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You are here: Home / 51 vs 60 for a wall?

51 vs 60 for a wall?

by David Anderson|  December 21, 201810:36 am| 220 Comments

This post is in: All Too Normal, All we want is life beyond the thunderdome

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The president wants Senator Majority Leader McConnell to give away his biggest tool if/when he is in the minority for a $5 billion appropriation and little else.

A statement by the President: pic.twitter.com/FBuoHj4sDD

— Real Press Sec. (@RealPressSecBot) December 21, 2018

Tierney-Sneed at TPM makes the immediately relevant point:

$5 billion in wall money for the elimination of the biggest obstacle to Dems’ legislative agenda if they win back White House and Senate seems like … kind of a good deal for progressives?

— Tierney Sneed (@Tierney_Megan) December 21, 2018

We can be fairly certain that after 1/4/19, there will be no more wall appropriations going through the House. A working 51 vote Senate will only pass bills for the White House to sign that Nancy Pelosi approves.

One of the major discontinuities in legislative procedure is that enacting administratively complex programs that have major policy imperatives in it currently are not able to go through reconciliation. These bills can be fillibustered and stopped with a 41 vote minority. Medicare for All and/or the Affordable Care Act, the Green New Deal, the new Voting Rights and Civil Rights Acts that are all on the Democratic agenda’s first page once they get a trifecta currently require sixty votes in the Senate. The major Republican policy priorities of confirming Federalist Society judges, and upper income tax cuts can be passed with fifty one votes in either regular order or reconciliation. Additionally, fifty one votes is all that is needed to defund major programs as we saw with Skinny Repeal, Graham-Cassidy, AHCA, and BCRA.

Trading a $5 billion appropriation for a wall that will slowly if ever be built in order to get a 51 vote Senate is a very good deal for Democrats and liberals especially if they aren’t being blamed for the nuclear option. It takes away some of the counter-majoritarian and anti-democratic structures that limit liberal and urban power and opens up opportunity space.

Anyone who thinks about the structure of American politics will see this in under three sips of coffee. And that is why I have no expectation that the Senate Majority Leader will burn one of his most effective tools he used as a Minority Leader for effectively piffle.

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Reader Interactions

220Comments

  1. 1.

    mapaghimagsik

    December 21, 2018 at 10:41 am

    Doesn’t this kind of assume we can expect good-faith dealing? It seems there is no deal they won’t break? Literally, they say “No we didn’t” minutes after they did. So I’m not sure how you make a deal work.

  2. 2.

    kindness

    December 21, 2018 at 10:42 am

    No! Because we still have 2 years of this Congress starting in January. The damage they could do without a filibuster would be impossible to fix.

  3. 3.

    oldster

    December 21, 2018 at 10:42 am

    Agreed: McConnell ain’t going to fall for this.

    On the other hand, it *will* piss of Trump and get him to say a lot of rude things about McConnell. And that in turn will alienate the Senate Repubs just that little bit further. So that’s good.

    I wonder how Nancy could have made such a beginner’s mistake as telling Trump that he wouldn’t have enough votes in the House? She’s a notoriously canny vote-counter. You don’t suppose she might have miscounted? Or misspoken? Or maybe just goaded the loathsome sh*t into running full-tilt into this particular brick wall?

  4. 4.

    JPL

    December 21, 2018 at 10:43 am

    Why not wait until they have control of the Senate? The one thing they could get passed now is protection for Mueller.

  5. 5.

    moonbat

    December 21, 2018 at 10:43 am

    Jeez, that’s tempting I have to say.

  6. 6.

    JPL

    December 21, 2018 at 10:46 am

    @oldster: They were able to get the votes in the house, because they were assured it was a meaningless vote.

  7. 7.

    tobie

    December 21, 2018 at 10:47 am

    @oldster: I hate to say it but we were burned on this. House Republicans decided it was more important to sock it to Nancy Pelosi than to stand up for country and the government and pass a continuing resolution that both parties would support. Here’s the roll call for yesterday’s vote. Departing House members like Leonard Lance and Ryan Costello who pose as moderates on TV all voted for the budget bill with $5 billion for Wall, ‘cuz even moderate GOPers would be happy to see the country burn if it hurts Democrats.

  8. 8.

    David Anderson

    December 21, 2018 at 10:48 am

    @kindness:
    No we have 2 more weeks of this Congress. On 1/3/19, we have a new Congress. That Congress has Nancy Smash in a veto holding position.

    a 51 vote Senate is irrelevant in what passes and gets to the White House compared to a 60 vote Senate. Anything that gets to the White House will be in an agreement zone that contains Nancy Pelosi+most if not all of the Dem. House Caucus + Mitch McConnell + most if not all of the Senate GOP caucus + a few Democratic Senators

    That is the minimal viable budget passing coalition with a 60 vote Senate. A 51 vote Senate makes it:

    Nancy Pelosi+most if not all of the Dem. House Caucus + Mitch McConnell + most if not all of the Senate GOP caucus

    The only way that this is pragmatically different than the 60 vote Senate is either marginally OR if you think that Nancy Pelosi’s agreement zone is significantly to the right of the 7-9 Democratic Senators who were needed in the other minimal viable coalition.

    I am assuming that anything that does meet the Speaker Pelosi’s agreement zone will be good enough for at least a dozen Democratic Senators to vote for it.

  9. 9.

    Quinerly

    December 21, 2018 at 10:48 am

    @oldster: I, too, have pondered how Nancy made the mistake in her count. Rain into a buzz saw on a thread saying that I needed to read the transcript from 12/11. So I did. Still had the same takeaway.

  10. 10.

    Mary G

    December 21, 2018 at 10:49 am

    @oldster: I think she was baiting him into a shutdown that he will be held solely responsible for. Also to piss off Mitch, who has half the Senate already at home and some may not come back. Flake, Heller, and Corker have no reason to.

  11. 11.

    Quinerly

    December 21, 2018 at 10:49 am

    @tobie: thanks for posting the roll call. I meant to pull it up last night.

  12. 12.

    The Dangerman

    December 21, 2018 at 10:50 am

    …biggest tool…

    I agree.

    Oh, you didn’t mean a person. My bad. More coffee for this West Coaster.

  13. 13.

    hueyplong

    December 21, 2018 at 10:50 am

    Tierney seems to be ignoring the “good deal for progressives” that would come from a Trump-Turtle falling out.

  14. 14.

    rikyrah

    December 21, 2018 at 10:50 am

    No way the Turtle goes for this.

  15. 15.

    Repatriated

    December 21, 2018 at 10:50 am

    @Quinerly: She was also including the Senate, assumimg the filibuster remained intact.

  16. 16.

    Lee

    December 21, 2018 at 10:51 am

    I’ve been kicking around a tag to use for when Republicans run for re-election in 2020.

    Something that indicates they could have prevented the shit show we are now dealing with.

    Something like ‘Where We You When We Needed You’.

    That’s too long, maybe BJer’s can come up with something a little more pithy.

  17. 17.

    dmsilev

    December 21, 2018 at 10:51 am

    Mitch McConnell falls thoroughly into the evil-not-stupid bin. I really doubt he’d take that deal.

  18. 18.

    David Anderson

    December 21, 2018 at 10:53 am

    @dmsilev:

    Hatch, Alexander, and Flake have all said in past few minutes that they will not vote to end the filibuster. It’s not going to happen. And the Senate voting for $5 billion for the wall? Not going to happen. https://t.co/e5CCrvoPvt

    — Bob Doherty (@BobDohertyACP) December 21, 2018

  19. 19.

    dmsilev

    December 21, 2018 at 10:53 am

    @Quinerly: A thought: The House GOP treated yesterday’s vote as similar to the endless Obamacare repeal votes in 2013-2016. A message proclaiming their intent, while knowing full well they’d never have to answer for the consequences since it would never become law. Posturing, in other words. Pelosi, being a more serious person, discounted the GOP’s desire for one last posturing gesture.

  20. 20.

    Repatriated

    December 21, 2018 at 10:55 am

    @dmsilev: He might do it as a “one-time good deal”, though that would be meaningless since the power to do it once implies the power to do it at any time.

  21. 21.

    dmsilev

    December 21, 2018 at 10:55 am

    @David Anderson: Yeah, that’s the other thing. McConnell has a 51 vote majority to work with right now, and that includes Senator Kyl who I think may have already officially resigned, Senators who have left town for the holiday and might be slow getting back, Senators who don’t want to give up their filibustery privileges, etc. Even if he wanted to nuke the rules, I doubt he could.

  22. 22.

    Roger Moore

    December 21, 2018 at 10:56 am

    @kindness:

    Because we still have 2 years of this Congress starting in January.

    No. We have a new Congress in January, and that new Congress has a Democratic majority in the House. That sharply limits how much legislative damage the Senate can do. They can do a lot of damage by confirming terrible Trump appointees, but the filibuster for those was already gone.

  23. 23.

    Quinerly

    December 21, 2018 at 10:57 am

    @dmsilev: A Dem Rep said last night that it was “an in your face move” to get at Pelosi.

  24. 24.

    hueyplong

    December 21, 2018 at 10:57 am

    When push comes to shove, Trump can’t afford to piss off the guy who could deliver an impeachment conviction. If Turtle won’t go for it, all Trump can do is sulk and tweet.

    Tell them to fuck off, Dems, so you can have the theater and the result. I

  25. 25.

    dmsilev

    December 21, 2018 at 10:57 am

    Preznit Numbnuts issues word-like things:

    @realDonaldTrump
    The Democrats are trying to belittle the concept of a Wall, calling it old fashioned. The fact is there is nothing else’s that will work, and that has been true for thousands of years. It’s like the wheel, there is nothing better. I know tech better than anyone, & technology…..

