Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

You can’t attract Republican voters. You can only out organize them.

When they say they are pro-life, they do not mean yours.

Relentless negativity is not a sign that you are more realistic.

When you’re in more danger from the IDF than from Russian shelling, that’s really bad.

Books are my comfort food!

The party of Reagan has become the party of Putin.

“Alexa, change the president.”

How stupid are these people?

I swear, each month of 2025 will have its own history degree.

You know it’s bad when the Project 2025 people have to create training videos on “How To Be Normal”.

The Supreme Court cannot be allowed to become the ultimate, unaccountable arbiter of everything.

Teach a man to fish, and he’ll sit in a boat all day drinking beer.

Never give a known liar the benefit of the doubt.

Tick tock motherfuckers!

“Loving your country does not mean lying about its history.”

Someone should tell Republicans that violence is the last refuge of the incompetent, or possibly the first.

Damn right I heard that as a threat.

Boeing: repeatedly making the case for high speed rail.

Consistently wrong since 2002

We will not go back.

The worst democrat is better than the best republican.

if you can’t see it, then you are useless in the fight to stop it.

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Human rights are not a matter of opinion!

You are here: Home / Open Threads / Tuesday Morning Open Thread: Spartans Reject Nazis

Tuesday Morning Open Thread: Spartans Reject Nazis

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I spent fifteen springs at MSU, so this story called up memories. From the Chicago Tribune:

Fights broke out between white supremacists and protesters Monday as anti-fascist activists, students and community members converged in and around Michigan State University to counter a speech by white nationalist Richard Spencer…

As some of Spencer’s supporters and people planning to attend the speech arrived on campus, masked protesters shouted obscenities at white supremacists and at police. A group of white nationalists marching down the road toward the speech venue – Pavilion for Agriculture and Livestock Education – were blocked by protesters. Shouts turned to punches thrown at protesters, but the group was forced by protesters away from the pavilion where Spencer later spoke…

The MSU campus is on spring break this week, which is not a coincidence. The timing and the venue of the speech were chosen to minimize the risk of violence and disruption to campus, according to university officials.

The Pavilion for Agriculture is a small arena well south of the campus’s developed core. Beyond it is farmland used primarily for research.…

Nice subtext (P.A.L.E.) from the university management. Unless things have changed a great deal since we left in 1989, it’s just about the right time for the extension farms to have started the annual process of recycling a winter’s worth of barn manure to fertilize the experimental field crops. So for once, the sinus-clearing aroma surrounding Spencer and his marks supporters would not have been metaphorical bullshit / chickenshit / pigshit…

(Per the tweet pics: Spencer claims that 150 advance tickets were given out, but the fearsome protestors discouraged his valiant supporters from showing up. Sad!)

Reader Interactions

159Comments

  5. 5.

    satby

    It wouldn’t surprise me that the Nazi could get an audience of 150 in that area. That almost all would be easily discouraged by protesters also doesn’t surprise me, they’re a chickenshit bunch. The setting was very appropriate.

  7. 7.

    opiejeanne

    Good Lord, Spencer’s haircut! Do barbershops have the Nazi Special on a list? I mean, how do you ask for that cut?

  8. 8.

    opiejeanne

    @rikyrah: good morning!
    I’m supposed to be asleep so I can get up in 2 1/2 hours to drive across LA to the airport and fly to Orlando for a couple of days. Birthday trip to Disneyworld for the two of us plus the middle kid who will get there ahead of us. bunch of March birthdays. Lots of fun.

  12. 12.

    Patricia Kayden

    So Ryan is finally standing up to Trump on the tariffs issue. I guess trade is the only issue that concerns Ryan enough to differentiate himself from Trump since he’s been kissing Trump’s butt on everything else.

  13. 13.

    Frankensteinbeck

    I think he was telling the truth. What we’ve seen is that the hardcore racists thought that Trump’s election meant they could safely come out of the closet and strut their stuff. After all, more than half of whites and the vast majority of the national press think they have a point.

    What they failed to realize is that everyone who wasn’t Republican hates their fucking guts. The flip side of the massively entrenched ‘look the other way’ attitude among whites is that the moderate racists aren’t going to stick their necks out for out-and-out Nazis.

