Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

This country desperately needs a functioning Fourth Estate.

If you are in line to indict donald trump, stay in line.

There are no moderate republicans – only extremists and cowards.

I’d try pessimism, but it probably wouldn’t work.

When you’re a Republican, they let you do it.

Innocent people don’t delay justice.

Republicans can’t even be trusted with their own money.

Tick tock motherfuckers!

But frankly mr. cole, I’ll be happier when you get back to telling us to go fuck ourselves.

I desperately hope that, yet again, I am wrong.

I really should read my own blog.

They love authoritarianism, but only when they get to be the authoritarians.

Jesus, Mary, & Joseph how is that election even close?

“Everybody’s entitled to be an idiot.”

No one could have predicted…

I’d like to think you all would remain faithful to me if i ever tried to have some of you killed.

I am pretty sure Katy Tur wasn’t always such a bootlicking sycophant.

Ah, the different things are different argument.

“And when the Committee says to “report your income,” that could mean anything!

They are lying in pursuit of an agenda.

… riddled with inexplicable and elementary errors of law and fact

This isn’t Democrats spending madly. This is government catching up.

The frogs are rarely mistaken.

Many life forms that would benefit from greater intelligence, sadly, do not have it.

You are here: Home / Elections / Biden-Harris 2020 / Tuesday Evening Open Thread: Now *Here’s* A Biden Staffing Proposal for Ya…

Tuesday Evening Open Thread: Now *Here’s* A Biden Staffing Proposal for Ya…

by | 242 Comments

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Houle is a political professional, unlike the Jacobin jagoffs. Yeah, none — well, almost none — of these Repub senators would actually accept, and they’d fvck up the job royally if they did. But wouldn’t it be fun watching Johnson or Kennedy swallow their tongues trying to explain why ‘bipartisanship’ didn’t mean they should have to compromise?

Reader Interactions

242Comments

  1. 1.

    Fraud Guy

    How many of those governors would have to appoint a Senator of the same party as the one resigning?

  4. 4.

    PenAndKey

    @Fraud Guy: That particular rule exists in Arizona, Hawaii, Maryland, North Carolina, Utah, and Wyoming. In Hawaii they actually have to be one of three candidates selected by the party. That’s it though, as far as I can tell.

    So if Johnson wants to accept a Biden admin position I’m sure Evers would be happy to fill his spot for him.

  6. 6.

    Gravenstone

    Well Bernie has apparently been angling for Labor. So good to know that Biden’s people are ignoring the little twerp.

  9. 9.

    Martin

    I would note that MA has a well established history of changing the appointment rules depending on who is governor. It’s bullshit that they so routinely change the rules to suit them, but I’m pretty sure they could arrange for Warren to safely transition.

    I think VTs rules are more consistently applied. Meanwhile here in CA, our last Senate race had two Ds and no Rs in the general election, so that’s about as safe as you can get.

  10. 10.

    Roger Moore

    @Fraud Guy:

    How many of those governors would have to appoint a Senator of the same party as the one resigning?

    Unless the state party is actually allowed to present a list of candidates, that shouldn’t be much of an obstacle.  Just have the person you want to appoint switch parties, appoint them, and have them switch back.

  12. 12.

    Eljai

    Geez, it’s not like Bernie and Elizabeth Warren are the only two progressive-minded people in the country capable of running a government agency*. Those Jacobin people need to get out more.

    * One of them is eminently more capable IMHO, but that’s another discussion.

  13. 13.

    Martin

    I hope people realize that these individuals have some degree of free will, and would only accept such a position if they were looking to overturn control of the Senate. Maybe Susan Collins would be okay with Mitch getting out of power, but no way any of the others would be down with that. Plus it would be a guaranteed end to any aspirations to run for President.

  15. 15.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Al Z.: heh, good point — “the rest of Dem Senate caucus…”

     

    @Martin: I think I saw something last week that Baker said he would veto any attempts to rewrite the rules, I don’t know if Dems could override

  19. 19.

    Yarrow

    Biden already chose one Senator. I’m happy if he leaves the Senate alone now. There are a lot of very qualified and not so well known Dems who would be excellent in cabinet positions. Pick them for those positions. Why do we think the president should raid the Senate for everything? Seems really counterproductive.

  22. 22.

    Martin

    @Roger Moore: Point of order. Kamala Harris becomes the President of the Senate, so she’s technically still part of the senate caucus. That’s why she will sit behind Biden during SOTU and not Mitch.

  23. 23.

    Roger Moore

    @Martin:

    Also, there is no guarantee of how long they would remain in office.  There would be nothing stopping Biden from demanding their resignation as soon as they had formally resigned their seat in the senate.

  24. 24.

    hells littlest angel

    The point to appointing Republican Senators to the Cabinet would be to fire them once their successors joined the Senate.

  25. 25.

    Ken

    @Fraud Guy: The last four eons years have made it clear the President can fire cabinet secretaries at will, so it’s not like they would have time to do any damage.

    As others have said, it doesn’t matter since none of them would go for it.  But I do like the idea of them squirming when explaining why they didn’t mean that kind of bipartisanship.

  26. 26.

    R-Jud

    @Eljai: This. I would love to hear the Biden team have asked for EW’s input into cabinet hires, though.

    Off-topic: my kid’s sweet little corn snake has escaped its tank. We’re beside ourselves with worry. Hoping to lure it out with food in the morning.

  27. 27.

    Martin

    @leeleeFL: For anyone. As soon as you do that, neither party will trust you for the big seat. You might be able to win a house race, but senate and up is now out of reach. Your best bet is to camp out as head of the FBI, etc. and try and span administrations.

  30. 30.

    Baud

    I would love for us to get control of the Senate through strategic appointments if possible, but if Biden goes that route, he’s not going to play games.  That person will be part of his administration.

  31. 31.

    WaterGirl

    @geg6: I also think it’s a super-smart way to avoid the hissy fit that  Wilmer and Wilmer-ites wold make if Warren was added to the cabinet and Wilmer was not.

