Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Every day Vance writes another chapter in the book called “Worst VP Pick Ever”.

The republican caucus is covering themselves with something, and it’s not glory.

Let’s finish the job.

I’m just a talker, trying to find a channel!

We cannot abandon the truth and remain a free nation.

Russia bombs Ukraine’s maternity hospitals; Republicans in the House can’t sort out supporting Ukraine.

One of our two political parties is a cult whose leader admires Vladimir Putin.

I am pretty sure Katy Tur wasn’t always such a bootlicking sycophant.

Republicans don’t want a speaker to lead them; they want a hostage.

Republicans don’t trust women.

Roe isn’t about choice, it’s about freedom.

The problem people have with Biden’s age is the color of the VPs skin.

You are so fucked. Still, I wish you the best of luck.

Compromise? There is no middle ground between a firefighter and an arsonist.

Books are my comfort food!

The US Supreme Court is on the ballot in november.

It’s a good piece. click on over. but then come back!!

Republicans do not pay their debts.

Joe Biden can go out like FDR, not by dying in office, but by crushing the fascists.

Seems like a complicated subject, have you tried yelling at it?

Republican also-rans: four mules fighting over a turnip.

Putin dreamed of ending NATO, and now it’s Finnish-ed.

Come on, man.

American History and Black History can not be separated.

You are here: Home / Open Threads / Say It (Over and Over Again)

Say It (Over and Over Again)

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This post is in: 

I was browsing for a podcast to listen to at the gym and this turd popped up in my feed:

Say It, Over and Over Again

This is his second week on this fantasy topic.  I’ll help Ezra out with a few pictures showing how it would work.  One possibility:

Say It, Over and Over Again 1

Here’s another:

Say It, Over and Over Again 2

At this moment, the top two stories on the NYT’s website are about China and AI, and the possibility of a Russian nuclear weapon going into orbit.  At the Post, we have Trump’s plan for militarized mass deportation of immigrants,[gift link] and the death of a non-binary 16-year-old after bullying in Oklahoma [gift link].  One of these papers captures the moment we’re in.  The other is spending time on bullshit (China’s behind on AI – unsurprising and not top of front page material IMO.  Pure, unadulterated speculation on Russia’s nuclear activity – again, not  top of front page material.) Ezra has clearly internalized his role in the wank-industrial complex.

Reader Interactions

209Comments

  3. 3.

    RaflW

    Open thread about presidential candidates? OK. Nikki Haley has apparently come down on the side of the Alabama Supremes, that IVF embryos are ‘babies’.

    So it seems it will now be GOP standard issue policy to say to couples struggling to conceive: tough luck, G-d’s plan didn’t include laboratories so it’s not available to you. And we’re going to make it unavailable to everyone, not just our fellow conservative Xtians.

    I don’t understand how the GOP doesn’t have like 1/4th of Congress or less, and damn few legislatures.

    (Or second thought, I do. I just shake my head in horrified resignation.)

  4. 4.

    steve g

    You just have to be able to imagine Joe Biden, 36 years as a senator, 8 years as a vice president, listening to Ezra Klein, a podcaster, for advice, and then taking that advice.

    Lol. Lol, lol, lol, lol, lol.

  7. 7.

    sab

    Joe Biden has got this, so the wonkier pundits are trying to both sides the brokered convention idea.

    Ezra Klein was really good pre-Obama care. Sigh.

  9. 9.

    RaflW

    @smith: She may have had artificial insemination rather than IVF?

    Still, she’s a God bothering hypocrite if she used medically assisted means but wants to limit them for others. ie: par for the course.

  10. 10.

    smith

    FTFNYT put China an AI on the front page and the Smirnov Russian op on page A16. But Biden is still old, so we can count ourselves well-informed , I guess.

  11. 11.

    Villago Delenda Est

    Ezra needs to check into an asylum because his public sharing of utter fantasy passed off as “punditry” is simply not sane.

  12. 12.

    Raven

    @RaflW: “Embryos, to me, are babies,” Haley told NBC News in an interview, adding that she used artificial insemination to have her son, a different process than IVF which doesn’t present the same complexities around creating embryos in a lab. “When you talk about an embryo, you are talking about, to me, that’s a life. And so I do see where that’s coming from when they talk about that.”

  15. 15.

    Anyway

    Is Ezra getting eviscerated in comments? Do podcasts have comments? I’ve heard NYT sometimes does allow comments for “controversial” columns.

  16. 16.

    rikyrah

    Isn’t it interesting that all of these folks posting this ridiculous nonsense never ever ONCE mentions the ACTUAL VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES!

     

    Uh huh

    Uh huh

  18. 18.

    geg6

    Forget this asshole.  Better to listen to Josh’s TPM podcast where he eviscerates Klein’s idiocy.

  19. 19.

    rikyrah

    They do not hide their plans. Listening to this demon, and Ezra thinks we should humor him and his clowning?

     

    Biden-Harris HQ (@BidenHQ) posted at 11:02 AM on Wed, Feb 21, 2024:
    GOP Rep. Waltz gleefully talks about Trump’s plan for mass detention camps and rounding up millions of Latinos: That’s the population of Alaska, North Dakota, South Dakota, and Vermont to be completely cleaned out! https://t.co/sSDQalLuYx
    (https://x.com/BidenHQ/status/1760349184631185449?s=03)

  20. 20.

    smith

    @rikyrah: In their fantasies she gracefully steps aside for a youngish white dude who is obviously more qualified. No need to explain what those qualifications are.

