Kevin’s speakership is blown again, the fifth time is not the charm, and the Post isn’t even issuing news alerts anymore. Never say never, but this will never happen:
Ohio Democrat Marcy Kaptur said no one on the GOP side has reached out to her since she expressed openness to potentially supporting Kevin McCarthy or another candidate as part of a moderate “unity caucus.” She wants moderate Democrats and Republicans to work together to break the speaker logjam, but she said that as far as she can tell, there is little interest in her suggestion on either side of the House.
In case I need to repeat the obvious, any R who works with Ds will be subject to an immediate and ugly primary challenge from a red-hatted asshole, who will almost certainly win. This includes Santos and the other reps who were elected in Biden districts in New York. They will not “moderate” their views to appease Democrats in 2024 because they’ll be thrown off the ballot if they do so.
By the way, the replacement for Gym Jordan in the last two ballots is Byron Donalds, a rep from Florida’s 19th district who will be sworn in for his second term if they House can elect a speaker and pass rules. The House runs on seniority, so this is just another effort for the Freedumb Cacas to fuck with Kevin, while trying to prove that Democrats are the Real Raciststm because we have the temerity to point out that a black man is unqualified for a job. (On this topic, if you haven’t read Oliver Willis’ piece on Herschel Walker, please do, it’s one for the ages.)
Also, a hearty ha ha fucking ha to this:
Ahead of the fifth vote, Republican Lauren Boebert (Colo.) said Trump called the defectors to tell them “they need to knock this off.” Boebert, among 20 Republicans who voted for Republican Byron Donalds (Fla.), said Trump should do the opposite — call McCarthy and tell him he lacks the votes and should withdraw.
Boebert and the other 19 drooling goobers are more in touch with the MAGA base than Trump. They’re doing exactly what their base wants — nothing, loudly and persistently — and they aren’t scared of an old guy who mostly golfs, posts in all caps and pockets campaign donations.
Old School
Is Byron Donalds unqualified for the job?
JaySinWA
And we are in round 6
And Kevin has lost again.
TriassicSands
If everyone still votes, then McCarthy has lost again — Number Six.
Five Donalds votes have already been recorded (they’re only in the Cs), which takes McCarthy’s maximum possible total down to one less than the needed majority (if everyone votes). Perry, who is a real whack-job, and who nominated Donalds for round six, hasn’t voted. Neither have Gaetz and some other likely to guaranteed votes for Donalds. So, it is pretty much inevitable that McCarthy will lose again. It couldn’t happen to a more corrupt and spineless waste of DNA.
Mr. Bemused Senior
I think they are not kidding. They want Kevin’s scalp and fully intend to get it.
C Stars
I don’t understand why they are doing this. Is there a strategy?
Captain C
@Old School: He’s a Republican in 2022, so, yes.
Even if he was otherwise qualified, that shows an appalling lack of judgement.
Splitting Image
Konstantin Chernenko is tanned, rested, and ready.
JKC
Meanwhile, Elise Stefanik is getting ungodly amounts of abuse from taunting liberals and foaming at the mouth MAGATs for this tweet…
https://twitter.com/elisestefanik/status/1610265935994036226?s=12
Bring on the popcorn!
M31
it’s like in Monty Python and the Holy Grail where he builds the castle that sank into the swamp except it never stops
“after the 6th vote it burned down, fell over, and THEN sank into the swamp”
Gin & Tonic
@Splitting Image: For some value of “rested.”
CaseyL
@Old School: I’m not sure what the qualifications are, tbh.
I mean, once upon a time, the idea was that the Speaker led a team designed to reach consensus to allow bills to come to the floor for a vote. Once upon a time, that might even have meant negotiating with members who weren’t in their Party.
Gingrich put a stop to that; DeLay expanded on that; Hastert made it official. The GOP does not, will not, look anywhere but within its own caucus for votes.
That does mean the Speaker still needs to reach some kind of consensus within their own Party to get things moving. The Whip position is crucial to that – and I don’t even know if the GOP has nominated anyone to that position yet.
So, your question, whether Donalds is qualified: Why wouldn’t he be?
Betty Cracker
We should start a pool on total ballots and eventual winner. I’ll go with 23 and Scalise.
TaMara
Next time someone says, oh Dems should come to the table if they bring a moderate candidate, show them this. There is no moderate with these folks. They are all deplorable. Fuck them all, let them continue and show the country what they are really like. Her entire nomination speech was disgusting.
bbleh
@C Stars: Yes! Clearly, it’s to keep doing the same thing and expect a different outcome. IIRC, that’s the definition of “genius.” Or wait … maybe not “genius” …
VOR
These people are not interested in governing the country. That requires compromise and considering the welfare of the many, not just the few. Their goal is not to pass laws, but to get air time on Fox News. Boehner fully understood the situation, which is why he noped on out. This is a self-inflicted problem and the Dems should not solve it for them.
Mike in NC
They really can’t stand McCarthy and after he loses a 10th round tonight the votes will be for Putin.
Captain C
@Splitting Image:
I assume by this you mean “mummified and replaced by a wax dummy.”
Also, great last-years-of-the-USSR reference.
TriassicSands
@Betty Cracker:
Scalise is probably right, but I doubt they’ll hold out that long.
bbleh
@Betty Cracker: I won’t bet against Scalise, but I’ll go with a lot fewer votes — around a dozen, maybe fewer. I think when they crack, they’ll crack all at once. A deal will be done and that’ll be that.
lowtechcyclist
@M31: Or the twenty GOPers voting against Kevin are the French taunters, and Kevin’s the one asking “is there someone else up there we could talk to?”
Ken
After a week, they’ll all be worn down, and then Baud makes his move.
