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You are here: Home / Past Elections / 2020 Elections / Election Open Thread: The 2020 Campaign Seems to Have Kicked Up A Notch…

Election Open Thread: The 2020 Campaign Seems to Have Kicked Up A Notch…

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On Thursday, two of the Democratic frontrunners went to South Carolina — not ‘First in the Nation’, but the first primary state where voters aren’t disproportionatly white. The NYTimes chose to highlight the Dems in disarray!!! angle, and to focus on Joe Biden. But IMO what’s important about the separate incidents is how the candidates handled them.

Elizabeth Warren’s event:

… Ms. Warren was in the opening minutes of her speech, a major address on racial inequities, when she was disrupted. In an interview, an organizer of the protest, Dianechia Fields, 40, who is from Memphis, criticized Ms. Warren for pledging to cut funding for charter schools. Ms. Warren’s education plan calls for ending federal funding for opening new charter schools and banning for-profit charters.

Ms. Warren eventually received some assistance from Representative Ayanna S. Pressley of Massachusetts, who had introduced her at the event. Ms. Pressley came back onstage and urged the protesters to let Ms. Warren proceed with her speech, which highlighted the story of black washerwomen who went on strike in Atlanta in 1881.

“We are grateful for your activism and your voice and you are welcome here, and we would love to convene after this about the issue that you are here to stoke our consciousness about,” Ms. Pressley said. “But when these women have been ignored this long, this is their moment, and we are going to hear the story.”…


Same state, different world:

… For more than six minutes in a palpably tense gym here during a town hall-style event at Lander University, Mr. Biden sparred with the activist, Carlos Rojas, an organizer with the immigrants’ rights group Movimiento Cosecha. The organization is urging presidential candidates to back a moratorium on deportations on their first day in office and has protested Mr. Biden before.

“You should vote for Trump,” Mr. Biden admonished Mr. Rojas during one of the most heated moments, after Mr. Rojas rattled off deportation figures under the Obama administration amid scattered cries of “give him the mic!”…

“If you were to be president, will you stop deportations on Day 1 through executive action?” Mr. Rojas asked.

“No,” Mr. Biden responded. “I will not stop all deportations. I will prioritize deportations only of people who have committed a felony or a serious crime, number one.”

He walked over to stand near Mr. Rojas and Silvia.

“Number two,” he continued, “to compare President Obama to this guy is outrageous.”

Mr. Biden went on to defend the Obama administration’s record on immigration, and said he would not discuss any areas of internal disagreement with Mr. Obama. And he repeatedly said he would not back a total moratorium on deportations, even as his remarks were punctuated several times by protesters who shouted, “Not one more deportation.” After Mr. Biden promised that there would not be family separations under his administration, someone shouted, “That’s a lie!”

“No matter what happens, someone commits murder, they shouldn’t be deported,” Mr. Biden said, characterizing the protesters’ position with an edge in his voice. By then, Mr. Rojas had left his seat and was standing next to Mr. Biden in the center of the room. “No, I’m asking you a question,” Mr. Biden added.

The exchange finally ended as the protesters left the room and the rest of the audience applauded Mr. Biden…

The clashes upended what had been an otherwise friendly town hall — but some voters afterward commended Mr. Biden’s stewardship of the incident.

Dan Healy, 70, said that he liked that Mr. Biden “said he wouldn’t stop deportations for criminals.”

“Yeah, he didn’t back down,” Mr. Healy’s wife, Lora Healy, 72, said…

The rules are changing. One of the things that impressed me about candidate Barack Obama, back in 2008, is that he’d learned valuable lessons from his time as a professional community organizer. It’s a much harder job than the scornful pundits’ conventional wisdom would have you believe, and part of the difficulty is that you can’t succeed unless / until you get ‘buy in’, however grudging, from a working majority of your coalition. Which means spending a lot of time dealing with tiresome cranks, one-issue fanatics, dedicated opponents determined to shout you down, and confused individuals who just wanna get the potholes on their particular street repaired. Mostly it’s enduring hours of boredom, but the kind of boredom where you can’t afford to lose focus, because while everybody must have their say, you can’t let the shouters intimidate the meek, or the ‘unwinnable’ derail the conversation.

Biden came up in Old School Original Gangster politics, where a guy made his bones by shouting down hecklers or encouraging his fans to do it for him. Every now and then, the OG would climb down into the pit to perform a primate dominance ritual, massaging a protestor into silence if they couldn’t be persuaded by a firm grip and a show of white teeth. This method… doesn’t work as well, a least for Democrats, in 2019.

Warren — and Pressley — only got into politics as the rules were changing. (And that’s been an advantage for them, because primate dominance never worked well for women.) They know they need to persuade the hecklers that their concerns are being taken seriously… while not letting any individual or subgroup derail the event, and without discouraging or frightening the rest of the audience.

