If you have been paying attention, this is not a surprise, but it is still jarring to see it in black and white:
I have now survived, in my lifetime, an “OMG THE JAPANESE ARE BUYING ALL OF AMERICA” and an “OMG THE CHINESE ARE BUYING ALL OF AMERICA” scares. Back to the point of the article, I generally think this is a great development, if for no other reason than lessening global shipping. And unless my fundamental understandings of economics are wrong, this will bring wealth to both nations, lifting both economies, and perhaps lessening the immigration crisis (although many of the people at the border are from other portions of central and south America who are fleeing regimes that we have encouraged/destabilized).
Any thoughts?
Steve in the ATL
A great way to spend those Ameros!
(Are the nut jobs still convinced there is a new currency coming?)
Baud
OMG the Mexicans are buying all of America!
satby
Agree, John! Plus, Mexico is a great country and a neighbor, we should be working more with them.
Edited
piratedan
my guess is that it’s due to the bolillo buns that are integral to the Sonoran Hot Dog demand.
Baud
Someone owes Bill Clinton an apology. :-)
US interference in LA is shameful, but I’m not aware of any direct connection to the current displacement of people from there.
OzarkHillbilly
I’m in favor of anything that is good for Mexico.
dmsilev
Yes yes, but all of that trade is coming ACROSS THE OPEN BORDER OOGA BOOGA BOOGA!
Xavier
International trade is a win-win if both sides have full employment, otherwise it’s complicated. I think Keynes was onto something when he said (paraphrased) that science, culture and arts, tourism, and things like that should be international, but let goods be homespun, and above all finance should be domestic. (National Self Sufficiency, 1933)
different-church-lady
It’s all those hipsters buying mescal skewing the numbers.
Betty Cracker
The supply chain snarls during the pandemic apparently prompted many off-shoring companies to rethink their approach. Near-shoring is probably their best bet — they can still exploit labor more than they could in North America but without their goods being an ocean away if a black swan event disrupts shipping. I don’t know anything about logistics, but it makes sense that manufacturing goods closer to the marketplace would decrease the environmental impact of shipping.
gene108
@Steve in the ATL:
The currency won’t happen until the North American Union merges the USA, Canada, and Mexico into one nation, which somehow would disadvantage the USA.
The argument against the NAU is Mexico and Canada would gang up to destroy the U.S. I point out in any representative system, the USA would dominate having a population larger than Mexico and Canada combined.
Somehow the NAU would not be a representative democracy and I guess would be ruled by a triumvirate with one member from each country, per the people worried about this, but they aren’t very clear about what sort of government the NAU will have.
azlib
There has always been robust trade with Mexico. I believe AZ does over $30B in trade with Mexico. If you are interested in the stats, they can be found here:
https://azmex.eller.arizona.edu/sites/default/files/2023-12/AZMEX-Data-Update-12-23.pdf
New Deal democrat
Since free trade increases the *aggregate* wealth of both nations involved, there are important strategic reasons not to enter into unfettered free trade arrangement with a military adversary (since they then have more money to spend on their military buildup). See also: “The Great Illusion,” Normal Angell, 1907 (touting the end of European wars due to free trade between, e.g., the UK and Germany).
Of course, some of the increase in trade with Mexico is exactly companies from those nations establishing plants in North America instead.
As to whether the American middle and working classes will be helped, see the above work, “aggregate.” If it helps the economy of Mexico and Latin America, meaning fewer feel the need to make the trek to El Norte, so much the better.
rikyrah
Good headline to me, Cole.
Chris T.
OK, yeah, but where are my taco trucks on the corners?
Chief Oshkosh
@Betty Cracker:Pedant Alert!
Mexico is part of North America.
You could look it up! ;)
wjca
Does that include smuggled illegal drugs?
I’m guessing it’s legal trade, but I can see that question getting tossed into political discourse.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@gene108: I want a switch to the metric system.
Scott
We need to completely shut down the border. Says all the crazies. I say: let’s do it! FAFO!
wjca
Good news! The US is already, as a matter of law, on the metric system. Has been for decades. It’s just a matter of using it more. Liter drinks bottles becoming standard suggest we are creeping, very slowly, in that direction.
FastEdD
Exactly right. And the build quality of items coming from Mexico is improving. I was a bit nervous that my current car was built in Mexico. I’d rather have one from Detroit, but … this is the first car I’ve ever had where everything works perfectly. Zero defects. Nothing breaks. Fantastic!
Suzanne
I am curious how much Mexico buys from China. Probably a lot of raw materials?
Chief Oshkosh
@FastEdD: Make and model?
Enquiring minds (who are carried to work in a 24 y.o. car that’s starting to wheeze a bit…) want to know!
comrade scotts agenda of rage
Automakers have a massive presence in Mexico building not just for the ‘Murkin market but worldwide.
If you drive a recent-ish Toyota Tacoma, it was built in Baja for example.
OzarkHillbilly
@Chief Oshkosh: Heh, I was thinking of pointing that out. Decided not to.
lowtechcyclist
@Chris T.:
This, dammit! I can see my corner out the window from my desk, and there’s NO TACO TRUCK there. I demand my taco truck!!
;-)
andy
@comrade scotts agenda of rage: i wish we could get the Hilux here. They just introduced a strippo model that’s under ten grand AND is an actual useful pickup, not a pavement princess like we got here.
lowtechcyclist
@Chief Oshkosh:
And it’s also part of Central America.
But they’re doing that just to confuse us.
Almost Retired
@Baud: When you said “US interference in LA is shameful,” I’m like DAMN RIGHT leave Los Angeles alone. Then I realized you meant Latin America. That’s a good point too.
lowtechcyclist
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
I’ve always thought the metric system made a world more sense than the silly formerly-English system we seem to be stuck with, but I really didn’t have any trouble dealing with teaspoons and tablespoons and ounces and quarts and gallons, or inches and feet and yards and miles, so it didn’t bother me much.
But when the kiddo was little, I kept on thinking: it would be SO much easier explaining metric measurements to him, than to explain the freaking mess of a non-system that we have.
Baud
@lowtechcyclist:
I’ve never heard of Mexico being classified as part of Central America before.
lowtechcyclist
@Almost Retired:
Reminds me of the days when I had a “US out of North America” button that parodied the “US out of Central America” buttons and stickers you’d see frequently in the 1980s.
lowtechcyclist
@Baud:
Central America – Wikipedia
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@andy:
https://www.motor1.com/news/701958/toyota-hilux-champ-cheap-pickup/
Anecdotally, people are always stating they want a smaller, aka lite, pickup truck like 90s-era Tacomas, Ford Rangers, etc., and yet no carmaker has rolled out one in recent years.
The Toyota Hilux in the link sounds like what you’re talking about but again, everybody wonders why something like that isn’t sold in the US.
