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You are here: Home / Open Threads / Views of Exiting Empire

Views of Exiting Empire

by @heymistermix.com|  October 19, 20202:21 pm| 164 Comments

This post is in: Open Threads

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I think we all assumed that Trump and Scott Walker’s Foxconn announcement in 2018 would amount to nothing, but perhaps not this:

Months after the 2018 groundbreaking, the company was racing to hire the 260 people needed to receive the first tranche of payments from the lucrative subsidy package passed by then-Gov. Scott Walker. Recruiters were told to hit the number but given little in the way of job descriptions. Soon, the office began to fill with people who had nothing to do. Many just sat in their cubicles watching Netflix and playing games on their phones. The reality of their situation became impossible to ignore. Multiple employees recall seeing people cry in the office. “The best is when you’re in the elevator with somebody and then they just scream out of nowhere,” said an employee who experienced this several times. “They’ve had enough, because things don’t make sense here.”

“Imagine being in a job where you don’t really know if it’s real or not. Or you know it’s not real, but you don’t know it’s not real. It’s a constant thing you’re doing in your head day after day,” said one employee, who returned to the rented building Trump had spoken at, where workers had been assembling TVs, only to find the line shut down and the lights dimmed a couple of weeks after the photo op was over. “I think all of us were on the verge of a major breakdown.”

Jobs without job descriptions, fake assembly lines, and a “fab plant” that was recently reclassified to storage are just a few of the many parts of this complete fraud detailed in this excellent story by Josh Dzieza at the Verge, a technology news site.  The net of the piece is that there isn’t, and will never be, a Foxconn plant that makes anything in Wisconsin.

If Biden wins, there will be a major effort to stuff this kind of fraud down the memory hole, in preparation for a 2022 backlash election powered by Biden’s inability to completely control COVID after a month in office, and Democrats’ inability to reverse a recession caused by McConnell’s refusal to pass more stimulus.  We need a truth commission, an audit report, and some fucking prosecutions, or we’ll be in a worse spot in a couple of years.

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Reader Interactions

164Comments

  1. 1.

    Baud

    October 19, 2020 at 2:23 pm

    Soon, the office began to fill with people who had nothing to do.

    Are they still hiring?

  2. 2.

    lowtechcyclist

    October 19, 2020 at 2:25 pm

    Sounds like worse than nothing. Not only is Wisconsin not getting anything worth having, but the local government spent millions, people were kicked out of their homes to make way for Foxconn, and it consumed a shitload of time and energy from people in state and local governments that could have been spent dealing with real issues.

    Fuck Trump, and fuck Scott Walker.

  3. 3.

    lowtechcyclist

    October 19, 2020 at 2:26 pm

    @Baud: Probably in December, in hopes of meeting a jobs target that gets them money from the state if they meet it.

    Until then, probably not.

  4. 4.

    Old School

    October 19, 2020 at 2:31 pm

    Trump was on a Milwaukee station over the weekend and when asked about Foxconn insisted that they were still planning on hiring everyone they originally promised.

  5. 5.

    Baud

    October 19, 2020 at 2:31 pm

    @Old School: “They’re going to start hiring right after I release my health care plan.”

  6. 6.

    Jeffro

    October 19, 2020 at 2:32 pm

    We need a truth commission, an audit report, and some fucking prosecutions

    And tumbrels, don’t forget the tumbrels

  7. 7.

    Feathers

    October 19, 2020 at 2:33 pm

    What’s crazy is that they could just hire novelists and other writers/creatives who need day jobs, make sure there’s enough wi-fi, and everyone’s happy.

    You would eventually end up with an alarming number of exposés, however.

  8. 8.

    Bill K

    October 19, 2020 at 2:33 pm

    This was all predictable.  Foxconn had no real incentive to build this plant.  Cheap labor?  Close to suppliers?  What?  Other than a photo op there was no reason to do this.  And Foxconn was already guilty of this same con in the past.  They had done it in Brazil and Pennsylvania.

    With a little creative thinking Wisconsin could have looked around for a local company to do a much better job.  Plexus is a PCB company that competes globally just like Foxconn.  They don’t need netting around their buildings to catch suicide attempts.  (granted, most of their buildings are only one story).  The Walker administration could have spun a tale of sticking it to China and promoting local industry.  Instead they slobbered all over Foxconn.

  9. 9.

    Other Other Other John

    October 19, 2020 at 2:33 pm

    Just coming off Lurker status to say, that is an EXCELLENT headline and a perfect song lyric for our times.

  10. 10.

    Old School

    October 19, 2020 at 2:35 pm

    @Baud: Well, he did imply that they’d only do it if Trump gets reelected.

  11. 11.

    westyny

    October 19, 2020 at 2:36 pm

    I’d like a “journalist” to track down Scott Walker and ask him about this.

  12. 12.

    Geeno

    October 19, 2020 at 2:38 pm

    @Baud: I was wondering if I could work remotely.

  13. 13.

    MattF

    October 19, 2020 at 2:39 pm

    It’s interesting to the degree that Foxconn management assumed they were doing what Trump wanted. One assumes that there was also some underground cashflow among the various guilty parties– might be good to look into that.

  14. 14.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    October 19, 2020 at 2:41 pm

    @Feathers: LOL. What a great take. And so true.

  15. 15.

    JCNZ

    October 19, 2020 at 2:48 pm

    HELL YES to every word. (also, Baud on fire today!)

  16. 16.

    Nicole

    October 19, 2020 at 2:49 pm

    If Biden wins, there will be a major effort to stuff this kind of fraud down the memory hole, in preparation for a 2022 backlash election powered by Biden’s inability to completely control COVID after a month in office, and Democrats’ inability to reverse a recession caused by McConnell’s refusal to pass more stimulus.  We need a truth commission, an audit report, and some fucking prosecutions, or we’ll be in a worse spot in a couple of years.

    This this this.  It’s on all of us to keep pressure on the representatives we worked to get elected to remind them what we expect from them.

  17. 17.

    Brachiator

    October 19, 2020 at 2:54 pm

    @Baud:

    Soon, the office began to fill with people who had nothing to do.

    Are they still hiring?

    Very droll.

    @Geeno:

    I was wondering if I could work remotely.

    Ha!

    Mockery is the best way to react to this bullshit.

  18. 18.

    Ken

    October 19, 2020 at 2:56 pm

    @lowtechcyclist: You forgot to mention that the December hires will be terminated as soon as Foxconn gets the money from the state.  Then again, so did Foxconn and Walker and Trump and…

  19. 19.