Ha-ha, just kidding. They’re Republicans, of course there’s no strategy.
TriassicSands
@bbleh:
Agreed. Even as clueless as the Republicans are, they have to aware of how bad this makes them look. True, most Americans are not paying any attention, and have no idea who Kevin McCarthy is, but this clown show will still get widespread media exposure. And with social media…
randy khan
@TaMara:
I don’t know that the Democrats particularly want the Republicans to fight each other, but I am sure that they’re enjoying the spectacle.
The Moar You Know
@C Stars: there’s not even a goal, much less a strategy on how to obtain it.
This was inevitable, of course. The party of no government at all now truly has what they’ve always wanted. They can just shut the door and go home now.
Almost Retired
At this point, it’s apparent to me that any random Balloon Juice troll has a better chance of becoming speaker than Kevin.
VOR
@Ken: Thing is, if the Dems keep delivering 212 votes for Jeffries then we need a relatively small number of Republicans to get bored and fail to vote. It is not impossible for Jeffries to become Speaker, at least momentarily.
hells littlest angel
Well, he’s got a criminal record.
Gravenstone
@TaMara: Yet, you’re fighting each other. Please continue…
randy khan)
@Betty Cracker:
I am lousy at this kind of prediction (well, any kind of prediction), but I will say that if it’s Scalise I think it will be fewer ballots because the McCarthy faction will give up well before then. The wild card is whether Scalise or any other Republican can get to 218, and if he can’t do that fast it will take a long time before reality sinks in. (What happens then I don’t know, but that’s the scenario where there’s some compromise between the not-insane Republicans (assuming there are at least 6 of them) and the Dems.)
Betty Cracker
@bbleh: Good point about them all cracking at once — 23 is probably just wishful thinking on my part because I want them to beclown themselves for at least a week and a half. Crackpots tend to be persistent, so it could happen! ;-)
Baud
The person who is Speaker doesn’t mean as much as what the rules would be. Even if Jefferies won with plurality voting, the full House would still need to vote on rules, which means we’d need some Republicans to cross over.
Ken
@TaMara: Cammack has confused cause and effect there. The popcorn is because the Democrats knew the Republicans would be fighting one another.
They didn’t even need to be tipped off with inside information — they’ve
worked withbeen in the same Congress with most of the Republicans for years now, and know which of them will throw a tantrum if things aren’t exactly their own way.JaySinWA
@TriassicSands: I suspect that Scalise will not be satisfactory to enough of the 20 to get to 218 R’s. There may be a better chance of some major concessions for D votes, but I don’t think Kevin could pull that off. Scalise maybe but whoever does it loses most of the R caucus almost certainly. There is no compromise R candidate that can win with R votes alone that I can see.
Suzanne
If I was Kevin McCarthy, I would fucken resign effective immediately, change my name, move to some beach town in Thailand, and hope I was never found again.
VOR
Kind of like knowing which kids in pre-school will throw a tantrum. Entirely predictable.
Ken
@Baud: Yes, it’s possible, even likely, that after they eventually elect a Speaker, this incompetency will be repeated as they try to vote in the rules.
ALurkSupreme
@Almost Retired: You rang?
raven
@TaMara: Fucking sow
kindness
With all due respect for Marcy, she’s an idiot. Ignoring what the Republican party has become will not help any Democrat govern nor in any 2024 elections, no matter how mad hatter Ohio voters have become. Bless her heart.
Almost Retired
@ALurkSupreme: I’ll make an impassioned nominating speech on your behalf.
TriassicSands
@Betty Cracker:
Since both McCarthy and Scalise are part of the leadership, they probably won’t nominate Scalise until McCarthy gives up. So, that could be in your favor for a higher than expected count.
Alison Rose
At this point, if anyone in that room is drinking, it’s the clerks. They’re probably all ready to start throwing hands.
Jinchi
@C Stars: Their strategy is disfunctional government. These are the people who’ve repeatedly shut down the government in recent years, who’ve targeted individual civil servants for punishment, and who joined an attempted coup plot.
They don’t care if a leader is seated. Tearing down the institution is the goal.
No sympathy for McCarthy, though. He helped create the monster.
Deputinize Eurasia from the Kuriles to St Petersburg
Donalds apparently has some pardoned and expunged felonies regarding bribery, bank fraud and weed.
Leave it to a high school dropout halfwit like Bobo to nominate someone only slightly less loathsome than Denny Hastert.
different-church-lady
@Suzanne: Your willingness to do that means you will never be Kevin McCarthy.
Baud
@different-church-lady:
Plus Suzanne isn’t a dumbass.
Mike in NC
Steve Scalise (R-LA) will probably be a compromise speaker. Close to “former” klan leader David Dukes. A big deal for the GQP!
Baud
@Alison Rose:
I think the clerks only care when they pull an all nighter.
Ladyraxterinok
@Old School:
I read the Wikipedia article on him.
He’s got a criminal record, don’t now rember if it was very serious.
C Stars
Meanwhile the storm is starting in Northern California. The (very large) tree just in front of my house is twisting and turning in a way I’ve never seen before.
TriassicSands
@JaySinWA:
Well, they’re all idiots, so that makes predictions quite difficult.
I wonder what they expect the Speaker to be if they elect someone like Donalds, who has been in the House only since 2021. Would he simply be a puppet, controlled by the other super-radicals? Is that their agreement? Or that, if Donalds, say, were elected, the Speaker would actually be a committee?
Tom Levenson
@C Stars: Good luck. Stay dry.
TriassicSands
@C Stars:
Are you safe? Is the tree likely to hit your house if it falls?
Be careful.
C Stars
@Jinchi: Or are they just giving their wackiest voters a little fan service right now, and eventually they’ll fall in line behind someone (Scalise?)
