Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

My right to basic bodily autonomy is not on the table. that’s the new deal.

Oh FFS you might as well trust a 6-year-old with a flamethrower.

I have other things to bitch about but those will have to wait.

New McCarthy, same old McCarthyism.

Not loving this new fraud based economy.

If rights aren’t universal, they are privilege, not rights.

The real work of an opposition party is to oppose.

The arc of the moral universe does not bend itself. it is up to us to bend it.

Quote tweet friends, screenshot enemies.

Is it irresponsible to speculate? It is irresponsible not to.

JFC, are there no editors left at that goddamn rag?

Not so fun when the rabbit gets the gun, is it?

We will not go quietly into the night; we will not vanish without a fight.

When you’re a Republican, they let you do it.

If senate republicans had any shame, they’d die of it.

Let’s bury these fuckers at the polls 2 years from now.

Bark louder, little dog.

They fucked up the fucking up of the fuckup!

Sometimes the world just tells you your cat is here.

A democracy can’t function when people can’t distinguish facts from lies.

This is dead girl, live boy, a goat, two wetsuits and a dildo territory.  oh, and pink furry handcuffs.

Speaker Mike Johnson is a vile traitor to the House and the Constitution.

The press swings at every pitch, we don’t have to.

Reality always lies in wait for … Democrats.

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Reader Interactions

150Comments

  3. 3.

    Ian G.

    Corker is still a no? That means Collins needs to feel the heat as much as possible. Go after Flake too (can’t hurt).

  7. 7.

    La Caterina (Mrs. Johannes)

    What is the result if McCain is not physically present to vote? Does a non-vote mean we only need 2 others to vote no?

  11. 11.

    Redshift

    As Chris Hayes says, if you’re depending on Marco Rubio having a spine for your survival, you’re already dead.

    (Slightly) better than nothing, though, I suppose.

  12. 12.

    hueyplong

    Rubio votes no only if another 25 GOPers are already voting no. So his comments are irrelevant, as per normal.

  16. 16.

    Another Scott

    TheHill – Timing of Senate tax vote uncertain due to absences:

    The absence of two GOP senators is creating uncertainty about the timing of the chamber’s vote on tax legislation.

    Sens. John McCain (R-Ariz.) and Thad Cochran (R-Miss.) have both missed Senate votes this week, and one of their votes will likely be needed to pass the bill.

    Republican leadership signaled on Thursday that the exact timing of the vote, and which chamber will move first, is now being hashed out.

    “I don’t know the answer to that question. It’s all about timing and managing absences in the Senate. … We’re simply being flexible to honor their concerns about managing their schedule and some possible absences,” Speaker Paul Ryan (R-Wis.) told reporters.

    The Senate was expected to move first on the tax deal, with an initial vote expected as soon as Monday. The upper chamber would then pass the measure and send it to the House on Tuesday for a final vote.

    But Sen. John Cornyn (R-Texas), the No. 2 Senate Republican, said on Thursday that there are ongoing discussions about which chamber will move first.

    “I think it’s just a matter of logistics,” Cornyn said, asked what was putting the timing into limbo.

    Senate GOP leadership is confident that they will have the votes to pass the tax deal next week, before leaving Washington for the year.

    But they face a narrow path with a 52-seat majority, meaning they can only afford to lose two GOP senators and still have Vice President Pence break a tie.

    Sen. Bob Corker (R-Tenn.) voted against the Senate’s tax bill and indicated this week that he’s undecided on the conference report, saying it doesn’t address his concerns about the deficit.

    If Corker remains a “no” on the tax bill, GOP leadership would need either McCain or Cochran’s vote for passage.

    Complicating matters further, Sen. Marco Rubio (R-Fla.) is warning that he could vote against the bill unless the child tax credit is expanded.

    “Rubio has consistently communicated to the Senate tax negotiators that his vote on final passage would depend on whether the refundability of the Child Tax Credit was increased in a meaningful way,” a spokeswoman for Rubio said on Thursday.

    Cornyn reiterated on Thursday that he expects McCain to return next week for the tax vote.

    “He’s just saving his energy and resting up for the big vote next week,” he told The Hill on Wednesday evening, asked if McCain’s absence would impact the tax vote.

    McCain was diagnosed with brain cancer over the summer. His office said this week that he was at Walter Reed Medical Center receiving treatment “for normal side effects of his ongoing cancer therapy.”

    Meanwhile, Cochran’s office said on Thursday that he would vote on both the tax bill and a short-term continuing resolution to fund the government next week.

    Cochran had an outpatient procedure Monday related to a nonmelanoma lesion on his nose.

    Both senators are expected to be “yes” votes on the tax bill.

    Pence’s office announced on Thursday that he would delay his trip to the Middle East to preside over the Senate vote.