Recent “small” entries like the Ford Maverick or Hyundai’s Santa Cruz still ain’t that small.
Suzanne
Off topic, but enjoyable: Marjorie Taylor Greene is apparently having the sadz about the GOP FAILURE yesterday. She said the Dems “hid one of their members waiting until the last minute, watching to see our votes, trying to throw us off on the numbers.”
That’s called showing up to work. A novel concept for some, I realize.
David Fud
@Suzanne:
@Suzanne:
Increased, but not by ginormous amounts.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/1105881/mexico-trade-value-china/
Baud
@lowtechcyclist:
Interesting.
Betty
@FastEdD: Quality is determined by the parent company and whether they choose quality over a lower price. Happy to hear you found good quality.
catclub
yeah I hate when people use ‘Americans’ to actually indicate USians. It is lazy.
Frankensteinbeck
@gene108:
If you do not understand that the next words are ‘the Jews’, you do not understand the conspiracy theory or the theorists.
@gene108:
They have figured out that you’re not supposed to say ‘the Jews’ in public, yes.
Betty
@Suzanne: The Rep responded to her. He said he was there, out of his hospital bed, because the vote really mattered to him. He had no idea it would be a deciding vote. MTG is just an awful person.
catclub
@comrade scotts agenda of rage: First link in my search for a nice looking small wagon:
Suzanne
@Betty: She is such a piece of dogshit. I love watching her tap dance on rakes.
Captain C
@Suzanne: “Why won’t the enemy* just line up for us to shoot them?”
*The GQP has considered everyone to the left of whoever their current leader is to be the enemy since at least the Newtie years
ETA: Also: “Whaddya mean we have to actually work and think? Real Americans(TM) like us should just have everything handed to us on a silver platter, preferably by unpaid Those People!”
catclub
Remember the Woody Allen movie where he was paranoid about being jewish, so when somebody asked him: **”I just saw the new movie, did you?” he heard “I just saw the new movie, Jew?”
** not an actual quote
sdhays
@Suzanne: They couldn’t pass this with their majority, so they had a cunning plan to take advantage of a Democrat’s absence for SURGERY and failed to make sure the guy was actually in surgery.
Their whole plan rested on that guy not being able to show up, and they didn’t bother making sure where he was.
They tried to game an impeachment of an administration official when they didn’t have the votes, which is an interesting precedent. And they failed because they’re lazy morons.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
More on why automakers flocked to Mexico since NAFTA: wages! Duh. For the Lords of Capitalism, it’s always, always about the pursuit of low wages and the most exploitable work force to be found and still be able to sell to the desired market(s).
Even by the standards of the ‘Murkin South, the average line worker in a Mexican auto factory is $2.70.
This piece, even tho it’s 6-years old, provides a good overview:
https://www.tecma.com/low-cost-manufacturing-labor-in-mexicos/
wjca
So sad. Go to all that trouble to schedule the vote when you know he’ll be in surgery. And then he manages to show up anyway. All that hard work to scheme the numbers, and all for nothing. Somehow, not all that sympathetic.
EDT sdhays got there first.
CaseyL
If I remember the NAFTA debate correctly (which I’m not sure about; it was 30-odd years ago) there was recognition that the trade pact would benefit all the country-signatories AND that seeing those benefits would take a generation, at least.
I’m delighted to see some of those benefits finally happening.
Suzanne
@sdhays: The notion that some people sought elected office in order to do work on behalf of Americans is, like, completely not in their worldview.
That’s because they all sought elected office for the LOLZ and to get rich. Republicans should leave serious work to serious people and they can all go spend their days playing mini golf or something.
Geminid
@catclub: There must be a lot of lazy people out there, because I see people all over the world calling citizens of the U.S., “Americans.” For instance, foreign journalists refer to Anthony Blinken as the “American” Secretary of State, not the “USian.”
Chris
A friend and I just started watching Batman Beyond, the cartoon from right around the time of the millennium that’s set in Future Gotham City.
We’re only a few episodes in, but so far one of the ways it really shows its exact age is that there are very few signs of crushing economic dominance by an Asian power in this vision of the future. (The opening credits have one building with characters in an Asian language on it, but that’s all I’ve seen). It has a really cyberpunk look in a lot of ways, but you can tell it was made right in that sweet spot when “OMG THE JAPANESE ARE BUYING ALL OF AMERICA!” had stopped being a thing, and “OMG THE CHINESE ARE BUYING ALL OF AMERICA!” hadn’t quite moved up to replace it yet.
If the same show got made either ten years earlier or ten years later, no way would that element be missing.
Suzanne
@comrade scotts agenda of rage: In 2019, Werner Ladder closed its US ladder factory and moved to Juarez to save on labor costs
I know it’s bad. But I laughed so hard.
Betty Cracker
@catclub: Arguably, it’s the complaints about people using “Americans” to indicate, uh, You-Essians, that are lazy and dumb. “Mexico” is actually the “United Mexican States,” so if we glom onto You-Essians as the complainers suggest, we’re appropriating part of that country’s official name, which seems worse than nicking a geographical appellation that doesn’t form part of their national identity.
Kelly
Prosperity south of the US border would reduce the immigration pressure on the our southern border.
eclare
@Chris T.:
I am still waiting on my taco truck too. Pout.
Ksmiami
@wjca: but I’ll never give up Fahrenheit. Never
eclare
@Suzanne:
Someone in the thread downstairs said George Takei tweeted, Crouching Tiger, Hidden Democrat.
catclub
@Geminid: Yes. there are.
gvg
@Baud: I agree. We have not really done anything active for quite awhile. 911 took our attention away from them, but even before then we really had been doing less.
This theme has become habit, not thought. Lets stop and think. Actually I am not sure what is causing the various issues. Lack of good reporting you know.
Leto
@Suzanne: numbers… how do they work?
NotMax
Republicans: “Mexit!”
catclub
@Betty Cracker: So you are suggesting that USians suggests Mexicans because an accurate abbreviation of their nationality is UMSians, even though mexicans is available?
Have you ever seen UMSians used anywhere but in this response?
Leto
Nancy Pelosi is on Andrea Mitchell’s worthless show, and is explaining her strategy behind votes: have your shit locked down, don’t worry about the other side. Goddamned cold blooded, and I love it.
NotMax
@catclub
Mini Cooper Clubman pretty much the only thing similar to a small station wagon available in the U.S. at present.
Manyakitty
@Leto: only reason I didn’t turn it off.
gvg
@catclub: Of the 3 countries, we are the only one with America in our official name. Other people are not going to call us United States of Americans. Our “name” is logical for conversation.