    Ken

    October 19, 2020 at 2:57 pm

    @westyny: I’d like a “journalist” to track down Scott Walker and ask him about this.

    Are the quotes around “journalist” because you don’t think much of the profession, or because you’re using it as a euphemism for “really big guy with a nail-studded baseball bat”?

  20. 20.

    Eric S.

    October 19, 2020 at 2:58 pm

    This deal was pushed by politicians and business leaders in the MIL area. My company had their fingers in the pot. We had an executive that referred to himself as Mr. Foxconn. I was incredulous at a company meeting 2.5 years ago when they spent over an hour patting themselves on the back. I’m not snickering at them.

    Also too, prosecute the heck out of them.

  21. 21.

    mad citizen

    October 19, 2020 at 2:58 pm

    I recalled in my world an expedited transmission project (line, substation, etc.) was approved in early 2018 for this project.  Haven’t tracked down the current status, but found a news report (SPGlobal Feb 2019)  stating: “American Transmission, or ATC, is building new transmission lines and a substation to supply electricity to the facility and has already spent $23.5 million on the roughly $117 million project, according to a progress report filed with Wisconsin regulators Jan. 30.”

    Sorry to all the Wisconsin ratepayers.

  22. 22.

    germy

    October 19, 2020 at 2:59 pm

    Bob Hope and Ann Jillian as "Donald and Ivana Frump" (1990): pic.twitter.com/qKL0tvYdI5

    — Steve Kornacki (@SteveKornacki) October 19, 2020

  23. 23.

    burnspbesq

    October 19, 2020 at 3:00 pm

    Foxconn currently has 30 percent of production outside of China, up from 25 percent one year ago. The company is eyeing several new locations, including India, Vietnam, Mexico, Brazil, and the United States.

    https://www.techspot.com/news/86350-foxconn-china-can-no-longer-world-factory.html

    Given its stellar performance in containing the pandemic, I’d bet heavily on Vietnam.

  24. 24.

    germy

    October 19, 2020 at 3:00 pm

    It’s hard to beat a fascist movement at the polls. “Fire intentionally set inside ballot box in Baldwin Park, officials say” https://t.co/DyyOzTL6hY

    — Joshua Holland ? (@JoshuaHol) October 19, 2020

  25. 25.

    Brachiator

    October 19, 2020 at 3:01 pm

    If Biden wins, there will be a major effort to stuff this kind of fraud down the memory hole, in preparation for a 2022 backlash election powered by Biden’s inability to completely control COVID after a month in office, and Democrats’ inability to reverse a recession caused by McConnell’s refusal to pass more stimulus.

    Let’s just win and see what the situation is in January.

    We need a truth commission, an audit report, and some fucking prosecutions, or we’ll be in a worse spot in a couple of years.

    Truth commissions are a waste of time. The denialism is too thick among right wingers. Some prosecutions might be good.

  26. 26.

    lowtechcyclist

    October 19, 2020 at 3:03 pm

    @Ken:

    @lowtechcyclist: You forgot to mention that the December hires will be terminated as soon as Foxconn gets the money from the state.  Then again, so did Foxconn and Walker and Trump and…

    I never quite figured out from the article where or how the workers who are currently there got hired, whether some of them were hired as part of the December push.  Seems like they have enough attrition that they’d have to keep some of them…

  27. 27.

    gene108

    October 19, 2020 at 3:05 pm

    From what I have read about communist countries, throwing something up for a photo-op to fool Western imperialists was pretty common.

    My take is this has more to do with how Chinese companies operate, as well as Walker’s naivety, than anything else.

  28. 28.

    burnspbesq

    October 19, 2020 at 3:06 pm

    @Brachiator:

    Some prosecutions might be good.

    AG may be THE key hire in a Biden Administration. There is no shortage of qualified candidates, but I like Maura Healy (Mass. AG) best of all.

  29. 29.

    NotMax

    October 19, 2020 at 3:06 pm

    “I’m pleased to report to the esteemed board of directors that our U.S. plant has found a way to completely eliminate paying overtime.”

    //

  30. 30.

    Bluegirlfromwyo

    October 19, 2020 at 3:08 pm

    No one could have predicted Potemkin on Lake Michigan.

  31. 31.

    burnspbesq

    October 19, 2020 at 3:08 pm

    @gene108:

    Hon Hai (Foxconn’s parent) is Taiwanese, but it seems they learned some things operating in China).

  32. 32.

    Kent

    October 19, 2020 at 3:11 pm

    So, what’s the situation on the ground in WI? Is this FoxCONN fiasco helping the argument against Trump? Is it affecting the 2020 election in any way?

    As for truth and reconciliation commissions? Sure. But the more important objective is to absolutely cement voting rights and elections so that they can’t ratfuck the 2022 elections and need to compete honestly. I like our chances in free and fair elections. We will win more than we lose.

  33. 33.

    prostratedragon

    October 19, 2020 at 3:13 pm

    I’ve never been able to get past the name “Foxconn.”

    But this is a huge travesty against the people of Wisconsin. Proving fraud can be hard, but someone might try. Can one fall this short and over time by accident? Truth commission if the prosecutors get nowhere fast.

  34. 34.

    Wyatt Salamanca

    October 19, 2020 at 3:14 pm

    OT

    What the Fuck!!!

    The New Yorker has suspended reporter Jeffrey Toobin. Sources tell VICE it’s because he exposed himself during a Zoom call last week between members of the New Yorker and WNYC radio.

    Toobin said in a statement to Motherboard: “I made an embarrassingly stupid mistake, believing I was off-camera. I apologize to my wife, family, friends and co-workers.”

    “I believed I was not visible on Zoom. I thought no one on the Zoom call could see me. I thought I had muted the Zoom video,” he added.

     

    h/t https://www.vice.com/en/article/epdgm4/new-yorker-suspends-jeffrey-toobin-for-zoom-dick-incident

  35. 35.

    prostratedragon

    October 19, 2020 at 3:15 pm

    @Wyatt Salamanca:  Just saw that a moment ago. This week in “Know Your Technology.”

  36. 36.

    RaflW

    October 19, 2020 at 3:15 pm

    “We need a truth commission, an audit report, and some fucking prosecutions, or we’ll be in a worse spot in a couple of years.”

    The wretched Nick Kristoff was flogging the ‘bygones’ effort in the past day or two. Expect far worse in the months ahead.