    “Yesterday the White House informed Senate leadership that due to the historic nature of the vote in the Senate on tax cuts for millions of Americans, the vice president would stay to preside over the vote,” Pence press secretary Alyssa Farah said in a statement.

    Pence also presided over the Senate’s initial tax vote, even though it was clear his vote would not be needed.

    – This story was updated at 2:10 p.m.

    FWIW.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  19. 19.

    Mike in DC

    If it fails completely, and Jones arrives to thwart it next month, I will laugh out loud for a solid minute and a half.

  20. 20.

    Yutsano

    @Yellowdog: It should drop them to 51 present, on a procedure which would require at least 50 yes votes. So that does narrow the Yertle’s hand. Two nos and it’s dead.

  21. 21.

    Yarrow

    @Walker:

    With the Puerto Rican influx, this is probably Rubio’s last term.

    Yep. Rubio sees all those Puerto Ricans moving to Florida and he’s scared. Good.

  22. 22.

    germy

    @Mike in DC:

    If it fails completely, and Jones arrives to thwart it next month

    I thought McConnell’s plan was to rush it through before Jones was sworn in.

  23. 23.

    germy

    @Yarrow:

    Yep. Rubio sees all those Puerto Ricans moving to Florida and he’s scared. Good.

    Fleeing Puerto Rico because of climate change and settling in Florida… that’s sort of like jumping out of the fire and into the frying pan.

  24. 24.

    Yarrow

    @Mike in DC:

    If it fails completely, and Jones arrives to thwart it next month, I will laugh out loud for a solid minute and a half.

    Me too.

    @germy: That’s McConnell’s plan. But with so many absences it might not work. Also, all the Senators want their bribes. Can they get them and keep the House votes?

  25. 25.

    Corner Stone

    OMG, Trump is using props. Poorly.

    ETA, This is so sad. Can this fucking clownish buffoon do anything with a shred of dignity?

  27. 27.

    MJS

    Sending bad thoughts McCain’s way. I would send good ones, but I think we’re all out of bouts of conscience from the “Maverick”

  31. 31.

    HeleninEire

    Irish Independent headline “Trump blow as Alabama rejects his candidate.” Europe is paying attention.

  32. 32.

    JPL

    @Yarrow: Maybe the plan all along was to have it go down in flames. That might just drive
    Trump over the edge.
    A gal can dream, right?

  33. 33.

    MomSense

    @Corner Stone:

    Ribbon cutting? Doesn’t even make sense. Also we have a helluva lot more shit now than we did in 1960. We didn’t have shoulder seat belts for example.

    Even electrical outlets have changed. Why would anyone think we could have the same number of regulations in 2017 as we did in 1960.

    Jesus you have to be really fucking stupid to fall for this shit.

  35. 35.

    Corner Stone

    @clay: Briefly, he has a really weird org chart that has fucked up workflow. He also has a small pile of papers on the ground with “1960” label. A few feet away is a massive 6ft+ tall multi-stack of papers with “Now” label, and a red ribbon connecting them on an upward angle. I guess to show the incredible growth of job killing regulations. He cut the ribbon like it was a new mall opening or something pathetic.
    I am not kidding. Someone actually stacked tens of thousands of paper to make a huge paper pile.

  37. 37.

    Barbara

    I can’t imagine that Rubio is serious. He was reelected in 2016 and isn’t up for another five years. There is no reason to believe this isn’t just a ploy for some kind of goody. Will gladly congratulate him if I am wrong.

  38. 38.

    TenguPhule

    @germy: It is. But McCain may not be able to vote if the gods are kind to us and Corker is presumed a no vote. So one more and McConnell’s scheme collapses.

  43. 43.

    gvg

    Sigh….I guess that means I need to write him tonight since I am actually in Florida. I hate doing it. He sends back replies that shows his office didn’t listen to what I wrote and it’s been kind of libertarian let them all die because freedom plus voodoo economics. Generic republican screeds saying he will do exactly the opposite of what ever I have requested up till now.
    I vote against him everytime and I am not a potential vote for a republican so I don’t think I have any honest leverage.

  45. 45.

    TenguPhule

    And tomorrow we have to fight the tax shit bill again too.

    GOP really know how to ruin Christmas for everyone else.

  46. 46.

    TenguPhule

    Trump will propose a pay freeze for federal employees and cut domestic security programs in fiscal 2019, according to reports released by Senate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee Democrats.

    The two reports are based on budget guidance from the Office of Management and Budget, dated Nov. 28, overruling Department of Homeland Security requests. The guidance was leaked to the panel’s Democratic staff by a whistleblower. Sen. Claire McCaskill (Mo.), the committee’s top Democrat, had the staff issue summaries of the OMB document. One report focuses on personnel, the other on counterterrorism programs.

