I saw this in today’s Washington Post, and thought it made a good accompaniment to Matt Taibbi’s latest:
By making debt the centerpiece of his campaign, Romney was making a calculated bluff of historic dimensions – placing a massive all-in bet on the rank incompetence of the American press corps. The result has been a brilliant comedy: A man makes a $250 million fortune loading up companies with debt and then extracting million-dollar fees from those same companies, in exchange for the generous service of telling them who needs to be fired in order to finance the debt payments he saddled them with in the first place. That same man then runs for president riding an image of children roasting on flames of debt, choosing as his running mate perhaps the only politician in America more pompous and self-righteous on the subject of the evils of borrowed money than the candidate himself. If Romney pulls off this whopper, you’ll have to tip your hat to him: No one in history has ever successfully run for president riding this big of a lie. It’s almost enough to make you think he really is qualified for the White House.
Mowgli
The banner ad flying above this article is for Atlas Shrugged II, coming to theaters in October. Let’s see if ‘Atlas Shrugged And Just Borrowed Some More Public Money to Convert into Private Profit’ comes to America in November.
John M. Burt
If you want to take Romney’s side of that bet, I’ll lend you ten thousand dollars with which to gamble, at a very reasonable double-digit rate of compound interest.
Howlin Wolfe
The bet against being, of course, that enough people will wake up and see the lie before we are cast into the cauldron that will be accelerated climate change.
lonesomerobot
OK, basically o/t but can someone please tell David Plouffe that the answer to the direct question (asked of him twice) “are Americans doing better than they were 4 years ago?” is “ABSOLUTELY – this country’s economy is no longer on the edge of collapse and that means every American is better off”.
Mileage may vary, but the fact is we were on the cusp of another great depression and we aren’t any more. There is no other word for that than better. Instead, Plouffe hemmed and hawed, and although he did bring up the points that needed to be brought up, it’s clear that the Obama campaign haven’t yet come up with a clear, concise and irrefutable response to the Rmoney campaign’s obvious centerpiece argument coming out of the convention. Until they can refute it in one brief sentence, they’ll be in trouble.
cathyx
I don’t understand how this works. He loans the company money and then charges a fee on top of that?
Handy
Why are they calling Gordon Gecko “Mitt?”
Corner Stone
I haven’t started drinking yet, but that quote inspires me to start early. Er, earlier than usual I mean.
WereBear
I’ve concluded that it doesn’t matter WHO the Republicans run when it comes to the base. Look at Romney.
He’s not a Christian. He’s not an entrepreneur. He has no plans, no charisma, and no ability at picking the people on his team. His wife is one of the most obnoxious potential First Ladies since Barbara Bush. His sons are a bunch of chicken hawks who haven’t accomplished anything, either. You can’t even have a beer with him!
THIS is supposed to appeal to Independent voters?
Corner Stone
@cathyx: Yes, it’s just a bigger scale mafia “bust out”.
He reorganizes the company by borrowing tons of debt, takes the pensions as management fees, sells off any profitable side units then leaves the core/shell company under so much stress it can’t survive.
He then moves on.
ETA, from wiki: “A “bust out” is a common tactic in the organized crime world, wherein a business’ assets and lines of credit are exploited and exhausted to the point of bankruptcy.”
Pen
@cathyx: Sort of. Wikipedia: Leveraged Buyout
JPL
@WereBear: you people just don’t understand how caring Mitt is.
Pen
@Corner Stone: Yup. There’s a damn good reason the term “vulture capitalist” was coined. Guys like Romney are predators, and their pray is floundering companies. They just don’t bother to wait til the company is dead, they actively move in for the kill under the guise of helping.
La Caterina
Rahmbo for the win on MTP! Suck it Gregory.
cathyx
@Corner Stone: @Pen: So does he borrow money from a bank, or is he financing the buying himself? Then he sells off the different parts of the company and makes a profit from that? Leaving nothing left for the company to run on?
General Stuck
It is something I noticed during the second term of the Bush admin, that came about naturally from cynical people doing fundamentally unpopular things, and mostly getting away with it. Though the lies and deception did finally catch up to George and co, at least with the voting public, throwing a pall over a failed presidency.
If this were a thoughtful country among voting citizens, then whoever was next up for a GOP POTUS election nominee, then republicans would feel chastened enough to change their MO to something more truthful. But this isn’t a thoughtful country, and if are you a republican in a white majority land, each failure gets washed away in the blink of an eye, as having even occurred in the first place.
I call it the Zebra effect, and for the short term, it can be a shield to any republican in a country that gives a steady supply of mulligans for politicians running under the GOP banner. Or, at some point, the lies and bullshit nearly covers everything they do, or plan to do, becomes so pervasive with malevolent intent to scam, that it is impossible to isolate individual cases of cheating, lying and stealing. Or just basic intentions
Like the lion pride of hunting females, get flummoxed with the broad mosaic of Zebra stripes of the herd, they cannot single out one Zebra from all the others. And it looks to me, that once again, in order to keeping dodging the “fact checkers” a republican presidential hopeful is filling the zone with nothing but bullshit lies (in record amounts), in hopes to slither on by to winning before a fawning white majority catches on. And having a base that demands very unpopular policies, does nothing to mitigate this cynical phenomenon.
Villago Delenda Est
@Pen:
He’s not just a predator. He’s a parasite.
He should be dealt with like all parasites. Eradication.
SiubhanDuinne
@lonesomerobot:
That message, bumper-sticker-sized, needs to be at the center of every speech given at the DNC.