    (I attended a human rights gala five years ago that headlined Kristoff. As far as I’m concerned he stole the speaking fee, he put so little time or effort into the talk. I’ve cordially hated him ever since).

  37. 37.

    RaflW

    October 19, 2020 at 3:17 pm

    @Wyatt Salamanca: Please don both upper-wear and lower-wear when attending a zoom meeting.

    -HR Dept.

  38. 38.

    gene108

    October 19, 2020 at 3:17 pm

    Truth and Reconciliation Commissions with Republicans will never work.

    If Republicans ever admitted the truth, they would have to admit they, their billionaire backers, and the religious right are all wrong, as well.

    They have too much incentive (billionaire bucks) to never admit a mistake.

  39. 39.

    jonas

    October 19, 2020 at 3:18 pm

    @burnspbesq: My short list: Adam Schiff, Chris Murphy, or Doug Jones (if he loses AL).

  40. 40.

    Archon

    October 19, 2020 at 3:20 pm

    Anyone want to know what will happen when Republicans know they can’t win elections, take a look at the behavior of the Republican Party of California.

    The fever will not break.

  41. 41.

    gene108

    October 19, 2020 at 3:20 pm

    @Wyatt Salamanca:

    Bullshit it was an accident. When you “Stop video” on a Zoom feed, your little Zoom window where you see yourself goes black.

    There’s no way after months of at least near daily Zoom meetings people can be this forgetful.

  42. 42.

    germy

    October 19, 2020 at 3:21 pm

    @Wyatt Salamanca:

    Zoom Dick Incident  would make a mighty fine name for a band.

    I remember Toobin way back in the ’90s, accusing O.J. Simpson’s lawyers of “playing the race card” during his murder trial.

    And then a Black lawyer responded by saying it would be malpractice if the lawyers hadn’t.  She said just look at the history of the LAPD, for God’s sake.

    Toobin will get a time out, and then he’ll be back telling us all what to believe.

  43. 43.

    Sure Lurkalot

    October 19, 2020 at 3:23 pm

    Let’s not forget the water diversion from Lake Michigan. Everything about this “deal” is a disaster.

  44. 44.

    matt

    October 19, 2020 at 3:25 pm

    Having unlimited billionaire-funded media for the right and a few little blogs and twitter for the left has created a power imbalance that has to be addressed.

  45. 45.

    Baud

    October 19, 2020 at 3:26 pm

    @Wyatt Salamanca: 

    Even I wear clothes when on a work-related call.

  46. 46.

    chopper

    October 19, 2020 at 3:27 pm

    @Baud: 

    as soon as the audit is over, they’ll hire millions.

  47. 47.

    Elizabelle

    October 19, 2020 at 3:28 pm

    @Other Other Other John:  You and mistermix made me look.  And “Views of Exiting Empires” is a wonderful phrase.

    From song:  by Andrew Bird.  The song:  Scythian Empire:  youtube link.

    The lyrics.

  48. 48.

    Just One More Canuck

    October 19, 2020 at 3:28 pm

    @Baud: Do they let people work remotely

    ETA – damn you Geeno – I should read the comments first

  49. 49.

    germy

    October 19, 2020 at 3:30 pm

    In 1986, Toobin married Amy Bennett McIntosh. They have two adult children, a daughter and son.

    Toobin had a longtime off and on extramarital affair with attorney Casey Greenfield. She is the daughter of American television journalist and author Jeff Greenfield and the ex-wife of screenwriter Matt Manfredi. They had a child in 2009, which Toobin initially resisted acknowledging. Ultimately, Toobin’s paternity was confirmed with a DNA test and separately, a Manhattan Family Court judge ordered Toobin to pay child support.

    (Life among our Media Betters)

  50. 50.

    Ruckus

    October 19, 2020 at 3:30 pm

    Until we figure out how to run a country with 30-40% of the population being petulant children, we are going to be in this roller coaster ride of completely shitty political malpractice, followed by 8 years of minimal cleanup and then another round of  the same. It is a ridiculous concept of government, all for the enrichment of a few massively over indulged assholes.

  51. 51.

    Delk

    October 19, 2020 at 3:30 pm

    At least they won’t be fucking around with Lake Michigan’s water. Assholes.

  52. 52.

    trollhattan

    October 19, 2020 at 3:31 pm

    @RaflW: 
    “I was told it was pants-optional!”

  53. 53.

    Wyatt Salamanca

    October 19, 2020 at 3:33 pm

    @gene108:

    Truth and Reconciliation Commissions

    Personally, I prefer Truth and Consequences Commission.

    I don’t believe any kind of commission will be created.  I’m just hoping the offices of the NY Attorney General or Manhattan District Attorney will get its ducks in a row and indict this ratfucking Trump after he loses the election.  This guy belongs in prison.

  54. 54.

    different-church-lady

    October 19, 2020 at 3:34 pm

    @Wyatt Salamanca:  Holy christ, has the man never heard of the PostIt Note?

  55. 55.

    scav

    October 19, 2020 at 3:36 pm

    @RaflW: 

    Please don both upper-wear and lower-wear when attending a zoom meeting.

    Hat and shoes.
    Done and dusted.

  56. 56.

    mrmoshpotato

    October 19, 2020 at 3:37 pm

    Even with snorting freighter-load of coke, Donnie Jr. can still have a SAD!

    The “Fuck Your Feelings” crowd sure is emo AF. https://t.co/M9dhf6Erzh— Rex Huppke (@RexHuppke) October 19, 2020

    Awwww……whiny ass mobster motherfucker!

  57. 57.

    mrmoshpotato

    October 19, 2020 at 3:38 pm

    @scav: Well played.

  58. 58.

    orsonk

    October 19, 2020 at 3:39 pm

    Thanks for this post. Jesus, we really will need to not let people forget all the dishonesty and corruption of the last four years.

  59. 59.

    rp

    October 19, 2020 at 3:40 pm

    @germy:  OTOH, Toobin’s book about the OJ trial was excellent. And while it’s true that OJ’s lawyers did their job by bringing up the race card, there’s no reason an outside observer such as Toobin has to sit back and ignore the fact that Simpson was guilty.

  60. 60.

    mrmoshpotato

    October 19, 2020 at 3:42 pm

    @different-church-lady: Kudos for them putting “dick-incident” in the URL.

    Also (too), seriously!  You could even drap a folded piece of paper over your webcam – or – where a pair of shorts!

  61. 61.

