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Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

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Disappointing to see gov. newsom with his finger to the wind.

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You are here: Home / Open Threads / This Is What Serious People Look Like When They Are Doing Their Jobs

This Is What Serious People Look Like When They Are Doing Their Jobs

by WaterGirl|  April 12, 202412:37 pm| 94 Comments

This post is in: Open Threads

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I submit this as a complement to TaMara’s Not Serious People thread.

Senator Sheldon Whitehouse at the hearing for Amy Coathanger Barrett

 

Plaintiffs should not be able to hand-pick individual judges to overturn laws they dislike.@SenSchumer, @SenWhitehouse, and I are leading a bill to codify the Judicial Conference’s new policy to curtail judge shopping in our federal courts and assign major cases at random.

— Senator Mazie Hirono (@maziehirono) April 11, 2024

.

Judge Shopping (verb): manipulating the justice system by filing a lawsuit in a district where your preferred judge will likely hear the case and rule in your favor.

When right-wing interests cherry-pick judges, they cherry-pick your freedoms.

This practice has got to end. https://t.co/iBQQgkmpHc

— Sheldon Whitehouse (@SenWhitehouse) April 11, 2024

.

For more on the Supreme Court’s phony fact-finding and what we can do about it, check out my latest law review article here: https://t.co/uHDBjgW7zU

— Sheldon Whitehouse (@SenWhitehouse) April 10, 2024

This is how it’s done.

Open thread.

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Reader Interactions

94Comments

  1. 1.

    Baud

    April 12, 2024 at 12:49 pm

    👍

  2. 2.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 12:55 pm

    ADORE.  This is what kindles my aspiration to stay in the fight!

  3. 3.

    New Deal democrat

    April 12, 2024 at 12:57 pm

    All well and good, but let me make my usual reminder that for any significant judicial reform, you need a trifecta of House, Senate, and Presidency all in Democratic Party hands; and also a majority of Senators willing to nuke the GOP filibuster.

    In other words, don’t hold your breath.

  4. 4.

    Anonymous At Work

    April 12, 2024 at 1:02 pm

    Democrats, if they gain a trifecta, should enlarge SCOTUS and enlarge the various Appellate Courts, in response to long-standing and bipartisan complaints about delays and the use of judicial legislative opinions citing “judicial economy” as a reason to deny claims.  They should also pass legislation to require all nationwide injunctions to go through the DC Circuit only.  It would consolidate case type, increase visibility of pending matters, and destroy judge-shopping for nationwide injunctions.

  5. 5.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 1:06 pm

    @New Deal democrat: facepalm.  WTF, over.  Progress isn’t bestowed under a pillow by the tooth fairy.

  6. 6.

    TaMara

    April 12, 2024 at 1:11 pm

    @TBone:  Keep this in your quiver…

    Climate scientist Michael E Mann & historian Timothy D Snyder  define doomerism:
    Doomerism is how we fail to fight for ourselves & one another.
    It is how authoritarians win. Let’s try to fight the doom.

     
    Works for all occasions.

  7. 7.

    TaMara

    April 12, 2024 at 1:12 pm

    @WaterGirl Love it!

  8. 8.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 1:13 pm

    @TaMara: 😘 you are in syncopation with my spirit animal

  9. 9.

    Geminid

    April 12, 2024 at 1:16 pm

    Vice President Kamala Harris is one of my favorite serious people, and it sounds like she intends to put a serious whupping on Donald Trump in Tucson today.

    This Arizona appearance was originally going to be about student debt relief, but then Arizona’s Supreme Court made its notorious decision reinstating a Civil War-era abortion ban. So now Harris has changed the subject and terms of her remarks. According to the NYT:

       Ms. Harris’s comments Friday may be some of the most direct and extended attacks that she has made against Trump on the [abortion] issue. While she has appeared frequently at events about abortion rights, she has often done so in her official capacity, limiting her ability to criticize Republicans. The event in Tucson, however, is a campaign rally, meaning Harris can speak more freely.

  10. 10.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 1:18 pm

    @Geminid: Kris Mayes (AZ Atty Gen) is being shown on MSNBC right now as an amplifier to VP Harris’s visit announcement.  They’re going hard on this, as we all should 💙

  11. 11.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 1:21 pm

    House just reauthorized FISA

  12. 12.

    Baud

    April 12, 2024 at 1:23 pm

    @TBone: Stand alone bill?

