Now that the inaugural Ballon Juice Book Discussion Chapter can see the light at the end of the tunnel for NIXONLAND (four more weeks! four more weeks!), I’d like to (re)propose Gail Collins’ When Everything Changed: The Amazing Journey of American Women from 1960 to the Present as our next book. (Or one of our next books, if any of the other front-pagers find time in their schedules to present their own agenda.) Because, despite everything, for some of us life really has improved since the economic “Golden Age” of the 1950s. Who else might be interested in a weekly discussion starting in mid-May?
What other books would you suggest as alternatives?
Since this is an open thread, what else needs discussing?
Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN)
I had dinner with a co-worker a few nights ago, and he told me something depressing. It might explain why I’ve had so much trouble keeping in touch with people that I knew a few years ago.
First, the background. My ex-wife was really messed up while we were married. (She still is, but I’ve finally managed to convince myself that her walking out means that that’s no longer my problem.) In the summer of 2004, she started hitting herself in the face with things. One night, she used the TV remote to give herself an impressive black eye. There were other instances that left bruising.
I spent a lot of time and effort and love to try to help her. I finally convinced her to get into therapy, where she was diagnosed as bi-polar. At least she now has medication to control that, so it’s just the rest of her problems that she refuses to confront. All of the care I put into this process underlies why I am *so* angry that her response to my breakout was to leave.
Apparently, there are people who think the injuries came from my hitting her. This supposed abuse is why she left in the summer of 2006. In some sense, I guess, it isn’t surprising that someone might come to that conclusion. The problem is that it’s not true. I have no idea how to confront this problem. I probably just have to write off a chunk of former friends. It’s just another reason for me to want a mulligan and try this life over again.
I really, really hate this world.
Omnes Omnibus
Even if the book has a more positive slant on the 60s-70s timeframe, which I understand that it does, I think that it may be a good idea to step away from that time period for the next book. I would not be opposed to reading and discussing it a book or two down the line; in fact, I think it would be interesting and valuable. But, for right right now, I need to call green balloons on that era.
MikeJ
Last time we had a suggestion thread, somebody came up with The Warmth of Other Suns: The Epic Story of America’s Great Migration, which I’m all for since it was already in my to read pile.
If you wanted a mini one week club we could do Sarah Vowell’s new book about Obama’s birthplace, Unfamiliar Fishes, in one week. And we could email her agent and see if she’d show up for questions, but everybody please, let’s not go on and on about how I think she’s the ginchiest in front of her. Gotta play it cool, ya know? I can just see all you standing around in a circle chanting “Mike luvs Sarah!” and it would turn out just like that 8th grade dance, and nobody wants that.
What? Oh yeah. The book on the great migration sounds good to me.
Jim Pharo
I’ll take Gail Collins for $200, Alex.
Elia Isquire
A book about how things are better than they used to be, eh?
Hmmmm.
The Old Testament!
Elia Isquire
@Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN): you should probably just beat her up at this point, no?
Martin
@MikeJ: Heh, you might have to put me in the same category wrt Sarah. I’m a big TMBG fan.
Uncle Clarence Thomas
.
.
I think we should discuss how America “Joining Forces” with retired Army Gen. Stanley A. McChrystal is one of the crowning achievements of President Obama’s miraculous first term.
.
.
Omnes Omnibus
@Elia Isquire: Only if you believe that public perception controls who you are. False accusations and false beliefs are a bitch. I have no idea how I would handle such a situation.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@Elia Isquire: I hate to tell you, but 3 things are never funny.
1- violence, especially between intimate partners
2- false accusations of any kind
3- brain diseases of any kind, including those known as “mood disorders” like bipolar disorder and major depressive disorder. These are serious chronic diseases, which can be survived with proper diagnosis and treatment.
I understand(I think) the flippancy you attempted here. Please do not ever use a frivolous tome about any of these topics. People die as a result of all three. Regularly.
Thank you.
Anne Laurie
@Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN): That is indeed a sukky situation to find yourself living in. You’re right that there’s no way to confront this directly without climbing back into the ‘she said, so he said, so I said’ post-divorce vortex, and your friends don’t want that any more than you do. The positive thing is, your ex-wife is still herself, albeit an improved-by-medication self, and you are yourself, and eventually the people who are still in her orbit will realize that her stories of what happened between you should be weighed by the fact that her more recent stories… probably don’t pan out as factual, either.