    Although the budget documents concern DHS, the personnel summary says “OMB intends to issue a pay freeze for federal civilian employees in 2019.” Quoting the administration’s document, the staff report adds: “OMB has instructed DHS: ‘Per governmentwide guidance, no civilian pay raise is included in the recommended level for the FY 2019 Budget.’ ”

    The counterterrorism report says the administration “intends to seek $568 million in cuts to counterterrorism programs” from 2017 levels. That would include decreases in programs on violent extremism, port and public transportation security, domestic nuclear detection and emergency management grants.

    Someone wants some obvious fires to break out on the homefront.

    Wonder why.

  47. 47.

    Corner Stone

    @Miss Bianca: I think no one in the Trump admin wants to admit we are not in the late 1950’s or early 1960’s. It’s almost as if the world has not changed at all and become more connected, and complex. The visualization props are just stupid and wasteful. You could have easily made a large posterboard chart with the same representation that people would have understood immediately. Without wasting all that paper, time and effort by somebody.
    And the red ribbon cutting with his Cabinet members behind him…I don’t even know where to begin with that. I’m embarrassed just sitting here watching it.

  48. 48.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    @TenguPhule:
    Golly, I don’t know. Wasn’t there a fire in Germany like 80 years?

    If a Dem proposed this they would be pilloried and then insta-impeached the same day.

  49. 49.

    chopper

    @TenguPhule:

    so according to trump the economy is doing so great under his stewardship that we have to freeze federal employee pay? he’s just a spiteful prick.

  51. 51.

    catclub

    @Yellowdog: somebody just as authoritative as you ( On this blog most likely) told me the opposite.
    that a 49-49 vote would not pass it. Might have been another reconciliation related rule.

  52. 52.

    Calouste

    @TenguPhule: Nah, I wish for treatment that will make McCain a lot better, but it has to start immediately and take him out of the running for a month.

  54. 54.

    Corner Stone

    @MomSense: That ribbon cutting thing. If he wasn’t such a brutal asshole of a human being I could feel sorry for someone who needed these small affirmations to make them feel better. I mean, this guy is cutting a ribbon taped between two stacks of paper. And he has members of his Cabinet level people all come stand behind him!

  59. 59.

    catclub

    @chopper: Trump’s hiring freeze lasted about three weeks before it kicked him in the ass, and was dropped.
    (They wanted to their own flunkies for DHS, I presume) This one has 9 months before it even gets implemented. I have my doubts.

  60. 60.

    germy

    @Barbara:

    Shades of Ross Perot.

    Didn’t Perot once deliver a television speech while waving a small stick with a monkey paw at the end of it? I forget what point he was trying to make with it.

  62. 62.

    Corner Stone

    @TenguPhule: I don’t want anyone to lose their dad (….hmmmm, check that.) I have to abandon this comment that might have been made by the pre 2016 me. The 2017 me definitely is rooting for injuries.

  63. 63.

    Miss Bianca

    @TenguPhule: Jesus, what an idiot. He can’t even get his performance art memes right. He makes Ronald Reagan look like the Great Communicator.

  64. 64.

    Kay

    Ramesh Ponnuru‏Verified account
    @RameshPonnuru
    Follow Follow @RameshPonnuru
    More
    GOP congressman tells reporters that Trump told him he is open to reform of Medicare, SS “on the first day of his second term.”

    So great of Trump to hand that to the opposition. Thanks!

    I will never understand this level of greed. They can’t let people keep 1,391.20 a month (or whatever measly amount they get) when they’re old and can’t work? They have to take that too?

    “He took the log from their fire”. It reminds me of the Grinch. This is conservatives “reforming” Social Security:

    But, you know, that old Grinch was so smart and so slick,
    He thought up a lie, and he thought it up quick!
    “Why, my sweet little tot,” the fake Santy Claus lied,
    “There’s a light on this tree that won’t light on one side.”
    “So I’m taking it home to my workshop, my dear.”
    “I’ll fix it up there. Then I’ll bring it back here.”

  66. 66.

    TenguPhule

    @Kay:

    GOP congressman tells reporters that Trump told him he is open to reform of Medicare, SS “on the first day of his second term.”

    Apparently Trump thinks the terms of service are only one year long. They want to do this next year.

  67. 67.

    Mnemosyne

    @Another Scott:

    “Yesterday the White House informed Senate leadership that due to the historic nature of the vote in the Senate on tax cuts for millions of Americans, the vice president would stay to preside over the vote,” Pence press secretary Alyssa Farah said in a statement.

    I am very happy that Pence is making a point of tarring himself with all of these terrible votes. He really is as dumb as advertised.

  68. 68.

    TenguPhule

    Chuck another ticking time bomb onto that Yuletide fire.