  13. 13.

    Anonymous At Work

    April 12, 2024 at 1:23 pm

    @TBone: The one pulled yesterday (with very mild reforms, like Midwestern ‘mild chili’) or a revised version with further reforms?

  14. 14.

    Urza

    April 12, 2024 at 1:25 pm

    Not to be a downer, but its not just Manchin and Sinema that were against filibuster and court reform.  There will be new preening peacocks given the chance, and they obviously don’t care about saving democracy if it means they don’t have reporters talking to them daily.

  15. 15.

    Tony Jay

    April 12, 2024 at 1:26 pm

    Being able to send all of your legal fuckery to a judge who is only in that post because the Right put them there for that exact reason is just as dangerous as being to appoint your own Police officers to jurisdictions where you want to be able to get away with crimes.

    Now that I write down, that doesn’t actually seem too far from the truth.

  16. 16.

    Anonymous At Work

    April 12, 2024 at 1:28 pm

    @Urza: There were a few oldsters behind the Preening Duo this go-around.  There will be fewer next term, regardless.  Things tend to advance “one funeral at a time,” per Planck.

  17. 17.

    Baud

    April 12, 2024 at 1:28 pm

    @Urza: I worry about that with abortion and voting rights, if we have a trifecta.  I think we should ditch the filibuster completely, but we need to pass those two bills and we need to ditch the filibuster to do so.

  18. 18.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 1:31 pm

    I don’t know about the particulars of what just passed re: FISA, I only saw a TV blurb in passing.  We’ll see soon…

  19. 19.

    Baud

    April 12, 2024 at 1:35 pm

    @TBone:

    Looks like it’s only FISA.

    House votes to renew FISA spying tool after earlier Republican revolt (nbcnews.com)

  20. 20.

    UncleEbeneezer

    April 12, 2024 at 1:37 pm

    America is less polarized by race – but more polarized about race- The pro-GOP shift among people of color is making racial attitudes more important to politics, not less:

    All the Latinos surveyed who shifted to the GOP express a sanguine view of equal rights for Black people, saying either that we’ve done enough or even gone too far. So, once again, Republican gains are concentrated among racially conservative Latinos. And, once again, an important measure of racial attitudes is becoming more predictive of partisanship, even in an era where partisanship may be less polarized based on racial group membership.
    The takeaway
    Note that we have been making descriptive claims, not causal claims.  We have shown what kinds of people of color may be shifting to the Republican Party. They are people with more conservative attitudes on race. But this does not mean that racial attitudes are causing these shifts, or, if they are, that racial attitudes are the only factor.

    But at the same time, it is premature to attribute these shifts among voters of color to “class” or to being “working class.” Any measures of class – income, education, occupation, etc. – is conflated with attitudes. People with different educational backgrounds may be of different social classes, but they will also have different beliefs about any number of issues, and especially racial issues.

    Ultimately, our findings provide an important reinterpretation of any “racial realignment” in the U.S. If voters of color are shifting durably toward the Republican Party, this most certainly does not make race less important, if race is defined as “what people think” not just “what group they belong to.”

    In fact, racial attitudes are becoming more strongly correlated with political attitudes, among white voters and voters of color alike.

  21. 21.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 1:43 pm

    Marcy Kaptur live on C-Span tearing Pooty a new one!  She’s GREAT today.  A WOMAN is standing up to Pooty and Rethugs AND SHE IS FEARLESS 🔥

    She had visual assistance poster boards.  Pooty bloody hands, etc.

    Now some yokel is blathering about Christ in Florida and their worthy Xtian lifestyle.  I feel dirty again.

  22. 22.

    Geminid

    April 12, 2024 at 1:44 pm

    @TBone: That frees up Speaker Johnson to fly to Florida and confer with foreign intelligence asset Donald Trump, at Mar-a-Loco. They have lots to talk about, including the Ukraine aid package. Not to mention appliances.

  23. 23.

    Eolirin

    April 12, 2024 at 1:46 pm

    @Baud: We had 48 Senators on the record willing to suspend the filibuster for voting rights legislation iirc. We should have 49 now. If Gallego replaces Sinema and we don’t lose anyone, we’ll see if any of those yes votes were made out of convenience since the vote was going to fail.

  24. 24.

    Baud

    April 12, 2024 at 1:46 pm

    @Geminid: Trump can talk about grabbing them by the hoohas.

