President Biden delivers remarks on the recent tragic mass shootings, and the need for Congress to act to pass commonsense laws to combat the epidemic of gun violence that is taking lives.
Open thread.
Reader Interactions
98Comments
Comments are closed.
CaseyL
I am pre-emptively dreading this. I want him to make clear the GOPers are the ones making these massacres possible, making them easy. I want him to make clear that the GOP is happy to turn every town and city into a prison so their gun-happy fans can keep buying their bang-bangs, and the money will keep rolling in from…whothefuck knows. Who’s backing the NRA these days? Russia? Our own homegrown fascist oligarchs?
I want some of that Biden anger. I want him to bring his brass knuckles and steel-toed shoes. I want him to verbally flay the GOP and kiss goodbye to the “bipartisanship” that is never ever going to happen because the GOP is out to destroy the country, is already halfway there, and will likely finish the job before 2024.
The dread is because I doubt he will go there.
BellyCat
@CaseyL: Ditto. Ain’t gonna happen though.
Old Dan and Little Ann
My mostly liberal friend who is a gigantic gun nut posted about the Tulsa Massacre Anniversary yesterday. Not negative. I give him shit relentlessly online and made some cracks about rwnj and CRT. He lives in Oklahoma. He liked that. I steered away to Twitter for a minute and the latest Tulsa shooting was just happening. I commented on his same post about it and……crickets. Sigh.
WaterGirl
@CaseyL: @BellyCat:
We will know soon enough, but I think President Biden will show anger and I think he will call out the Republicans for standing in the way of reasonable gun legislation.
BellyCat
Suspect that if one drinks every time the word “heal” is used, alcohol poisoning is assured.
I love Joe, but “healing” at this point can’t happen without extensive GOP cancer surgery, including amputations.
trollhattan
Meanwhile, from Missouri comes a different approach to gun violence.
He seems super bright.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@trollhattan:
Who the fuck even connects abortion to gun violence, anyway? What does one have to do with the other? I guarantee Long, that nobody who commits murder or mass murders does so because some woman, somewhere had an abortion. Never crossed their minds.
That guy is not living in the real world
WaterGirl
Wow, he started on time!
BellyCat
Republicans let law expire. YES
MisterForkbeard
@CaseyL: I wish he would. McConnell just stated a couple of hours ago that he’s totally willing to work on a law that will help the situation, and that the solution can’t touch guns or gun control and should be focused on mental health funding (that he also opposes).
Time for Biden to just flat out describe the problem. Republicans own this. They make it worse. They actively keep us from trying to fix it and will do anything they can to stop even the most simple gun control measures that 80% of the public agrees with.
Haydnseek
test
Mike in NC
But the Fat Orange Clown once declared that the carnage was going to stop “right here and right now”, or some such bullshit that was probably composed by Steve Bannon or another of his idiot henchmen.
Old Dan and Little Ann
No calling out republicans. Fucking Bollocks. Edited to add. Ah. Finally.
SpaceUnit
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):
Here in Colorado we had a “pro-life” kook shoot up a Planned Parenthood facility about six years ago. Three people killed.
So there’s that.
gene108
I think Obama’s adage about making politicians do something is really at play now.
We really need to be louder than the gun nuts right now.
I don’t know how to do this, but if we want politicians to have a spine we need to make them straighten up.
Elizabelle
I love Biden’s voice. The voice of reason, of empathy, of lessons learned through grief.
Elizabelle
We are not so much a nation anymore. We are polarized, because it’s in Murdoch’s and Mercer’s and the plutocrats’ interest for us to be divided.
Elizabelle
Let us finally do something.
Cacti
@trollhattan: Whenever I see a 67 year old man who still goes by “Billy”, I think…
“He doesn’t sound at all like some dimwitted hayseed”.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@gene108:
Making Republicans radioactive and their lives a living hell would be a good start
There was a blog (article?) post posted downstairs about needed to act and become just as crazy as the anti-maskers; to scream at Republican officials in meetings.
I wonder if those kind of tactics could work. Or could GOPols simply point to the “INSANE, irrational, fascist liberals!”?
BellyCat
Not angry enough. Oh well…
William D
Heard speech on npr….seemed powerfully angry to me
bbleh
WOW! Full marks plus bonus! Greatly exceeded expectations! GREAT speech!
And I admit, I particularly liked the part where he called out Senate Republicans, and Republicans generally several times, and likewise the absurd laws in Texas. And his list of particulars is spot on!
Fkin-a, go Joe!