Meanwhile, for your own sanity, turn away from those people and go find different people to hang with. Even though that’s almost as purely hellish as being alone.
suzanne
@Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN): Confront it directly. Call up or write to the (former) friends and explain exactly what you just told us here. If you wait until someone confronts YOU about it, you look shady. Say something like, “It’s come to my attention that there is a rumor that I was physically violent to Ex-Wifey. I don’t expect your friendship in the future, but it is intrinsic to my integrity that I clear this up and confront this situation with honesty.”
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN): False accusations are horrific. Self harm of various kinds is often an artifact of untreated bipolar disorder. Without proper treatment, people with bipolar make unusual, to put it politely, decisions. It’s a horrible, sadly often fatal when untreated, disease. Successful treatment is made more complex by both the natural resistance people have to the notion that they have a chronic disease and then compounded by the social stigma of a “mental illness.” It is nevertheless not an excuse for falsely accusing anyone. I feel for you. Anne Laurie has offered good advice, imo.
stormhit
@a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q):
People regularly die as a result of a lot of things other people are sensitive about. Naming pet issues doesn’t make you the internet humor police.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@stormhit: I don’t find rape and homicide jokes real humorous either. Would you like to bitch at me about that also? Because I would post the same kind response to an attempt to be flip about either of those topics.
BR
@suzanne:
This is a good idea – far better than any ideas I have for what sounds like a horrible situation.
Omnes Omnibus
@stormhit: And who appointed you internet humor police police?
James E Powell
I propose The Arc of Justice by Kevin Boyle.
I’ve had it sitting around for awhile and its the kind of book I’d love to read and discuss with others.
BR
Anne Laurie – I think Bill McKibben’s Deep Economy is very worth reading as a group – it touches on so many issues that we discuss at this site, and some that we don’t but should. I’ve been meaning to read it again, and would love to discuss it here.
Omnes Omnibus
@BR: I second your seconding of suzanne’s plan.
Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN)
@Anne Laurie: In fairness, so far as I know, my ex-wife has never made that accusation. I certainly haven’t ever heard her do it or gotten reports from anyone that she has. The particular friend who told me this isn’t even in a circle that she is at all likely to have any contact with. She’s not responsible for this.
No, it’s just people who saw her battered condition and assumed that I was the cause, regardless of what either of us said. Again, I can understand why someone might leap to that conclusion, given the behavior often exhibited by couples where one is abusive. So, on some level, I don’t even blame anybody for this. It’s just one of those things that happens, even when people are well intentioned. On some level, that’s actually more frustrating. It’s nice to have someone you can point the finger at.
As for reaching out, I’d have to ask the friend for specific names, as he didn’t offer any. I just really don’t want to do that. And, as I said, I’ve had a lot of trouble staying in touch with people, so I’m not quite sure how I would do so.
MikeJ
@a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): “Tragedy is when I cut my finger. Comedy is when you fall into an open sewer and die.” Mel Brooks
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@Omnes Omnibus: I am functionally innumerate today, but I agree. Did you use all your commas before they went bad?
DamnYankees
@Elia Isquire: I thought it was funny…
asiangrrlMN
@suzanne: I go with suzanne’s idea. And, that is a horrible situation, JMN.
@Omnes Omnibus: Do you have, in you pocket, any commas for me?
@Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN): Wait a minute. A friend told you but wouldn’t tell you who?
Omnes Omnibus
@a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): I had to dice some up and make comma bread, but that’s okay.
Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN)
@asiangrrlMN: I didn’t ask who. The path of the conversation leading up to his saying that makes more sense than the comment sounds in isolation.
suzanne
@Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN): If you don’t know specifically who of your friends/acquaintances had that suspicion, then I would just preemptively throw it out there when you have conversations with any of those people in that social circle. “I heard that apparently some people thought Ex-Wifey and I had a violent relationship. It’s not true, and she’s apparently getting help and is more stable now. I hope that no one ever seriously believed that.” Then let gossip do the work for you.
asiangrrlMN
@Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN): Ah. Got it.
