@Iowa Old Lady:
They think war is glorious, and that only childish idealists are concerned with whether politics helps or hurts anyone. By now, I’d say that’s quite well established.
10.
Elmo
@Iowa Old Lady: What real people? You mean soldiers and foreigners?
11.
pseudonymous in nc
I like the fact that Israeli TV is showing it on a five-minute delay to cut out anything that smacks of election campaigning, because “election propaganda” is banned in the last two weeks before a vote. Israel also has public financing of elections and strict caps on private contributions. (It’s streamable live, of course, but laws are laws.)
A good reminder that Israel is, in fact, not the US.
Remember the real world threat is Iran and not Saudi Arabia or their ISIL proxies.
15.
Michael G
Congress’s habit of clapping and whooping at anything they agree with is really fucking with Bibi’s timing.
16.
SteveinSC
This is the most outrageous attempt to meddle in American foreign policy since Madam Chiang Kai-shek used to roam around spewing her drivel and Cardinal Spellman was pushing his christianist jehad in Vietnam. Ronald “Stuffed” Dermer should be declared personna non grata and thrown out of this country. Boner is acting at the behest of a foreign power and as such is bordering on treasonous.
17.
Mike in NC
May Bibi the warmonger step on a banana peel as he approaches the top of the Capitol steps.
I must regret to inform Congress that I will not pay attention to this sh-tburger being offered to the world, as I will be busy helping people with their research needs on a state-wide level with Ask-A-Librarian chat support.
P.S. Stop voting Republican, everybody. This is the quality of political leadership we get from them nowadays: worthless and fear-mongering.
@Villago Delenda Est: When did things change so that you had to be pre-qualified to call yourself a Christian? For most of my life, you were a Christian if you went to, say, a Methodist church or even if you just said believed in Christian doctrine. Pretty much everyone I knew qualified except for my Jewish friends. Now it’s treated like an honorific that some high level crowd gets to say whether you deserve.
28.
D58826
We don’t need to go to war with Iran, just demand a better deal, i.e. 1. Iran gives up terrorism, 2. Iran gives up aggression in the middle east, 3. Iran stops threatening Israel, and last but not least 4. Iran eliminates it’s entire nuclear program. See how easy that all is.
Needless to say pink unicorns will graze on the White House lawn before Iran agrees to any of that.
We now are getting a history lesson on the Holocaust and the Exodus.
Exactly when did the US Congress become a wholly owned subsidiary of Lekud?
Bibi makes it sound like Iran is a bigger threat than the USSR. We survived the cold war I suspect that we will survive a nuclear armed Iran if it comes to that..
29.
Betty Cracker
He has traded the Israeli-US relationship for a Likud-GOP alliance. He chose poorly.
30.
GregB
The entire speech is predicated on the notion that President Obama is working on a bad deal.
The morons in the Democratic Party that went are applauding this?
31.
shortstop
@Chris: Bibi is just being Bibi, exactly as we expect him to be. I think the real fucking should be saved for the GOP for giving a foreign head of state the first-ever opportunity to come to Congress to openly defy a sitting U.S. president. Just imagine Shamir doing this when GHWB was prez.
32.
Elmo
Confession time: I have a troll account over at FreeRepublic that I post to when I’m bored and ornery. Lately I’ve been over there asking why Bibi is even allowing the election to take place, since he’s obviously the leader they need. He should suspend elections until Israel isn’t in mortal danger!
Not one person – not one – has called out the obvious fascism. The most I got was a gentle reminder that it was Bibi who called the elections in the first place.
33.
GregB
So now we find out of this destroys the negotiations with Iran.
Which will pave the way to a more hostile relationship with Iran.
Which will lead to war.
34.
D58826
@GregB: Jeffrey Goldberg on MSNBC said basically the same thing. Obama is weak and naive and will sell out the US and Israel. The GOP obviously agrees.
Bibi painted Iran as the most evil country that the world has ever know. BUT if the US had a real President we could get a better deal.
Now why would the ultimate evil Iran agree to a ‘better’ Bibi dictated deal?. Bibi is demanding an unconditional Iranian surrender. It isn’t going to happen
35.