    Walls on wheels! Genius1

  26. 26.

    dmsilev

    December 21, 2018 at 10:58 am

    @Quinerly: Also a very plausible motive.

  27. 27.

    The Dangerman

    December 21, 2018 at 10:59 am

    @Lee:

    Something like ‘Where We You When We Needed You’

    “should have never played with 45”

    Extra Credit if you can fold in Russian Roul-ettte (let’s see if THAT gets the Moderation hammer) in there someplace.

  28. 28.

    Humdog

    December 21, 2018 at 11:00 am

    @dmsilev: I think you have it right here. Less crazy Rs who did not agree with the wall voted it for it here, symbolically, to underscore that there truly are no moderate or non crazy House Rs.

    OT, anyone know a way to read Eliza Dushku’s Boston Globe op ed without paying? Pretty crappy one cannot get even one article without forking over cash. They didn’t even pay her for the op ed but we have to pay them?

  29. 29.

    Spanky

    December 21, 2018 at 11:00 am

    And in case you were worried your vacation plans would be ruined by a shutdown:

    Visitors with holiday plans to visit the Grand Canyon will not have their hopes dashed in the event of a government shutdown, according to a statement from Arizona Gov. Doug Ducey:

    “Regardless of what happens in Washington, the Grand Canyon will not close on our watch. Arizona knows how to work together. We have a plan in place and we’re ready to go. If you have plans to visit the Grand Canyon over the weekend, keep ‘em. The Grand Canyon will remain open.”

    Of course, if you weren’t going to the Grand Canyon, I guess you’re still screwed.

  30. 30.

    SRW1

    December 21, 2018 at 11:00 am

    Very clever of Trump to open a distracting skirmish line with Senate Republicans. They sure will be thrilled.

  31. 31.

    chopper

    December 21, 2018 at 11:01 am

    @dmsilev:

    it’s 50-49 right now, as corker has clearly clocked out.

  32. 32.

    Mike in DC

    December 21, 2018 at 11:02 am

    If the filibuster is abolished, the go to move is to gain power in 2021, pass the top 5 most popular items on the policy agenda, survive the midterms due to base enthusiasm, then tackle the thornier items on the flipside heading into a more favorable presidential election.

  33. 33.

    MattF

    December 21, 2018 at 11:04 am

    The Grand Canyon will remain open.

    Hmm.

  34. 34.

    chopper

    December 21, 2018 at 11:05 am

    this shutdown basically ends on 1/3, once pelosi gets the gavel and sends a clean CR to the senate. at that point, given that the numbers are gonna be awful for trump and the GOP on this issue, mcconnell is gonna be on the hot seat. if it’s a choice between making trump happy and keeping his party from eating untold buckets of shit, he’ll pass it on up to trump to deal with.

  35. 35.

    patrick II

    December 21, 2018 at 11:06 am

    It’s too bad Steve Jobs is dead. I would have loved to see a one hour TV special of Steve and Donald talking technology. Two tech geniuses talking future technical advances would have been so enlightening. Maybe Gates could fill in.

  36. 36.

    tobie

    December 21, 2018 at 11:06 am

    If Flake and Alexander won’t vote to end the filibuster, and Murkowski is still in town to register a no vote, then the Senate will still need 60 votes to pass the CR with wall funding, which means the CR is dead. Can the Senate turn around and send back to the House the original CR proposal today? That would avert a shutdown.

  37. 37.

    Spanky

    December 21, 2018 at 11:06 am

    @MattF: I’d pay to watch them zip it up.

  38. 38.

    Betty Cracker

    December 21, 2018 at 11:07 am

    Looks like McConnell doesn’t have the votes. You make a great point about how burning the filibuster over a dumb wall just weeks before the Democrats take over the House would be disastrous for Republicans in the short term. But FSM help us if they ever regain control of the House — which they almost certainly will someday. The Senate will always be stacked against us thanks to the land-mass representation formula the Founders devised. Simple majority rule would’ve been catastrophic for the past two years and could be again in the future.

  39. 39.

    STW1

    December 21, 2018 at 11:10 am

    @Betty Cracker:

    McConnell doesn’t want to have the votes. Wonder how he persuaded Flake and Alexander to take the blame.

  40. 40.

    MattF

    December 21, 2018 at 11:10 am

    @Betty Cracker: Wasn’t there some woman who said exactly this… um, recently, in front of Trump, in the Oval Office?

  41. 41.

    Baud

    December 21, 2018 at 11:11 am

    @Betty Cracker: It’s not like that future Republican Congress wouldn’t always have the nuclear button in its back pocket.

  42. 42.

    Roger Moore

    December 21, 2018 at 11:12 am

    @Mike in DC:
    I think priority #1 when the Democrats retake the Senate and Presidency has to be a new, stronger VRA. That will do more than anything to help them win again the next election.

  43. 43.

    Baud

    December 21, 2018 at 11:12 am

    @tobie: I think the Senate CR is still in the House.

  44. 44.

    David Anderson

    December 21, 2018 at 11:15 am

    @Betty Cracker: Disagree — a 51 vote Senate was the relevant Senate for the major GOP agenda items of judges, tax cuts and cutting Medicaid. They were able to get 51 votes for the first two. And failed on the last one.

  45. 45.

    Fair Economist

    December 21, 2018 at 11:22 am

    If McConnell wanted to nuke the filibuster, he could probably get Democratic support and nuke it in spite of losing some Republicans. That said, he’s not stupid and he’s not going to do it. The filibuster is currently hugely advantageous to Republicans, because they have enough of an advantage in the state gerrymander that a 60 seat Democratic majority is almost impossible with the current politics.

  46. 46.

    tobie

    December 21, 2018 at 11:23 am

    @Baud: Thanks, that’s clarifying. The shutdown should fall on Paul Ryan, too. I really don’t see any difference between him and Devin Nunes. They’re both craven party hacks who would betray, and have betrayed, their country to advance the GOP. I’m glad Judge Sullivan used the word treason this week.

  47. 47.

    Fair Economist

    December 21, 2018 at 11:24 am

    @Baud: Properly, we now have a Senate bill and a House bill that are not the same, so we should proceed to a conference committee to work out a compromise.

    @tobie:

    The shutdown should fall on Paul Ryan, too.

    More than anybody. Trump is a wimp and if Ryan had just allowed the Senate bill to be voted on it would have passed and Trump would have just signed it.

  48. 48.

    germy

    December 21, 2018 at 11:25 am

    Even President Ronald Reagan tried for 8 years to build a Border Wall, or Fence, and was unable to do so. Others also have tried. We will get it done, one way or the other!— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) December 21, 2018

    “Rather than talking about putting up a fence, why don’t we work out some recognition of our mutual problems and make it possible for them to come here legally, with a work permit, and then while they are working and earning here, they pay taxes here.”
    – Ronald Reagan, 1980

  49. 49.

    Steeplejack

    December 21, 2018 at 11:34 am

    @Repatriated:

    Pelosi said (from the transcript of the December 11 meeting):

    But there are no votes in the House, a majority of votes, for a wall, no matter where you—[crosstalk].

    The fact is that you do not have the votes in the House.

  50. 50.

    Gelfling 545

    December 21, 2018 at 11:35 am

    @Quinerly: I don’t think so. At least not mainly. I think they give Trump just about anything to keep the GOP from being blamed for another shut down.

  51. 51.

    ??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??

    December 21, 2018 at 11:39 am

    @germy:
    It’s fucking scary how reasonable Raygun sounds compared to Trump.

  52. 52.

    ??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??

    December 21, 2018 at 11:41 am

    @Fair Economist:

    because they have enough of an advantage in the state gerrymander that a 60 seat Democratic majority is almost impossible with the current politics.

    When you say, “current politics”, do you mean the current political climate? The Dems had a Senate majority as recently as 2014.

  53. 53.

    Mike in DC

    December 21, 2018 at 11:42 am

    @Roger Moore: Election reform, infrastructure, green energy, minimum wage/job guarantee, free college and debt relief could be tier 1. Flipside is M4A, SS boost, immigration reform, corporate reform and criminal justice reform. Probably 2 or 3 more items–tax rebalancing, ENDA, and gun control–would round out a complete policy agenda.

  54. 54.

    chopper

    December 21, 2018 at 11:43 am

    @??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??:

    the dems had 60 seats in the senate in 2014?

  55. 55.

    Steeplejack

    December 21, 2018 at 11:44 am

    @dmsilev:

    I think this is the truth of it. Pelosi miscalculated how two-faced the GOP reps are.

  56. 56.

    Eolirin

    December 21, 2018 at 11:46 am

    @ Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  : They said 60 seat majority. We had that for a few months in 2008. It’s unlikely we’ll have it again.

  57. 57.

    Betty Cracker

    December 21, 2018 at 11:47 am

    @David Anderson: You don’t think the filibuster rule contained some of the legislative damage that could’ve been wrought under one-party rule? I think the incompetence of the Trump admin gets partial credit for this relatively unproductive session, which is why Trump is always bellowing about Gorsuch, Kavanaugh and tax cuts. But we can’t assume future Republican congresses and presidents would also be incompetent boobs who struggle to pass legislation.

  58. 58.

    Baud

    December 21, 2018 at 11:48 am

    @Mike in DC: Is that all?

  59. 59.

    Mrs. D. Ranged in AZ

    December 21, 2018 at 11:48 am

    @Spanky: That quote from Gov. Doucey is laughable. “Arizona knows how to work together.” What he means to say is that the Republicans control this state lock, stock and barrel and they do whatever the hell they want.

  60. 60.

    jl

    December 21, 2018 at 11:48 am

    News report I heard on way to work says McConnell just proclaimed that he really just doesn’t see how it’s such a big emergency. No need to give up filibuster.
    So,let’s if that holds up.

