This is interesting:
In a direct challenge to Microsoft, Google announced late Tuesday that it is developing an operating system for PCs that is tied to its Chrome Web browser.
The software, called the Google Chrome Operating System, is initially intended for use in the tiny, low-cost portable computers known as netbooks, which have been selling quickly even as demand for other PCs has plummeted. Google said it believed the software would also be able to power full-fledged PCs.
The move is likely to sharpen the already intense competition between Google and Microsoft, whose Windows operating system controls the basic functions of the vast majority of personal computers.
“Speed, simplicity and security are the key aspects of Google Chrome OS,” said Sundar Pichai, vice president of product management, and Linus Upson, engineering director, in a post on a company blog. “We’re designing the OS to be fast and lightweight, to start up and get you onto the Web in a few seconds.”
I know a lot of you like google Chrome, and I tried it, but just couldn’t get used to it. I have it installed on both computers (as well as Opera, Safari, and IE), but I’m just a Firefox kind of guy. Regardless, I’d be tempted to try out a new OS that doesn’t require me to go back to school for eight years of programming classes to learn (see also, Linux).
arguingwithsignposts
maybe if they had a mac version, I’d be able to say whether I liked it or not.
mistermix
99% chance that it’s a Linux variant. If Google has control of the hardware and software, you won’t need 8 years of programming classes — it will “just work”. Linux is a PITA to those without 8 years of programming because there are a ton of variants and because hardware manufacturers don’t care if their hardware works with Linux.
Jason
Surprising that they weren’t pushing the drivers into Android for the netbook market. And mastermix is right: it’s the Linux kernel, which makes me worry about Ubuntu more than Windows.
This is where browsers are going anyway. All you need is a system that boots into a free browser and it’s going to look a lot nicer cost-wise than any portable. What I’m worried about is web standards staying fluid until 2022, and the weirdness of the Google Linux appropriation.
DeadlyShoe
So are they bundling their browser with their OS?
Not that I’m bitter. :P
The Other Steve
Anybody who is familiar with the history of modern computing should recognize this as the Shark Jumping moment.
So long Google, it was nice knowing ya!
Morbo
Does Chrome have mouse gestures? Yes, I’m one of those Opera one percenters.
Robert Sneddon
My impression, and it is only an impression at the moment is that Google’s vision is not a fully-fledged standalone OS per se but a method of running a browser on a range of hardware. It’s effectively a XHTML “thin-client” which relies on network connectivity to back-of-the-house heavy-metal hardware and software to deliver content. The front-end presentation to the user will be via a browser rendering HTML with very little local processing.
The connectivity requirement is going to limit its abilities severely and the necessity to keep it lean and mean to run on limited hardware will result in something that Microsoft or Apple need not lose much sleep over, much like Linux which is much more capable than Google’s offering.
dmsilev
It’s an interesting idea, but I wonder whether it’s going to run into the same reception that greeted version one of Apple’s iPhone Application Plan (Apple: “write all your cool applications as web-apps inside our nice browser”. Developers: “How about letting us write *real* applications?”).
-dms
The Other Steve
BTW, read Mark Cuban’s entries this week on living on free.
Hey John… check out your sidebar. Have you considered finding yourself a nice christian filipina girl?
Keith
I think the days of the thin client OS are gone. If netbooks were capable of 486 (or even Pentium I) performance, or cell phones had gargantuan screens, I could see it, but the things run Windows fine more than adequately *today*. The next generation will run it even better, and on and on and on.
There will always be a market for “anything but Windows” to be sure, but it will not be driven by Windows’ bloat, as it’s being slimmed down (been using Win7 on my desktop and netbook since the beta) while hardware will only get faster.
GusThePrimate
Whatever it turns out to be in a technical sense, developing a net-centric OS makes every bit of sense. I’d guesstimate that I spend more than 90 percent of my computer time using an app that is either hosted on the net or that depends on the net. The only local apps I use with any regularity are a text editor (TextMate), an info storage program (DevonThink), and the apps I use to tweak photos (Photoshop and Lightroom). Nothing happens in any of those 4 applications that precludes their being hosted remotely on the net.