Leto
@catclub: there are a number of smaller/mid-sized vehicles that other countries have that would work very well here. Great gas mileage, good power, good interior room (spacious/cargo room/comfortable), but the fucking F-150 has been the best selling vehicle for over 30 years now. /shrug
NotMax
@comrade scotts agenda of rage
My hybrid Maverick was built in Mexico. It’s Goldilocks size.
;)
Hear tell the Australians’ long, long love affair with the ute has ended.
Geminid
@eclare: George Takei:
Mike Johnson tapped Marjorie Greene to be an Impeachment Manager if the Mayorkis impeachment goes through. Greene’s mad because she really wants the exposure, bless her heart.
Betty Cracker
@catclub: Nope. I’m suggesting the entire “don’t call citizens of the United States of America ‘Americans'” argument is silly nitpicking.
BigJimSlade
@comrade scotts agenda of rage: I heard something about smaller pickup trucks would have to meet higher MPG standards (based on the vehicle’s footprint), and that’s hard for them to manage in a pickup truck. So our good works of trying to improve MPG standards has incentivized building bigger pickup trucks (and some of the customers like to feel big and important).
Leto
@Geminid: Greene couldn’t manage a bake sell, but she’s going to lead the Impeachment team? Lul
Baud
@Geminid:
How did Greene get Mayorkis’s dick pics?
Ruckus
We had a very good customer in Mexico, decades ago. I’ve had to go to their plant a few times and I have to say Mexico may not be the richest country in the world but it was a LOT different than I was taught. The people I’ve known were hard working, good people. But then I’ve traveled to a lot of countries and seen that while they aren’t us, that often is not a bad thing. We tend to see the world in terms of size of bank accounts, many countries use far different guides to be healthy and a country. And yes money is important, no matter what it’s called in any country, and yes this one can give pretty decent lives because of our money, it can also make it far more difficult for those that live paycheck to paycheck or even less. We often cast aside those that do not make a profit by breathing. Our economy is, like pretty much every other one, not about making this a better place but a wealthier place, especially for those in the upper strata. It’s just that overall we focus more on the upper end than the lower end. That upper end can fend for itself – but usually at a cost to those below.
John S.
@NotMax:
I love my Mini Cooper Clubman. It’s extremely versatile, and very fun to drive. Alas, the last one made rolled off the assembly line the other day as Mini has discontinued production.
It will be “replaced” with the Mini Aceman which is more of a small SUV than a wagon. And it will be 100% electric.
NotMax
@Leto
One of the things I really like about my Maverick is that it’s part TARDIS. The interior of the cab is unexpectedly capacious.
UncleEbeneezer
@Baud: Financial INVASION!!1!
Betty Cracker
@Geminid: From what I’ve read, it’s certain to go thru once Scalise returns. Since House Repubs are determined to pursue this ridiculous impeachment, I’m glad to hear Speaker-Pastor PornHub was dumb enough to make Greene a manager. The more indelibly she becomes a face of the GOP House, the better it is for Democrats.
Geminid
@Leto: I don’t think Greene would lead the Impeachment Managers, just be one of the team. Johnson will want someone with more gravitas for the leading role. Like Andy Biggs..
Betty
@Betty Cracker: Just imagine hours of that voice. Yikes!
Leto
@NotMax: that’s Avalune’s Honda Fit. She’s also called it a TARDIS. Surprisingly large interior. Our son, who’s 6ft, has plenty of legroom in the back without the seats being pulled all the way to the front. And just like the Clubman, Honda discontinued the Fit in 2020. She’s a bit bereft because when she’s goes to get a new car in about 5 years, she doesn’t know what she’s going to do.
Chris
@gvg:
I’ve occasionally wondered what an alternative name might look like, but never come up with one. “Etatsunien” in French is one I hear occasionally but still sounds odd, and “Unitedstateser” sounds even weirder.
Mind you, I’ve also always found it similarly awkward that people from the UAE are called “Emiratis.” Using the same rules as for America, it would just be “Arabs,” though that will offend people for the same reason as “Americans.” (I don’t know what the correct term in Arabic is).
New Deal democrat
@gvg: Time for the periodic history lesson (not directed at you per se) about why citizens of the US call themselves Americans.
In 1776, or 1789 if you want to be technical, every other person in the Western Hemisphere (except the natives) was not a citizen of any country, but rather a *subject* of a European monarch, e.g., Spain, France, Portugal, the UK. By contrast, in the US the non-native white population were *citizens* of the United States of *America.*
So calling themselves Americans was a patriotic point of pride vis-a-vis European countries. Given that historical context, there’s no reason for anyone to be defensive.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@NotMax:
That’s even a bit smaller than our 2015 Tacoma (which I totaled on I-25 coming back from an extended camping trip in 2021 to WY and SD) and I thought it was as big as I wanted to go.
We replaced it with a 2021 Tacoma and yeah, it’s bigger, not the direction we wanted to go in.
The Maverick is a move in a smaller direction but still larger than a lot of people say they want. They basically want a 5′ bed with minimal cab size and width.
Leto
@Geminid: f’ing lol
eclare
@Geminid:
Yep, I saw that. She is really disgraceful, I saw her speaking to Mayorkas yesterday, and it was vile.
When I lived in Atlanta I used to go to what is her district to go hiking occasionally. I would never do that now. I would not feel comfortable.
Uncle Cosmo
Forty-five years ago I ordered a brand-new Cutlass Salon** and when it arrived I noticed it was assembled in Ste-Therese. Quebec. I looked forward to using some of the choice language I’d learned in high school French class when it broke down, but I only had one chance. (Overheated about a mile from my folks’ house when a thermostat controlling a valve in the cooling system failed. Dad & I figured out the problem, went to Western Auto for a replacement & fixed it ourselves.)
** One of the strangest auto designs of the past 50 years. Anyone remember a Chevy Citation? Like that, on steroids. I called it a half-fastback. (IIRC a Cadillac model shared the concept as well.) Only lasted a couple of years – but if anyone at GM had had the bright idea to replace the trunk lid with a full hatchback and then produce hardware to lock that lid open in a horizontal position and fold up a tailgate from the trunk floor that also locked, buyers for a few dollars more would’ve gotten a station wagon conversion from a fuel-efficient (for the time) mid-size sedan, and they couldn’t have made ’em fast enough. Nitwits.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@BigJimSlade:
That’s ringing a bell now.
But, automakers of all stripes continue to say (I know, I know) that smaller vehicles don’t sell in good ole ‘Murka and have used that as a reason to not market some of the smaller truck lines they sell to great success around the world.
I think one reason (aside from cultural) is that there is a market for smaller versions of something, but then when every maker trots out a design, it over-saturates the market, then they all axe their offerings within a few years of each other.
Or at least that’s a theory I saw years ago on an autoblog run by a bunch of glibertarians of all people.
Ruckus
@comrade scotts agenda of rage:
It is a vicious circle.