    Just like saying “I’ll be choosing a female VP” took a whole lot of bullshit off the table because Wilmer was out of the running on that alone.

  40. 40.

    BR

    @Roger Moore:

    I’m really hoping Newsom appoints a seat filler like Jerry Brown rather than making the choice that voters should make about who should fill the seat.

  41. 41.

    Searcher

    @Ken: Yeah, I think if you actually want any of the Republicans to bite, you have got to offer up something juicy, and then fire them the next week after their replacements have been added to the Senate.

    You’re not going to get anyone to bite at an appointment that isn’t sufficiently prestigious, for all that there’s no such thing as an “insignificant” Cabinet position.  But if you offer up something like Secretary of State, they may not be able to resist, even if they see the hook.

  42. 42.

    catclub

    @R-Jud:

    Off-topic: my kid’s sweet little corn snake has escaped its tank. We’re beside ourselves with worry. Hoping to lure it out with food in the morning.

    Good luck with that. UNfortunately, i suspect odds of success are VERY low.
    maybe snake pheromones? NOT overdone! Or you get hundreds.

    ETA: Maybe chill the room and put a heatlamp on where you can watch it.

  43. 43.

    schrodingers_cat

    What the purity left does is take important issues, takes out the nuance, slaps a catchy slogan and makes that a purity test for  Ds running for office. They are the Green Tea Party which wins seats only where the Democratic primary is the real election.

    Examples

    1. M4A
    2. Green New Deal
    3. Defund the police
    4. Abolish ICE

    Joe Biden did not fall into this trap and so he went on to win the nomination.

  46. 46.

    Jeffro

    @Yarrow:Why do we think the president should raid the Senate for everything? Seems really counterproductive

    Exactly!

    Also, there’s my Constitutional amendment to get rid of the Senate, period, and we need to get used to looking other places for talent.

    =)

  47. 47.

    catclub

    @MattF: Speaking of the Senate, Judy Shelton’s appointment to the Fed board has been blocked. For now.

     

    wow, talk about your low bar to be impressed.  Of course, it is not a permanent position – like a judgeship, and the GOP doesn’t want the fed to REALLY fuck up the economy.  A little would be fine, though.

  49. 49.

    Tony Jay

    @BR:

    Doesn’t matter? Doesn’t matter?!?!?

    Chum, in a couple of years the US Embassy is probably going to be one of the few places in the Disunited Kingdom where you can get food that’s not carved off the bones of whoever runs slowest when the dinner bell rings.

    It’ll be like ‘The Man Who Would Be King’ with smaller mountains and more balding former stockbrokers running around in loincloths. Who wouldn’t want that gig?

  51. 51.

    Captain C

    @BR: Ambassador to the Court of St. James might turn out to be a rather complicated job if BoJo and the Cons keep fucking up Brexit.

  52. 52.

    MisterForkbeard

    @Captain C: At the very least, would be involved in some trade deals that probably won’t be too friendly to Britain’s current government. :/

  57. 57.

    Citizen Alan

    I remain convinced that Jacobin is financed entirely under the table by Charles Koch and the Mercers.

  63. 63.

    Kent

    @catclub:

    Good luck with that. UNfortunately, i suspect odds of success are VERY low.
    maybe snake pheromones? NOT overdone! Or you get hundreds.

    ETA: Maybe chill the room and put a heatlamp on where you can watch it.

    Yes, snakes are cold blooded.  Unlike mammals, they need to eat only very infrequently.  Might be a week until it gets hungry enough.

  64. 64.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    @catclub: Got to wonder why Trump thinks gold buggery and the resulting deflation would be good for a man with his kind of loans, but  then it’s Trump, he don’t think.

  65. 65.

    Tony Jay

    @Captain C:

    Modern Conservatism. It’s a global franchise, with the menu differing only a little to accommodate local standards of heartless bastardy.

  71. 71.

    Kay

    @BillCassidy on a call with reporters declines to acknowledge President-Elect Joe Biden’s win, saying “The courts are deciding now as to the validity of these court challenges…If it turns out president Trump loses those court cases, the president will concede.

    Bullshit. He’s never going to concede. I support that, btw. I think it would be great if we have to throw the Trump family out.
    Now that they’ve jerked the country around for 2 weeks I don’t think we should let them concede. I much prefer a hugely humiliating removal where they have to be dragged out, live on tv. A fitting end.

  73. 73.

    JAFD

    @Tony Jay: Myself, am follower of hobby, for which much stuf is made in Merrie Olde, thinking that once Pres-elect Biden gets US back in Universal Postal Union (which has #$%^*&# translantic package shipping), and Brexit has affected exchange rate (if you make it tougher to sell to and buy from your biggest trade partner…), should be bargains galore…

    Convince me I’m wrong, maybe ?

  74. 74.

    NotMax

    @H.E.Wolf

    Thanks for pointing that out as I can now make it a point to avoid it. Intense dislike of that sort of who’s in-who’s out broad speculation when it comes to governance. This ain’t the Oscars or the Preakness.

  76. 76.

    Miss Bianca

    @Gravenstone: I’m already practicing my “but we really need Bernie in the Senate” speech to any butt-hurt “progressives” I haven’t already cut out of my daily communication circle.

    And consider it a sign of evolving maturity that I don’t say, “ha ha, fuck your feelings!” to the most egregious whiners.

    (Gotta say, tho, that even the usual suspects are staying quiet on the subject. Is our progressives learning?)//

  77. 77.

    Tony Jay

    @Steve in the ATL:

    I am getting en cerveza after a long day of not very much to report.

    Also things must be looking up, since I’ve been able start re-watching The West Wing from the start now that the Q Tang Klan are deflating into little puckered molluscs of spite and regret.

  78. 78.

    Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony

    @Martin: I think Collins would be the only OK choice on that list.  When she has bucked the GOP it has been on climate issues, Biden could appoint her to something in that capacity.  She also comes from a rural state and authored a bill on alternatives to opioids.  If he put her on a taskforce for dealing with the opioid crisis, she would do an OK job.  If she accepts, we have her out of the Senate and doing things none of us object to.