@suzanne: Yes. This. And, how you and the bebes be?
Linnaeus
@Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN):
I can’t add anything to the good advice that others have given you here other than to say I hope you get through this situation and that any harm to you from the suspicions of abuse is healed or at least minimized.
suzanne
I need a bit of advice, too. The ancient curmudgeonly fuckwad who lives two doors down from me is somehow convinced that my dog barks 24/7, and he came over to my house while my husband and I were at work and my mom was watching the munchkins and yelled at her. First of all, the dog sleeps all night in my room and spends much of the day inside, so he’s smoking crack. She barks occasionally, but by no means excessively. There are other dogs in our neighborhood that bark more often, but he’s all pissed off at mine. Then today, our back gate was somehow mysteriously open and Luna was standing out in the front yard without a leash. (It’s possible that my husband left it open but he doesn’t think so.) What the fucking fuck should I do? If he goes to the cops about it, what can I say? Our houses back on a fucking elementary school, so I don’t know why he’s got his panties in a wad about noise.
Cris
This guy walks into a bar and says, “The human race will decree from time to time: ‘There is something at which it is absolutely forbidden to laugh.'”
suzanne
@asiangrrlMN: Awww, da bebes are good, thank you. :) Sarah has been invited to go to a new school next year in a self-contained gifted class, so potentially a whole room of little nerds. Mia has started laughing in earnest, which is charming. My job is rad. And they even pay me to do it. Can’t complain.
Corner Stone
@Cris: I was waiting for you to edit that.
Now that’s getting into the spirit of things!
Elia Isquire
my uncle is deaf in 1 ear b/c his wife who at the time was suffering from vertigo thought he had told her she was “a riot” when she said she was worried about a spell coming on while dicing tomatoes but he said “youre all right” just trying to soothe her before he got into the room to grab her shoulders but she spun around really angry and the knife went into his ear and popped his ear drum.
so i think i get a pass
EvolutionaryDesign
Bill Moyers’ “On Democracy” Is a good read, and I think it is a good perspective of the last 40 years of politics from an honest source who has been both on the inside and the outside.
Cris
Did you use cereal commas?
suzanne
@asiangrrlMN: How goes the presidential campaign? I’ll do your campaign logo. I guarantee it’ll be better than Romney’s piece of shit.
asiangrrlMN
@suzanne: Excellent! Sounds like all is good except with the crappy neighbor. Can you watch him somehow? I’d be nervous that he’d do something to Luna. Can you videotape him? Honestly, I don’t think the cops are gonna do anything about it.
@suzanne: I’m still trying to get on the Colbert Show. And, cool on the logo. I have other designer friends, so perhaps you can all collaborate. Though, to be truthful, I could do a better logo than the POS Romney unveiled.
Corner Stone
@Elia Isquire: You don’t need a pass.
arguingwithsignposts
i found out today that my aunt died, and there’s a lot of family stuff to work through. It’s late, and I’m tired of fucking living in Nixonland (not even reading the book any more), so I will again suggest Kitchen Confidential by Anthony Bourdain, or something light.
Cris
@Corner Stone: I almost left it as it was, for the inadvertent appropriateness. Kind of a Freudian autocorrect.
Gina
@suzanne: WTH? I’m confused, are you saying you think he broke in to your house and put the dog outside?
If it were me, I’d be tempted to put up a camera or two and set up DVR or computer recording. I actually did that a few years ago when we were having some creepy stalker neighbor kid issues. He’s got issues, and one of them involves teasing animals, and I wanted to have a clear, impartial record of whatever may or may not happen if/when he started up his nonsense again. The kid has a history of egging younger kids on to do bad things, then either ratting on or screaming about being a victim of whomever he was badgering. Same with animals, teasing dogs til they go ballistic, then fussing about it.
Interestingly, once the camera was up, and once I told the neighborhood grapevine that I had it connected to computer and would post on YouTube, stalker kid ratcheted his shit way down, and leaves us out of his orbit entirely now. The camera now catches the local deer snacking on my roses and other pretty flowers.