The economy of Mexico is, at least at my last visit a few years ago, not nearly as much of a manufacturing country as this one. And that has allowed our country to charge more of things people need which in turn allows higher wages (not of course in any sort of straight line concept) which means there is a demand for workers with skills and said workers can demand more to create/service whatever. It grows the economy. And things like unions have an outsized effect on the entire economy, raising the tide for all. But concept one is – you can’t sell needs or crap to people if they don’t get paid reasonably. The term robber baron did not come about for no reason.
Baud
@Chris:
They are using the same rules. Emirates:Emiratis::America:Americans
cain
@gene108: At long last, we can finally give Texas back to Mexico ;)
stinger
@gvg: This has always been my argument. “America” is part of our name. The country to the north is officially named “Canada”; the country to our south is “The United Mexican States”. It would be odd for persons of either country to want to be called “Americans”. And in fact, they don’t. Canadians will always correct you if you refer to them as American (and the Quebecois will correct you loudly if you refer to them as Canadian).
JustRuss
Call me crazy, but seems like a stable, prosperous Mexico would be a much better solution to the immigration “crisis” than a stupid wall.
JustRuss
Jeezus people, let it go already!
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@Uncle Cosmo:
Heh heh, one of the many examples of the classic American POSmobile from back in the day. Along with the Chrysler K Car and a whole host of others.
I remember, probably around 1979, a friend bought something used that was Japanese. His staunchly right wing family gave him endless shit about “Not Buying ‘Murkin” as some patriotic marker. They pointed to their new Dodge Onmi, another POSmobile if there ever was one, as an example of “Buy American”.
He then proceeded to open the hood and point to all the components that *weren’t* built in ‘Murka, the proceeded to tell them about the car’s overseas origins, etc.
They were not amused and made excuses.
Chris
@gvg:
Kent’s guest post from three years ago during Kamala Harris’ visit to Guatemala had some good stuff about what decisions the U.S. has made and continued to make that helped turn several Central American countries into such a shit show. (Keep reading into the comments as he made a few other asides after it). He very much does stress that the U.S. is not the only actor at fault here.
ETA: sorry, forgot to link. https://balloon-juice.com/2021/06/08/guest-post-vice-president-harris-in-guatemala/
JustRuss
@Uncle Cosmo: Yeah, those 80’s fastback Cutlasses were…interesting. I don’t think Cadillac made one, but Buick or Pontiac probably had similar.
cain
@comrade scotts agenda of rage:
I alwasy find it funny that we are always looking for cheap labor but it seems it is ok to get the most expensive executives. I mean good grief – an executive cost is way high.
Geminid
@Leto: Or maybe they’ll get Paul Gosar to head up the Impeachment team. He can be a galvanizing speaker.
cain
@Chris:
I saw a few episodes just last week and the first episode really jarred me because – at the beginning Bruce Wayne Batman was living in a world relatively like hours -20 years later though – holy shit technology has advanced to the point of flying cars, scooters or whatever it is and robots. I’m like wtf…
Baud
@Chris:
I see free trade and the drug war, things that have affected this country too.
The OP refers to destabilizing regimes, which harkens back to more direct interventions in government.
JustRuss
@comrade scotts agenda of rage: Assuming this guy is being truthful, EPA regs are what keep small trucks out of the US market: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azI3nqrHEXM
Worth a watch.
Chris
@Baud:
What’s the rule, then? Wouldn’t “emirates” in that name be the equivalent of “states” in ours?
stinger
@cain:
Excellent point.
cain
@Ruckus: I love Mexican people – so much potential there. Guadalajara for instance is a great city – but man it could use some really great transit system to ease traffic. While we aren’t one to talk – I just feel that if they had people in govt with some real vision – Mexico could go really far.
It makes me sad that we are destabilizing Mexico thanks to all the easy access to guns here.
Marcopolo
@Betty Cracker: not if the D wins the NY -3 special on the 13th. Pretty sure that makes it a tie again w/ scalise back (assuming all votes stay the same).
Hoppie
@catclub: The problem of course is there is no such word in English as “USians” (unlike Italian, for example, where you can say “Statunitense”) so we are reduced to what, “citizens of the United States”? Very clunky. Or perhaps “subjects of Hair Furor”?
EVERYBODY understands what “Americans” means. Let language flow where it will.
trollhattan
@NotMax: As one goes smaller the line between hatchback and wagon-back blurs. Audi A3 Sportsback could be considered a baby wagon.
Used to have an A4 Avant wagon–lots of fun until Timing Belt Departure Day.
ETA was pondering a VW GTI during last car shopping event and the entire thing was hecho en Mexico, including drivetrain. (There are distinctions between manufacturing and assembling that I cannot define.)
Geminid
@Chris: The rule is, it works. People in and outside the region say “Emiratis” because it’s easy to say and there is no doubt as to what it means.
Chris
@Baud:
In that case, I think the last time we overthrew a regime to the south of us would’ve been Haiti in 2004 (because of course it was George Dubya). So, twenty years, almost exactly give or take a few weeks. Yeah, it’s been a while.
JustRuss
@John S.: Too bad about about the Clubman. I had a 2009, smaller than the current version, and it was a terrific little car.
wjca
About like Comer managed the impeachment hearings. “Patheticly” would be putting it mildly.
Anyway
@cain:
Right? All carrots for the MOTUs and sticks for the worker bees.
andy
@lowtechcyclist: never understood the problem. it’s a base ten system, and even the slowest child or conservative would understand that it’s just like money, and it’s pretty slick how you can just move the decimal point around.
Citizen Dave
@comrade scotts agenda of rage: You remind me that I in fact owned and drove a Dodge. After an old Civic crapped out, (I was in grad school so limited budget), did my research and bought a silver, new Dodge Colt. Which was the same car, made by and in Japan as the equivalent Mitsubishi model. I always thought of it as a Japanese car. Pretty, pretty, pretty, pretty good car.
cain
@Chris: Let’s also take a minute out to say “fuck Kissinger”
Baud
@Chris:
There are no rules.
wjca
Well, that and the massive demand for drugs here.
Baud
@andy:
The problem isn’t conversions between metric units. It’s getting people used to a new scale of measurement.
trollhattan
Remember the Big Bear Eagle Nest Cam from last winter? Jackie spent 62 continuous hours on the nest during the recent storms.
andy
@wjca: the “one weird trick” style of governance. sure beats working!
catclub
How about “most Americans don’t speak spanish”?
My first response to that is “are you sure?”
Geminid
@Uncle Cosmo: I think Tesla missed a good opportunity when they did not make a pick-up version of their Model 3. Someone cut one down and converted it to a small pick-up that got some play on the Internet. Tesla ignored the opportunity even though there seems to be a market for a compact pick-up of any kind. Instead, Tesla made a major investment in another big pick-up truck that may turn out to be Tesla’s “White Elephant.”