  81. 81.

    Kent

    @Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony:@Martin: I think Collins would be the only OK choice on that list.  When she has bucked the GOP it has been on climate issues, Biden could appoint her to something in that capacity.  She also comes from a rural state and authored a bill on alternatives to opioids.  If he put her on a taskforce for dealing with the opioid crisis, she would do an OK job.  If she accepts, we have her out of the Senate and doing things none of us object to.

    Not a cabinet job.  Make her ambassador to the UK or something.  She is of English and Irish ancestry.  Much more fun job than say Secretary of Commerce.

  82. 82.

    David ?Booooooo!? Koch

    Bernie is 80 years old, with a bad ticker, and hasn’t worked a daily job since 1989 – what job could he possibly do?

    To my knowledge there is no Secretary of Yelling and Pointing the Finger

  83. 83.

    J R in WV

    @debbie:

     

    Far better to discuss the merits of peanut butter and mayonnaise sandwiches!

    I like Mayo in its place, and Peanut Butter as well, in a different place. Together….ewwww!

  85. 85.

    Miss Bianca

    @Citizen Alan: The funny thing is, before 2016 I used to be able to read Jacobin. And Crooked Timber. And…well…a lot of blogs that seemed to be more or less scholarly lefty takes on issues and politicians.

    Then they all collectively showed their white-male-academic-privileged asses when Hillary Clinton won the Democratic nomination, and I was done with them. Seems like in Jacobin‘s case, Clinton Derangement Syndrome done broke those boys’ brains for good.

  86. 86.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony: I think that, like Graham, being a Senator is what gives Susan Collins meaning in life. When she first ran she made a big show of only serving two terms. She’ll be starting her fifth. And I believe she’s head of the appropriations committee, which which is one of the plummiest jobs in DC.

  87. 87.

    Geminid

    @Citizen Alan: Every now and then I make myself read a Jerkobin article. The last one was an in depth examination of Stacey Abrams’ record, trying to show how she’s not what she’s cracked up to be. The author found a couple of minor Georgia legislative issues where he argued she voted wrong. But his main gripe was that often when Abrams voted right, she would justify her position with pragmatic reasoning.

    Sometimes it seems like those guys are parodying themselves.

  88. 88.

    Salty Sam

    @Martin: Maybe Susan Collins would be okay with Mitch getting out of power

    Maybe, but I’m sure  would be with brows furrowed with concerns…

  89. 89.

    mrmoshpotato

    A different perspective.

    65 days until Trump is eligible for indictment.— G O L D I E. (@goldietaylor) November 16, 2020

    Also, Lindsey Graham is lucky “being hanged by the nutsack” would be considered cruel and unusual punishment.

  90. 90.

    Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony

    @Kent: While I’m good with the ambassador idea, I’m not sure she’d bite.  She went into the Senate to DO things, and I think she still wants to have real influence.  I could see her not being able to resist being the person who ‘solved’ the opioid crisis.

  91. 91.

    Tony Jay

    @JAFD:

    I am no economist, but once the real costs of Brexit start impacting on the UK I don’t think it’ll be long before everything starts going for a song. All of the forecasts breezily dismissed as “Project Fear” by the architects and cynical bandwagon mounters of Brexit are going to look like Enid Blytonesque jolly romps when the truth hits.

  95. 95.

    debbie

    @Kay:

    I think the only way to get Trump to concede is for everyone to start mocking his legacy and ridiculing how his brand is cheapened every minute he delays.

  96. 96.

    Topclimber

    @WaterGirl: You are clearly not a fan of the Bernarati but I don’t recall if you have the total hate for the man himself that others here so readily and endlessly espouse.

    Leaving aside the impact it could have on Dem numbers in the Senate, I think Sanders would be a great choice for Labor secretary. If we can’t put a militant figure for economic equity in that department, then where?

    Also see the sayings of  J,LB: I want the critics inside the tent pissing in vs. outside the tent pissing in.

  97. 97.

    Miss Bianca

    @mrmoshpotato:

    Let’s sit six feet apart with our masks on and laugh about the “extreme center.”

    I’ll join you all. I can’t wait to rebrand myself as “an extreme centrist!”

  98. 98.

    Anonymous

    @Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony:

    She also comes from a rural state and authored a bill on alternatives to opioids. If he put her on a taskforce for dealing with the opioid crisis, she would do an OK job.

    As a chronic pain patient who has to take quizzes with no actually correct answers in order to obtain pain relief prescriptions, I object to allowing politicians to have anything to do with my medical care.

    As far as I can tell, people who receive medical prescriptions for opioid pain relief are 95% not going to abuse their medications. So for the 5% of people who mess up on their pain prescriptions, the rest of us chronic pain sufferers are punished beyond belief.

    I’m sorry about those who succumb to opioid abuse, and have lost people dear to me on that account. But I don’t think chronic pain sufferers should be abused by people trying to keep everyone from any legal access to pain relief whatsoever.

    Especially politicians using the phony opioid crisis for their own benefit. When 95% of people do fine, and 5% fuck it up, the 95% vast majority of people should not be punished.

  99. 99.

    JPL

    @debbie: SAME    I actually thought that mocking is the way to get to all of them.   May they rot in hell.   See I’m no Michelle .

    true story,  I monitored social media for local candidates and comment when necessary, because those in power think I’m fair and balanced.   My sons rolled on the floor laughing.   I was a volunteer and I quit recently .

  100. 100.

    Salty Sam

    @Tony Jay: It’ll be like ‘The Man Who Would Be King’ with smaller mountains and more balding former stockbrokers running around in loincloths.

    Christ, Tony, I’ve visited your neck of the woods decades ago, and that’s the impression I took away then!… well, minus the loincloths

  101. 101.

    NotMax

    @Topclimber

    Labor secretary?

    Let’s focus on his list of accomplishments in the House and the Senate.

    Oh damn, maybe not. My electron microscope is on the fritz.