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@SpaceUnit:
Oh yeah, the abortion clinic bombers, too. But I’m sure Mr Long would hem and haw about it. Or even try to justify that
SpaceUnit
I love me some Uncle Joe, but that speech ain’t gonna move the needle.
CaseyL
@BellyCat:
He wasn’t. He did single out the Senate, but not McConnell, not the GOP, not the RW Wurlitzer. Not even the NRA.
He still thinks he can work with those pitiless ghouls.
ETA: I’m hearing he did call out the GOP, but IMO he did so too gently.
dr. bloor
@trollhattan: This would be more amusing if he wasn’t going to be in the position of questioning Supreme Court nominees as a member of the Senate Judiciary committee in the foreseeable future.
Elizabelle
@CaseyL:
Maybe Biden is going to be good cop to other Democrats’ bad cop.
And, boy, is bad cop a concept that has arrived in the wake of Uvalde.
Cacti
@CaseyL: Biden was literally the only candidate we had who could win.
But he’s also in some ways the wrong man for the moment, as he still truly believes that there are reasonable Republican politicians willing to negotiate for the good of the country.
That ship sailed with Newt Gingrich.
SiubhanDuinne
I wish that instead of saying “should” he had substituted the word “will.” Didn’t count, but I’m guessing there were 10 or 15 opportunities for him to say “Here’s what we WILL do,” not “Here’s what we SHOULD do.” “You WILL be held accountable,” not “You SHOULD be held accountable.” “Should” sounds like a suggestion. “Will” sounds like determination.
BellyCat
@CaseyL: This was rote recitation. He’s sad but knows he is powerless on this topic and nothing will change.
I would have loved ONE thing — ANYTHING — that he would do through Executive Action tomorrow.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@CaseyL:
Even if he had, I’m sure McConnell et al would just use that as justification to not consider any legislation
bbleh
@CaseyL: As an angry pessimist on the issue, I think he did point at the Republicans several times, and correctly so. I was a bit disappointed with the “if we can’t ban assault weapons, at least raise the age limit,” but then he returned to banning them, and overall that’s a quibble.
Plus, he addressed the Second Amendment AND the “taking your guns” issues head-on, and he deliberately made common cause with “responsible” gun owners.
I think the question now is, what’s the follow-up? The Republicans wil squeal like pigs. Will Dems follow up? Or will they all hide under their desks and hope it all goes away now?
The jury is still out, but major props to Joe IMO.
CaseyL
@BellyCat: I’d love to see him nationalize the gun manufacturers. My god, wouldn’t that be gorgeous. The 2nd Amendment doesn’t mention manufacturing guns, just owning them.
BellyCat
Agreed. “Should” is better. Best is “*I* WILL”
Another Scott
(I can’t wait for the day when the White House bans cameras with mechanical shutters.)
Excellent speech by Biden. I liked how comprehensive it was. I didn’t particularly like his repeated statement (roughly) “if we can’t ban assault weapons now…” – I’m not sure why he needed that disclaimer.
We’ll see what happens. He’s right that voters have to make this an election turning issue or things will not change in the Senate.
Cheers,
Scott.
BellyCat
@CaseyL: Nice…
Omnes Omnibus
@CaseyL: That will never happen.
Another Scott
@gene108:
March for Our Lives – June 11, 2022
Cheers,
Scott.
Old School
@bbleh:
The House will pass bills next week, so there will be follow-up. Whether that builds enough pressure for Senate Republicans and Manchin/Sinema to do something is the question.
BellyCat
@Another Scott: Disagreed. An “excellent” speech inspires. It rises to the moment and effects change.
This was a perfunctory eulogy. Not inappropriate, but not what the moment called for. Not going to move the needle. In fact, signals to the opposition that he’s got nothing. I’m even more sad now
ETA: And since he didn’t use “heal” even once (small blessings), it’s time to pour one in honor of those who gave their lives. Pouring two for the children.
debbie
@SiubhanDuinne:
He can’t say “will”; he’s not a dictator. Maybe “must” would have worked.
japa21
First of all, if he says “we will” and it doesn’t happen, he would get blamed, not the GOP. This way, by saying “should” the blame can be squarely placed on the responsible parties for the failure, namely the GOP.
He rightfully placed the blame for the lapsing of the assault rifle ban on the GOP. In fact, I don’t think Bush the younger gets the amount of blame that he deserves for letting that happen. If he had requested it, it would have been extended.
And I don’t know of anything he can do by executive order that wouldn’t get overturned by the courts, which would be worse than if he did nothing at all.