    Like satby said, they’re chickenshits. We’re chasing them back into their hole. And by god, when we get power let’s clean them out. I don’t mean violence. I mean laws to make their cowardly harassment tactics punishable. Make them afraid to even admit their hate.

  16. 16.

    NotMax

    The end of civilization as we know it*.

    Health officials in France have just published an open letter in the newspaper Le Figaro warning the public about the dangers of wine Source

    *Okay, okay, hyperbole, but still….

  17. 17.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @Patricia Kayden:
    Like I’ve been saying, just because they don’t want to give liberals a win doesn’t mean congress supports Trump himself. They detest him. On the rare occasions they disagree with him, they don’t give him what he wants.

  18. 18.

    Ohio Mom

    Good morning one and all!

    Spencer’s suit is weird. It almost has an empire waist thing going.

  19. 19.

    Amir Khalid

    A good time-of-the-day to one and all.

    I’m curious to know: when Spencer and his nasty ilk are confronted with such stark evidence of their movement’s unpopularity, how do they react? Do they acknowledge it in some way, and paint themselves as Cassandras or martyrs? Do they accuse the media of lies and/or distortion? Do they blame “antifa”?

  20. 20.

    satby

    @Frankensteinbeck: evidently about 40 showed up to fight with antifa protesters, those who wanted to hear Spencer were escorted into the hall by police, but several more either got arrested or were just there to fight.

    Even if they had all gone in, 150 is a tiny crowd; pathetic that Spencer would claim that as a total.

  22. 22.

    different-church-lady

    “Yeah, well nobody watched the Oscars, so SUCK IT, LIBTURDS!!!1!”

  24. 24.

    Amir Khalid

    @opiejeanne:
    Many happy returns of the day — or as many as you wish for. You have my sympathies. LAX is the one place in America that I learned to hate.

  25. 25.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @raven: Something I’ll bet you didn’t know:

    Wreckage from the USS Lexington, an aircraft carrier that sank during the second world war, has been found in the Coral Sea by a search team led by the Microsoft co-founder Paul Allen. The wreckage was found on Sunday by the team’s research vessel, the R/V Petrel, about 3,000m (two miles) below the surface and more than 500 miles (800km) off the eastern coast of Australia.

    The team released pictures and video of the wreckage of the Lexington – one of the first ever US aircraft carriers – and some of the planes that went down with it. Remarkably preserved aircraft could be seen on the seabed bearing the five-pointed star insignia of the US Army Air Forces on their wings and fuselage.

    Yep, you read that right, the US Army Air Force was flying off of US Navy ships.

  33. 33.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    @Elizabelle: Thanks, last Tuesday we had lots of snow on the mountains due to a really cold storm on Monday night. The storm over the weekend was wetter but warmer so it washed away the snow at the lower elevations but dumped lots of snow up higher.

  34. 34.

    satby

    It snowed last night, only an inch. Will melt today and then it’ll rain tonight, turning to freezing rain. We’re still under flood warnings in this area, the river is high but not over topping the banks here. But it wouldn’t take much more water to flood again.

    Spring needs to come. Daylight savings starts next weekend!

  39. 39.

    Elizabelle

    I’m actually interested in another sad story out of Michigan. The young college student who killed his parents in his own dorm room with his father’s gun. College had called parents to come collect their son, because he was behaving erratically.

    Chicago Tribune: Cops: Student acted erratically day before he killed his parents at Central Michigan University

    This one has been of interest to me because, being a young black male, the initial story was “drugs, drugs, the kid said he took drugs”, when it looks so much like a kid having a psychotic break (and his is the age when schizophrenia often manifests).

    Have you been following this one? I want to hear the full story. If this was not “drugs, drugs, drugs”, I’d like to see heavy pushback against any authorities and media that pushed that line.

    Do you guys know more? Tragic case.

    From Chicago Tribune: they were screaming “drugs” a lot more in the initial reporting than in this story, and their later followup “relatives still love this college student” item didn’t mention drugs at all.

