Please watch this video:
So help me out here- which cop is the bad apple? Is it the one beating him on the legs? Or the one who blasted him in the face with pepper spray? Or the ones beating his upper torso? Or the ones cracking his hands with a baton?
I’m so confused.
trollhattan
Sadly, our barrel brigade is concentrating on finding a good apple, at this time.
I would like Biden to dismantle DHS. W created it in our time of National Panic and it has never worked worth a damn, and is the source of much that is bad and/or evil. “Abolish ICE” doesn’t begin to address the problem.
Eric NNY
Yes
Benw
Fuck the police
JPL
@trollhattan: Same.
Delk
Trick question. None of them are cops.
Bruuuuce
ACAB, edition 276, 321
waspuppet
I just have to point out, as I often do, that the whole point of the “one bad apple” truism is that it DOES spoil the whole barrel. If the fascism enablers in our midst actually knew anything about the heartland folk they claim to love, they’d know that.
Not that they’re the only ones. I blame The Osmonds.
Cermet
A trick question because the gestapo has immunity here in the U..S of A.ssholes by the inferior court of the land.
randy khan
I’ve seen people (using the term loosely) on social media saying that he deserved everything he got because he did not obey the orders of the law enforcement personnel. It is kind of remarkable that they don’t understand that, when the guy is just standing there, there is no legal justification for doing anything beyond arresting him. They just want to hurt the people they don’t like.
SiubhanDuinne
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Emerald
They’re not cops. If real cops were on the street they would be arresting these goons for assault at the very least, not to mention false arrest and kidnapping from the other videos we’ve seen.
I cannot believe this isn’t getting more coverage. Well, the goons are on their to Chicago now, so the coverage should become more prominent. Lori Lightfoot said she ain’t takin’ it. I wait to see what she’ll do with her own real cops, if she has any.
Pete Mack
To be fair, these ain’t actually cops by any useful definition. They are paramilitary.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
According to Iron Man there these cops or military were in a panic and clearly had no idea what to do. This is just a reenactment of the Boston Massacre down to untrained soldiers dumped into a civil disturbance, what could go wrong?
Blue Galangal
I see you’ve been reading OTB this morning.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Pete Mack: From what I read it sounds like Trump admin grabbed a bunch of guys just out of training in the military or law enforcement and dumped them in Portland.
Joey Maloney
Chicago cops are just another gang and by no means the smartest one in the city. What they lack in brains they more than make up for in mean, however. If the mayor can convince them to go up against the TrumpenTwaffel that’s going to be a rumble.
trollhattan
I’m beginning to think the Lincoln Project folks are in it as much for the fun as for a rage outlet.
“Trumpfeld”
Bruuuuce
@Emerald: From a public FB post by Heather Cox Richardson:
The local cops aren’t on the side of protestors, and not under the control of their supposed elected bosses. They’ve become and are now stretching into the role of Praetorian Guard, seeing that their privileges to harm people might get removed, and are on the wrong side of this fight.
Fester Addams
What’s horrifying me most about this particular atrocity is that goon who broke Mr. David hand was so clearly swinging with intent to do permanent damage.
scav
@Pete Mack: But — to be even fairer — they are increasingly the cops role models, icons and aspirational goals. Ever more military’s toys and less accountability!
low-tech cyclist
Rumor has it the DHS appropriation bill is coming up soon. So here’s something the Democratic-controlled House could actually DO.
Unless that appropriations bill passes the House, DHS (which includes CBP and ICE, if I recall) has no money after September 30. The House could pass a bill defunding ICE entirely, and barely providing enough money for CBP to fund their responsibilities to man actual border crossings and ports of entry. And then they could tell the Senate that they will not consider any other DHS funding bill.
different-church-lady
The one in the White House.
Aleta
Don’t forget the officer off camera who (it looks like to me) gives the OK (or the order) to the one who starts beating Christopher David. (Before David is sprayed in the face.)
I could be wrong, but watching it, my impression was that the officer who starts beating (first on David’s left) then moves around to his right, to hit him from that side and break his right hand. And that in the beginning (when David is trying to talk and is forcefully pushed back) that officer first moves into position, then looks off to someone for the order before he starts. Cold, methodical command structure and precisely trained delivery.
