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Hot air and ill-informed banter

Do we throw up our hands or do we roll up our sleeves? (hint, door #2)

Black Jesus loves a paper trail.

Someone should tell Republicans that violence is the last refuge of the incompetent, or possibly the first.

Hey Washington Post, “Democracy Dies in Darkness” was supposed to be a warning, not a mission statement.

… gradually, and then suddenly.

Not all heroes wear capes.

Dear Washington Post, you are the darkness now.

Republicans don’t lie to be believed, they lie to be repeated.

When they say they are pro-life, they do not mean yours.

Damn right I heard that as a threat.

Why is it so hard for them to condemn hate?

Hey hey, RFK, how many kids did you kill today?

It is possible to do the right thing without the promise of a cookie.

No one could have predicted…

Tide comes in. Tide goes out. You can’t explain that.

Never give a known liar the benefit of the doubt.

Petty moves from a petty man.

When do we start airlifting the women and children out of Texas?

Mediocre white men think RFK Jr’s pathetic midlife crisis is inspirational. The bar is set so low for them, it’s subterranean.

I’m starting to think Jesus may have made a mistake saving people with no questions asked.

The press swings at every pitch, we don’t have to.

Human rights are not a matter of opinion!

The media handbook says “controversial” is the most negative description that can be used for a Republican.

You are here: Home / Open Threads / E Jean Carroll Verdict: $83.3 Million

E Jean Carroll Verdict: $83.3 Million

by | 307 Comments

This post is in: 

Just a place for you to whoo-hoo the verdict.

 

3…2…1 to Criminal Trump tantrum

 

Open thread

Reader Interactions

307Comments

  5. 5.

    WV Blondie

    Woohoo indeed! Broke away from my work to hear it in real time – partner’s celebrating already.

  12. 12.

    Yarrow

    HAHAHAHHA! That’s awesome. I hope his handlers have an unlimited supply of ketchup. They’ll need it.

  13. 13.

    Trivia Man

    It is my understanding that any appeal must be accompanied by the full $ amount to be held in escrow. He can appeal or he can refuse to pay -(come and take it from me!) – not both.

  14. 14.

    dexwood

    If you could only hear Mrs. dexwood’s loud cheering. Startled the dogs and has me laughing.

  15. 15.

    coin operated

    @Albatrossity:

    What’s the over-under on him twatting something defamatory before the end of the day?

    Probably zero…who’d be willing to take the under on this asshole?

  18. 18.

    coin operated

    Kinda OT…the court appointed monitor tells the judge in the Manhattan fraud trial that the Trump Org docs are incomplete and full of errors.  Way to go, Donny Boy.

  27. 27.

    dexwood

    Judge Lewis A. Kaplan said to the anonymous jury that while they are now free to speak publicly, he didn’t advise it.

    “My advice to you is that you never disclose that you were on this jury and I wont say anything more about it,” he said.

  28. 28.

    TheronWare

    . If Rumpus doesn’t shut up after this judgement, it should go to $1 billion; it’s only fair.

  29. 29.

    Alison Rose

    No idea if Carroll is ever going to see a dime of it, but if she does, I hope she takes it and lives her absolute best life.

    Or donates it to Democrats LOL

  30. 30.

    Jeffro

    @Old School:and she’ll likely get to file a new lawsuit after Trump’s behavior this weekend!

    please FSM make it so

    (although frankly I’d rather he shut up and quit harassing her…but part of me wants everyone but the MAGA mouth-breathers to see just who we’re dealing with here)

  31. 31.

    SiubhanDuinne

    I hope Ms. Carroll enjoys every penny of it, and lives many more years to do just that.

    Courageous woman, to take on TIFG. Too bad Republican politicians don’t have a tenth of her backbone.

  32. 32.

    geg6

    LOL!  Six white men, most without college degrees, one Black man and two women.  Shoulda gone better for Drumpf with that crowd.  He made them hate him.  Love it.

  33. 33.

    Chief Oshkosh

    I wonder what the actual impact will be. What happens if he agrees to pay, but never gets around to it? That was his MO for various charities and business activities. I mean, who actually goes into his “accounts” and takes the money? How is that done? I know some of how it’s done against us mere mortals, but how to you take $83M from a Master of the Universe?

    ETA: Meant to start the post with: Yippee! Hope he blows a gasket!

  34. 34.

    Delk

    It’s raining in Chicago and my husband is on his way home. I guess we need to go outside for a hand in hand stroll.

  35. 35.

    Alison Rose

    From NYT:

    Carroll walked out of the courthouse arm in arm with her legal team, grinning for the cameras.

    Also:

    Judge Kaplan tells the jurors that they are free of his order to maintain their anonymity. But, he said, “my advice to you is that you never disclose you were on this jury.”

    Yeah, good advice.

  36. 36.

    Leto

    I can only hope this is the start, and that he just keeps running his stupid fart cloud mouth so she can keep chiseling away at his “wealth”.

    Three generation rule proves correct.

  40. 40.

    Harrison Wesley

    He probably has the fund-raising letter already set to drop: “SO UNFAIR!!..etc., etc.,”

  41. 41.

    Alison Rose

    @geg6: Much as I sometimes fear otherwise, there are a lot of white dudes who find him absolutely repulsive and worthless. Plus, people who grew up/live in NY tend to hate him. My mom’s parents, both born and raised in Brooklyn, hated him with the fire of a thousand suns, and they both passed well before he was elected (thankfully).

  43. 43.

    HumboldtBlue

    Well, that’s some delicious news to go with a delicious fresh out of the oven thin crust pizza!

  44. 44.

    Alison Rose

    Donald Trump just posted on Truth Social, calling the verdict “absolutely ridiculous.” He said he plans to appeal, and again accused Carroll’s suit of being a “Biden Directed Witch Hunt focused on me and the Republican Party.” He adds, “They have taken away all First Amendment Rights. THIS IS NOT AMERICA!”

     

    LOL someone’s having big feelings

  45. 45.

    Yarrow

    @dexwood: If I were a juror I wouldn’t even tell my family. I’d pretend to be on whatever jury for another few days so my “jury duty” didn’t coincide with this trial.

  47. 47.

    Chief Oshkosh

    @Alison Rose: Yep. I’m an old pudgy white dude myself, and everyone I know at the OPWD Club absolutely reviles him. And we have members from all walks of life, including former Republicans and “Reagan Democrats.”