  21. 21.

    kindness

    Ezra is buttering his bread and it isn’t our bread.  He’s become another Village Elder who is above we, the commoners

    @Raven: Republicans haven’t gotten to the ‘Every sperm is sacred’ part yet (h/t Monty Python), but I won’t bet against them not going there.

  22. 22.

    Will

    It has been funny to see all these number and stats guys from 00s/Obama Era, such as Ezra & Nate Silver, have mostly abandoned the numbers for hot take pieces.

  23. 23.

    JML

    Josh Marshall nailed Klein pretty thoroughly, I thought. The “open convention” would turn into a total shit-show as issues like Gaza, Medicare for All, and more would turn into a pie-fight on national TV. You’d have literally people screaming at each other and making the $#@*%* GOP look competent and acceptable. As if anyone is going to be able to control delegates once their candidate “released” them. After one day of the disaster it would turn into (having been through more than a few convention fights, I can tell you there would be a total break down in the first hours as people would lose their minds over the rules, space allocation, speaking time, and more let alone getting to an actual candidate and a platform.) people would be begging Joe Biden to rise up and save the Democratic Party.

    This only “works” in the ivory tower fever dreams of media bobos who presume to speak for the people but don’t actually talk to any of them. The media would love the circus. Everyone else would hate it, even if they would still watch. People gawk at car accidents too, it doesn’t mean they want one.

    And who exactly do they think would emerge as the candidate, anyways? notice they never actually have a name?

    I also hope people keep calling out clowns like this and demand they say what they really mean about Kamala Harris: that they think she’s too black and too female to be president. because that’s what they’re saying when they keep repeating these ideas that Kamala can’t be the candidate as they hide behind unnamed “Democratic consultants”.

  24. 24.

    JML

    @Will: yep. because someone like Silver had one trick (and it was a good one…for the time) and don’t actually have another idea.

  28. 28.

    Lyrebird

    @rikyrah:

    Uh huh inDEED.

     

    And thank you OP! I am glad that the Post front paged that awful killing of somebody’s baby.  Somebody’s grandbaby.  With way more style than a spirochete.  I hope people are protecting and caring for the bereaved Grandma and otherwise raising holy hell.

  29. 29.

    WaterGirl

    @geg6: I haven’t been able to listen to most of Josh’s podcasts lately, same with Pod Save America, because they all seem to have to talk about Joe Biden is old.

    Our side is contributing to that narrative, and it makes me crazy.

  30. 30.

    jackmac

    I realize the topic is Ezra Klein and his desire for an open Democratic Convention, but the thing that really got my attention is the WaPo story on militarized mass deportations and detention camps under a second Trump Administration.

    What happens when there is inevitable opposition, organized protests and even clashes over this policy, leading to the terrifying prospect of detention camps being used for political foes?

  31. 31.

    pat

    I believe a fertilized egg that has grown to a couple hundred cells is properly referred to as a zygote, not an embryo.  These a-holes are thinking that the thing resting in the freezer and then being implanted has arms and legs and a head…

  34. 34.

    justawriter

    Meanwhile the Lincoln Project group of fascists with better taste have come out with a way below the belt hit job on Trump using AI to have an image of Trump’s father berating his failure of a son. (apparently Trump accused the group of using AI so they said “why not?”)

    Waiting for the high minded liberals to start tut-tutting about mudslinging and such in 3 … 2 … 1 …

  36. 36.

    Kathleen

    @Anyway: He and Bro Favreau who signal boosted Klein’s xeet on his podcast and on Xeet, where the ratios were savage. So much that a wounded Favreau came back with “you guys really didn’t read or understand what I wrote.” Silly centrist Democrats. We don’t understand journalism, comedy or political analysis.

  37. 37.

    Marcopolo

    I suppose this is what you are getting at but when I first heard about the Klein Biden old/open convention shitcast my initial thought was, “this is something to get clicks.” No real relevance to reality, Klein, I think, is smart enough to know that and the only point in writing it is to raise his profile (i.e. not help in informing or increasing understanding of anything that might actually benefit the listener in their life).  Alas, that is where we are with so much media coverage & reporting nowadays.  So, yeah, fuck all the folks focusing on some asinine narrative to drive engagement.

  38. 38.

    Citizen Alan

    @jackmac:

    What happens when there is inevitable opposition, organized protests and even clashes over this policy, leading to the terrifying prospect of detention camps being used for political foes?

    I don’t think it would even take that long. Shitgibbon and his cultists are talking about invoking the Insurrection Act on the first day! I have no doubt that if the bastard gets back in, his very first act will be to have enough Dem Reps and Senators arrested on trumped up charges to give him a GOP house and a filibuster proof Senate majority.

  39. 39.

    Gretchen

    @RaflW: I know 5 people personally who needed IVF, and that’s just people I know well enough to be in their confidence about reproductive problems. Two of the IVF babies are in their 30s and starting families of their own. This is incredibly common and has been used for decades. Nikki knows the process involves destroying some embryos and doesn’t have the courage to own it.

  41. 41.

    Eyeroller

    @pat: Strictly speaking, a zygote is the single fertilized cell.  It completes its final meiotic division and does a few other housekeeping things, then starts dividing.  The ball of cells resulting is a morula, then subsequent stages are things like blastula, blastocyst, gastrula.  It generally is called an embryo once it implants, which seems to be around blastula stage.  Needless to say, at this point it doesn’t even have the shrimp-like appearance of what we think of as “embryos.”

    In general I have observed that many people have an understanding of biology that is roughly on par with what people believed around the 18th century.  It would not surprise me if they think there is something like a homunculus that just enlarges.