  104. 104.

    scav

    Given a 50-50-ish senate, I don’t think you pry me out with a crowbar if I wanted influence over an administration’s policies, especially one given to compromise.

  105. 105.

    Miss Bianca

    @Topclimber:

    Leaving aside the impact it could have on Dem numbers in the Senate, I think Sanders would be a great choice for Labor secretary.

    One, two, three…*deep breath* “But we really *need* Bernie in the Senate!”

    And honest to Pete…”leaving aside” the little matter that we can’t afford to lose ANY Senator who caucuses with the Democrats right now? Really?

    Let’s “leave aside” for right now, also, that the guy is 80 years old and really doesn’t seem to like to work all that hard at his current day job anyway. Let’s just say, there are better – or shall we say, “less problematic” – candidates.

  106. 106.

    mrmoshpotato

    @Baud:

    I would love for us to get control of the Senate through strategic appointments if possible, but if Biden goes that route, he’s not going to play games.  That person will be part of his administration. 

    The newly-established Secretary of Assclownery position will be filled ass-to-clown with Rethuglican Senators.

  108. 108.

    Sab

    @Topclimber: Labor Secretary is an administrative job with lots pf moving parts. Has Bernie ever administered anything bigger than a small city decades ago?

  110. 110.

    Another Scott

    @Sab: Labor Secretaries can break lots of stuff, but if they do the job well, do we notice?  Can anyone tell me off the top of their head what Robert Reich was able to accomplish as Labor Secretary?

    Biden should pick a competent administrator who will fight to support the department’s mission.  Not a showhorse.  And, indeed, no Democratic Senator.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  113. 113.

    Sab

    @Tony Jay: I did junior year abroad as American in north of England 1975-1976 when UK was just going into the EU (was it EU then or Common Market?) The economy was a mess then even pre-Thatcher. Lots of students I knew at university were learning a foreign language and hoping to emigrate. I still can’t believe y’all voted to go back to those days.

  115. 115.

    mrmoshpotato

    @Tony Jay:

    Chum, in a couple of years the US Embassy is probably going to be one of the few places in the Disunited Kingdom where you can get food that’s not carved off the bones of whoever runs slowest when the dinner bell rings. 

    Sorry, but BWHAHAHAHAHA

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

    HAHAHAHAHAHA

    HAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!

    You have a way with words.  Thank you.

  117. 117.

    Sab

    @J R in WV: My husband loves peanut butter and mayo. Also peanut butter and grape jelly with a dill pickle. Also peanut butter and tuna salad. He has to make his own sandwiches, amd I would prefer that he eat them out of my presence.

    Peanut butter and actual butter is as adventurous as I get.

  118. 118.

    Topclimber

    @schrodingers_cat:

    1. M4A. Use the term universal coverage if you like but that is where even impure leftish stallions like myself want to go. You do understand that the A part refers to all medical needs as well as all people, right. You know, universal coverage.

    2. Green New Deal. Remove the BJ toxic AOC from this label and tell me how linking one of the Democratic Party’s greatest successes with an all out mobilization against climate change is something we should denigrate.

    3. Defund the Police. A slogan mouthed by many Republicans to rouse their base and disowned by virtually all Democratic politicians is not worth discussing. Free up money in over-stuffed police departments for targeted community initiatives that address the totality of factors affecting street level crime,  Hell yes.

    4. Abolish ICE, which I think is a legacy of  9/11 and a haven for racists, I will leave to you to explain why they should survive in any way remotely like they operate today.

  119. 119.

    WaterGirl

    @Topclimber: No, I would not run Bernie down in a parking lot if the opportunity arose.  But I am so over him.  And I am beyond over his followers who won’t let anything go

    edit: In case that sounded like I was referring to you, I was not.

  120. 120.

    WaterGirl

    @JPL: Maybe he’s afraid that if he leaves, they won’t let him come back.

    I worked with someone who NEVER took vacations because “that’s when they get you.”

    edit: or maybe Trump is afraid of Putin now that he has lost the election.  Which he surely knows, but cannot admit.

  122. 122.

    Chyron HR

    @Topclimber:

    I want the critics inside the tent pissing in vs. outside the tent pissing in.

    Either would be an improvement over having them inside the tent PISSING ON EVERYTHING IN THE TENT.

  123. 123.

    Tony Jay

    @Sab:

    I couldn’t agree more. The scary thing is that the vast majority of the people who voted for the splayed bukake fest of Brexit are people who lived through those years as, at least, teenagers. It’s a testament to the destructive power of media-driven propaganda that they will all tell you how much better Britain will be if we can just return to the halcyon days when White was Right and you could spit in a Paki’s face without having to explain yourself to the bloody PC Police.

    But don’t call them racists. They don’t like that.

  124. 124.

    Sab

    @Steve in the ATL: There isn’t any way to do Brexit without fucking up badly, because the underlying concept is so flawed. Pull up the ladders, burn the bridges, and the economy will bloom. They’ll be back to war over codfish with Iceland in no time.

  125. 125.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Topclimber:

    Rep.Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (D-N.Y.) said New York City’s proposed $1 billion cut from the police department budget tiptoes around demands from activists who are asking for a reduced police presence. […]

    “Defunding police means defunding police,” the congresswoman said in a statement. “It does not mean budget tricks or funny math. It does not mean moving school police officers from the NYPD budget to the Department of Education’s budget so the exact same police remain in schools.”

    I mean I know she’s a shrinking violet and all….

  129. 129.

    Salty Sam

    @mrmoshpotato: Also, Lindsey Graham is lucky “being hanged by the nutsack” would be considered cruel and unusual punishment.

    Depends on who’s doing the considering- I’d certainly be OK with it.

  130. 130.

    JPL

    Guess it’s official, trump is hankering down in DC.   Please someone take away the nuke code.   If not that then let it snow so he can’t golf.

  131. 131.

    Miss Bianca

    @Sab: I like peanut butter and sardine sandwiches – a taste I acquired from my dad’s BFF, our “Uncle Freddy” – but strangely, very few others seem to regard this as a taste treat.