BGinCHI
@La Caterina: What did he do?
My doctor forbids me to watch Gregory in any form.
magurakurin
@cathyx: they get a majority stake as shareholders and then begin their “consulting.” They arrange financing, through their contacts, build up the debt, pay the “shareholders” a huge dividend(themselves) drive the company into bankruptcy, sell off the pieces in bankruptcy protection, fuck the creditors, close shop and move on.
here’s a video description
SiubhanDuinne
@La Caterina:
I didn’t watch. Can you summarize?
Rex Everything
@cathyx: Yes, a leveraged buyout works by putting the loan used to buy the company on that company’s own balance sheet. The co. is then forced to downsize—close plants, sell off assets, eliminate pensions, and of course fire people—in order to service its debt. The management coorperates with the scam because they’ve been paid off. The result is a super quick & efficient transfer of wealth upward, from workers & production infrastructure to the financial upper class. This scenario has characterized American capitalism for nearly 30 years.
Corner Stone
@cathyx: He gets financing from private equity placements. Other investors, funds, maybe banks if needed. Never his own money. That’s why they coined the term OPM, Other People’s Money.
Ratchet up the debt, strip the profitable assets and anything generating cash flow, and then take your fees for services off the top.
Rex Everything
Of course, Taibbi is a nefarious stooge and phony, unlike the heroic Ben Wittes, of the Brookings Institution you know.
cathyx
@magurakurin: Thanks, now I get it.
Violet
@lonesomerobot:
YES! THIS! Can someone on the front page please post this so everyone can see it and repeat it. EVERYONE is better off, and that includes Mitt Romney. Remind people of how scary it was to watch the stock market collapse. Remind people that it was so bad John McCain suspended his campaign over it. Remind people the economy was falling off a cliff. It’s not now. It’s better. It’s not back where we want it to be, but we’re on the right track.
El Cid
GRRRRRRR MAIT TAIBBI GRRRRR GRRRR GRRRRRRRR
cathyx
@Rex Everything: Thanks, that helps too. Now I’m finally getting it.
Violet
@La Caterina: When I saw the lineup on Meet the Republicans, I just turned it off. I absolutely cannot stand that smug chipmunk David Gregory.
arguingwithsignposts
Dana Milbank needs to get out of the comedy business. Seriously, dude. You’re only funny in an unintentional way.
Corner Stone
@El Cid: Trenchant as hell, man.
Chris T.
@cathyx:
Sort of. The details vary from one to the next, but the pattern remains the same. Borrow heavily from some lender; buy the target; “dress up” the target now that you own it legally and can dictate terms; and sell off all or part of that target.
The trickiest part is the first. In the old days, you got a bunch of wealthy backers together to form a group that pooled their own cash (say, $100k each times ten people = $1 million) which was used as collateral to borrow roughly another ten to twenty times that ($10 to $20 million) which was enough to buy a company, usually one with management making some obvious mistakes, and then you fix it up and sell it, or break it up and sell the parts. It’s a lot like buying a house. If you’ve built up credibility with the bank (“good credit”) they’ll let you get away with 10% down, or sometimes even less.
Someone, somewhere along the line, realized that there was no need to put ten or even five percent down—that you could borrow virtually all the money up front. And someone else (or maybe the same first “someone”) discovered that you don’t have to be any good at business after all, you just have to be a smooth liar. Voila, vulture capitalism was born.
Vulture capitalism is how Hurwitz bought Pacific Lumber in 1985 and turned it from a sustainable lumber harvesting operation (run as a sort of sleepy backwater economy) into a forest-destruction short-term-profit-long-term-doomed system. Hurwitz bought Pacific Lumber in an LBO and brought in automation and raised the timber harvest rate by introducing clearcutting (and also heavy automation, which resulted in firing most of the lumberjacks). That’s what the spotted owl controversy was about: the automated equipment needed clearcuts to be profitable, so now that Pacific Lumber had to service a huge debt load, the only way to do it was to clearcut with the fully automated equipment and few workers, rather than sustainably-harvest with chainsaws and many workers.
As a “bonus” (no doubt planned from the start) Hurwitz discovered that it was possible to take all the cash out of the employees’ pension fund once he owned Pacific Lumber.
See also http://www.multinationalmonitor.org/hyper/issues/1994/09/mm0994_07.html
La Caterina
@BGinCHI: Gregory asked questions that presumed Obama’s failure and the accuracy of the Republican critique against him. Rahmbo refused to accept the false premises, pointed out many of the administration’s successes (as well as Obama’s work on welfare reform in the Ill. statehouse) politely and succinctly- then Gregory quietly retreated.
WereBear
Many people don’t know how anything works.
They know how to drive, but not how the car works. They know their job, but not how it fits into what their company does. They know which vegetables to choose for dinner, but not how they grow or what was needed to get them to the store.
No one can be an expert on all things. But in my time with the public I constantly encounter people who are clueless about every single freakin’ thing they do.
And they fall for the headlines that proclaim Mitt Romney is a business genius.
geg6
@La Caterina:
Heh. And Donna Brazille spanked George Will and Matthew Dowd on This Week with George Snuffleuppagus’ Hair.
Dems fighting back. Dogs and cats living together. ABL and CWG going to Democratic convention in North Carolina. The End Times must be right around the corner, I swear.
Davis X. Machina
Bluffing works when the bluffee wants to be bluffed.
Debt is sin. Thrift is virtue.
To millions and millions of Americans still, though they have mortgages and credit cards, debt is simply sin.