  25. 25.

    Baud

    April 12, 2024 at 1:48 pm

    @Eolirin: Agreed. We’ll cross that bridge when we come to it. I’m most worried about Tester and Angus King in Maine. Still, I hope to god Tester wins.

  26. 26.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 1:49 pm

    @Geminid: 😆 MTG will be so jealous!

  27. 27.

    Eolirin

    April 12, 2024 at 1:54 pm

    @Baud: I believe King was at least willing to consider suspending the filibuster on abortion rights as well. I don’t know where Tester is on that one.

    This cycle is also going to be a big test on how much ground organization and competently run campaign infrastructure matters as well. We’re going to have very big advantages there, with Trump effectively shredding the party infrastructure. They’ll still have the churches as a parallel GOTV organization, so we’ll also see how strong of a force that continues to be.

    Cruz and Scott are potentially vulnerable if we can over perform by a few percentage points. Having a few extra senators will help a lot.

  28. 28.

    Baud

    April 12, 2024 at 1:56 pm

    @Eolirin: Yes! Mo’ Dems = mo’ good.

  29. 29.

    cain

    April 12, 2024 at 1:58 pm

    @Baud: I suspect the “deep state” has gone after republicans to make sure that they are on the fisa thing.

    GOP has traditionally been about foreign policy warhawks etc – but of course, that’s all changed.

  30. 30.

    Shalimar

    April 12, 2024 at 1:58 pm

    As I have pointed out before, the judge shopping for Kacsmaryk only works because the 5th Circuit confirms the rulings.  The appeals court is full of radicals too.

  31. 31.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 1:59 pm

    @UncleEbeneezer: on that note

    https://twitter.com/ButtaFly1010/status/1778770321891348767

  32. 32.

    Captain C

    April 12, 2024 at 2:00 pm

    @Baud: Given how enthusiastically the Republicans supported this sort of spying when it was being used against their enemies, this seems like a Leopard Eating Faces moment for them, especially since a nontrivial percentage of that party are openly acting like criminals and traitors these days.

  33. 33.

    RaflW

    April 12, 2024 at 2:01 pm

    @New Deal democrat: You introduce the bill. You hold hearings. You get the D.C. pearl-clutchers to at least stop hyperventilating about overreach into the courts, etc.

    It is laying the groundwork for next year, or 2027, or whenever it can get passed. Part of the reason the GOP is endlessly being pantsed in budget negotiations, etc, is exactly because of the downstairs thread.

    They’re busy ‘writing’ bullshit bills like the HOOHA Act, so they have no idea how to markup and move a real bill, nor how to get it past the non-Congressional gatekeepers/special interests.

  34. 34.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 2:03 pm

    @RaflW: no no no!  The tooth fairy brings us everything we want or I’m not voting!

  35. 35.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 2:05 pm

    I don’t need a snark tag for that here, right?

  36. 36.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 2:07 pm

    Almost missed this one

    https://crooksandliars.com/2024/04/trump-lawyer-leaves-team-expected-testify

    Evan Corcoran, an attorney for Donald Trump who became a critical witness in the classified documents case, no longer represents him. Via CNN.com:

  37. 37.

    Anonymous At Work

    April 12, 2024 at 2:20 pm

    @TBone: Was he still representing TFG after all this time until just NOW?  Lawyers on retainer have to do work for the retainer or return it, not hire their own attorneys with the money.

  38. 38.

    raven

    April 12, 2024 at 2:23 pm

    @Anonymous At Work:

    However, Trump campaign spokesman Steven Cheung said Corcoran “remains on the legal team and is continuing to help fighting the Biden Trial witch-hunts,” adding, “Any assertion otherwise is fake news peddled by uninformed sources and untruthful reporting that seeks to leak disinformation and misinformation.”

  39. 39.

    rikyrah

    April 12, 2024 at 2:24 pm

    Senator Whitehouse is so on point. He has found his wheelhouse.

  40. 40.

    Leto

    April 12, 2024 at 2:25 pm

    I read this in the Washington Post the other day:

    Leo rejects Senate subpoena from panel probing gifts to Supreme Court justices
    The conservative judicial activist called the move ‘politically motivated,’ and the committee chair said Leo had left them ‘no other choice’ but to move forward with the compulsory process

    The Senate Judiciary Committee sent a subpoena Thursday to conservative judicial activist Leonard Leo as part of a months-long inquiry into undisclosed gifts to Supreme Court justices and he promptly rejected it, calling the move “politically motivated.”