  61. 61.

    Mandalay

    December 21, 2018 at 11:49 am

    @oldster:

    I wonder how Nancy could have made such a beginner’s mistake as telling Trump that he wouldn’t have enough votes in the House?

    I wondered that as well. Maybe she knew he had the votes in the House all along, and was deliberately goading him into getting them to vote?

    While the current situation is a clusterf***, I think that Trump has made things even worse for himself, and the Republican Party, by getting the House to vote to give him his $5 billion. We can look forward to reports on federal workers not getting paid while they show Trump in a golf cart in the sunshine, grinning from ear to ear.

    Is Pelosi playing eleventy-dimensional chess, but we are too dumb to realize it?

  62. 62.

    Baud

    December 21, 2018 at 11:50 am

    @Betty Cracker: Over the long haul, the rule works both ways. Obama’s first two years would have been even more productive if we didn’t have the filibuster.

  63. 63.

    Eolirin

    December 21, 2018 at 11:51 am

    @Betty Cracker: We’re also not going to have much choice but to nuke it ourselves, if we want to accomplish anything legislatively. McConnell will not let any legislation through if we retake the Senate and White House. There’s no upside to McConnell taking the hit, instead of forcing us to, and he likely doesn’t have the votes, but the filibuster is going to have to die one way or another.

  64. 64.

    ??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??

    December 21, 2018 at 11:51 am

    @chopper:
    @Eolirin:
    Whoops. I confused 60 seat majority with a simple 51 majority.

  65. 65.

    piratedan

    December 21, 2018 at 11:53 am

    we have to remember while the rest of us are well acquainted with the nuances of insider politics (why else would we be here?) the vast majority of Americans are going to examine this pretty much like this I guess….

    Trump wants his wall….
    despite telling us that we wouldn’t have to pay for it, now he wants us to pony up for it to the tune of 5 Billion dollars
    Pelosi said he doesn’t have the votes for wall
    Political gamesmanship ensues
    Wall doesn’t get funded

    Who is America going to believe won? Pelosi or Trump?

  66. 66.

    Eolirin

    December 21, 2018 at 11:54 am

    @Mandalay: Honestly, it’s much more likely that they didn’t have the votes until Pelosi made her comments, at which point proving her wrong was enough of a motivating factor to pull some people over. Especially since they know it’s dead in the Senate anyway.

  67. 67.

    Mike in DC

    December 21, 2018 at 11:56 am

    @Betty Cracker: On the other hand, we’ve already seen that the GOP will use the filibuster to block the progressive agenda at every turn, so keeping the filibuster is essentially accepting that most of the policy we want enacted isn’t going to happen any time in the next 10 to 12 years. And actually passing stuff that’s popular could help keep Dems in power past a midterm.

  68. 68.

    randy khan

    December 21, 2018 at 11:56 am

    @??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??:

    And on top of that, some of the states that are reliably red today elected pretty liberal Dems as recently as 20 years ago. We should not assume that the current political demographics of the country will not change.

  69. 69.

    jl

    December 21, 2018 at 12:00 pm

    @Eolirin: Hard to say, really. Too many moving parts. Trump signaled he caved, then he reversed course when racist pundits riled up the base. People like Limbaugh and Ann Coulter. Ryan, a natural flunky on his way out, immediately caved. McConnell, who plans to spend more time ruling over his personal empire of shit, doesn’t see any reason to jump for a mess like Trump right now. At least so far. Let’s see what happens to McConnell’s current stated resolve to do business as usual and tell Trump to get lost.

  70. 70.

    Eolirin

    December 21, 2018 at 12:02 pm

    @piratedan: I have a bigger concern; Trump seems to have crossed a line in terms of his being unhinged. I don’t think he’s going to back down on this now, especially with Russian bots pushing for it, which means if the Senate isn’t willing to override his veto, it’s quite possible dems will be left with two options, give him everything he wants, and try to salvage some of that by getting things attached to wall funding that can get through the senate but are clear wins, or let the government stay shut down until the republicans in the Senate give in and allow an override.

    Any scenario that doesn’t involve an override will be spun as a Trump win. And any capitulation on the part of dems for wall funding, even if tied to important concessions, will be spun, with the help of Russian trolls, as a huge abandonment of immigrants.

  71. 71.

    tobie

    December 21, 2018 at 12:03 pm

    @Eolirin: Exactly. The House passed a symbolic vote yesterday to get back at Nancy. Unfortunately the GOP is now pushing the line that Dems own the shutdown. I don’t know how supine the media is being to its favorite rightwing sources. I assume they’re being predictably submissive.

  72. 72.

    realbtl

    December 21, 2018 at 12:03 pm

    According to SHS-spit- the President* will stay in DC if there is a shutdown. Odds anyone?

  73. 73.

    Baud

    December 21, 2018 at 12:03 pm

    @randy khan: California was a 50-50 state in the 90s.

  74. 74.

    germy

    December 21, 2018 at 12:04 pm

    The Democrats now own the shutdown!— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) December 21, 2018

    Just 10 days ago: “I am proud to shut down the government for border security … I will take the mantle. I will be the one to shut it down. I won’t blame you for it.” https://t.co/dwF5G2Hj9j— Renato Mariotti (@renato_mariotti) December 21, 2018

  75. 75.

    Baud

    December 21, 2018 at 12:04 pm

    @tobie: They always push that line and it always fails.

  76. 76.

    Mandalay

    December 21, 2018 at 12:05 pm

    @Eolirin: We’ll never know, but I don’t think Pelosi’s comments swayed the votes.

    Instead, it was Limbaugh and Coulter publicly stating that Trump was dead meat if he caved that changed everything. After that Trump contacted Limbaugh to say he would shut down the government if he didn’t get his funding.

    Many House Republicans may loathe Trump as much as us, but they know which side their bread is (currently) buttered on, so they went along with the madness.

  77. 77.

    Quinerly

    December 21, 2018 at 12:06 pm

    @MattF: I was out west for the last shut down. Had planned two days at Carlsbad Caverns. Got the first day in but closed down the second day. Spent a delightful day in town and ended up at wonderful little microbrewery with interesting locals. ?. Cruised over to White Sands and was the second car in when it reopened. Poco was wowed by the pristine sand. There had been a windstorm over the weekend while the park was closed. It was my second winter visit over the years there but it was truly amazing to enter to a pristine palette. The roads weren’t even plowed. Maybe 4 cars over 4 hrs. Thank you for bringing back that memory. Totally had forgotten about that shut down.

  78. 78.

    Eolirin

    December 21, 2018 at 12:06 pm

    @tobie: Trump is undercutting that message by demanding McConnell kill the filibuster and pass the wall funding.

  79. 79.

    brantl

    December 21, 2018 at 12:07 pm

    And that is why I have no expectation that the Senate Majority Leader will burn one of his most effective tools he used as a Minority Leader for effectively piffle.

    Never underestimate the willfull stupidity, and cupidity, of Mitch McConnell.

  80. 80.

    Steeplejack

    December 21, 2018 at 12:08 pm

    @Humdog:

    I went to this Boston Globe link, got the full op-ed and a notice that I have one free article left. Maybe you have Globe cookies (from previous visits) that could be deleted?

    . . . Eh, what the hell. I used my Google superpowers to find the entire text at this Eliza Dushku fan blog.

  81. 81.

    VOR

    December 21, 2018 at 12:08 pm

    @Mandalay: I think Pelosi was right – at that point in time. But pointing it out was the equivalent of taunting them so the Republicans decided to come together to perform a really stupid gesture. They showed her!

  82. 82.

    germy

    December 21, 2018 at 12:09 pm

    While thousands of public servants figure out how they’ll make ends meet without a paycheck during a government shutdown, Trump heads to his luxury resort. https://t.co/xPEg5OyNeF

    — Renato Mariotti (@renato_mariotti) December 21, 2018

  83. 83.

    Eolirin

    December 21, 2018 at 12:09 pm

    @Mandalay: And why is this suddenly such a big deal to Limbaugh and Coulter, when it hasn’t been every other time this has failed to go through? Pelosi made their side look weak in a way that was actually gaining traction. They can’t have that.

  84. 84.

    germy

    December 21, 2018 at 12:11 pm

    @Steeplejack: A quick side question for you: Years ago, during your time as a reporter, did you ever envision “cookies” and “google” entering the lexicon of journalistic terms?

  85. 85.

    ??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??

    December 21, 2018 at 12:14 pm

    @tobie:
    How could Dems possibly own a shutdown? They don’t have a majority! This is all on the GOP and Trump because they’re the ones driving this crazy train.

    I understand you’re not saying that, rather the media might go along with this line. I just can’t groak why the media would go along with this when it can clearly be fact checked by anybody.

  86. 86.

    Betty Cracker

    December 21, 2018 at 12:14 pm

    @Baud: That’s what I was thinking — that it will cut both ways and not invariably redound to Democrats’ favor, especially in a legislative body with a structure that puts blue states behind the eight-ball. That’s also true with the status quo. I don’t think McConnell will be dumb enough to nuke it now and take the hit, but who knows.

  87. 87.

    different-church-lady

    December 21, 2018 at 12:14 pm

    TRUMP: I WANT TO KILL ALL PUPPIES!
    DEMS: Uh, killing puppies is wrong.
    TRUMP: HERE’S A BUNCH OF OTHER STUFF YOU WANT, MAYBE.
    DEMS: Killing puppies is still wrong.
    ANDERSON: Puppies are overrated. I think we should trust the guy.

  88. 88.

    ??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??

    December 21, 2018 at 12:16 pm

    @randy khan:

    I hope it changes soon, because the US Federal government (and subsequently the states) can’t function without a sane Senate.