    Hours later, officers spotted Davis Jr. in a dorm hallway with his suitcases, Yeagley said. When officers tried to talk to him, he again wasn’t making sense, Yeagley said, adding that the student was acting “in a fashion that isn’t reasonable or logical.” They asked Davis Jr. to call his parents, which he did. An officer then spoke to Davis’ mother, Diva Davis, told them about her son’s behavior, their concerns about possible drug use and asked her whether he had a history of drug use, Yeagley said.

    “The mother said she too was concerned this could be drugs,” he said. He declined to say whether drugs were found in Davis Jr.’s system.

  40. 40.

    opiejeanne

    @Amir Khalid: Thank you for the kind wishes. I don’t hate LAX, have never had trouble there and I’ve been in worse airports. Far worse.
    We have a layover today at George Bush Intercontinental* of about 80 minutes so we get to find out if I hate that airport. I hate that it’s not a direct flight to Orlando but this flight was cheap. Coming back is a direct flight that cost less, go figure.

    *Is Intercontinental fancier than International?

  41. 41.

    opiejeanne

    @satby: Thank you. Mister opiejeanne turned 71 yesterday, and in a few days I’ll be 68. Still a pair of kids.

  46. 46.

    opiejeanne

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: Very nice. We could see the ocean from Rim of the World Drive (Highway 18) coming down from Lake Arrowhead. Not only the ocean, but it was clear enough to make out ships. Probably Long Beach Harbor, we think. I didn’t have a camera with a decent lens along or we’d have stopped to photograph it.

  49. 49.

    satby

    @Elizabelle: not much more info has been released, but it does sound like the kid had a psychotic break.
    And the danger of a gun in the house is more that it will be used by a family member either to commit suicide or kill another family member. Cop families are just as in danger as any other family with a gun.

  51. 51.

    debbie

    @Elizabelle:

    I didn’t realize until just now that the father was a cop. What a horrible situation for everyone who knows the family.

  55. 55.

    Elizabelle

    @satby: Please keep me posted. It’s almost local news for you. I was struck by how much “drugs” was part of the original stories, and this was tragic. Student looks like a handsome young college student of the darker persuasion.

    Agreed re the gun availability. Quite a few lessons to be drawn from this story.

    I think I might see if there’s much in Central Michigan’s student newspaper.

  56. 56.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    @opiejeanne: I could see San Antonio, San Gregornio, San Jacinto(barely) and Saddleback from the Baldwin Hills. I picked the right day to head out and take pics. Much better visibility than last year’s outing.

  57. 57.

    opiejeanne

    @Baud: Indeed.
    We went to the “state fair” in Puyallup a couple of years ago, just a coincidence that it was Sr Citizens Day, and we felt like teenagers compared to the fossils

    WA doesn’t have a state fair, the state just allowed that fair to make the claim to try to boost attendance.

  58. 58.

    Kay

    The Ohio Democratic Party will hold its fourth official debate for its governor candidates at Bowsher High School in Toledo on March 7, but this time with an almost entirely new cast.
    The only participant left standing from the first three debates, state Sen. Joe Schiavoni (D., Boardman), will be joined on stage for the first time by former federal consumer watchdog Richard Cordray, former Cleveland congressman Dennis Kucinich, and former Ohio Supreme Court Justice William O’Neill.

    I’m going to this debate. I’m a Cordray supporter. I once helped Bill O’Neill in one of his (losing) campaigns- he later won. However. He said he would drop out of this if Cordray got in so I’m wondering why he went back on his word.

  60. 60.

    opiejeanne

    @debbie: Thanks, although I’d rather just drive down to Anaheim for this party than fly across the continent to cohabit with the alligators, since the visit is too short for a meet up with la Cracker et al.

  62. 62.

    Elizabelle

    @NotMax: from NotMax’s link:

    This letter was inspired by recent comments France’s Minister of Health and Solidarity Agnès Buzyn made on a France 2 radio program. In this interview, Buzyn told reporters she believed the French wine industry was misleading the public by listing their beverages as “soft alcohol.” She went on to argue that wine is just as poisonous to the liver as other alcoholic beverages.

    Addiction specialists who signed Le Figaro’s letter said the government was putting the public at risk by not taking a tougher stance on France’s wine industries. They pointed out that wine is one of the most powerful psychotropic drugs on the planet and is the second leading cause of preventable death in France. Academics also pointed out how overindulging in wine was linked to higher rates of domestic violence, suicide, and mental illnesses. …. France both produces and consumes most of the world’s wine. It’s estimated that about 50,000 French people die every year due directly to alcohol.