  132. 132.

    Tony Jay

    @mrmoshpotato:

    I’m just planning ahead. Personally I’m torn between having my eye on Flobalob for the energy-rich fat content and easily crisped up wattle and not wanting anything that deeply fermented in red wine and bile anywhere near my battered mess-tin.

    One thing’s for sure. After the first Winter’s slaughter it’s going to be the Vegan Militia who outlast us all.

  133. 133.

    Topclimber

    @Sab: That is why secretaries have operational deputies. But if you want administrative experience how about we compare Mayor Bernie with Mayor Pete? And Sanders did manage a credible run for President which regardless of how it might have hurt Hillary certainly put the spotlight on income inequality. You know, the kind of issue people working 2.5 jobs might care about. What we call laborers.

  134. 134.

    Sebastian

    So about Dana Houle. The other week I had a back and forth with him about Georgia where he didn’t know who Stacey Abrams was and told me he has to check how much she fundraised before he can form an opinion about her.

  135. 135.

    Sab

    @Tony Jay: And weirdly, Pakistanis are not coming from EU, and they were already there. I met a disgruntled Pakistani-Scottish teenager in Stornoway on Lewis in the Hebrides in Scotland in 1976. I was visiting where some of my ancestors came from, and he wanted to go to where my ancestors went.

  136. 136.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    regardless of how it might have hurt Hillary certainly put the spotlight on income inequality

    Right, no one was talking about income inequality before 2016, so four years of trump was all worth it!

    Good fucking god.

  138. 138.

    Sab

    @Topclimber: His upper eschalon guys were in perpetual catfights with each other and the media. That is not good administrative management. Didn’t see any of that with Mayor Pete.

    ETA I am fine with Bernie in the Senate. He is very good on overton window moving. I have never seen any sign that he can manage things.

  139. 139.

    Miss Bianca

    @Tony Jay:

    One thing’s for sure. After the first Winter’s slaughter it’s going to be the Vegan Militia who outlast us all.

    Are you so sure, though? I’d think they’d be the first to go. I mean, if you’re going to eat Long Pig, don’t you want it vegan-fed?

  141. 141.

    Amir Khalid

    Per The Guardian‘s coronavirus liveblog, Chuck Grassley has just tweeted that he has tested positive. Do you guys already know about this?

  143. 143.

    mrmoshpotato

    @Sab:

    My husband loves peanut butter and mayo. Also peanut butter and grape jelly with a dill pickle. Also peanut butter and tuna salad. 

    ?!

    Mmmm……PB&J – and WTF?!

    ??!

  145. 145.

    Miss Bianca

    @Topclimber: Yeah, well, this 2.5-job-and-counting laborer is not exactly holding her breath in anticipation of what Bernie is going to accomplish for me. Maybe just cuz I need to save my breath to keep going, but it may just also be my conviction that the hound that bays the loudest is not always the one that catches the hare.

  150. 150.

    Sebastian

    @WaterGirl:

    I literally said I don’t know if he was joking but explained him and his answer was he’ll have to check her fundraising.

    If that’s a representative example of the Dem consulting class then AOC’s broadside against theM makes a lot sense.

    I can’t even.

  152. 152.

    Sab

    @Steve in the ATL: Highlander/Islander so his accent was lovely, and also quite comprehensible. Up there they speak English, not Scots. When they aren’t speaking English they speak Gaelic.

  153. 153.

    Tony Jay

    @Sab:

    Brexit voters in many northern areas were quite open about what they wanted out of it. Getting rid of ‘immigrants’ meant getting rid of the post-War diaspora from the Indian sub-continent. Never mind that we’re talking three, four, five generations. Never mind that these are the people who power the northern economies; shops, textiles, restaurants, property because they worked fucking hard for it. Never mind that they’re just as ‘northern’ as any descendent of a thousand years of cloth-cap wearing whippet fondling. Never mind any of the billion reasons it’s just sick and stupid and horrendously embarrassing. They wanted the brown people gone and they thought Brexit meant they could get it done.

    No wonder they voted Tory in 2019.

  154. 154.

    mrmoshpotato

    @JPL:

    Guess it’s official, trump is hankering down in DC. 

    Hankering for a getting-literally-thrown-out-of-our-house-on-January-20-12:01PM-Eastern-time.

  155. 155.

    Topclimber

    @Sab: That is why secretaries have operational deputies. But if you want administrative experience how about we compare Mayor Bernie with Mayor Pete? And Sanders did manage a credible run for President which regardless of how it might have hurt Hillary certainly put the spotlight on income inequality. You know, the kind of issue people working 2.5 jobs might care about. What we call laborers.

     

    @NotMax: You be you. If that includes ignoring how a politician moves the overton window because he happened to suck as a legislator, then so be it.

  156. 156.

    Tony Jay

    @Steve in the ATL:

    I live in the People’s Socialist Republic of Liverpool, but I do have family who’d be happy to cross the Wastelands and come skivvy for you.

    But the second you do a Dick Van Dyke accent they are gone.

  157. 157.

    mrmoshpotato

    @Tony Jay:

    After the first Winter’s slaughter it’s going to be the Vegan Militia who outlast us all. 

    As history has repeatedly taught us.  Legume-loving landlubbers!

  158. 158.

    Topclimber

     

     

    @NotMax: You be you. If that includes ignoring how a politician moves the overton window because he happened to suck as a legislator, then so be it.

  159. 159.

    Topclimber

    @Chyron HR: Piss poor version of the quote on my part. Did you use context clues to understand what I meant or do you need further explanation?

  164. 164.

    Another Scott

    @MattF:

    RollCall:

    Republican Sens. Mitt Romney of Utah and Susan Collins of Maine had earlier said they would vote against her. But the opposition to Shelton was dealt a blow last week when Alaska GOP Sen. Lisa Murkowski said she would support her. Murkowski had helped sink Herman Cain and Stephen Moore, Trump’s last two controversial Fed nominees.