One of the weak points of Linux is that hardware manufacturers have little or no financial reason to develop and release drivers for Linux. That’s why Linux so often just doesn’t work for many people. That problem is compounded by the fact that so many different flavors of Linux exist. Even a strong Linux player like Ubuntu lacks the clout and market presence to change that. Google, though, has the cloout and enough capability to influence the market, as well as the resources to reverse-engineer drivers.
Todd
http://www.ubuntu.com
No programming required.
mistermix
@The Other Steve:
It would be shark-jumping if it were all concept and no implementation, and if Google were betting the company on it. Chrome and Google Apps are a pretty powerful combination on Windows today, so this is an incremental technology move for Google. And Google makes all of its money on ads, and this is just another way to get more Google ads in front of customers. It won’t make or break the company.
A $200 device that just runs Chrome has a lot of potential for kids, casual users, developing countries, etc.
azlib
I use Ubuntu Linux on my notebook. The comment that Linux is hard to use is not accurate today. My Ubuntu worked out of the box on an IBM T61. While there are always going to be some hardware issues, the system is no harder to use or learn than Windows or Mac OSX. Most of the use case problems with converting Windows users has more to do with familiarity with the Windows interface.
Jon H
Go Linus! (Used to work with him and he rented a room at my house for a bit.)
Brian J
Yeah, WTF is up with that? From what I understand, a lot of programmers seem to prefer working on Macs. When asked about what sort of laptop Obama might have at his desk in the Oval Office, being the first president to do so, Google GEO Eric Schmidt said, “I hope it’s a Mac.”
So I’m lead to believe the industry and the company itself isn’t averse ti Apple products. If that’s the case, then why hasn’t anything happened in that area? Is there some issue with development that I, as someone who knows nothing about it, just don’t understand? That seems likely, but really, WTF?
The Other Steve
@Brian J: Programmers buy Macs and then install Windows on them so they can do programming. :-)
The Other Steve
BTW, 95% of netbooks are sold with Windows on them. It’s never the 80% that drives adoption, it’s the 20%. That is, if you limit what people can do they will beat a path to the door of those who can do it all.
Anyway, this is going to be yet another failure. I hope they aren’t investing too much into it. Point being this isn’t the first limited access computer, there have been others before it. WebTV was perhaps the most successful. It’s always the little things that get them in the end. Printer drivers, or webcams, etc.
4tehlulz
@azlib: I’ve tried Ubuntu and several other flavors of Linux. Until it has decent wireless drivers that don’t require being teh 1337 h4rdc0rz haXX0r to install and configure, windows will be superior.
Brian J
Semi-related question that one of the more knowledgeable people on the thread can hopefully answer: with a netbook that can’t really do anything but connect to the Internet, is there any limitation to using something like Google Apps? I’m trying to envision a scenario where a lot of people who are trying to cut costs–college students who are on a tight budget–go to this option because they can do the majority, if not all, of the academically centered work using this.
Brian J
@The Other Steve:
Why is that?
MattF
It is, in fact, a Linux variant. Interesting, that poke at Apple at the end of the third paragraph.
I’m on the skeptical side, myself. 1) Putting all my personal data on the ‘cloud’ relies on Google’s pledge of ‘not evil’. But what’s the business model here? How they going to make enormous amounts of money by spending vast amounts of money on data centers? 2) I’m doubtful about the stability and reliability of the web’s infrastructure. When I want data, I don’t want to be told “Uh, wait a minute. Make that two minutes. Um, make that an hour or so.” 3) On the web, 99.99% of everything is crap and/or spam. Even if access to it is cheap, it’s still crap and/or spam.
Jon H
@The Other Steve: “Programmers buy Macs and then install Windows on them so they can do programming. :-)”
Well, no, programmers are smarter than that. If they’re just going to run Windows, they’d buy something cheaper. If they want to use OS X also, then they might run Windows in a VM on top of OS X on a Mac.