Christopher David interview:
Navy vet beaten by federal agents on the streets of Portland, Oregon: ‘They came out to fight’
https://apnews.com/4c521336d47c25d76d18000a3ea04511
bjacques
They’re good apple Sturmabteilung
Served
As far as Chicago goes
Lightfoot gets good headlines for talking tough when it’s easy, but that’s about all she does
scuffletuffle
Let’s look at all this from another angle, whose interests are being served by the actions of the alleged “law enforcers” when with no provocation whatsoever apart from existing, they are moved to beat with weapons and spray with chemicals a citizen of these United States…
Certainly not his, nor my, nor your freedoms…
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@randy khan:
There’s literally no justification for what they did to him. He wasn’t attacking them. He wasn’t a threat.
That people can justify government goons beating up on a military veteran really does prove your point: they just want to see people they don’t agree with get the shit beat out of them.
I’m sure they’ll greet the next veteran/active duty soldier they meet with a “Thank you for your service” without a hint of irony
This also goes to show that their are limits to the protection that whiteness provides. It didn’t even matter to these guys that David was an older white guy
Emerald
@Bruuuuce: Lightfoot says that the union president is a wacko, but that the real police are not like that.
She says. I guess we’re about to find out.
Humdog
I thought John would include the video of the naked white woman who strutted in front of the DHS goons and got them to retreat.
the alignment of these goons with the police unions is very very bad news. Where is Steve in the ATL to let us know what the employers can do about a union undermining public safety?
different-church-lady
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):
At this point I think it would be more accurate if you left out the middle clause.
Aleta
Picture of street medic helping Christopher David:
Christopher David on twitter:
Malovich
Well, I can’t tell who the bad apple is, but I can sure see which one is a Legend.
Remember kids, NCO is a terminal condition.
Otherwise, ACAB.
Bruuuuce
@Emerald: If I were betting, I wouldn’t put my money on Lightfoot’s side.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
I remember old Bob Dole plaintively asking the ducks in the pond “Where’s the outrage?!” because Al Gore attended a fund-raiser in the gardens of a Buddhist temple in CA and when it turned out some Chinese nationals had paid to attend, which was a campaign contribution, which money was returned.(from memory, I may have some details wrong after twenty-five years)
Bob Dole was lucid enough to endorse trump in ’16, with apparent enthusiasm. That I admit surprised me.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
This whole thing is a powderkeg waiting to go off with these camo assholes. Are these areas where these goons at blocked off from traffic?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Served: what do you want her to do?
Roger Moore
@randy khan:
I’m sure many of the people saying that are also the people saying they need an AR-15 to resist an oppressive government. Their inability to recognize one is remarkable.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Not directed at me, but I’ll give my own answer. Basically don’t do this:
Kelly
Navy Iron Man asked them about their oaths. “Oath Breakers” seems an appropriate epithet many, many LEO’s in many agencies. I don’t come to this easily I have cop relatives. One of my dad’s fishing buddies was a state cop.
Baud
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):
Criticism # 2 seems weak.
trollhattan
@Roger Moore:
I keep thinking of the Portland Nazi march last summer when those heavily armed camo-wearin’ assholes were escorted around the town by cops. Compare and contrast.
Bobby Thomson
@Malovich: He was an LT
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Baud:
How? Anybody who takes Trump at his word is a fool at best. This is just an own goal, honestly
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Kelly:
“Oath Breakers” is perfect!
Baud
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):
It’s not a blood oath. People use that phrase all the time when dealing with people they don’t trust. It’s a way of saying “I’m going to hold you to your promise.”
ETA: When people say “bless your heart,” they aren’t literally wishing for people’s heart to be blessed.
low-tech cyclist
@Roger Moore:
I expect their definition of ‘oppressive government’ is one that oppresses them and their friends – like makes them wear face masks in stores. If it oppresses people they don’t like, even when it injures and kills them, that’s A-OK with them.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Baud:
I’ve always assumed “I take you at your word” means “I trust you’ll do as you promised”
I guess, thinking about it more, I see your point
Sebastian
This vet brings up a very important point. In the military you have rules of engagement and code of conduct. If you violate it you are being court martialed outside the civilian legal system. Also, there is Military Police which exclusively polices the military.
Instead of the police unions we need a court martial system for the cops. We can set one up easily by getting a bunch of recently retired Army, Navy, Air Force, and USMC officers.
low-tech cyclist
@Emerald:
Best thing that could happen in Chicago is if the protesters stayed off the streets for the rest of the summer, or until the ICE goons got bored.
People might even suggest that they help patrol some of the more dangerous parts of town, and make things safer for the people who can’t afford to live elsewhere.
Not that I think the ICE goons would do anything useful like that. They probably think that sort of police work is beneath their station.
NotMax
Resumption of federal executions concurrent with this unfolding of naked abuse of authority is not coincidental.