  53. 53.

    Scout211

    Well, well, well. So much for whining, complaining, insulting, bullying and social media screeds as a high quality defense strategy.  Who knew?

    But chump change to the owner of Mar-A-Lago, worth BEEllions and BEEllions of dollars.  Just ask him .

  54. 54.

    MazeDancer

    Andrew Weissmann said on MSNBC that the courts do not like when punitive damages are more than 10 times the other damages.

    These are not.

    Courts unlikely to adjust on appeal.

    And Trump has to post bond to appeal.

  55. 55.

    JoyceH

    Question – was Trump in the courtroom for the verdict? I know he dramatically stormed out earlier but came back later. In a civil case he doesn’t have to attend, and didn’t attend the first trial.

    Also – what happens if he tries the dramatic exit in one of his criminal trials? Dare I hope we’ll see him in leg irons?

  56. 56.

    Old School

    @Alison Rose:

    and again accused Carroll’s suit of being a “Biden Directed Witch Hunt focused on me and the Republican Party.”

    I didn’t realize the Republican Party was involved with this suit.

  57. 57.

    hells littlest angel

    @Alison Rose: I think that in order to appeal, he has to put the entire 83.3 into an escrow account. He might do better to just stall until he dies. We’ll see.

  58. 58.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    I know this has been kinda asked above but can somebody lay out in excruciating detail what the next steps are?  I’m under the impression that while these verdicts are great publicity, no money is ever actually paid out because of how the process grinds along.

    And if Hair Furor simply refuses to pay, basically threatening somebody to “come and get him”, how would that process actually play out?

  59. 59.

    Alison Rose

    From some dude on Bluesky:

    Surety bonds on appeal in the 2nd Circuit are at the district court’s discretion. I’m guessing Judge Kaplan will require a bond for 100% of the verdict. Justice Engoron is likely to issue a ~$400 million fine next week; in state court appeal bonds MUST be for 100% plus statutory 9% interest.

    Appeal bonds are generally 100% collateralized; it’s conceivable some bank could offer Trump an irrevocable letter of credit, but a half- billion dollars is a lot.

    I don’t know what some of those words mean, but there you go.

  60. 60.

    trollhattan

    Friday News DTrump.

    Sucks to be you, Donny. Now which lackey are you sending in to pay this?

  61. 61.

    jonas

    @geg6: Trump and Habba were such WATBs the whole trial, I’m sure some of the jurors were asking if they could hand down the death penalty.

  63. 63.

    Jeffro

    I haz unleashed cognitive dissonance on the RWNJs in my life…

    Justice! Just like when Fox News had to pay $787M(!) for lying about the 2020 election, trump now has to pay $83M(!) the woman he assaulted and then defamed…and we might not be done yet!

    “Today’s ruling may not be the end of the story, according to Andy McCarthy, a former assistant U.S. attorney in the Southern District.

    “if trump continues to repeat what he said, she can continue to sue him, and seek more millions [in] damages,” McCarthy said on Fox News.”

    (GOP: are you sure you want to run with this corrupt, deranged guy’s headlines dominating our news all year? There’s still 91 felony charges to go…)

  64. 64.

    Jeffro

    @Alison Rose: hint hint GOP: he’s going to ride this (and all the other charges) allllllllll the way in…y’all might not want to be there for the big finish.

    (but hey, they haven’t asked for my advice)

  65. 65.

    Scout211

    @JoyceH:was Trump in the courtroom for the verdict?

    His motorcade left at 4:00, according to CNN. I haven’t read anything about the motorcade returning.

  67. 67.

    trollhattan

    @Old School: Dark Brandon and his mighty powers, who is by the way old and ineffective, and old.

    Did I mention a president has unlimited powers, in and out of office, which by the way I am still in because ELECTION FRAUD.

  71. 71.

    AntiCliche

    @Harrison Wesley: no way he pays a dime of his own money for this outcome, unfortunately. one thing The Schmuck knows how to do is convince other people to support his lifestyle choices.

  72. 72.

    Leto

    @Jeffg166: ​ it’s why he’s in FL now. He tried to get into the NY upper class, and they just slapped his dumbass down. He’s a clown and it shows in everything he does. He’s also losing his “base” and I hope this just continues the trend. He’s a loser, has loser stink on him, and I hope he eventually winds up in a damn cardboard box under an underpass.​

  73. 73.

    MattF

    He’s fired the lawyers who told him to cool it, so I’m guessing there will be a third round of damages. Sometimes bullying is, um… counterproductive.

  74. 74.

    Jeffro

    @Yarrow:If I were a juror I wouldn’t even tell my family. I’d pretend to be on whatever jury for another few days so my “jury duty” didn’t coincide with this trial.

    That actually sounds like a fair reward for going through all of this shit.  A few extra days of chilling at the local Starbucks, movieplex, or Putt-Putt golf course!

    “what?  Oh, it’s going great hon…looks like it’ll be about 2 more days with this lawsuit…nah, they’ll probably settle in the end, but in the meantime, I guess I gotta do my civic duty.”

    (sinks a hole-in-one on the windmill hole)

    “YES!  No, hon…sorry…that was just me glancing up at the clock, it’s almost time for lunch…”

  75. 75.

    Mallard Filmore

    @Chief Oshkosh:

     

    I wonder what the actual impact will be. What happens if he agrees to pay, but never gets around to it? That was his MO for various charities and business activities. I mean, who actually goes into his “accounts” and takes the money? How is that done?

    There are lawyers with staffs that specialize in that sort of stuff. It is not something that Ms Carroll will have to figure out from scratch.

    And for that big a payoff, I suspect they will do it on a contingency basis.

  78. 78.

    SenyorDave

    Trump hats are on Amazon for $13.99. Assume Trump makes $8 per hat, that is 9,255,555.56 hats. I’m guessing that he could find that many saps. Of course that doesn’t account for Round 3 when he continues to shoot his mouth off.  Maybe the next step is that he has to sign over Trump Tower to Ms. Carroll.

  79. 79.

    jonas

    @MazeDancer: Plus Kaplan — like Engoron — bent over backward to tolerate Trump’s outrageous behavior during the trial, including literally walking Alina “I can fake being smart” Habba through basic procedure on evidence and questioning, so as not to open the doors to any appeals. Trump will appeal of course, but I suspect it will be denied in fairly short order as these things go. I don’t see him being able to raise any really complicated issues.