A big advantage of OS X is simply having actual Unix underneath, and Terminal.app is a thousand times more functional than the Console in XP (dunno about Vista). In XP the damn Console is still the crippled thing it was in Windows 3.1, with different keys for cut&paste, etc.
And if they’re doing cross-platform C/C++/Java coding, then the performance-tuning tools that come free with OS X are as better than tools for Windows that cost upwards of $500.
In an all-Windows work environment, it can be extremely handy to have a Mac around, because there are some things that are awkward on Windows that are easy on a Mac, and vice-versa.
harlana pepper
WTF is a netbook?
Jason
I dunno lulz, I have to netsh ip int reset, reset winsock, fuss with the DNS cache, and reinstall my wireless drivers on XP much more often than in Ubuntu. I recognize that wireless is a big problem for a lot of people but I’ve found Windows to be just as bad (and less transparent); and after fixing Ubuntu tends to stay fixed.
For me it’s always been about how easy it is to fix a problem on your own. And for most problems I’ve always been able to find a fix regardless of operating system. Never advanced with Windows beyond XP, though, so I can’t comment on Vista. 7 looks nice though.
debit
@The Other Steve:
It’s funny because it’s true. My son the programmer has three Macs and each one has Boot Camp or some variant.
Edited to add: @Jon H: Oh, you and your logic.
ploeg
@Robert Sneddon:
In the consumer market, there’s a lot of appeal in having your computer “just work”. And having limited capability isn’t as much of a problem now as it might have been in the past. At this point, Microsoft’s main competitor is Windows XP. Consumers and corporations don’t feel compelled to upgrade every three or four years anymore. If Google’s technology will allow customers to extend the use of their current systems, or make it easier for customers to jump to another base OS, that’s a problem for Microsoft.
Jon H
@harlana pepper:
A teeny-tiny laptop with a relatively slow processor and relatively little memory, and no CD/DVD drive, but with wireless and USB. They’re really inexpensive (under $500?)
mike
It looks like its not going to be an OS per se. Instead it appears to be a Linux distro with a new Window Manager to replace X Windows. Sounds really cool to me. X is a disaster, no one will be sorry to see it go when/if ChromeOS succeeds.
X Windows is sort of like apples to oranges when compared to Microsoft Windows. X is a graphics and windowing toolkit with an incredibly baroque and over-complicated API that everyone hates. Good move on Googles part to ditch it.
Jason
@Brian J: This is actually a scenario for a lot of colleges looking to expand their software offerings quickly – with Apps you get syncable Office apps and great email (college webmail systems are generally awful). So you’re absolutely right; it’s often the faculty that have a bigger problem with adoption and use than the students.
Jon H
@debit: “It’s funny because it’s true. My son the programmer has three Macs and each one has Boot Camp or some variant.”
Well, sure, it’s useful. For playing games, if nothing else. I’d be surprised if he spent all his time in Windows.
mistermix
@The Other Steve:
Yeah, the straw man product that exists in your mind would fail. Good thing Google isn’t creating that.
If it runs Chrome, it’s not “limited access” unless you think being able to run browser-based apps only is “limited access”. Pretty much everything runs in a browser today.
“Printer drivers or webcams” — Linux printer support is very good nowadays, and if Google controls the hardware, they’ll install a webcam that works with it.
Finally, you didn’t say this, but keep in mind that “lack of universal adoption” does not equal “failure”. This type of device certainly won’t be adopted universally, but it might well be adopted by a lot of people who would normally not buy a computer, and that’s a huge market.