    I’d rather take my chances against red wine than bullets.

  64. 64.

    OzarkHillbilly

    Apple co-founder Steve Jobs once said: “There’s not a straight piece of glass on this building” and that this was “a shot at building the best office building in the world”.

    Yes, one that is hazardous to Apple employees health:

    Employees in Apple Park, Apple’s grand new spaceship-style headquarters in California, keep walking into glass doors and windows.

    Despite warnings from a building inspector that people would not be able to tell where the door ends and the wall begins, at least three Apple employees walked or ran into the ultra-transparent glass hard enough to require emergency medical treatment during the first month of occupation, according to recordings of 911 calls obtained by the San Francisco Chronicle.

    Apple Park is a gigantic, $5bn (£3.6bn) four-storey glass and metal circle building designed by Norman Foster, where the glass has been specially treated to achieve an exact level of transparency and whiteness. The doorways reportedly have perfectly flat thresholds because “if engineers had to adjust their gait when entering the building, they risked distraction from their work”, according to a construction manager talking to Reuters. It also uses the largest, heaviest single pieces of glass ever installed on a building that also happens to be curved.

    Let’s see: They want to encourage people to work while they are walking and make everything out of super transparent glass, such that those same distracted people can’t tell where a door begins and a wall ends. What could possibly go wrong?

  67. 67.

    satby

    @Elizabelle: I think they always jump to drugs to try to explain erratic behavior (especially with teens), after all people speculated on that last night with the Nunberg freakout. It doesn’t help that many mentally ill attempt to self medicate with drugs either. And denial of mental illness because of the stigma is still very real.

  69. 69.

    NorthLeft12

    @Frankensteinbeck: I believe it is more accurate to say that Trump, despite what he says about Congress, supports the Republicans in Congress rather than the other way around.
    As predicted, Deadbeat Donald signs pretty much anything he is given by the Repubs and dutifully talks it up like it is the greatest thing since sliced bread and tries to cop the “credit” for it as well.
    Outside of his protectionist streak, the ignorant Orange Idiot pretty much lines up with all the worst policies of the Repubs. If anything, his presence in the White House has made the Repubs even crueler and meaner than before.

  71. 71.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @opiejeanne:

    WA doesn’t have a state fair,

    Tha tha tha that’s just un-American! Bunch of liberal pinko commie west coast elitists you are.

  73. 73.

    opiejeanne

    @Baud: Haha! No, the BJ group that I’ve met are a lot like us or younger. I think Ruckus is slightly older than we are but he’s a teenager compared to the people inhabiting all the recliners at the Barcalounger display that day. They looked like they were prepared to spend the rest of the day there, disinclined to leave.

  76. 76.

    Kay

    @Baud:

    I don’t know. I’ll try to find out. I’ve met Joe Schiavoni. He’s charming- engaging and interesting one on one- but much more a political operator than a governor. You know my feelings on Kucinich.

    Debating skill doesn’t necessarily mean anything- Sherrod Brown is a terrible debater- slightly bored, sort of mumbly and disinterested. Treats it like a chore.

  79. 79.

    opiejeanne

    @OzarkHillbilly: Well, it is a very blue state.

    There’s the Green State Fair in Monroe, which is smaller and nicer than the one in Puyallup. There’s an indoor arena they use for horse shows during the fair and the best event is the wagon teams. Beautiful horses pulling brightly colored wagons… and that one guy with the six Shetland ponies that shows up every year and tries to get them to all turn the same direction at the same time. I don’t think they’ve ever turned the wagon over, at least not at the event, but Shetland ponies must be related to cats so you know how entertaining this part of the event is.

  82. 82.

    Patricia Kayden

    @raven: What do you think is wrong with it? Haven’t watched it and probably won’t because it seems depressing. The story sounds interesting though. Saw the director on Tavis Smiley’s show a while back.

  84. 84.

    ThresherK

    That’s rilly, rillllly low-occupancy, and I say this as a someone who seeks out a lot of lower-seed womens’ hoops conference quarterfinals games. Y’know, the ones where two teams who are in the arena Baylor and Texas will fill up–in three days–play.

