Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Do we throw up our hands or do we roll up our sleeves? (hint, door #2)

Never entrust democracy to any process that requires republicans to act in good faith.

Peak wingnut was a lie.

Republicans firmly believe having an abortion is a very personal, very private decision between a woman and J.D. Vance.

Fight them, without becoming them!

This is dead girl, live boy, a goat, two wetsuits and a dildo territory.  oh, and pink furry handcuffs.

All hail the time of the bunny!

Republicans are the party of chaos and catastrophe.

Just because you believe it, that does not make it true.

The party of Reagan has become the party of Putin.

The willow is too close to the house.

This year has been the longest three days of putin’s life.

It’s always darkest before the other shoe drops.

No one could have predicted…

If rights aren’t universal, they are privilege, not rights.

Some judge needs to shut this circus down soon.

The arc of history bends toward the same old fuckery.

We still have time to mess this up!

“But what about the lurkers?”

The next time the wall street journal editorial board speaks the truth will be the first.

“Perhaps I should have considered other options.” (head-desk)

The words do not have to be perfect.

Weird. Rome has an American Pope and America has a Russian President.

Prediction: the gop will rethink its strategy of boycotting future committees.

You are here: Home / Open Threads / Afternoon Open Thread

Afternoon Open Thread

by | 127 Comments

This post is in: 

You need an open thread and I need a coffee break.  So here you go and off I go to brew a cup.

If you don’t know why this is super funny, consider yourself lucky. The magat’s heads have exploded over Taylor Swift and it’s beyond parody.

ETA: this is too funny and unfortunately we all know why

 

This is an open thread

 

Reader Interactions

127Comments

  1. 1.

    SiubhanDuinne

    HAHAHA, I remember those days very well, and that’s fookin highlarious.

    ETA: Referring to Norma Jean and Joe, not the Boebert roast. Haven’t yet watched the Boebert roast.

  2. 2.

    NotMax

    Originally named the Trolley Dodgers, once the last trolleys were kaput there was no reason for them to stick around.
    //

  3. 3.

    Baud

    I thought Geminid was a dude.

    I left the US and moved to Istanbul for a fresh start. I only spend $1,500 a month to live comfortably

  5. 5.

    zhena gogolia

    I don’t understand why there is a roast for Lauren Boebert? Is she actually there? Who is doing this?

  6. 6.

    Scout211

    The online media is ga-ga over the Taylor Swift MAGA ”holy war.”  Of course, it’s all about the clicks.

    But this one from Politico just made me laugh.

    To explore how Swift’s influence has grown and how the attacks could backfire on the GOP, POLITICO Magazine reached out to Brian Donovan, a University of Kansas professor who teaches a popular college course called “The Sociology of Taylor Swift.”

    The Swiftie fan is arguably the most immersive and intense fandom in the U.S. right now,” Donovan said. “And to anger them is just political folly. They are a political force that I don’t think anyone really should mess with.”

    It was an amusing read, but it seems to take itself way too seriously.  However, if you want to understand the sociology of Taylor Swift, it’s very informative.

  8. 8.

    CaseyL

    The Christo-fascist complex is doing its best to ruin all innocent past times for its incel fans. They can’t listen to music, watch movies, or (now) even watch sports without thinking all those things are their enemies.

    All they’re gonna have left is guns and coal-rolling trucks.

    I’d say the goal is to create a fascist army, with no outlets for any energy or interest other than violence, except we know these ding dongs would make a lousy army.

  9. 9.

    Pink Tie

    Hoping that the Taylor/Travis romance couldn’t be as poisonous and abusive as the Monroe/DiMaggio relationship. I don’t see Travis Kelce attempting to boss Taylor Swift around or slapping her into compliance. Honestly – having been assaulted, I find the lead image incredibly triggering, knowing what she went through. I don’t think it’s appropriate for the front page.

  10. 10.

    NotMax

    Now that’s funny. Just heard on a British program am sampling.

    Scene: unsophisticated crook and his wife (his gang sitting on a large stash of gold ingots) dining out with an elite underworld fence.

    Fence (bragging): “Pablo Escobar is one of our clients.”

    Crook (turning to wife for confirmation): “No kidding? We love his music.”

  11. 11.

    Dangerman

    Random (really random) local fact; DiMaggio and Monroe honeymooned at the Madonna Inn in San Luis Obispo. This has always kinda surprised me. The Madonna Inn is nice, but not THAT nice for a power couple of that stature.