  83. 83.

    Leto

    He’s on his shit platform screaming again. I’m sure Ms Carroll’s lawyers are already drafting up the next legal paperwork.

  84. 84.

    kindness

    Wonder if the Republicans in the Florida legislature are going to offer to pay for this one too?

    I was kinda taken aback when they suggested doing that previously.

  88. 88.

    jonas

    @Chief Oshkosh: As I’ve written here before, what I’d like to see is Trump refuse to pay, Carroll going to court for a judgment and getting a lien on a bunch of Trump properties, including Mar-A-Lago, which she’ll end up owning when Trump has to liquidate them to pay the judgments from the other NY fraud trials.

  90. 90.

    MattF

    @WaterGirl: Well, ‘lawyers look away and don’t explain why’. I think the legal profession has figured out how to deal with him. Just my opinion.

  91. 91.

    Harrison Wesley

    Guess he’ll have to break out those classified docs he was saving for a rainy day and put them up on ebay or something.

  93. 93.

    pajaro

    In terms of whether he will actually have to pay Carroll, if he wants to appeal, he will probably need to file a bond.  In addition, next week, there’s supposed to be a decision on damages in Trump’s civil fraud trial, which could amount to hundreds of millions of dollars.  If Trump wants to appeal, he will also need to file a bond in that case.  We are looking at a situation where, by the end of the month, he may be on the hook for hundreds of millions of dollars, which he will need to pay, or get someone to pay, or he won’t be able to appeal.

  94. 94.

    Alison Rose

    Some fitting music:

    Bad Decisions — Bastille (because his whole life has been a series of them)

    You Owe Me — Dave Gahan & Soulsavers (Carroll to Trump forever)

    The Evil That Men Do — Hot Chip (because he is evil incarnate)

    It seems to me
    First there needs to be
    An admission of guilt
    For what we did
    For all we see
    Atonement

    Beg for forgiveness
    Bear witness
    Be humble
    Beg for forgiveness
    Bear witness
    Be humble
    The evil that men do

  95. 95.

    kalakal

    A few observations

    1. Hahahahahaha
    2.  Huzzah!
    3.  Hahahahahaha

    Could keep that up all day.

    It would appear TFGs charm offensive failed to sway the jury

  98. 98.

    Sister Golden Bear

    @TaMara:

    Guess this was a good day to test out my 3-minute Molten Chocolate Mug Cake. Lots of cake here to celebrate!

    Sounds like there’s enough to share with the rest of us chocolate-loving jackals. <nudge, nudge>

  99. 99.

    Alison Rose

    “I am so proud to stand with President Trump,” Alina Habba says, when asked whether she regretted representing him. “But I am not proud to stand up with whatever happened in that courtroom.”

    “Don’t get it twisted. This was a violation of our justice system,” Alina Habba says, adding they will appeal immediately.

    LOL shut up dumb lady

  104. 104.

    waspuppet

    He will do literally anything to stave off as long as he can the day he has to admit he doesn’t have $83.3 million.

  105. 105.

    Alison Rose

    @kalakal: Apparently not well. I think she confused being good at faking orgasms with faking anything else. Babe, just because the men you bang are too stupid to know the difference doesn’t mean you have skills, it means they lack any and all.

  106. 106.

    Kay

    Maggie Haberman wrote “it’s hard to express how angry Trump is going to be about this”

    The NY Times but her emails team – . Always laser focused on what matters.

  111. 111.

    Jeffro

    @Kay: yes…the important thing is how angry trump’s going to get(!)

    Has anyone ever asked Mags about her, um, issues?  It’s pretty obvious at this point.

  114. 114.

    jonas

    @pajaro: It’s not a problem. Remember, his properties are worth whatever he imagines on a particular day, so he’ll just sell a few smaller buildings for like two billion dollars — because, remember, that’s totally what they’re worth because of his “brand” — and settle up.

  115. 115.

    kalakal

    @Kay:

    Maggie Haberman wrote “it’s hard to express how angry Trump is going to be about this”

    Could overload the Ketchup-o-meter. Access Maggie, concentrating on the real victim here

  117. 117.

    oldgold

    4 things:

    1. Roberta Kaplan is an excellent litigator.
    2.  Alina Habba is an incompetent litigator;
    3. Trump is a client from hell;  and,
    4.  After Trump’s performance in this trial, his criminal defense counsel have to be wetting their pants.
  118. 118.

    Kay

    @Jeffro:

    Ask her about her beach house. The butheremails team all raked it in on Trump.

    Joe Biden is bad for the shitty political book industry.

  121. 121.

    scav

    Rinse and repeat! And with idiot blob & his legal bobble-doll already swinging for a three-peat.

    If only E J Carroll could start dating a football player and really drive them all over the edge.

  122. 122.

    jonas

    @Jeffro: yes…the important thing is how angry trump’s going to get(!)

    …or whether or not this will send him into a spiral of depression like after the 2020 election where he could only eat half the number of hamberders and Diet Cokes per day as usual and Kevin McCarthy had to fly down to cheer him up. I hear Mike Johnson has a hilarious Bible story puppet routine that will really tickle his funny bone.

  123. 123.

    J. Arthur Crank

    @Alison Rose:   Whenever I ask the question “who is the bigger asshole, the lawyer for the defense in this case or the defendant in this case?” the answer always seems to be “yes”.

  127. 127.

    jonas

    @oldgold: I bet one of the things that *really* pisses Trump off is that Roberta Kaplan got this massive judgment for Carroll and did so without a spray tan and fake boobs. He went to all that trouble to give the jury a little eye candy and they do this to him?

  130. 130.

    HumboldtBlue

    @scav: ​ 

    Taylor Swift invites her to share a box the next time she attends a game. Now that would be fucking amazing.

  131. 131.

    Kay

    So the Ohio Supreme Court is going to subsidize lawyers who agree to work in Trump counties.

    I think all defendants need counsel – even Trumpsters! – so I’m glad but perhaps Trumpsters might want to reflect on why their ambitious children all run away to blue counties?

    Why do they have to beg people to represent them or treat them? Because we’re also subsidizing advanced practice health care workers. The market is speaking, Republicans! 🙂

  136. 136.