Keith
On the subject of netbooks, they do run a relatively slow processor (usually an Intel Atom), but – and I’ve had to dispel this rumor a LOT to folks that see me using mine – they are far more useful than for just email and browsing if you boost the memory and put in a solid-state drive (memory’s dirt cheap, and solid state can be; mine is 2GB with 32GB SSD and ran under $450 – including state sales tax). I can (and do) regularly run MS Office and MS Visual Studio (what Windows, Office, etc are *written* with), and with the exception of actually compiling, it beats my desktop in speed. The key is the solid-state drive, as disk access is insanely fast compared to a hard drive.
mistermix
@MattF: From that blog posting:
ARM will enable $200 netbooks that run for 8 hours on a charge. ARM processors run things like digital music players and cellphones. They’re cheap and easy on power.
jnfr
Gat back to me when it can run Warcraft, Sims 3, and my TiVo Server.
tom
Google has released a “preview” of Chrome for Mac.
harlana pepper
@Jon H: Thanks. Color me a reluctant Luddite. At any rate, doesn’t sound too desirable
Anticorium
@The Other Steve: “then install Windows on them so they can do programming. :-)”
Java, Perl, Python, PHP, Ruby, C, C++, and Obj-C all ship by default with every single Mac that Apple sells. If I installed Windows to do programming, it would take me a few hours of downloading and waiting for installs to be able to do the same work I can do eight seconds after I log into a fresh Mac for the first time.
Though, to be fair, if I want to compile C++, I do have to insert the Xcode DVD and double-click an icon. Presumably the DVD containing the free C++ compiler that ships with every Windows Vista desktop uses autorun.
Adolphus
A little OT: Yesterday I saw an episode of the Simpsons in which there was a Newton handwriting recognition joke.
Remember when Apple made shitty unpopular personal computing devices? Good times.
And the Simpsons was there for it. Jeebus, how old am I?
jrg
From the article:
Netscape was the first company to try disrupting Microsoft using this tactic. In 1995.
asiangrrlMN
I love Chrome. It’s faster than Explorer, and it does more things. I refuse to use Explorer any more, except to watch videos I can’t watch on Chrome.
My brother also told me that Google is coming out with something called the Wave. It’s gonna integrate e-mail with text-messaging and instant messaging and other good things (he can explain it much better than I just did as he is a techie geek). Two people can work on a document in the email at the same time, and then it can be automatically posted to a website or a blog. If it’s true and if it actually works, it’ll be really cool.
This other stuff? No idea.
Jason
@asiangrrlMN: Yeah, Wave and some new flavors of markup are more likely to make this sort of thing workable.
Jon H
@jrg: “Netscape was the first company to try disrupting Microsoft using this tactic. In 1995.”
Yeah, but Netscape wasn’t really in a position to provide the software to run in the browser, as Google is now. Also, Netscape got wrapped up in Java applets, which was a dead end.
Come to think of it, the Linus mentioned in the story worked on Netscape’s Internet Foundation Classes Java UI widget framework, which was largely thrown away in favor of Sun’s Swing classes. (Actually Linus worked for NetCode, which developed the frameworks, and was acquired by Netscape.)
Jason
@Jon H: @ Also it was freakin’ 1995. Though Google’s parting with Java standards is an interesting subplot to this whole story.
Dennis-SGMM
Here’s the official Google Blog announcement, dated yesterday.
One interesting thing is that the code for it will be open sourced by Google. Let the games begin.
CalD
@Keith: I think the bigger attraction to Anything But Windows is likely price as much as anything. A license for even Vista Home Basic adds something like $100 to the cost of a machine and a big part of the attraction of netbooks is that complete machines are selling for $300 – $400 or less. So knocking off that $100 bucks for the OS or any significant portion thereof would be kind of huge. In fact, I believe they’re selling quite a few of those machines with Ubuntu Linux already.
I’ll second the votes above about Ubuntu Linux, BTW. I loaded up a copy of Ubuntu Desktop in a VMware virtual machine on an iMac a while back and I was pretty impressed with the user experience. It wasn’t just that it was night and day in comparison to my only previous experience with Linux, noodling around with a copy of Red Hat about 10 years back. It actually stacks up pretty well against Windows if you ask me.