    Raven

    October 19, 2020 at 3:43 pm

    About an hour to vote here.

  62. 62.

    germy

    October 19, 2020 at 3:44 pm

    @rp:

    I never read it.  But I know he’s a clever writer, like a few of the New Yorker Magazine folks who turned out to be shitty people.

  63. 63.

    mrmoshpotato

    October 19, 2020 at 3:48 pm

    @Baud:

    Even I wear clothes when on a work-related call. 

    Would you mind affording that courtesy to commenting here too?

  64. 64.

    FridayNext

    October 19, 2020 at 3:48 pm

    I feel like this might have been a Max Barry novel. Didn’t that turn out to be some corporate experiment and multiple deaths ensued?

  65. 65.

    MisterForkbeard

    October 19, 2020 at 3:49 pm

    @Wyatt Salamanca: If he’s telling the truth (probably) he’s guilty of a thoroughly understandable but incredibly unprofessional action.

    It’s pretty normal for people to attend a zoom meeting without pants, or to have mute on and have something else going on. It sounds like he did something really, really stupid and then fucked up his Zoom settings

    @gene108: I go the other way on this. Everyone does this kind of stuff sometimes (though probably not what he did). Being all Zoom all the time increases the chance that you fuck up. If you’ve got a 1% chance of screwing it up but are in Zoom 50x as much, then you’re much more likely to have a mistake. :/

  66. 66.

    Baud

    October 19, 2020 at 3:49 pm

    @mrmoshpotato: No.

  67. 67.

    Elizabelle

    October 19, 2020 at 3:49 pm

    @mrmoshpotato: 

    “the Biden crime family.”

    Again, with Trumps: every accusation a confession.

    I hope these people do some serious prison time.

  68. 68.

    pamelabrown53

    October 19, 2020 at 3:51 pm

    @germy:

    Truthfully, I’m not interested in the “shittiness” of some of the New Yorker’s journalists. Why I both read and subscribe is because the New Yorker is known for its stellar standards: whatever the story I know it’s been thoroughly vetted before it graces their pages.

  69. 69.

    narya

    October 19, 2020 at 3:52 pm

    What I would like to see is matter-of-fact investigations and, where warranted, prosecutions. Lots of “we do not speak about ongoing matters” when asked for comments about what’s going on; if necessary, add “we do not want to unfairly target anyone.” Make it as bland as possible on the outside, and bring the hammer when the ducks are arrayed nicely. Target the clear and egregious violations (oh, there are so many . . .).

  70. 70.

    MisterForkbeard

    October 19, 2020 at 3:53 pm

    @FridayNext: This sounds like it was lifted out of his Jennifer Government novel. Which was really quite lovely.

    @Elizabelle: Ugh. Tell me about it. These guys are almost certainly committing tax fraud at a minimum for money much more than they’ve even accused Hunter Biden of making. And that’s in addition to the various campaign finance laws, secrecy laws, ethics laws and others that they break on a daily basis.

    I really hope they do time. They probably won’t, but they all should. All of them.

  71. 71.

    Gin & Tonic

    October 19, 2020 at 3:53 pm

    @germy:  Dude gets around. And here I looked at him and always thought he was kind of a nebbish.

  72. 72.

    Delk

    October 19, 2020 at 3:55 pm

    Hubby just got back from dropping off his ballot. Apparently he just missed some whack job who was refusing to wear a mask. Then she ran around coughing on everybody.

  73. 73.

    Sebastian

    October 19, 2020 at 3:57 pm

    @lowtechcyclist:

    Looks like premeditated fraud to me and should be prosecuted to the full extend of the law.

  74. 74.

    Wyatt Salamanca

    October 19, 2020 at 3:58 pm

    @prostratedragon: @RaflW: @gene108: @germy: @Baud:

    What do you get when you put Jeffrey Toobin, Charlie Rose, Matt Lauer, and Bill O’Reilly together?

    DNN – The Dick News Network. the first all news channel for dicks hosted by dicks.

    Yes, I know Toobin did not do anything approaching the acts that Rose, Lauer, and O’Reilly committed. The common thing they all share is the massive fucking stupidity.

  75. 75.

    Punchy

    October 19, 2020 at 4:00 pm

    @germy: expecting to see a lot more of this.  Fire, glue, organic solvents…..whatever it takes to destroy the ballots inside.

    First they came for the mailman but couldn’t jack it up enough.  Now they’ll go for his inorganic surrogate, destroying these boxes everywhere they can.

  76. 76.

    mrmoshpotato

    October 19, 2020 at 4:01 pm

    @burnspbesq:

    AG may be THE key hire in a Biden Administration. 

     Psst.

    If you want an Attorney General to go after Trump aggressively, I have a better suggestion than Andrew Cuomo. pic.twitter.com/YhF7ZoBqkS— Hillary Warned Us to Vote Early (@HillaryWarnedUs) October 17, 2020

  77. 77.

    debbie

    October 19, 2020 at 4:02 pm

    @Delk:

    She should be arrested for assault with a biological weapon.

  78. 78.

    prostratedragon

    October 19, 2020 at 4:02 pm

    @Sure Lurkalot:  Oh thanks for the reminder! No, let’s not. The Lakes, and that one especially it seems, are in play to some.

  79. 79.

    rp

    October 19, 2020 at 4:03 pm

    Who sits on a chair — any kind of chair — without pants or underwear? Gross

  80. 80.

    mrmoshpotato

    October 19, 2020 at 4:03 pm

    @Bluegirlfromwyo:

    No one could have predicted Potemkin on Lake Michigan.

    Please keep our great lake out of this.  It’s innocent – and delicious.

    ETA – Oh, and Wisconsinites would throw Scott Walker into Green Bay (the actual bay) if they knew what was good for them.

  81. 81.

    MattF

    October 19, 2020 at 4:04 pm

    OT. Twitter has questions.

  82. 82.

    Sebastian

    October 19, 2020 at 4:05 pm

    @pamelabrown53:

    Bullshit. That’s provably wrong.

  83. 83.

    Raoul Paste

    October 19, 2020 at 4:05 pm

    The Foxconn story is a perfect 60 Minutes piece

    And yes, prosecute these people for calculated fraud

  84. 84.

    MisterForkbeard

    October 19, 2020 at 4:07 pm

    @burnspbesq: Not that this is even being considered, but can you be AG and… the vice president? :)

  85. 85.