    Citizen Alan

    @Chief Oshkosh:  One thought that occurs to me is that Carroll’s lawyers will have the right (once the judgment is entered) to force Shitgibbon to sit for a Debtor’s Exam under oath and ask him everything about his finances.

  138. 138.

    jonas

    @Alison Rose: there are a lot of white dudes who find him absolutely repulsive and worthless.

    There are. Wish it was more, but…

    IIRC, the jury in the first trial included a man who claimed to be a pretty ardent Trump voter (dollars to donuts from Staten Island), but who voted against him anyway. If every MAGAt could spend several days actually living with the orange sack of shit, I bet it would scare a lot of them straight.

  139. 139.

    Scout211

    Copies of E. Jean Carroll’s book mentioned in the trial are selling for hundreds of dollars or more.  CBS

    Amazon

    Take a look at E. Jean Carroll posing for the cover of the book in 1985.  She is DEFINITELY Trump’s type.  He just can’t remember anything that many years ago.

  142. 142.

    Jeffro

    @jonas:or whether or not this will send him into a spiral of depression like after the 2020 election where he could only eat half the number of hamberders and Diet Cokes per day as usual and Kevin McCarthy had to fly down to cheer him up. I hear Mike Johnson has a hilarious Bible story puppet routine that will really tickle his funny bone.

    right?

    it infuriates me all over again.  like I give a flying FUCK about what stresses this corrupt goon or makes him (cue violins) sad…

  143. 143.

    Ken

    @Old School: I didn’t realize the Republican Party was involved with this suit.

    They’re paying for his lawyers, albeit indirectly because he’s pulling all the fundraising from the base (hence the MIchigan GOP near bankruptcy, and other state party organizations following). I wouldn’t be surprised if he demands they put up the bond so he can file an appeal.

  144. 144.

    hitchhiker

    @Kay: Saw that. I’ve really been enjoying not having to think about how Maggie Haberman will choose to frame her trump reports.

    I noticed that in the truth social bleat he just put out, he didn’t flat call Carroll a liar, so he might not be as mad as Maggie thinks. He controlled himself.

  145. 145.

    Scout211

    @hitchhiker: I noticed that in the truth social bleat he just put out, he didn’t flat call Carroll a liar, so he might not be as mad as Maggie thinks. He controlled himself.

    I don’t think he wrote that one himself.

  146. 146.

    Miss Bianca

    @pajaro: oh, that is just a delicious scenario to contemplate on this snowy Friday afternoon…

    I may have to end Dry(ish) January a little sooner than the 31st…

  147. 147.

    KrackenJack

    In a wonderful coincidence, I just got a family size Garrett’s popcorn in the mail. Half cheese, half Garrett’s Mix. Off to Mastodon to enjoy the wit and schadenfreude!

  150. 150.

    Ken

    @jonas: Trump and Habba were such WATBs the whole trial, I’m sure some of the jurors were asking if they could hand down the death penalty.

    There’s always the third E. Jean Carroll defamation trial! The one based on what he was saying and tweeting while he was in the courtroom for this one.

  151. 151.

    mrmoshpotato

    3…2…1 to Criminal Trump tantrum

    Fuck ’em!  Back to the current episode of Hot Ones.

  153. 153.

    HumboldtBlue

    $83 million reminds me that Joe Biden will be 83 years old in a few years, and he’ll still be president.

  155. 155.

    trollhattan

    @oldgold: Speaking of those Houthis, they managed this today.

    An oil tanker is on fire in the Gulf of Aden, its operator says, after Houthis said they hit it with a missile.

    The movement said it had targeted the Marlin Luanda on Friday evening.

    Operator Trafigura told the BBC the strike caused a fire in one of the ship’s cargo tanks and firefighting equipment was being used to contain it.

    US officials told the BBC’s US partner CBS the tanker was hit by an anti-ship ballistic missile and a naval ship was responding to its distress signal.

    There were no injuries reported, the US officials said.

    It is the latest attack on commercial shipping by the Houthis in and around the Red Sea.

    The UK Maritime Trade Operations (UKMTO) said that the incident happened 60 nautical miles south-east of Aden.

    The UKMTO said warships were in attendance and supporting the vessel, adding all crew had been reported safe.

    It warned other vessels to transit with caution and report any suspicious activity.

    Trafigura confirmed the vessel had been struck and military ships were on their way to provide assistance.

    Over the horizon radar and antiship missiles are pretty sophisticated. Am surprised we’ve not been able to take out the radar with anti-radiation weapons.

  156. 156.

    kalakal

    At this rate 99.99% of GOP election spending is going to be on TFGs legal ‘complications’. They’ll have to have a time share scheme between every candidate for the lawn sign

  157. 157.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    The totally overlooked question here is with that amount of damages, how is Hunter Biden ever gonna recover?

  158. 158.

    Bill Arnold

    I wonder whether Peter Thiel approves of this. The Hulk Hogan/Gawker damages were larger.
    Bollea[“Hulk Hogan”] sought $100 million in damages. In March 2016, the jury found Gawker Media liable and awarded Bollea $115 million in compensatory damages and $25 million in punitive damages.

    Billionaire Peter Thiel, a co-founder of PayPal and former Facebook board member, paid $10 million to help finance lawsuits against Gawker Media, including the Bollea lawsuit. The idea had been brought to him by Australian businessman Aron D’Souza. Thiel called his financial support of Bollea’s case “one of my greater philanthropic things that I’ve done.” Gawker had published an article in 2007 outing Thiel as gay.

  159. 159.

    Miss Bianca

    @jonas: You know, a “win a day with Donald Trump” contest for TIFG to try to pay his legal fees.could have *all kinds* of hilarious unintended consequences…for MAGAts, that is.

  160. 160.

    Steve in the ATL

    @Kay: my daughter’s med school is doing something similar. I told her I would happily subsidize her to live instead in an area where she and other women can get healthcare.

  162. 162.

    jonas

    @kalakal: At this rate 99.99% of GOP election spending is going to be on TFGs legal ‘complications’.

    Until he secures the nomination, I don’t think the party as such can technically pay for any legal bills*. AFAIK, his political PAC is doing that now. But every dollar a party or a PAC spends paying off his lawyers and sundry judgments is one less dollar they can put towards actually campaigning.

    *which is why, if she really wants to fuck with him, Nikki Haley will stay in until the convention no matter what.

  163. 163.