  42. 42.

    sab

    @Parfigliano: Thank you. And I wasn’t laughing at protecting kids.

    My comment #38 last thread was my position, but who cares.

    I don’t think Nikki Haley rises to my low standards of protecting medical personla privacy. Their os no privacy in Republicaan world if you even register to vote.

  46. 46.

    Gretchen

    @smith: She went round and round about you have to have good communication with your doctor. No, interviewer didn’t press her about the embryos which don’t look good.

  48. 48.

    Kay

    I love how he’s “earnest” so he has to pretend that his plan to have Party Insiders force the President and Vice President to step aside is somehow egalitarian. It’s just a matter of delegate rules. Okey doke.

    He basically wants Anita Dunn to execute a coup.

    You just know these assholes already have someone in mind they’d love to foist on Democratic voters – some horrible “consensus” centrist. Ugh.

  49. 49.

    geg6

    @WaterGirl: ​
     
    I listen to Josh’s pod every week and he basically is making fun of the whole TOO OLD meme that the rest of the media are so happy to flog. He’s been doing the same for months on the website. He, like we all do, acknowledges that Biden is, yes, old. But also that it really doesn’t matter. I don’t listen to any other political podcasts, so I can’t speak to them. But you’re wrong about Josh.

  50. 50.

    Paul W

    @WaterGirl: TPM is not Biden is old, I find he and Kate are still in the sanity column and able to observe their industry without being caught in its worst tendencies (especially on this episode it is a must listen).

    The only thing Josh fixates one that I don’t know makes a measurable difference is saying over and over that Biden has to say EXACTLY “If we get back the House and keep the Senate we will get rid of filibuster to codify  Roe v Wade” – instead of “If we get back the House and keep the Senate we will … codify  Roe v Wade” which is what he is already saying and I don’t think most people will know the difference in the wider public.

  51. 51.

    Princess

    I think Ezra and Nate Silver look back to what they were writing in 2008 and think that *they* got Obama elected and are wistful and sad about losing that kind of power. They’re trying to recapture it. And maybe they’re having midlife crises and can’t get laid like they used to, and they project it all onto Biden. Anyway. Sure Ezra, let’s take the thing people inclined to vote Dem hated the most about the Dems in 2016 — the fear that Hillary was selected and promoted by some back room powerbrokers, and let’s institutionalize it for 2024. What could go wrong?

  52. 52.

    Kay

    This may be paranoid but I am now genuinely convinced the political media complex are trying to scuttle Joe Biden’s chances because Biden is liberal on economics, and that makes the Reagan babies too scared.

    This pile on is just fucking incredible. The ninnies are having another collective nervous breakdown.

  53. 53.

    rikyrah

    @jackmac:

    What happens when there is inevitable opposition, organized protests and even clashes over this policy, leading to the terrifying prospect of detention camps being used for political foes?

     

    They already told you …

    He’s going to pull the Insurrection Act and order the military to open fire.

  54. 54.

    Baud

    @Kay:

    IMHO Biden is feared by many because he represents all kinds of change. But the death is Reaganomics is definitely at the top of media’s minds.

  56. 56.

    VFX Lurker

    @sab: Ezra Klein was really good pre-Obama care. Sigh.

    Right?! Back then, he helped me understand the complexities of health care and the many different solutions around the world.

    Such a bummer to see him do this now.

  58. 58.

    Glidwrith

    @jackmac: ShitforBrains has already declared the Insurrection Act will be declared on Day 1 so the military will be mowing down us protesters.

    ETA: darn it rikyrah beat me to it, and reading upthread, several others.

  59. 59.

    rikyrah

    @Kay:

    This may be paranoid but I am now genuinely convinced the political media complex are trying to scuttle Joe Biden’s chances because Biden is liberal on economics, and that makes the Reagan babies too scared.

     

    Kay,

    it ain’t paranoid, if it’s THE TRUTH

     

    The full throated, absolute pushback against Reaganomics by Biden as WRONG..

    Along with the policy positions that he has taken, and his full throated support of Organized Labor?

    I thought it was obvious.

    A Democrat who says ‘ Phuck Reaganism and the horse it rode in on’

    AND, who has pushed POLICY positions that are WORKING?

    Oh yeah…they’re shook.

    You are not being paranoid.

  63. 63.

    Kay

    @Princess:

    I don’t think this is true of Klein, but IMO Nate Silver is one of the middle aged men who completely lost their minds because of BLM, Me Too and Covid. They just aren’t resilient, flexible people and there was too much change and stress in a short period of time and they all became reactionaries. They didn’t hold up in challenging times. They’re ninnies.

  65. 65.

    VFX Lurker

    @Baud: IMHO Biden is feared by many because he represents all kinds of change. But the death is Reaganomics is definitely at the top of media’s minds.

    Louder for folks in the back!!!

  66. 66.

    TBone

    “Instead of trying to regain a place in mainstream media, it has propaganda outlets. Instead of civil society institutions, it has the Proud Boys. Instead of lobbying efforts, it has direct action. Instead of electoral victories, it has post-election maneuvering. Instead of constitutional governing, it has a . . . more expansive view of executive power.”

    And, holy guacamole, see Will Bunch’s take on The Heritage Foundation xit at the end.

    https://digbysblog.net/2024/02/21/the-2020s-counterculture/

  67. 67.

    catclub

    @rikyrah: GOP Rep. Waltz gleefully talks about Trump’s plan for mass detention camps and rounding up millions of Latinos:

     

    Of course, many millions of them have been US citizens all their lives, and so were their grandparents, in Texas, NM and Arizona, and California.