    Shelton might have survived that opposition, but Republican Sens. Rick Scott of Florida and Charles E. Grassley of Iowa went into quarantine this week because of exposure to COVID-19. Alexander’s absence from Washington during the vote left the count unclear as the voting started. Roberts added to the suspense by saying he was undecided shortly before the vote.

    Senate Democratic Whip Richard J. Durbin of Illinois asked California Democratic Sen. Kamala Harris, the vice president-elect, to hurry back to Washington for the vote.

    McConnell’s task was complicated further by other difficulties ahead. Mark Kelly, the Arizona Democrat who won a Senate seat in a special election, will arrive in early December, reducing the Republican majority.

    COVID-19 is continuing to throw a monkeywrench in Moscow Mitch’s plans. We have to fight for Ossoff and Warnock, have to fight to seat them and Kelly quickly, and never give up.

    We have to fight them every single day.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  166. 166.

    Steve in the ATL

    @Tony Jay: Liverpool? Oi guv’na, I love Echo and the Bunnymen! I’ll bet you have lips like sugar and always do it clean.

    Anyhoo, put a few of your Zimbabwe dollars, uh, I mean pounds sterling, into euros or dollars and you’ll be perfectly splendid.

  167. 167.

    mrmoshpotato

    @catclub:

    Peanut butter , jelly, and ham, or bacon

    Peanut butter and jelly

    Ham, bacon, turkey, lettuce, tomato, mayo – club sammich!

    FTFY. ?

  168. 168.

    Tony Jay

    @Miss Bianca:

    Nah. While the meat-fed mobs are trampling each other at the dog-food aisle the Vegans will be constructing forts out of stacked hemp-bags of lentils and weaving garottes for their children to train with. They may lose a few cadres in the worst incidents of chaos, but when it comes down to pitched battles my money will be on the phalanx of pulse-fed basketweavers and not the paranoid mobs of walking chewflesh.

    Clearly, I’ve thought this through. Brexit took a loooong time coming.

  169. 169.

    Topclimber

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: You have the receipts this time. She does say defund the Police and explains how paying for cops out of non-cop budgets is (wait for it), a cop-out.

    So that is 1 out of hundreds of national Dem office holders using the term. Guess I was wrong.

    BTW what makes you think she is a shrinking violet, oh literal one? She is not, which seems to upset many folks. Have you noticed?

  172. 172.

    Miss Bianca

    @Tony Jay: Good God, it’s a good thing I’m all alone in the office. Trying to explain just *what* I was L’ingOL at would be…interesting.

  176. 176.

    The Moar You Know

    I’m sorry about those who succumb to opioid abuse, and have lost people dear to me on that account. But I don’t think chronic pain sufferers should be abused by people trying to keep everyone from any legal access to pain relief whatsoever.

    @Anonymous:  I have lost someone extremely dear to me from opioid abuse. And I agree with you 100%. Her death was on her, and to a far lesser extent the pharma companies who sent billions of OxyContin pills to farmacias in Tijuana where there were no prescriptions being written for them.

    The punishment – and there is no other word for the way that chronic pain sufferers and the medications they desperately need are dealt with in this country – is utterly inexcusable.

  178. 178.

    trnc

    @PenAndKey: That particular rule exists in Arizona, Hawaii, Maryland, North Carolina, Utah, and Wyoming.

    One form of divine justice would be that if NC Sen Burr had to resign over insider trading, Gov Cooper would just put off appointing a new senator since he would have to choose a republican replacement.

  179. 179.

    Geminid

    @Topclimber: AOC and Ed Markey don’t  have a copyright on “Green New Deal.” Tom Friedman proposed a Green New Deal to combat climate change in 2007, and it’s been a staple of the Green Party platform since 2010. In fact, if you look at reporting on AOC during her 2018 primary and general election campaign, climate change was almost an afterthought. Her prime issues were M4A, abolishing ICE, and criminal justice reform. But AOC and the Justice Democrats jumped on the green new deal bandwagon right after she was elected, and she had the loudest trumpet, so people think it’s her bandwagon. Her and Markey’s aspirational legislative proposal was half baked, and a catchall for the entire “progressive” agenda. That and the slipshod FAQ document prepared by her staff set the fight against climate change back. Elizabeth Warren put out a climate change proposal during the primaries that’s ten times better, and would actually work.

    The Journal of the Atomic Scientists published an interview with economist Robert Pollin in March of 2019, titled “We Need a Better Green New Deal.” It’s not long, but if you read it you’ll know more about climate change policy than does Congresswoman Ocasio-Cortez.

  181. 181.

    Topclimber

    @Geminid: Ok. I was talking about using the term not endorsing anybody’s particular version. I hereby stipulate that AOC should get no credit for originality. Happy?

  183. 183.

    Sab

    @The Moar You Know: Me too on the opioid abuse. My husband has severe pain. Our kid had drug problems for 15 years. He jas been clean for years, but I never thought drying up painkillers for people who needed them was helping. He needed treatment, repeatedly. You couldn’t keep drugs away from him if he wanted them. He needed to be treated to deal with them.

    I also really fucking resented in my temp worker phase having to pee into a bottle every time I (with no history of drug use) was assigned to work with medical records because Roger Clinton and my step-son were out of control at some point in their lives.

  184. 184.

    Tony Jay

    @Miss Bianca:

    I’m feeling frisky tonight. Might be something to do with the triumphalist Death-Eaters running my own Party faceplanting so crunchingly into the brick wall of their own blinkered vengefulness and maybe, just maybe, starting to realise that in their eagerness to show people like me who’s boss they’ve left their milky-white backs open to the undiscriminating knives of people who just don’t like the colour red no matter what the shade. Couldn’t happen to nicer people.

    I am not one of those nice people. I’m also not Vegan, so I know I’m not going to survive the Brexipocalypse. I’ll take my chuckles right now.

  185. 185.

    Miss Bianca

    @Topclimber: The only “point” you should be conceding is that you’re apparently too ill-informed and self-satisfied to do anything but parrot empty slogans and ignore any actual evidence that the empty slogans and their sloganeers are filled with anything but hot air. Kind of like most “progressives” I know. Which is why I stopped thinking of myself as a “progressive” – it became too embarrassing.