Six generations of Poor Richard’s Almanac and biblical enjoinders of usury, and the Populist movement’s war on bankers, and two sets of war bond drives — you’re saving, it’s the government borrowing — leaves a deep, atavistic, mark.
It’s one of the reasons why the ‘the government-like-a-household-pay-its-bills-every-month’ meme refuses to die.
You can readily find deficit hawks on DailyKos and DemocraticUnderground.com, even now, in the midst of a collapse in aggregate demand — and they mean it, it’s not just a stalking horse like the same position is in GOP circles.
Most advertising, except for new products, is about keeping the customers you’ve got, not pulling new ones. Romney’s politics is built on this.
Rhoda
@Violet: People DO NOT want to hear that message; it bombed spectacularly in focus groups I remember reading. The muddle is the best they’ll listen to; which is why the re-elect is pushing a central future oriented message; FORWARD. The surprising thing is how much the Romney team is willing to play on that turf; likely because when they try the four years ago bullshit it opens the door to Bush.
Violet
@Rhoda: Interesting about the focus groups. Wonder why that is. Maybe they think four years is long enough and the economy should be great by now. People are dumb.
I wonder if there’s a way to bring up four years ago without saying it like that. “Four years ago the Republicans wanted Sarah Palin to be a heartbeat way from the Presidency” or something.
Violet
RE: Four Years Ago question, here’s Governor O’Malley of Maryland answering it with “No.”
Video and article
Seriously, the Dems don’t have an effective counter to this? That’s crazy.
Edit: Also in the article, Stephanie Cutter seems to think reminding people of how back it was four years ago will work. I think she’s right, but what do I know.
La Caterina
@SiubhanDuinne: sorry i haven’t got the hang of multiple reply to’s and the whole commenting as conversation- my summary is at #32 above
SiubhanDuinne
@Violet:
Hahaha! “Smug chipmunk.” PERFECT!!
Ben Franklin
I really don’t understand the reluctance of some to read the views of those they disagree with.
Kinda on topic is the GOP Convention. There is no ‘bounce’ from the Convention, other than the kinetic ball of negative political energy called Eastwood who stole the kleiglights from Mitt who had NO worthy soundbytes for post convention pondering.
Matt Taibbi;
A Republican politician’s job back then was, if not easy, pretty clear: you bashed welfare queens and free-riders, told tearful stories of fetuses composing operas in the womb, and promised to bomb America’s enemies back to the Stone Age. You didn’t have to split hairs or hedge bets: you got up on stage, took a baseball bat to liberals and terrorists and other such perverts, and let the momentum of the crowd carry you to victory. You were like Slim Pickens at the end of Dr. Strangelove, riding high with a nuke between your legs, waving your ten-gallon hat at and going out in a blaze of yeeee-hah!!!s.
Doesn’t that crap make you just…well…angry?
Rhoda
@Violet: People accept that Bush is responsible and they hold his policies responsible for the meltdown; him and Congress and then Wall Street. But they don’t think the country is doing fine and they feel uncertain and in a depression not a recession. So, they KNOW POTUS was dealt a bad hand and they see how crazy the Republicans have been (especially in states with Republican governors; big backlash there that helps Democrats). They’re very sensitive to anyone telling them they are okay when they feel they aren’t; it makes them angry and makes them question the judgement of someone telling them they’re better off when they lost so much wealth and they may be out a job or working two jobs or fine themselves but their kid can’t catch a break etc etc etc
It makes sense when you think about it and makes the FORWARD message all the more brilliant; the election is about continuing to try to get to good and how the other side wants to go back to Bush. That’s the Obama campaign message with a side of Bain and war on women and immigration reform to get to 51% despite 8% unemployment.
SiubhanDuinne
@La Caterina:
Got it, thanks, no worries. And anyhow, FYWP hung my comment.
Schlemizel
@Corner Stone: I had posted the term ‘bust out’ here many weeks ago. It is exactly what Willard and Bain did time and time again. But they somehow made it legal. I do wish someone in the national media would pick up on this pattern and comparison. Th reelection committee should be pushing the comparison.
Judas Escargot, Acerbic Prophet of the Mighty Potato God
@Chris T.:
I’ve been trying to explain to anyone who’d listen that Romney is NOT a “businessman” in the sense they think. Generally, once you explain how the leveraged buyout mechanism works, anyone who’s seen the Sopranos or Goodfellas immediately ‘gets it’.
The next step: Explain how simple it is to discourage this practice. Tax unproductive activity at a much higher rate than productive activity (like we did in the period from 1933-1980 or so). That’s a harder sell, though, since it involves using the T word.
Corner Stone
I have found the perfect breakfast ice cream.
“everything but the…” by Ben & Jerry
Joel
@Mowgli: I had a dream/nightmare two nights ago that I saw Atlas Shrugged and liked it.
aimai
Did anyone see the Daily Show spoof on what would happen to all those red, red, states if America were run like a business? I just watched it online and it is truly spectacular. They go to the floor of the Republican convention and interview people from different states, show them their state “balance sheet” and then fire them and eliminate their states because they are non performing. When South Carolina blames “government spending” they bark out “oh, so you are blaming the boss?” Priceless.
aimai
Jennifer
Next time you hear someone spout the moronic “we need a BUSINESSMAN to run the country” drivel, remind them that the Republicans told us the same thing back in 2000 and it ended in a near-depression. Bush, like Romney, profited from every business failure. Bush, like Romney, was born into a wealthy family and had zero understanding of what it was to ever have to work or live on a budget like an ordinary person. Romney, like Bush, proposes the same policies that widened the income and wealth gap that have made the economy weaker rather than stronger.