    Maybe they fell in love with the waterfall urinal. Yes, I have been in that head when women come in to take a picture.

    Of the urinal. Just to be clear.

  16. 16.

    NobodySpecial

    That shot across the bow is the signal from the safe seats that she’s done and therefore safe to mock. It’s a gloriously petty sight.

  20. 20.

    cain

    @Baud: Americans have been going to Mexico and doing the same thing – thanks to remote work. The Mexicans are not pleased because it causes prices to rise.

  24. 24.

    catclub

    @CaseyL: They can’t listen to music, watch movies, or (now) even watch sports without thinking all those things are their enemies.

     

    all ideas stolen from the likes of ISIS and Wahabism.

     

    I was always amused about the ‘Christian ‘ cure group, not sure if it was curing drugs or being gay, that only allowed the residents/prisoners to listen to that awful ‘praise music’  but they forbade listening to Bach. What they don’t know….

  25. 25.

    eclare

    Off topic, I have had a Doja Cat ear worm since yesterday.  It’s a good song, but enough is enough.

  26. 26.

    Jay

    @catclub:

    could fill a book?

    Wasn’t there one written centuries ago and re-edited over time?

    Trying to remember what the name of that one was,……….

    Had some Jewish refugee and his Dad as the main protaganists,……..

  28. 28.

    Jackie

    Nikki Haley was interviewed by CNN’s Jake Tapper, and he asked her thoughts about all the RW’s conspiracy theories re Swift and Kelse:

    I don’t — I will not lie, I don’t know what the obsession is,” said Haley. “Taylor Swift is allowed to have a boyfriend, Taylor Swift is a good artist. I have taken my daughter to Taylor Swift concerts before. To have a conspiracy theory of all of this is bizarre. Nobody knows who she will endorse. I can’t believe that has overtaken our national politics.”

    “Right now you have 60 percent of American families living paycheck to paycheck, we have a border out of control, wars happening around the world,” she added. “The last thing we need to be worried about is who Taylor Swift is dating and what conspiracy theory has her endorsing a person for president.”

    That sane and reasonable response will rile TIFG and his Deplorables!

  32. 32.

    Quadrillipede

    @zhena gogolia: I think the underlying theme is that Republicans all hate each other now and can’t get out of each other’s way.

    Personally, I’ve been waiting for this since November 2015 so I’m off to buy popcorn… 🍿

  33. 33.

    Scout211

    @cain: Aren’t the KPop fans similarly intense? Perhaps we could get the GOP to start a holy war with them as well?

    Could we get them to endorse Biden? That would be cool.

  34. 34.

    a thousand flouncing lurkers (was fidelio)

    @CaseyL: Stochastic terror prep, aiming for a myriad of programmed attackers, randomly inflicting violence. Think of the Nazis’ SA, but without the centralized organization.

  36. 36.

    Quadrillipede

    @catclub: they forbade listening to Bach

    I’m really curious as to their motivation for doing that. I’m not a connoisseur of classical music but most of it sounds perfectly inoffensive to me…

  39. 39.

    Quadrillipede

    @eclare: I had the Cars’ Best Friend’s Girl for an earworm a week or so ago. Discovered a lot of songs titled There She Goes (Again) in the process of trying to identify that one.

  40. 40.

    trollhattan

    @catclub: Ayn Rand didn’t like Beethoven, called him “malevolent.”

    Subrau Diane knows more than I, having had a front row seat.

    Lutherans like them some Bach, believe you me.

  45. 45.

    Uncle Cosmo

    @NotMax: It’s kind of interesting to note that nearly all the LA professional sports teams ( NFL Rams and Chargers, MLB Dodgers, NBA Lakers, NHL Kings, MLS Galaxy) are named for things that have no connection to the town. (The first 4 acquired their names in their former home cities of Cleveland, San Diego, Brooklyn NY, and Minneapolis, respectively.) The only exceptions are the WPSL Angel City and the MLB Angels – and the latter play in Anaheim. I guess that’s par for the course in a city where less than 60% of the population were born in the USA – and by that I mean nothing more than at least 40% of its inhabitants are from outside LA.