Martin
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Arrest them. Federal unmarked troops are operating out of their jurisdiction.
low-tech cyclist
@Baud: I married a Southerner. It’s impressive, all the different shades of meaning that “bless your heart” can carry.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
Unfortunately relevant:
Dead Kennedys- Bleed For Me
Whenever I heard that these “federal officers” were kidnapping people off the streets in unmarked vans, this is what I immediately thought of
oldster
ACABA
All cops are bad apples.
rikyrah
Tell it, Cole.
TELL.IT.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Martin:
Truth be told, I’d trust the Illinois State National Guard to arrest these Federales before the CPD. Directly under control of the Governor and no ties to police corruption. But then again, what’s to stop Trump from simply federalizing them?
Belafon
The sailor will be on Chris Cuomo tonight: https://twitter.com/Tazerface16/status/1285642292485922818
Roger Moore
@low-tech cyclist:
That sounds like a terrible idea. If they actually tried patrolling the dangerous parts of town, they would wind up beating people up for going about their daily business while being too afraid to take on actual criminals. That’s the last thing we need.
jl
I agree with commenters above. They are not cops in any way. No correct attitude, no correct mission, no correct training, no constitutional, federal, state or local authority or jurisdiction, no due legal process or any process at all, no records, no recourse for local population for abuses, and criminal acts and deprivation or rights under the color of law.
This is way beyond ‘bad cops’ and ‘bad apples’ territory.
No nothing but brute force, illegal conversion of public resources for partisan political purposes, and provocative incitement for the sake of an effective war lord in the WH.
SiubhanDuinne
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):
I take Trump at his word salad.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Martin: I was more responding to this:
I don’t know the law in Chicago, but I’m guessing that what she’s doing is following the law.
also, this:
I haven’t looked up the whole letter, and I’m not going to, but I doubt these five words accurately represent the tone and purpose of the letter. I suspect she’s working in concert with the governor, state AG and Congressional caucus to defuse the situation before trump can escalate it. He wants violence in the streets.
Kelly
Note: Oregon allows Feds to enforce state laws but they must hand arrestees over to local authorities and follow Oregon procedures. It’s been useful for instance for Forest Service LEO’s to corral yahoos ruining our day beautiful outdoors.
I’m not claiming the anonymous thugs are OK
trollhattan
@SiubhanDuinne:
He’s a few croutons short of Ceaser.
I’ll come back in.
trollhattan
@NotMax:
The stories about Governor Bush and Gonzo’s lighthearted attention to Texas executions come to mind as I ponder how Trump and Barr must celebrate their sanctioned killings.
We are a very advanced nation, envy of the world.
jl
OK, one bit of good news, if Pentagon is serious and keeps up pressure. Will reporters exert some pressure? Will be interesting to see if Esper or any of Joint Chiefs have some spine, if they can be flushed from their holes in the ground, and reporters ask them (rather than doing bland cosplay of ‘Hunger Games’ savvy hot take commenter crap).
@LucaFoxNews
Defense Secretary Esper Secretary has expressed “concern” within Trump administration about federal agents dressing up in military uniforms while handling protests and riots. “We want a system where people can tell the difference,” spokesman says
https://twitter.com/LucasFoxNews/status/1285633169212035072
Found via joshtpm twitter
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Kelly: Barr will sniff out any legal hook for trump to justify his desire for violence in the street. And Susan Collins will express her concern as she sprints for a door marked “Senators Only!” Cory Gardner won’t do that much.
rikyrah
I have been suspect about Oregon and the provacateurs.
But, for me, the most encouraging sight from Oregon?
The line of mothers in bicycle helmets.
It’s so…I dunno…2020. but, in the best possible way.
When soccer moms in bike helmets show up…
No, it’s not going like you thought it would.
jl
@rikyrah: “I have been suspect about Oregon and the provacateurs.”
I’m not sure what you mean by that. I have read that the groups making trouble (vandalism, etc.) for last few weeks, and messing up peaceful protests, are basically Proud Boys rolling into town for provocation, and some more aggressive antifa (or maybe black bloc?) groups confronting them.
Edit: I agree with you on the Moms. And the Navy vet who did the right thing and went to ask the illegal fed forces what they thought they were doing, and stood his ground bravely to take the beating is getting some appropriate media attention.
raven
@jl: What’s the difference who they are if they are getting what they want?
Kelly
@jl: The Portland protests usually have a pointlessly destructive and provocative fringe element. The fires built under the elk statue across the street are a classic example.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Just turned on MSNBC and Brian Williams sounding pretty appalled by the goonery.