    PAM Dirac

    @Ken:

    There’s always the third E. Jean Carroll defamation trial! The one based on what he was saying and tweeting while he was in the courtroom for this one.

    I can’t keep up, but I think this one was for what the loser said in 2019. I’m sure there are already other examples between then and now. Whatever the number, the fact that he can’t just make it go away makes him look weaker and weaker. Of course that makes him panic and that feeds that cycle. It seems the Biden campaign is going to use a lot of ridicule and I think that is much more effective that getting mad, because it just reinforces what a loser he is. He can’t made the libtards mad, he just makes them laugh.

  164. 164.

    Delk

    NYT email just now:

    Good evening. Here’s the latest at the end of Friday.

    • A verdict in Trump’s defamation case
    • More good economic news
    • Plus, avoid your midlife crisis
  166. 166.

    jonas

    @Miss Bianca: I recall back in 2016, they did something like that — promise that if you donated $500 or whatever, you’d get the chance to attend a personal event or dinner with Trump or something. Of course, he didn’t follow through because, you know, asshole.

  167. 167.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    @trollhattan:

    https://www.iiss.org/online-analysis/military-balance/2024/01/houthi-anti-ship-missile-systems-getting-better-all-the-time/

    I was actually doing China Navy stuff (among other things) back in the day as an intel officer when the C-801 was first deployed.  Ah, the good old days.

    “Taking out” a site isn’t that easy assuming it’s mobile.  You basically need active elements in the vicinity looking for that sort of thing, then have assets that can quickly respond and prosecute the target.

    If you’re not doing that, it’s “shoot and scoot”, which remains a remarkably effective tactic.

  170. 170.

    Martin

    @jonas: I don’t think the party as such can technically pay for any legal bills

    Who’s going to stop them? They’ve been cheating on campaign laws since before I was born with virtually no consequence. And it’s only gotten worse with super pacs acting as money laundering efforts.

  171. 171.

    Martin

    @Kay: California has expanded medical residency opportunities for out-of-state nurses to get experience with women’s health. Not a bad way to recruit more nurses for the state.

  172. 172.

    geg6

    @jonas:

    This.  Seeing state parties teetering on bankruptcy should be a canary in the coal mine for the GOP.  But their orange god rules all and they are willing to jump off the cliff for him.

    Gotta say, it makes me very happy.

  174. 174.

    JoyceH

    I’m hearing the talking heads say that if Trump appeals (and you know he will), he’ll have to post bond of the full amount. So Carroll won’t get the money right away but Trump still has to pay it even before appeals are settled. If the civil fraud trial gets the judgment they’re asking for, Trump could wind up having to start selling assets while appeals are ongoing.

  175. 175.

    Kay

    @WaterGirl:

    it’s an incentive. They don’t have prosecutors or defense counsel in rural counties so they’re paying student loans – announced today

    We are already paying incentives to physicians, PAs and nurse practitioners. You would think this would inspire some reflection among conservatives – why does no one want to deal with them – but it does not.

  179. 179.

    Lapassionara

    One key piece of evidence in this case is the point in his deposition when he looked at a photo of E. Jean Carroll and identified her as his ex-wife, Marla Maples. Thus completely undercutting his claim that Carroll was “not his type.” I bet the attorney who prepared him for that deposition hated that moment.

  182. 182.

    Kay

    @Martin:

    I feel like women’s health is about to take off as an area of study. My daughters already had training in how health care providers minimize women’s self reported issues – and that goes double for AA women.

  186. 186.

    Hoodie

    Maybe this is the start of getting people to quit giving their power away to this guy.  Is this some indication of the power of a malignant narcissist?  At the end of the day, he’s just a nutty old fart with a bad combover and a splotchy home bronzer job.   He shits in his depends.  It’s there for everyone to see.  The old fable of the Emperor’s new clothes is really trenchant.

  193. 193.

    Ken

    @PAM Dirac: I can’t keep up, but I think this one was for what the loser said in 2019.

    That’s my understanding too. Today’s verdict is in the first lawsuit filed; it was delayed in part because he claimed that disparaging women was part of his duties as President.

    Meanwhile, a second lawsuit was filed for what he said about her after he left office. That one was resolved in her favor, which among other things meant the facts for this one didn’t have to be re-litigated, which is why the jury’s role was just to determine damages.

    However this should not be confused with the other Trump trial that’s just for damages. In that one, the judge ruled that there was overwhelming evidence the Trump Organization was guilty of fraud, so they can skip that step. Also no jury is involved there, because Trump’s legal team forgot to ask for one.

  194. 194.

    Geminid

    @Jackie: I ran into a Twitter post by Immanentize last month, on a thread concerning the potential for a full scale war between Israel and Hezbollah. His post made a lot of sense, which was why I looked up the author.

  195. 195.

    AnthroBabe

    @coin operated: I will say this till the cows come home: he coulda just sat there and ate his food for the rest of his life defrauding everyone with little oversight, but NO! He was offended by the *Black Man* making fun of him.

  196. 196.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    @trollhattan:

    I have no clue.  My experience in this predates drones (although I have stories to tell about the very first ones used for recon of Serb artillery positions the winter before we started operations against them).  I’d imagine MQ-9 drones (USAF) are in theater and used but again, I have no idea what their usage doctrine is.

    People forget that coastlines like there are big places and we can’t see/be everywhere at once.

  197. 197.

    Kay

    @Quinerly:

    I think we would have known by now if Biden was a crook. He’s been in public service for 50 years and is now on his third term as VP and then President. If his Republican opponents couldn’t find anything from 2008 to 2024 I don’t think it’s there.

  199. 199.

    Ken

    @Quinerly: It must be annoying for Republicans on those committees, both because the witnesses they call keep saying they’re wrong, and because every time they try to release something it’s (ahem) Trumped by even worse news about their orange god.

  200. 200.

    Brit in Chicago

    If TFG has to pay $370 million in the case in NY state as well as the (mere) $83.3 million in this case, that might really leave him short of cash. Would Vlad roll the dice on his winning in November and ‘lend’ him money? Would Deutsche Bank disgrace themselves by lending him money again?  —Not so obvious, in either case.

    Somewhat related: there have been reports that polls show that a significant number of people planning to vote for TFG (for reasons I cannot fathom) would change their minds if he were convicted. This is not a criminal trial, and he has already been found to have raped Carroll (in the usual sense of the word, if not the NY State legal sense). But still, this outcome will get a lot of publicity. Perhaps it will make a dent in his support? (Any views?) Maybe this is why Haley is staying in.