Security Spy is the software I used, it’s for Macs only, but I’m sure there’s tons of others out there for other OS’s.
suzanne
@asiangrrlMN: I *am* nervous that he’ll try to fuck with her. ‘Course, she’s about seventy pounds of Lab/Pit muscle, so she looks intimidating to those that don’t know that she gets her ass kicked on a daily basis by my mom’s Chihuahua. But this guy is a serious dickhead.
And Luna’s turds are more graphically appealing than that fuckin’ logo of Romney’s. The kerning makes me consider blindness as an appealing alternative.
MikeJ
@suzanne: Speaking of Romney, a tale of two heds:
Boston Globe
Romney on Obama: ‘The citizenship test has been passed’
Fox “News”
Romney to Trump: Obama Doesn’t Need a Birth Certificate
Romney says it’s ok that the blackblackblackityblack man doesn’t have a birth certificate.
(twice in the last hour I’ve typed “birth” as “broth”)
suzanne
@Gina: No, the gate from the front yard to the back was open, so the dog wasn’t contained in the fenced backyard, but was able to run into the street. Our gate has a latch but I don’t usually lock it, but I sure as hell will now. I’m so friggin’ glad nothing happened. I will never know if he’s the one that opened the gate, but a camera is a good idea. Shall look into that this weekend.
Yutsano
@suzanne: Romney looks like he’s trying to start a low-budget airline with that logo. Ugh.
Re: creepy neighbor: see if you can get a lawyer friend to chip over a cease and desist order. He is harassing you.
Gina
@Elia Isquire: Meniere’s? The hearing loss and tinnitus do make for some quirky interpretations of dialogue.
I found instead of jumping to conclusions it’s best to repeat back what I thought I heard. As a plus, it can be pretty funny. Or passable surrealist poetry, like in Cocteau’s Orphee.
MikeJ
@asiangrrlMN: I understand that you now lead the republican polls. Roy Edroso linked to Conservatives 4 Palin who say, “CNN Poll Shows that Governor Palin Probably Leads If You Take Huckabee, Trump, and Bachmann Out of the Poll.”
You only need to take one more person out of that list for you to be ahead, and I see no reason not to.
Gina
For the book club, how about the book “Malcolm X: A Life of Reinvention” by Manning Marable that DougJ posted about a while back?
Anne Laurie
@suzanne: First off, I’d say either Luna needs to be supervised while she’s in the yard until the curmudgeon goes on to his next grievance. If that’s not possible, can you put her on a long line, or a trolley? If you own the yard, are you or your husband handy enough to install one of those spring-loaded automatic gate closers so that it can’t “accidentally” be left ajar?
(Also, of course Luna’s rabies vaccination is up to date, but make sure she’s wearing her tag. And if there’s some kind of town or city dog license you may possibly not have gotten around to renewing just yet, this would be a good time to take care of that, too.)
And I know you don’t need more complications, but if there’s a way for Luna to get her Canine Good Citizen certificate, it never hurts to have “proof” that you care enough to keep her under control. If you google CGC tests your area, a lot of obedience groups & even big-box pet stores around here offer the test for a nominal charge.
Thirdly, depending on your impression of your local law enforcement, you might want to consider reporting the curmudgeon for scaring your poor mom. That’s kind of the nuclear option, but if there’s some kind of ‘community relations’ office, this is the sort of thing they’re supposed to handle before it gets to SWAT teams.
Anne Laurie
@Elia Isquire: Sometimes it’s just best to shut up and move on, because otherwise you might be perceived as playing the ‘But my best friend is black’ card, and that’s never dignified. Just my opinion.
Sly
Then I suggest a book on the 1950s. The Way We Never Were by Stephanie Coontz or Homeward Bound by Elaine Tyler May might not be as exhaustive as other books, but they’re easy to follow.
You really can’t come to grips with how social rebellions occurred in the United States without first understanding what, precisely, people were rebelling against. And in the 60s and 70s, people were rebelling against the imposed consumer and family ideals of the 1950s. This country basically went through a fairly massive and sustained psychotic meltdown in the latter half of the 20th century, in large part because the American ideal of the 1950s was impossible to live up to without going insane.
