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You are here: Home / Foreign Affairs / War / The Real Danger From Dem Pullout Plans?

The Real Danger From Dem Pullout Plans?

by Tim F|  June 14, 20078:10 am| 43 Comments

This post is in: War

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An email from a friend who works with the military:

Just had an interesting conversation with a fellow who just returned from the theater and I mentioned my theory about the Prez going nucular about the supplemental funding resolution and its pullout dates because he was going to pull a lot of troops out next summer (the same timeframe) and claim it was because of “success.” He busted out laughing saying “of course that’s why” and its openly spoken of by the troops and leadership in Iraq.

He said KBR (Halliburton) has already started closing things down, cutting back the nice to haves, and letting go all their non-American employees (mostly eastern European guys). Clearly they’ve gotten the word to scale things way back.

Our side needs to be prepared to counter the propaganda that will be driving this. I know it’s politics as usual, but the soldiers who die in the meantime are pawns and should not be forgotten in the calculation. The military leadership, while always biased to conservatism, is particular craven in its failure to speak the truth and in its collusion in this charade.

The soldiers are generally not stupid, but many still feel somehow that they are fighting for American freedoms. It’s that loyalty and patriotism that is tapped by the venal jerks on the neo-con right and exploited. I am not ashamed of the soldiers or my former career as an officer, just the generals and culture that have become hypocritical and duplicitous in the un-American and undemocratic times we find ourselves.

You can put an “X” on your calendar next summer when “success” miraculously happens in Iraq.

Although plenty of reasons exist to feel cynical about any withdrawal talk, some very real limitations exist on how much longer we can keep lots of American troops in Iraq. The new (improved!) fifteen-month tours are an obvious sign of desperation, the National Guard commitments are unsustainable and ongoing stories about sailors and airmen training for street combat suggest how ridiculously overcommitted we have become. Safe withdrawal takes time and careful planning to keep it from turning it into a rout, wait too long that window will close.

I suppose we should feel marginally grateful for signs that our leaders are just hacks who play politics with American lives, repeatedly, rather than the reality-denying loons that they themselves insist they are.

***

One ancillary thought. Assuming that this accurately reflects Bushie thinking, do you suppose they bothered to clue in Joe Lieberman?

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Reader Interactions

43Comments

  1. 1.

    cleek

    June 14, 2007 at 8:42 am

    do you suppose they bothered to clue in Joe Lieberman?

    maybe not. but maybe Rudy “no plans for Iraq” Giuliani knows something about it.

  2. 2.

    scats

    June 14, 2007 at 8:56 am

    how do you square that with all the permanent base-building and talk of the “Korea model”?

  3. 3.

    The Other Steve

    June 14, 2007 at 9:07 am

    Get Ozzie back on the phone. We need to queue up “Momma, I’m coming home”

  4. 4.

    ThymeZone

    June 14, 2007 at 9:35 am

    The mendacious plan makes sense, of course. It’s what this administration does. But … how are they going to fake “success?”

    Just as an example, Iraq has a “governemnt” that has never actually governed anything. It can’t pass a law or carry out a measure for its people. It can’t protect it citizens.

    So the potatoheadsmust thing that they can just say the word “success” and then the American people will think there’s success. Like they trid to do in New Orleans?

  5. 5.

    Zifnab

    June 14, 2007 at 9:36 am

    how do you square that with all the permanent base-building and talk of the “Korea model”?

    Bush could be going into Ninja Turtle Mode, where the entirety of the US Armed Forces bottles themselves up in Bagdad and tries to pretend the rest of Iraq doesn’t exist.

    The great thing about the balloon-theory – squeeze in the middle and the insurgents just go everywhere else – is that the middle (Bagdad) does look an aweful lot thinner.

    And Saddam did very well by himself, holed up in Bagdad and armed to the teeth. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.

  6. 6.

    srv

    June 14, 2007 at 9:45 am

    It’s called Go Long

    What FDChief says.

  7. 7.

    Jake

    June 14, 2007 at 9:49 am

    But will this be a “success” that brings the soldiers back home or a “success” that puts them in Tehran?