    Raven

    October 19, 2020 at 4:07 pm

    @Delk: I ll dust a motherfucker who tried that here.

  86. 86.

    Punchy

    October 19, 2020 at 4:09 pm

    @burnspbesq: Obama’s a lawyer, right?

  87. 87.

    Dan B

    October 19, 2020 at 4:10 pm

    @matt: Absolutely agree with the media imbalance.  New Zealand eliminated Murdoch and claim their politics is not as partisan.  I believe it.  You can’t have Himmler 2.0 and keep the fascist tendencies tamped down.  Also Zuckerberg must be strictly regulated as should all social media and cable outfits.  Free speech doesn’t allow a million people to yell fire in crowded theaters.

  88. 88.

    mrmoshpotato

    October 19, 2020 at 4:10 pm

    @Baud: Well…..ummmm……thank you for your prompt and direct response.

  89. 89.

    Kent

    October 19, 2020 at 4:11 pm

    @Wyatt Salamanca: Exposed himself as in took his mask off?  Or exposed himself as in too his pants off?

    EDIT:  Ah…I see it was the latter.

  90. 90.

    prostratedragon

    October 19, 2020 at 4:12 pm

    @Delk:    How are the rights granted? Is there a license or something that might persist or be transferrable after the project is declared dead? At the least it’s not comforting that the precedent of handing out rights like this has been established.

  91. 91.

    mrmoshpotato

    October 19, 2020 at 4:12 pm

    @Elizabelle: I’m still hoping for serious hang time.  Followed by serious bodies-thrown-next-to-bin-Laden time.

  92. 92.

    Delk

    October 19, 2020 at 4:12 pm

    @Raven: I walk with a cane. Nobody gets that close to me unless I want them to. BTW I never got a chance to tell you that I was sorry to hear about your dog.

  93. 93.

    pamelabrown53

    October 19, 2020 at 4:13 pm

    @Sebastian:

    Okay. What exactly is bullshit that’s provably wrong? I read the New Yorker because of it’s reputation for high journalistic standards. So…prove me wrong. I’m okay with that; I’m wrong on a daily basis.

  94. 94.

    The Moar You Know

    October 19, 2020 at 4:14 pm

    This was pretty much exactly what I expected from these people.

    I guess we can change the old term “Potemkin Village” to “Wisconsin Foxconn Plant”

  95. 95.

    sdhays

    October 19, 2020 at 4:15 pm

    @rp: I took basically two things away from the OJ trial: 1) the rich have a very different standard of justice compared to the rest of us and 2) if a trial jury trusts your police officers so little that they find it completely credible that an officer would plant evidence to incriminate a black celebrity, it’s on the police when a criminal goes free.

    I was in high school back then, and I really didn’t understand how the bigger scandal wasn’t that the LAPD had so little credibility with the people it was supposedly “serving and protecting” that an officer could say “I collected this almost smoking gun evidence” and 12 people on a jury could be convinced that there was still reasonable doubt. That should have been a wake up call, and it wasn’t, at least not to the extent it should have been. Instead it was “those” stupid, lawless people hating on a nice white man and woman. It was weird, as well as disgusting.

  96. 96.

    pamelabrown53

    October 19, 2020 at 4:16 pm

    @Raoul Paste:

    Agree that Foxconn is the perfect 60 minutes piece. I’m wondering how thoroughly this story is being reported in Wisconsin?

  97. 97.

    Quinerly

    October 19, 2020 at 4:19 pm

    @Wyatt Salamanca: I’m so old that I remember when Toobin got his colleague at CNN Jeff Greenfield’s daughter pregnant and denied paternity until proven and then he was sued for child support b/c  he wouldn’t pay. CNN has now suspended him for pulling his dick out on the Zoom call.

  98. 98.

    different-church-lady

    October 19, 2020 at 4:19 pm

    @rp:  I know: at least put a towel down first!

  99. 99.

    Omnes Omnibus

    October 19, 2020 at 4:21 pm

    I surprised that the project even generated some BS no work jobs. I figured it was all scam and grift.

  100. 100.

    prostratedragon

    October 19, 2020 at 4:21 pm

    @Dan B:  Any idea how NZ did it? I recall that in the 80s and early 90s a lot of carveouts, setasides, and the like went into allowing Murdoch to build his US empire –one of the things that got my heart sinking early, actually. Some of these represent bad practices that should and probably could be reversed, though that might not affect the status quo, and though I don’t know what we can do about the bastard’s citizenship.

  101. 101.

    sdhays

    October 19, 2020 at 4:22 pm

    On the topic at hand, as I recall, the numbers never added up for this project, even in the official statements. The state was putting in so much money that they were paying the equivalent of a 6-figure salary for every projected person to be hired. It only worked out if you took the rosiest of promises (from a company with a reputation for never following through on its promises) and looked far, far into the horizon. Wisconsin could have done a make-work project cleaning up highways for a quarter of the price and got the same level of employment and would have at least had clean highways.

  102. 102.

    Quinerly

    October 19, 2020 at 4:22 pm

    @germy: looks like you got there first. I didn’t read the comments and was working off of memory. Toobin has been on my radar since OJ.

  103. 103.

    Delk

    October 19, 2020 at 4:22 pm

    @prostratedragon:  I’m not sure but I think they were on pretty shakey ground. I would guess this whole fiasco will make it harder for anybody else to use the lake.

  104. 104.

    mrmoshpotato

    October 19, 2020 at 4:23 pm

    @Kent: And then he coughed all over his webcam, confusing everyone.

  105. 105.

    debbie

    October 19, 2020 at 4:24 pm

    @pamelabrown53:

    I’d also like to know.

  106. 106.

    Sab

    October 19, 2020 at 4:24 pm

    @gene108: My husband once left his firstborn son in the carseat on the roof of the car when he drove off to work. Kid and carseat fell off and hit the road. Baby thought it was fun. Everyone was okay.

    People do stupid stuff all the time.

  107. 107.

    different-church-lady

    October 19, 2020 at 4:24 pm

    @pamelabrown53: What’s Mandarin for, “I know that! Why wouldn’t I know that? It’s my company, I’m quite aware of that!”

  108. 108.

    rp

    October 19, 2020 at 4:24 pm

    @sdhays: I agree with that. The LAPD bears a lot of the responsibility for the OJ outcome.

  109. 109.

    Brachiator

    October 19, 2020 at 4:27 pm

    @Wyatt Salamanca: 

    Yes, I know Toobin did not do anything approaching the acts that Rose, Lauer, and O’Reilly committed. The common thing they all share is the massive fucking stupidity.