    Contrast that with here in Baltimore, where both the MLB and NFL franchises (both, coincidentally, named the Browns!) were moved from other cities, but before play began changes their mascots to quintessentially local icons – the baseball team from St. Louis were renamed after the MD state bird, the Baltimore Oriole (Icterus galbula), and the football franchise formerly in Cleveland was renamed the Ravens, as a nod to Edgar Allan Poe, who died here. Even our former NFL team, now in Indianapolis, was rechristened after many previous stops the Colts in honor of the city’s history of thoroughbred horse breeding and racing (the Preakness at Pimlico is the middle of the three Triple Crown races).

    NB: On his way to the Pacific Theatre in WW2, my future father fell in love with California & spent some years fruitlessly trying to convince my future mother to move out there. In the course of which he followed California politics and as a good FDR Democrat developed an abiding dislike for a GOP type who ran for Congress against incumbent Jerry Voorhees – a guy with an 11-o’clock shadow named Nixon. Yep, Dad despised Tricky Dick before I was born…​​​
    ​
    ​

  46. 46.

    Jay

    Last fall, he was convicted in the case over the child sexual abuse images, which originated when a computer that Schulte possessed after he left the CIA and moved to New York from Virginia was found to contain the images and videos that he had downloaded from the internet from 2009 to March 2017.

    The judge described that trial as “a bloodbath” in which “Mr. Schulte had no defense.”

    Yet, Furman noted, Schulte was unable to express remorse for those crimes either.

    Of the 40 year sentence, Furman said the bulk of it was for the CIA theft while six years and eight months of it were for the convictions over the child sexual abuse materials.

    In a statement afterward, U.S. Attorney Damian Williams said Schulte “betrayed his country by committing some of the most brazen, heinous crimes of espionage in American history.”

    “When the FBI caught him,” Williams continued,” Schulte doubled down and tried to cause even more harm to this nation by waging what he describe as an ‘information’ war’ of publishing top secret information from behind bars.”

    https://www.ctvnews.ca/world/ex-cia-computer-engineer-gets-40-years-in-prison-for-giving-spy-agency-hacking-secrets-to-wikileaks-1.6752110

  47. 47.

    Alison Rose

    Hey, this is neat:

    An extinct species of walrus was unearthed in Santa Cruz County, providing a unique window into a time when California was teeming with odd creatures that feel closer to fantasy than reality, researchers said.

    An article about the newly discovered species, Valenictus sheperdi, was published in January 2024 by a group of California scientists. Authors say the species is perhaps most remarkable for its “toothless” appearance, Robert Boessenecker, chief paleontologist at the Charleston Center for Paleontology, told SFGATE over the phone. Modern walruses have about four teeth along each quadrant, he explained, and click them together to communicate underwater. This species, however, only had tusks, and likely thrived during the early Pliocene epoch about 4.9 million years ago.

    The encased fossil was found in January 2011 by Forrest Sheperd, who was just 13 at the time, the self-described amateur paleontologist told SFGATE via email. As a kid, Sheperd went looking for specimens at least three times a week – but little did he know that he’d discover a fossil that would eventually be named after him.

    “This particular time, I brought my friend fossil-hunting and we were walking along the bluffs of the beach when a freshly fallen boulder caught my eye,” he wrote. “I recognized the unique texture of bone emerging from the rock.” By then, he had seen enough specimens to realize that the flat, curved shape was a skull. Together, Sheperd and his friend slowly lugged it near the road, where they were picked up by Sheperd’s parents.

    “Given that the boulder weighed around 70 lbs, I was very glad to have a friend with me,” he continued.

    After getting in contact with the Sheperd family, Boessenecker spent three years meticulously cleaning the specimin with hammers, chisels and “lots and lots” of acid, he wrote. As the encased rock began to fall away, he started to see just how unusual the fossil truly was: The skull was bigger and older than other walrus fossils Boessenecker knew of. In addition to V. sheperdi, the boulder contained a skull from Valenictus chulavistensis, another walrus that once lived in the proto-gulf of California, along with “a tusk representing the oldest known member of the Odobenini –  the long-tusked walruses.”

    “That’s why this is so wild,” Boessenecker wrote. “Walruses today have an Arctic distribution, but most walruses in the fossil record lived in cold temperate, temperate, and even subtropical waters; many walrus fossils are known from as far south as San Diego, Baja California, South Carolina, Georgia, Florida, and Morocco.” But these walruses all went extinct over the last two million years, he said, leaving us with just two main arctic subspecies today.