I really found Ubuntu no more difficult to install than Windows or Mac OS X (although OS X’s installer is prettier of course). It preloaded Firefox, a mail client and OpenOffice — which I’ve been using exclusively on my PC’s and Mac’s for a couple of years now — along with GIMP and a bunch of other goodies. With a Windows PC or Mac, I’d still have to install most of that stuff separately — after I spent an hour cleaning off all the crapware/demo-ware that comes loaded on them.
I also found Ubuntu to be much less of a resource pig than Windows XP, even with the Gnome desktop GUI, which is quite user-friendly. So it’s arguably more appropriate than Windows as an OS for lighter machines in that sense as well.
GusThePrimate
@Todd: Ubuntu is a terrific version of Linux. But, if your hardware isn’t supported, you have a problem. Fixing that problem usually doesn’t require programming, in the exact meaning of that word, but it often requires considerably more noodling around with text files and strange word constructions that the typical layperson wants to do.
E.g., if someone buys a new piece of hardware that doesn’t work out of the box with Linux, they do not want to be told that all they need to do is download a tar file, expand it, compile it, ensure that the resulting file is executed during bootup, etc.,etc. What they want to do is to point and click a couple of times.
Nor do they want to learn after an OS upgrade that their current driver stopped working and will not be upgraded because the guy who was the developer lost interest.
GusThePrimate
@Todd: Ubuntu is a terrific version of Linux. But, if your hardware isn’t supported, you have a problem. Fixing that problem usually doesn’t require programming, in the exact meaning of that word, but it often requires considerably more noodling around with text files and strange word constructions that the typical layperson wants to do.
E.g., if someone buys a new piece of hardware that doesn’t work out of the box with Linux, they do not want to be told that all they need to do is download a tar file, expand it, compile it, ensure that the resulting file is executed during bootup, etc.,etc. What they want to do is to point and click a couple of times.
Nor do they want to learn after an OS upgrade that their current driver stopped working and will not be upgraded because the guy who was the developer lost interest.
GusThePrimate
@Brian J: Google has released an early alpha version of Chrome for the Mac. Mac versions of all Google software typically appear some time after the PC release.
RSA
Have you recently browsed for Web pages describing Linux usability efforts? It’s like the debris-filled highways in Mad Max: Lots of big ideas, great plans, and then you see that this page hasn’t been updated since 2006, and this other page promises great results to be released in 2008, broken links everywhere, and so forth. I’ve been keeping an eye open for usability work in Linux and open source systems in general, and there’s just not that much going on. I think this essay, by John Gruber, on attitudes toward usability in the Linux world, is as true now as it was in 2004. I expect things will change as soon as the average Linux developer has an attitude other than amused tolerance for non-technical users — that is, not very soon.
Brian J
@asiangrlMN:
I do think what they are doing is amazing. I wish I had something substantive to say, but I don’t.
The only problem I see with most of this stuff is that I have no reason to use any of it. That’s not to say I never will, but right now, I’m merely an onlooker to what amounts to a technological version of “new and shiny (and useful, too).”
Xanthippas
I used Firefox for a long time too and I liked it, but I find Chrome to be a lot faster. And I use every other Google feature, so it would be strange to leave one off the list. Eventually I’ll get a Google tattoo, and the conversion process will be complete.
arguingwithsignposts
@tom:
That arstechnica article smells like complete PR to me. And the “preview” is still this incomplete? WTF? Sorry, but I’m unimpressed by Google’s speed in developing the mac and linux versions of Chrome, and this “preview” does little to impress me.
BenA
@The Other Steve:
That’s what I did. I run MacOS for me and Windows in Parallels for work. Actually I just run the work VPN software in Parallels and then TS into my desktop at work.. but it’s the same idea. :-)
BenA
Also count me in a someone who’ll switch to Chrome when it comes out for the Mac. I use Chrome exclusively on my PCs… except when I develop for work… still fricken IE 6.5 only at work! Firefox just is to bulky… or feels bulky.