    I just saw this story. I’m not sure it is a big deal, aside from the fact that it happened to Toobin. Zoom embarrassments are already a cliche.

    I’m not seeing anything here that puts Toobin in the same basket as these other people.

  110. 110.

    MisterForkbeard

    October 19, 2020 at 4:30 pm

    @Brachiator: That’s where I land on this. Stupid zoom things happen to most people.

  111. 111.

    mrmoshpotato

    October 19, 2020 at 4:31 pm

    @Sab: Ever got out of the shower, thrown on a shirt and walked out the door to work?

    Dude had to be pantsless and underwearless.

  112. 112.

    WaterGirl

    October 19, 2020 at 4:34 pm

    @Brachiator: I agree.  it was foolish, but Toobin is a serious person and not a dick.  I can’t imagine that he would do this on purpose.

  113. 113.

    Brachiator

    October 19, 2020 at 4:35 pm

    @Quinerly:

    CNN has now suspended him for pulling his dick out on the Zoom call.

    This is sad. The story is only a few hours old, and already it has gone from his genitals being observable to a claim that he was deliberately pulling it out and exposing himself.

    I wonder how hard the Internet mob will jerk this one before they pull it back.

  114. 114.

    sherparick

    October 19, 2020 at 4:35 pm

    @Wyatt Salamanca:  Lesson for new world of VTC: Always wear your pants.

  115. 115.

    pamelabrown53

    October 19, 2020 at 4:35 pm

    @different-church-lady:

    LOL. You’re delightful!

  116. 116.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes

    October 19, 2020 at 4:36 pm

    @Baud:

    I mean, sounds like a dream job to me, too.

  117. 117.

    westyny

    October 19, 2020 at 4:41 pm

    @Ken:  why not both?

  118. 118.

    schrodingers_cat

    October 19, 2020 at 4:41 pm

    Someone stole my Biden-Harris lawn sign. We are deep blue. HRC got 70% in this town in 2016.

  119. 119.

    Brachiator

    October 19, 2020 at 4:43 pm

    @mrmoshpotato:

    Ever got out of the shower, thrown on a shirt and walked out the door to work?

    Are you serious? This is a ridiculous comparison.

    There are YouTube clips of news anchors being accidentally exposed as being inappropriately dressed from the waist down, sometimes exposing their naughty bits.

    Zoom calls from home have only magnified the problem.

  120. 120.

    E.

    October 19, 2020 at 4:46 pm

    @pamelabrown53:  I used to think that too. The New Yorker was revered in my house when I was a boy in the 1970s and 80s, and I kind of took that attitude for my own and read the thing pretty religiously. Then a few articles came along that happened to be about subjects I am personally invested in and knowledgeable about, and my opinion changed in a hurry. A lot. I also think the magazine has slipped quite a bit, although I quit reading it about five years ago so my insight into it is pretty stale now. The last time I read it I remember muttering, “What utter horseshit this is” and then thumbing through the ads for jewelry and cars and investment bankers and thinking, you know, these are not my people. It’s no surprise they would think these things.

  121. 121.

    Dan B

    October 19, 2020 at 4:47 pm

    @prostratedragon: I haven’t seen any stories about how NZ eliminated Murdoch*.  It would be great if they manage to rein in Zuckerberg who approved a new set of algorithms that favor and / or promote conservative content.  Monster.

    *Time to Google Murdoch – NZ.

  122. 122.

    Roger Moore

    October 19, 2020 at 4:48 pm

    @Baud: 

    Even I wear clothes when on a work-related call.

    Honestly, I found putting on work clothes to be helpful when working from home. It helped me to psychologically separate work from home. The one exception I made was to wear my normal house slippers rather than shoes, since I try to avoid wearing my shoes anywhere in the house.

  123. 123.

    JPL

    October 19, 2020 at 4:49 pm

    @Quinerly:  Thanks to both of you, because I had no idea of his sordid past.

  124. 124.

    Brachiator

    October 19, 2020 at 4:53 pm

    @MisterForkbeard:

    That’s where I land on this. Stupid zoom things happen to most people.

    It is very easy for problems to happen because of the informality of home Zoom calls. And a Zoom etiquette is evolving.

    I recently overheard a woman telling a friend at lunch that in the beginning she thought working from home was easier because she didn’t have to dress for work. But after doing a lot of Zoom conferences she started wearing makeup again and making sure that her top half was dressed well. Hopefully the lower half is always at least safe for work.

  125. 125.

    MisterForkbeard

    October 19, 2020 at 4:57 pm

    @schrodingers_cat: Let’s be charitable and assume they just really wanted a Biden-Harris sign for themselves.

  126. 126.

    BruceFromOhio

    October 19, 2020 at 4:59 pm

    @Brachiator: 

    I wonder how hard the Internet mob will jerk this one before they pull it back.

    I see what you did there.

  127. 127.

    mrmoshpotato

    October 19, 2020 at 4:59 pm

    @Brachiator:

    There are YouTube clips of news anchors being accidentally exposed as being inappropriately dressed from the waist down

    In the news room?
    I guess I have higher standards for being in front of a camera.

  128. 128.

    Another Scott

    October 19, 2020 at 5:03 pm

    @MisterForkbeard:  I thought Keenan already covered this with his 2020 graduates message (0:50).

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  129. 129.

    Roger Moore

    October 19, 2020 at 5:04 pm

    @narya:

    Lots of “we do not speak about ongoing matters” when asked for comments about what’s going on; if necessary, add “we do not want to unfairly target anyone.”

    Definitely the occasional “those decisions are being made by career prosecutors; we let them do their jobs without political interference” while they’re at it.  The goal should be to tell the prosecutors in very general terms what to do- root out any corruption and malfeasance under Trump- and let them handle the details.

  130. 130.

    Chetan Murthy

    October 19, 2020 at 5:05 pm

    Let’s give it up for Foxconn CEO Terry Guo: he had Shitlord’s number from day one.  Knew he was a grifter, knew that the only thing to do, is to grift even better in return.

    I’m sure his training in “guanxi” in China was eminently useful.

  131. 131.

    mad citizen

    October 19, 2020 at 5:07 pm

    @E.: Interesting.  I just started receiving the New Yorker about 8 weeks ago through an amazon $5 trial or something (have to remember to unsubscribe in Nov).  Thought it would be interesting to get it to the election.  I always find 3-4 words I don’t know in there.  To be honest, I never have enough time to read much of it.  A couple of the political columns have left me perplexed.  They are sufficiently factual (liberal), but are written to someone who is living under a rock, like the New Yorker is their main information source.  I find that weird.