    “I am not capitulating to his lawless support of Senator Sheldon Whitehouse and the left’s dark money effort to silence and cancel political opposition,” Leo said of Sen. Dick Durbin (D-Ill.), the committee’s chairman, in a statement to The Washington Post.

    The committee voted along party lines on Nov. 30 to authorize subpoenas for Leo and Texas billionaire Harlan Crow following reports that Supreme Court Justices Clarence Thomas and Samuel A. Alito Jr. accepted — and did not disclose — free luxury travel and gifts from Crow, Leo and conservative donor Robin Arkley II.

    Crow did not receive a subpoena Thursday, his spokesman Michael Zona told The Post.

    In a statement to The Post, Durbin said sending a subpoena to Leo was a necessary step.

    “Since July 2023, Leonard Leo has responded to the legitimate oversight requests of the Senate Judiciary Committee with a blanket refusal to cooperate,” Durbin said. “His outright defiance left the Committee with no other choice but to move forward with compulsory process. For that reason, I have issued a subpoena to Mr. Leo.”

    “Mr. Leo has played a central role in the ethics crisis plaguing the Supreme Court and, unlike the other recipients of information requests in this matter, he has done nothing but stonewall the Committee. This subpoena is a direct result of Mr. Leo’s own actions and choices,” Durbin continued.

    The committee did not respond when asked for comment on why only Leo received a subpoena. And when asked why so much time elapsed between the vote and Leo’s subpoena being sent, Durbin’s office declined to expand on his original statement.

    Like every other conservative, he doesn’t believe he needs to follow the rules because he assumes that all the dirtbags he’s installed across the judiciary will back him up. He needs to be disabused of that thought. The entire scheme needs to be dismantled.

  41. 41.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 2:27 pm

    @Leto: I saw that too and thought of Navarro. Who is incarcerated.  Wheels of justice, please grind him up!

    https://www.cnn.com/2024/03/19/politics/peter-navarro-jail-contempt-of-congress/index.html

  42. 42.

    Captain C

    April 12, 2024 at 2:27 pm

    @TBone: Judge Cannon:  “He’s not allowed to testify, for in this case, criming with TIFG counts as attorney-client privilege.  I am not a FedSoc crank!!!!”

  43. 43.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 2:29 pm

    @raven: consider the source of that “statement.” 🤡

  44. 44.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 2:30 pm

    @Captain C: grrrrrrrrrr Jack Smith please please please prevail over that buffoonery!

  45. 45.

    RaflW

    April 12, 2024 at 2:38 pm

    @Leto: Leonard Leo complaining about ‘dark money’ is of course 1000% chutzpah. Drag his ass into a hearing room.

  46. 46.

    JML

    April 12, 2024 at 2:42 pm

    @Leto: I am thrilled with this news. Leo defying a subpoena is perfect grounds to a) throw is corrupt ass in the clink, and b) really turn up the investigative heat.

    “he’s already broken the law once, how many more has he broken? the people have a right to know.”

    I’m also quite sure he won’t hold up if he’s actually jailed. clowns like him think they’re tough, but they soft AF.

  47. 47.

    Frankensteinbeck

    April 12, 2024 at 2:52 pm

    @Leto:

    Like every other conservative, he doesn’t believe he needs to follow the rules because he assumes that

    …he’s too good for them.  “Do you know who I am???” is a cry that echoes up and down their movement, right down to the street level where their status is “I’m white!”

    I will absolutely never forget, not just Kavanaugh’s freakout, but the way the whole Republican congress were frothing at the mouth infuriated that Democrats would dare suggest that rape is a disqualifier for a Supreme Court position.  They weren’t pushing back, they were offended.  Even the women.

  48. 48.

    wjca

    April 12, 2024 at 2:58 pm

    @JML: Leo defying a subpoena is perfect grounds to a) throw is corrupt ass in the clink, and b) really turn up the investigative heat.

    “he’s already broken the law once, how many more has he broken? the people have a right to know.”

    And just maybe, once the investigation gets rolling, the whole Federalist Society will implode.  Hey, a guy can dream….

  49. 49.