Anne Laurie
@arguingwithsignposts: Sorry to hear about your aunt, and the family situation. I agree that ‘light’ is what we’re looking for, a nice summer read. I like Bourdain, but I don’t think I’ve got the cooking cred to lead a discussion of his books…
Brother Shotgun of Sweet Reason
@Omnes Omnibus: I agree on bailing on the 60s. Been there, done that, and Nixonland covered it well.
As I’ve suggested, ad nauseum to anyone who reads the comment threads, I recommend Albion’s Seed to anyone who wants to figure out why the USA is the way it is.
Four British cultures: Puritans, Cavaliers, Quakers, and Borderers settled this country and we’re still fighting their battles.
I used to mock the Balkans for holding grudges for 400 years, but parts of the US are still fighting the English Civil War from the 1600s.
And the Scots-Irish (Borderers) … sheesh. Actually, James Webb’s book Born Fighting is what got me interested in this in the first place. An easier read, also recommended.
’nuff said.
Joseph Nobles
“When I was in Cairo during the Egyptian uprising, I wanted to change hotels one day to be closer to the action and called the Marriott to see if it had any openings.”
Guess who.
Yutsano
@Joseph Nobles: Donald Trump?
Brother Shotgun of Sweet Reason
@Sly: Hey, those books about the 50s sound interesting. I’m OK with those. After suffering through Nixonland, let’s just go back in time figuring out why it all happened.
Jared
How about Martin Luther King’s first book, Stride Toward Freedom from 1958? It cheerfully recounts how a progressive movement was built (the montgomery bus boycott). It has chapters on how they dealt with the methods of the opposition at the time (ratfucking, intimidation, propaganda etc.), biased media and internal disagreements on tactics and leadership style etc. The more things change eh… :)
Also he talks about badly spelled hate mail. You need to read that bit.
221 pages also too.
Yutsano
@Brother Shotgun of Sweet Reason: LET’S DO THE TIMEWARP AGAIN!!
I’m not in a hugely serious mood, so please forgive my lack of focus.
Joseph Nobles
@Yutsano: Worse.
Donald Trump knows what a clown he is. Trump’s been part of the WWE carnival more than once, and that’s basically what he’s doing in his presidential campaign right now – he’s making a full-on mockery of the Republican presidential primary process to boost his show’s ratings and I’m over the moon about it right now.
No, this quote is from a Very Serious Person. Very. Serious. Person.
Yutsano
@Joseph Nobles: My other thought was Joke Line only because I recall him rumbling about being in that part of the world around that time. But then I decided that was too obvious.
Crusty Dem
@Joseph Nobles:
The moustache of understanding. Nice.
Jared
Stuck in moderation?
How about Martin Luther King’s first book, Stride Toward Freedom from 1958? It cheerfully recounts how a progressive movement was built (the montgomery bus boycott). It has chapters on how they dealt with the methods of the opposition at the time (ratf**king, intimidation, propaganda etc.), biased media and internal disagreements on tactics and leadership style etc. The more things change eh… :)
Also he talks about badly spelled hate mail. You need to read that bit.
221 pages also too.
Joseph Nobles
@Crusty Dem: Oh, yeah, baby. And that paragraph gets worse.
Bless us, he does not report his vocal response to this person. One assumes it was not “Suck. On. This.”
Crusty Dem
@Joseph Nobles:
Yeah, he’s pretty much my least favorite person on Earth. Not that he’s the worst person (though he does suck), but he combines so many of the traits I personally despise. To sum up:
A) He’s obviously bright but talks/writes like a simpleton.
B) He takes self-promotion to a new level of parody.
C) He travels all over the world and talks to everyone, but somehow almost everything he learns is exactly what he already believes.
D) Anything he discovers that is contradictory to his beliefs is always, absolutely THE MOST PROFOUND THING EVAR!!
E) That motherfucking moustache.
I’ve determined that he’s an idiot’s version of a genius. He’s only useful for determining if someone is a fool (if they ever say “Tom Friedman thinks..” you know they shouldn’t be taken seriously).
ETA: And I wrote that list w/o mentioning the Iraq War.