Betty Cracker
@GregB: It will lead to war for the US only if we keep electing morons. I realize there’s a high likelihood of that; just wanted to point out that Iran is absolutely NO threat to the US.
36.
Iowa Old Lady
@GregB: A war they will not be willing to pay for while screaming about the deficit. And that doesn’t count the cost in lives. Our military is stretched thin already.
We now are getting a history lesson on the Holocaust and the Exodus.
Lovely. Exodus is about as historically accurate as The Flintstones.
40.
Elie
I posted this comment on another thread but it fits here too…
This is wrong regardless of what anyone believes the policy should be. For a so called ally to come to our Congress to undermine a foreign policy initiative undertaken by this country is on its face, terrible and without justification. period. Also, what is the alternative for Israel? For us? Do we go to war with Iran or continue sanctions and other punishments just to please them? We need balance in the ME and having a participating Iran will check many of the excesses of not just Israel but Saudi Arabia. Need we be reminded of which country is the most aggressive state sponsor of terrorism????? It aint Iran…
There is something very very wrong on Boehner’s part in this… he is not listening to the demands of his role as an officer of our government. His owner, his loyalty I believe is not even to the Republican Party but to a corporate ownership that respects no national loyalties but their interests… this was very much to instill and inflame and cause splits in the American people so that we can be further manipulated by our anger and tribal interests rather than for the good of all.
I cannot remember being this upset about anything related to our government — and certainly nothing about Israel. I am changed and I will never forget this and in my gut, I feel this is a very very bad precedent and will have deep impact on our country…
Oh, I agree – my contempt for Likud and the far-right Orthodox parties is nothing compared to my contempt for their American groupies. But hey, at the moment it’s Bibi giving the speech – and he’s richly deserving of that same phrase in any case. So fuck Bibi.
The few little bits I just read of his speech had him fantasizing about Iran “gobbling up entire countries” and being on the march – never mind that they’ve lost their only reliable ally in the region and that the rising tide at the moment is their enemies, not them or their allies.
On BBC World News they had Israel’s economy minister, who called Obama naive. Unlike our MSM hacks, Laura Trevelyan countered, “you are calling the President of a superpower naive? ”
The minister sounded exactly like a Fox News wingnut.
Problem is, this is a problem that goes far beyond Boehner. The notion that our entire Middle East policy should be based around What Israel Wants is a delusion that goes far beyond the political class.
45.
No One of Consequence
@Chris: Hear hear! “Mr Nettanyoohoo, we’d like to help you out. Which way did you come in?”
If I recall correctly, there is a minor corollary that used to be in the Bible before the Council of ReasonableEdit, which went something like: “… and Roasted be the WarMongers…”
Fuck you Bibi. Why don’t you take a lesson from your Holocaust and treat all people with dignity and respect. Keeping a people under your bootheel and continuing to take what land they have left does not engender you or your people or your nation to the rest of the planet.
Oh, and at least one American has not forgotten the USS Liberty you shitweasal.
Now why would the ultimate evil Iran agree to a ‘better’ Bibi dictated deal?. Bibi is demanding an unconditional Iranian surrender. It isn’t going to happen
Netanyahu doesn’t want a better deal. He wants genocide. I grew up Jewish. I know lots of ultra-orthodox. I know what Likud voters want. It’s a lot like what American conservatives want. They think Arabs/Muslims (they can’t tell the difference) are subhuman and peace will only happen when they’ve been wiped out. As someone I am disgusted to be related to put it when Israel bombed a school, ‘They’d just grow up to be terrorists anyway.’
I totally agree and was not as clear in my arguments as I should have been… the crazy shit we see from many of the republicans and the silence and passivity from many of the democrats have the same parent and it aint love or respect for what this country is supposed to stand for… this is a reflection of narrow, parochial, corporate interests. That at least is my growing belief… nothing else makes sense…
The second layer of this strategy is creating a balance of power. The United States wants regional powers to deal with issues that threaten their interests more than American interests. At the same time, the United States does not want any one country to dominate the region. Therefore, it is in the American interest to have multiple powers balancing each other. There are four such powers: Turkey, Iran, Saudi Arabia and Israel. Some collaborate, some are hostile, and some shift over time. The United States wants to get rid of Iran’s weapons, but it does not want to shatter the country. It is part of a pattern of regional responsibility and balance.