On another note, if you have a facebook page, post this. It may be dirty pool to use religion as a political tool, but the Republicans have been doing it effectively for 40 years; their Christian base really needs to be made aware of the fact that Mormons believe Joseph Smith did more for humankind than even Jesus Christ – particularly since Smith’s career as a charlatan and con man is fairly well documented. Also, the Catholics in particular might want to know that Mormons say that Mary got pregnant through physical sex. And probably all of them don’t know about the Mormon belief that Jesus had a polygamous marriage with 3 women and many children, or that Joseph Smith himself claimed to be a direct descendent of Christ.
Look, I basically think all religion is so much mumbo-jumbo, but if they’re going to use it, and they always do, we should make sure they know the Republican nominee isn’t a Christian in any normal sense of the word.
J.D. Rhoades
@Rhoda:
I’m certainly doing better than four years ago, and so are many people I know. And yet, even when I tell this to people who I know for a fact are doing better, they get angry. And Republicans get furious to the point of apoplexy.
Violet
@SiubhanDuinne: He’s always reminded me of a chipmunk, with his oversized cheeks and perked up fear-induced inquisitive eyes. Now that he’s got MTP he’s unbearably smug. I just can’t stand him. I used to watch Russert and even watched Brokaw in 2008 after Russert died, but Gregory has just been awful.
I wish one of the Sunday shows would figure out that changing the format could bring in new viewers and that in turn could increase ratings. The Sunday shows are ripe for a makeover.
WereBear
From the article:
I really try to not swear, so I’ll just say that Romney is one effed-up mother-effer.
Corner Stone
@Schlemizel: Yeah, I think Cole or DougJ even posted something asking “This really is a bust out, isn’t it?” or some such thing.
It’s pretty much the only way to describe what Bain did and what the R party did to the nation, in a very focused way, for the last decade or so.
Suffern ACE
@lonesomerobot: indeed. They will Adked that Reagan question. They will be asked about gas prices with no context into why they had fallen so low four years ago.
Hell just answer “well, I’d youre in the auto industry, you’re in a job at a company that’s no longer controlled by private equity firms. I hear they run companies into the ground
Schlemizel
@arguingwithsignposts: I won’t watch the dick whisperer even if his target is the GOP. He is a very large part of what is wrong with the media in America. He’d like to think of himself as Jon Stewart with a higher-class audience but he is just a low-priced rent boy for the powers that be.
J.D. Rhoades
@Jennifer:
Don’t be silly. You know you can only criticize a person’s church if their pastor is black.
Ben Franklin
It may be dirty pool to use religion as a political tool, but the Republicans have been doing it effectively for 40 years
Yes. I am old enough to remember the 1972 campaign; the advent of rat-fucking.
It is comforting that Romney has all the worst qualities (feckless and helpless) of McGovern without any of his sterling qualities.
LanceThruster
Gregory just asked if R-Money succeeded with the convention in being more likeable (with the “I Like Ike” button graphic).
Doris Kearns Goodwin added/sung the rest of the jingle.
“I like Ike, cuz he is easy to like.”
Using the same tune…
“I hate Mitt, cuz he he is full of shlt.”
Crude, yes…but descriptively accurate.
Jennifer
@J.D. Rhoades: You don’t have to criticize it. Just help that video go viral. The heavy lifting has been done for you.
Jennifer
Also, too: for quite some time, I have been referring to Chris Christie as Fat Bastard. After his speech the other night, I figured out that there’s a better analogy:
Chris Christie = Governor Cartman
trollhattan
@Violet:
Hell’s yes. For frack’s sake, just look at that yardstick of capitalism, the Dow.
1.20.09: 7,949
8.31.12: 13,090
Our “betters” seem to consider this an indication of policy failure.
General Stuck
Troll, troll, troll your boat,
Gently down the stream.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily,
Life is but a dream.
Schlemizel
@Ben Franklin: I’ll defend George. He was neither hapless nor feckless but he was the perfect candidate for Nixons team to project the image they wanted for their opponent on. Thats why his ratfuck operation worked so hard to destroy the campaigns of the candidates who all would have beaten the big dick. The real story of unconstitutional, illegal activity was not the bugging of the DNC offices but the work done to make McGovern the candidate.
JPL
@Violet: Richardson had a role also, talking about Foreign Policy. I loved the part where Bob asked Cutter whether or not she was calling the Republicans liars and she said let’s talk about what they said.
I did turn off the show before Newt came on though.
quannlace
This should be the Dem’s mantra.
Bush Tax Cuts, Bush Tax Cuts.
The biggest chunk of the national debt.
Violet
@Judas Escargot, Acerbic Prophet of the Mighty Potato God: @Corner Stone:
I don’t watch a lot of mafia movies or TV shows, so I didn’t know about a “bust out”. Thanks for the explanation, everyone. Is there a scene in one of those movies or TV shows that could be used to illustrate what Romney does? Somewhere where a character talks about a bust out and explains it simply? Substitute a few names or words in the audio and I think it could be very effective.
LanceThruster
@trollhattan:
Saw a piece that said this above all else proves “trickle down” does NOT work.
trollhattan
@aimai:
The bit was a wicked riff on “Glenngarry Glen Ross” in case you haven’t seen it. I thought they pulled it off brilliantly.
Ironic, given Mamet has gone to the winger dark side.
Ben Franklin
@Schlemizel:
The gist of my comment was whether one should attack the candidate’s religion, and the history of republican strategy indicates they feel everything is germane, even a Veeps bout with depression.