Suffern ACE
@Yutsano:
In China, your glib use of that sci-fi time travel device is mildly discouraged by whatever body it is that monitors such things.
http://artsbeat.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/04/12/making-tv-safer-chinese-censors-crack-down-on-time-travel/?partner=rss&emc=rss
Yutsano
@Suffern ACE: Uhh, wow. I shudder to think what they’d do to Quantum Leap. Not to mention the Good Doctor.
Arclite
DougJ suggested Shock Doctrine. I’d really like to do that one, as I don’t have the fortitude to read it by myself. My anger will form a singularity and I’ll disappear into infinite dimensions. I’ll need an outlet…
Fucen Pneumatic Fuck Wrench Tarmal
@Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN):
false suspicions are a real pain, and normally i would agree with anne laurie’s advice that you might have to simply write off those who are inclined to believe them, good intentioned or not, but something like that tends to have tentacles. meaning, because you are likely to want to meet similar people to the people you know,or knew, the likelihood of them knowing each other on the small world clause, is high. any degree of new friendship you attain will be smeared by the old gossip, further down the grapevine, and with less chance of confronting the specific rumors that change your new friends perception of you.
fwiw, i have a cousin who got busted dealing heroin, i didn’t know about it, until i googled it,but apparently some in my circle, including an ex-wife who should know better, saw the last name on the news, being uncommon, they associated it with me, and thus i became a heroin dealer …its insanely ridiculous if you knew me, but these things live on the word of people who only think they do.
i agree also with omnibus, a book that doesn’t wrap itself in personal nostalgia might make for a less impenetrable discussion, but folks who liked it probably should hold sway, for having stuck with the first one.
Bill (aka 10amla)
@asiangrrlMN: Re Romney POS.
What, don’t like Aquafresh?
PurpleGirl
@Joseph Nobles: Tom Friedman? His column today is about Islamic matters it looks like from the title. (I don’t usually read The Mustached of Wisdom myself.)
ornery curmudgeon
@Arclite: Didn’t we already have a book selection thread, in which Shock Doctrine was a favored choice? That would be the one I’d like to participate in…
bemused
Yes to Collins’ book. I’ve had this book in my book shelf, along with about 30 other books still waiting to be read, when I recently started reading it. I’m about half way through it and even though I was in high school when only boys had sports teams, I’m discovering a lot of fascinating events I’ve either forgotten or didn’t absorb at the time.
I do remember the negative reactions to and stubborn reluctance to accept the passage of Title IX but a story about Congressman Pat Schroeder depicts the intolerant attitudes well. Congresswoman Schroeder was visiting a high school in her Denver district. The basketball coach told his team, “Show Mrs Schroeder what you think of Title IX,” and the boys turned around and mooned her. I notice the coach addressed her as Mrs. instead of Congresswoman.
birthmarker
Shock Doctrine, or Griftopia by Taibbi. At least Griftopia is funny. Shock Doctrine just makes one mad. Griftopia is also fairly short.
The book about North Korea, Nothing to Envy, is good, and makes you glad you live in the USA. Also not too long.
Sarah Vowell is always good.
Scott P.
Alternate suggestions:
Edmund Morris: Theodore Rex.
Teddy Roosevelt built the modern presidency yet he is really not well understood today.
Daniel Walker Howe: What Hath God Wrought: The Transformation of America 1815-1848.
A great book covering an important period in American history glossed over in most curricula.
JPL
Shock Doctrine seems appropriate because of the current political climate.
renegademom3
I vote for Shock Doctrine, tempered by a rockin’ good book of poetry by Alice Walker: Absolute Trust in the Goodness of the Earth.
Cfeddy
I would like Shock Doctrine or Griftopia, since those books are ones I see often sited. I have been reading along with Nixonland to make sense of the recent history I lived through. I found it very helpful in filling in the lapses in my knowledge.
matryoshka
OK, so that’s two threads in a week in which Shock Doctrine was a clear favorite. So? Will we or won’t we?
Suggestion: Maybe some of us could read Shock Doctrine some could read Griftopia, and discuss. The two are not unrelated at all.
Batocchio
Shock Doctrine, Angler by Barton Gellman, or Winner Take-All Politics. Griftopia wouldn’t be bad.