  89. 89.

    JPL

    December 21, 2018 at 12:16 pm

    @Betty Cracker: I’m not a Tim Ryan fan, but he airs your sentiments.
    https://twitter.com/briantylercohen/status/1075959276349349888

    You might consider putting it on a separate post later.

  90. 90.

    schrodingers_cat

    December 21, 2018 at 12:18 pm

    @different-church-lady: I just hate the breathless way in which the media peeps are covering this shutdown nonsense. They are like a fucking propaganda arm for Rs.

  91. 91.

    chopper

    December 21, 2018 at 12:19 pm

    @realbtl:

    bullshit he will.

  92. 92.

    trollhattan

    December 21, 2018 at 12:19 pm

    @STW1:
    Family members, shackles, basement.

  93. 93.

    The Dangerman

    December 21, 2018 at 12:19 pm

    @realbtl:

    …will stay in DC if there is a shutdown. Odds anyone?

    Can he sneak out the back way? Else, zero.

  94. 94.

    SiubhanDuinne

    December 21, 2018 at 12:20 pm

    @Quinerly:

    I remember your posting about that at the time. Makes me want to visit on my next driving trip west.

  95. 95.

    trollhattan

    December 21, 2018 at 12:21 pm

    @realbtl:
    What, golf the Tidal Basin? Magic 8-Ball says “Unlikely.”

  96. 96.

    swiftfox

    December 21, 2018 at 12:21 pm

    @Spanky: @Eolirin: all the parks will be open; the law enforcement rangers will be on duty as essential personnel. The interpreters, visitor’s centers, and the rest of the support staff will be on furlough. What Ducey does is on the margins.

  97. 97.

    Eolirin

    December 21, 2018 at 12:21 pm

    @ Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  : It’s absolutely possible for the minority party to own a shutdown, as long as the filibuster exists. When we briefly shutdown the government over DACA, it wasn’t inaccurate to place the blame for that on Democrats. But it’s only because the majority is willingly ceding it’s power by allowing the filibuster to exist. And that is why you absolutely must not, at any point in these proceedings, make it clear that the Senate majority has the ability to take away that filibuster. So of course, Trump is doing exactly that.

  98. 98.

    PeakVT

    December 21, 2018 at 12:21 pm

    There should not be a supermajority requirement for basic legislation.

    Nuke the filibuster.

  99. 99.

    Spanky

    December 21, 2018 at 12:21 pm

    @schrodingers_cat:

    They are like a fucking propaganda arm for Rs.

    Fox … Sinclair … NYT …

  100. 100.

    JPL

    December 21, 2018 at 12:22 pm

    @The Dangerman: Believe me Melania will not stay there. The government will fund her vacation while TSA employees work with out pay.

    i guess we’ll have to pay for Jared and Ivanka’s trip too.

  101. 101.

    CarolDuhart2

    December 21, 2018 at 12:23 pm

    @Eolirin: Limbaugh and Coulter are looking at what we are looking at for the next two years: Gridlock. After 1/3 there is going to be no funding for the wall at all, and likely will be never again…if A Democrat win the White House in 20, add another 4 years to the 2. By then, we will have accepted thousands of asylum seekers, and America will be browner than ever. And we are going to reverse all of Trump’s cruelty with a brand new Immigration Policy. So we are seeing their panic.

  102. 102.

    ??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??

    December 21, 2018 at 12:24 pm

    @schrodingers_cat:
    It’s partly because the people who work in these news organizations, the reporters, are very privileged, middle to upper class people from many of the same J-Schools. None of this is likely to affect them, so they’re entertained by it, on some level.

  103. 103.

    different-church-lady

    December 21, 2018 at 12:25 pm

    @patrick II: “I would ask for wheel. We need wheel.”

  104. 104.

    Mandalay

    December 21, 2018 at 12:25 pm

    @Eolirin:

    And why is this suddenly such a big deal to Limbaugh and Coulter, when it hasn’t been every other time this has failed to go through?

    I don’t know about Limbaugh, but there is nothing sudden about Coulter dumping on Trump over the wall – she has been doing it consistently for the past 2 years. Coulter views Trump as a useful idiot who is just a vehicle for implementing her racist agenda. Trump is right to be scared of her because she is ten times the honey badger that he is, and she truly doesn’t give a flying fuck about who she pisses off, Trump included.

    And there is extra focus right now only because if this attempt fails Trump will never get the $5 billion.

  105. 105.

    Eolirin

    December 21, 2018 at 12:26 pm

    @CarolDuhart2: I can possibly see Coulter having that opinion, but Limbaugh isn’t *that* stupid. 5 billion for a border wall that probably can’t even be built is a purely symbolic gesture. They’re not going to bat for something that’ll actually affect change, like gutting the ACA. So why are they willing to make this a hill worth dying over, if it’s not about the appearance of dominance?

  106. 106.

    different-church-lady

    December 21, 2018 at 12:26 pm

    @??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??: And the rest of it is because drama draws more eyeballs/clicks than straight reporting does.

  107. 107.

    SFAW

    December 21, 2018 at 12:27 pm

    To paraphrase Mencken (or whoever really said it first), no one ever lost money overestimating the vileness/venality of Mitch McConnell.

    I understand the ramifications of nuking the filibuster for this, and I’m not disputing the thought process, but I think Turtle is willing to take the chance that they can hold onto a Senate majority for the rest of his unnatural life.

  108. 108.

    JPL

    December 21, 2018 at 12:29 pm

    BREAKING: Supreme Court: Justice Ginsburg has cancerous growths removed from lung.

    fkfkfkfkfkfkfkkfkfkfkfkfkfkfkfkfkkfkfkfkfkfkkffk

    according to AP

  109. 109.

    Kelly

    December 21, 2018 at 12:30 pm

    26 states, a majority of the Senate represent 17% of the population. It would require an unlikely amount of fair mindedness to fix this in the constitution. Moar states? Break up big blue states to make more little blue states? Any allocation based on an inflexible map is gonna be a problem. Make every city or county with a population greater than Wyoming a state? That’d still leave a bunch of very red rump states behind. Take Portland out of Oregon and what’s left is deep red.

  110. 110.

    Quinerly

    December 21, 2018 at 12:32 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne: I’m so homesick for my driving trip. It’s like I’m mourning and can’t snap out of it. Sounds selfish but I do two solid months of trip planning and research and love that almost as much as the trip. It’s nice just to meet strangers and have small day to day interactions. No expectations or disappointments of/in strangers…No politics, no worries… Small talk and move on. Just can’t get the timing to work this year. I think it plays into my mood and this creeping minor depression. I’m on Trump overload. He’s everywhere. Can’t escape him.

  111. 111.

    Quinerly

    December 21, 2018 at 12:33 pm

    Fuck. RBG has had lung cancer surgery.

  112. 112.

    jl

    December 21, 2018 at 12:33 pm

    @Eolirin: Coulter and Limbaugh make money off of catering the hardest core racist crazy Trump base. The hardest core racist crazy Trump base is detached from reality. They don’t have the interest or the mental capacity to understand anything about the reality of immigration, documented or otherwise, border security, or Wall.

    They’ve been been duped for 2 years on dishonest Trumpster propaganda about what is going on with Wall, the existing Wall that Trump claims he built (he didn’t, it’s all been repairs on existing Wall), the Savior Wall to come that George Soros and the evil Democrats are preventing from being built and that is needed to save the country from complete dissolution.

    Coulter and Limbaugh need to keep those loons happy.

  113. 113.

    Schlemazel

    December 21, 2018 at 12:34 pm

    JFC!
    Ruth Bader Ginsburg just had two cancerous growths removed from her lungs

    God must hate us all so much

  114. 114.

    SiubhanDuinne

    December 21, 2018 at 12:34 pm

    RBG had two malignant nodules removed from her lung. No sign of any other malignancy. Resting comfortably.

    RECOVER SOON AND FULLY, NOTORIOUS!!

    But oh shit.

  115. 115.

    germy

    December 21, 2018 at 12:35 pm

    BREAKING: US Supreme Court Justice Ginsburg has cancerous growths removed from lung, the court says: "Post-surgery, there was no evidence of any remaining disease." pic.twitter.com/YZZq3db4DW— NBC News (@NBCNews) December 21, 2018

  116. 116.

    Baud

    December 21, 2018 at 12:35 pm

    @JPL:

    Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg underwent a pulmonary lobectomy today at Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center in New York City. Two nodules in the lower lobe of her left lung were discovered incidentally during tests performed at George Washington University Hospital to diagnose and treat rib fractures sustained in a fall on November 7. According to the thoracic surgeon, Valerie W. Rusch, MD, FACS, both nodules removed during surgery were found to be malignant on initial pathology evaluation. Post-surgery, there was no evidence of any remaining disease. Scans performed before surgery indicated no evidence of disease elsewhere in the body. Currently, no further treatment is planned. Justice Ginsburg is resting comfortably and is expected to remain in the hospital for a few days. Updates will be provided as they become available.

    Official statement.

  117. 117.

    Eolirin

    December 21, 2018 at 12:36 pm

    @Kelly: It would be easier and less disruptive to annex Canada and Mexico.

  118. 118.

    Baud

    December 21, 2018 at 12:36 pm

    @Schlemazel:

    God must hate us all so much

    For some of us, with good reason.

  119. 119.

    Baud

    December 21, 2018 at 12:38 pm

    As a reminder, it was wrong for us to bring up the Supreme Court as an issue in 2016.

  120. 120.

    Frankensteinbeck

    December 21, 2018 at 12:39 pm

    It sounds like RBG and the rest of us got incredibly lucky when she broke those ribs. It let them discover the cancer early.

    I had a heart attack there for a second, myself.

  121. 121.