I LOVE George McGovern. One of the truly great People in the mold of Adlai Stevenson.
trollhattan
@LanceThruster:
Or to pivot off GHW Bush’s line, “A rising tide lifts all yachts above a certain size.”
Ben Franklin
@trollhattan:
Yeah. He gets the steak knives.
LanceThruster
@LanceThruster:
Corrected to –
“I like Ike, cuz Ike is easy to like.”
&
“I hate Mitt, cuz Mitt is full of shlt.”
Ben Franklin
I just heard Chuck Todd say Romney is down just 10 points in polling and ‘that’s where he wants to be’.
Lying sack of shit. They want to be UP 10 points. Where do they get these idjits?
LanceThruster
@trollhattan:
That does not bode well for my dinghy.
PurpleGirl
@cathyx: He either borrows from a bank or from investors. If at all possible he does not use his own money — that would be too much risk. He also doesn’t really care if investors take the risk and lose. He (and Bain) must make money at any cost.
trollhattan
@Ben Franklin:
By that logic, it’s better to be in a midair collision than a “near miss.”
arguingwithsignposts
Re: Are we better off than we were 4 years ago.
The answer for many people may be “yes,” but the problem is a confusion between “better” and “well.” Are people doing better? many. Are they doing well? that’s not so clear. And there is still a lot of uncertainty. People lost a LOT in the 2008 debacle. Don’t discount their perception that they still aren’t where they want to be.
Sarah, Proud and Tall
@Rex Everything:
I like you.
Ben Franklin
Newt going ballistic on MTP
‘Where is the outrage’ heh.
arguingwithsignposts
@Ben Franklin:
How weird. That’s where i want him to be too. Especially in the only poll that matters.
J
Speaking of big lies, Romney’s claim that the Republicans put aside differences at the beginning of the Obama administration to work for the good of the country may be the biggest–and most pernicious–whopper of them all.
The Republican party was, and is more than willing to see the country suffer if it will improve its chances of gaining power.
General Stuck
After the GOP convention, Even the Wall Street Journal editorial board is scratching their noodles as to what exactly does Mitt Romney plan to do as president, along with his reverse Robin, Paul Ryan.
They plan to help the middle class shed its working class burdens as well as what is left of their bank accounts, and train them into being hunter gatherers, scrapping for every scrap just like the poor have done for millenia, under the passionate stewardship of little baby jeevus.
So Hey, WAPO!! You don’t really expect them to provide a power point on the details of their plan, with an election to win, do you? The godbotherers would ask too many questions with bad answers.
You can have my answer now Senator, I offer nothing
Jennifer
@Violet: This should answer all your questions:
Tony Soprano explains Bain Capital
ThresherK
@trollhattan: Yeah, but as the screen presence to remember from the movie, I’ll take Alec Baldwin on the left’s side in lieu of Mamet.
Violet
@Ben Franklin: I cannot believe I actually liked Chuck Todd back in 2008. Remember there were blogs devoted to him? People thought he was a straight shooter and he seemed a refreshing change from the usual political reporters.
I feel so dumb.
Chuck is the worst kind of Villager. For him, truth is something that only appears as a reflection in a Both Sides Do It interpretive dance.
Ben Franklin
@arguingwithsignposts:
Heh. That’s an anchor-worthy Convention bounce.
trollhattan
@LanceThruster:
[Switching to four Yorkshiremen] Dinghy? Sheer luxury! Why, we have to make do with an inverted cap from a tagger’s spraypaint can. And we’re happy to have it.
aimai
@trollhattan:
Yeah, it was very Glen Garry Glen Ross but I thought for most people watching it it was probably more like the Apprentice (which I never saw).
aimai
LanceThruster
Newt is beating the ‘Biden in chains’ meme. F that POS. I saw him earlier in the week saying that it means that Biden is accusing the GOP of wanting a return to slavery, not a metaphor.
Well then “unchain Wall Street” means that they have been completely deprived of the fruits of their labor as they toil for others with no reward but the crack of the whip.
Biden’s analogy is not far from being metaphorically true for all of us, as WS has ensured our oppression from and servitude to a corrupt system.
Wall Street “unchained” brings to mind the image of King Kong just before the deadly rampage.
Newt U needs to lose its accredidation.
trollhattan
@Violet:
To borrow a Coleism, Chuck Todd has one of the most punchable necks on television. I wince each time I have to look at him.
Citizen_X
@aimai: Jason Jones was perfect for that role. I loved the “Third prize is you’re fired”/Glengarry Glen Ross part, where they said of the Mississippi delegate: “You hear that? Her state is performing dead last and she’s STILL outselling both you guys!”
Ben Franklin
@Violet:
He seems a competent analyst, but I’ve always had an olfactory reaction to him on my smell TeeVee.
SiubhanDuinne
@Violet:
I vaguely remember seeing some rumors a few months ago that NBC was unhappy with the smug chipmunk ( ::does little happy dance because of “smug chipmunk”:: ) and planned to replace him, but I guess that’s all they were, rumors.
Ben Franklin
No edit; smellovision
LanceThruster
Btw, saw JFK at the 1960 DNC in LA on CSPAN last night, and he had a great line very apropos for today…
“The Republicans claim to be the party of Linclon, but with malice to all, and charity towards none.”
Citizen_X
@Ben Franklin:
Ah, but you see, it’s so stupid it’s brilliant!
lamh35
@geg6: what did Donna Brazile say?