    Nah, I’m being too cynical. This will be a “success” that brings the soldiers back home, leaves Blackwater’s mercenaries in Iraq to hold the borders against Iranians fleeing the missles launched from ships in the Gulf.

    Get Ozzie back on the phone. We need to queue up “Momma, I’m coming home” ^Crazy Train.

    Fi- oh wait, that’s been playing all along. War Pigs?
    Hmm. Nope, that’s been running so long the needle’s worn a hole through the record. Sweet Leaf? Nope. Bush is a coke man…

  8. 8.

    Rome Again

    June 14, 2007 at 10:02 am

    One ancillary thought. Assuming that this accurately reflects Bushie thinking, do you suppose they bothered to clue in Joe Lieberman?

    Is Lieberman jewish? Yeah? I think they clued him in. Israel seems to always get the lowdown when the American people don’t.

  9. 9.

    Rome Again

    June 14, 2007 at 10:05 am

    Jake, it’s not Ozzie, I tell ya, it’s Pink Floyd. Although you did have some good titles picked out there.

  10. 10.

    Rome Again

    June 14, 2007 at 10:10 am

    So the potatoheadsmust thing that they can just say the word “success” and then the American people will think there’s success. Like they trid to do in New Orleans?

    Well, of course, because while they want us to all learn how to spell, they don’t really want us to learn how to think. I’m so glad you didn’t listen to them and take them seriously. ;)

  11. 11.

    Punchy

    June 14, 2007 at 10:30 am

    Just because we’re pulling troops out of Iraq doesn’t actually mean we’re bringin’ em home, folks.

    **cough–IRAN–cough**

  12. 12.

    Rome Again

    June 14, 2007 at 10:36 am

    cough—IRAN—cough

    Why not? After all, it is just right next door. It will just be a short little visit.

  13. 13.

    ThymeZone

    June 14, 2007 at 10:40 am

    Israel seems to always get the lowdown when the American people don’t.

    But I saw an article the other day that said (Israeli prime minister) Olmert has an approval rating of 3% in Israel.

    I guess that’s what happens when you follow Darrell’s advice.

    In any case, Israel is governing itself about as well as Iraq is these days. Well, maybe that isn’t really fair to Iraq, I don’t know.

  14. 14.

    Tsulagi

    June 14, 2007 at 10:42 am

    …he was going to pull a lot of troops out next summer (the same timeframe) and claim it was because of “success.”

    A lot of the same was being said before the midterms when continued control of Congress was important to Bush. Remember, that was when we were on the “As they stand up, we stand down” slogan for success and exit plan. Even late last year at a joint Bush/Maliki commander guy press conference…

    Iraqi Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki said Thursday that his country’s forces would be able to assume security command by June 2007 — which could allow the United States to start withdrawing its troops.

    That’s worked out well.

    Plus looking forward to the stabilizing effects the Kirkuk referendum could have at the end of this year. The admin has had a few years to prepare for that as with Saddam’s execution so you can expect the same level of competent preparation leading to success from our side.

  15. 15.

    Filthy McNasty

    June 14, 2007 at 10:53 am

    our leaders are just hacks who play politics with American lives

    The most accurate description of the Democratic party I’ve seen anywhere.

  16. 16.

    John S.

    June 14, 2007 at 10:56 am

    The most accurate description of the Democratic party I’ve seen anywhere.

    If you want to be taken seriously as a conservative spoof you must learn to refer to them as the Democrat party.

    Other than that, full marks for the pithy rejoinder.

  17. 17.

    Rome Again

    June 14, 2007 at 10:59 am

    But I saw an article the other day that said (Israeli

    prime minister) Olmert has an approval rating of 3% in Israel.

    I guess that’s what happens when you follow Darrell’s advice.

    In any case, Israel is governing itself about as well as Iraq is these days. Well, maybe that isn’t really fair to Iraq, I don’t know.

    But you’re talking as if “the people” (whether American or Israeli) are part of the equation, and actually, as far as those currently in power are concerned, the people are only there to cast a ballot and buy into the propaganda ploys.