Barbara
@C Stars: Stay safe.
Another Scott
Spartz voted Present (again?). Nothing much changed after round 6.
I imagine some will want to break now, let’s see if there’s a recess request…
Cheers,
Scott.
Suzanne
@different-church-lady:
I know. And yet it’s just such a foreign mindset.
Fuck. I am at the age where I am trying to figure out how to do less work and engage with fewer other humans.
JPL
@Mike in NC: Scalise did apologize for speaking before the white supremacists so there is that. Of course, most wouldn’t have done that in the first place.
Okay, this is my guess, they nominate trump in round 13, but he goes down in flames.
piratedan
for any pundit who believes that the Dem’s will throw the GOP a lifeline here doesn’t recall their history. The Dems helped out Boehner get to the Speaker’s chair when these same HFC types blocked him from the chair….. what did the Dems get in return? They got HRC Benghazi’d to death and allowed them to continuously shovel dirt on her for 18 months when she was running for office…
I doubt anyone on the Blue side of the aisle wants to Red Wedding this again… let them eat themselves.
geg6
@TaMara:
Fuck her. There’s an easy solution for them. Stop fighting and come together. But they refuse to do that, so bring on the popcorn, alcohol and blankets!
C Stars
@TriassicSands: Thanks. I think if it falls it will go toward the street, and not my house. It’s just so odd, I’ve never seen it do that before in seven years at this place. It’s not getting blown in any one direction, but instead seems like it’s getting pushed in circles. And the storm hasn’t even started yet; it’s barely raining.
MattF
Meanwhile, Kari Lake.
Ken
“You can’t tell me what to do!” — at least 27% of the Republican caucus
TaMara
@C Stars: Stay safe!
Selfish note, I hope it calms the fuck down before it continues on to here.
CaseyL
@C Stars:
Trying to escape?
Hope you can ride out this one with no or little damage.
Alison Rose
@geg6: I loved how she tried to crow about the GOP having “diversity of thought” unlike the Dems, as though being united behind a candidate was a bad thing and being a hot mess like them was a plus.
TaMara
@raven: Which, of course, is an insult to sows. 😉
different-church-lady
@Suzanne: You’re 14?
Matt McIrvin
@piratedan: Like Mona Charen (!) said, there are no moderate Republicans to believe in any more, just differing degrees of extremist. Most of Kevin McCarthy’s supporters are 2020 election denialists. These aren’t people who are legitimately interested in governing. Maybe you can peel off a few who will keep the rest from literally burning down the country, but that’s no reason to help the Republicans start Republicaning any time soon.
Rocks
@Ken: “You’re not the boss of me!”
James E Powell
“The ayes have it!” – I love this woman.
Kent
The reason this isn’t going to happen is that Democrats are not going to do it for free. They will demand something in exchange, such as equal representation on committees, full funding and enforcement of the ethics committee, etc. And the majority of GOPers necessary for a unity candidate will never go along with that. Not when they are SOOO CLOSE to having it all. Plus there are no moderate Republicans left, The MAGA hordes made sure of that.
And even then it would be an enormous risk on the part of Democrats since the GOP could play Lucy and the football at any time and just have a new vote to strip out whatever they agreed to and Democrats would be powerless to stop it. A bipartisan compromise actually only works if you have an actual tie like in the Senate this past Congress since neither party could control a majority of votes and the VP doesn’t get involved in background organizational votes, only legislation as far as I know.
So no, I give it like 0.01% chance that the Dems will support a unity Speaker.
Bill Arnold
@Betty Cracker:
Not betting, since it is all in active play.
The Republicans elected to the House appear to not have an actual viable majority, IMO.
I.e. it appears that will not be able to elect a speaker without some sort of help from the Democrats, and such help would be very expensive for Republicans, with sharp-toothed enforcement clauses. (Assuming no stupid mistakes like trusting Republicans.)
The Democrats have zero reasons in the next several months to help the Republicans start their long-promised attacks on the Biden administration and Democrats in general, and engage in House-legitimatized fuckery. A deal that blocked such fuckery might be worth pursuing, very cautiously, with political combat knives out.
SiubhanDuinne
Adjourned until 8:00 tonight.
C Stars
@TaMara: Me too! I hope the impacts are minimal where you are.
It’s actually calmed down a bit since I first posted. Got gusty for a while there!
Baud
@James E Powell:
Yes, she is the silver lining to the shitshow.
Alison Rose
Is McCarthy planning to have the 20 no votes kidnapped during the break?
Elizabelle
@TaMara: Kat Cammack is a hemorrhoid. I was not interested in watching all of that clip. Enough.
citizen dave
@Another Scott: Spartz! That’s my rep, Indiana’s Fightin’ 5th (would love Colbert to re-start his 435-part series Better Know a Congressperson). She may be our only USSR-born Member.
Mike in NC
They voted to adjourn until 8 PM in order to drink heavily.
Kent
Also the Dems didn’t really purposefully help out Boehner out of any sort of deliberate strategy. The NY contingent left to attend Mario Cuomo’s funeral and I think the attitude was why stick around DC when the GOP can do whatever it wants anyway.
MattF
@Alison Rose: If it gets over 20, it’s more than fingers + toes, and so past the cognitive capacity of Rs.
WaterGirl
Does “decorum in the house” include NOT LYING???
eclare
@C Stars: You and all the West coast jackals stay safe!
Anoniminous
NWS
It is a bomb cyclone – an area of low pressure that intensifies by 24 millibars within 24 hours – but they’re not calling it a bomb cyclone —- for some reason. Not officially approved vocabulary? These kinds of storms are called hurricanes when they develop over the North Atlantic, central North Pacific, and eastern North Pacific, these rotating storms are known as cyclones when they form over the South Pacific and Indian Ocean, and typhoons when they develop in the Northwest Pacific.