Jennifer
@SiubhanDuinne: Just wait, though…if they do replace him, it will probably be with Lil’ Luke Russert.
Violet
@Jennifer: Ohhh…that is good. Maybe a tad too long, but very good. I do remember it now that you posted it.
I wish our Democratic spokespeople would start calling what Bain did a bust out. It’s so clearly vulture capitalists do.
CarolDuhart2
One way to describe what Romney does is this: have you ever heard of those parasites that kill the host and feed off it? That’s Romney business practices in a nutshell. The parasites get in through food, eat the host alive, and then kill it.
Or those rent-to-own deals where you pay twice as much as the item is worth, and then it’s worthless, but you have to take it back. That’s Romney’s line of work. Romney is just an overfed parasite and scavenger, like the folks who sometimes hang around the stuff left on the sidewalk after an eviction.
No bounce? That has to be the first time a Convention in the modern era hasn’t had one. Even bad ones have been a sort of rallying cry for the party at times. But it shows how full of fail the Republican Convention was. They didn’t even try to reach out to anyone outside of the party, had no enthusiasm for it’s nominee, and was nothing but nasty all around. By the time it was done, I bet people were looking forward to what will doubtless be a Democratic Lovefest just as an antidote.
trollhattan
@Jennifer:
Or EWE Rickson. For balance, you see.
Anya
@Violet: Someone should tweet it to Axelrod, Plouffe, or Stephanie Cutter.
Ben Franklin
@Citizen_X:
Ah, but you see, it’s so stupid it’s brilliant!
It’s that covert subjectivity that makes it brilliant…….”LIAR !”
LanceThruster
Jon Voight’s on my local ABC public affairs show. Gawd, how I despise him (largely as Israel’s lackey, but for plenty of other nonsense that comes out of that otherwise talented piehole).
Ouch! He’s explaining how he became a conservative (Dems caused the murder of 2.5 million people by pulling out of Vietnam).
The stupid…it burns!
Violet
@SiubhanDuinne: I think they got bad press with the Ann Curry stuff at the Today Show and didn’t want to risk more bad press by replacing the Smug Chipmunk too close after that. I think another problem is they don’t have anyone they can replace him with. Okay, there are plenty of people if they think outside the box, but politics-y white guy replacements would be limited to Chuck Todd.
I also think that this close to the election they don’t want to shake up the show. They went through that last time when Russert died around this time and they just don’t want to do it again, imho.
After the election, unless ratings are massively improved, I think Gregory’s toast.
LanceThruster
@LanceThruster:
AND NOW HE’S PLUGGING DINESH D’SOUZA’S POLISHED TURD!
ARRGH!
[shoot me now]
Mr Stagger Lee
@Citizen_X: Come Tuesday the deluge via Citizens United, plus John Q Public pays attention, it is going to be fun, ugly, interesting. Lets see if Mencken was right about the American People.
slag
Soooo…what’s up with Dana Milbank actually elucidating rather than obfuscating an issue? Is he still trying to slough off the #dickwhisperer moniker that he so took so much time to procure?
Anya
@Ben Franklin: This is the same Chuck Todd who this dumb comment during the Republican Convention:
gelfling545
Fine is not the same as better than 4 years ago. Many people are better off it only because of the Affordable Care Act which has helped a large number. Better means less bad than it was, which is quite true.
SiubhanDuinne
@Jennifer:
:: shudder ::
Paul
@Ben Franklin:
Not much different than Mark “the classless Republican pundit who called Obama the d-word” Halperin, when he claimed in 2008 that any bad news for McCain was actually good news for McCain.
It really is appalling how these people make as much money as they do, yet are so incompetent.
PJ
@Davis X. Machina: Many people have no idea how the personal credit industry works, let alone the commercial credit industry – even those who work for companies who take on massive amounts of long term debt in their regular course of business. The “you must always repay your debts, no matter what it costs you” is hammered home to individuals by lending institutions and those who work for them (politicians), but no business of any size operates with that understanding. The government of course operates under completely different rules than an individual or a business and debt only hinders its operation when it’s inconceivable for it to raise operating funds (which is basically never going to be true with the US). Debt: the first 5000 years by David Graeber is a good historical/sociological analysis of this issue.
Ben Franklin
@Anya:
He dials back when Tweety has him on, but he’s half-a-birfer.
Violet
@Anya: Oh, gawd, that is sooooo dumb. Anyone who is paying attention knows that the Castro brothers in Texas are major up-and-comers in the Democratic party. Julian Castro is young, Latino, a charismatic speaker, and very smart. He’s a younger, Latino version of Obama. I hope he decides to run for Governor of Texas very soon. His brother is running for Congress in Texas.
The Dems didn’t “dig deep to find” him. They’re doing the smart thing and promoting their talent.
Chuck Todd is an idiot.
SiubhanDuinne
@Violet:
I had forgotten the timing; didn’t really pay much attention to the whole Ann Curry fiasco. But I agree that they’re locked in with him now until after the election. At which point, Fluffy leaves MTP “to explore other professional opportunities.”
gene108
@Violet:
Vultures and other scavengers provide a useful function in nature by stripping the meat off of dead animals to help those carcasses decompose faster.
I find very little that’s actually useful with regards to what private equity firms do for the overall economy.
Ann Rynd
@Jennifer: Luke Russert has gotten better. He’s been doing his homework. He is not his father and that is a good thing. My tv is thanking god every Sunday since he died because each time I’d hear “Go Bulls” I’d hurl something at it.
Also: I don’t believe Romney’s rose story. It sounds made up. An often told lie. Prove it, m-fucker.