  86. 86.

    Kay

    @Baud:

    I’m kind of worried about Cordray in this environment. He will just never be a red meat ranter. It’s like asking him to turn into a completely different person. I’m afraid Kucinich is gonna do his bullshit made-for-tv act (and to a lesser extent O’Neill will too) and Cordray will look boring and somber in comparison to those two hopping around yelling. After Trump I just have no faith in the electorate- none.

  87. 87.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @opiejeanne:

    but Shetland ponies must be related to cats so you know how entertaining this part of the event is.

    Heh. I love that stuff. Our’s is in Sedalia and I’ve never been tho I probably should go once. I like county fairs, they are so hokey and…. well, to say the least, white. They are a hoot with rodeos and livestock shows and rides and all the greasy food one could ever want and than some. And “country” music, or at least what passes for “country” these days.

  88. 88.

    opiejeanne

    @debbie:

    You consult historical photographs and ask the barber to emulate the haircut of the man you idolize.

    I find that depressing. I did wonder if they sit around after their meetings in their clubhouse (Mom’s basement) and give each other that Hitler Special

  89. 89.

    Steeplejack

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    Techno-weenie hubris is a hell of a drug. There seems to be something about (successfully) doing large-scale software development that triggers the belief (in some people) that they can apply that expertise to everything in the world and it will all be so much better. It seems analogous to the way physicists sometimes come across as condescending assholes to other scientists.

    Steve Jobs: “a shot at building the best office building in the world.” Of course, because it’s not like architects and builders have been trying to do that since the Pyramids. (Not saying the Pyramids were office buildings! As Ben Carson told us, they were grain storage facilities.)

    Alas, if only in my 30-year software career I had worked in a building where the doorway was not a distraction from my work. What wonders would I have produced! And, oh, yeah, I’d be a bazillionaire now.

  99. 99.

    Steeplejack

    Well, I’m off to see the endodontist in a bit. At my dental checkup last week they found what appears to be a latent abscess way down at the bottom of one tooth’s root, so I’m supposed to get some sort of scan that is better than the basic X-ray. Shouldn’t be invasive or painful or take too long, but I foresee dental work in my future.

    And when I made the appointment they gave me some forms to fill out ahead of time and bring with me, which of course I can’t find now. So I need to arrive a little early to redo those. Grr.

  100. 100.

    WaterGirl

    @Kay: I always figured Cordray would be a shoe-in for governor if he ever ran. Stupid electorate.

  101. 101.

    opiejeanne

    @OzarkHillbilly: I think it was the Puyallup fair that has an exhibition hall full of absolutely beautiful rabbits and chickens, and no AC. On hot days it’s very unpleasant inside but the animals are so wonderful that I tough it out longer than I would normally.

  102. 102.

    cosima

    I have a huge number of extremely entitled shitty racist family members in Lansing & Grand Rapids. They are the children of one immigrant straight off the boat (my Danish grandfather) and a mother one generation removed from that status, as her parents immigrated from Sweden. The number of sane family members there — i.e. not racist — is near zero. Completely baffling. The family regularly have family reunions there, and there is nothing that could get me to hang out with that lot. I had dreams of going to Michigan State, but fortunately came to my senses.

  103. 103.

    Baud

    @Kay:

    The Dem electorate is usually pretty solid. I’ll be worried about the general electorate when the time comes for that.

  105. 105.

    opiejeanne

    @rikyrah: Thank you.

    Alarm going off in 45 minutes. Somehow spending this time with the jackals here seems better than the sleep I missed.

  107. 107.

    Betty Cracker

    @Kay: Maybe sober and sane will resonate in the Trumpdashian era. I’ll never again have as much faith in the electorate as I had for most of 2016 — even factoring in voter suppression and Russian shenanigans, tens of millions of our fellow citizens enthusiastically cast a ballot for a buffoonish demagogue. But even apathetic people who don’t pay attention to politics seem to sense that this clown show is abnormal, and maybe they’ll conclude they’re tired of the circus and decide that non-clowns are the way to go. We’ll see, I guess.

  108. 108.