    Geminid

    April 12, 2024 at 3:00 pm

    @Geminid: Some more info on Vice President Harris’s Tucson appearance: it will be a private event, livestreamed on a campaign social media platform. Starting time is 2:30 p.m. local time, or 5:30 Eastern.

    Besides Harris, Tucson Mayor Regina Moreno, will appear; also, Secretary of State Adrian Fontes and Rep. Ruben Gallego, Arizona’s next U.S. Senator. Doug Emhoff was already in Tucson yesterday and he will be part of today’s campaign event as well.

  50. 50.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 3:00 pm

    @wjca: 👍 go forth confidently in the direction of your dreams…

  51. 51.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 3:09 pm

    LEST WE FORGET

    “No mention of Ginni, of course,” judicial activist Leonard Leo wrote of the 2012 payments to Justice Clarence Thomas’ wife, The Washington Post reported.

    https://www.huffpost.com/entry/ginni-thomas-consulting-payments-washington-post_n_645457d9e4b0452cee9c86fb

  52. 52.

    patrick II

    April 12, 2024 at 3:15 pm

    Supposedly judge connor was picked at random. Do you suppose that she really was?

  53. 53.

    WaterGirl

    April 12, 2024 at 3:17 pm

    @patrick II: Connor?  Or Cannon?

  54. 54.

    trollhattan

    April 12, 2024 at 3:18 pm

    Assholes never take the day off.

    Gun rights group the Firearms Policy Coalition is suing the State of California in federal court, arguing that a state law banning out-of-state residents from carrying guns in-state violate the Second Amendment. “State law generally prohibits individuals from carrying firearms either openly or concealed in public, and non-residents are not eligible for a license to carry a firearm in public. Indeed, California’s unconstitutionally restrictive scheme provides no path for non-residents to carry a firearm lawfully in public at all,” the coalition argued in its complaint, which was filed Thursday.

    The lawsuit was filed in the U.S. District Court for the Southern District of California. A lawsuit complaint represents one side of the story. The Bee reached out to the California Attorney General’s Office, which is charged with defending the law, for comment, but did not immediately hear back. The lawsuit was filed on behalf of three non-California residents — Christopher J. Hoffman of Pennsylvania, Chad Orrin of Idaho, and Jennifer Sensiba of New Mexico — who are licensed in their home states to carry firearms.

    Both Hoffman and Orrin are former California residents, according to the complaint. [Gee, I sure miss those guys.]

    “Individuals like (Hoffman, Orrin and Sensiba) do not lose protection of their rights under the First Amendment’s speech or religion clauses when they cross state lines. Nor do they lose their protections under the Fourth Amendment’s prohibition on unreasonable searches and seizures. They likewise do not surrender their Second Amendment protected rights when they travel outside their home state,” the complaint reads. While California offers concealed carry licensing to residents, non-residents are ineligible for it — the law requires that an applicant live in the state for a two-year license or have a principle place of business or employment in the state if applying for a 90-day limited license.

    “As a result, California law provides no path for non-residents to obtain the license necessary to exercise their constitutionally protected right to bear arms in public for lawful purposes without running afoul of the state’s broad statutory scheme that works a total ban on carry generally,” the complaint reads.

    https://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/capitol-alert/article287623895.html#storylink=cpy

    Dollars to donuts this goes before that crazy asshole Judge Benitez who declared the AR-15 to be just like a Swiss Army Knife. Reload!

  55. 55.

    trollhattan

    April 12, 2024 at 3:19 pm

    @WaterGirl: I happen to know a Connor will fit in a Cannon. Saw it at the circus.

  56. 56.

    Suzanne

    April 12, 2024 at 3:25 pm

    O/T, but fuck it.

    Edward Luce, on Xhitter:

    If you sincerely believed that abortion was murder you’d never compromise at x weeks. You’d be utterly unyielding. If, on the other hand, your aim was to restore traditional gender relations, then you’d behave exactly like the GOP is now.

  57. 57.

    prostratedragon

    April 12, 2024 at 3:25 pm

    forbes.com analyst says, run, now! from djt stock

  58. 58.

    Baud

    April 12, 2024 at 3:27 pm

    @Suzanne: Agreed, but I think folks here recognized that a long time ago. Still, always glad to see others get it.

     

     

    @prostratedragon: A little late for that advice, no?

  59. 59.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    April 12, 2024 at 3:31 pm

    @TBone: ​
     
    It’s appalling to me that somebody like her not just flaunts the rules but basically breaks them and yet, no repercussions.