    House Republican leaders filed a government funding bill late Wednesday that bows to the wishes of conservative lawmakers but is widely seen as unpassable in the Senate, thanks to Democratic opposition.

    The move sets up a showdown between the two chambers and the two parties ahead of a Dec. 22 midnight deadline to avoid a partial government shutdown.

    The House bill provides funding for the military through end of the fiscal year on Sept. 30, and temporarily extends all other government funding until Jan. 19. The legislation also includes a GOP-written reauthorization of the Children’s Health Insurance Program and federal funding for community health centers.

    What is does not include are any of the top priorities for Democrats, including provisions dealing with the immigration status of “dreamers,” funding to subsidize premiums in the insurance markets created under the Affordable Care Act, more money to combat the opioid addiction crisis or any increase in spending levels for nondefense agencies.

    At this point, our side’s best option is to jam things up and shut it down on spending.

  69. 69.

    germy

    Trump told him he is open to reform of Medicare, SS “on the first day of his second term.”

    Okay, so then… never?

  70. 70.

    Kay

    @TenguPhule:

    I hope they try. They fail to grasp the concept of “security”. It’s a straight class issue. There’s 2 groups of people who can take a lot of financial risk- people who have absolutely nothing to lose and rich people. No one else is comfortable with it.

  71. 71.

    catclub

    Marco Rubio
    ✔
    @marcorubio

    20.94% Corp. rate to pay for tax cut for working family making $40k was anti-growth but 21% to cut tax for couples making $1million is fine?

    sounds to me like Rubio is fairly pissed off. Good on him. He is saying here what the Democrats would be saying.

  73. 73.

    TenguPhule

    @catclub:

    sounds to me like Rubio is fairly pissed off. Good on him.

    Don’t be fooled. He’s not nicknamed spineless for nothing. No credit for words, cash only on delivery.

  74. 74.

    Another Scott

    @Corner Stone: Remember Donnie made the Cabinet pledge fealty to him in June:

    Each member thanked the President. Many said they were honored to serve him and his agenda. And each person around the table sought to reassure the president that, despite the political noise, they were doing the work to make America great again. Trump sat, pleased, sometimes with his arms folded across his chest, smiling as cabinet members sang their siren songs of praise.

    Reince Priebus, the White House Chief of Staff, said in a tone full of supplication, “On behalf of the entire senior staff around you Mr. President, we thank you for the opportunity and the blessing you’ve given us to serve your agenda and the American people. And we’re continuing to work everyday to accomplish those goals.”

    He wants them (and us) quaking in their boots, the way the Iraqi parliament did when Saddam purged the Baathists in 1979.

    Donnie is too brain damaged to realize that he’s not a dictator and he doesn’t define reality in the USA. :-/

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  75. 75.

    TenguPhule

    @Kay:

    There’s 2 groups of people who can take a lot of financial risk- people who have absolutely nothing to lose and rich people. No one else is comfortable with it.

    You forgot the idiots.

  76. 76.

    efgoldman

    @Yarrow:

    That’s McConnell’s plan. But with so many absences it might not work. Also, all the Senators want their bribes.

    And every one of the senior RWNJs (Hatch, etc) is getting older, and more prone to the maladies thereof, by the minute.

  77. 77.

    Gravenstone

    @Kay:

    Trump told him he is open to reform of Medicare, SS “on the first day of his second term.”

    Gods forbid there actually is a second Trump term, no way do the oligarchs wait that long before forcing their pet Congressmonkees to gut those programs for their own further enrichment.

  78. 78.

    Yutsano

    @efgoldman: Hatch seems like he’s already deficient in his cognition. I’m not one for term limits but I’m wondering if a maximum age isn’t a good idea.

  79. 79.

    Kay

    What’s under-discussed about Donald Trump and the people he hires is how they’re all such assholes:

    The debate over net neutrality isn’t whether people are literally going to be unable to upload photos of cute puppies to the internet, but whether they’re going to be able to do so on fair terms or arcane, extortionate ones dictated entirely by a handful of ultra-wealthy service providers. But that’s beside the point; just like with a previous video mocking Twitter critics he filmed with the right-wing site Independent Journal Review, the intent seems to be finding friendly last-minute venues for Pai to publicly laugh off the intense criticism being directed at his plan.

    It isn’t just that they have horrible ideas. They’re personally, to a man or woman, assholes. Just like their boss.

  81. 81.

    efgoldman

    @chopper:

    so according to trump the economy is doing so great under his stewardship that we have to freeze federal employee pay? he’s just a spiteful prick.

    He is, to be sure, but I’m pretty sure he as just mouthing Mulvaney’s words without having any idea what they say or mean.

  82. 82.

    Shalimar

    @Ian G.: Corker said yesterday that he is undecided. My cynical interpretation is that he only voted no the first time because his vote didn’t matter, and he will fall in line if necessary.