  49. 49.

    a thousand flouncing lurkers (was fidelio)

    @cain: Wasn’t it the K-pop fans who screwed up one of TIFG’s rallies in Oklahoma by reserving all the tickets & then not showing up a few years back?

  51. 51.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Uncle Cosmo:

    It’s kind of interesting to note that nearly all the LA professional sports teams ( NFL Rams and Chargers, MLB Dodgers, NBA Lakers, NHL Kings, MLS Galaxy) are named for things that have no connection to the town. (The first 4 acquired their names in their former home cities of Cleveland, San Diego, Brooklyn NY, and Minneapolis, respectively.)

    True, but other than the Lakers (no lakes in L.A., 10,000 of them in Minnesota), they’re all sufficiently generic sportsball team names that it doesn’t matter.  Even the Dodgers – if you didn’t know the origin story of the name, you’d have no reason to think it made any more or less sense than any other team’s name.

  55. 55.

    frosty

    OMG I don’t know whether to be proud or deeply ashamed that I’m so deep in the rabbit hole that I the Dimaggio-Monroe reference. And I think it’s funny!

  57. 57.

    FelonyGovt

    @Scout211: I knew how incredibly pervasive Taylor Swift’s fandom was when I saw, at my local bookstore, that there is a Little Golden Book about her. So that means LITTLE girls- elementary school age- want to read about her.

  59. 59.

    Craig

     

     

    @Dangerman: wasn’t that place seen as way more exotic back then? A kind of Central Coast Palm Springs getaway for fancy folks. I’ve liked staying there a couple of times.

  66. 66.

    trollhattan

    Greta still out there, putting herself on the line. We don’t deserve her, but sure need her.

    Climate campaigner Greta Thunberg has defended climate activists facing prosecution in court, saying “we must remember who the real enemy is”.

    The 21-year-old was arrested during a demonstration near the InterContinental Hotel in Mayfair on 17 October.

    Oil executives had been meeting inside for the Energy Intelligence Forum.

    Ms Thunberg appeared at Westminster Magistrates’ Court after previously denying breaching the Public Order Act 1986. She is accused of breaching section 14 of the act by blocking the entrance to the hotel. [which is right out.]

    Ms Thunberg appeared at court along with two Fossil Free London protesters and two Greenpeace activists, who also pleaded not guilty to the same offence.

    Outside court, Thunberg made a statement alongside some of her co-defendants in which she said: “Even though we are the ones standing here, climate, environmental and human rights activists all over the world are being prosecuted, sometimes convicted, and given… penalties for acting in line with science.

    “We must remember who the real enemy is, what are we defending, who our laws are meant to protect.”

    She added: “History’s judgement against those who deliberately destroy and sacrifice… resources at the expense of humanity, at the expense of all those who are suffering the consequences of the environmental and climate crisis… and at the expense of future generations, your own children and grandchildren will not be gentle.”

    Earlier, the court had heard that Greta Thunberg was given a “final warning” by police before she was arrested.

  69. 69.

    smith

    @HumboldtBlue: And of course, here is how the ever-civil TFG campaign responded:

    “It’s a shame that Crooked Joe Biden disrespects the presidency both publicly and privately,” said CHRIS LACIVITA, a senior Trump campaign adviser. “But then again, it’s no surprise he disrespects the 45th president the same way he disrespects the American people with his failed policies.”

    Note that one thing that touched off these remarks from Biden was TFG making fun of the attack on Paul Pelosi.

  78. 78.

    Timill

    @lowtechcyclist:

     

    Even the Dodgers – if you didn’t know the origin story of the name, you’d have no reason to think it made any more or less sense than any other team’s name.

    Well, LA did have the Red Cars (of which there is no decent history, dammit). Also, the St. Louis Browns were the transplanted Milwaukee Brewers

    ETA: Also, the St Louis Browns were within a couple of days of being approved to move to LA, when the league meetings were interrupted by Pearl Harbor.

  83. 83.

    Scout211

    News from the fraud trial. Link

    Allen Weisselberg—the ex-CFO of the Trump Organization—is in talks to negotiate a plea deal with Manhattan prosecutors in which he would plead guilty to perjury, ABC News and the New York Times reported Thursday, citing people with knowledge of the matter.

    . . .

