch
@somethingblue:
You’re a retard, right. You have to be to not know he appointed two of the justices who ruled in favor of SSM and he reversed the government from defending DOMA and turned the full weight of the DOJ and the Solicitor General’s office in favor of marriage.
Of course you don’t read the papers or legal briefs or transcripts of oral arugments.
David Koch
@TG Chicago: you’re a retard, as well. you have to be not to remember him repealing DADT and what I said above. But based on your long time comments, we’ve known you’re a sad sack emoprog loser.
What he said.
David Koch
@TG Chicago: @somethingblue:
Even Glenn thinks you two are morons.
White Trash Liberal
@somethingblue:
I think you are also forgetting that Obama appointed the Joint Chiefs to review DADT, and all branches of the military voluntarily chose to allow gays to serve freely in the military. That was huge. And well politicked. And was criticized by the hair shirt progressives.
Obama took several calculated risks that helped usher in this radical change.
bystander
Today Moanin’ Joe was remonstrating over Obama’s disguising his real agenda. The crafty Kenyan was planning to legalize SSM and was lulling the dumb Dems by endorsing only civil unions during his campaign. Not only was Obummer late to endorse SSM – he was lying all along!
And let’s not forget that HRC used her stern femgaze to make Bill sign DOMA. It was as if she signed it into law herself. And let’s never mention that the first fight Bill had with the repukes was when he banned discrimination against gays and lesbians in service. IIRC.
NobodySpecial
@Omnes Omnibus: Yeah, YOU weren’t slammed like that. I was from the beginning of the Obamacare debate, simply for pointing out that the subsidies were going to hurt me – and they did. Celebration is one thing; bulldozing (and bullshitting) are another.
AxelFoley
I swear, emoprogs just don’t know how to fuckin take the damn win. I’ll be glad when President Obama’s term is up in 2017, just so you sorry ass fuckers get screwed by the next person in the White House. Bernie will never get the nomination, Hillary will give you her ass to kiss, and any GOPer will tell you to go fuck yourselves while they destroy the country more than W did.
jafd
Well, if you look back to October of ’08, note that Obama’s nationwide TV pitch ended up being broadcast right before the resumption of a rain-interrupted World Series game between teams from Pennsylvania and Florida…
If that don’t prove he’s lucky – AS WELL AS GREAT – I don’t know what does.
different-church-lady
@David Koch: When you’ve lost Glenn Greenwald you’ve lost… well, you’ve lost Glenn Greenwald.
Kay
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
The campaign to sell the TPP was the most dishonest thing I’ve seen come out of the Obama Administration. They shut down legitimate questions in a coordinated campaign and not only ignored loyal allies, they attempted to discredit them personally.
From the launch at Nike to today, they have sold this thing dishonestly up to and including taking credit for a trade adjustment program that has been in place since 1974.
Obama is getting tons of political media credit right now but a chunk of that is due to his pushing his trade bill, which 90% of major media pundits supported although they have LITERALLY not read it. He said “free trade” and they jumped onboard.
They weren’t even honest about the most basic process issues- fast track means passage. People should have been told that.
Bill
@Gimlet: I loved the part of the eulogy where he said god used a psychopathic racist to murder nine people.
He was very inspiring, but I just can’t get past people “worshipping” an entity like that.
LAC
@AxelFoley: lol! Well, we do have a crowd of emoprog face- savers in this crowd. “Yeah, but…” will be on their tombstones, along with a frowny face. Things have moved forward during this man’s presidency but instead of thinking about keeping the momentum, we have those that are invested in replaying how a public option was viable ( despite monumental opposition) or how the president should have blah, blah…. To me, a lack of realism and broad thinking in the emoprog wing puts a genuine progressive movement in danger of being nothing more than reactive back patting source of online outrage that is on the sidelines. We cannot afford that.
Spanky
@Gimlet: I’m really sick and tired of reading that carp. Every time he does something that you don’t agree with it’s he’s not living up to his potential. When he does what you like it’s this is the man I voted for. Did you really believe that he really is the Magic Negro?
sublime33
As an Obama supporter, I do think supporters get a bit defensive about him being lucky. Damn right he was lucky, just like George W. Bush was lucky his brother lost the Florida governorship and Tom Brady was lucky Russell Wilson’s pass was picked off at the goal line. If Karl Rove and his minions didn’t try to exact revenge on Senator Peter Fitzgerald for recommending Patrick Fitzgerald as a special prosecutor, Peter Fitzgerald doesn’t walk and Barack Obama is still in the Illinois General Assembly. Successful people take advantage of breaks that fall their way and don’t get defeated by obstacles in their path.
lethargytartare
@Cervantes:
Clinton & Reagan?