And anybody that thinks Biden believes the GOP is rational needs their heads examined. He is fully aware of the reality of the situation. As President he needs to play by certain rules of contact but he has been showing more and more steel as time goes on. He is the perfect person to have in the job right now.
SiubhanDuinne
@BellyCat:
I think in this context “will” is better than “should.” But I’m sure his speech writers had their reasons.
SiubhanDuinne
@debbie:
Yes, I can live with “must.”
gwangung
@gene108:
This is by no means sufficient. But IT IS NECESSARY.
if we can’t be bothered to get up off our butts and harangue politicians (and KEEP haranguing them), then things WILL stay the same.
Another Scott
@BellyCat: I’m not sure what you and SD expected. He has no power to force the Congress to do anything. He can’t “will” them to pass legislation.
All he can do, as a co-equal branch of government, is persuade them and the population to enact what he sees as sensible legislation (and threaten to veto things he disagrees with). He talked about what sensible legislation is needed and why and made a compelling case, IMHO. That’s all he can do.
Millions marching on June 11 is something useful that the rest of us can do. It won’t “will” the Senate to pass useful bills, either, but it is our power. As is voting in November, and donating and working for sensible candidates. It’s a process, and usually a long and painful one.
Ultimately, “it’s just words”. Obama was a great orator with great speechwriters. He couldn’t bend the GQP to his will either. Speeches don’t move Congress – what the rest of us do, does.
My $0.02.
Cheers,
Scott.
Baud
Biden should have taken out an AR-15 and started shooting people until Congress enacted gun legislation to stop him.
I am disappoint.
David ☘The Establishment☘ Koch
Has he addressed the urgent crisis in
gundoor control?japa21
@Baud: He couldn’t. Illegal in DC.
Dan MacGuffin
A weak and totally forgettable speech. What a waste of time.
Given that it’s entirely in the hands of Congress, Biden needs to refrain from making any more meaningless, performative bullshit speeches.
bbleh
@Old School: That will be *A* step. And the odds are that Manchin (and likely Sinema) and MORE than enough Republicans will kill ANYTHING meaningful in the Senate (other than, I dunno, a “sense of the Senate” that “gun deaths are bad” or something).
So THEN what?
Will Dems continue to pass bills and make Republicans vote against them? Will they call Republicans out by name? Will they make gun safety an issue in their campaign advertising? Will they and their surrogates return again and again to it in their speeches and their interviews and their talk-show appearances? Will they keep up the pressure? Will they brand the Republican Party as the party of murderers and child-killers? Will they take a page from, say, Republican opposition to the ACA? Will they fight POLITICALLY, and CONTINUE to do so, even if they lose on the laws today?
Republicans will fight tooth and nail. They’ll screech about Democrats coming to take your guns every chance they get. They’ll put guns in every ad. They’ll double and triple down on a point of view that is supported only by a TINY MINORITY (fewer than 10% when it comes to background checks) of the population.
What will Dems do? (I am pessimistic, as if it weren’t obvious.)
japa21
@Another Scott: There are times I wish for a like button. Your comments are frequently those times.
Baud
@japa21:
He could pardon himself in between reloading.
zhena gogolia
@Omnes Omnibus: But what about the trillion-dollar coin?
Another Scott
@Baud:
Obligatory President Camacho (2:23)
Cheers,
Scott.
zhena gogolia
@Baud: I like the way you think!
Ohio Mom
I got drawn in watching the ASL interpreter. She was angry and full of passion. She heard and expressed the subtext of Biden’s words. He is just too dignified.
Baud
@zhena gogolia:
I think like a president.
SpaceUnit
I can’t see anything getting passed in the Senate. But the killings continue getting worse and continue to dominate the news cycles. I have to believe that this (along with the issue of reproductive rights) is going to seriously erode support for the Republican Party nationwide. Eventually. And just maybe if we can pick up a couple more Senate seats over the next couple of elections we can finally kick Lord Manchin to the curb, end the filibuster and get something done about the fucking guns.
Not sure if this qualifies as optimism or pessimism.
BellyCat
@Baud: On Fifth Avenue
RinaX
@bbleh:
At that point, it becomes what will voters do. If more dead children and lost abortion rights can’t overcome high gas prices, we will unfortunately find out just what the electorate holds dear.
ian
@Cacti:
I don’t know if this is true. I think Biden was the most likely to win, and I think that was a consensus among most Democratic voters. I strongly suspect that others could have won as well, but many D voters were too afraid of a second Trump term (for damn good reasons) to roll the dice with a different candidate.