  60. 60.

    prostratedragon

    April 12, 2024 at 3:32 pm

    @Urza:  Has the Senate addressed the judge-shopping issue recently? I know that apart from SM, other opponents of a blanket filibuster repeal said they could agree to carve out some issues such as voting rights. In fact on that specific matter istr it did come down to just those two.

  61. 61.

    Mr. Bemused Senior

    April 12, 2024 at 3:32 pm

    @prostratedragon:

    Feeble responses by Trump Media CEO Nunes in interview by Fox Business News

    Well of course.

    [ETA I wonder what Devin Nunes’ cow thinks of it.]

  62. 62.

    prostratedragon

    April 12, 2024 at 3:44 pm

    @Baud:  Was my first thought. Wonder if he’s found enough borrowable shares to go short? Rare to see such a naked statement.

  63. 63.

    lowtechcyclist

    April 12, 2024 at 3:47 pm

    @prostratedragon: ​
     

    forbes.com analyst says, run, now! from djt stock

    If someone needs a forbes.com analyst to tell them that, they’ll just fall for the next con that comes along. No use trying to save them.

  64. 64.

    sdhays

    April 12, 2024 at 3:48 pm

    @patrick II: My understanding is that Cannon, if that’s who you mean, is alone in her own sub-district in Florida which just so happens to cover Mar-a-Lardo. So filing charges there was going to go to her unless she recused or there was some other intervention.

    One suspects that if Jack Smith knew how compromised she was, he would have kept the court action in DC.

  65. 65.

    WaterGirl

    April 12, 2024 at 3:50 pm

    Reminder: If you’re interested in the Einstein zoom on Wednesday evening (4/17) at 8 pm Eastern, and you haven’t already RSVP’d, please send me an email message.

  66. 66.

    David 🏀Caitlin Clark🏀 Koch

    April 12, 2024 at 3:51 pm

    @prostratedragon: the financial situation has developed not necessarily to Dump’s advantage

  67. 67.

    lowtechcyclist

    April 12, 2024 at 3:51 pm

    @prostratedragon:

    Has the Senate addressed the judge-shopping issue recently? I know that apart from SM, other opponents of a blanket filibuster repeal said they could agree to carve out some issues such as voting rights. In fact on that specific matter istr it did come down to just those two.

    My recollection is that Virginia’s Mark Warner was kinda vague about what exceptions, if any, he’d support. ETA: I’ll bet Geminid can quote chapter and verse on what he’s said.

  68. 68.

    Baud

    April 12, 2024 at 4:01 pm

    @lowtechcyclist: I don’t know what he’s said, but I’d be surprised to see him as the lone holdout.

  69. 69.

    Captain C

    April 12, 2024 at 4:05 pm

    @JML:

    Leo defying a subpoena is perfect grounds to a) throw is corrupt ass in the clink

    I would love it if he had to share a cell with TIFG for 23 hours a day.

  70. 70.

    StringOnAStick

    April 12, 2024 at 4:10 pm

    So I decided to email Speaker Johnson today, but unless you have an zip code that is in his district, you can’t get his email form.  Clever, these fascists.

  71. 71.

    Geminid

    April 12, 2024 at 4:12 pm

    @lowtechcyclist: Not really. I do not pay close attention to this particular question, mainly because it will be resolved on a case by case basis starting 9 months from now at the earliest. That’s assuming Democrats have 50 or more Senators in the next Congress.

    In the meantime, I’m not trying to suss out whether Senator Warner is gonna let us down on filibuster reform. If and when that becomes a real prospect we’ll hear about him plenty.

  72. 72.

    lowtechcyclist

    April 12, 2024 at 4:19 pm

    @Baud:

    I don’t know what he’s said, but I’d be surprised to see him as the lone holdout.

    Well, I was thinking of him in addition to Angus King and possibly Jon Tester, who have been mentioned already in this thread.

  73. 73.

    lowtechcyclist

    April 12, 2024 at 4:20 pm

    @Geminid:

    In the meantime, I’m not trying to suss out whether Senator Warner is gonna let us down on filibuster reform. If and when that becomes a real prospect we’ll hear about him plenty.

    I totally understand.

  74. 74.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 4:21 pm

    @comrade scotts agenda of rage: they think they aren’t merely “above the law” – in their own minds, they are the law.  We need to disabuse them of both notions.