The NYTimes, and the rest of the Media Village Idiots, still prefer the Stand-Up Performance they’ve gotten so expert at reporting, but this is just one more indication that the future is passing the NYTimes by. Big Swinging Dick arena performances still (seem to) work for Trump, and the (shrinking) Republican voter pool, but the Democratic candidates drawing enthusiastic attention right now seem to be those who hustle to ‘make connections’ with potential voters on a much more intimate scale. It’s not manly, it doesn’t make for a good ‘horse race’ lede, but I think our politics will be better for the evolution.

Reader Interactions

64Comments

  1. 1.

    Chyron HR

    “We came from all over the country in professionally-printed T-shirts for our grassroots protest!”

  3. 3.

    WereBear

    Toxic masculinity in all its forms must die. Everyone will be better off for it.

     

    Look at the immature, mindless, spoiled-brat of Kavanaugh. We’re told we get John Wayne. That’s not at all what we get.

  5. 5.

    Balconesfault

    Instead of ganging up on her over the Constitutionality of the wealth tax, or whether it would cause big dollar donors to sit out the cycle … People should note that it’s gotten a bunch of billionaires to be starting their interviews by saying “I’m all in favor of increasing my income tax rate”.

    Good for Dems to stop negotiating themselves down before ever reaching the table … after all, it did so much good for Obama’s ability to get bipartisan support for his legislative agenda, didn’t it?

  6. 6.

    David ??Booooooo?? Koch

    Fucking Bernie voted for Dump’s racist wall.  Why aren’t they protesting him.

     

    Fucking Bernie is in the pocket of the corporate gun manufactures.  Why aren’t they protesting him.

  7. 7.

    Steeplejack (phone)

    @Anne Laurie:

    Warren’s event was at Clark Atlanta University, not in South Carolina. Also, the first link in your Warren snippet goes to a Biden article. “Ms. Warren was in the opening minutes . . .”

  8. 8.

    NotMax

    @Steeplejack
    Thanks for clearing that up. Was confused about the intimation of an event to support Abrams’ election for governor of Georgia having been held in SC.

  9. 9.

    Steeplejack (phone)

    @NotMax:
    Apropos of nothing, Clark has a great jazz/urban contemporary radio station, WCLK. The late night jazz shows are great, which would be early evening for you.

  10. 10.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    We’re crossing the Atlantic for today and the following three days. I wasn’t sure how warm it would be at sea, but it was already in the 70s at 9am. We’ve met a couple from CA who watch the hearings avidly and want to talk about them. We knew they were safe to approach because the guy wore an anti-Trump T-shirt.

     

    Also, I’m on Mr DAW’s laptop and my info is sticking  tight.

  13. 13.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    @Steeplejack (phone): We’re slanting a little SW and will eventually dock in Recife, Brazil.

     

    One of the tours yesterday in Dakar went to Goree Island, just  off the coast. That’s the island from which slaves were shipped to the New World. You may have seen pictures of Obama, Bush, and Clinton visiting there. We didn’t go, but just looking out the window at it was appalling. It was like looking at a Nazi concentration camp

  14. 14.

    Ruckus

    @WereBear:

    We’re told we get John Wayne. That’s not at all what we get.

    IMHO, I think it might just be.

    That toxic masculinity that he played, the concept that the tough man was in charge, was superior, had to be allowed to do whatever he wanted, that was most of the characters he played. Only in his later films did that concept have the rough edges somewhat sanded down. The whole concept of the western was masculinity was far superior and violence was quite acceptable. For some reason I’m reminded of a jr high coach, a real asshole, I saw him pick up 7th grade boys standing next to me by the throat so he didn’t have to bend over, he could be a dick to them standing up. It’s better today, not much but better. Still needs improvement. A lot of it.

  15. 15.

    David ??Booooooo?? Koch

    Alexandra Jaffe @ajjaffe

    Tulsi Gabbard told me after this event she’s taking her campaign to the Dem convention, even if she doesn’t have enough delegates to win

    By my count, at most, she’ll have 4 delegates (from Hawaii caucus)

  16. 16.

    (((CassandraLeo)))

    Hecklers at a rally? Warren has a plan for that. It’s a major reason she remains my top candidate. She and Harris also seem to be the only ones who fully grasp what an existential threat to the long-term survival of human civilisation the Republican Party and especially this administration* are, which is why there’s such a long gap after Harris (my second choice) in my candidate ranking that I rarely even bother listing my third choice (and honestly, I’m not sure who my third choice would be, and since Warren is likely to remain in the primary until the end, it’s not even really that important.)