    If that makes me a “cool kid”…well…your words, not mine.

  187. 187.

    Omnes Omnibus

    Extreme centrism is just another way of referring to radical centrism which is an actual political science term.  As used by Jacobin in this context, it is a synonym for neo-liberal.

  188. 188.

    Tony Jay

    @Steve in the ATL:

      I’ll bet you have lips like sugar and always do it clean.

    I hope to God that’s a lyric* or I might have to send Cole an ALL CAPS about Stranger Danger.

    Phew. It’s a lyric. And a damned fine one.

     

    *Yes, I’m ashamed how late I ‘got into’ music. In my defence our only radio was made out of seashells and imagination.

  189. 189.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Geminid:That and the slipshod FAQ document prepared by her staff set the fight against climate change back.

    I thought they “accidentally” leaked that to prove to their twitter following that they were, like, totally way more radical than what they could get boring old Ed Markey to agree to. Then, surprise surprise, it blew up in their faces.

    Elizabeth Warren put out a climate change proposal during the primaries that’s ten times better, and would actually work.

    blah blah something overton window something something blah blah

  190. 190.

    Geminid

    @Topclimber: There is no need for you to try to please anyone here. I sure don’t. But I follow climate change and clean energy policy, and I feel that this is an area where Ocasio-Cortez and those around her mislead people. And I guess I took that out on you.

    But check out the Robert Pollin article when you have a few minutes. I know I learned a lot from it.

  195. 195.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @Topclimber:

    That is why secretaries have operational deputies. But if you want administrative experience how about we compare Mayor Bernie with Mayor Pete? And Sanders did manage a credible run for President which regardless of how it might have hurt Hillary certainly put the spotlight on income inequality. You know, the kind of issue people working 2.5 jobs might care about. What we call laborers.

    Oh good god. He only managed a “credible” run because he was Not Hillary. He didn’t fare nearly as well the second time around

  196. 196.

    Sab

    Husband and I just had a huge shrieking argument (husband loves these) about whether Hillary Clinton was a good first lady.

    It was really weird because we have both hugely admired her since forever. I won’t say which side I was on.

  202. 202.

    Geminid

     

     

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: After her staff’s FAQ came out and was met with widespread ridicule, Ocasio-Cortez tried to play it off like someone made a draft and then accidentally hit the”send” button. But it was a completed product, and was received by various media outlets and held under embargo for two days before Markey and Ocasio-Cortez held their introductory news conference.

    I can’t understand what you meant to say about Warren’s clean energy and conservation program, and I myself always thought that the “Overton Window” was an empty intellectual construct.  I just know I thought Warren’s plan was detailed and practical, and could serve as a template for legislation in the next Congress. And while many people take it for granted that republicans will kill any and all good legislation next year, I think there will be good clean energy legislation passed and signed next year.

  203. 203.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Geminid: sorry, that was an indirect shot at our Bernie Cultist, who seems to think it’s more important that Bernie moved the Overton Window than that trump damn near wrecked the country, and it would seem 70% of the Republican Party seems determined to keep his movement going.

    I have little patience with this notion that righteous shouting and clever tweeting is more important than actually winning elections and moving the ball.

    I’m gonna change my handle to “Foolish Incrementalist”

  204. 204.

    topclimber

    @Geminid: I have no doubt Warren’s plan is far superior. It is why EW was my first choice after Kamala faded. I will read what you sent.

    I expect AOC to make mistakes. I also expect her to move a whole generation of people that we well-intentioned boomers won’t (sorry if you are not in that group, which seems over-represented on BJ).

  206. 206.

    Chyron HR

    @topclimber:

    It’s wild how you keep flipping between “Well I say better inside the tent pissing out” and “Oh god please piss on me Mistress AOC” and think nobody will notice anything out of the ordinary.  Were you intending to use a sockpuppet for some of your comments?

  208. 208.

    Geminid

    @topclimber: I’m sorry that I am in that boomer group, if only because I probably won’t be around in 2050 to see us hit the IPCC’s target of world net zero carbon emissions. But the clean energy transition is happening right now, and I think that the next Congress will push it along, even if not as much as the situation calls for.

  209. 209.

    topclimber

    @Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): I realize the word Bernie is a trigger for  many here, but  keep in mind what my point was:  He had sufficient administrative ability to run a 2020 primary that, like it or not, was more effective than my choices (EW and KH) and that of Mayor Pete as well. Yes, he was more of a factor (unfortunately) in 2016.

    I think there is a good chance he could handle managing the Dept. of Labor. Not that it will happen unless Vermont’s GOP governor agrees to name a Democratic successor. So not. That’s too bad, because I think he could be the militant voice for economic justice that that department needs. YMMV, no doubt.

  211. 211.

    Geminid

    @topclimber: I’m sorry that I am in that boomer group, if only because I probably won’t be around in 2050 to see us hit the IPCC’s target of world net zero carbon emissions. But the clean energy transition is happening right now, and I think that the next Congress will push it along, even if not as much as the situation calls for.

     

    @Omnes Omnibus: I think French President Emmanuel Macron describes himself as a “radical centrist.”

  216. 216.

    Steve in the ATL

    @Omnes Omnibus: whatever happened to the Housemartins? Ah yes—Beautiful South, with the ever subtle “36-D” that is about exactly what you are afraid it’s about.

  221. 221.

    Kay

    Joe Biden’s transition team announced today that Dana Remus will be Biden’s White House counsel.
    Interestingly, Remus was also a law clerk to Justice Alito during the Court’s 2008-2009 Term. Notably, in a 2013 letter to the Washington Post, she (and a fellow signatory) strongly defended Alito against a “snide piece”—that should be enough for you to guess the author—that insinuated that Alito has (in Remus’s summary) “some deep and abiding disrespect for women.” Remus responded: “This suggestion is offensive and couldn’t be further from the truth, as his many female clerks can attest.” Alito, she added, “is a good man who serves every day with humility, dedication and incredible intelligence and insight.”