    Ksmiami

    December 21, 2018 at 12:39 pm

    @Lee: the bread song – cause you left me just when I needed you most

  122. 122.

    JPL

    December 21, 2018 at 12:40 pm

    @Baud: Thanks Baud for the additional information and hopefully she is okay. Maybe we can keep the senate closed until 2020. That would make me feel better.

  123. 123.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    December 21, 2018 at 12:40 pm

    @Baud: WALL STREET SPEECHES!

    gotta have priorities

  124. 124.

    Baud

    December 21, 2018 at 12:40 pm

    @Frankensteinbeck:

    Maybe God loves us?

  125. 125.

    Terry chay

    December 21, 2018 at 12:41 pm

    @??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??: he meant a 60 seat supermajority not a bare majority. The last time that happened was late 2009 with al Frankenstein being seated.

    The electoral math doesn’t favor the democrats reaching 60 again, but I don’t think that takes into account what will happen post crash. That event clouds all visibility.l as it will probably touch off a political realignment after the destruction of the Republican Party.

  126. 126.

    Eolirin

    December 21, 2018 at 12:41 pm

    @jl: Yeah, and those loons are particularly sensitive to appearances of weakness, especially when it’s a woman (or minority) that’s expressing dominance. Pelosi making Trump look weak and stupid is going to make them *very* angry, which is just going to make the situation more urgent to them. If there wasn’t a confrontation over this, and it just simply didn’t happen, there’d be less push back over it. The second it was a fight though, it becomes much more of an imperative to not look like a loser.

  127. 127.

    rikyrah

    December 21, 2018 at 12:42 pm

    Trump Becomes More Dangerous as a Day of Reckoning Draws Near
    by Nancy LeTourneau
    December 21, 2018

    ……………..

    Additional attempts to obstruct justice

    The administration is also shoring up its efforts to either infect the Mueller investigation or stop it in its tracks. If not for all of the other bombshells dropping this week, the story about acting Attorney General Matt Whitaker’s move would have gotten a lot more attention.

    Acting Attorney General Matthew Whitaker chose not to recuse himself from the Russia investigation even though a top Justice Department ethics official advised him to step aside out of an “abundance of caution,” a senior official said Thursday.

    Whitaker’s past criticism of the Russia investigation has raised questions about whether he can oversee it fairly. The ethics official said this week that a recusal was “a close call” but suggested that Whitaker remove himself, even though he was not required to do so.

    Whitaker decided not to take the advice.

  128. 128.

    zhena gogolia

    December 21, 2018 at 12:45 pm

    @JPL:

    Why didn’t she retire when Obama was president?????

    Now I’ll get flamed.

  129. 129.

    Betty Cracker

    December 21, 2018 at 12:45 pm

    I can’t even fucking contemplate the possibility of RBG leaving the SCOTUS and being replaced by someone chosen by Donald Motherfucking Trump, who once reportedly salivated over that possibility and said maybe he’d get to replace Sotomayor too since she has diabetes. It’s just too hideous a scenario to bear thinking of, goddamn it!

  130. 130.

    Eolirin

    December 21, 2018 at 12:46 pm

    @rikyrah: If this opens Whitaker up to congressional investigation once democrats have the house again, it may end up doing more harm to them than good.

  131. 131.

    Terry chay

    December 21, 2018 at 12:47 pm

    @Mandalay: at the time Trumo didn’t have the votes. That changed after the conference as the modern republican is what liberals don’t want.

    In the end, it is shooting yourself in the foot because the suburbs aren’t buying Trump saying this shutdown is the democrats fault, and the suburbs now represent almost half of America. Without the suburbs, the Republican Party is less than a third party. Rural America was on decline, had a small growth/reprieve under Obama, and now are being wiped out under Trump. They reoelresent 14% of the economy and single digit percent of the GDP and both are declining rapidly in just two years.

  132. 132.

    Schlemazel

    December 21, 2018 at 12:48 pm

    @zhena gogolia:
    YEAH! She could have been replaced by Garland Merrick. I means what could have gone wrong?

  133. 133.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    December 21, 2018 at 12:49 pm

    @zhena gogolia: No fire from me, but she would have had to retire before the 2014 midterms to get a replacement past the McConnell blockade, and I don’t remember anyone calling for her to do so then.

  134. 134.

    Rylan Futch

    December 21, 2018 at 12:50 pm

    Trade wall for Obamacare reinstatement……every single bit of it. Not that the dems are smart enuff to see this.

  135. 135.

    Eolirin

    December 21, 2018 at 12:51 pm

    @Rylan Futch: What makes you think Ryan or McConnell would go for that?

  136. 136.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 12:52 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    It’s freaky BUT it sounds like they caught it extremely early by chance and were able to remove it.

    We had a scare a few months ago when my mother-in-law’s dentist spotted a suspicious abscess during a routine exam that turned out to be cancerous. Again, though, because it was caught very early during a routine exam, they were able to excuse the whole thing with no need for radiation or chemotherapy. Phew!

  137. 137.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    December 21, 2018 at 12:52 pm

    @Rylan Futch: if only Nancy Pelosi were smart enough to post things on a blog! then Mitch McConnell would cease to exist!

  138. 138.

    jl

    December 21, 2018 at 12:53 pm

    @Terry chay: I think almost certain to be a recession before 2020 now. We may be on verge of it. That is going to blow Trump out of the water, politically. What has been missed I think is that the recovery of the real economy (versus financial industry) has been exceedingly weak, in terms of two important measures, real per capita income, and the residential housing market. The effects of the very weak recovery of the housing market is there for all to see, with a shortage of supply, and spreading housing shortages throughout the country, and that includes urban areas in very red states. The dip in housing supply below trend since the end of the Great Recession dwarfs the minor over supply that occurred during the bubble years.

    There will be some Fed blaming for the coming recession, but I don’t see how that is justified. The extraordinarily weak recovery in terms of personal income available to the mass of the population, hasn’t been able to support a prudent level of real interest rates, the most macroeconomists think the economy needs to manage the economy, especially in the face of GOP control of government that will prevent adequate fiscal response. The GOP will spend like mad to give rich people money at the peak of the boom, but will block anything for normal people in a downturn.

    The residential market has been stuttering, and the vast amounts of speculative global capital that was financing overpriced housing pulled out earlier this year.

    One reason for Trump’s panic might be he sees his precious and artificial Trump stock market boom disappearing, and maybe his business buddies are running around with their hair on fire about now worried about the onset of the next recession. And more economic news today that business investment went into an even bigger reverse than expected over last quarter. So, GOP’s public rationale for the tax cut heist just got another hole blown into it.

    And Trump is an ignorant dope who has appointed unqualified people (except for the puzzling nomination of Powell at the Fed), and they have no clue what to do.

  139. 139.

    JPL

    December 21, 2018 at 12:53 pm

    @Betty Cracker: Then don’t go there. Because of a friend’s illness, I did learn that you can remove nodules on your liver and elsewhere. Previously I thought that if cancer had spread to your liver, there was little they could do, but it has to actually penetrate. Since the liver can regenerate, as long it’s not beyond the first layer you might be okay.

    btw I’m giving myself a pep talk more than you.

  140. 140.

    Rylan Futch

    December 21, 2018 at 12:54 pm

    @zhena gogolia: Actually you are exactly right about that! She is selfish and not very nice. I spotted a recent article about her clerk hiring habits and damned if Clarence Thomas doesn’t have a more diverse crew than she does! She rarely if ever hires black clerks. If she dies then her legacy will be that she held on too long and let Trump replace her. Maybe that’s what she really wants?

  141. 141.

    Brachiator

    December 21, 2018 at 12:55 pm

    So, how could the GOP use the Nuclear option and then de-nuke in 2019?

    I don’t trust them about anything, and I expect that they will continually bend the rules in order to give themselves whatever advantage they can muster.

  142. 142.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 12:56 pm

    @Rylan Futch:

    Oh, look. It’s the boy who hates RGB posting under a new fake nym.

    Now tell us how mass shootings are no big deal and there’s no need for gun control, you blood-gargling ghoul.

  143. 143.

    Schlemazel

    December 21, 2018 at 12:58 pm

    @Rylan Futch:
    Trade $5B for:
    DACA
    Mueller protection

    let the bastard sign that bill!

  144. 144.

    Rylan Futch

    December 21, 2018 at 12:58 pm

    @Eolirin: They might not go for it but it’s at least an offer on the table. Dems can always say they made an offer and were turned down. Don’t forget that trump sees cutting deals as asking for more and more and more and more. You deal with people like that by doing the same to them. As someone up top said this wall if piffle. Obamacare reinstatement would be huge. I’m not sure the dems know how to propose deals any more.

  145. 145.

    Martin

    December 21, 2018 at 12:59 pm

    @dmsilev:

    A thought: The House GOP treated yesterday’s vote as similar to the endless Obamacare repeal votes in 2013-2016. A message proclaiming their intent, while knowing full well they’d never have to answer for the consequences since it would never become law. Posturing, in other words. Pelosi, being a more serious person, discounted the GOP’s desire for one last posturing gesture.

    Oh, I don’t think it was even that. I don’t think Pelosi cared one way or another if Trump could get it done in the House – Chuck assured her it wouldn’t get through the Senate. Or, I should say – a bill that could get through the Senate wouldn’t get through the House that included wall funding. That was her challenge to him – stop blaming Democrats and fucking do it yourself. And that’s basically what everyone has been signaling – a House bill that included wall funding is DOA in the Senate. If they want to take the nuclear option to get it done, so be it. Democrats lose no power on that front because they control the House starting 1/4/19. Dems are good odds to win the Senate in 2020.

  146. 146.