MCA1
@RK: Good god, how short is your memory? Of all the things said in this now dead thread, this has got to be the most willfully obtuse: “As to health care, credit is due because it passed but any Democrat with that super majority could’ve, and would’ve, done the same.”
You have got to be fucking kidding me. Other than Nancy Pelosi and a few select others, practically every Democrat in Congress at the time was (a) terrified of addressing health insurance, and (b) complaining that he was wasting his political capital on the issue while more important matters needed to be addressed by that supermajority, like passing GOP-friendly tax breaks. The Village crucified him for not spending every waking moment working on saving the economy with Republican policy, while conveniently forgetting about the entire concept of walking while chewing gum at the same time. Were you actually in the United States in 2009?
RK
@MCA1: Practically every democrat was terrified? Do have numbers on that? Healthcare was central to the Democratic platform. primaries, campaign and was ripe for the picking after a historically miserable Bush era and a super majority in place.
RK
Wanted to add that there’s nothing I’ve read or seen to demonstrate that Obama’s political acumen, or lack thereof, was central to the ACA passing.
LAC
@RK: really? So do you think made it work since the president had absolutely nothing to do with its initial passage? Keebler elves? The A Team? Batman and the boy wonder?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@RK: Um… he got elected? and did so building the coalition that more than likely made that Senate supermajority– all 40-some days of it, IIRC– possible (Franken, at least, ETA: Hagen, probably, maybe Shaheen)
lethargytartare
@RK:
60-39 for cloture only after making concessions to Ben Nelson and Joe fvcking Lieberman. That’s zero votes to spare, if you’re counting.
that’s be the platform drafted at Obama’s nomination, right?
not for red-state dems, or republicans at all, who then decided to oppose any healthcare bill in favor of making Obama a one-term presisdent.
lethargytartare
@RK:
not surprising, given there’s not a lot about the ACA in the comics section of USA Today.
David Koch
@RK: you emoprog/firebaggers are a bunch of idiots.
At the time Barney was the most liberal member of congress and one of the most powerful members of the caucus and though he had a rock solid seat in deep, deep blue Massachusetts, even he was pissing his pants and cutting and running.
Kucinich said the same thing on msnbc. the hard core liberals were scared shitless of the issue.
Kerry Reid
@David Koch: And there were a lot of people inside his administration — including Emanuel and Biden — who told him to forget about doing healthcare reform once the economy had tanked.
So yeah, I think I’m comfortable with giving the president and Nancy Pelosi a shit-ton of credit for ACA.
RK
Where’s the number on those who were terrified? Oh. Did Frank or Kuncinich say they were terrified to vote for the bill? Oh. That Emmanuel and Biden, or others, felt a bill should wait doesn’t mean they didn’t think one wasn’t doable later or that others disagreed with their view. Now, could you give me the address where you guys buy the Obama Pom-poms you seem so attached to?
David Koch
@Kay:
None of the people I saw were attributing his historic week to TPP. YMMV
David Koch
@RK: you’re a born loser.
you start out saying Obama wasn’t central to Obamacare (which is stoopid to begin with). we show that the most senior and power members were against it, which obvious demonstrates that it was passed over their objections. and you say, well, they were only against at the time it passed, but they would have done it later. yes. exactly. they were against it at the time it passed. that’s the whole point, you blithering idiot.
now, fuck off and die. I’m done with you.
Kerry Reid
@David Koch: No, see — you’re glib. The whole point was to KILL THE BILL so all the pants-wetters who didn’t want to vote “at that time” would be EMPOWERED to come back in the NEXT Congress, after healthcare reform had already been mud-slung as a socialist granny-killing plot, to pass single payer with all those NEW votes that were going to emerge after the midterms! I mean, surely you can see why that’s a sensible assumption.
Kerry Reid
@RK: Can you name a signature accomplishment of Bernie Sanders’ in the Senate – not a speech or a filibuster, but an actual bill he sponsored and shepherded through to law that has had a significant impact?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Kerry Reid: I’m getting more of a PUMA whiff off of this one. Still bitter after all of these years.
RK
I said I’ve seen nothing to demonstrate Obama’s political acumen was central (seems to me this bill was largely left to the hands of Congress) or that another President with the same super majority and moment couldn’t have passed their own bill. You haven’t shown most Democrats were terrified nor that most leaders were against it only that a few thought it should be shelved for a while.
Born loser and your other angry, desperate insults really lack any bite or wit. (I wonder why dat.) Okay, be back in a month or so to make fun of this cheerleader squad whose captain was for the war in Iraq cause murca,
BTW, someone call when you give Obama credit for the Citizens United decision.
LAC
@RK: back in a month? Oh heavens, how will we ever live without your wit?
How do you do it?
Btw, your ability to see anything over your ass is probably an issue you need to take up with your doctor.