  68. 68.

    BR

    That WaPo story is something that Dems need to be shouting about from the rooftops in immigrant communities. There’s been a significant erosion in Latino support for Biden/Dems over the last few years, but I can’t imagine that a renewed militarized “Operation Wetback” from Trump is going to go over well.

  69. 69.

    Villago Delenda Est

    @TBone: The Heritage Foundation and the Federalist Society both need to be annihilated if the Constitution is to survive.

  70. 70.

    catclub

    @Villago Delenda Est: That’s a shitty plan. The officer corps hates him. Most of the enlisted, too.

    The Federal government as employer and the US military even more so, is the most diverse it has ever been, and is more diverse than any other major employer.

  71. 71.

    gene108

    @jackmac:

    but the thing that really got my attention is the WaPo story on militarized mass deportations and detention camps under a second Trump Administration.

    What happens when there is inevitable opposition, organized protests and even clashes over this policy, leading to the terrifying prospect of detention camps being used for political foes?

    There are two trains of thought on detention camps being used against political foes of Donald Trump.

    1. It can’t happen here.
    2. It can happen here.

    The MSM and most of the public are in the former mindset.

  72. 72.

    TBone

    I got bored and went to see what’s cookin’ at a far lefty site today.  They’re making pretzels again, twisting long “theories” about Navalny being (1) a white nationalist and I don’t know about that but (2) he was encouraged by the CIA to return from Germany after his poisoning and has been a tool of the CIA and the West this whole time. And much, much more. Putin is completely innocent AND there were many Epstein comparisons made. It’s so sad I have to laugh, no choice.

  73. 73.

    WaterGirl

    @Kathleen:

    Which Favreau?  You said bro so I imagine Obama bros Favreau?

    That must have been one of the Pod Save Ameracs that I didn’t listen to because I could see they were going to talk about age.

  78. 78.

    rikyrah

    @gene108:

    There are two trains of thought on detention camps being used against political foes of Donald Trump.

    1. It can’t happen here.
    2. It can happen here.

    The MSM and most of the public are in the former mindset.

    They tore parents away from their children, and had basically no record system of either.

    THAT HAPPENED.

    We didn’t imagine that.

  79. 79.

    Princess

    @Kay: I don’t think it’s paranoid at all. Or if it is, come sit by me. NYT is very clearly giving attention and time to those reporters who will push their narrative. What I hate is seeing it echoed by my liberal friends.

  80. 80.

    scav

    It suddenly struck me that a real scary thing for them about Biden is that he’s an old white man that is comfortable with not only change (in fact working to produce it!) but he also comfortable working for and with women and minorities. Horrors!

  81. 81.

    WaterGirl

    @geg6: @Paul W:

    That’s good to know.  On any of my regular podcasts, I see the age thing listed as one of the subjects they are talking about and I don’t bother to listen.

    The age thing really sets me off, especially when it comes from our side.  Even when BJ peeps bring it up now, even mockingly, I cringe.

    Good to know that when Josh & company cover age it’s to mock the stupid.  Now I can happily listen to the one from last night. It had looked interesting, except for that, so I was sorry to be missing the rest.

  82. 82.

    Papa Boyle

    How long do I have to wait for the “Here’s How a Credible Actual News Reporting New York Times Would Work” episode?

    Should I hold my breath?

  83. 83.

    Princess

    @Kay: yeah, I agree. I don’t think Ezra has lost his mind but he does want to be important so he’s trying to push an angle the NYT will accept. His personal ambitions coincide with their story. Nate is just…awful. I loved it when he got fired and G Elliot Morris took his place — the two had been sparring on Twitter for a long time. Morris mostly sticks to numbers.

  86. 86.

    Jackie

    @smith:

    In their fantasies she gracefully steps aside for a youngish white dude who is obviously more qualified. No need to explain what those qualifications are.

    Let’s replace Harris with Pete Buttigieg!

    Correct complexion, correct plumbing… //

  87. 87.

    Gretchen

    Oops, I was wrong, she did say she had artificial insemination herself and then pivoted to IVF. Sorry.

  88. 88.

    SiubhanDuinne

    Just putting this down as a marker. I continue to believe there is a not-insignificant chance that TFG will not be the Republican nominee on Election Day 2024. And if he is, I think there’s a very strong chance he will not win the general election.

    I am not in any way attempting to predict what circumstance might keep his name off the ballot, nor whom the GOP might select as a replacement nominee. And I’m not even saying that it will happen, just that I won’t be a bit surprised if/when it does.

  89. 89.

    rikyrah

    @schrodingers_cat:

    @rikyrah: They didn’t let people with Greencards enter the country at various ports of entry.

     

     

     

    They began targeting CITIZENS AND STRIPPING THEM OF THEIR CITIZENSHIP

     

    I know you and I can’t be the only ones remembering those years.

     

  90. 90.

    rikyrah

    @Gretchen:

    Oops, I was wrong, she did say she had artificial insemination herself and then pivoted to vif. Sorry.

     

    Typical Republican.

    A child for her, but, the current desperate couples out there struggling with infertility – phuck you.

  92. 92.

    SiubhanDuinne

     

    @Jackie:

    Let’s replace Harris with Pete Buttigieg!

    Correct complexion, correct plumbing… //

     

    Incorrect marital status, though  //

  94. 94.

    Jeffro

    @smith:In their fantasies she gracefully steps aside for a youngish white dude who is obviously more qualified. No need to explain what those qualifications are.