  18. 18.

    The Other Andrew

    June 14, 2007 at 11:02 am

    Here’s my fear:

    1. Summer 2008–Bush announces “Mission Accomplished! For reals this time!”

    2. Either as we pull out or after we’re mostly gone, the Shia militias are “deputized” by the not-quite-government, and start slaughtering the Sunnis more than they already are now.

    3. A borderline-genocide situation begins to creep in, but Bush won’t acknowledge it, as, in his reality, we won. I can just picture Tony Snow talking about how the brave, ethnically-vague Iraqi army is fighting evil, ethnically-vague terrorists.

    4. And so we come to the opposite of the original situation…the rest of the world wants to go in and take down the despotic regime (that we created), but we’re firmly anti-war.

  19. 19.

    Rome Again

    June 14, 2007 at 11:17 am

    4. And so we come to the opposite of the original situation…the rest of the world wants to go in and take down the despotic regime (that we created), but we’re firmly anti-war.

    Okay, my head hurts now!

  20. 20.

    cleek

    June 14, 2007 at 11:22 am

    4. And so we come to the opposite of the original situation…the rest of the world wants to go in and take down the despotic regime (that we created), but we’re firmly anti-war.

    i’m pretty sure Iraq’s fucked-up enough that no other country will want to touch it for a good long time.

    sorry, Iraqis, you’ve been Bushed!

  21. 21.

    Jake

    June 14, 2007 at 11:41 am

    5. Iran goes in to defend the Shia, Saudi Arabia goes in to defend the Sunnis.

    6. America goes back in to support the Saudis.

    7. In retrospect the current clusterfuck will look like the very model of a well run military campaign.

    8. Bush sits on the porch at The Ranch and says “Heh.”

  22. 22.

    ThymeZone

    June 14, 2007 at 11:45 am

    Bush sits on the porch at The Ranch and says “Heh.”

    This we can say with absolute certainty.

    No matter what happens between now and Jan 2009.

    That stupid motherfucker will be snickering at us.

  23. 23.

    Bubblegum Tate

    June 14, 2007 at 11:57 am

    But … how are they going to fake “success?”

    Well, bear in mind that they only have to fake “success” to the 28 percenters, who are already sitting in moist anticipation of the day The Deciderator declares Iraq to be “great success…high-five!” so that they can say, “Ha! I told you we’d win–and you moonbats wanted to surrender and turn America over to Al Qaeda!” The other 72 percent already understands that The Deciderator’s words about Iraq are pretty much devoid of substance or reality and, ultimately, are meaningless.

    Oh, and as for this:

    4. And so we come to the opposite of the original situation…the rest of the world wants to go in and take down the despotic regime (that we created), but we’re firmly anti-war.

    I want to say, “Ha, that’s a good joke!” But given how mind-bogglingly incompetent and ridiculous this administration is…the joke isn’t entirely implausible. Ugh.

  24. 24.

    Jake

    June 14, 2007 at 11:58 am

    That stupid motherfucker will be snickering at us.

    Being Bush means never having to say you’re a sorry piece of shit.

  25. 25.

    Zifnab

    June 14, 2007 at 12:07 pm

    I don’t think you have to worry too much about that, Andrew. The Republican Party is many things, but it is never “anti-War”. So long as money keeps flowing to the right military contractors and the Rs think they can pin any resulting increase in genocide on evil, weak-kneed Democrats, we’ll hole up in our U.S. Embassy/Fortress for as long as we can.

    Besides, I don’t see the rest of the world looking to clean up our mess. Take a look at the EU’s response to Darfur, or China’s response for that matter. America used to hold moral superiority over the rest of the planet because we were known for going in and doing the right thing when everyone else brushed it off as being too expensive/dangerous/politically costly. See: Kosovo, Sudan, Haiti, Desert Shield, Taiwan, Isreal, take your pick.