    Rylan Futch

    December 21, 2018 at 12:59 pm

    @Schlemazel: There ya go! $5B for a wall is peanuts. Let him turn down that deal.

  147. 147.

    Eolirin

    December 21, 2018 at 12:59 pm

    @Brachiator: McConnell doesn’t currently have the votes needed to nuke the filibuster, and he won’t have any possibility of having them until Pelosi is running the house. He can’t nuke it now, and there’s no point in nuking it later.

  148. 148.

    Schlemazel

    December 21, 2018 at 12:59 pm

    @Rylan Futch:
    You forgot the “/s” at the end

    People could mistake that load of shit as serious comment

  149. 149.

    rikyrah

    December 21, 2018 at 1:00 pm

    The Demise of the ‘Young Guns’
    by Nancy LeTourneau
    December 21, 2018

    Less that two months before the 2010 midterms election swept Republicans into a majority in the House, three GOP upstarts published a book titled, Young Guns: A New Generation of Conservative Leaders. You might remember that the three white guys who assumed they were about take over leadership of their party were Eric Cantor, Paul Ryan, and Kevin McCarthy.

    Each of those men assigned themselves a role as the vanguards of a new Republican Party. Cantor was the leader, Ryan the policy wonk, and McCarthy the strategist. Their so-called “blueprint” was nothing more than the warmed-over policies that generations of Republicans have embraced: tax cuts and deficit reduction via gutting of the social safety net. As Politico noted at the time of the book’s release, it was “long on platitudes and personality but short on policy details.”

    Frankly, it was a bit audacious—even for Republicans—to anoint themselves the “new generation of conservative leaders.” But in the midst of the red wave of 2010, those were heady days for the GOP. Even so, the audacity of the young guns was relatively short-lived.

  150. 150.

    different-church-lady

    December 21, 2018 at 1:02 pm

    @Rylan Futch: Everyone remembers, “My offer is this: nothing.” Nobody remembers, “Not even the fee for the gaming license, which I would appreciate if you would put up personally.”

  151. 151.

    Elizabelle

    December 21, 2018 at 1:02 pm

    Wow, so it turns out those cracked ribs were actually luck in a rather painful form. Recover and no more cancer, RBG.

    Further, I think she should have retired too. In 2015. Scalia did not die until February 2016. We will never know, but I am pretty sure Obama could have gotten a justice through then.

    Mostly, I want McConnell in prison or dead (for treason) for all the Senatorial mayhem he has caused.

  152. 152.

    Rylan Futch

    December 21, 2018 at 1:02 pm

    @Mnemosyne: That’s my real name you dipshit. Why don’t YOU stop hiding? And refute what I said. Why didn’t she step down and let O replace her, huh? If she’s such a liberal lion then she should understand legacy and the future of the court enough to know that she’s old and there was a chance to put a much younger person on the court.

  153. 153.

    Rylan Futch

    December 21, 2018 at 1:04 pm

    @different-church-lady: I remember that! Great movie. Unfortunately we can’t enforce those offers the way Michael could!

  154. 154.

    Eolirin

    December 21, 2018 at 1:05 pm

    @Rylan Futch: So, I’m gonna assume you’re just a troll. If not, please educate yourself on the process of how legislation is brought up to a floor vote.

  155. 155.

    RAVEN

    December 21, 2018 at 1:05 pm

    @Rylan Futch: What the fuck are you whining abut it now for?

  156. 156.

    Steeplejack

    December 21, 2018 at 1:06 pm

    @germy:

    Inorite?! You hit a nerve. I have a huge collection of Abe Simpson onion-belt stories about the ways the whole field has changed, and I have to monitor people for eyeball-glazing and edit myself when I trot them out.

    And, of course, one of the biggest changes—in all area of life, not just journalism—is the rise of the Internet and all that it enables. The thing that I notice on a daily basis is how much easier it is now to do basic fact-checking type research. Can’t remember how to spell Khashoggi’s name, or what his first name is? You can start typing in your browser’s search box and autofill will get you the answer (or a link) within three or four characters. You’re reading a story and you think there’s something off about “Metrie, LA”? Quick check and you find that it’s “Metairie, LA.”

    When I worked at a mid-sized Southern daily in the ’70s, all of that would have required a visit to the mini-reference library that took up a small but crowded area beside the “morgue”—the place where two or three women worked all day cutting up the previous day’s paper and putting the articles and photos into files for future reference. The library had atlases, encyclopedias, almanacs, phone directories for numerous cities, reverse phone directories, all sorts of reference books.

    And spelling! There was a stand with a worn, well-used copy of the gigantic Webster’s Third New International Dictionary (similar to this), to which everyone had recourse all too often. “Spell-check”? What’s that?

    Okay, my eyes are glazing over. But, yeah, the changes we’ve seen. Even the most trivial Google dive is light-years ahead of what you could accomplish back then. And some things you couldn’t even think of doing—just not possible with the existing resources.

  157. 157.

    Amir Khalid

    December 21, 2018 at 1:10 pm

    @??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??:

    How could Dems possibly own a shutdown?

    The same way 9/11 happened on Bill Clinton’s watch.

  158. 158.

    jl

    December 21, 2018 at 1:12 pm

    Okee-dokey, GOP Senators tell Trump to forget about trashing filibuster for Wall. As a few other commenters said or suggested, I think McConnell knows that if he trashes the filibuster for the unpopular Trump Wall nonsense, and the Dems take the Senate in 2020, the filibuster isn’t coming back. If he keeps it, he has a much better chance of using it when the Senate is in enemy hands. I think that depends on how wiped out the GOP gets after the Trumpsters goof up the recovery from the upcoming recession.

    Let’s see if the GOP Senate holds up its resolve. I guess the corporate hacks in the media and the GOP will try to blame the Dems for not always giving in to lose-lose deals with a pathological liar who acts on whims, and is constitutionally incapable of keeping deals.

    OTOH, if this plays out as mainly a fight between Trumpsters and Senate GOP, the ‘blame the Dems’ story line has competition with a much more dramatic, and in this case, accurate, story. The media will always go for maximum drama. If the corporate media hacks have to spin out such elaborate BS scenarios to blame the Dems, that even people like Tim Ryan break out in hysterical laughter, then that will be a problem for the ‘blame the Dems’ story line.

    GOP Sens To Trump: We Won’t Trash Legislative Filibuster To Pass Wall Funds
    https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/gop-sens-to-trump-we-wont-trash-legislative-filibuster-to-pass-wall-funds

  159. 159.

    schrodingers_cat

    December 21, 2018 at 1:14 pm

    Thanks T voters and JS voters for our waking nightmare.

  160. 160.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    December 21, 2018 at 1:15 pm

    @jl:

    I think almost certain to be a recession before 2020 now.

    according to two friends who are economic analysts for banks we are six months into a recession now.

  161. 161.

    PJ

    December 21, 2018 at 1:17 pm

    @Steeplejack: It’s true that research of many things has become close to instantaneous. But you point out that, behind the morgue, there was a staff who knew not just what files articles and photos were put into, but why they were put into those files. Google doesn’t know they why, because it doesn’t know anything. It just links things together, which is what makes it so easy for disinformation to proliferate.

    The other thing about doing research online is that, while it is much easier to find things you know you are looking for, it is more difficult to find things you don’t know you are looking for, but which might be side by side if you were doing research in, say, the stacks, or in a digest, where people had painstakingly assembled underlying data according to useful categories. You can still do research that way, of course, which is why it’s good to have the best of both worlds, but people tend to forget it (or never learned it in the first place), because convenience is just the best thing ever.

  162. 162.

    schrodingers_cat

    December 21, 2018 at 1:19 pm

    @Schlemazel: I addressed this in the last thread.

    That DACA deal involved torching legal immigration by getting rid of whole green card categories including throwing in the trash pile thousands of applications that have been approved for permanent residency but are waiting for their GC for the appropriate quota numbers to be available, sometimes for decades.
    Plus, the Orange Man does not keep his word.

    The entire process of getting your intention to immigrate form approved is nightmarishly difficult. It takes years not to speak of blood sweat and tears.
    DACA holders deserve a path to citizenship but so do the people who have had their I-140 (job-based GC )and I-130 (family based GC) approved.

    ETA: In many cases they are already in the country on other long term visas. So just getting rid of those applications means that they would have to pack up and leave.

    Gutting legal immigration in the present and future is not an acceptable deal

  163. 163.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    December 21, 2018 at 1:19 pm

    @jl:

    if this plays out as mainly a fight between Trumpsters and Senate GOP, the ‘blame the Dems’ story line has competition with a much more dramatic, and in this case, accurate, story. The media will always go for maximum drama

    Worth noting Democrat/Lib is Right Wing double speak for “the conservative I disagree with”

  164. 164.

    Jinchi

    December 21, 2018 at 1:20 pm

    Honest question:
    If Trump shuts down the government, does that mean ICE agents don’t get paid over Christmas?

  165. 165.

    Cheryl Rofer

    December 21, 2018 at 1:21 pm

    I have some thoughts about this looming shutdown… pic.twitter.com/XQfEwlMHst

    — Congressman Tim Ryan (@RepTimRyan) December 21, 2018

  166. 166.

    schrodingers_cat

    December 21, 2018 at 1:21 pm

    @Jinchi: I don’t know about ICE but USCIS will continue to open, because its largely funded through fees for various visas and such.

  167. 167.

    Hob

    December 21, 2018 at 1:23 pm

    By the way, here is the article that I’m guessing is what Rylan Futch was referring to about Supreme Court clerks. Not surprisingly it offers no support for Rylan’s claim that Ginsburg is “not nice”, and doesn’t in any way single her out for lack of diversity in clerks, which the article makes clear is a systemic problem. Anyway, it’s an interesting read and it would’ve been nice of Rylan, if he really is a legit commenter, to have linked to it.