  202. 202.

    Sure Lurkalot

    @Miss Bianca:

    I may have to end Dry(ish) January a little sooner than the 31st…

    Household decided last September that daily wine with dinner was not as good as it gets so it has become a once a week indulgence, usually on Friday.

    Oh, it’s Friday?

    Celebrate E. Jean Day.

  206. 206.

    Alison Rose

    @m.j.: We can call it rape, and I have, but I’m not sure why there was a need to say the word in this thread.

    The media cannot call it rape, because legally speaking, it wasn’t:

    Considering the preponderance of the evidence, the jury delivered a verdict that first stated that Carroll had not proven that Trump raped her, and next stated that Carroll did prove that Trump had sexually abused her

    Now, that’s some hair-splitting, but still, journalists and media cannot call it rape if that’s not what he was found liable for. If they did, they could get in trouble. Same reason why before a verdict, they always have to say “alleged” or whatnot.

  207. 207.

    different-church-lady

    I’m so old I can remember when lying about consensual sex made you unfit for the presidency.

  209. 209.

    Splitting Image

    I’m fairly content with this result.

    On the one hand, I’d be happy to see the fucker bankrupt, but on the other, they need to save some cash for the other groups suing him.

    Given the idiot’s track record, Carroll may be able to sue him again anyway after he triples down on smearing her. I hope she is able to get her life back on track, and that the thugs who threatened her on Trump’s behalf get what’s coming to them as well.

  212. 212.

    Jackie

    @Geminid: Did he get mad at someone(s) here? I’ve missed his posts, but I’m glad he’s around somewhere, if not here.

    I’m still processing J R’s passing, and worried about Amir and others gone missing.

  215. 215.

    RSA

    Pointless noodling: Forbes estimates Trump’s net worth at $2.6 billion. An $83 million unpaid bill is a lot to you and me, but it’s just 3.2% of his net worth.

    For context, the net worth of the median household in the U.S. is just under $200,000. (The mean is about five times that.) 3.2% of that number is $6,400.  An amount you might be happy to pay for a crappy used car when you’ve graduated from high school.

    This analogy isn’t to downplay Carroll’s win, but to give context for Trump’s reaction. Trump cares a lot more about money than the average person. This hits him where it hurts.

  216. 216.

    Bill Arnold

    @TBone:

    Nikki Haley just curb stomped him too.

    Hope we (team D) have a decent strategy already worked out for opposing her in the general, including thorough oppo research.

  229. 229.

    Jackie

    @Alison Rose: I believe that’s a NY distinction. Rape must involve penis penetration. Most other states define rape as being penetrated involuntarily/by force.

  232. 232.

    Scout211

    @Martin: California has expanded medical residency opportunities for out-of-state nurses to get experience with women’s health. Not a bad way to recruit more nurses for the state.

    And abortion training for medical students in states that don’t allow abortions.

  233. 233.

    Alison Rose

    @Jackie: Probably many states have such distinctions. But my point was that the media cannot call it rape if that’s not what he was found liable for. Words matter in legal issues.

  235. 235.

    Quinerly

    @Brit in Chicago:

    Haley is banking on convictions, some sort of outrageous, in your face, strait jacket requiring,  public meltdown, and/or death. I admire her for having bigger balls than Cruz and McConnell. If her strategy pays off, I fear she could beat Biden. Just saying.

    Women are the ones who have stood up to Trump….Stormy, Pelosi, Liz C., E. Jean,…..let’s add to the list….Cassidy Hutchinson, and to a certain extent, Shaye Moss and Ruby Freeman.

    Trump attacks McConnell and Cruz’s wives….and they kiss his ass.

    I did a 5 mile hike early this AM. My 2 glasses of Costco red wine have kicked in.

    We need a list of all the men and their wives Trump has attacked and then they cowtow to him vs a list of the women who have stood up to him.

  239. 239.

    Another Scott

    @Gin & Tonic: +1

    Plus, she should report what he actually says when he says it, rather than trying to grab the limelight back on herself with a prediction.

    Apparently Who What Where When How/Why is too old-school these days.

    Grr…,
    Scott.

  240. 240.

    Ken

    @RSA: Forbes estimates Trump’s net worth at $2.6 billion.

    If that’s based in any part on the financial statements from the Trump Organization, I — or rather Justice Engoron — have some bad news for Forbes.

    Plus, it could be like Musk’s net worth — you can get a number by multiplying his shares of Tesla stock by their market value, but if he ever tried to sell all those shares he’d get nothing close to that.

    Or in Trump’s case, since he himself says so much of his worth is his “brand”, a better analogy might be any of the many crypto companies that claim a net value in the billions, based on their holdings of hundreds of millions of their own tokens.

  241. 241.

    terry chay

    @comrade scotts agenda of rage: next steps: he can either pay the judgement after it goes into effect within a time window (like in the next month and a half), refuse to pay, or appeal.

    I think we can all agree he is not going to pay the judgement. Though if he went this route his lawyers could negotiate a settlement with say a lesser amount or payment schedule. I think this would be how most defamation cases that the plaintiffs win would end (e.g. Johnny Depp).

    If he chooses to refuse to pay, they will have to go after that money civilly. I’m not sure the details but it’s be like getting the system to garnish wages, getting liens against his properties etc. Given the amount and who is bankrolled the suit I’d imagine they’d get the amount plus expenses somehow and it would not be pleasant. I don’t think this is a likely possibility given Trumps public image/goal of winning the POTUS and pardoning himself.

    If he chooses to appeal, he would not to have to pay immediately. However he would have to post bond for the full amount plus interests (there are laws that can get that amount reduced and I believe this is the discretion of the courts the actual bond amount). Keep in mind the purpose of the bond is to ensure that the defendant doesn’t avoid payment by abusing the appeals system (because they are out the money), ensure the money is paid if the decision is overturned, and protect them if they do prevail (since they didn’t hand over the money and then the onus is on them to get that money back). So the bond functions as an escrow account.

    IANAL but I imagine because he has claimed he is worth billions and because he has engaged in fraud, nobody will guarantee the bond so he’ll have to post about $90m in assets that he owns directly or can direct as a bond. It’s actually a huge hit. He can probably do it with this but despite his claims I doubt he’ll be able to do this with the other judgement since that will be at least almost a half billion.