    Republicans have a habit of going in to empire build. Democrats have a habit of going in to spread love and buttercups. Europeans have a habit of not going in at all. I suspect they’ll sit back on their kesters, cry “America’s Fault!”, and ignore it.

  26. 26.

    BFR

    June 14, 2007 at 12:25 pm

    Bush sits on the porch at The Ranch and says “Heh.”

    Are we talking about the TX ranch or the secret compound he’s building in Paraguay?

  27. 27.

    Tony J

    June 14, 2007 at 12:31 pm

    The Republican Party is many things, but it is never “anti-War”.

    They were pretty anti-war when Clinton was in office, weren’t they? And since the MSM seems to have no problem whatsoever with forgetting that the pre-2001 GOP was more or less a pacifist movement, why wouldn’t they be quietly confident that another 180 degree policy flip-flop on their behalf wouldn’t be given the same friendly treatment?

  28. 28.

    S.W. Anderson

    June 14, 2007 at 12:37 pm

    From Tim F’s very interesting post:

    “I suppose we should feel marginally grateful for signs that our leaders are just hacks who play politics with American lives, repeatedly, rather than the reality-denying loons that they themselves insist they are.”

    I don’t think any such dichotomy applies. There might be a bunch of schizoid personalities in the toxic mix, but what you mistakenly perceive as a meaningful distinction is just the neocon Republican primitives’ rendition of multitasking.

    Even if such a dichotomy did exist, there’s no reason for anyone to be the least bit grateful.

  29. 29.

    Chad N. Freude

    June 14, 2007 at 12:38 pm

    About the Europeans:

    High officials of European governments describe U.S. influence as squandered and swiftly eroding (one minister went down a list of Bush administration officials, rating them according to their stupidity), the country’s moral authority nil. Lethal power vacuums are emerging from Lebanon to Pakistan, and Europeans are incapable on their own of quelling the fires that burn far closer to them than to the United States through their growing Muslim populations and proximity to the Middle East. They have no illusions that they will be treated seriously as real allies or that there will be a sudden about-face by the Bush administration. Their faint hope — and it is only a hope — is that they have already seen the worst and that it is not yet to come. Even worse than Bush, from their perspective, would be another Republican president who continued Bush policies and also appointed neoconservatives. That would toll, if not the end of days, then the decline and fall of the Western alliance except in name only, and an even more rapid acceleration of chaos in the world order.

    The entire article is worth reading.

  30. 30.

    S.W. Anderson

    June 14, 2007 at 12:45 pm

    cleek wrote:

    “i’m pretty sure Iraq’s fucked-up enough that no other country will want to touch it for a good long time.

    sorry, Iraqis, you’ve been Bushed!”

    You’re right on about Iraq being Bushwhacked. But don’t underestimate the attractiveness of Iraq’s geographic location and huge oil reserves. Then, keep in mind Mideast standards regarding how screwed up a country is. What we see as unimaginable chaos, murder and mayhem, they see as a routine dustup.

  31. 31.

    Sri Ramkrishna

    June 14, 2007 at 12:48 pm

    How does this theory square with the fact that if Iraq is fucked up, we aren’t going to be getting any of their wonderful oil. Whatever happens in Iraq I doubt the people who end up in power are going to be pre-disposed to us.

    If saudi’s join and help the Sunnis, and than Iran jumps in. Hell, maybe Turkey will join the party. I suspect gas prices to sky rocket. Who bets that the blame will fall on the Democrat party? (frankly, they deserve some blame.. wanky bastards)

    sri

  32. 32.

    S.W. Anderson

    June 14, 2007 at 12:52 pm

    Chad N. Freude quoted:

    “(one minister went down a list of Bush administration officials, rating them according to their stupidity)”

    That must’ve been a marathon event.

  33. 33.

    Chad N. Freude

    June 14, 2007 at 1:05 pm

    “(one minister went down a list of Bush administration officials, rating them according to their stupidity)”

    What wouldn’t I give to know what was on that list.

  34. 34.