    What a shame. Republicans don’t hire Democrats, and apparently Democrats don’t hire Democrats either.
    Gonna be tough to protect voting rights when we hire lawyers who don’t support voting rights.

  222. 222.

    Kay

    In an unusually caustic and politically tinged speech, Justice Samuel A. Alito Jr. told a conservative legal group that liberals posed a growing threat to religious liberty and free speech.
    The remarks, made at the Federalist Society’s annual convention Thursday night, mirrored statements Justice Alito has made in his judicial opinions, which have lately been marked by bitterness and grievance even as the court has been moving to the right. While Chief Justice John G. Roberts Jr. has tried to signal that the Supreme Court is apolitical, Justice Alito’s comments sent a different message.

    This was last week, when Justice Alito attacked all the people who voted for Joe Biden.

    Alito, she added, “is a good man who serves every day with humility, dedication and incredible intelligence and insight.”

    He also loathes all the people who just voted for Joe Biden, but let’s not let that minor detail get in the way of kissing his ass.

  224. 224.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Kay:

    What a shame. Republicans don’t hire Democrats, and apparently Democrats don’t hire Democrats either.
    Gonna be tough to protect voting rights when we hire lawyers who don’t support voting rights.

    Where are you seeing that she doesn’t support voting rights?

    An early member of Mr. Biden’s third bid for the presidency, Ms. Remus served as the campaign’s top lawyer and before that was a key legal adviser to President Barack Obama. She was the White House ethics lawyer for Mr. Obama and has represented the Obama Foundation since he left office in 2017. […]

    Ms. Remus was brought into Mr. Biden’s orbit by Bob Bauer, a veteran Democratic lawyer who served as chief counsel for Mr. Obama and has been a legal fixture for Democratic presidents and candidates for decades.

  225. 225.

    Kay

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    Alito, the justice she passionately defended in the Washington Post, doesn’t support voting rights.

    He also thinks “liberals are a growing threat to religious liberty and free speech”

    But The National Review is happy, so I’m sure she’ll be great. We’re racking up huge points with the grassroots over there at the National Review and in Justice Alito’s chambers.

  226. 226.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: is Bob Bauer a secret anti-voting rights Republican plant? How far does guilt-by-association go? Do we toss RBG on the ash heap of history because she and Scalia were close friends?

  228. 228.

    Kay

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    Justice Alito, who she so admires, gave a viciously partisan speech last week where he attacked every liberal in the country. That may not matter to her but it matters to me. I’m sick of our people getting attacked and no one fucking defending them. Sick. Of. It.

  229. 229.

    Ramalama

    I thought the term jagoff was specifically Chicagoan. It’s the only place I heard it used while growing up. Living other places later I’ve never heard it uttered. Reading it now makes me aware of this.

    I stand corrected.

  230. 230.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Kay: jesus christ, she wrote that letter seven fucking years ago, you make it sound like she wrote it defending his speech

  231. 231.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Kay: Jesus, Kay, she clerked for him.  She is going to see him differently than a lot of others will.  Since when do we ascribe a judge’s views to the clerks who worked for him?  Look at the rest of her career.

  232. 232.

    NotMax

    @topclimber

    The Labor Department isn’t some sort of private fiefdom. Any Secretary will be bound by the policies and direction of Biden. Bernie’s “If it’s Tuesday, I’m a Democrat” history doesn’t bode well for operating as a team player.

  233. 233.

    MisterForkbeard

    @Timurid: Probably noted later in this thread, but after getting yelled at by residents for being racist for 4 hours, they revoted and certified the results. No danger here.

  236. 236.

    columbusqueen

    @Kay: Kay, you know that most former SC clerks are conditioned to defend their former bosses in public. I don’t read a whole lot into the statement. It actually sounds rather pro forma to me.

  237. 237.

    Kay

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    Yes, poor, poor Alito. Wherever would he be without the ass kissing lawyer club rushing to his defense. One of the unwashed made a “snide” comment about His Excellency! Quick! Defense counsel! Start your engines!

    Sick. Of. It.

    He’s in a 6/3 majority and the veins were popping out on his head last week he hates liberals so much. Another privileged, hugely powerful asshole walking around with a huge chip on his shoulder, reciting grievances. Why aren’t any of these people grateful? That’s my question. I know the answer though- they’re not grateful because they believe they are entitled to all of it. And more! Liberals can’t even exist without enraging Justice Alito! How dare they?

  238. 238.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Kay: are you gonna get to your evidence that Dana Remus is opposed to voting rights?

    are you Kay the lawyer from Ohio who used to be on the front page?

  239. 239.

    Kay

    @columbusqueen:

    No one asked her. She took offense on his behalf.

    It’s fine. She hugely admires the justice who is out campaigning against “liberals”. All liberals. We all suck. That’s the towering intellect. The incredible rigor. He wrote and delivered a speech maligning half the country. Go look for one of those from Justice Kagan re: conservatives. You won’t find one. She doesn’t deliver campaign speeches.

  240. 240.

    Kay

    @columbusqueen:

    No one asked her. She took offense on his behalf.

    It’s fine. She hugely admires the justice who is out campaigning against “liberals”. All liberals. We all suck. That’s the towering intellect. The incredible rigor. He wrote and delivered a speech maligning half the country. Go look for one of those from Justice Kagan re: conservatives. You won’t find one. She doesn’t deliver campaign speeches.

  241. 241.

    Kay

    Robert Costa
    @costareports
    ·50m
    One thing I keep hearing from Rudy people tonight: they know they can’t catch up. What they want — in MI, PA, NV, other states — is for the vote to *not* be certified. Their end game: try to force it to the House. Giuliani talking about this privately.

    Every Republican in Congress is supporting this. How can you ever trust them with an election again? If they get the slightest chance, they’ll throw it out and install themselves.
    Certainly ups the ante on elections. Don’t let them get in. It’ll be hell getting rid of them.

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