WaterGirl
@Ken: “They made us fight! They brought popcorn!”
anon
@CaseyL: if you are referring to the Hastert rule, I believe it only requires a majority of the majority. once they have that, they can pad with minority votes to get majority of house. it does not mean they need 218 votes from their own party.
They cannot use a minority of majority and pad with minority party votes.
TriassicSands
From Wikipedia:
Ladies and gentlement, your Speaker of the House….
JPL
@WaterGirl: I didn’t know there was going to be alcohol.
WaterGirl
@raven: Hey, don’t talk to TaMara like that! //
(just kidding, it’s obvious that you are talking about the blue-white dress lady who lies)
raven
@WaterGirl: I thought twice about that but decided to let it fly!
Betty Cracker
McCarthy thinks he’s still in it, according to MSNBC.
WaterGirl
@James E Powell: I thought the NOs were louder.
Warblewarble
Quevin McFlop , flops&flops & flops &flops & flops & flops,
WaterGirl
@raven: Good choice.
David ⛄ 🎅The Establishment🎄 🦌 🕎 Koch
Po’ Kevin – he’s home alone
Shalimar
My prediction for weeks has been Scalise as a compromise candidate. We will find out relatively soon whether that is possible.
As for working with Democrats, it is theoretically possible for McCarthy to make a deal without anyone being able to prove it. Remember, Democrats don’t have to vote for him. All he needs is for 32 of them to suddenly get suspicious food poisoning and fail to show up for a vote. If he could secretly arrange for something Democrats want, say continuing the Ethics Committee with no changes (which coincidentally would screw quite a few of the 20 never-Kevins), then he could still be Speaker.
Another Scott
@WaterGirl: Microphones are always deceptive. But even if they were louder, nobody called for the Yeahs and Naaws so her ruling stands.
Cheers,
Scott.
Ken
In what? Delusion? Denial? Deep doo-doo?
Baud
@Shalimar:
I would think the Dems would ask for more than that.
One interesting question is whether the Dems want a weakened McCarthy as Speaker as opposed to whoever a compromise candidate would be.
ETA: I recall hearing some Dem saying he thought Scalise would actually be better for the Dems than McCarthy.
Ken
“And this device will be implanted in your chest. Don’t worry, at least two of the Democratic leadership caucus have to push their activators at the same time to trigger it. Sorry about this, Kevin, but let’s face it: You’re a completely amoral, untrustworthy snake.”
Shalimar
@Betty Cracker: Let’s put McCarthy in a room with his 20 opponents and an array of torture instruments and see if he comes out of the “discussion” with that same belief.
Roger Moore
@Kent:
If the Republicans could actually get the votes to do that, they could do it today. There’s literally nothing the Republicans could do after a power-sharing deal they couldn’t do without one.
Another Scott
@Shalimar: I’m no expert, but I think it will probably be Scalise, too.
But, on the other hand, I still can’t see the Democrats helping in any way without loud and verifiable commitments of something important in return. And just about everyone agrees that Qevin is a liar who will tell anyone anything to get what he wants, it’s not at all clear how it would work.
Democrats standing back and letting the GQPers destroy themselves is the way to go. They’re going to have to knife Qevin themselves and pick Scalise themselves. At the moment, there’s no up-side for Democrats helping.
Cheers,
Scott.
David ⛄ 🎅The Establishment🎄 🦌 🕎 Koch
@Alison Rose: that wouldn’t work. Jefferies would become Speaker with a lower threshold as he still has more votes than Kev.
Origuy
Regarding Byron Donalds, his opponent in the last two elections, Cindy Banyai, has a few things to say about him.
Danielx
@piratedan:
Lifeline? Anvil, more like.
Betty Cracker
I heard somewhere (maybe Josh Marshall’s podcast?) that the Freedumb Caucus peeps who are currently dropping anvils on McCarthy’s nut-sack also hate Scalise. Anyone know why?
Another Scott
@Betty Cracker:
Warning – TheHill:
FWIW.
Cheers,
Scott.
WaterGirl
@Another Scott: I’m aware of that.
WaterGirl
@Baud: Scalise is more competent, so it seems like he would be more dangerous.
Suzanne
@different-church-lady: Well, my sense of humor is stuck at 14-year-old-boy level.
Danielx
@Betty Cracker:
At a guess, because Scalise believes the House has a role to play in governing as opposed to the House being solely a vehicle for personal aggrandizement. I cannot name a single legislative accomplishment by any of those 19 (20?) assholes.
hells littlest angel
@Betty Cracker: Because he’s an ally of McCarthy, basically.
Another Scott
@WaterGirl: Sorry. Didn’t mean to mansplain.
:-(
Cheers,
Scott.
Chief Oshkosh
@JKC: My god those people are stupid. But, I’m happy that they’re pissing all over McCarthy and Stefanik.
Bupalos
@C Stars: I think it’s mostly just destruction for destruction’s sake. These folks want to dismantle the United States as a functional entity, and this is a thing they can do to help that along.
Folks on the D side are enjoying seeing R’s discomfited, but there isn’t really any upside here that I can see for anyone. The ominous thing is that several of the bomb-throwers are identifying defunding Ukraine as their issue. It kinda starts to look like a Putin attack, and I wonder if it might be time to cut that deal with McCarthy that everyone is denying.
CaseyL
@anon: Even that means no meaningful input by the other party in legislation. Anything that needed Democratic votes was “Here’s the bill. Take it or leave it.”
Shalimar
@Another Scott: It’s not going to happen because Bakersfield is deep red, but it would be hilarious if McCarthy resigned after losing and his constituents were so disgusted with this whole process that a Democrat won the special election.