  168. 168.

    jl

    December 21, 2018 at 1:23 pm

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques: That may well be true. Hard to time these things as they unfold. That would time nicely with when global capital made gave up on making gobs of money on speculative over priced high end residential properties in the US and pulled out of US in favor of nutso real estate deals in various places around the world. I’ll have to check the global capital real estate investment market news and sucker bait flyers on what the new hot bonanza opportunity is. Maybe rare earth mining plays, or agricultural land in Africa that will boom due to China’s Belt and Road, or whatever it’s called. That would also time nicely with when big investment funds decided they couldn’t make money on the ‘own-to-rent’ single family market in the US.

    US residential market, of every kind, has been stutter stepping ever since end of Great Recession, and then just stopped trying, it fell down and couldn’t get up. Didn’t have a clapper.

    The entire world economy is completely screwed up, IMHO. I think mainly due to to way too much money in the hands of very rich people and sovereign funds and they have no clue what to do with it.

  169. 169.

    Frankensteinbeck

    December 21, 2018 at 1:26 pm

    @jl:

    The media will always go for maximum drama.

    Reminder: There was probably no more boring story than Hillary Clinton’s Emails, but the national press harped on it relentlessly for at least a year. Still, I think the GOP are screwed on this shutdown. The population is too polarized and the narrative is set.

    @Jinchi:

    does that mean ICE agents don’t get paid over Christmas?

    Yes.

  170. 170.

    Hob

    December 21, 2018 at 1:30 pm

    @schrodingers_cat: That’s all true but even if the proposed policy hadn’t been terrible, “the orange man does not keep his word” would be reason enough to say no. I mean, I don’t see how it’s possible for legislators to make any kind of deal on immigration with a person who clearly thinks the executive branch can unilaterally do whatever it wants on immigration.

  171. 171.

    jl

    December 21, 2018 at 1:32 pm

    @Frankensteinbeck: I do agree that the majority of the public has correctly decided that Trump Wall is BS and that will play an important role. Any narrative that makes that look like an important goal will be unpopular. The corporate media will be forced to pay attention to that fact, sooner or later, through audience reaction to how they pitch their news stories. Since the corporate media’s highest and only goal is always be profiting, always be getting audience share.

  172. 172.

    StringOnAStick

    December 21, 2018 at 1:33 pm

    @jl: I agree with most of your points,but there are places in the US where the US residential market has been very hot, Denver being one of them. For the first time in several years, properties in the sub $700k market here are sitting for a bit, a big change from people buying things based on video and a local realtor as the family hadn’t moved here yet. Existing residential listings are up 19% here, and the housing shortage is real. So is the serious problem with affordability.

    I recall a patient telling me 5 years ago that Denver is the new Silicon Valley. At the time I could see his point but I hoped it wasn’t true. Turns out, it’s true. The many years of 8-10% annual appreciation are finally slowing a bit. Maybe the slowing that is showing up here in what was the hottest area for quite awhile is a recession indication as well.

    BTW, totally agree with your point on the sovereign wealth funds; all that money floating around, looking to make more money.

  173. 173.

    Uncle Cosmo

    December 21, 2018 at 1:33 pm

    @Rylan Futch: Fuck off & die, troll. Better yet, skip the preliminaries & just drop dead. (NB if that’s your “real name” you are overdue to drop dead of utter embarrassment anyway.)

  174. 174.

    West of the Rockies

    December 21, 2018 at 1:35 pm

    @Cheryl Rofer:

    Boom.

  175. 175.

    ??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??

    December 21, 2018 at 1:35 pm

    @jl:
    This is good news for Anarcho-Syndicalism!

  176. 176.

    jl

    December 21, 2018 at 1:39 pm

    @StringOnAStick: All I can say is go look at the business reporting on real estate. So far, the investment money that was behind the very poor lousy residential supply response in this recovery is not interested in what it considers to be the puny returns to building residential housing of any kind for middle, working classes and poor. It wanted big returns on very high end housing, not interested in anything else.

    I admit I haven’t gone looked at the news over the last month. At any rate, a hot market that is based on rising prices for an inadequate existing housing stock that most people cannot afford doesn’t make for a popular or sustainable economic expansion. We’ll see what happens.

    Edit: I’ve been reading plaintive speculation by real estate analysts that maybe after the luxury market is saturated the money will be interested in building something for not rich people. But that never happened, the big money was not interested in that.

  177. 177.

    janesays

    December 21, 2018 at 1:41 pm

    @kindness: What damage could they do without a filibuster after January 3rd that they can’t already do? None of their wacky legislation would get through a Democratic House, and as far as appointments go, the filibuster has already been killed.

  178. 178.

    Brachiator

    December 21, 2018 at 1:42 pm

    @jl:

    I think almost certain to be a recession before 2020 now. We may be on verge of it.

    No one can predict this, no matter how “certain” you are.

    I recently heard a relatively level-headed economist note that the financial signs look good despite the volatility of the stock market. This is not necessarily gospel, but people who insist that a recession is on the way need to bring something other than their gut feeling. And I don’t say this out of any love for Trump, or any belief in his competence or that of any of his chief advisors.

    That is going to blow Trump out of the water, politically.

    I don’t think a recession would do it. He would lie about any responsibility and his base will never desert him, no matter how much they suffer for his stupidity.

  179. 179.

    jl

    December 21, 2018 at 1:43 pm

    @??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??: Baud 2020!!! Only Baud2020! can screw things up even more.

  180. 180.

    janesays

    December 21, 2018 at 1:45 pm

    @JPL: But it would have been a meaningless vote two weeks ago as well when Nancy said he didn’t have the House votes then. Nothing has changed – the filibuster was always going to stop this thing from getting through the Senate. I think she miscalled that one. It’s probably good that Cheetolini didn’t immediately call her bluff at the time she said he didn’t have the House votes, because she would have lost that one. The GOP doesn’t vote against Trump. Ever.

  181. 181.

    jl

    December 21, 2018 at 1:48 pm

    @Brachiator: ” relatively level-headed economist ” are a dime a dozen. Do you remember who said this?

    Anyway, I made my case, people can read and make up their own minds. We;ll see what happens. I could be wrong. Maybe Trump will decide to end his trade war, and that will keep the recovery wheezing along to make 2020.

  182. 182.

    dfferent-church-lady

    December 21, 2018 at 1:50 pm

    @Frankensteinbeck:

    There was probably no more boring story than Hillary Clinton’s Emails…

    That’s only if you report it straight. If you report it as a bitchy woman getting the shit kicked out of her, it’s catnip.

  183. 183.

    different-church-lady

    December 21, 2018 at 1:52 pm

    @Frankensteinbeck:

    There was probably no more boring story than Hillary Clinton’s Emails…

    That’s only if you report it straight. If you report it as a bitchy woman getting the shit kicked out of her, it’s catnip.

  184. 184.

    jl

    December 21, 2018 at 1:53 pm

    Can BJ blog sue Trump for stealing one of its biggest promotional features? If Cole can collect some damages this blog might really pay for itself. I assume Cole trademarked the rotating headers, him being a good businessperson.

    Edit: if the current Trump Decompensation Event continues, it will be difficult to get the spotlight off his complete lunacy and incompetence, even if the corporate media would like to.

    ” Pres. Trump says “the wall will pay for itself on a monthly basis.”
    https://twitter.com/evanmcmurry/status/1076181471608492033

  185. 185.

    NJDave

    December 21, 2018 at 1:54 pm

    @The Dangerman: How about, “Why didn’t you stand?” It’s a bit ambiguous so it could be fleshed out with why didn’t you stand against Trump, against Russian interference, against corruption, etc. It’s also accusatory implying the need for a response. It also suggests weakness.

  186. 186.

    different-church-lady

    December 21, 2018 at 1:55 pm

    @jl: He’s selling subscriptions now?

  187. 187.

    different-church-lady

    December 21, 2018 at 1:55 pm

    @Lee: “What the fuck were you thinking?”

  188. 188.

    Immanentize

    December 21, 2018 at 1:59 pm

    Has anyone mentioned that there are not 50 votes to change the rules right now in Washington?

  189. 189.

    PJ

    December 21, 2018 at 2:01 pm

    @Lee: @different-church-lady: “How much did you get for your soul, or did you never have one?”

  190. 190.

    jl

    December 21, 2018 at 2:03 pm

    @Immanentize: None of the Senate GOPers who skipped town are coming back? If so, thanks for info. That would explain the GOP Senate’s stand, it is empty and they can’t do anything anyway. Would make sense.

  191. 191.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 2:04 pm

    @Rylan Futch:

    Wow. If that’s your real name, your parents must have hated you from the moment you were born.

    Explain how the Democrats got a new justice through the Senate once they lost their filibuster-proof majority in 2010. Step by step.

  192. 192.

    tam1MI

    December 21, 2018 at 2:07 pm

    I see that, “But these three cherry-picked sentences from a conversation held over a month ago” is the new ” But her e-mails”.

  193. 193.

    chopper

    December 21, 2018 at 2:08 pm

    @Immanentize:

    there aren’t even 50 senators in washington right now. they all went home after passing the clean CR.

    seriously, trump didn’t even coordinate this strategy. he waited until all the senate went home for vacation to throw a tantrum, blow the whole thing up and demand a do-over. now mcconnell has to convince all these guys to book a flight back to DC just to save trump from beclowning himself.

  194. 194.

    chopper

    December 21, 2018 at 2:09 pm

    @Rylan Futch:

    That’s my real name

    bullshit, that’s a harry potter character, i know it.

  195. 195.

    Brachiator

    December 21, 2018 at 2:11 pm

    @jl:

    ” relatively level-headed economist ” are a dime a dozen. Do you remember who said this?