    OzarkHillbilly

    This is worth paying attention to: Monsanto says its pesticides are safe. Now, a court wants to see the proof

    This week’s events will mark the first time that the body of research, some that has been gathering dust in stuffy scientific journals or confidential corporate files, will be analyzed under oath for all to see.
    ….
    Monsanto has tried to persuade US judge Vince Chhabria to throw out the litigation, and sought to keep secret the many internal documents it has been forced to turn over in discovery. But Chhabria has ordered that the hearing be video-recorded and shared publicly over the internet. And he has granted permission for plaintiffs to explore in open court such things as the ghostwriting of science as well as a controversial 1983 study that EPA scientists at the time said showed evidence of glyphosate’s cancer-causing potential.

    The court has dubbed the 5-9 March events as “science week” because the only evidence to be presented will come from experts in cancer science, including epidemiologists, toxicologists and others called to analyze relevant research. There will be no crying cancer victims to tug on heart strings; just opposing sides presenting science to a judge who will decide if the lawsuits can move forward.

    To bolster its defense, the company and chemical industry allies have been working to discredit cancer scientists and others who have been warning of danger. That effort was highlighted when members of the House committee on science, space and technology held a hearing in Washington on 6 February to air Monsanto’s complaints about the International Agency for Research on Cancer’s (IARC) classification of glyphosate as a probable carcinogen, and to threaten to strip funding from the scientific body.

    The committee effort – effectively turning a war on cancer into a war on cancer science – was applauded by the chemical industry. Monsanto, along with lobbyist CropLife America and other agricultural organizations, has also sued California to stop environmental regulators from requiring cancer warnings on glyphosate products, and on 26 February they won an injunction blocking such a warning.

    The debate over glyphosate is but the latest example of how industry efforts often focus not on scrutinizing scientific evidence of harm, but on discrediting the offending science.

    Lots of links in the article for those who want to explore this more deeply.

  109. 109.

    Kay

    @WaterGirl:

    There are no shoe-ins in Ohio. Democrats always have to run perfect campaigns and they need a number of factors in their favor to win because the Democratic electorate is REALLY diverse- everything from white gun-loving labor union leaders to suburban people who whine about taxes to urban AA electeds who are real power brokers in their respective cities. You have to court all groups because each thinks they are the “real” Democrats and each discounts the political value of the others.

    DeWine is the Republican but he’s riding on name recognition – he’s been around forever- so we won’t know if Cordray is doing okay until later, after the general starts.

  110. 110.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    Our’s is in Sedalia and I’ve never been tho I probably should go once

    We’ve been once, around 3-4 years ago. The “draw” was the fact that one of headliner acts (the Happy Together tour) had a backing band in which we knew everybody. It was an excuse to see them. But we ended up enjoying all the stock and poultry stuff.

    Sedalia is well, Sedalia. There’s no reason whatsoever to go there other than to take in the State Fair once.

    We stopped going to our county fair a dozen years ago. The other thing that’s unique to here are all the Catholic parish picnics. Stopped going to those about a dozen years as well. Worth doing a couple of times and we always tell B&B guests during “parish picnic season” that they should go to one while staying with us.

  111. 111.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @comrade scotts agenda of rage:

    There’s no reason whatsoever to go there other than to take in the State Fair once.

    That and the Katy trail. I’ve never been to a parish picnic, doubt I ever will. I get nervous when I find myself surrounded by Catholics.

  112. 112.

    low-tech cyclist

    Spencer claims that 150 advance tickets were given out, but the fearsome protestors discouraged his valiant supporters from showing up. Sad!

    How can that be? I thought his supporters were supposed to be the Master Race – they couldn’t have possibly been scared away by lesser beings!

  115. 115.

    Kay

    @WaterGirl:

    LIke all places, Ohio has regional rivalries. Toledo feels they are dissed in favor of the Three C’s, because they ignore the fact they are much smaller than the Three C’s, which is the real reason they are less powerful.

    They hate Columbus because the feeling is all state funding goes to Columbus and stays there. True, to a certain extent. So, I imagine Kucinich will portray Cordray as a Columbus person (true- he is) and act like a gritty, down to earth Cleveland person. Except Toledo doesn’t really like Cleveland any more than they like Columbus because part of Toledo’s essential nature is to be downtrodden and under-appreciated :)

  116. 116.