Arguingwithsignposts
@GusThePrimate:
Um, not always. I believe I was using gdocs and gmail at the same time as the PC world. Not almost a year after the PC version. Now, the 3d modeling program and Earth, I’ll give you. But we are talking about a web browser here. shouldn’t take that long to develop a mac version.
zaine_ridling
I would use a Linux/Google OS (which is a small Linux distro used as a host environment for Chrome). gOS has been doing this for the past couple of years with success.
I’m using Linux right now and it’s amazing how much faster it is than Win7 or Vista. There are only two programs I now use that are not online. But the vast majority of my computing time is spent accessing and sharing data and information via the web using my browser. Microsoft will never match that, nor will they be able to.
Arguingwithsignposts
BTW, I’m writing this comment in the preview release of the Chrome browser on a mac. i wonder what kind of privacy we’re giving up to the GOOG for all this speed?
And yeah, it’s pretty stupid that they don’t have support for YouTube videos, even at this late date.
The Moar You Know
@Morbo: Another Opera user here. I think we’re more than 1%.
inthewoods
Google Chrome was released with a lot of fanfare as well, and now has 2-3% of the browser market. What many people fail to realize is that people (particularly businesses but also individuals) buy Windows so that they’ll be able to run MS Office. MS Office makes up about 50% of MS revenues, so Google’s first move (Google Docs) didn’t make a dent in that, so they’re trying the OS route. They’ll no doubt have some success, but most large businesses are not going to change until there is a true replacement for Word/Excel/Powerpoint.
The question that is always asked whenever I offer OpenOffice to anyone is “Can’t I just have Office? I hate having to convert my documents”…etc..”
It’s an interesting move by Google but at the end of the day I doubt it will be a big game changer. Google Wave is a lot more interesting – that looks like a true Outlook killer.
All that being said, I like Chrome a lot, although I’ve had to switch back to FF because too many sites I use don’t work with it.
I welcome the competition – but it seems to me that Android has a better chance of making a big difference than the Chrome OS does because they should be able to win a larger market share more quickly.
bago
An OS discussion and nobody mentioned .net? WTF?
Martin
Well, I think Google’s plan will be to produce something resembling the Palm Pre platform. Not a bad idea – MS has pretty thoroughly squandered the processing power than modern computers have, so I think the day has come that you can run a word processor through (effectively) your browser and have it not thoroughly suck.
That said, I’m now positive that a iPhone OS based netbook is on the way. I don’t think Google would make this move at this time if there wasn’t other competition coming to the space.
inthewoods
@bago: .NET isn’t an OS – it’s a framework.
rachel
@The Moar You Know: Here’s another Opera user. Once you learn mouse gestures, you never want to go back.
Max Peck
@Todd:
Go with Kubuntu, KDE kicks Gnome’s ass.
If iTunes had a Linux version I wouldn’t need windows at all anymore.
James K. Polk, Esq.
I got me a 9″ Dell netbook (barebones) for $205 shipped to Gullyvornia. Linux worked fine out of the box, including my wireless network.
I upgraded the Hard Drive and RAM for about $90, and the thing is very fast. I installed Win7 for kicks, and the thing is fantastic. The cuteness factor is off the charts.
somegayname
@The Other Steve:
“Real” programmers use emacs + gcc + gdb on debian. Everything else is for scrubs and computer janitors.
Cain
@Jon H:
We got the same appraiser.. (he lives in Lake Oswego in Oregon). Of course, he’ll be at our conference in September doing a tutorial. Yay.
My mom has Ubuntu on her notebook and I haven’t had a single support call from her in months. That said, I need to wipe the thing and start over. Bleeding edge is hard on linux as stuff like sound is still kinda pathetic. (we’re working on it)
But being part of GNOME for the past 12 years, we got some really cool stuff that is coming down the pipe that is going to be awesome using some of the features from Moblin (which is part of the GNOME stack) Full integration with social networking stuff and collaboration will be the big things. It will be very mac-like. :-)
cain
Cain
@RSA:
I think you need to define “usability” here. There are always tradeoffs and what not when trying to figure out what is usable since we have people who will take an instruction literally if it comes from a computer. But what do you think is missing based on your definition?
cain
Cain
BTW Google OS is a direct competitor to Moblin 2.0 an Intel product also open sourced. So it’s not just Microsoft that is being challenged here. The blog seems to indicate that this is for the netbook platform. So we have at least 4 competitors (Ubuntu, Intel, Microsoft, and Google) on the same platform. That should be fun. Only 1 is a commercial product… and microsoft is paying a lot of money to keep their platform on the netbook.