Starfish
@bbleh:
Of the list of ten or so pieces of legislation or so that the house is considering, raising the age limit is the only piece that has Republican co-sponsors.
David ☘The Establishment☘ Koch
@zhena gogolia:
Didn’t Castro steal the trillion? (video)
BellyCat
@Another Scott: Biden has agency. His job is to INSPIRE all the other necessary items you listed.
Do you feel inspired by that speech? I mean like “wanna leap off the sofa and DO SOMETHING!!1!” inspired?
Roger Moore
@Another Scott:
To be a pedantic camera nerd, mechanical shutters are actually very quiet. The thing that makes the obvious noise you’re complaining about is the moving mirror in traditional SLRs. Cameras without that moving mirror- mostly rangefinders like the Leica M and modern electronic viewfinder digital cameras- are usually quiet enough that nobody objects to them, even if they still have a mechanical shutter.
Soprano2
@trollhattan: YOU HAVE GOT TO BE FUCKING KIDDING ME!!!! Billy Long is an ignoramous. There were 26 homicides in Springfield in 2021, which was a high year. I don’t know if all of them were shootings, but it’s still one every two weeks, not 4 a week!! The population of the metro area now is around 200,000 or so. When Billy Ignoramous was young, the population was probably under 100,000, and gun restrictions were a lot tighter. We didn’t have concealed carry here until around 2000 or so! That’s my rep, I’m so proud.
Adding, I think this is code for “There’s a lot more of those people here than there used to be, what can you expect?
Kay
Keeps inching up the more it’s threatened. Good issue for Democrats.
Kay
Ladyraxterinok
@Old Dan and Little Ann:
The shooter wanted to kill his doctor, a black man highly respected among his colleagues who had an undergraduate degree from Emory and his medical degree from Harvard medical School
I find it worth noting that one of the people killed in the Tulsa race massacre was a black doctor highly praised after the massacre by the Mayo clinic
WaterGirl
I kind of wish Biden had included something like this:
bbleh
@Starfish: Great, pass it if we can! (And wait for some legal challenge that allows SCOTUS to strike it down.) But I don’t think there’s any serious dispute that passing laws with real teeth just isn’t possible right now.
The point is to start, and CONTINUE, a major POLITICAL — not legislative — fight. It’s to seriously damage the Republican brand AND individual legislators. It’s to keep media at least interested in the issue, if not at the current level. It’s to keep the embarrassing questions coming at the Moscow Mitches and Cancun Cruzes. It’s to turn the issue into Republicans Versus America’s Children. And that will take time and persistence.
The media won’t do it on its own. There is no gun-manufacturers-lobby (NRA) equivalent for gun safety to do it. And AS YET there is not a “single-issue voter” constituency strong enough to keep the heat on. Dem political leaders are the only ones who can do it.
The point is not now. The point is gun safety — and, y’know, kids’ lives and stuff — over the next several election cycles. (And btw, some damage to the Republican brand generally as a bonus.)
bbleh
@RinaX: Sure, but it’s also — even more so — up to the political leaders. Political leaders can, y’know, lead. They can focus attention. They can shape the conversation. They can choose something from the giant vat of Everything Soup that is daily life and make it an Issue of Significance. They are influencers. It won’t do for them to sit back, wait and see, and then say, well, voters didn’t want it so [shrug]
David ☘The Establishment☘ Koch
Honestly, the speech was disappointing.
I was hoping Biden would rotate the tires on my car and reveal who really killed JFK, but nada – zilch.
Heidi Mom
I have a friend who’s even further left than I am, and he’s already talking about who shouldn’t run in 2024 because, regretfully, too many people won’t vote for Joe (because too old) or Kamala (because female) or Pete (because gay) or anyone Hispanic or Black . . . But didn’t we once have a coalition that actually managed to elect such an unlikely candidate???
gene108
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):
It’s as simple as just copying Republican tactics. It wouldn’t work for Democrats.
Democrats represent a lot of “out groups”, like blacks, Hispanics, Asians, women, LGBTQ+, etc., whereas Republicans represent the interests of the “in group”, white heterosexual “Christian” men.
The latitude given to these Republican white men (and women) for being assholes in public will not be extended to enough of the Democratic base for us to get away with it.
I think people calling Congress people, state legislators (where most of the bad laws happen), and going in groups to peacefully demonstrate at their offices might help. The goal would be the be for the group interaction to get picked up by the media, whether they are their live or pick up a video on social media.