Leto
@comrade scotts agenda of rage: I was there the day my parents bought their first brand new car. A 1984 Dodge Aries (K car). Four speed manual. A/C. AM/FM. So many bells, so many whistles. That was also my first car in 1992. They had it repainted, engine rebuilt, and I had it for the next 6-7 years, until I got married and we bought their mini-van. My sister got the vehicle, and about 18 months later wrecked it. It was a damn workhorse of a car. Took me around multiple states for soccer, many first dates, too many outings with friends, and a whole lot of family trips. Any time I see a military movie from the 80s, there’s typically one of those cars in the movie. Because it was also a mass purchased government vehicle. It was definitely a crappy car, but I have a lot of good memories of/from it.
dnfree
@Uncle Cosmo: We had a Chevy Citation from 1980 until 1988. Great car for a family of four, less great for the family of five we became, but still the kids were sad when we sold it and got a minivan.
Paul in KY
@comrade scotts agenda of rage: I think there’s a whooole lot of profit made when a ‘pavement princess’ truck is sold up here.
Betty Cracker
@trollhattan: Incredible photos!
Paul in KY
@Ksmiami: I agree! Told my Celsius using/loving wife that Fahrenheit was more granular and gave you a better temperature reading.
She was not amused…
Paul in KY
@NotMax: I like the styling on them, but hate that it’s a ‘Mini’.
NotMax
@Citizen Dave
Used to own a Dodge Colt Vista with a 5-speed manual transmission. For all intents and purposes a shrunken down station wagon. Ran like a champ except for the time it was in the shop for 3 months awaiting the parts to replace the clutch.
While being visited by someone 6’8″ and in the range of 300 pounds, he couldn’t get over how easy and comfy it was for him in to fit in.
Paul in KY
@Uncle Cosmo: I had a 1980 Cutlass 4 door. Was a nice car. Styling was pretty staid.
Paul in KY
@cain: Blade Runner was set in 2019. Should have been 2119.
Baud
@Paul in KY:
No, 2019 should have been more like Blade Runner.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@Paul in KY:
Yeah, that’s pretty much the knock on at least the “legacy” American automakers.
I purchased a 2023 Bolt EV in September and have been pretty immersed in Bolt world since…which also means a lot of meta conversation about EVs in general and GM’s approach specifically (with some spillover into Ford).
Ford’s Lightning is a poster child for what you’re talking about: they thought they could sell a $100K F150 EV by the truckload, make profit. It’s not turned out that way b/c there’s no demand for a $100K EV truck (Tesla’s moronic Cylon truck will be the next example) the way there is for the ICE version…and the inherent bigger profit margins that come with that.
But then taking this conversation into the EV realm opens a whole different can of electrons. But the general point remains in that there’s a demand for a vehicle, in this case an EV, that doesn’t cost a ton even with various state/fed tax credits, and isn’t overlarge.
trollhattan
Mind the trees.
Road down to a single lane near the office this morning, to accommodate the YUGE crane lifting ginormous tree hunks out of the house it had split in two.
Xavier
@Dorothy A. Winsor: except for Fahrenheit temp scale, which is objectively better than Celsius or Kelvin, because: 0F – really cold. 100F – really hot. 0C – cold, 100C – you’re dead. 0K – you’re dead, 100K – still dead.
NotMax
@Baud
1949, anyone?
;)
trollhattan
@Baud: Need more Pris in my life.
trollhattan
@comrade scotts agenda of rage: Oddly, I see a lot of Rivians around town and am not sure I’ve ever spotted a Lightning. Would I recognize it? Maybe not. Lord knows F-150s compete with Camrys for most-common award.
Somebody has a Fiskar Ocean in the office lot. Yeah, had to look that one up.
Baud
@Xavier:
Agreed. F° > C°
Soprano2
@Geminid: The whole thing is going to be a joke. Their whole argument seems to be that Mayorkis won’t break the law like TFG tried to do, and that he can’t by force of will keep people from coming to our southern border. Will the Senate even take it up?
Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony
I think people give too much weight on the influence of US efforts both for and against family planning. It was already culturally expected to have large families before we made any effort there. Guatamala is a Catholic country. The Church has long been violently against family planning. Had the US been firmly and consistently making efforts to encourage family planning in Guatamala across the decades, it would have helped, but it would not have had the impact I think some of you believe it would have. Cultural change is a slow process and it is more successful when it comes from internal rather than external pressures. We are responsible for governments we depose. We are responsible for not doing more to curb drug demand and addiction in the US. We are NOT responsible for the people of a sovereign country having big families, engaging in rampant corruption, or tending to prefer autocratic leaders. We are actually really limited in what we can do to change that.
Take Haiti. Its a mess. Its remained a mess regardless of US policy or the number of NGO’s acting in country. Haiti will stop being a mess when Haitians agree on a good path forward and work together to acheive it.
geg6
@NotMax:
I’m pretty sure VW makes one. The Golf, I think. Our campus’ Chancellor drives one.
Origuy
Spanish has a word “estadounidense” for people from the United States. I don’t know if it is used in Spain. They may sometimes use the word “norteamericano”, but that would apply to Mexicans, too.I haven’t found any other language that has a demonym for people from the USA that isn’t a form of American. Certainly the other languages I’ve studied, Italian and German do not. Apparently Portuguese is similar to Spanish. I found a Wikipedia article on the subject. An exception is Esperanto, which uses usonano. But Esperanto was created after there were other independent countries in the Americas.
Old School
Baud
@Origuy:
True, but I believe that Spanish speakers use it along with Americano, not instead of.
Paul in KY
@dnfree: I always liked the styling (for the time) on that car. Thought it was a pretty clean design.
NotMax
@trollhattan
When it comes to trucks, look up the planned Fisker Alaska.
Soprano2
@Chris: I wonder what’s happened to migrants from El Salvador since the current president took office, because he brutally cracked down on gangs while completely violating people’s human and civil rights. He was just re-elected by a wide margin, mainly because people there say now they can walk down the streets and not be afraid for their lives. I would think we would have seen a marked decrease in migrants coming from that country.
Paul in KY
@Baud: See your point. If you are/were a Trekkie the 2200s will probably disappoint you as well.
Paul in KY
@Xavier: Will use that sometime. Good summation!
Paul in KY
@trollhattan: A realtor around here had a Fisker Karma. Probably the only one in KY. Sharp looking car, I must say.
Eyeroller
@Xavier: Fahrenheit intended for 90 (revised later to 96) to be human body temperature. Missed it by a bit, but it’s close enough that it makes a good estimate. The 0 was set to be some mixture of ice,and salt. At the time there was some dislike of negative numbers so “really cold salt water” was considered as cold as anybody might care about. The original Celsius scale was inverted; 0 was boiling and 100 was freezing.