  83. 83.

    Kay

    @Gravenstone:

    I don’t think they’ll be able to do it. It isn’t 1996 or even 2002. No one trusts any of them. The minute they float this plan – any plan, really- it will be wildly unpopular

    That’s why they should have worried about retaining some credibility. They need it. They think they won’t have to pay for the incessant lying and swindling, but they have no credibility banked and they pissed away whatever the people who came before them banked. No one will believe they’re “saving” Social Security. There were few enough people who believed it in 2002. That number now approaches zero.

  84. 84.

    ChrisS

    @Yutsano:
    There’s a guy that’s a member emeritus at our hunting camp. He’s been there since the 1960s. Great guy – and I know that this isn’t equal across everyone the same age, but he’s 74 and I can tell the difference from when he was even 70. He’s quick to anger, grumpy as hell, forgetful, etc. I couldn’t imagine him having a vote in the Senate.

  87. 87.

    feebog

    OK, just watched the regulation cutting ceremony and ye gods what a cluster fuck. But it is the type of ceremony he is most familiar with. Probably done hundreds over his lifetime. Don’t people with dementia revert to familiar routines they are comfortable with?

  88. 88.

    TenguPhule

    @Kay:

    That’s why they should have worried about retaining some credibility. They need it. They think they won’t have to pay for the incessant lying and swindling, but they have no credibility banked and they pissed away whatever the people who came before them banked. No one will believe they’re “saving” Social Security.

    And yet they’re behaving the exact opposite.

    And I find this troubling.

    They’re not supposed to have an organized armed force to support them.

    But increasingly, they’re acting like they do.

    Maybe they’re all just crazy.

  89. 89.

    germy

    The NY attorney general says he will sue to stop net rules rollback

    ALBANY, N.Y. (AP) – New York’s attorney general says he’ll lead a multistate lawsuit to stop the rollback of “net neutrality” rules that guaranteed equal access to the internet.

    Democrat Eric Schneiderman released a statement announcing the lawsuit after the Federal Communications Commission voted Thursday to scrap the Obama-era regulations. He said the rollback will give internet service providers new ways to control what consumers can see, do and say online.

    Schneiderman has been investigating fake public comments submitted to the FCC during the net neutrality comment process. He says his analysis shows 2 million comments stole the identities of real Americans, including dead people and children.

    FCC Chairman Ajit Pai, a Republican, said at a July FCC meeting that the raw number of comments wasn’t as important as the substance of issues raised.

  90. 90.

    efgoldman

    @catclub:

    sounds to me like Rubio is fairly pissed off.

    Sounds to me like he’s running for president in 2020, although why any RWNJ wants to is madness. Orange Orangutan is below Bush in 2008.

  92. 92.

    ruemara

    @Another Scott: You sure about that, Scott? Republicans have been able to redefine reality for their base and large swaths of others, for as long as I’ve been an adult. Mind you, that’s about 30 years and I’ve heard it goes back past the 70’s.

  93. 93.

    TenguPhule

    @efgoldman:

    Sounds to me like he’s running for president in 2020, although why any RWNJ wants to is madness.

    For Republicans, great power comes with no expectation of responsibility.

  94. 94.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    @germy:

    FCC Chairman Ajit Pai, a Republican, said at a July FCC meeting that the raw number of comments wasn’t as important as the substance of issues raised.

    What a jackass.

  100. 100.

    Jeffro

    @Kay:

    They can’t let people keep 1,391.20 a month (or whatever measly amount they get) when they’re old and can’t work? They have to take that too?

    Kay, in all fairness to our Galtian overlords, a) we peons didn’t really earn it, they gave it to us and b) they don’t want the whole $1,391.20…they just want it sitting in a nice mutual fund (or junk bond fund – it’s up to them!) that they manage where they can skim fees off the top and double (or maybe triple, tops!) their income.

    This whole not-for-profit, taking-care-of-each-other thing…it’s so…not-for-profit.

  104. 104.

    Brachiator

    @? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:

    @germy:

    FCC Chairman Ajit Pai, a Republican, said at a July FCC meeting that the raw number of comments wasn’t as important as the substance of issues raised.

    Also, the new net neutrality rules will hurt people living in rural areas where Internet coverage is thin. These are the same people who voted for Republicans because they were convinced that Democrat elitists didn’t care about the needs of rural folk.

  105. 105.

    Another Scott

    @ruemara: Donnie’s attempts really are different from what we’ve seen in the past.

    But, yeah, you’re right. They do live in a reality in their heads that is different from what most of the rest of us deal with in the real world…

    Thanks.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  106. 106.

    germy

    @Brachiator: Rather cynical response from Pai.

    The issue isn’t the number of comments vs. their substance. The issue is the number of fake comments.

  107. 107.