    Tenar Arha

    @different-church-lady: That particular online insult really made me scratch my head. The assumption by WaPo & the propaganda network that the lower numbers had anything to do with them at all is baffling. Not one mention that MeToo and OscarsSoWhite might be what’s driving those numbers down. Gee, it even makes me think that the argument that liberals live in a bubble might be a bit projectiony. /sarcasm

  117. 117.

    tobie

    @germy: I’m spending a few days with the extended family and have to say Levi Sanders reminds me of my 27-year-old nephew. He’s a permanent scold, convinced he’s the only one who understands the plight of the poor, and blames all the ills of America on the white liberal establishment. Listening to him, you would think here’s no Republican party whatsoever. The whole thing is frightening to see. I hope this is a really small sliver of the electorate.

  120. 120.

    Matt McIrvin

    Friend: “Look at it this way. At least you can’t physically get the Nazi haircut. You have that going for you.”
    Me: “No, but I could get the Nazi haircut of 30 years ago, easy.”

  121. 121.

    balconesfault

    @Patricia Kayden: Ha. Everyone is acting Ryan pushing back on tarriffs is some amazing thing.

    I’m sure it took all of one phone call from the Kochs – who are rabid anti-protectionists – for him to leap into action.

    How can the media not draw that connection?

  123. 123.

    germy

    @tobie:

    blames all the ills of America on the white liberal establishment.

    Levi’s preoccupations remind me of Greenwald’s.

    I’m assuming he voraciously reads everything GG writes.

  125. 125.

    What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?

    @cosima: I went to MSU for grad school but grew up in Grand Rapids, thankfully with parents who passed their enlightened views of race relations on to their children. Unfortunately, that was a 50/50 proposition on the West side of the city, which was where most of the working class whites of Polish and Dutch descent lived. Actually the Dutch are all over but back then at least the Polish were on the West side. I have lots of former high school classmates with pretty bigoted views, but don’t call them racist because that’s offensive. Seriously, I hate that they’re racist but what’s almost more annoying is that they are super duper offended by being called racist, or at least pretend to be so offended.

  126. 126.

    Steve in the ATL

    @OzarkHillbilly: I saw it from the air last night flying to SFO from LAX. Pretty cool looking, but I was thousands of feet up in the air and couldn’t see how clear the glass was.

  127. 127.

    Anotherlurker

    @OzarkHillbilly: The finding of the Lexington is very cool! I am an old Northeast Wreck diver who has a ball researching the sites that I have dove on.
    Sadly (or happily) the Lexington is well beyond SCUBA range.

  128. 128.

    tobie

    @germy: I should ask him if he reads The Intercept. You’re right that Levi sounds a lot like GG. The sad thing with my nephew is that his politics are clearly a rebellion against his “white liberal” parents. I suppose I should be happy he didn’t go in the direction of Richard Spencer but it’s sometimes hard to tell the difference between left-wing and right-wing populist warriors. Last night he was telling my increasingly wide-eyed and disbelieving mother that Jews own the banks and hence control politics. Ugly stuff.

  130. 130.

    Yutsano

    @opiejeanne: The master race needs a gene infusion.

    In happier news: happy day of birthing! You and your hubby are always a delight to see and I’m glad to have met you both. Will you be around between March 28-April 1? I’ll be around town then.

  133. 133.

    stinger

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: Cool! Actually, that’s what it looks like outside my window right now — we had freezing rain that coated all the bare branches, then snow that stuck to the ice. I think I’d prefer that it was the effect of digital or chemical manipulation, rather than the result of 33 degrees and precipitation!

  135. 135.

    tobie

    @Baud: I think the best thing I can do is recommend some news sites for him to read. He’s something of an autodidact so this might work…or it might convince him that I’m a member of the neoliberal establishment who should be ignored at all costs. Social media has really made fringe positions seem totally legitimate.

  136. 136.

    Baud

    @tobie:

    it might convince him that I’m a member of the neoliberal establishment

    You’re not? Then what are you doing here?

  137. 137.