    Hmmm…looks and thinks…just like Ezra Klein?

  95. 95.

    Gretchen

    @rikyrah: yep. And it’s maddening that reporters don’t press them about this stuff but just move on. What about the embryos that aren’t developing properly? Is it ok to discard them or do we have to implant them and wait for a miscarriage.
    U of Alabama is suspending its IVF program until courts sort this out. If you’re in the middle of an egg retrieval process and spent thousands of dollars, sucks to be you.

  97. 97.

    Kay

    @Princess:

    I think that whole group of middle aged male white liberals are not really comfortable or confident in being liberals – instead they want to be admired by conservatives, or the NYTimes, or really any other entity than the group they supposedly belong to.

    IMO this happens partly because they all live in liberal urban areas – they never really have to defend the ideas. I think I’m a stronger, more confident and better informed liberal because I’m surrounded by conservatives. I don’t care if they “like” me – I’m not seeking their approval.

    They’re just SO weak. The slightest wiff of “liberal over reaching” and they’re frantically pushing us back, hoping centrists and conservatives will be nice to them. It’s a mugs game.

  98. 98.

    Jeffro

    @Kay: [Klein] basically wants Anita Dunn to execute a coup.

    He’s going to have to take a number…this coup-thing is all the rage these days.

    // (did I do that right?)

    lefty trolls trying to get Biden to step down are also inherently asking Harris to step down, and that’s exactly where this shit goes right off the rails.

    They need to shut up, work harder to talk about the administration’s monumental successes, and have some faith.  Barring that, they just need to shut up.

  103. 103.

    Jeffro

    @scav:It suddenly struck me that a real scary thing for them about Biden is that he’s an old white man that is comfortable with not only change (in fact working to produce it!) but he also comfortable working for and with women and minorities. Horrors!

    110%

    They use a lot of words to avoid saying ‘race/gender/class traitor’, but it’s definitely part of the anti-Biden pile-on

  105. 105.

    rikyrah

    @Kay:

    IMO this happens partly because they all live in liberal urban areas – they never really have to defend the ideas. I think I’m a stronger, more confident and better informed liberal because I’m surrounded by conservatives. I don’t care if they “like” me – I’m not seeking their approval.

     

    They are awful human beings. I mean, awful.

    There isn’t anything to admire in right-wing folk.

    Nothing.

    So, why would I care what they think of me?

  106. 106.

    Baud

    @Kay:

    Yeah, it seems that way.

    My theory has been there’s this whole cohort of people, mostly but not entirely white dudes, who pictured themselves as liberal aristocracy, and can’t understand why that isn’t so.

  109. 109.

    cain

    @rikyrah: I remember – and it was the most scariest shit I’ve ever seen along with separating kids from their parents. Absolutely horrific shit.

    I can’t imagine that people have forgotten that – I hope they remember and vote.

  111. 111.

    Captain C

    @JML:

    a pie-fight on national TV.

    Which seems to be what the nihilistic extremists on both sides want for their conventions.  So far, only the Republicans have been taken over by such, and fully.

    media bobos who presume to speak for the people but don’t actually talk to any of them.

    “I SPEAK FOR THE PEOPLE!!!”

    “Which people?”

    “ALL THE PEOPLE!!!”

    “Um, do they know this?”

  112. 112.

    Gretchen

    @Princess: Nate has turned horrible about covid. He obviously hasn’t taken a biology class since high school and knows nothing about viral genomes but  he’s sure he knows more than the experts about covid origins. The virologists go down the ton of evidence about natural origin, but he knows there’s a virus lab in Wuhan. What about that? Huh? Huh? Sure, it’s miles away and across a river and none of the early cases were anywhere near there, but he’s sure that’s where it came from.

  114. 114.

    FelonyGovt

    @Gretchen: Maybe reporters don’t push back on this more because it’s perceived as just another “women’s issue” that they can’t be bothered to know or care about.

  115. 115.

    sab

    @Kay: My stepson approves. He is bright and a lefty but works in a machine shop in a blue city. His co-workers mostly are not lefties because they are idiots. All they want is to protect their big trucks. (Their government doesn’t care. It’s their bank that does.) He is still a leftie. though. He spends some of every day trying to convince them. I think he is a keeper for us. He thinks and he asks about things.

  116. 116.

    KrackenJack

    IVF clinics fertilize as many eggs as they can to maximize the chances of success and reduce the number of extractions. Now thousands of those eggs in AL are effectively immortal. They can’t be disposed of and there is no chance they will ever be implanted.

    I assume clinics in all states have to be wondering what to do with stored zygotes and going to one egg per attempt in case the USSC goes even crazier.

  117. 117.

    Kay

    @Princess:

    I would go further. I think there’s a whole group of white male liberals who are not really comfortable being liberal because they’re not really cofortable being allied with us, or being in a coalition with us – with “us” being women, or people of color, or other liberals.

    Remember the pundity guy who wrote the essay about how the Womens March embarrassed him because he identifies as liberal? As if the important part of the Womens March is what is says about his personal coolness and sense of himself? Thats what I’m talking about. We’re a club they don’t want to be a member of.

  118. 118.

    karen marie

    While getting back in my car after a visit to Trader Joe’s, I was approached by a young black man soliciting signatures to get a candidate “on the ballot.”  Which ballot, I don’t know – can’t be the primary because ballots are in the mail.  He did everything he could to get me to sign without telling me who the candidate is, because he knows people aren’t going to sign once he does.

    The candidate is RFK.