    Mnemosyne

    @Brachiator:

    And which candidate was it that had a plan for improving rural internet and cellular coverage but got thoroughly mocked for it as being “out of touch”? ?

  108. 108.

    Boatboy_srq

    @Kay: Of course they do. The oi polloi don’t deserve it, and the Good Job-Creatin’ Patriotic Hetero Xtian Ahmurrrrkkkans® won’t miss it.

    You HAVE read the history of the New Deal, yes? This has always been their complaint.

  110. 110.

    Yutsano

    @Mnemosyne: BUT HER E-MAILS!!!
    Honestly anyone who was buying that shit was just looking for any excuse to not vote for that female who’s had puppies.

    (No I’m not typing that word. I’m trying to wash it out of my personal language as much as possible.)

  111. 111.

    Brachiator

    @germy:

    Didn’t Perot once deliver a television speech while waving a small stick with a monkey paw at the end of it? I forget what point he was trying to make with it.

    Actually, Perot was effective at illustrating his points with brief, effective charts.

    It astounds me that even though Obama was good at using social media and cyber tools, the Democrats still do not know how to make their points effectively using visual media. They should be killing on this. The Republicans are usually worse, but Trump at least knows how to talk to the rubes using simple language, and vivid insults. Low Energy Jeb. Crude, but communicates the goddam point.

    ETA. Also, the GOP lies shamelessly. Bad messaging is easier when you don’t care about facts.

  112. 112.

    germy

    @Yutsano: I saw a rather zestily ignorant comment on another blog. This comment was in reaction to the Jones win in Alabama:

    Good for us that Trumpf et. al. will learn nothing from this defeat. Instead, as is his way he will blame everyone but himself as will Moore. All of this bodes well for next falls mid-terms , maybe. It all makes me wonder had Hillary actually tried last year and not been so damn arrogant maybe she would have won? She thought she could glide after the Acess Hollywood tape and she was dead wrong.

    A progressive commenter, male.

  114. 114.

    lowtechcyclist

    @mapaghimagsik:

    And after capturing that sound bite, he’ll abruptly cave.

    Yeah, I’ll believe that Rubio shows some backbone when I see it. And even then, I won’t be sure I’ve really seen it.

  115. 115.

    Kay

    @TenguPhule:

    We get cynical and disappointed but they DID used to have more credibility. When Bush wanted to destroy Social Security they were earnestly discussing plans and it was always presented as well intentioned.

    That doesn’t happen anymore. No one believes getting rid of net neutrality will help regular people. No one believes privatizing Social Security will save it. The BEST defenders of these policies can manage is “we promise we won’t completely ruin what you already have”

    That loss of faith in “institutions” Trumpsters were so gleeful about and exploited? Guess what. Now they run the institutions and no one believes a fucking word they say. They were dumb enough and arrogant enough to light the house on fire and then move into it. They said the same shit about this tax bill they’ve been saying about tax cuts my entire life- the difference is MOST people don’t believe it. They have no credibility left and they need some.

  116. 116.

    Boatboy_srq

    @TenguPhule: In this case the tax plan. There’s enough shyte in it for a dozen of them to balk.

    All we really need is a good listing of GOTea Senators with sacred oxen that this monstrosity will gore, and enough pressure on each of them to act in their own (selfish) interest. Surely SOMEBODY in that caucus has owners significant contributors who will be hurt by this thing.

  118. 118.

    Yutsano

    @germy: I would say English as a second language speaker but all the ones I know type better English than I do. Other than that I can’t even anymore. Except I’m thinking there were some less than legit hijinks going on. And I’m talking actual vote switching.

    @lowtechcyclist:

    I’ll believe that Rubio shows some backbone

    Those two words do not belong in the same sentence and you know it.

    (Also: FYWP)

  120. 120.

    Kay

    My son’s a freshman in high school and he and his friends are upset about conservatives ruining the internet. I don’t know if they understand net neutrality (I’m not sure I understand it) but I encourage this outrage because I know enough about Trump and Republicans to state with complete confidence that none of these venal, greedy, coddled assholes will IMPROVE what we have. They will definitely, 100% sure, make it worse. How much worse? I don’t know. So it’s a safe bet for high school freshman to be mad at conservatives for ruining the internet. They’re not wrong. To some greater or lesser degree that is true.

  121. 121.

    germy

    @schrodingers_cat: This was that same commenter’s prediction a few days before the Alabama election:

    Sadly, I doubt the black population is going to turn out. They didn’t bother for Hillary either. It’s the price we pay for Identity politics, isn’t it?

  122. 122.

    TenguPhule

    @Brachiator:

    These are the same people who voted for Republicans because they were convinced that Democrat elitists didn’t care about the needs of rural folk.

    They will blame Democrats for not fighting against it hard enough. We can’t win those people over, we can only suppress their votes for the greater good..