Roger Moore
@Betty Cracker:
My guess is it’s the same reason leftists always turn on successful Democrats. You can only succeed and become powerful by cutting deals and making compromises. The very fact people like McCarthy and Scalise are in position to be elected Speaker is proof they’re too corrupted to trust with the position. Only a career back bencher can possibly be pure enough to trust.
Steve Crickmore
The next one in the firing line? Is Scalise enough of a whack job to appease the QAnon caucus, perhaps, perhaps not? According to the Washington Blade, Scalise has one of “the most anti-LGBT reputations of any lawmaker”. Scalise rejects the scientific consensus on climate change. Scalise refused to acknowledge that Trump lost the 2020 presidential election. Scalise has been an opponent of gun control and was given an “A+ rating” from the National Rifle Association. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Scalise
zhena gogolia
@C Stars: Good wishes from a fellow UCC member!
Tim Ellis
@Roger Moore: Speaking as a leftist(ish) myself, you’re actually being a little too nice to us here lol – during “Force the Vote” a bunch of my lefty comrades turned on AOC, who despite her prominence is still very much a backbencher. (Disclaimer: “Force the Vote” was obviously and objectively stupid and it is ludicrous that people tried to make it a test of being a “true” progressive.)
I think to some extent this is just people who don’t have much power seeing a representative, who they think must have much more power (and to a degree does have more power), and then puts all their hopes for the use of that power on the rep. But the rep of course is constrained by a lot of factors and has to make decisions about when and how to use what power they have, and they are also human and so will sometimes get it wrong.
Layer8Problem
@Bupalos: “Vote for McCarthy, or your friends in Ukraine won’t see another dime.” Yeah, I don’t see that as a winning strategy.
zhena gogolia
@Bupalos: Yeah, Gaetz tweeted something about, the big loser is Zelenskyy.
Bupalos
She’s absolutely not an idiot. She’s committed to actual governance, which I think is a pretty good thing.
Captain C
@Alison Rose: If he does, he still loses to Jeffries, except because Jeffries would now have a majority of the votes, he’d be Speaker. If McCarthy kept the 20 kidnapped, we’d have a working majority.
Kent
It is a different calculation though.
Today we are asking say Boebert to vote for McCarthy for speaker and that is a no-go.
In my scenario it would be GOPers asking for Boebert to vote at some future date to strip Democrats of their committee assignments.
Which vote do you think she is going to be more likely to make?
JBWoodford
@Betty Cracker: He’s in it to spin it?
Bupalos
@Layer8Problem: Opposite. It’s the freedumb guys and gunbunnies opposing mccarthy that are putting “defund ukraine” into the mix. Like “no on mccarthy, he wastes our money on zelensky.” Like they are advertising to cut a deal with their caucus to drop opposition to mccarthy if everyone promises to let Putin torture and murder people in basements.
Which…I’m fairly worried that the R caucus might make that deal. Which is why I think D’s should be thinking carefully here and not just doing the “not our problem” thing.
Eolirin
@Kent: If there’s a way for things to be set up in such a way that reneging on the deal means the Speaker gets vacated and a new one needs to be voted in, then the Dems have actual leverage for as long as they can’t find a candidate they can unify the caucus around
Actually this is kind of like trying to form a coalition government in a parliamentary system and we’re really not set up to deal with it, but that’s the only way the House is going to be even remotely functional.
Bupalos
I just want to remind folks that however feckless kevin mccarthy may be, he is the one who was conjecturing back in 2016 or whenever that Trump and Rhorbacher were on Putin’s payroll.
And the R opposition to McCarthy now looks like a who’s who of Putin’s most likely payee’s right now. The hardest-core of the insurrectionists. And to the extent they are identifying an issue that this McCarthy opposition is about, it’s defunding Ukraine.
Might want to slow the roll on cheering this on.
WaterGirl
@Bupalos: I am thinking that Team Dem probably have this gamed out several different ways. Nancy Pelosi may not be speaker but I’ll bet she is an unofficial part of the leadership team and they will be thinking their way through the whole thing ahead of time.
We will soon see.
Redshift
@Steve Crickmore:
And didn’t change his views at all after being a victim in a mass shooting.
matt
Hottest take I’ve seen – if the Dems don’t help McCarthy out, they’re just as much part of the problem as the Republicans. The real villain is partisanship.
Love these fuckers in media and academia and all of the shit they talk. Super inspiring. Makes me want to go out and salute a flag.
James E Powell
@WaterGirl:
Me too.
Baud
@matt:
The anti-Dem spin machine is the closest we’ll ever get to perpetual motion.
Bupalos
Before I join in on this “haw haw this is fun watching R’s destroy themselves” entertainment take on this whole thing, someone needs to explain to me how they actually get destroyed and what that is actually supposed to mean in practical terms.
Layer8Problem
@Bupalos: I understand completely what where the Freedom Caucus stands on Ukraine. I don’t see McCarthy as a Ukraine supporter; is there any evidence that he was? Everyone was pretty much expecting that the new Republican House would do what they promised about cutting Ukraine support, much like we expect them to threaten to screw around with raising the debt limit. Are you assuming any deal the Democrats make with McCarthy, regarding House rules or committee assignments or Ukraine funding or whatever, would be honored? The Republicans will do their usual disorganized hate at all costs thing, and they’re even doing that badly.
Baud
@Bupalos:
They’re behavior lead to a poor showing for them in the midterms and now they are doubling down on the crazy.
The Rs won’t be destroyed by this.
Geminid
@WaterGirl: Have you watched Nikki Budzinski vote yet? She sounds like a very experienced and competent person even though Representative for the Illinois 13th CD is her first public office.