    I was shocked to see a young black man who should know better willing to take money from Republican rat-fuckers.  Where is his mama?

    He gets $7/signature.

  119. 119.

    Captain C

    @rikyrah:

    They are awful human beings. I mean, awful.

    There isn’t anything to admire in right-wing folk.

    Nothing.

    So, why would I care what they think of me?

    The only reason to even take them seriously is for purposes of threat assessment.  If they liked me, I’d wonder what I was doing wrong.

  120. 120.

    Kay

    @Princess:

    So Ezra Klein is a Democrat and supporting the old, wrinkly decidely uncool President is not how Ezra Klein sees himself, so the President has to give way so Klein won’t have to be associated with him.

    They’re Democrats and liberals who hate Democrats and liberals.

  122. 122.

    RaflW

    @Kay: Our own Tom Levenson eight hours ago on Bsky:

    Why does the NYT so want to get rid of Biden?

    It ain’t because he’s old.

    It’s because he is good at his job in ways that demonstrate how much of the center-right political consensus—for which @nytimes.com is the house organ—is wrong.

    Also: if there’s a D trifecta in 2025, Sulzberger’s taxes go up

    To which I added

    Biden does break the horrible consensus that austerity fixes anything, and which wrecked at least 1.5 generations of western economic possibilities.

    So, yes, the NYT wants to protect decades of neoliberalism that grows the wealth divide, punishes the poors, and limits the size of meddling government (even if Bidenomics does deliver a good stock market and low unemployment!).

  125. 125.

    schrodingers_cat

    @RaflW: NYT wants to protect white mediocrity. There are several people who I follow on Twitter or even here in the BJ comment section who can come up with better political analysis than Klein. And yet he has this op-ed perch based on what achievement exactly? That he went to the right schools and was in the right peer group

    BTW  how was Reagan’s run for office treated when he ran the second time?

  126. 126.

    Sloegin

    Never assume idiocy or naivety in political punditry.  Klein could easily be looking at a big fat ‘no labels’ check with his name on it.  It’s *much* easier (and more accurate) these days to assume enemy action first, general stupidity second.

  127. 127.

    Jackie

    @SiubhanDuinne: True,

    Incorrect marital status, though  //

    But, the rest is which would be more palatable to conservatives?🤔

    IF faced with the choice? I’m gonna say Buttigieg. ANY MALE is better than “That Woman.”

    It’s going to be interesting to see see if TIFG chooses Scott – unmarried black man, or a woman, or… I’ve seen Vivek’s name floated.

  128. 128.

    RaflW

    @Kay: “They’re Democrats and liberals who hate Democrats and liberals.”

    They’re also Democrats and liberals who think by dint of their position in society (and their skin color and plumbing) they won’t pay a price for living under a Republican authoritarian regime.

    I think they’re absolute blinkered idiots for thinking they’re safe, but it seems so far to be impossible to budge them from their sense of separateness from the catastrophe that could be coming.

  129. 129.

    Frankensteinbeck

    I don’t know what is going to happen with the media when Biden is actually nominated, presumably at the same time as Trump.  The whole ‘Biden is old’ thing is part of a framing like Klein’s, that somehow Biden might not be the nominee.  ‘Biden is old’ is a primary rather than general election argument.  They’re running in a fantasy world, selling this fantasy world to the public where it’s not Biden vs Trump, and a lot of the public are making decisions based on this fantasy world.

    That’s all going to come crashing down for them.  When everyone knows it’s Biden vs Trump, period, no fantasy football league, 3/4ths of their schtick won’t work anymore.

  130. 130.

    RaflW

    @Jackie: Scott is engaged to be married. I have several very uncharitable assumptions about all that. But he is tap dancing as fast as he can to be Don’s sidekick.

  132. 132.

    NotMax

    Whoops.

    Google has apologized for what it describes as “inaccuracies in some historical image generation depictions” with its Gemini AI tool, saying its attempts at creating a “wide range” of results missed the mark. The statement follows criticism that it depicted specific white figures (like the US Founding Fathers) or groups like Nazi-era German soldiers as people of color, possibly as an overcorrection to long-standing racial bias problems in AI. Source

  134. 134.

    Elizabelle

    Shall we start calling it Wank the Wanking NY Times?

    Because something can be “fucking good.”

    “Wanking” does not work in that context.

    And spell it out.  It will get back to them.

  137. 137.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @zhena gogolia:

    When they say “Biden is old!” we go “What about Trump?”  They can completely evade that question right now, because they’re not talking about Biden vs Trump, they’re talking about Biden vs Fantasy Democrat.  No matter how they try to ignore “What about Trump?” when the general comes someone is going to ask it to their face.  Often.  It’s a whole different environment.

  138. 138.

    Baud

    Dems are always complaining that Dems aren’t tough like Republicans. But when Biden gives the media the back of the hand about the age thing like any Republican would, half of us piss their pants. It’s frustrating.

  139. 139.

    TBone

    Froomkin xit:

    “The one day there actually should be a Hunter Biden story on the NYT homepage: bupkus.”

    Also, Alexander Smirnov has been released on bond in Nevada.

  146. 146.

    Ohio Mom

    @geg6: I can’t help comparing Ezra and Josh Marshall. They both started blogging around the same time and I read both of them back then, and Matt Yglesias too. Nowadays, of the three of them, I only follow Josh.

    My memory is that Josh is a little older, my impression is that he was working on a PhD while the other two were in undergraduate school.

    I think what we are seeing now is the difference in their backgrounds. Josh refers to himself as a “lapsed historian” but I think being grounded in that field has given him a depth that those other two just don’t have.