     

    The GOP must be burned to the ground, the fields salted, a stake driven through its heart, shot with a silver bullet, and surrounded by garlic and holy water for good measure. My candidate ranking largely depends on candidates recognising this. It’s also why I close every comment I make (barring the ones where I just forget) with the repurposed Cato quote (“Furthermore, I opine that the Republican Party must be destroyed”, for those whose education in Roman history didn’t cover the destruction of Carthage). The survival of humanity (and millions of other species at a minimum) depends upon the Republican Party’s destruction.

     

    Ceterum censeo factionem Republicanam esse delendam.

  19. 19.

    Steeplejack

    @(((CassandraLeo))):

    Hecklers at a rally? Warren has a plan for that.

    Which some Sandernista (mis)characterized thus:

    The paid protestors are charter school parents but Elizabeth Warren went into freeze mode. She could not handle it.

    Rep. Pressley had to walk up onto the stage, take control and show Elizabeth Warren how it's done.https://t.co/JyJtUSRrYC

    — ?BERNforBernie2020? (@BernForBernie20) November 22, 2019

  20. 20.

    OzarkHillbilly

    I see nothing wrong with the way Biden handled it. He handled it in the way that best suits him. If it had been me I’d have just had them tossed. Not arrested, but tossed They have the right to protest. They do not have the right to hijack my event.

  22. 22.

    NotMax

    @David Booooooo Koch

    The D party in Hawaii has moved away from caucuses and to a ranked choice primary procedure. Gabbard is guaranteed exactly one of the 33* delegates Hawaii will send to the national convention – that being herself (both Senators and both Representatives are automatically sent as delegates**).

    *Wikipedia incorrectly lists the number as 31.

    **IIRC as so-called superdelegates, who under convention rules now in effect do not vote on the first ballot at the convention unless the nomination is uncontested.

  24. 24.

    NotMax

    @NotMax

    For clarification, the Congresspersons sent as delegates are nominally sent as unpledged, but it is hardly a leap to see her casting a vote for herself should voting extend beyond a first ballot.

  27. 27.

    Gvg

    I think Biden handled himself just fine here. Giving in on not deporting criminals would have given the Republicans sound bite ads and lost a few potential voters. Giving in and saying he disagreed with things Obama did, would have hurt him with black Americans….and a fair number of other Democrats too.

    i think they both did fine.

  31. 31.

    What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?

    Which means spending a lot of time dealing with tiresome cranks, one-issue fanatics, dedicated opponents determined to shout you down, and confused individuals who just wanna get the potholes on their particular street repaired. Mostly it’s enduring hours of boredom, but the kind of boredom where you can’t afford to lose focus, because while everybody must have their say, you can’t let the shouters intimidate the meek, or the ‘unwinnable’ derail the conversation.

    This is what Parks and Rec (the TV show) got so brilliantly right about local government public meetings. I half suspect the writers just sat in the back of city government public forums running a tape recorder and then just transcribed what they got on tape, with minor modifications, for the script.

  32. 32.

    NotMax

    Woo. Buffeting winds, big boomies and rain outside. We need that last. Whole cottage shaking in the gusts.

  35. 35.

    oatler.

    @Gvg: Biden lost the election when he said weed is a gateway drug.I can’t forgive him for the RAVE Act, A Republican in thought and deed.

  36. 36.

    rikyrah

    Deporting criminals is a no brainer. Take their protests to MoscowMitch or any other Republican, who has been SILENT on the attacks on immigrants. Folks peeped out who sent the protesters to Warren’s event? I want to know who sent the protesters to Biden’s. Because, anyone demanding that Biden stop deporting phucking CRIMINALS,  when the scope of the attack on immigrants by THIS Administration is so VAST, they aren’t serious. They gotta be PAID.???

  38. 38.

    Betty Cracker

    @What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?: I was just thinking about the Parks & Rec depiction of local government meetings the other day. I live in the Confederate backwater that recently became a global laughingstock because a few Great Value-brand Trump knockoffs on the county commission overruled the library director’s decision to make a digital subscription to the NYT available to cardholders instead of just the print version that has long been available at local libraries.

     

    Never mind that a digital subscription would have saved money in the long run while greatly increasing access — the ignorant blowhards nixed the plan because “fake news!” The subsequent local government meetings resembled a Parks & Rec parody in every detail.

     

    We had Fox-addled nitwits shambling forth to demand that the library subscribe to Breitbart (it’s free) for “balance.” Some of us who are pro-NYT (the irony!) were denounced as carpetbagging elitists by transplanted Midwestern retirees — despite our families squatting in this benighted swamp for nearly two centuries.

     

    I’ve rarely seen more concentrated stupidity and braying ignorance in one spot, and having lived in Florida all my life, by God, that’s saying something.