I bet his bosses wouldn’t say no if he asked to be sent to do live reports from Portland. Or Chicago.
BlueNC
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): Oh no. “I take you at your word” is code for “You’re lying, you asshole.” In the same way that “Bless your heart” means “You are too stupid to remember to breathe.”
raven
@Kelly:
There’s blood in the streets, it’s up to my ankles
She came
There’s blood on the streets, it’s up to my knee
She came
Blood on the streets in the town of Chicago
She came
Blood on the rise, it’s following me
Think about the break of day
She came and then she drove away
Sunlight in her hair
She came
Blood in the streets runs a river of sadness
She came
Blood in the streets it’s up to my thigh
She came
Yeah the river runs red down the legs of the city
She came
The women are crying rivers of weepin’
She came into town and then she drove away
Sunlight in her hair
Indians scattered on dawn’s highway bleeding
Ghosts crowd the young child’s fragile eggshell mind
Blood in the streets in the town of New Haven
Blood stains the roofs and the palm trees of Venice
Blood in my love in the terrible summer
Bloody red sun of Phantastic L.A.
Blood screams the pain as they chop off her fingers
Blood will be born in the birth of a nation
Blood is the rose of mysterious union
There’s blood in the streets, it’s up to my ankles
Blood in the streets, it’s up to my knee
Blood in the streets in the town of Chicago
Blood on the rise, it’s following me
JoJo
@Roger Moore: Well, from their perspective, the correct people are being oppressed. So, it’s totally different.
patroclus
Well, as a Chicagoan, I say that the best way to control the gun violence is to get the guns off the streets. We have/had a good ordinance, but the SCOTUS effectively rendered it inoperative in the Heller case (which applied to D.C., but has de facto applied here too). If the goons are coming to try and enforce the gun laws, I’d welcome them, but if they’re coming to escalate a confrontation with BLM protesters , then I’m against it. I suspect the latter. My prediction is that this isn’t going to end well.
catclub
And here I thought the right wing loonies were worried that Jade Helm was when the federal government would take over their states rights by using federal agents to detain people in empty walmarts. Not a peep from them about this version of jade helm. that I’ve heard these days.
Pete Mack
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: Definitely *not* military. These guys are all DHS types. And it really shows: the military is genuinely, deliberately integrated. This group genuinely, deliberately is not.
catclub
the term outside agitators seems quite apt here.
debbie
@rikyrah:
Did you see the one photo of the Mom with the sign, “I’m so disappointed in you”?
raven
@patroclus: enforce the gun laws how?
Kelly
Also there is video of PPD coordinating with the Feds last night several days after the mayor banned coordination. Police defiance of civilian authority hasn’t been surprising for a long time.
Mart
@Joey Maloney: The cops follow the Union boss not libtard s/ Mayor Lightfoot. I had a few run ins with Chicago police back in the day, watched a few altercations. I was always careful to say yes sir, no sir, thank you very much sir. Boys and men that told them to fuck off got smashed bad, almost always no arrest. We were white, had some privelege. Relatives I know in the force are all Trumpers, social media posts are Qanon level stupid. I see the Chicago Police welcoming the feds.This could get horribly bad real fast. Hope I am wrong.I
ETA – I should have read the post below yours…
Kelly
I read they are teams trained to kick down doors on drug cartel raids. Not a really good fit for the situation in Portland unless throwing gas on the fire is the plan.
patroclus
@raven: Well, I’m not in law enforcement, but I’ve seen it on TV, and I think they could employ undercover agents who buddy up to suspected purveyors of large caches of assault-style weaponry, maybe they could add federal gun charges to already existing prosecutions of suspected criminals who also possessed illegal weaponry in the commission of their alleged crimes, they could check on licenses of those who sell guns and make sure they are in order, they could employ background checks and invest in better technology so as to enforce the existing prohibitions on mental illness and previous convictions. There are a lot of tools in the law enforcement arsenal that can be used by legitimate law enforcement agencies who are serious about enforcing existing laws. (And they could advocate for further Congressional action).
raven
@patroclus: rotsa ruck
Calouste
@Kelly: Narrator: it is the plan.
Just Chuck
@low-tech cyclist:
“My offer is this: nothing. Not even the fee for the gaming license, which I would appreciate if you would put up personally.”
Language they understand and all that.
patroclus
@raven: Well, you look at the existing situation and say why and I imagine what could be and say why not. Right now, the federal government (the SCOTUS by idiotic rulings, the Congress by inaction and the POTUS because he’s an sociopath who wants to enflame violence) is an impediment to Chicago enforcing its gun laws. It doesn’t have to be that way.