  124. 124.

    Chyron HR

    @germy:

    “It all makes me wonder had Hillary actually tried last year and not been so damn arrogant maybe she would have won?”

    Well, who else could be responsible for progressives voluntarily surrendering the country to Nazi plutocrats?

  125. 125.

    Adrift

    All my thoughts and prayers are with Sen. McCain in his waning hours of life. I pray that he is taken from us quickly and heads over the rainbow bridge to be met by those true American Heroes (TM) St. Ronaldus of Alzheimer and Sir Nixon the Dick.
    Karma is not truly a bitch. She’s just got a bad rap. Hoping for the death of someone who would inflict pain on millions should actually produce positive results.

    Edited for clarity.

  127. 127.

    MisterForkbeard

    @Kay:

    They have no credibility left and they need some

    Disagree there. I don’t think a lack of credibility hurts them at all – the media will always play a “You say your bill will help working families, but Democrats say it will literally hurl them into the sun. What’s the truth?”, which will be faithfully backed up by other media sycophants. And other media will say “This bill may literally burn the poor alive, but we have to remember that Hillary Clinton had an email server, so we totally understand why the nation hates all politicians.”

    In the meantime, their core voters will continue to get their hate-fix through propaganda on fox/rush/breitbart/info wars/russian media/the_donald. They won’t be impacted by reality.

  128. 128.

    Patricia Kayden

    @Another Scott: Remember when President Obama agreed with Senator McConnell that the Senate had to wait for Senator Brown to be seated before the vote could be taken on the ACA? Good times. Now McConnell is giving Democrats the middle finger and refusing to seat Senator Jones until next year.

  130. 130.

    MisterForkbeard

    @Kay: I’m completely happy with high schoolers reflexively learning that Republicans want to hurt them. It’s going to remain true for the foreseeable future, at least. :)

  131. 131.

    MisterForkbeard

    @Chyron HR: Now now. Any time now Amaranthine RGB will show up and yell at you because THEY totally supported Hillary for realsies and you didn’t.

  132. 132.

    TenguPhule

    @Kay:

    That loss of faith in “institutions” Trumpsters were so gleeful about and exploited? Guess what. Now they run the institutions and no one believes a fucking word they say. They were dumb enough and arrogant enough to light the house on fire and then move into it. They said the same shit about this tax bill they’ve been saying about tax cuts my entire life- the difference is MOST people don’t believe it. They have no credibility left and they need some.

    But that’s just it, they’re acting as if they don’t care about any of that. They’re not getting spooked by the same things that had them backing off in terror in the early 2000s. By all rights this tax shit is so unpopular it shouldn’t even be coming up for a vote, but they’re still gonna do it.

    So either they’ve gone completely insane (which I do not rule out), or they expect that there’s some other factor which is going to save them.

  133. 133.

    randy khan

    @Kay:

    Anyone who followed Pai when he was a mere commissioner at the FCC is entirely unsurprised by this. For a guy in a position of significant responsibility, he is remarkably juvenile. It’s no wonder Trump decided to promote him to chairman.

  134. 134.

    TenguPhule

    @MisterForkbeard:

    I’m completely happy with high schoolers reflexively learning that Republicans want to hurt them. It’s going to remain true for the foreseeable future, at least. :)

    Where there was one Roy Moore, there were undoubtedly others.

  135. 135.

    TenguPhule

    @Adrift:

    I pray that he is taken from us quickly and heads over the rainbow bridge to be met by those true American Heroes (TM) St. Ronaldus of Alzheimer and Sir Nixon the Dick.

    And then immediately immersed in the Seventh Level of Hell.

  136. 136.

    NotMax

    @Patricia Kayden

    Procedural nitpick. McConnell is not refusing to seat Jones, he is refusing to postpone a vote on the bill until after Jones is seated.

    Even if (in some parallel universe) McConnell’s top priority was the seating of Jones, the Senate would be unable to until Jones receives the official credentials to be presented to the presiding officer. And those documents don’t exist until the vote is certified by the Alabama Sec. of State.

  137. 137.

    TenguPhule

    @Boatboy_srq:

    In this case the tax plan. There’s enough shyte in it for a dozen of them to balk.

    There was. Unfortunately they stuck in the ACA mandate repeal into the negotiated shit show so this might be enough to keep them in it to win it. Their only consistent platform is Cleek’s Law, updated daily.

  138. 138.

    Doug R

    @ruemara:

    Republicans have been able to redefine reality for their base and large swaths of others, for as long as I’ve been an adult. Mind you, that’s about 30 years and I’ve heard it goes back past the 70’s.

    New Quinnipiac poll last week has generic ballot D+14
    New Monmouth poll this week has generic ballot D+15. Polled Dec 10-12, so the humiliation in Alabama not fully cooked in. Same poll has trump at 32% approval, a RECORD low, same as the Pew poll last week.