RevRick
@Baud: That our trade with Mexico now exceeds that with China is indeed great news, especially in terms of supply chain issues.
But there’s one thing I find hilarious about discussions about US trade: the incredible silence about our ongoing trade deficit.
Washington and the media are constantly harping and fretting over our federal government deficits and the accumulating debt, but in many respects this is absurd nonsense. The reality is that we owe 3/4ths of this debt to ourselves. Paying it off would amount to taking the money out of our right pocket and stuffing it in our left.
Meanwhile, we have been running a constant trade deficit with the rest of the world since 1980. It amounts to trillions of dollars. We have received way more in goods and services from the rest of the world than we have sold to them. And how have we mmade up the balance?
By shoveling trillions of dollars into the hands of foreign governments, businesses and individuals. So?
Well, according to classical economic theory this ought to be causing a disaster. The rest of the world ought to be punishing us with demands that we jack up interest rates to stratospheric levels to tamp down our demand for the world’s goods while making our goods cheaper. Just ask Argentina what happens when things get out of hand with trade imbalances.
Yet, with us the rest of the world seems to shrug and say, “No, you don’t have to pay us back. We’re good!”
Turns out we have a secret sauce called U.S. Treasuries, which are the gold standard for the world. They are the benchmark for all the world’s financial assets.
The deficit we ought to worry about has ended up being no worry at all. It’s absurd.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@trollhattan:
Here in Denver, like anyplace that’s seen a shitton of money come into it over the last decade, showing off one’s affluence via what car you drive, drives what car you drive. :)
Here, it’s Rivian in terms of “Lookeee at my $80-100K EV!” That’s helped by the fact I live 5 minutes from the two Rivian places in Denver, their “service center” is at one place, their “space” (which is their twee term for “showroom”) is in another. As a result, I see plenty of them.
Also too, they’re smaller than the Lightning. And look different hence my “Dig My Expensive Car” theory above.
Origuy
@Baud: You’re right, americano/a is common even in Mexico. Wikipedia notes that gringo and yanqui are also used, although derogatory.
Geminid
@Soprano2: I think the Senate has to take up an impeachement whether they want to or not. Maybe Schumer and McConnell can schedule the trial for a Saturday morning. People with nothing better to do can watch cartoons, infomercials or Marjorie Greene.
Paul in KY
@Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony: The Catholic Church has always been violently opposed to anything that would reduce the potential numbers of FCPDs (Future Collection Plate Donors).
FelonyGovt
@Leto: My husband and I bought a brand new Ford Granada, loaded with options, for $6500 cash in 1979. That was a great car. We drove it across country in our move to CA. Never gave us any problems.
On the topic of the post, I remember the maquiladora system with lots of border town Mexican factories owned by US companies. I spent some time at my employer’s facility in Nogales, Mexico. Hardworking people, somewhat exploitative system.
Alison Rose
@FelonyGovt: When I clicked the down arrow to get to the bottom of the thread, at first glance when this scrolled up I thought it said Ford Granola and I was like wait what.
Sister Golden Bear
@Betty Cracker: There’s other supply chain issues with China as well. There’s company that sells lens, which introduced a new line of lens that have been in short supply for months. Apparently they’ve finally caught up on the manufacturing side, but the lens have been sitting on a loading dock because of the Chinese New Year holiday break, which lasts a couple weeks.
trollhattan
@NotMax:
This gets my attention. :-)
Hat-holder’s name: Betty Jo.
$45k sounds aspirational but we shall see, presuming it arrives next year. (Trump would outlaw it.)
NotMax
@Paul in KY
Heck even the world of The Jetsons doesn’t have fully self-driving cars.
;)
Sister Golden Bear
@lowtechcyclist:
Having worked on international projects involving Mexico, I can assure you Mexicans are very insistent that they’re part of North America, and are quite offended if one refers to them being part of Central America.
lowtechcyclist
@Xavier:
Same here. Metric is better for everything else, but Fahrenheit is a temperature scale that fits human life better. I’ve almost never experienced below-zero temperatures, or over 100, but often in single digits or 90s.
Hamlet of Melnibone
I finally bought a replacement for my 2008 Kia Rondo. I went with a 2021 Kia Niro EX plug-in hybrid. It’s got an advertised 26 miles of “all-electric” range. In practice, the gas engine kicks on as a supplement anytime you accelerate reasonably fast, and the cabin heat is done exclusively via the gas engine.
On the plus side, it looks like my effective gas mileage is going to be very high, since I mostly take pretty short trips. I’m guessing 75% or so of my driving is going to be powered by me plugging in at home.
The crazy thing is how much cars have changed in the 13 years between models. The Niro is pretty comparable in size to the Rondo it is replacing, but the features are amazing. Push to start, heated seats, bluetooth, USB ports, driver assist stuff, backup camera, etc. The shocker was the assisted cruise control, which slows down to keep distance with the car in front of you, and steers itself to keep you in your lane. It squawks if you take your hands off the wheel, but it can pretty much drive on the highway on its own.
FelonyGovt
@Alison Rose: Ford Granola!. That would be an interesting car! Maybe for the hippie set. You’re way too young to remember the Granada.
Uncle Cosmo
@comrade scotts agenda of rage: Just FTR, everything I said about the Salon sedan applied to the Citation as well but more so – it already had a full hatchback & would have cost maybe a hunnert bux to put in the hardware to lock it horizontal (with some accordion<-fold plastic to unfold from the sides) and then another hunnert for a tailgate that folded up from the trunk floor and locked in place and youda had a mini-SW for schlepping the weekly grocery run around. Nitwits!
Jeffg166
@Leto: $6,500 in 1979 is worth $27,463.48 today.
trollhattan
@comrade scotts agenda of rage:
There’s the Central Valley resident fleet and then there’s the Bay Area fleet, which must have a median purchase price at least $30-40k higher. You have to drive something really fancy-schmancy to stand out, and a mere $120k won’t get you noticed at all because there will be twelve others in the Whole Foods parking lot.
JMG
@Geminid: After opening arguments, a Senator can move to dismiss the charges. Majority vote carries it.
eclare
@comrade scotts agenda of rage:
Strangely I have seen a Rivian at a traffic light in my neighborhood in Memphis. It’s a nice looking truck. I say it’s strange because I would expect to see that truck in the much wealthier suburbs, not five minutes from me.
Hamlet of Melnibone
Does anyone remember the “Adobe” from SNL in the 80s?
Sure, you can buy a Yugo, if you’ve got 3-4k to spend. But some of us aren’t named Rockefeller.
The Adobe is the first car to break the $200 barrier.
“Hey, hey, we’re Adobe.