    They have basically turned into trolls because after coasting for twenty years, that’s all that is left to do.

  152. 152.

    Jay

    @Gretchen:

    Smirnoff is safe on bail, because he’s going to jump bail first chance he gets.

    The FSB isn’t going to “hunt him down”, because they knew he was a pathological liar, loaded him up, and suckered the FBI, DOJ and a dozen Rethugs, for years. He did his job well.

    He will get a medal, a new job, probably on a RTV “opinion” show cross chair from Tucker and Ritter, and a State pension.

  153. 153.

    TBone

    @Jay: I’m not so certain any handlers will want him to testify to anything. He connected himself to international assassination squads.  He may have been set loose ROR on purpose.  My understanding of ROR does not involve bail.

  161. 161.

    Citizen Alan

    @scav: I never thought of it like that, but in the same way that FDR was viewed as a class traitor, I guess es Biden is a race and gender traitor.

  167. 167.

    Princess

    @Kay: I love Obama but I’ve got to say, his campaign team and WH were very bro-y. (And look where they are now.) (And tbh I have hated some of  his humor over the years at Michelle’s expense — real passive aggressive henpecked husband nonsense.) Some women but not a lot. Bernie’s team was even worse until he got dinged for it and made Symone Sanders his public face. Hillary’s WH would have been revolutionary. Biden has, I think been good. Harris helps a ton of course.

  168. 168.

    Jay

    @TBone:

    Let’s see,

    the sawdust is out,

    the Chinese spy is out,

    the ruZZian spy is out,

    the Ukrainian fugitives are out, as they all fled to ruZZia or are under arrest for treason in Ukraine,

    Joe Biden’s brother is out,

    the laptop is out,

    the dick picks are out,

    Hunter Biden is out,

    Hunter Biden’s business associates are out for pantsing the “Commitee”,

    My guess is somebody from LakeLawn, it’s the closest manditory psyc facility to Comer’s “home”

    Maybe an unhoused person from downtown DC?

    Maybe the guy encountered collecting ballot signatures for RFK Jr at $7 a pop?

  169. 169.

    Citizen Alan

    @Jackie: I will be utterly shocked if Shitgibbon picks a person of color as his running mate.  I do not believe he is capable of suppressing his seething hatred of blacks to that degree. Maybe if Tim Scott literally, physically groveled at his feet while calling him “Massah” or something, but even that is a stretch to me.

  174. 174.

    Jay

    @NotMax:

    well, the dick picks are out, they have been shown on CSPAN, and many press photo’s, but while they are out, they are out as evidence, because MTG now clutches them to her heart out of loneliness, and of course, there was no collaborating evidence that they were of Hunter’s dick, or even Hunter’s Collection of Other People’ s Dick Pic’s because of chain of custody on the alledged “Hunter Biden Laptop”, and it’s not illegal to have consentual dick picks.

  175. 175.

    wjca

    @Jackie: Let’s replace Harris with Pete Buttigieg!

    Correct complexion, correct plumbing… //

    ROTFLOL!!!

    Give Pete the State Department for the next 4 years (to round out his resume).  Then go with Harris-Buttigieg in 2028.  And watch heads explode!

  176. 176.

    NotMax

    @Jay

    It has zero to do with evidence or legality. Never has been. It’s 100% titillation, sensationalism and innuendo.

  177. 177.

    Dan B

    @Jackie: I don’t believe that conservatives see Pete as a man.  Hay men have been called sissies for many years.  We know the derivation of the term sissy.  There are other terms in the same vein.  Pete  might rate a tiny notch above a woman but I’m not holding my breath.

  178. 178.

    RSA

    Open thread topic: Conservative newspapers censor a Doonesbury strip about censorship.

    You’d better not joke about Florida censoring speech that goes against their preferred narrative, or else Florida newspapers will censor your joke… This past Sunday, many readers whose regional newspapers are owned by the multi-billion dollar, conservative-leaning mass media holding company Gannett flipped to the funny pages to find that Doonesbury was conspicuously missing from its usual position in the printing.

  179. 179.

    citizen dave

    Well Inside Edition just “covered” (or whatever they do) the replace Biden story, but said it’s a right wing fascination at the moment, and they played Joe Rogan talking about Gavin Newsom being the guy picked in August at the convention.

    Saw Haley on the news, coupled with the clip of trump asking/mocking why her husband wasn’t around.  I’ll never understand why the target–Haley in this case–just doesn’t go fucking ballistic on trump day after day until he HAS to apologize in some weak form.  Instead she reacts by saying her and her husband can handle it, but the military should be off limits, and trump is taking a shot at at all of them.

    Third, if embryos are people, then every time a woman miscarries one, is that murder?

  180. 180.

    wjca

    @Jackie: It’s going to be interesting to see see if TIFG chooses Scott – unmarried black man, or a woman, or… I’ve seen Vivek’s name floated.

    Today’s fundraising text for TIFG claims to be a poll about who he should pick for VP. The man can monetize anything.  And find marks to pay for it.

    I’m guessing that topping the poll will be the kiss of death — can’t have anyone who might be popular in his own right on the ticket.

  181. 181.

    Jay

    @NotMax:

    it’s supposed to be, but instead of the 3 breasted woman, or the amazing monkey boy, we are getting 7 ReThug clowns, the FBI and the DOJ stuck in a Yugo, trapped in the Center Ring,  unable to get out because they don’t know how to work a late 1970’s econocar door handle.