  39. 39.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @Betty Cracker:

     

    I’ve rarely seen more concentrated stupidity and braying ignorance in one spot, and having lived in Florida all my life, by God, that’s saying something.

    HA! Starting my day with a laugh, thankyou Betty.

  40. 40.

    Jeffro

    @Balconesfault: That’s a good point.  It really is good negotiating.

     

    Billionaires: “Don’t take from my pile o’ loot – but yeah, we can talk about slowing the rate that I am adding to it.”

  42. 42.

    Jeffro

    @(((CassandraLeo))): The GOP must be burned to the ground…

     

     

    And it should.  It represents exactly ZERO majority positions at this point, but (as you noted) it does represent a lot of positions that are getting people killed.

     

    Btw folks Catherine Rampell has a nice big-picture take of the last Dem debate up in today’s Post.  Generally speaking, the Dems are not that far apart on policy and they clearly represent the majority in this country – in some cases, the vast majority (as with universal background checks, action on climate change, etc)

     

    No amount of Walton-printed t-shirts can change that!

  46. 46.

    mrmoshpotato

    @SFAW: You and OH.  I’m content with a soundproof room.  Let ’em yell about the meanie DNC to their hearts’ content at each other.

  52. 52.

    gene108

    @rikyrah:

     

     

    Obama, initially, ran a very strict immigration policy. His goal was to prove to hesitant Republicans that all immigration laws could be complied with, therefore they should be on board with reform.

    Obama had record high deportation numbers, until he realized Republicans were never going to agree to reform.

    Immigration activists protested Obama’s strict immigration policy, but they never got much attention

    Don’t think anyone put those immigration protestors up bringing up Obama’s immigration policy with Biden.

  53. 53.

    HinTN

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: Apropos of your comment

    It was like looking at a Nazi concentration camp

    I highly recommend that every movie buff go see JoJo Rabbit. It’s amazing in too many ways to recount. You will not be disappointed.

     

    For Watergirl:

    Nym and email are sticking fine on Android running Chrome.

  54. 54.

    HinTN

    @Betty Cracker:

    despite our families squatting in this benighted swamp for nearly two centuries.

    Tell it, girl.

     

    I see @SFAW: got there firstest and bestest. Many laughs this morning thanks to you,  Ms C.

  55. 55.

    Citizen_X

    @Betty Cracker: Ooh, I didn’t realize you were right in the middle of that dumbassery. I don’t know if you take requests, but I think that calls for the full Betty Cracker post treatment. If’n you’re not too busy or anything.

  56. 56.

    Betty Cracker

    @Baud: The same morons would have the same objections to The Post. My position is that the county employs a professional to make those decisions, so they should let him do his job.

     

    @Citizen_X: Maybe I’ll do a cartoon about it someday. Been meaning to do more cartoons!

  57. 57.

    SFAW

    This may have been covered elsewhere in this joint, but apparently the senior traitor from SC (i.e., Graham) sent a letter to the Traitor Pompeo, seeking materials related to then-Vice President Joe Biden’s interactions with Ukrainian officials.

     

    As I said over at Josh’s site: I look forward to the day that Graham is convicted of Treason

     

    ETA: Which raises an interesting thought: does Graham doing this amount to giving “aid and comfort to the Enemy,” i.e., Donald J. Trump? Because it could be argued that Trump is an Enemy of the Constitutional order/government of the United States.

  59. 59.

    Kay

    Kind of an interesting backstory here. Not really “backstory” but there’s a history between Warren and the Walton-funded charter groups.
    The Walton-funded charter groups have a “news” site (The 74) and the allegation was they targeted Warren for attacks. One of the board members of the “news” site is Campbell Brown- she’s the former cable tv news person who is a Right winger.
    Campbell Brown is also the director of Facebook’s “news” division, which, you know, may explain why Facebook is a Right wing media organization.

    This is Brown defending her dual roles at The 74 and Facebook:

    There are accusations The 74 has it in for Elizabeth Warren. But all the negative pieces cited are labeled opinion. In journalism there is a difference between opinion and reported pieces. That’s why opinion is clearly labeled.

    The Waltons would go after Warren no matter the issue, but this is the issue they chose to attack her on.

  60. 60.

    SFAW

    @Searcher:

    you know, on the new site, we now have the option of developing a new convention of, say, sarcasm pink.

    But then the RWMFs couldn’t read the comments, because “I don’t see color.”

  64. 64.

    The Lodger

    @Ruckus: It’s nice to see another commenter has ol’ Marion’s number. I don’t know how easy it is, though, to distinguish toxic masculinity from sheer phoniness, Being John Wayne, especially younger John Wayne, was always an act.

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