The little car that’s made out of clay!”
trollhattan
@FelonyGovt: I think the Granola would have been built by either Fiat or Renault.
Roberto el oso
@satby: agree 110%!
Geminid
@comrade scotts agenda of rage: I saw my first Rivian last fall, at a country store near Charlottesville. It looked brand new, and it was funny to see the driver cross an asphalt speed bump. He babied that truck over the bump like he was hauling a priceless Ming vase.
JAFD
@lowtechcyclist:
Well, if you move to the New York City area, you’ll find everyone here expects you to speak the Metric like a native Met..
😃
trollhattan
@Hamlet of Melnibone:
Inevitable Trabant post.
The Trabant had a steel frame, with the roof, boot lid, bonnet, wings and doors made of duroplast, a hard plastic made from recycled cotton waste from the Soviet Union and phenol resins from the East German dye industry.
Yes, a car made from industrial waste.
Alison Rose
@FelonyGovt: I wouldn’t say “way too young” — they were still being sold in the US when I was born, and from Google images, I’m pretty sure there were at least one or two in my neighborhood as a kid.
Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony
@FelonyGovt:
I’m pretty sure VW and Suburu has that market covered.
lowtechcyclist
@Sister Golden Bear:
Then per my link @33, they must be pissed at the U.N.
jlowe
If Texas doesn’t want to be part of the Union, can’t we just return it to Mexico, with a renegotiated trade deal (and compensation for the continuing cleanup of Federal Superfund sites in the state)? We’d have to relocate all of the bases, Ft. Hood, Brooks AFB, et al, Might be some compensation for the Mexican-American War of aggression in the 19th Century. Might immediately catapult Mexico into the ranks of First World nations.
Texas couldn’t possibly defend itself, even from Mexico. if it went independent (no, it can’t keep the Third Corps) and it would eventually would either be annexed by Mexico or the US. I’d be much happier if Texas was Mexico’s problem rather than ours.
Taken4Granite
@lowtechcyclist: Late to this thread, but I actually witnessed a “US out of Nebraska” demonstration in the mid 1980s. Some prankster(s) had produced a bunch of posters advertising the demonstration with language that should have made it obvious it was a parody; e.g., the demonstration (on the MIT campus) was to be followed by a march to Harvard, Tufts, BU, BC, Wellesley, and Omaha (a route which those familiar with the Boston area will realize involves a fair amount of backtracking). A handful of demonstrators apparently didn’t realize it was a parody.
Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony
@jlowe: It would never work. The worst Texans would all flee to OK and LA, and the best ones would give Mexico a chance. I’m afraid we still have to solve the problem of the Texas GOP. They aren’t going anywhere.
lowtechcyclist
@Geminid:
The Constitution is silent on whether the Senate must take up impeachment. So unless Congress passed a law saying it has to, or if it’s in the Senate rules, I’d say it doesn’t have to.
A fitting way to deal with the Mayorkas impeachment if it ultimately passes the House.
Soprano2
@Geminid: That will be a hoot then, since they’ve got nothing other than that he’s not doing what they want him to do. That’s not an impeachable offense.
Hoppie
@Origuy: “Statunitense” is a perfectly respectable word in Italian.
To everyone: last I read, the Mayorkas impeachment attempt failed, so the Senate needn’t do anything.
Kay
@Old School:
They tried the same thing in Ohio – not to court but to the public – and no one cared. It’s been super interesting since Dobbs what we’ve found out about the public and abortion. They don’t care about “number of weeks”, despite what political people have been telling us for 50 years. It’s come up in all the abortion-only votes (and polling) and it turns out it doesn’t make a bit of difference if Republicans say they’ll ban it “at conception” or at 6 weeks or at 16 weeks. The people who don’t want them making the decision don’t want them making the decision at 6, or 16, or 17,18,19… weeks.
They want to go back to Roe, what they had before these religious crusaders butted in, where the excruciating and deeply personal experience that is a (relatively rare) “late term abortion” was between a woman and her doctor.
The whole thing about a “middle ground” at 15 weeks (or whatever week Republicans make up!) that media love so much doesn’t matter to voters.
Chris
@Soprano2:
I’ve been wondering if we could get a thread about that.
The thing that’s hugely helped his approval ratings as near as I can tell is that he’s actually succeeded in cratering Salvadoran crime rates, which mostly isn’t what happens. Haven’t read nearly enough about why exactly that worked; apparently a popular theory is that he’s brokered a deal with the gangs behind the scenes, but no idea on the veracity of it.
Ruckus
@JustRuss:
It would absolutely. It’s likely getting better since the last time I’ve been there, which has been a while. But it takes time and a lot of effort to change the direction, basic normalcy and economy of a country. Look at some of our citizens and where they want this one to go. It ain’t up/better.
wjca
Sssssshhhh!!!
I have this horrid thought that the MAGAts might decide to “punish” the rest of the world by defaulting on Treasuries. At least ones held by non-US entities. Which would be far more disasterous for us, but they’re too dumb to understand such details.
Eyeroller
@lowtechcyclist: In the <my name> system, I would have defined the following to be exact even though it would have caused some disruption:
1 quart = 1 liter exactly
1 inch = 2.5 cm exactly
Then 1 foot = 30 cm exactly. That is a convenient measure. I have heard that boards and such are sold in units of 120 cm because that number is evenly divisible by 2,3,4, and 6. So that would be a 4′ board.
Maybe make a mile exactly 1.5 km.
Pound = 0.5 kg exactly
Most of our “traditional” units were ultimately based on Roman measures, but other cultures have some traditional units that are fairly close, probably because the ancient units are scaled to humans, particularly the length units. Fahrenheit is also scaled to the human body, since 100 is close to body temperature and 0 is about as cold as we can tolerate fairly safely.
Taken4Granite
@Eyeroller: The measurement units we use in the US are already defined in terms of metric equivalents. If we convert to the system you are proposing we would have to go through a process as disruptive as biting the bullet and converting to the metric system.
There are, nonetheless, workarounds of this sort in other countries. In Germany they call 500 grams a pfund, which is cognate with pound. That weight is about 10% larger than our pound. Similarly, the metric ton (1000 kg) is close enough to the standard ton (2000 lb) and even closer to the so-called long ton (2240 lb, IIRC), which is why 1000 kg is generally called a ton rather than a megagram (which is what it would be called if you adhered to the SI standard).
As for Celsius temperatures, there is a mnemonic poem:
30 is warm
20 is nice
10 is cool
0 is ice
Ruckus
@Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony:
You can’t hear me but I’m clapping over this.
(OK yes I’m currently typing – get over it)
It is hard to change the minds of groups of people and the bigger the group, the harder it is. It takes a very good, rational reason, well presented or a lot of something in it for the most individuals.
geg6
@Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony:
Hey, hey, hey there! I love my Jetta SEL and I’m no fucking hippie. I’m a punk.