  132. 132.

    Brachiator

    October 19, 2020 at 5:07 pm

    @Baud:

    Even I wear clothes when on a work-related call.

    But if it’s not work related, watch out!!

  133. 133.

    Brachiator

    October 19, 2020 at 5:09 pm

    @Baud:

    Even I wear clothes when on a work-related call.

    But if it’s not work related, watch out!!

  134. 134.

    Roger Moore

    October 19, 2020 at 5:13 pm

    @sdhays:

    I’m disappointed how many people didn’t see the connection between OJ being acquitted and the Rampart scandal.  Lots of people just couldn’t accept that a jury would believe the LAPD would frame someone.  Then, a few years later, there was a massive scandal when it turned out officers from the Rampart division were routinely planting evidence to frame suspects.  Somehow the media never connected the two.

  135. 135.

    Roger Moore

    October 19, 2020 at 5:17 pm

    @MisterForkbeard:

    Stupid zoom things happen to most people.

    I’ve been on a lot of work zoom calls, and the worst thing that’s ever happened has been people’s kids interrupting them.  I’ve never seen anyone even wear work-inappropriate clothing, much less expose themselves.

  136. 136.

    Sab

    October 19, 2020 at 5:18 pm

    @mrmoshpotato: So? He was on zoom and thought the camera was off.
    I am a luddite. 40 years ago I thought new technology was exciting. Now I am utterly bored and often enraged about new hoops I have to jump through just to do my job.

    My younger sister is a really talented computer tech support system person. Works with research scientists. Her company wants to clone her. Covid bad because she cannot help the kids in the office because she is at home.

    She used to complain that I don’t keep up to date. My response is that I do taxes. Computers are just a tool, and an exponetially difficult tool to work with. I have my own area to keep up with. I simply do not want to be bothered with the computer side.

    She humphed about that. Then at the end of the year she got her tax documents. She had been made a contractor mid-year. Same paycheck, but she owed 15.65 social security tax on all the income after the change that she thought was wages withholding. Duh. That is normal under tax rules ( Probably not legal but lately nobody cares.)

    We all have our expertise. None of us can know everything.

  137. 137.

    L85NJGT

    October 19, 2020 at 5:27 pm

    I guess technically it’s not ghost pay rolling if you have to show up to a cubicle??

    Like that fantasy Aluminum mill in Ashland KY, the GOP is all bullshit, all the time.

  138. 138.

    Elizabelle

    October 19, 2020 at 5:29 pm

    @mad citizen:

    A couple of the political columns have left me perplexed.  They are sufficiently factual (liberal), but are written to someone who is living under a rock, like the New Yorker is their main information source.  I find that weird.

    Laughing, because that is so true.  For some of them, not all.

  139. 139.

    Barbara

    October 19, 2020 at 5:31 pm

    @Roger Moore: Not just “people” but Marcia Clark specifically.  What I understand is that she refused to use as witnesses people who were ready to testify that they had seen OJ in the vicinity of Nicole’s house on the evening in question because they were too impeachable (read: had prior convictions).  She thought police witnesses would be seen as more reliable and credible.

  140. 140.

    Sab

    October 19, 2020 at 5:32 pm

    @L85NJGT: I had one internship with no actual job attached.

    Anyone laughing at people who showed up to a much needed job that turned out not to be a job have no soul.

    This isn’t funny. Putting laughing jackals onto my list of monsters I don’t care about at at all.

  141. 141.

    Brachiator

    October 19, 2020 at 5:37 pm

    @Sab:

    She used to complain that I don’t keep up to date. My response is that I do taxes. Computers are just a tool, and an exponetially difficult tool to work with. I have my own area to keep up with. I simply do not want to be bothered with the computer side.

    I do taxes too and sympathize with you, but I love, love, love technology and find it funny how “luddites” are really just comfortable with the tech they know.

    I remember when dot matrix printers were used for specially formatted paper versions of tax forms. But even people doing taxes by hand had their adding machines and calculators.

    But yeah, keeping up with tax issues is a job in itself. Even small things. I look forward to explaining why someone received a Form 1099-NEC for 2020.

  142. 142.

    mrmoshpotato

    October 19, 2020 at 5:41 pm

    @Sab:

    So? He was on zoom and thought the camera was off.

    We’re talking about wearing pants and underwear here.

  143. 143.

    Another Scott

    October 19, 2020 at 5:42 pm

    @WaterGirl:  More details…

    Update, with some answers https://t.co/L2O81yjIiL pic.twitter.com/T75CPpNgqJ

    — Laura Wagner (@laurawags) October 19, 2020

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  144. 144.

    Brachiator

    October 19, 2020 at 5:53 pm

    @Another Scott:

    Two people who were on the call told Motherboard separately that the call was an election simulation featuring many of the New Yorker’s biggest stars

    Wow. Sounds like Toobin thought it was an erection simulation.

    It’s more and more embarrassing. And sad. And Toobin will forever be the butt of jokes.

    But otherwise there is not much here.

  145. 145.

    Pete Downunder

    October 19, 2020 at 5:54 pm

    @Barbara: 
    I followed the trial closely and while I’m a lawyer I don’t do criminal work but even I could see that Marcia Clark was completely hopeless. First she brought the case downtown LA where there would be a black jury pool who would not believe LAPD as to the time of day and then much of her tactics and questioning were stupid beyond belief. This is not to say LAPD didn’t try to frame a guilty man but Clark lost the case.

  146. 146.

    germy

    October 19, 2020 at 5:54 pm

    the new game is to replace every new yorker cartoon caption with "Jeffrey Toobin took his dick out on a Zoom call." pic.twitter.com/NkuxsTJtxs

    — Ryan 'Follow @SecretBase' Simmons (@rysimmons) October 19, 2020

  147. 147.

    Wyatt Salamanca

    October 19, 2020 at 5:57 pm

    @Brachiator:

    My previous post was tongue in cheek. Toobin is certainly not in the same category as Lauer, Rose, and O’Reilly. On the other hand, he acted like a goddamn idiot and has only himself to blame for his problems.