C Stars
@zhena gogolia: Thank you! **secret UCC handshake
Matt McIrvin
@Bupalos: It won’t destroy them. It will make them less, rather than more, able to do things like threaten Armageddon over the debt ceiling, because that requires having a united caucus.
Layer8Problem
@Baud: “But won’t somebody think of the children?” We knew what the Republicans would do going in to this Congress. We expected two years of this crap. The Republican Blow It All Up Caucus will be fighting it out with the Republican No Way Your Nihilism’s Ejecting Me From My Purple District Caucus.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Also a long history of the thinking David Duke is crude and vulgar, but not necessarily wrong
as for our new friend Byron Donalds, I heard on MSNBC earlier that he was something of a celebrity on the mid-term campaign trail, on the same bills as Gaetz and Marge Greene. One thing that interested me on his wiki page:
“expunged” how and by whom? he was elected in ’16, so seated in ’17, I assume. It had to be either trump or Rick Scott, right? depending on if the felony were state or federal? google isn’t helping, given that there have been so many stories and posts about him in the last 24 hours
looks like his most recent opponent had the same question
does “expunged” mean something technically different from “pardoned”
Roger Moore
@Kent:
No. Kaptur is suggesting that the Democrats cut a deal with the center-most Republicans to elect a compromise candidate. I agree it isn’t going to work because there aren’t enough people on either side willing to make it work, but the basic idea isn’t nuts. If you could find enough people close to the center who would prefer a more centrist Speaker, they could cut a deal to make one. It would work best if it were someone other than McCarthy, since then that person would have a strong incentive not to go back on his word, since it would result in him losing the Speakership.
I’m not sure what a Centrist Speaker would look like, or what rules the House would have under one, but it could be made to work. Or at least it could be made to work if the Representatives who would have to vote for said Speaker could count on keeping their jobs after the next election. It might have worked 60 or 70 years ago, when there actually was a center in our politics, and the liberal wing of the Republican Party was far to the left of the conservative wing of the Democratic Party. There’s no way it would work with today’s nationalized politics.
Jay
Blew my back out yesterday repairing a 100 foot, 3/4 inch sewer snake, have KITO training tomorrow, so, day off, back meds, heating pads and finally catching up on Rachel Maddow’s “Ultra” transcripts,……. funny how the plot seems familiar,……..
Geminid
@Bupalos: It hurts their brand, and helps Democrats shape their 2024 campaign theme: Republicans are unfit to govern.
It also exacerbates their general intra-party strife, which is an impediment to them electorally.
Ruckus
@VOR:
Dems can not solve this for them.
They have to want to legislate and they do not want that. They do not want a working government, at least not one that is in any way a democracy and they are in a position that is getting them exactly what they want. KMC wants a government that works, even if poorly, and that is in no way what they are looking for. They want their own government, one that only flows their way, and locks out everyone on the other side of the aisle.
Jinchi
Six defeats for the Speaker position with virtually no change in the count. I think Kevin is done, whether he knows it or not. I give it a week at most before the party will tell him to give it up.
Poor guy. He had a simple dream. To hit Nancy Pelosi with the Speaker’s gavel.
And now that dream has dashed by people who think he’s too willing to work across the aisle.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Bupalos: I am not overburdened by faith in the American people, but I still think that talking about Hunter’s dick pix and Anthony FAUCI having plotted with the heathen Chinese communists so he could release a bioweapon on the American people that would shut down the country and then…. PROFIT! OR POWER! OR SOMETHING! Is not going to play well outside the most committed of Hannity’s followers
ETA: And this mess is just the prelude to that mess
Ruckus
@Suzanne:
That’s mean.
To Thailand.
Another Scott
@Bupalos: My take is a bit more simplistic. Namely – people respond to incentives. If there are no consequences for bad behavior, the bad behavior will continue.
When House GQPers are calling other House GQPers “political terrorists”, that a start down the road of consequences. It lets the normies know that the days of “this is how we know we’re a real family here” are long gone. That both parties aren’t the same. That just because someone has an (R) behind their name doesn’t actually make them better than a Democrat.
The GQP is the weaker, less popular political party in this country. They have outsized political power because they have twisted the system. Business as usual with them will not return them to sanity. There have to be consequences for their actions, and letting the world see that they are incompetent at even picking their own leaders is a step along the road to consequences.
My $0.02.
Cheers,
Scott.
Darkrose
@Anoniminous: It’s going to be ugly. We’ve charged everything, and I moved the car out back so it’s not on the street. Fortunately I’m WFH all week, since classes don’t start until Monday.
MomSense
In functional news – I’m at the inauguration of Maine’s 75th Governor.
🌲
Baud
@MomSense:
Awesome! One of the best outcomes of the midterms.
Jinchi
@Roger Moore: I agree, Kaptur’s suggestion is undoubtedly where the party would prefer things end up. Democrats want a House that will get things done.
If they could get an deal which guaranteed an end to government shutdowns, advancement of bills that have support of a majority of the members, that preserved the ethics committee and stripped away all the corrupt bargains he’s made with the MTG crowd, that would be an all-around win.
I don’t think McCarthy would be the Speaker in that universe and it’s fair to question if there are any Republicans left who would agree to it, but I have to believe that Democratic leaders are at least brain-storming what their asks would be.
Sister Golden Bear
@M31: Re-upping my paraphrase from Stonekettle:
Brachiator
@Another Scott:
UK’s Conservative Party would like to have a word with you.
But I agree with your larger points.
HumboldtBlue
@Suzanne:
You assume he, and any of the GOP caucus, have a sense of shame.
Geminid
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: I think “expungement” is done at the judicial level, perhaps by the sentencing judge. Not sure though.