    Really, Smirnoff? Is Rasputin still dead? Arn’t there some claimants to the Romanoff Dynasty still out there conning that can testify?

  182. 182.

    Kay

    I had someone tell me today they have “a wedding officiant business, small”

    I can’t stop thinking about it. How many weddings could they do in my area? Would this even be worthwhile? They only need you for an hour, tops, and the travel to and fro, dressing up, etc.

  183. 183.

    Jackie

    @RaflW: Is Scott’s engagement a real engagement or just a political deflection so he’s not questioned about his life long bachelorhood and possible sexual orientation?

    I couldn’t care less, but then I’m not a hypercritical conservative.

  184. 184.

    Jinchi

    @Jackie: ​
     I’ve seen Vivek’s name floated.

    I think Vivek enjoys being the center of attention too much. Trump wants a sycophant who can blend in with the furniture.

  185. 185.

    NotMax

    @wjca

    Exercise in futility but my (imaginary) money’s still on Pompeo.

    Bland, subservient, stays mostly in the shadows, heartland roots and a known quantity in D.C. circles.

  187. 187.

    Jinchi

    @Jackie: ​
    I think Trump would get along better with Tim Scott than he ever did with Pence. Scott will at least pretend he wants to spend time alone in the same room with an attractive woman.

  188. 188.

    Jay

    @Kay:

    Back in the day, got married in the upper meadow. 4 of us, me, her,  2 witnesses, plus the officiant. T and Dave walked up, with the dogs, I drove the Officiant and Dave’s wife Vikki up.

    $250,

    plus BBQ ribs, grilled asparagus, baked potatoes and apple/blackberry pie when we got down.

    I think most of them do it because they like weddings.

  189. 189.

    Jinchi

    @citizen dave: ​
     Third, if embryos are people, then every time a woman miscarries one, is that murder?

    Probably.

    I’m also curious about the implications for people who’ve already started IVF. It’s arguable that the woman should be compelled to carry each of the embryos to term.

    So maybe a commitment to a dozen kids…

    I guess we’ll have to ask the Alabama court.

  192. 192.

    Gretchen

    @Kay: My daughter hired a person with a wedding officiant business to do her wedding. She helped plan the ceremony too, so maybe 3-4 hours? I’m guessing she had other sources of income too.

  194. 194.

    geg6

    @Ohio Mom:

    Exactly right.  Josh has wide interest and knowledge about the past that informs his analysis of the present.  Ever see the reading list he periodically posts about?  The stuff that he’s read recently and is recommending?  It is mostly very serious histories of diverse subjects.  I’ve plowed through a few that sounded interesting.  Good stuff, but it’s often like taking a college history class.  I minored in history so I recognize the academic style of writing.

  196. 196.

    geg6

    @Ksmiami:

    Hey now!  I was a poli sci major!  But I did minor in history.  A good and very interesting mix of complementary areas of study.

  197. 197.

    Jay

    @Jinchi:

    If frozen embryo’s are people, when does child support start?

    Does the van taking them to cryo get to use the carpool lane?

    Do they all get a share of the Estate?

  198. 198.

    TBone

    @Jay: according to the Fox shrews, it’s JAMES BIDEN who is the, and I quote, “connective tissue” tying the “Biden Family Brand” criming together.  The brother did it!  In the library! With the candlestick!

  199. 199.

    Chip Daniels

    I’m convinced pundits like Klein want Trump to win because it gives them the circus that puts money in tier pocket.

  200. 200.

    Jay

    @TBone:

    and yet, according to his actual testimony and evidence, not FAUX News huffing farts, he’s not even a character in the game of Clue that they are trying to play.

  201. 201.

    Jinchi

    @Jay: ​
     Does the van taking them to cryo get to use the carpool lane?

    A pregnant Texas woman literally tried that defense to get out of a ticket a few years back. Unfortunately for her, the judge wasn’t on the Alabama SC.

  202. 202.

    Citizen Alan

    @citizen dave:

     if embryos are people, then every time a woman miscarries one, is that murder?

    Yes. If a fetus is a child from the moment of conception and a miscarriage can possibly be attributed to some action by the mother, then she killed her own child through, at a minimum, an act of negligent homicide.

    I genuinely expect them to start forcing women to take fertility meds to increase the likelihood that late periods will turn into “babieezzz.”

  203. 203.

    artem1s

    I’ll help Ezra out with a few pictures showing how it would work.

    I appreciate the circular firing squad reference, but personally would have gone with
    Slim Pickens saving the Democratic Party via detonating a doomsday device.

  207. 207.

    nasruddin

    Hmm.  There’s some good in the 2 Ezra shows.  First, it is useful to think about contingencies.  Bad things can happen to anybody, a candidate might have an issue on the way to the convention … or even after it and have to be replaced.

    We really need to have a plan B.  Donald Trump is not, say, George Bush I.

    So their exercise in trying to game out what a convention would be like under various circumstances is useful.

    The 2nd thing I thought was useful was a tangent early in podcast #2 where they discussed quality control – the current parties, neither one, really do not do that, but in the olden days like when Jack Kennedy was working his way thru the system the candidates to some extent had to sell themselves to various movers and shakers like Gov Lawrence of PA – there was some form of quality control, and would that there had been some of that in the Republican party in 2016.  Ok, I’m down with that.  I would like the parties to be stronger and filter out garbage.  Whether that worked in the past is a debatable matter but the point they worked over is  a good one.  I don’t see it being reinvented in 2-3 months in a national emergency but we do what we have to do when we have to do it.

    There are other things in those shows not so good but I thought these things were worth it.

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