    Christopher Thornberg of Beacon Economics. Previously, he would often appear on public radio station KPCC talking about the California economy and real estate market. He appears to be branching out more and talking about the national economy.

    Anyway, I made my case, people can read and make up their own minds. We;ll see what happens. I could be wrong. Maybe Trump will decide to end his trade war, and that will keep the recovery wheezing along to make 2020.

    I don’t think that Trump is smart enough to end his stupid trade war. But the economy will likely sputter along with strong corporate profits and stagnant real wages.

    We will also see another test of the impact of GOP tax reform this tax filing season. Should be interesting.

  196. 196.

    Gin & Tonic

    December 21, 2018 at 2:12 pm

    @chopper: Because it’s a slow day here, I googled that name, and came up with a Mormon from Monroe, Louisiana, who won some kind of a church award at age 15 back in 1984. Rylan now appears to live in NC, at which point I got tired of stalking.

  197. 197.

    Kent

    December 21, 2018 at 2:14 pm

    All Nancy Pelosi has to do is say that they won’t conference on any bill from the Senate that doesn’t have at least 60 votes.

    Mitch can approve all the judges he wants but can’t get a single piece of legislation through Congress without the House.

    Besides, Republicans are traditionally much more obstructionist than Democrats. They will NEVER give up their ability to obstruct legislation in the future next time Dems take control. Especially for this trivial of an issue.

  198. 198.

    Steeplejack

    December 21, 2018 at 2:14 pm

    @PJ:

    True. “Basic fact-checking” is just one part of the picture.

  199. 199.

    J R in WV

    December 21, 2018 at 2:17 pm

    @Lee:

    I’ve been kicking around a tag to use for when Republicans run for re-election in 2020.

    Something that indicates they could have prevented the shit show we are now dealing with.

    Something like ‘Where We You When We Needed You’.

    That’s too long, maybe BJer’s can come up with something a little more pithy.

    maybe:

    THANKS GOP!!

  200. 200.

    jl

    December 21, 2018 at 2:19 pm

    @Brachiator: Thanks. He is a fairly good forecaster, though I have some significant disagreements with him about best way to read the tea leaves.. I’ll go check on what he is saying.
    I think we are in a new pattern of recessions, since 2001, where financial markets tend to follow events in real markets.
    OK, that is an assumption that I am making about best way to monitor economy these days.
    So, a disclaimer no one should construe my speculations on the economy as any kind of investment advice.

    But, I have many email-beers to bet Brachiator that we are in a recession before 2020, nevertheless. With stakes like that, how can B not take the bet?

  201. 201.

    J R in WV

    December 21, 2018 at 2:21 pm

    @chopper:

    The GOP wins 49-49 with Dence as a tie-breaker.

  202. 202.

    chopper

    December 21, 2018 at 2:37 pm

    @Gin & Tonic:

    it’s a harry potter name. he was roommates with Cuthbert Wobbleflott in Hufflepuff house. this is some bullshit right here.

  203. 203.

    chopper

    December 21, 2018 at 2:40 pm

    @J R in WV:

    i was wrong, corker is back in town. dunno why he’s so interested in saving trump’s bacon, but there you go.

    i’m imagining all these GOP senators turning around and coming back to DC just to vote on a bill they know is DOA, all so trump can try and fail to pin this shutdown on someone else.

  204. 204.

    Another Scott

    December 21, 2018 at 2:40 pm

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques: The local single-family home market seemed to dry up around here around 6 months ago. Houses that would be sold in a week or so are now sitting on the market for months and months.

    But I wonder if those earlier sales were mostly driven by people hoping to flip them quickly, or hoping to turn them into AirBnB places. Both avenues to get rich quickly seem to have dried up.

    I don’t think we’re in a recession yet, and the Index of Leading Economic Indicators hasn’t pointed to one yet, either. But it’s easy to see that the economy is nervous and unless Donnie backs down on things like the steel and aluminum tariffs and all the rest, then the economy is going to have severe headwinds next year.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  205. 205.

    J R in WV

    December 21, 2018 at 2:41 pm

    @Eolirin:

    So why are they willing to make this a hill worth dying over, if it’s not about the appearance of dominance?

    They intend to steal most of that $5 billion — and if they can’t have the whole pot, their theft will be more noticeable.

  206. 206.

    Gin & Tonic

    December 21, 2018 at 2:41 pm

    @chopper: OK, if you say so. Never read those books nor watched any of the movies. But it also seems like it was/is a legit name for at least one USian.

  207. 207.

    Brachiator

    December 21, 2018 at 2:42 pm

    @jl:

    So, a disclaimer no one should construe my speculations on the economy as any kind of investment advice.

    Ha! No problem.

    But, I have many email-beers to bet Brachiator that we are in a recession before 2020, nevertheless. With stakes like that, how can B not take the bet?

    As you say, we will see what happens.

    Unfortunately, even if Trump craters the economy, his core supporters will continue to cling to him. It is strange and sad. I’ve seen conservatives who previously showed sparks of common sense jump through all kinds of mental hoops to rationalize his dumbest actions. He struck a nerve and feeds some essential need in these people. They can’t quit him. I am not sure what it would take to shake them loose.

  208. 208.

    Formerly disgruntled in Oregon

    December 21, 2018 at 2:44 pm

    @Kelly: That’s an exaggeration – 4 of Oregon’s congressional districts are represented by Democrats. (As you know) we don’t all live in Portland.

  209. 209.

    Raven Onthill

    December 21, 2018 at 2:49 pm

    There seems no simple way this can end. Maybe the Senate Democrats give in. Maybe Trump decides enough is enough. Other than that, this could drag on for years.

  210. 210.

    J R in WV

    December 21, 2018 at 2:50 pm

    @Rylan Futch:

    Wyrm-troll — so bad, just a few words was enough to see the sickness!

    Go away, don’t come another day!!

  211. 211.

    jl

    December 21, 2018 at 2:53 pm

    @Brachiator: OK, we’ll see. As long as we can lick them come election time, I don’t have much interest in what the hard core Trump base thinks.

    Looking at Thornberg’s economic blog at Beacon website, he seems to be betting that GDP growth will be somewhat stronger than most forecasters, based on growth estimates from income side being much stronger than from product side. Particularly, history of upward revisions of GDP stats based in growth in income accounts. And a commenter above is correct to mention leading indicators, which makes onset of an official recession doubtful for next 6 months to a year. But that leaves plenty of time for one before 2020, which is my main bet.

    OTOH, don’t need to wait for an official NBER dating of a recession for Trump and GOP to get hurt politically by slowing income growth.

    I’m glad that we all can agree that we’ll all see eventually how things play out.

  212. 212.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    December 21, 2018 at 2:55 pm

    @Another Scott:

    The local single-family home market seemed to dry up around here around 6 months ago. Houses that would be sold in a week or so are now sitting on the market for months and months.

    They both cited the housing market probably because their banks were involved in loans to flip houses. But I am wondering if the tight labor market and boomers retiring masks a lot of stuff.

  213. 213.

    J R in WV

    December 21, 2018 at 3:01 pm

    @jl:

    Baud 2020!!! Only Baud2020!

    It looks to me like Baud 2020!!! is three times more dynamic and exciting than Baud2020! could ever be?!?!

    ;-)

  214. 214.

    Kent

    December 21, 2018 at 3:05 pm

    It will end in a hurry when TSA employees stop showing up to work for no pay and airport travel comes to a halt during holiday travel season.

    I would not be surprised if we don’t start seeing massive “sick-outs” at airports around the country. Trump is going to demand they work for no pay when he is on his 16-day golf vacation? Bring that one on.

  215. 215.

    Bill Arnold

    December 21, 2018 at 3:17 pm

    Does anyone have a link to the continuing appropriations (+ more border security?) bill that the House of R passed? In particular, does it mention a wall at all or is it just more money to homeland security?
    (I searched briefly but found zero texts.)

  216. 216.

    Another Scott

    December 21, 2018 at 3:26 pm

    @Bill Arnold: GovExec story about the bill and the vote.

    The actual bill (59 page .PDF).

    HTH.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  217. 217.

    chopper

    December 21, 2018 at 3:56 pm

    @Gin & Tonic:

    i was kidding. tho Cuthbert Wobbleflott does sound like it’s right out of the series, don’t it.

  218. 218.

    Bill Arnold

    December 21, 2018 at 3:58 pm

    @Another Scott:
    Thanks!
    So all I see is this, on page 2:

    SEC 141. Notwithstanding any other provision of
    this Act, there is appropriated for ‘U.S. Customs and Bor-
    der Protection—Procurement, Construction, and Improve-
    ments’ $5,710,357,000 for fiscal year 2019, to remain
    available until September 30, 2023.

    And of course, no “wall” in that bill.
    So slush fund it is, and calling it funding for “The Wall” is a lie, or at least deeply misleading.

  219. 219.

    nasruddin

    December 21, 2018 at 5:06 pm

    The incoming senate is 54-~46 I think, and electoral trends look like this is near equilibrium for a while, with a large number (~30) of aging, depopulating states
    maintaining their 2 Republican senators indefinitely. Until we wise up and change this system, which looks like never.

    Therefore Mitch has 0 chance of this ever being a problem for him in his professional lifetime.

  220. 220.

    Ruckus

    December 21, 2018 at 6:16 pm

    @Another Scott:
    Never forget that individual 1 made whatever pitence he has by buying during a downturn. Which is not to say that there was ever any forethought on his part and he often invested at the worst investment times. But he’s creating a wealthy buyers market – known to most of us as a recession. Don’t assume that he’s doing this out of total ignorance/stupidity. He probably is, but it’s not impossible that he’s also evil

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