    Leto

    @Baud: You’re never too old to be slapped for saying dumbshit. It’s just socially unacceptable. Of course if you don’t care about social conventions…

  138. 138.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    @stinger: That’s not really digital manipulation, it’s capturing infrared light as opposed to visible light. The manipulation comes in when I returned the visible color back in by putting in a visible light color layer in Photoshop. Of course infrared images right out of the camera look pretty red so there is the color swap since red skies look kind of freaky.

  141. 141.

    Doug R

    @opiejeanne:

    *Is Intercontinental fancier than International?

    Well, with bush in the name maybe they thought they need to be more continental.
    You’re flying United, aren’t you?

  142. 142.

    cain

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:

    @Amir Khalid: LAX is to be avoided at all costs; unless we were flying internationally, we’d always use Burbank.

    Ugh, too late. I’m flying in tomorrow. I’m giving the opening talk at a conference in Pasadena. I have never liked LA either. On the other hand, I’m going to be visiting the Pixar studios, meeting some folks there on some Linux business.

  143. 143.

    a thousand flouncing lurkers (was fidelio)

    @OzarkHillbilly: One year the Tennessee State Fair had the Pogues play. I can only conclude they had never heard any of their music, and just selected them on the theory that people love traditional Irish music.

  144. 144.

    Ruckus

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:
    Burbank is the only airport I’ve flown into or out of where the pilot had to take evasive action to avoid hitting another airplane. And the approach is almost as bad as some of the island airports in the world. Not my favorite airport.

  145. 145.

    a thousand flouncing lurkers (was fidelio)

    @comrade scotts agenda of rage: There’s a St. Lawrence’s Catholic Church here on the northern, rural outskirts of Nashville (complete with statue of St. Lawrence holding his gridiron) that has a barbecue every year.

  146. 146.

    No Drought No More

    Does anyone know what year QB Joe Theisman changed his last name to Manchin? It was obviously after he retired, but before he was elected senator from west Virginia.

  147. 147.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    @cain:

    meeting some folks there on some Linux business

    Sounds painful.

    @Ruckus: Never had any problems with Burbank; of course there was the plane that didn’t stop at the end of the runway and almost hit a gas pump at the gas station* across the street.

    *Gas station is no longer at that location for some reason.

  149. 149.

    Doug R

    @cain:

    Ugh, too late. I’m flying in tomorrow. I’m giving the opening talk at a conference in Pasadena. I have never liked LA either. On the other hand, I’m going to be visiting the Pixar studios, meeting some folks there on some Linux business.

    Pixar has studios around LA? I guess they took over some Disney Burbank space.
    Or are you heading to Emeryville as well?

  150. 150.

    cosima

    @What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?: You may know my family, they’ve been in Grand Rapids & Lansing now for a long time. My grandparents made a ton of money and every single one of their children who stayed in MI benefitted directly from that, living off them somehow, with that extending to their offspring. So, they’ve managed to survive through the efforts of an immigrant, half of them not bothering to get a proper job, and somehow are above the new immigrants? And God forbid someone is anything other than bright white. They’re just such garbage people. I haven’t been back to MI in 30+ years. Racists raising racists.

  151. 151.

    Mnemosyne

    @cain:

    If you’re flying through LAX to get to both Pasadena and Emeryville from Denver, you have a very bad travel planner. Sorry.

    Also, make sure you have room on your phone to take pictures at Pixar. They have cool outdoor spots to do it.

  152. 152.

    Shell

    Wiki says Spencer heads a ‘white supremacist think tank’. Contradiction in terms, anyone?

    Nice suit, though.

  154. 154.

    Miss Bianca

    @germy: He seems dull as dishwater to me, tho’ the jury is still out on whether that means he’s as dirty, too.

    Couldn’t even read thru’ his rants. With their idiosyncratic spelling, punctuation, and thought-drift they kind of reminded me of Trump, tho’ more prolix. Worst of all possible worlds!

  158. 158.

    What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?

    @cosima: I don’t know any of the Grand Rapids oligarchs if we’re talking that much money (Meijer, Devos, Van Andel, Wege, Bissell) or anyone there who has so much family money they no longer have to work, so I probably don’t know your family. Nobody with that kind of money lived on the West side as far as I know. I wouldn’t let your family completely sour you on the area as it is nice and not everyone in West Michigan is racist by any means.

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