    Rome Again

    June 14, 2007 at 2:04 pm

    Even worse than Bush, from their perspective, would be another Republican president who continued Bush policies and also appointed neoconservatives. That would toll, if not the end of days, then the decline and fall of the Western alliance except in name only, and an even more rapid acceleration of chaos in the world order.

    There is the real Bush legacy: the death of The West.

  35. 35.

    HyperIon

    June 14, 2007 at 2:11 pm

    Chad N. Freude Says:

    “(one minister went down a list of Bush administration officials, rating them according to their stupidity)”

    What wouldn’t I give to know what was on that list.

    what good would it do?
    surely our idiot AG was on the list.
    even the Repubs know he’s is a total loser.
    in the no-confidence “debate”, no R said anything positive about his performance. but he’s still the AG.

    i’m long past needing my opinion of these assholes to be validated. now i want them GONE.

  36. 36.

    BFR

    June 14, 2007 at 2:30 pm

    What wouldn’t I give to know what was on that list.

    Goose: The list is long, but distinguished.
    Slider: Yeah, well so is my Johnson.

  37. 37.

    RSA

    June 14, 2007 at 4:01 pm

    You think there was an error in the transcription of the quote?

    (one minister went down [on] a list of Bush administration officials, rating them according to their stupidity stamina)

  38. 38.

    Brian

    June 15, 2007 at 4:21 pm

    “and doing the right thing when everyone else brushed it off as being too expensive/dangerous/politically costly. See: Kosovo, Sudan, Haiti, Desert Shield, Taiwan, Isreal, take your pick.”

    You’re kidding, right? A typical Democrat. “White Man’s Burden” War and interventionism is perfectly ok when controlled by “our” side? No thanks

    Kosovo-basically turned over to a bunch of white slavers and drug runners who quickly began doing the exact same thing to the Serbian minority that the Serbs had done to them. (i.e. ethnic cleansing).

    Sudan-what have we actually “done” here.

    Haiti-a total mess, with CIA-supported goons terrorizing much of the population. U.S. intervention has never solved anything in Haiti, only exacerbated the problems.

    Desert Shield-A real proud moment. One Bushie tells Sadaam ok, the others decide to poison the entire region with nuclear dust from depleted uranisum for generations. Not to forget the hundreds of thousands of deaths from “sanctions” that do nothing.

    Israel and Taiwan? The verdict’s out. I’m sure Palestinians who have been bulldozed out of their homes by settlers are appreciative of our good works here.

  39. 39.

    BIRDZILLA

    June 17, 2007 at 2:47 pm

    Have you seen the latest polls for the demacratic CONgress their numbers are lower then bushes

Comments are closed.

Trackbacks

  1. Balloon Juice says:
    July 6, 2007 at 10:48 am

    […] Contrary to my post below, maybe Republicans won’t sign on to Democratic proposals because they know that whether they do or don’t, the troops are coming out of Iraq. Count me among those who trust Joe Klein about as far as I can punt him, but this (via Sullivan) both explains a lot and jibes what military-connected readers have been telling me. […]

  2. Balloon Juice says:
    July 6, 2007 at 10:49 am

    […] Contrary to my post below, maybe Republicans won’t sign on to Democratic proposals because they know that whether they do or don’t, the troops are coming out of Iraq. This (via Sullivan) from Joe Klein, who I trust about as far as I can punt him, both explains a lot and jibes what military-connected readers have been telling me. […]

  3. Balloon Juice says:
    July 6, 2007 at 10:49 am

    […] Contrary to my post below, maybe Republicans won’t sign on to Democratic proposals because they know that whether they do or don’t the troops are coming out of Iraq. This (via Sullivan) from Joe Klein, who I trust about as far as I can punt him, both explains a lot and jibes what military-connected readers have been telling me. […]

  4. Balloon Juice says:
    July 6, 2007 at 10:51 am

    […] Contrary to my post below, maybe Republicans won’t sign on to Democratic proposals because they know that whether they do or don’t the troops are coming out of Iraq. This (via Sullivan) from Joe Klein, who I trust about as far as I can punt him, both explains a lot and jibes with what military-connected readers have been telling me. […]

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