  139. 139.

    TenguPhule

    The problem is that Sen. Mike Lee (R-Utah) has already started to wobble. He, too, supported expanding the child tax credit and is officially undecided on the final bill.

    Huh, now that’s unexpected. Not sure if its worth trying to pressure him, but it probably couldn’t hurt.

    ETA: May have found a second wobbler on the R side.

  141. 141.

    Brachiator

    @MisterForkbeard:

    Disagree there. I don’t think a lack of credibility hurts them at all – the media will always play a “You say your bill will help working families, but Democrats say it will literally hurl them into the sun. What’s the truth?”, which will be faithfully backed up by other media sycophants.

    The media has been pretty good about laying out the facts of tax reform. Also, as with the ACA, they have also been pretty good about reporting on the unhappiness of citizens with what is going on.

    The GOP does not care.

    I agree that the pundit shows have been wretched. But anyone who depends on them is looking for someone to lie to them.

    Fox, Sinclair, Clear Channel continue to be cesspools of misinformation.

    And I am sorry. People want pre-digested facts fed to them, when they can easily get access to a range of information using a minimum of their own brain power.

    I type in to google, “does the tax plan help the middle class” and get a number of results that address the question, including:

    CBS News poll: Americans say tax plan helps wealthy, not middle class

    Some middle-class Americans would pay higher taxes under GOP bill …

    Trump’s tax proposal won’t actually help the middle class. Here’s what …

    GOP tax bill: Republicans reach compromise and add new tax cut for wealthy

    Will the House Tax Plan Help the Middle Class? – Video – NYTimes.com

    The only way you could improve on this would be if you got a tax primer with your happy meal when you drive through a McDonalds

  142. 142.

    NotMax

    Wouldn’t it be a bombshell if Luther Strange voted nay “in deference to the will of the voters of Alabama” as expressed in the most recent election?

    /one can dream, can’t one

  146. 146.

    Brachiator

    @TenguPhule:

    These are the same people who voted for Republicans because they were convinced that Democrat elitists didn’t care about the needs of rural folk.

    They will blame Democrats for not fighting against it hard enough. We can’t win those people over, we can only suppress their votes for the greater good..

    This is not true. Many of the young college kids who voted against Moore in Alabama are not yet committed Democrats.

    And once again, the Big Lie, and one that some keep repeating here, is that Independents are just Republicans who will not ‘fess up. In Alabama, people who identified themselves as Independent or Other voted 51 percent for Jones, 43 percent for Moore, according to exit polls.

    And getting the vote out is more important than trying to suppress it. One weakly documented idea is that Moore voters just stayed home. This is not sufficient. People assumed that this vote would be a low turnout election, based on what happened in the past. Looking for maybe 15 to 20 percent of the voters. Actual turnout was 40 percent.

    Democrats won because they worked hard to get their message across and worked harder to get the vote out. They also anticipated where voter suppression might happen and worked to overcome it.

    They DID NOT waste time trying to suppress Republicans. They overwhelmed them with votes for Jones.

    This should not be hard to understand.

  147. 147.

    randy khan

    @Yutsano:

    Shorter Pai: I’m gong to get this thing done for the corporate paymasters that have promised me a sweet sweet 8 figure gig after I’m done and none of you can stop me!

    He can only dream of an 8-figure payout. The only former FCC chairman who has done remotely close to that well was Clinton’s 2nd chairman, Bill Kennard, who got a gig at Carlyle, the big investment group here in D.C. Pai is not nearly as smart or savvy as Kennard, and also is much more likely to giggle inappropriately. (Hey, it’s true.)

    A more likely path is what happened with Kevin Martin, who went to work for a big law firm for a while, but couldn’t really attract clients because nobody actually liked him, and now works for Facebook. He probably makes mid-6 figures.

    Also, it’s an amusing but true fact that no former FCC commissioner ever has achieved any higher office after leaving or been elected to Congress. A few have tried (Martin was toying with running for Congress in North Carolina), but none have succeeded. (There’s some speculation that Mignon Clyburn, whose father is the House Minority Whip, might run for his seat when he retires, but for now she’s still at the FCC.)

  148. 148.

    TenguPhule

    @Brachiator: Whether this applies to places like Ohio or Kansas remains to be seen. Personally I think we’re better off suppressing Republican votes there for a couple hundred years. Only way for them to understand is to experience it personally.

  149. 149.

    Yutsano

    @randy khan:

    There’s some speculation that Mignon Clyburn, whose father is the House Minority Whip, might run for his seat when he retires, but for now she’s still at the FCC.)

    Eh. I’m not big on political dynasties. If she’s competent on her own merits then I’m all in. But she’s gonna have to do some leg work here.

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