    Grace Panetta @grace_panetta
    This is not the kind of editor’s note you want to see in a story about yourself: “This piece has been updated with more detail about the call and the headline has been updated to reflect that Toobin was masturbating.”

    h/t https://twitter.com/grace_panetta/status/1318303346172755971

  148. 148.

    Brachiator

    October 19, 2020 at 6:00 pm

    @Another Scott: 

    Damn. I almost missed the obvious New Yorker cartoon caption.

    Two people who were on the call told Motherboard separately that the call was an election simulation featuring many of the New Yorker’s biggest stars.

    Toobin thought it was an erection stimulation.

  149. 149.

    Miss Bianca

    October 19, 2020 at 6:02 pm

    @MisterForkbeard: I’m still just wondering why the hell you would be waving your dick around at your wife or whoever during a conference call *anyway*, Zoom or no Zoom, but maybe I’m just prudish that way.

    ETA: Kind of puts “multi-tasking” in a whole new light, methinks…

  150. 150.

    germy

    October 19, 2020 at 6:10 pm

    Per two sources to Motherboard, the call was part of an election simulation in which a number of prominent New Yorker staffers played various roles and Toobin acted as the courts. During a strategy session break, the sources said Toobin appeared to be on another call.

    “The sources said that when the groups returned from their break out rooms, Toobin lowered the camera,” Motherboard reported. “The people on the call said they could see Toobin touching his penis. Toobin then left the call. Moments later, he called back in, seemingly unaware of what his colleagues had been able to see, and the simulation continued.”

  151. 151.

    Brachiator

    October 19, 2020 at 6:13 pm

    @Wyatt Salamanca:

    My previous post was tongue in cheek. Toobin is certainly not in the same category as Lauer, Rose, and O’Reilly.

    Point noted, although it may be a poor jest since these other clowns exploited people and behaved unethically.

    On the other hand, he acted like a goddamn idiot and has only himself to blame for his problems

    I noted that Toobin will rightfully be the butt of jokes for years to come, but otherwise think this is much ado about nothing.

    I don’t think he was an idiot or that there is a big problem here.  I suspect though that the hunt is now on to find some deliberate sexual related offense that Toobin may have committed.

    I also try to resist the urge to Instant Internet Judgement about everything.

  152. 152.

    H-Bob

    October 19, 2020 at 6:21 pm

    @mrmoshpotato: Why not Elliot Spitzer ?  He & Trump have so much in common!

  153. 153.

    NotMax

    October 19, 2020 at 6:25 pm

    @Miss Bianca

    I’m still just wondering why the hell you would be waving your dick around

    Whose should be waved around in its stead?

    ;)

    :)

  154. 154.

    Miss Bianca

    October 19, 2020 at 6:57 pm

    @NotMax:

    I caused a great hullabaloo
    When I saw Toobin’s whang in my stew
    The waiter said, “Please don’t shout
    And wave it about
    Or the rest will be wanting some too!”

  155. 155.

    mrmoshpotato

    October 19, 2020 at 7:12 pm

    @Miss Bianca: You ought to be ashamed of yourself! :)

  156. 156.

    mrmoshpotato

    October 19, 2020 at 7:13 pm

    @NotMax: ?????

  157. 157.

    germy

    October 19, 2020 at 7:20 pm

    Both people, who spoke on the condition of anonymity in order to speak freely, noted that it was unclear how much each individual person on the call saw, but both of the people we spoke to said that they saw Toobin jerking off. The two sources described a juncture in the election simulation when there was a strategy session, and the Democrats and Republicans went into their respective break out rooms for about 10 minutes. At this point, they said, it seemed like Toobin was on a second video call. The sources said that when the groups returned from their break out rooms, Toobin lowered the camera. The people on the call said they could see Toobin touching his penis.

    https://www.thecut.com/2020/10/media-reacts-to-jeffrey-toobin-zoom-dick-incident.html#_ga=2.136506100.590587316.1603149424-1175306012.1603149424

  158. 158.

    Brachiator

    October 19, 2020 at 7:50 pm

    @germy: 

    Both people, who spoke on the condition of anonymity in order to speak freely, noted that it was unclear how much each individual person on the call saw, but both of the people we spoke to said that they saw Toobin jerking off.

    So what? Who cares?

    I know this is under investigation. Has anyone said that Toobin was deliberately doing this in front of anyone?

  159. 159.

    patrick Il

    October 19, 2020 at 8:08 pm

    @schrodingers_cat: 
    You should be able to narrow down the list of suspects pretty quickly.

  160. 160.

    zhena gogolia

    October 19, 2020 at 8:51 pm

    @schrodingers_cat: 
    We’ve been taking ours in at dusk every evening. It got vandalized but we were able to unbend the supports.

  161. 161.

    burnspbesq

    October 19, 2020 at 8:55 pm

    @MisterForkbeard: 

    can you be AG and… the vice president?

    I’m not aware of any legal impediment, but the bandwidth issues would likely rule it out as a practical matter.

  162. 162.

    Sab

    October 19, 2020 at 10:12 pm

    @mrmoshpotato: Next time he will.

    Prosecutors in many states are destroying lives of teens who do this shit. Posting porn online. Silly kids posting dirty pictures. Even when the posters are underage idiot teens.
    I would like to cut Toobin some slack but nobody cut those kids slack. Underage kids tried,when they were underage! (They were legally not competent to have intent!)

  163. 163.

    Ruviana

    October 19, 2020 at 10:37 pm

    i@Pete Downunder:
    A very dead thread but Clark had the trial downtown because the courthouse in Santa Monica where the trial would normally have been held was still seriously damaged by the Northridge earthquake that had happened 5 months earlier.

  164. 164.

    germy

    October 20, 2020 at 7:32 am

    @Brachiator:  So what? Who cares?

    This is a dead thread, but this woman explains it better than I can:

    Masturbating while on a work zoom/call is a choice. If Toobin was on mute he was listening/watching the other participants and that’s still disgusting & violating. If the urge is so great end the call. He knew that. Always a good time to re up this https://t.co/7NJxI7nqEl— Jennifer Gunter (@DrJenGunter) October 20, 2020

    Please stop defending wanking during online work meetings as normal&gosh, what everyone does (read: men, who are "everyone"), 'what's wrong with you Puritans throwing stones' etc. Your zoom co-workers do not need this imagery or its implications. Wank on your own time. Thank you.— ? EJ Willingham ☠️ (@ejwillingham) October 20, 2020

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  • Geminid on Why Raw Story (and other outlets) Make Me Crazy (May 24, 2025 @ 5:19am)

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