    As part of the deal, Weisselberg would have to admit he perjured himself on the stand in October 2023 in former President Donald Trump’s civil fraud trial and that he lied under oath while being interviewed by the New York Attorney General’s office, the New York Times reported.

    . . .

    A guilty plea would mark Weisselberg’s second guilty plea recently, as he pleaded guilty to criminal charges in 2022 when he was convicted of tax evasion.

    15. That’s how many criminal tax fraud charges Weisselberg pleaded guilty to in 2022, when he admitted he had conspired to avoid paying taxes on corporate benefits.

    The Trump organization sure picks some criminal  competent employees.

  85. 85.

    MomSense

    One of my cousins died last week.  He was almost 80 – had a rough life but was so cared for by family and his community.  The family asked my kids to play at his memorial. They loved talking music with him starting when they were very young. He especially loved Johnny Cash and Merle Haggard.  My youngest sang Sing Me Back Home and I just lost it.  My oldest is playing with him at the memorial service and it’s just so damned beautiful.  I think D would be so touched by this.

    Imagine dealing with severe mental illness in the 1950s. As bad as the stigma is now it was impossible then.  It’s only because of the love of family and the townspeople that he was able to live as well as he did.  So many of us didn’t have that support and suffered.  Thinking of them.

  88. 88.

    Uncle Cosmo

    @Dangerman: DiMaggio and Monroe honeymooned at the Madonna Inn in San Luis Obispo. This has always kinda surprised me. The Madonna Inn is nice, but not THAT nice for a power couple of that stature.

    SLO was future-Dad’s last stateside posting on the way out to Pearl, then Leyte, Okinawa and the Korean occupation. That was the California he fell in love with. Our family passed through there on the road from FranSan to LaLaLand a couple of years B.C. and it was nice – easy to see how a 30-something from Appalachia could have been bowled over.

  91. 91.

    Jackie

    OOOPS!!!

    Special counsel Jack Smith’s team probed an “astonishing” lapse that saw FBI agents miss a “hidden room” in their search of Mar-a-Lago, the social club where former President Donald Trump stands accused of storing top secret official documents, a new report shows.

    Multiple witnesses were questioned about a secret space off the former president’s bedroom, hidden behind a large dresser and a big television set, that FBI agents did not check when they searched Trump’s Florida estate in August 2022, anonymous sources told ABC News Thursday.

    https://abcnews.go.com/US/special-counsel-questioned-witnesses-2-rooms-fbi-search/story?id=106826552&cid=social_twitter_abcn

    It’s a very long detailed article. Sooo how many documents are STILL MISSING? I doubt any are in the hidden/locked rooms any longer, but where are they hidden NOW?

  98. 98.

    Uncle Cosmo

    @Timill: ​Also, the St Louis Browns were within a couple of days of being approved to move to LA, when the league meetings were interrupted by Pearl Harbor.

    Interesting, I never heard that before. Got a link?

    The league meetings were so profoundly “interrupted” that instead of the Browns heading off to LA, they stayed put for another 12 years until sold to a Baltimore group and brought here. It wasn’t until the 1958 season that the first MLB teams relocated to the Left Coast (NY GIants to SF, Brooklyn to LA). I wonder how much proximity to a war zone and the obvious hassles of long distance transport in wartime put the kibosh on that move. In any case the Browns (formerly the Milwaukee Brewers) had been in St. Louis since 1901, which is nearly an eternity for a sports franchise.

  101. 101.

    smith

    @Jackie: More likely it’s because the monitor watching the Trump Org handed in her report to Engoron on Monday, and, oh boy, did she have a lot to say. A lot of incomplete, erroneous and late statements, and most especially a claimed loan for $48 million that turned out not to exist. All this uncovered about the Trump Org’s activities during the 14 months they’ve been under a monitor. In other words they just kept on frauding.

    Engoron is most likely reworking his judgement to take all this into account.

  102. 102.

    Steve in the ATL

    @Baud: if you’ve been to Istanbul lately, you know that $1,500 per month is plenty (thanks to Erdogan’s “non-conventional” fiscal policy).

    If you want to cut that in half, there’s always Cairo!

  104. 104.

    LiminalOwl

    @Uncle Cosmo: This is an entry from my mother’s journals, 9 November 1960:

    I thought I’d have so much to tell you about the presidential campaign–filthy, exciting, hurly-burly, ugly, glamorous–but there it is, and what else shall I tell you? Nixon the Unwashed is beaten, and his friend Lodge with him. Perhaps you’ll know his name without our mentioning it, but I hope not. I hope his descent to the obscurity he so richly deserves will be rapid and final.