When Asus started the netbook trend, Linux had a 100% lock on it and now it only has about 2% marketshare. The claim was that customers kept returning it saying it they didn’t know how to use it or something like that. With stuff like Moblin the interface looks really really slick. Better than windows which is pretty boring.
cain
RSA
You’re right that it’s all about tradeoffs. I’m sometimes concerned that some software folks aren’t aware of these tradeoffs. (For example, I’ve gotten in discussions with people developing interactive software who didn’t think it was worth their while to talk with or even observe the eventual users of their systems. “But it’s obvious what to do next.” Sure, to a software developer it may be obvious, just the way vi and emacs are obvious.)
I think the conventional definitions of usability are fine; I like this one: “The extent to which a product can be used by specified users to achieve specified goals with effectiveness, efficiency and satisfaction in a specified context of use,” from ISO. It turns out, at least as far as I’ve read and experienced, that achieving good usability is a matter of process, which involves a lot of hands-on evaluation with real users. I think a lot of open source developers, working on teams or individually, just can’t muster the resources to do it. Results are sometimes fine, sometimes not-so-good.
Nutella
re usability of Linux: That was a big problem in the past but Ubuntu has made usability a top priority and now it is in pretty good shape, roughly as good as Windows usability these days. Remember when Vista first came out and MS was pushing it but hardly any drivers worked on it?
re Mac OSX as a programming platform: Since OSX is just a skin on Unix it is a serious OS for programming. If the hardware weren’t so expensive a Mac OSX machine would be the best choice for every programmer now, except the ones working on Windows-specific apps.
re Google OS: The browser will probably become the universal client for apps that run locally and over the web, but I think Google is wrong about web-based apps taking over. No giant corporation can be trusted to take care of my data.
RSA
Cool. I’d be interested in seeing any reports of comparisons, if you have pointers.
jh
I know it’s fashionable to crap on M$ but given the vast number of hardware/software configurations that are possible in the PC world, their OS does an admirable job managing everything.
Yes, the registry system is crap on wheels and yes, they’ve done some pretty shady things to squelch competition, BUT they’ve provided people with what are effectively “industry standards” for text documents, spreadsheets, presentations and (shudder) browsing the internet.
Windows is a giant lego system that people can plug into, get work done and share that work with other people without too much fuss.
That is what makes windows, in all of its forms, so valuable and that is why any proposed alternative that moves away from seamless interoperability with these standards is doomed to fail.
Sometimes, my Linux box is better for the task at hand than my Vista box. And for some people, a MAC is the preferred tool for the job. For vast majority of people, from cubicle farms to small home offices, swapping MS Word documents, Excel spreadsheets and emails, a Windows box (which are basically commodities at this point) makes the most sense, warts and all.
As long as the corporate world sees Windows as a standard, nobody is going to be able to make a dent in M$s OS dominance (browsers are another thing altogether)
some guy
In my experience, Linux w/KDE is a great near-drop-in replacement for Windows as long as everything works upon installation and your software needs are met by the programs included with the installation.
As others have noted, installing non-stock drivers is often a painful process. Installing software that is not already in a repository can be challenging, too, due to the “dependency hell.” For any given program to run in Linux, it requires that x program(s) be installed– and it must be version x.x.x of the program, otherwise it might not work. As someone who would typically be considered a Windows “power user” (but definitely not a hardcore geek), I found the experience rather tedious.
That said, I wouldn’t hesitate to install Linux on my mom’s or grandmother’s PC knowing that all they plan on doing is playing music, surfing the web, writing emails, and occasionally typing out a letter. They’re not going to upgrade their hardware or try to install esoteric programs.