This year the Democratic members of Virginia’s House of Delegates replaced their Minority Leader with a convicted felon. He actually did prison time after pleading guilty to a federal crime involving drug distribution. He was pardoned later on. There were doubts expressed at the time but I haven’t seen much grumbling since.
I was just sorry to see Eileen Filler-Corn “rolled” because I thought she did a good job in the 2020 and 2021 sessions when she led the majority as Speaker. Democrats got a lot of good stuff done and I never saw what the problem was with her.
Another Scott
@Brachiator: It can take a while, a very long while, but it does happen.
Bloomberg – UK Labour has 26 point lead over Sunak’s Tories in latest poll.
Something something 1000 miles something something single step…
Cheers,
Scott.
JML
Oh god it won’t stop snowing. snowed most of yesterday. snowed most of today. Still snowing now. The plows have already deposited 14 metric tons of snow back into my driveway…
so. much. snow…
zhena gogolia
@JML: Where?
Ruckus
I’m not sure why anyone thinks that republicans in the house want to actually try to govern. The other 2/3 of the federal elected government is Democrat for at least the next 2 yrs. Actually having a functioning house only gets them the same thing as screwing up any worse than they are doing right now. And they are not rational or on the side of having a functioning government. I don’t know that they will do this for 2 yrs but they will make a spectacle out of this because that’s all they’ve got.
Hoppie
Here I thought one Donald was too many….
Annie
@C Stars:
I live and work in San Francisco and my boss told all of us to go home. So, I leave the office — and it’s not even raining! Strong wind, but no trees or branches down along my bus route. But I’d been on the phone earlier with someone in Redwood City, south of San Francisco, who said it was pouring down rain there.
JPL
@JML: When I lived in CT, the plows would deposit the snow in my driveway. I discovered that my toddler standing in front of the storm door, changed their pattern. Can you rent a kid?
zhena gogolia
@Annie: I e-mailed my friend in Berkeley. Haven’t heard back yet.
Gravenstone
@MattF: i look forward to her arrest for trespassing when she tries to occupy the Governor’s office, and subsequent meltdown.
rikyrah
I love petty 46!
L.A. Suiter (@Suiter_LA) tweeted at 9:21 AM on Wed, Jan 04, 2023:
“It’s not my problem.” – President Biden, remarking on the Republican House debacle.
😂😂😂
(https://twitter.com/Suiter_LA/status/1610657569982517249?s=02)
Brachiator
@Another Scott:
At this point, even a wet rock has an 18 point lead over Sunak and the Tories.
And yet the strange thing is that the Conservative Party is doubling down on pushing BREXIT, fighting unions and quietly trying to dismantle the NHS. And the biased, cynical and venal British press makes American media look benign.
coin operated
@TriassicSands:
Have not read all the replies but one of the Never Trumpers said that the Republican superpower is shamelessness. The Klown Kaucus does not care about the optics as long as they are 1) loud and 2) owning libs.
Betsy
I AM ENJOYING THIS SO MUCH
M31
@Sister Golden Bear: Flaming Weasel Caucus says DO IT AGAIN
rikyrah
Truth
Jack Cocchiarella (@JDCocchiarella) tweeted at 5:12 PM on Wed, Jan 04, 2023:
Republicans trying to blame Democrats for THEIR inability to elect a Speaker is the most Republican thing ever.
(https://twitter.com/JDCocchiarella/status/1610776327585660928?s=02)
Betsy
@TriassicSands: Oh, but K-Mac and Tucker C are already shotgunning the latest talking points: True Democracy is Messy! The Dem way of governing is to March in Socialist LockStep, just like Soviet Russia!, etc.
I expect to hear this everywhere in days to come, as the press pivots straight from “Dems in Disarray!” to “Democracy is Messy”!
rikyrah
@HumboldtBlue:
They don’t even know how to spell SHAME
H.E.Wolf
Rep. Budzinski is included in this nice little summary of all 34 incoming Democratic US House members, including a few familiar names from the Balloon Juice fundraisers!
https://twitter.com/RobertGarcia/status/1609672237539536896
H.E.Wolf
@Sister Golden Bear:
that makes me so sad for the weasels… pore li’l flamin’ critters.
different-church-lady
@coin operated:
They might have lost track of which side of the aisle the libs are on.
Barbara
@anon: No- Hastert rule is that any legislation can pass only if Republicans make up the deciding votes. It’s not majority of majority — It’s at least 218 Rs, or whatever number is needed to pass a majority of the quorum. That’s why rump group extremists have so much power.
Roger Moore
@rikyrah:
Saying it isn’t his problem isn’t Biden being petty; it’s him showing proper respect to our constitutional order. It not only isn’t his job to get involved in choosing the Speaker, it’s wrong for him to meddle in the central workings of another branch of government.
WaterGirl
@Geminid: I have not!
JML
@zhena gogolia: Minnesota. I’m in central MN. but the whole state seems to be getting blanketed.
WaterGirl
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Yes, it is different. Expunged means it is removed from your permanent record, as if it didn’t exist.
Another Scott
Ooof!!
rofl.
(via Popehat on Mastodon)
Cheers,
Scott.
JML
@JPL: lol, probably not on the kid rental.
someone from public works tried doing a sweep in my driveway of the huge swath (and wall) that was blocking off half the driveway…and nearly destroyed my mailbox in the attempt. sigh.
Geminid
@H.E.Wolf: Thanks! Those are some nice short biographies. They look like an experienced and capable bunch.
Roger Moore
@different-church-lady:
At this point, I think they see “the libs” as anyone who isn’t part of their little clique. It’s the same way that if they ever get their way and make things “Whites Only” again, their definition of who exactly is White will start contracting.