Ben Franklin
@Paul:
It really is appalling how these people make as much money as they do, yet are so incompetent.
He tried to reinvent himself with Game Change, but he is a rank-and-file conservative.
Chris
@Jennifer:
I myself have been using “Jabba” and performing the Huttese “hoo, hoo, hoo!” belly laugh whenever he shows up on TV for quite some time, but I love your latest.
Violet
@Ann Rynd: Someone linked to a story about a guy in the UK doing that very rose thing for his wife of 60-some years. The story had appeared very recently. The person who linked it speculated that Romney just found it in his news feed.
I don’t really believe it either. Why didn’t anyone ever talk about it before the convention? Seems like the kind of thing that would show up in Romney’s book or in another speech.
arguingwithsignposts
@Anya: And herein is the problem with Josh Marshall. He starts off with:
ETA: The point being I could fill a whole college football roster with people who are knowledgable and sensible more than Chuckles.
Ben Franklin
@LanceThruster:
Well, at least it’s easy to identify him. Sometimes you need a program…..:)
Chris
@LanceThruster:
I hate Jon Voight too, but I love how “24” cast him as a genocidal supervillain from the military-industrial complex. Talk about typecasting!
kd bart
@Judas Escargot, Acerbic Prophet of the Mighty Potato God:
Another way to visualize it, remember what Gordon Gekko intended to do with Blue Star Airlines in Wall Street. Sell off all the assets, pay off the minimum he had to on the pension obligations and walk off with millions from the over funded pension fund. The airline would’ve been gone and those who worked for it would be jobless.
Ben Franklin
@Chris:
Talk about typecasting!
Manwhore
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midnight_Cowboy
Ann Rynd
@Violet: A lifetime of small lies get these narcissists to a place where people start noticing them and to then begin researching them. Ryan’s marathon lie, the rose lie, insignificant until they are enormously significant to knowing who these guys really are.
Violet
@Ann Rynd: Okay, I found mention of the rose/flower story in “The Real Romney” that was published in January. Excerpt from Page 18, via Google Books:
So he “tried” to bring her one. Not “did”. And who knows where this story came from. Probably family lore.
geg6
@lamh35:
Dowd was droning on about both sides doing it (the discussion was turning to the disrespect and outright lying by the GOP) and Brazille started to answer when Will piped up by asking her what the biggest city in IL is. Looking like WTF, she answered Chicago. Will then proceeded to say there it is, you are a racist because anytime a Republican says Chicago, they are called a racist. She puffed herself up and how she didn’t explode, I’ll never know. But she told him and Dowd to shut their fat pieholes (not exactly her words, she was more gracious than that, but the effect was the same). It was lovely to see. Now that, that was an angry black lady, but one so well trained in media that she could project her anger without sounding angry. A lovely trick that I, sadly, have never mastered.
mamayaga
Another thing to remember about Bain’s bust outs: In several instances Federal funds made up for the stolen pension funds. The victimhood from these operations was nationwide.
While we’re on the topic of basic things ordinary people don’t understand, a lot of people are clueless as to how insurance works. That is the only way the Repugs can get away with saying that SS and Medicare are generational theft, and the only way that widespread anger over the mandate can be propagated. People need to understand that as long as the right insists that we can only get our health insurance through private for-profit companies and the public insists that there should be no exclusions for preexisting conditions and no rescissions, then there has to be a mandate. Unless we’re willing to entertain a public option, anything else is childish thinking.
trollhattan
@Violet:
See, Mitt, impressed by his father’s efforts and empathetic of his inability to find a fresh rose every day in the ’50s and ’60s, despite vast wealth, power and influence, had to invent the Colombian hothouse flower industry and the international air cargo transport industry in order to supply his bride, Ann, with the daily rose his mother had tragically been deprived of.
You could look it up.
Ann Rynd
@arguingwithsignposts: Chuck Todd: a music major who dropped out before graduating. Political director of a network. The peter principle.
Sweats a lot because he’s in over his head. Will have a pronounced combover in a year or two. Ah America!
Jess
@Jennifer: Awesome! thanks!
piratedan
@trollhattan: and despite that… Wall Street still loves them some Mitt. I hate that the theme of Regulation hampers business, it doesn’t, all it does is screw with the folks that like to break the rules, that are there to protect business who do operate ethically as well as their customers, why do they continue to fuck that chicken is beyond me and simply proves that the R machine about going against your own best interests doesn’t simply apply to low information voters.
WereBear
@trollhattan: There ain’t enough roses in the world to be married to Mitt, despite his money.
Anne Romney’s convention speech was about how it sucked to be a woman, but it’s just our burden to bear. When she speaks about motherhood, it is in the context of uncontrolled boys and their mayhem. She talks about how much “fun” her husband is, but never offers specifics. The boys actually get specific; and do not even realize their little humanistic glimpses horrify the hoi polloi.
The picture they paint is of serious emotional burdens, relentless pressure, and constant Mitt-ego catering, all unfolding in dramatically luxurious environments. It’s the stuff of prime time soap opera.
Far more fun to watch than actually experience.
Paul
I think the first time I started to get sick of the cowardly and lazy “both sides do it” argument was when Edwards ran for President in 2008. Ann Coulter had said some just nasty and dishonest things about John Edwards. The Edwards campaign in response then sent out a fundraising letter quoting Ann Coulter’s words.
The next day on Hardball some pundit were describing the above verbatim and then had had the audacity to say that since the Edwards campaign fundraised quoting Ann Coulter a pox on both houses.