  243. 243.

    Quinerly

    @zhena gogolia: that’s great.

    In my circle of women, in NC, in St. Louis, and here….there’s a lot of interest in her. I was a bit taken back by how many of my women friends were tuning into the Repug debates to watch her and praise her. Liberal Dem women who were all in for HRC. Obviously, this was several weeks ago.

    It’s early….I know. Normies don’t really know Haley. I am just talking about what I am observing among some friends and acquaintances.

  245. 245.

    karen marie

    @Lapassionara: The crazy thing is that anything that will be used as an exhibit in a deposition is shared with the other party beforehand.  Sounds like Individual-1’s attorney didn’t go over the proposed exhibits with him before the depo.

  247. 247.

    Jackie

    @Quinerly: I’m banking my opinion that Haley’s beatable. MAGA absolutely won’t vote for her, women and others who support keeping the government out of women’s GYN/OB examination rooms won’t vote for her. Those who don’t like her name and/or female anatomy won’t vote for her. AND, those who don’t want TIFG pardoned will absolutely not vote for her.

    She may get more votes than TIFG, but unless something catastrophic happens, Biden’s got this.

  249. 249.

    karen marie

    @Quinerly: Hang this around her fucking neck:

     

    Nikki Haley would not pre-emptively pardon Individual-1 for crimes committed as president, saying no one was above the law and legal processes should play out. But she would pardon him anyway after any conviction, she added.

    …

    “This is no longer about whether he’s innocent or guilty. This is about … how do we bring the country back together? And I am determined to make sure all of this division, all of this chaos goes away. And I think a pardon for him would make all of that go away, and I think it would be healing for the country.”

  250. 250.

    Quinerly

    @Jackie:

    I’m a true Dem.

    I fret.

    Plus, in my wildest dreams, I could never fathom a Trump election in 2016 and a come back after 1/6.  We all need to be honest….we are at a point anything can happen.

  254. 254.

    Ken

    @terry chay: I don’t think this is a likely possibility given Trumps public image/goal of winning the POTUS and pardoning himself.

    A reminder that if you think being Trump’s lawyer is a horrible job, imagine being the lawyer who has tried to explain, again and again, that the pardon power doesn’t extend to state civil cases.

  256. 256.

    Princess

    @RSA: 3% of his (or anyone’s) net worth is a lot, no matter how rich you are. And having to find that money in a hurry exposes him to tax consequences beyond the sum owed to Carroll as he’ll probably have to liquidate assets to come up with the cash.

  257. 257.

    Geminid

    @Jackie: I think Immanentize just got busy and needed to scale back on time commitments. Commenting here involves much more time than just lurking.

    But who knows? Maybe he’s gone to work on Abigail Spanberger’s campaign for Governor!

  259. 259.

    Geminid

    @Jackie: One question here is: how many Trumpers will stay home if he’s not on the ballot? There’ll be some for sure. A lot of them have no more loyalty to the GOP than he does.

  260. 260.

    Jackie

    @Quinerly: It’s BECAUSE OF 2016 I don’t fret; Dems were complacent and Comey should have “followed the unwritten rules.” We aren’t going to see a complacent Democratic voting bloc for a long, long time. Not until MAGA is castrated, ROE is restored, along with voting rights for all, and LBGTQ members can live freely again.

  261. 261.

    Miss Bianca

    @Sure Lurkalot: That’s what Dry(ish) January is likely to do for me – the “daily wine” or whatever has been exposed as…a habit. (And not the healthiest of habits, either.) Not a necessity.

    ETA: But damned if TIFG starting to get clobbered in the pocketbook doesn’t feel like a champagne moment! :)

  262. 262.

    Jeffro

    @Brit in Chicago:If TFG has to pay $370 million in the case in NY state as well as the (mere) $83.3 million in this case, that might really leave him short of cash absolutely anything at all.

    fixed, as they say

    LOLOLOLOL

  263. 263.

    mrmoshpotato

    @TheronWare:

    . If Rumpus doesn’t shut up after this judgement, it should go to $1 billion; it’s only fair. 

    Agreed!  After all, the orange shitstain is a billionaire, right?

  264. 264.

    Brit in Chicago

    @Bill Arnold: “Hope we (team D) have a decent strategy already worked out for opposing her in the general, including thorough oppo research.”

    Well I worry about Haley because I worry about everything, but if I can put that neurosis aside I mostly think that if she won the nomination then TFG (assuming he loses rather than dies) would be out there telling the world that she stole the nomination from him and urging everyone to write in his name. That would take away a lot of R votes. Would the number of people who went for Haley because she’s relatively young be greater than that? I don’t think so, but I suppose it might be. (I’ve been wrong before.)

  265. 265.

    Jackie

    @Geminid: I agree. TIFG’s rationale (ha!) for “his” election being stolen was less votes for HIM, but down ticket GQPers won their own elections with higher counts.

    I think a lot of republicans will leave the top of the ticket blank – including a lot of repugs in congress – and act surprised that TIFG lost AGAIN. I definitely don’t see Pudd’n Boots voting for TIFG!🤭

  266. 266.

    Ceci n est pas mon nym

    @HumboldtBlue: Coincidentally I sort of made unintentional pizza dough today.

    A couple of weeks ago I decided for the first time in my life to experiment with bread baking. Had a very successful first bake. Today’s second attempt didn’t rise. My wife assured me that if I flattened it, she’d be able to make something like pizza out of it.

    I’m not sure, these things feel like you’d break a toe if you dropped one on your foot. But she’s a genius.

  267. 267.

    Ceci n est pas mon nym

    @mrmoshpotato: After all, the orange shitstain is a billionaire, right?

    One of the many things I loved about Carroll’s legal team is that they used his own bragging about how Mar-a-Lago is worth umpty-billion dollars as evidence that it’s going to take a lot of punitive damages to cause him any pain and encourage him to stop the behavior.

  268. 268.

    Quinerly

    @Jackie:

    Love this. Love your passion.

    I suspect I am a bit older than you. I supported Biden in his first run in 1988. Have been over the moon about what a fantastic president he has been. I’m a realist….his age, any literal or figurative stumble can change the dynamics in a heartbeat. That’s not being gloom and doom….that’s a fact. So as a 62 yo woman who has seen and done a lot, I can fret.