  75. 75.

    Baud

    April 12, 2024 at 4:22 pm

    @lowtechcyclist: Yeah, maybe. I guess it’ll depend on how many Senators we end up with.

  76. 76.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 4:24 pm

    @StringOnAStick: I recently overcame that same hurdle with my State reps by looking up an address in their district (real estate for sale) and using that with a local area coded phone number. In other words, I lied.  But I got over the hurdle.  So fucking ridiculous.

  77. 77.

    Geminid

    April 12, 2024 at 4:26 pm

    @lowtechcyclist: Winning the Senate again could create all kinds of problems for Democrats, and I am looking forward to each and every one of them!

  78. 78.

    Another Scott

    April 12, 2024 at 4:27 pm

    @StringOnAStick: It’s pretty standard in the Congressional web forms.

    https://ziplook.house.gov/htbin/findrep_house?ZIP=70750

    One can do things like use the post office address, if one really wanted to, on the web form.  (Dunno if they check for that.)  The +4 in the zip code could be a little annoying, but the USPS will give you that for any address or PO box.

    A post card might be easier.  ;-)

    FWIW.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  79. 79.

    Baud

    April 12, 2024 at 4:28 pm

    @Geminid: Heh. Fingers crossed.

  80. 80.

    sdhays

    April 12, 2024 at 4:30 pm

    @Baud: That’s my expectation. I get the feeling he doesn’t want to get rid of the filibuster, but he also knows his career is probably over if he’s the one who tips the balance to “no” on “must pass” legislation like voting rights and abortion rights.

    In other words, I’m assuming he’s “gettable”.

  81. 81.

    Odie Hugh Manatee

    April 12, 2024 at 4:35 pm

    What Republicans like is activist judges. Or at least the ones that are conservative activists. All I heard for years was “activist liberal judges” when what they really wanted was their own activist judges. Between the SCROTUS payola scandals, court shopping, TFG doing whatever he wants, Moscow Mitch stealing appointments from Democratic presidents or numerous other issues and I have to say that lady justice isn’r blind but also deaf and dumb.

    I think men chose a woman to depict justice because they’ve been pushing women around for centuries.

  82. 82.

    karen marie

    April 12, 2024 at 4:35 pm

    @prostratedragon: I watched the Nunes video. What a maroon!

    His big plan is to allow video content that’s been banned by other sites. Yeah, that’ll bring in advertisers. I hope he tries it.

  83. 83.

    Paul in KY

    April 12, 2024 at 4:37 pm

    @Urza: I am sure there were/are at least 2 more Democratic senators agin it, who were happy to let Manchin & Simienenenea vocalize that opposition.

  84. 84.

    karen marie

    April 12, 2024 at 4:37 pm

    @StringOnAStick:  You already got the suggestion I made.

    It is infuriating though that only people in the speaker’s district can send an emaii.

  85. 85.

    TBone

    April 12, 2024 at 4:40 pm

    @Anonymous At Work: I am intimately familiar with how retainers work, as part of my former job(s) were to input every minute detail of every moment (yes, moment!) “spent” working on a case into one of the various computer billing systems devised for and sold exclusively to attorneys for that purpose.  In some cases, I was instructed to eavesdrop on every phone call to see who/what/when the attorney was doing because he didn’t want to waste his own time on the few seconds it would have taken him to log his own time into the computeruzed billing system that had a stopwatch timer he could have just clicked on.  Padding is not uncommon.

    I know your point was that the money isn’t supposed to be used until legal service is rendered and NOT to pay for additional representation when you’re caught criming but generally nobody sees the nuts and bolts of these operations.

  86. 86.

    Paul in KY

    April 12, 2024 at 4:46 pm

    @StringOnAStick: Curses! How would one ever find the zip codes for the sad district Speaker Pornhub ‘represents’?

    They have out foxed us again…

  87. 87.

    lowtechcyclist

    April 12, 2024 at 4:48 pm

    @Baud: ​
     

    Yeah, maybe. I guess it’ll depend on how many Senators we end up with.

    I’m assuming 50 for purposes of this discussion. Picking up a 51st Senator in Florida or Texas still seems like a long shot, and of course if we wind up with 49 or less, it’s a moot point.

  88. 88.

    prostratedragon

    April 12, 2024 at 4:55 pm

    @karen marie:  Hunh, guess it never occured to him to wonder why they were banned.😶

  89. 89.