How in the world was the two equal to credibly claiming both sides do it? We have pundits that are just scared of calling something out because they will get nasty e-mails from the supporters of the one they call out. And as a result, we have the cowardly both sides do it. This, eventhough, anybody with a brain knows that it is not true. Why even have a media and pundits when they are too scared of doing what they are getting paid big bucks to do?
trollhattan
@WereBear:
Scratch very deep and you’ll find the prep-school bully Willard, looking for the next weird kid to abuse.
He’s still that sociopath.
Anya
@Violet: The whole “they had to dig inside a red state to find a Hispanic mayor,” is so offensive and stupid it hurts my head. It assumes that Democrats shouldn’t even consider red states. Any sensible person would think that a Democrat winning in a red state should be watched. He was also talking about the guy who’s on the Times’ list of “40 under 40” to watch, the mayor of the nation’s seventh largest city.
Anya
@arguingwithsignposts: I took that as Marshall’s “bless his heart.”
The Moar You Know
@mamayaga: But they don’t. The Pension Guarantee Fund pays 10 cents on the dollar, tops, per law.
90% gone. This happened to my dad, I know a lot more about this than I’d like.
Violet
@Anya: Totally agree. It’s offensive on a whole bunch of levels.
I think Julian Castro is great. People in San Antonio love him. And Texas is poised to go blue in the near future. Imagine if a Democrat Latino runs for Governor of Texas. I think that nudge that change along. What better way to help that along than to highlight him at the Democratic convention.
Again, Chuck Todd as an idiot.
Cacti
If the question is only whether Americans are better off than four years ago, the answer is HELL YES!
Four years ago, the stock market had lost half its value, and we were hemorrhaging 700,000 jobs a month.
How is that even a serious question?
Maude
@Jennifer:
Fat Bastard is a nickname of a character by Reginald Hill.
I don’t name call our governor, just state that he is incompetent.
Jennifer
@Maude: I was referring to Fat Bastard, the Mike Myers character from the Austin Powers movies.
trollhattan
@Jennifer:
“Get in my bellah!”
Villago Delenda Est
@kd bart:
Gecko’s pension was not involved, so why should he give a shit if a bunch of proles are reduced to eating cat food in their old age?
Just not his problem, at all.
Just like OvenMitt. The people he stole money from are not his problem.
The best way to rob a bank is to own one.
arguingwithsignposts
@Violet:
I lived in Texas most of my life. I wonder what you’ve been smoking.
AA+ Bonds
I hope people will read the Taibbi article and realize that as someone who wrote a book about conventions, he knows how little they mean
rikyrah
damn,
Willard and his team must have peed in Milbank’s breakfast one day.
Violet
@arguingwithsignposts: The good stuff.
Corner Stone
@arguingwithsignposts: It’s 20+ years away, regardless of the demo changes. We have to have the Old Guard Texas D Party leadership people die off or drop out before we can get anything done in TX.
They’ve been corrupt and sucking at the teat for so long they don’t give a shit about anyone but themselves and their “Old Boys”.
Some Loser
Yeah. I’ve been in Texas for a few years and haven’t really been following state politics, but there does not seem to be much activity or effort coming from the Texas Democratic Party. At least, I mean, in recruiting voters or energizing people to vote for Democrats for state offices. Maybe it is different in the more urban areas where it is friendlier for Progressive values, but I see many Republican bases of operations in towns and villages but no Democrat bases. It doesn’t seem to be any outreach from Democrats here. That is a shame because I know a lot of people who would be receptive to the national party’s message.
AA+ Bonds
Here’s how it works in Texas:
1) Republicans seize power
2) Republicans redraw all the districts to fight the inevitable demographic shift against Republicans
3) Demographic shift happens anyway
4) Big fuckin trouble
5) Reactionary Republicans start doing really, really bad things to the Hispanic population to hold onto power
AA+ Bonds
What I am saying is:
Texas is where Republicans are trying to start a race war against Hispanics
This is hardly a “conspiracy theory” – just Google up prominent Texas Republican politicians and what they have to say about Hispanic culture, and how they believe it should be purged
Their attempts to start a race war are based on their own conspiracy theory – a Reichstag fire type situation where they claim Hispanic immigration is part of an effort by Mexico to reconquer the Western United States
You can’t get any crazier than that, really
AA+ Bonds
This is why so many Republicans are opposed to the Voting Rights Act, by the way, because the only way Republicans will have power in the next decade is if black and Hispanic populations are re-subjugated to Republican-style Jim Crow voting laws
Rex Everything
@Sarah, Proud and Tall: Hey are you the Sarah who was around & about Manhattan back in the day, rumored to give a better blowjob than Quentin Crisp? I like you too!
JustAnotherBob
@Chris T.:
More: PL had been cutting a bit below the sustainable threshold and treating their employees well. PL could have run forever based on the way they operated and locals would have had good jobs for generations.
The PL buyout was financed largely with junk bonds.
As you said, the rate of cutting was ramped up to the point where almost all the mature timber was harvested. A small portion of critical watershed was sold to the government at a very high price. (“Pay us well or we’ll cut these few remaining old growth trees.”)
PL sold off assets. The machinery that could cut very large diameter trees got shipped away. The trucking assets were sold off.
During all of this the cash flowed to Texas minus just enough to pay bond interest.
PL declared bankruptcy and left the bond holders holding paper backed by some timber land with no timber on it.
The local economy got fvcked.
JustRuss
@Ben Franklin: I nominate “And that’s where he wants to be” to replace 2012’s “Good news for John McCain”