We somehow need to get attention that we exist and want gun control and their are a lot of us.
David ☘The Establishment☘ Koch
@Heidi Mom:
Maybe Usain Bolt will run. He’s really good.
Old Dan and Little Ann
@Ladyraxterinok: Indeed. I knew nothing about the shooter or the victims untl today. My comment to him was I knew nothing about The Tulsa Massacre until watching the Premier of Watchmen on HBO 3 years ago and if the CRT Okies had burned or banned the show yet. It’s not so much to rattle him but to piss off his local friends.
Omnes Omnibus
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): A lot of our voters would be turned off by that kind of behavior.
Cacti
@ian: It was true.
Warren or Sanders would have been beaten like a dirty throw rug.
gene108
@Elizabelle:
I think we the gun control crowd have to be the bad cop.
As much as we say Republican politicians say mean and nasty things, they really don’t.
That work is done by right-wing media, from an ultra-conservative pastor with a YouTube channel or podcast to the Fox News prime time lineup to every right-wing media figure in between, who so saturate the public space with “Democrats are pedophiles” to attacks on inclusivity training and so on it sort just becomes the de facto position for Republican politicians, because they are silent, at best, as their base ratchets up violent rhetoric.
We can’t follow the exact same way, but we need to somehow point fingers directly at Republicans, without taking digs at Democrats for what they could have done better.
We need whatever media space we can carve out for ourselves to be 100% negative on Republicans, and as close to 0% negative on Democrats as is humanly possible.
EDIT: What makes people like MTG and Boebert standout from the crowd is they take the same shots at Democrats that right-wing media does.
Baud
@gene108:
FWIW I agree completely.
ETA: But I’ve also given up. I need to get back to my normie lifestyle.
Another Scott
@Roger Moore: D’oh! I knew that. Really! ;-)
Thanks for the correction.
Cheers,
Scott.
Quiltingfool
@trollhattan: He is an idiot.
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): Connecting abortion to a rise in the murder rates is a two-fer for that moron.
Emma from Miami
So we dump on Joe and then become enraged when the Republicans, “independents”, and lefty cranks all answer our arguments with “but you yourself said that you were disappointed with him!”, Say what you will about Republicans, they close ranks around their own.
japa21
@Baud: When were you ever a normie?
Dorothy A. Winsor
Someone else from my secret Democratic cabal just texted me saying “Wow, Biden’s speech was so emotional.” She meant that in an approving way. I thought that was an interesting comment
zhena gogolia
@Emma from Miami: And they don’t give up after one or two or a hundred election cycles.
gene108
@zhena gogolia:
Did Democrats give up on expanding healthcare access for Americans after President Harry Truman couldn’t get his national health insurance proposal enacted into law?
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Baud:
What exactly is the “normie” lifestyle, exactly?
Tazj
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):Some Conservative white evangelicals pastors and white Catholic priests do. I’ve heard this talked about before it’s not that unusual in that world. That’s why some conservatives voted for Trump no matter what he said or did, because he would install judges that would overturn Roe.
They believe that overturning Roe and gay marriage is the key to restoring the United States to prosperity. They either say that the immorality of the US has allowed great evil to come to the country or people have no respect for life anymore because of abortion. Some Catholic priests say everything started going downhill in the country after birth control was legalized.
There are people in my family who believe their salvation and the fate of the country is tied to the legality of abortion in this country because their pastor has told them so. They couldn’t believe Trump lost because they thought heaven wanted him to win.
Ben Cisco
@gene108: Reading some of the responses here, one would think that President Biden was expected to come to the podium and cut a fucking WWE promo.
FOR. FUCKS. SAKE.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Omnes Omnibus:
Then they’re living in a dream world and need to wake up imo
lowtechcyclist
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):
Laura Ingraham blamed the shootings on marijuana. A real “tell me you’ve never smoked dope without saying you’ve never smoked dope” moment.
If I had the energy, I’d do a plot of the abortions and homicides, year by year, to show the absence of any meaningful correlation. But I’m sure someone’s already done it.
KSinMA
@WaterGirl: I contacted both of my senators, FWIW. I know they’re on the right side of the issue, but I’m sure it doesn’t hurt.
Old School
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):
I believe they keep up with the Kardashians more than they keep up with Washington DC. And their online time is spent more with Tik Tok than Balloon Juice.
dnfree
@Ohio Mom:
I noticed the sign-language interpreter also. When she pointed her finger and went bang to illustrate (I would guess) a gun being shot, I wouldn’t have wanted to be standing where she was aiming.