  105. 105.

    Uncle Cosmo

    @smith: “…CHRIS LACIVITA, a senior Trump campaign adviser…” Jeebus cripes, another italoamericano. How much you wanna bet he has Mob connections?

    Were it not for the Speaker-Emerita and a handful of others, I would have nothing but disgust for the people I share 100% of my ancestry with. Within my parents’ lifetimes, Italian-Americans were pilloried as greasy, hairy, garlic anarchists and gangsters smelling of garlic and routinely discriminated against. Things didn’t improve until the end of WW2, when we were “godfathered” into whiteness – and then practically the first thing we did as a group was to yank the ladder up so the n*****s and the sp**s and any other ethnicity left out of the “American dream” couldn’t climb it, while furiously maintaining there was no such thing as the Mafia even though every one of us knew better.* It’s no accident most of the support for Italian fascism came from the paesani of the Mezzogiorno, that backward malarial region south of Rome from which the vast majority of Italian immigrants came to the US…e poi, eccoci (here we are).

    *And just FYI, eager to strut around as if we played a central role in every great thing Italians have accomplished back to Romulus and Remus, even though we’re nearly all descended from ignorant peasants who worked the sulfur mines and pea farms.

  106. 106.

    LiminalOwl

    @MomSense: I’m sorry for your loss, but glad that your cousin received the love and care he did. As you say, so many don’t have that—even now, let alone in the old days.

  109. 109.

    Uncle Cosmo

    @Albatrossity: Joltin Joe was a Yankee, not a Dodger

    And the holder of one of the last two canonical MLB records that remain unbroken: longest hitting streak (56 games, 15 May – 16 July 1941)*. This, like the other one**, is unlikely to be broken before the heat death of the universe.***

    *I.e., games in which a player got at least one hit.

    **Most wins recorded by a pitcher (Cy Young, 511: 1890-1911)

    ***Then again, the same was long believed to be true of the former record for most consecutive games played by an individual player (Lou Gehrig, 2130, 1 Jun 1925 – 30 Apr 1 1939), which stood until Cal Ripken, Jr., of the Baltimore Orioles broke it on 6 Sep 1995. Ripken went on to play in 2,632 consecutive games (30 May 1982 – 19 Sep 1998), the current record.

  111. 111.

    pieceofpeace

    @MomSense:   Wow, I seldom long for the 50s and small-town living, so this took me swiftly back to the feelings and remembrance of similar instances and grace of those with close familial and community ties that supported one another.

    What a moving musical tribute by your sons.  That this song was chosen because, in part, music was a joyful connection with him is putting a cherry on top.

     

     

     

    @MomSense:

  113. 113.

    Uncle Cosmo

    @Timill: Wow, thanky kindly. We are a baseball fambly (Dad was a semipro shortstop, one of our cousins spent 4 years in the NL) and my relatives will find this interesting!

  116. 116.

    Quadrillipede

    @Jackie: And the Fraud Civil Suit decision has been postponed AGAIN

    If it helps any, it means the Bronzer Goblin gets to spend a few more days seething and decompensating before the hammer drops…

  117. 117.

    Quadrillipede

    @smith: In other words they just kept on frauding.

    Engoron is most likely reworking his judgement to take all this into account

    I hope Judge Engoron has at least a passing familiarity with Zeno’s paradox of Achilles and the tortoise…

  118. 118.

    Odie Hugh Manatee

    @MomSense:

    My condolences to you and your families for the loss of a loved one. Thank you for the backstory to their life and those who made it possible for them. Stories like yours are too often the exception for those who need help to live.

    Good people are a good thing. RIP to your cousin.

  124. 124.

    Paul in KY

    @Alison Rose: Down in S. America during Pliocene, they had aquatic sloths! Fed on seaweed (they think) Went extinct when S. America connected up with us & ocean currents became much colder (or non-marsupial carnivores from N. America got em).

  125. 125.

    Paul in KY

    @eclare: If you or I had gone back to 2005 Paul and said (what is completely true) ‘One day you would have crawled over broken glass to have Dubya back in the White House, instead of the alternative.’ 2005 Paul would not have believed you. Would have laughed in your face & called you crazy.

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