Baud
@Roger Moore:
It’s also him saying he’s not going to entertain the media’s pleas for the Dems to fix the Republicans’ mess.
C Stars
@zhena gogolia: The power is out in some places in Berkeley. One of the elementary schools lost its internet/phone. Still no big rain, though. A lot of wind.
WaterGirl
@Ruckus: They want to stop the good governance that we have going.
schrodingers_cat
@rikyrah: Like this clown on Twitter. BTW the air fryer is definitely a winner!
C Stars
@Annie: I’m beginning to think the rain might just miss us up here and only hit the South Bay.
cain
@matt:
Only Dems have agency – we take all the blame and get none of the credit.
Baud
@schrodingers_cat:
Who’s that idiot?
zhena gogolia
@JML: Sorry!
WaterGirl
@Another Scott: That’s a good one.
prostratedragon
@H.E.Wolf: Thanks, that’s very handy. Jonathan Jackson is my new Rep.
Roger Moore
@Barbara:
The Hastert Rule, as originally invented by Hastert, was that he would only put a bill to a vote if it could win a majority of the Republicans. It was a bad rule that saw the Speaker as representing their party over the House as a whole, but it made some kind of sense. When Boehner was speaker, he resurrected the rule in the form you remember, that the bill had to be able to pass with only Republican votes. That was far worse, since it gave a small, extremist minority effective veto power. It’s utterly ludicrous with a majority as slim as the Republicans have today, since that extremist minority could be just a handful.
Brachiator
@matt:
These idiot pundits never demand that the GOP actually reciprocate any goodwill gesture that the Democrats might make.
Baud
@Brachiator:
It’s the same mentality as the people demanding that Ukraine come to the negotiating table to end the war.
TS
@Shalimar:
And how many democrats would be taken in by this “promise” that could easily be denied the minute he became Speaker?
Nancy Pelosi was elected by democrats only in 2021 – now we see republicans in disarray & people still thinking the democrats should bail them out.
Dan B
@schrodingers_cat: Agreed about clown.
And what Air Fryer did you get?
Dan B
@C Stars: The radar of the storm looks like narrow bands at the edges but wide in the middle. Hang in there!
Steeplejack
TriassicSands
But, will they stop there or will it become the Democrats’ responsibility to fix this mess?
The MSM have never figured out how to cover the Republican Party. They continue to cling to the idea that if they report something unflattering about the GOP, they must also report something unflattering about the Democrats, even if there is no comparability between the two. The Post’s fact-checking under the leadership of Glenn Kessler is constantly guilty of this kind of false equivalency and bothsiderism.
While the Democrats can’t expect Republicans to cooperate and help govern, should they help the Republicans out of a mess entirely of their own making?
Nominate and elect clowns and you’re going to get a clown show. Nominate and elect corrupt criminals and what should you expect? No sane person would want McCarthy to be in any leadership position, and the alternatives are mostly as bad or even worse. Why should Democrat’s help bail out Republicans by supporting someone who has no business being Speaker of the House
Anyone interested in a contrast between the parties should listen to the nominating speeches for Jeffries versus the speech Perry gave for Donalds or Kat C’s speech for McCarthy. Both Republican speeches were about how terrible everything is (including the Democrats). The Jeffries supporters I heard simply spoke about how good he is.
HumboldtBlue
Just read that Stephanie Ruhle will have Boebert on her show tonight.
Also this:
Gvg
@Bupalos: unfortunately in the years since, I think Putin has picked up more influence including McCarthy. He has not stood up to Russian influence at all IMO, nor have a bunch of others. I did not like McCain but he was the only one I really thought still understood that danger. Actually some of the Bush cronies did too, old guys. These carnival barker types that remain are naive but think they are smart. And totally unpatriotic.
Roger Moore
@Gvg:
There’s a tendency to interpret McCarthy’s comments about who was on Putin’s payroll as a criticism. Now, I understand it was a complaint the money wasn’t being shared more widely.
rikyrah
People clowning Kevin using Hamilton😂😂😂
https://vm.tiktok.com/ZTRbppSgF/
Miss Bianca
@Almost Retired:
And the
sadfunny thing is, any random Balloon Juice troll would probably do a *better* job as speaker!apocalipstick
@hells littlest angel: Not disqualifying, at least not in the Constitution.
Geminid
@HumboldtBlue: Boebert’s a trip. What a motormouth! I guess she might have slowed down some, but she’s stll a babbling bonehead.
Danielx
@schrodingers_cat:
Fucking hilarious, as are the replies to his idiotic both-sides attempt. Yeah, it’s Dems’ fault House Republicans can’t agree on…,anything, and Dems should bend over backwards to pull Republicans out of a shitheap of their own making. Without getting anything in return, because…something something bipartisanship.
Pull the other one, it’s got bells on it.
Edit: I’ve got it! Elect TFG as Speaker, everybody can agree on him! Makes about as much sense.
Steeplejack
@HumboldtBlue:
Choice reply: “Inadequately addressed in Federalist 61.”
HumboldtBlue
@Steeplejack:
Too funny.
prostratedragon
Incoming: Bullitt. Later, High Sierra, Gun Crazy.
Geminid
@Miss Bianca: Taumaturgo for Speaker- they’ll work miracles!
kalakal
@TaMara:
To be fair she’s not wrong there
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: Some political science
post-doc,undergrad.@Dan B: Instant Vortex Plus 10QT air fryer oven.
David 📢 Speaker 📢 Koch
☑️
David 📢 Speaker 📢 Koch☑️
test
WaterGirl
@David 📢 Speaker 📢 Koch☑️: I just approved both of your comments. So if you post a new comment now with a time stamp that is later than the one on this comment – with either of those nyms – and it goes into moderation – that will mean that WordPress doesn’t like one of those emojis.