Ruckus
@Emerald:
A lot of cops would be helping them beat the crap out of him, not stopping them.
Brotherhood and all that.
Ruckus
@Pete Mack:
A difference with little distinction these days, in this country.
Just Chuck
@raven: A song that should win the Emmy for “Most Incongruous Name” :)
Delk
Despite the misplaced and incendiary rhetoric from you and your staff which is divisive and unhelpful, I will take you at your word that you want to assist the City in its effort to reduce violence…
What we do not need, and what will certainly make our community less safe is secret, federal agents deployed to Chicago. “It is a bad idea and I urge you not to do it,” the mayor warned, pointing to issues with a separate federal deployment in Portland, Ore., over the weekend. Such agents would be ineffective, do not know Chicago’s neighborhoods and “will foment a massive wave of opposition
Ruckus
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):
It has long ago stopped being about anything other than pure power and control to most cops.
BK in NJ
“All of them, Katie.”
(92 comments and nobody used this? What’s up here?)
Dan B
@Aleta: Three degrees of separation here. The brother of a friend of mine, Rasheed if I recall, was “Iron Man / Christopher David’s roomate in naval training school. Apparently he was impressive then as well. My friend Samia has been a progressive activist for decades driving while female in Saudi, promoting interfaith dialogue, speaking up for LGBTQ people, and just being a talented and delightful person.
A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan)
@Baud: In general, the Southernism “Bless your heart” when spoken directly to someone can be loosely translated to “F*ck you”. If said about someone, “Bless their heart” implies they have something sadly wrong with them and deserve pity.
A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan)
@BlueNC: Nicely done. Better than my definition at #95. :-)
raven
@Dan B: So in SeeBee school after the academy? My understanding is that “Iron Man” was a wrestler and it makes sense the way he just flicked off the truncheons like they were flies.
Dan B
@raven: I don’t know the details but it’s interesting that he was a friend and roommate of a Muslim guy. Talk about being an ally!
raven
@Dan B: Very much so.
Sab
Where was Balloon Juice shrieking against Jim Webb with foreign wife when he essentially barred Uighurs. Not a peep out of BJ. I was there. I remember. Don’t complain now. You have no standing anymore.
joel hanes
These are not cops.
CBP/ICE are worse than police — it’s a culture that assumes than anyone in their hands has no rights at all.
Also, Mark Morgan, who is speaking as if he were legally the acting head of CBP, has no such authority — his 210-day interim appointment expired some time ago.
polyorchnid octopunch
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: From what I’ve read he grabbed the people that get used to knuckle recalcitrant prisoners and has turned them on middle-aged mothers in Portland, and they’re performing about as well as can be expected.
Mai naem mobile
They’re not cops. Don’t call them cops.
Jay
Jay
Jay
The
Jay
Jay
Jay
Kay
@patroclus:
They’re working on Donald Trump’s political campaign. The point is to create violence and mayhem, because the Trump Administration thinks that works for them politically.
They don’t work for the public. They work for Donald Trump and the Trump Family. We just get the honor of paying them.
Kay
I saw the Trump Administration’s fear-mongering ad on you tube. It’s a terrible ad- a loud ringing phone and a bunch of lies about protesters. I wouldn’t think it would be effective- it’s so obnoxious your impulse is to immediately turn it off – clanging and really loud with weird background noise. It sounds like insane people made it.
Kay
If sending Chad The Lobbyist’s army of security guards into cities doesn’t work, if Trump’s poll numbers don’t rise, I wonder how they’ll amp it up. Will the Trump Administration actually invade a US city and occupy it?
We’re all footing the entire HUGE bill for this campaign stunt. Millions and millions of dollars. All extracted from the public for the benefit of Donald Trump and the Trump Family.
Jay
@Kay:
HHS was supposedly formed to protect the American people from terrorist acts like 9-11.
they probably shouldn’t have staffed HHS with terrorists.
Jay
Jay
chrisanthemama
@rikyrah: Well, if you like the Wall-of-Moms, then you’ll appreciate the Dads-With-Leafblowers (blow the teargas back on the camo-feds).
AnotherBruce
@Emerald: Chicago has a population of almost 900 million black persons. I’m pretty sure that these assholes are going to be arrested by the mayor. Black people know what they’re up against. There is a huge Latino population also. I think these pretty boy soldiers are going to be punted to the next century. At least I hope.