    I have been shocked how quickly some people have forgotten the day to day shit show the Trump Administration was and seem to have forgotten 1/6. As I said, I think anything can happen. This election shouldn’t even be close if it’s Biden vs Trump. But, who really knows right now?

  270. 270.

    RSA

    @Ken: Plus, it could be like Musk’s net worth — you can get a number by multiplying his shares of Tesla stock by their market value, but if he ever tried to sell all those shares he’d get nothing close to that.

    Good points. Fingers crossed.

    @Princess:  3% of his (or anyone’s) net worth is a lot, no matter how rich you are.

    It’s entirely possible I’m over-generalizing when it comes to attitudes about money.

  272. 272.

    Burnspbesq

    @hells littlest angel:

    The appeal bond is 111 percent of the judgment, or approximately $94.7 million. If he doesn’t put it up within 30 days of filing the notice of appeal, she can start collecting.

  275. 275.

    Ken

    @Ceci n est pas mon nym: One of the many things I loved about Carroll’s legal team is that they used his own bragging about how Mar-a-Lago is worth umpty-billion dollars as evidence

    I think that’s the evidence where there was an exchange (paraphrased)*:

    CARROLL’S ATTORNEY: We now ask to admit document X into evidence.

    HABBA: No objection.

    CARROLL’S ATTORNEY: According to document X, the defendant has said his net worth —

    HABBA: Objection! This should not be admissible.

    JUDGE: You just said you have no objection.

     

    * I’d check, but I saw this on one of the bluesky accounts, and it seems to be down right now.

  277. 277.

    Quinerly

    @Jackie: that’s cool. Love your passion even more.

    Maybe I am just a fretter by gene pool….not because of age.

    We are all wired the way we are wired.

  278. 278.

    catclub

    @Princess: 3% of his (or anyone’s) net worth is a lot, no matter how rich you are.

     

    Agreed, but will it change one’s lifestyle?  Will they miss meals? I think for anyone near rich or rich, probably not. More like one less vacation at Monte Carlo.

  280. 280.

    catclub

    @Scout211: ​
     

    She is DEFINITELY Trump’s type. He just can’t remember anything that many years ago.

    Didn’t Trump confuse her and Ivana?

  285. 285.

    Ruckus

    @JoyceH:

    NO.

    There is only one thing, OK 2 things that will shut him up.

    I’ll let you guess what #1 is…..

    Number 2 is that he goes to jail as a penalty of one of his 91 felony counts. But I doubt that will happen and it might not even be possible given that I don’t really know the penalties for those 91 felony counts are. Maybe we’ll get lucky…… Naw, that’ll never happen.

  286. 286.

    Tehanu

    I’ve got nothing new or different to say. Just want to chime in to the chorus of “HA HA HA HA HA, gasp, wheeze, OMG this is hilarious…”

  288. 288.

    Ruckus

    @Leto:

    He does have loser stink on him but that’s because creating loser stink is the only actual skill he has and he has been practicing the ongoing manufacture of loser stink for somewhere around 75 yrs.

  291. 291.

    Betsy

     

    @Chief Oshkosh: If he doesn’t pay, the plaintiff gets a court order with a writ to the  local sheriff (or equivalent local LE official), the sheriff  takes it to the institution where the monetary assets are held, and seizes them up to the amount of the judgement.  Then they are given to the plaintiff.

  294. 294.

    Ruckus

    @waspuppet:

    He’s now at $231,300,000 million, not counting his legal fees

    And 91 more felonies to worry about. He seems to be a bit of a fuck up…..

  295. 295.

    Ruckus

    @jonas:

    Hmmmmmm, his brand?

    He’s going to come out with a beer labeled Priceless and sell it at $200,000/can? I’m not a retail businessman – any longer, but still, pure crap beer at $200,000/can?????

  296. 296.

    wjca

    @Ruckus: He’s going to come out with a beer labeled Priceless and sell it at $200,000/can? I’m not a retail businessman – any longer, but still, pure crap beer at $200,000/can?????

    Seems pretty simple.  Take cans of Bud Lite (or Coors Lite or whichever one it was that’s deemed excessively woke), wrap a (cheap) paper band around it bearing the “brand” name.  Hey, it’s the “Trump steaks” con reimagined.

  297. 297.

    Ruckus

    @Alison Rose:

    Much as I sometimes fear otherwise, there are a lot of white dudes who find him absolutely repulsive and worthless.

    Count me in. Although I’ve been in this group for a rather long time.

  298. 298.

    Ruckus

    @wjca:

    He’d have to purchase, with actual money, a lot of beer to do that, pay for the design and printing of the labels, hire someone put them on, and then sell it all. By the time he did that it would cost more than the original beer, he’d get sued for rebranding it, and the concept in this paragraph is far beyond his mental skills, which seem to be leaving him rather rapidly because – ShitForBrains.

  299. 299.

    Ruckus

    @RSA:

    How much of that $2.6B is tied up and he can’t access it? I’d bet it’s a fair bit. Remember he’s on the hook now for just under 1/4 of a billion. Not exactly chump change.

  300. 300.

    wjca

    @Ruckus: he concept in this paragraph is far beyond his mental skills

    To dream it up today? Perhaps.

    But, as noted, he did something rather similar with “Trump steaks”. So, no invention required, just recycling a known ploy.

  301. 301.

    Ruckus

    @Kay:

    If conservatives could reasonably reflect upon the world, would they be conservatives? They want to conserve things and people that have a love affair with money and make them higher on the totem pole of life. Explain to me anything and everything else in their political spectrum. I shan’t be holding my breath….

  302. 302.

    wjca

    @Ruckus: How much of that $2.6B is tied up and he can’t access it? I’d bet it’s a fair bit.

    If by “tied up” you mean mortgaged to the hilt, I expect you are quite right.  Of course, that drastically reduces the putative $2.6B net worth to something far lower.

  303. 303.

    wjca

    @Ruckus: They want to conserve things and people that have a love affair with money and make them higher on the totem pole of life. Explain to me anything and everything else in their political spectrum

    Wealthy conservatives, yes.  But then there are the not-wealthy conservatives who simply dislike (or perhaps are merely skeptical of) change.

  304. 304.

    Dumbosrus

    Outrageous mockery of our justice system. No justice. No peace. This isn’t justice. It’s judicial abuse and election interference.

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