Ruckus
@Sister Golden Bear:
I always treated my customers in Mexico as any other customer, very happy that they wanted to spend thousands of dollars to have me make them tools to use to create products that their customers could use. My experience is that Mexico is a pretty good place and it’s citizens are human, like every other country I’ve been to. It’s different than here but then so are a lot of countries, including the one’s I’ve visited and even a lot of states in this one. We have one thing in common – we are all humans. Of every description, disposition, education, history, positive and negative traits, desires and needs. The difference today is that it is far easier to communicate over extreme distances, to have discussions, to learn about many people in many countries – and OK that’s enough….
Chris
@Kay:
“Number of weeks” was always the media, and the supposedly clever people who think their pundits are deep thinkers, applying their beloved “one person says one thing, one person says another thing, so clearly the answer is something in between.” Some things don’t have a clever middle ground compromise. Slavery didn’t, and this doesn’t either.
Sister Golden Bear
FWIW, there’s a one weird trick solution to the tricky 5/9ths and 9/5 math involved in converting between Fahrenheit to Celsius and vice versa.
For Fahrenheit to Celsius, subtract 32, add 10%, then divide by 2.
For Celsius to Fahrenheit, double the Celsius temperate, then subtract 10% then add 32.
It’s not precisely accurate, but usually it’s within a 0.5 degree.
Paul in KY
@Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony: Hey man, like don’t forget Volvo!
Paul in KY
@Chris: Hitler did it by conscripting all the criminals into the Wehrmacht.
Edit: Oh, and murdering a bunch too!
FelonyGovt
@Sister Golden Bear: For a really rough Celsius to Fahrenheit conversion, I use “double it and add 30”. Good for, for example, deciding how warm to dress.
artem1s
OMG here come the ‘NAFTA IS TOTES RUINING THE COUNTRY’ whinging from the usual suspects. Never mind that they effectively killed it over 20 years ago (notice that’s the last time Mexican imports exceeded China’s). But hey, maybe not as the Do Nothing House GOPers are doing their best to not draw attention to things crossing the border right now. Thanks Speaker Johnson.
sab
@Dorothy A. Winsor: We learned that in elementary school in the 1960s. I have forgotten how to do the conversions.
RevRick
@wjca: Fortunately, MAGA doesn’t read Balloon Juice, well maybe alwayssore, but he just wants to troll. Our secret is safe.
sab
@Betty Cracker: Do the inhabitants of rest of the western hemisphere really care that only we call ourselves after an Italian cartographer?
Nellie
China is shipping to Mexico to avoid the tariffs, and Mexico is sending the stuff here. It’s nice that Mexico is getting a cut, it doesn’t mean that there’s an increase in manufacturing in Mexico.
sab
@NotMax: I used to have one of those. I bought it in Ohio (without air conditioning) then moved it to Nevada.
It was actually a Mitsubishi so parts were indeed a problem. Its odometer cable wore out and couldn’t be replaced. The car ran fine still but it couldn’t pass inspection.
Timill
@sab: I recently (in the last decade or so) came across a hypothesis that ‘America’ is actually an Italo-Latinization derivation from Markland, the Viking name for ‘that country over there to the West next to Vinland’
Basically, going from ‘Mark’ to ‘Marik’ to ‘Amerika’
Not sure I believe it, but it’s more plausible than “named for Vespucci’s first name”.
Ruckus
@eclare:
How much does a Ford F150 or a Chevy Silverado cost?
An F150 XLT is the second up lists at $42,000 and a Silverado HD is also second up line and $43,400.
Those are the ones that people buy for themselves the bottom of the line is what companies buy for work trucks and is less. And sure that’s list price, they likely can be bought for slightly less……
sab
@Timill: That’s interesting. Detracts a bit from Columbus though.
Chris
@sab:
I don’t think Ohio has anything to do with it.
JimV
Since you asked, my thoughts are that soon after NAFTA, Welch started moving GE factories to Mexico and shutting them down in the USA. So I suspect a lot of stuff we are buying used to be made in the USA.
(The GE Schenectady plant had 28,000 employees when I started there in 1968, and 4,000 when I left in 2003.)
wjca
Last I heard, bad mouthing Columbus is now required to be properly woke.
Timill
@sab: Columbus was still the one with the publicity machine, getting the word out about this New World.
YY_Sima Qian
PRC exports to countries such as Mexico & Vietnam has risen very much in line w/ their rising exports to the US. What all of the efforts at “near shoring” & “friend shoring” is accomplishing is moving some of the final stage assembly (the step w/ the least value add) from the PRC to these other low cost countries, but the goods they assemble still have huge amount of PRC content (along w/ that from around the world). Dependence on the PRC has not meaningfully decreased, but the global supply chains become more complex, more opaque & more brittle, rather than more resilient. (It used to be that a major event affecting large parts of the PRC, such as the nationwide lockdowns at the onset of the Pandemic, is required to significantly disrupt global supply. Now, such an event, or one in Vietnam, or one in Mexico, could shut down supply.)
Furthermore, the new trade patterns are increasing these Global South countries’ dependencies on the PRC, & pulling them more tightly into the Sinocentric global supply chain network. Chinese companies, such as the EV makers, are setting up factories in Mexico to sell into the US market, since US domestic politics is such that any company w/ any PRC connection viewed w/ paranoia (so no direct investments, no JV, even tech licensing to US companies are politically fraught). The same is happening across SE Asia, as well.
Meanwhile, the PRC share of global manufacturing value added continues to march up, in spite of the rising labor/operating costs & the efforts by Western countries to “de-risk”, it is as large as the US & the EU combined.
This was entirely foreseeable, & predicted by many experts on international trade. One can only fight economic gravity by so much. The hope (by those who advocate such a course of action) is that eventually the countries that are getting low value added final stage assembly now can build up their manufacturing strength & start to take away market share from the PRC some time in the future. However, that eventuality could be decades away, if it ever materializes. It is very difficult for countries such as Mexico & Vietnam to complete w/ the PRC in terms of economy of scale (since they lack the internal markets), scale of government support, & qty. of human resources. It is very likely that Chinese companies will be taking market share away from Western incumbents at the medium to high end (where the value added is concentrated) faster than Vietnam/Mexico can take away market share from Chinese incumbents in the low end.
Chris T.
@trollhattan: Dead thread, but:
Fisker (with an E); Fiskar, with the A, is the scissor company. Fisker-with-E is the guy who designed some of the most iconic James Bond movie cars.
Paul in KY
@sab: Thank God his 1st name wasn’t Scumbaggio.
Paul in KY
@Chris T.: Figured it out after I used Fisker, but with the ‘a’ and then googled the car.