Jon H
@Nutella: ” If the hardware weren’t so expensive a Mac OSX machine would be the best choice for every programmer now, except the ones working on Windows-specific apps.”
IMHO, if you’re a professional developer, it seems silly to skimp on the major tool of your profession. Saving a few hundred bucks on a tool you’re going to use for upwards of 2,000 hours a year strikes me as a false economy.
splorp
@Adolphus: It’s obvious that you’ve never touched a Newton device, let alone used one … otherwise you never would have uttered such a ridiculous statement. Yes, they were good times. However, the difference between your recollection of that period and mine is that Apple’s PDAs were completely lacking in shit. Your comment on the other hand, is bathing in it.
Brachiator
@Nutella:
I used to think that way, but now I see the light. People want fast, people want compactness, people want reliability.
But here’s the fun thing. Even though hard drive capacity is expanding exponientially, hard drive reliability is not. So, people have goo-gobs of pictures and music on computers, and a crash or a virus kills them. Just kills them.
But if people can keep lots of data securely offline, data can become device independent. And apps as well.
Then it don’t matter whether I use a cellphone or a PC or a netbook.
Heaven.
Bonus question: Do most of you use a desktop, a laptop, or both?
I ask becasue I noticed that most ads I see about computers these days show someone using a laptop.
drillfork
You actually use Opera? While Firefox is my primary browser, I have Opera installed. It crashes on me at least a couple of times a day, and I barely use it. It does this on every version I install.
I assume Opera’s at least more secure than IE (low bar there), but I can’t believe how unstable it is. Not to get technical, but it’s total, worthless crap. Am I missing something?
cschack
Somewhat OT, but here is Fake Steve’s glorious take on Chrome OS:
http://fakesteve.blogspot.com/2009/07/lets-all-take-deep-breath-and-get-some.html
It’s long, but worth it.
Jason
I use both.
Maude
@Brachiator:
I use a legacy laptop and desktop.
Is having files saved on the web safe or can it in the future be hacked?
I do legacy tech and I have noticed that larger hard drives can be a pain to maintain as they are slower.
I have always told people to store their family photos on CD. It is the best way. Even an external hard drive can go sour.
I got Ubuntu accepted as a legitimate os at a non profit which had windows and MAC. It was a bit of an uphill battle, but now, the administrator likes it.
The kids who used the room were fine with it.
The reason I chose Ubuntu is because of the end user and if someone doesn’t have money, they can have an os and apps.
I’m late to this thread and I missed bashing Daou (sp) to bits and I feel very left out.
Jason
@drillfork:
Good for testing? I keep Safari around even though I think it’s a piece of crap. I might as well, since iTunes’ update always tries to reinstall it (and MobileMe. And Bonjour. And a bunch of other useless crap) in order to distract me from the fact it’s putting QuickTime back on the desktop.
The iPod was a great gift for my wife, but the happy husband personality profile takes a real beating from the angry administrator whenever I have to go snooping around for collateral damage from the updates, endless file dupes, file conversion workarounds for cd burning…
The Other Steve
LOL! I love reading all the news about this today, with few exceptions it’s all “Oh this is absolutely brilliant!” It’s like Bill Kristol is writing for the tech world.
It’s so funny. It’s like most people just bleet like sheep and jump for joy.
They don’t realize that this announcement was the equivalent of Sarah Palin announcing she was resigning. It’s not brilliant, this signals the end of Google. They’re flailing and they don’t know what to do next.
The Other Steve
@Brachiator:
I actually has Google apps… hosted email and such on my own domain.
So I decided to start putting pictures up on their photo services and wanted to use Picasa.
PICASA IS A DESKTOP APP!
LOL!!!!! :-)
Steeplejack
@drillfork:
You might be. I have been using Opera as my primary browser for almost a year (on a Win XP box), and I can’t remember it ever crashing.
Is there something unusual about your setup, e.g., you have the CPU overclocked and have dual Hooker headers installed for Xtreme gaming or something?