    Geminid

    April 12, 2024 at 4:56 pm

    @sdhays: Mark Warner is likely serving his last term. I expect him to retire, like his friend across the Potomac, Ben Cardin. Rep. Jennifer McClellan will probably replace Warner.

    From what I’ve seen, Warner would be on board for filibuster carveouts for a very few critical bills, like voting rights and women’s health rights. He would not go for abolishing the filibuster outright, but I think he’d be one of many in that respect.

  90. 90.

    UncleEbeneezer

    April 12, 2024 at 4:57 pm

    @sdhays: The main reason that Smith filed in Florida is because many of the crimes only occurred when he was officially no longer President.  And when that happened, Trump (and the documents) were both in MAL.  Elie Honig explains:

    So why would Smith’s team choose Florida over DC? The primary answer, I believe, is that it was the safest move, legally. The key concept here is called “venue.” In any federal case, prosecutors must charge in a federal geographic district where at least some of the alleged criminal activity occurred. If a crime happens in multiple districts, prosecutors have broad latitude to choose, so long as some part of the crime happened in the district where the charge lands. (At the Southern District of New York, we were infamous for stretching this principle; I once charged a 20-defendant case where virtually all of the conduct happened in another district – because one poor sap of a defendant placed one phone call from Manhattan.)

    There’s no question here that Smith has chosen a legally proper venue in the Southern District of Florida, where Mar-a-Lago sits. That’s where the bulk of the charged criminal activity occurred: the wrongful retention of defense information, the efforts to obstruct justice, the false statements. But if Smith had tried to charge in DC, he would have run into problems. He might have argued that DC was essentially the scene of the crime, the place from which Trump illegally took classified documents; if you rob a bank in DC and bring the proceeds down to Florida, the argument might go, you can certainly be charged in DC. But Trump himself, and the documents at issue, physically left DC before his presidency ended at noon on January 20, 2021 – when it was not yet illegal for him to have those documents. The crime – unlawful retention of defense information – therefore started, at the very earliest, at 12:01 p.m., right when he left office. But by that time, Trump and the docs were already out of DC. So it’s not clear Trump ever committed any criminal act relating to the documents in DC. I’m not saying Smith surely would have lost a legal argument over venue had he charged in DC (though, in my view, he probably would have lost). He absolutely would have contended with a vexing (and potentially time-consuming) issue that likely would have wound up the subject of an appeal. Smith’s decision to charge in Florida obviated any venue objection, and took that particular issue off the board.

  91. 91.

    Martin

    April 12, 2024 at 5:23 pm

    @UncleEbeneezer: Worth adding that USSC was at that moment examining a case that involved the question of if a trial is determined to have been filed in the wrong venue if that invokes jeopardy. Smith had a real considering that if he filed in DC and the case progresses and is then found to be the wrong venue (maybe because the charges for what happened in DC are either dropped or acquitted leaving only the Florida activities) that he would be unable to retry the case because of jeopardy.

    Precedent was that so long as it didn’t make it to jury before the determination, the case could be retried, but USSC took up this new case which challenged that, and as it turns out USSC held that precedent, but in that moment it wasn’t clear why USSC took that case and if they’d be inclined to attach jeopardy at an earlier time.

    So the safe move was to file in the district where the most serious and easy to prove elements of the case reside.

  92. 92.

    Jackie

    April 12, 2024 at 5:28 pm

    @StringOnAStick: I just use the home town’s zip code that they’re from 😉 They seldom ask for an actual mailing address.

  93. 93.

    Geminid

    April 12, 2024 at 5:36 pm

    @Paul in KY: If you are in a Republican district, you could always email your Representative and instruct him to tell his buddy Mike Johnson to put the Ukraine bill on the House floor. Maybe send friendly follow-ups: “Have you told your buddy Mike Johnson to put that dam’ Ukraine bill on the floor yet?”

    Or maybe be more politic, but still make the point. There are a lot of Republican Representives, I think, who have been straddling the fence on this issue with their fingers in the air. Those that want to know which way the wind is blowing will look to constituent communications for a wind gauge.

  94. 94.

    Chacal Charles Calthrop

    April 12, 2024 at 5:44 pm

    @Captain C: unfortunately Leo’s just the kinda guy who might love it too. Those creeps like to hang out together

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