This is the heart of Israel’s problem. It has always been a pawn in U.S. strategy, but a vital pawn. In this emerging strategy, with multiple players balancing each other and the United States taking the minimum possible action to maintain the equilibrium, Israel finds itself in a complex relationship with three countries that it cannot be sure of managing by itself. By including Iran in this mix, the United States includes what Israel regards as an unpredictable element not solely because of the nuclear issue but because Iran’s influence stretches to Syria and Lebanon and imposes costs and threats Israel wants to avoid.
49.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@schrodinger’s cat: I guess the Mossad and the nearly two hundred military and intelligence officers who were calling for BiBi to keep his yap shut are “naive”, too. If only they understood military operations and the geopolitics of the middle east as well as John Boehner, John McCain and Jeffery Goldberg.
on a completely unrelated note, we seem to be quietly relying on the Iranians to lead Shia’ militias working next to the official Iraqi army in the current drive to take Tikrit from ISIS, on the road to Mosul. Good thing there’s no history of conflict between Shias and Sunnis
They think Arabs/Muslims (they can’t tell the difference)
I had to crack up last summer when a relative of mine, after spending the entire summer in full mental breakdown over the fact that people were daring to question Infallible Israel, randomly posting a video about the plight of Christians under Hamas, and adding “I didn’t know there were Christians in Gaza!”
Oh, honey. No, of course you didn’t. Just like and for the same reason that you managed to find the video where they talk about how Hamas treats them, but channel surfed right past all the ones where they mention that Israel treats them just as badly. I mean, why would you? They’re only one tenth of the Palestinian population, after all, so not knowing that they exist is kind of like saying “I had no idea there were black people in America.” Does it ever occur to you, when you stumble across something like this, that if you have such a horrifically bad grasp of something as simple as “what religions are involved in this conflict?” maybe it’s time to take a step back and wonder “what ELSE am I missing about this?” instead of continuing the full throated “Israel can do no wrong” screeching?
No, of course it didn’t. That would be crimethink. Carry on. You and the rest of this fucking country.
This must not be undermined… or the US will be chasing its tail in non stop ME wars and being led around by the nose by Israel.. we cannot have it. Period
53.
Betty Cracker
@schrodinger’s cat: Bingo, and with Netanyahu’s enthusiastic coat-holding!
No, I think it’s much too well rooted in the population to be explained simply by corporate interests. I’d say it’s a combination of acting out Bible fan fiction and working through our own Holocaust guilt in a way that doesn’t require us to shoulder much of the burden. In this particular place, the Republican determination to bring down Obama to the exclusion of all other considerations factors into it too.
55.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Joel: pretty much my take as regards Obama’s longer strategy, the alleged naive is practicing some pretty cold-blooded realpolitik. And I approve.
56.
WaterGirl
@Elie: I don’t know if we have the equivalent of “high crimes and misdemeanors” for the house and the senate,but if so, it surely seems like this move by boehner qualifies.
I think we will see President Obama come out very strongly against this in the next few days, after this debacle of a speech and visit is over. I am reminded of the interview where candidate says “I will crush them”.
@Joel:
I’m sorry, no. This excerpt is beyond bullshit. The US doesn’t want powers balancing each other. Democrats want peace, and Republicans want holy war, and keeping various Mideast nations in tension does not help either. Israel is also not a pawn of anybody. They have their own interests, and they’re sure as Hell not concerned about Iran because of anything the US does. Bibi wants his people to believe they’re facing an existential threat, surrounded by murderous anti-Semite savages, and peace is impossible. That gets him votes and lets him continue his slow attempts to wipe out the Palestinians. This isn’t diabolical Realpolitik. Everyone involved wants exactly what they say except Iran, who only mostly wants what they say but have a tradition of inflamatory rhetoric. It’s just a thing for them, as essential and meaningless as Republicans claiming they’re ‘fiscal conservatives’.
58.
Germy Shoemangler
@pseudonymous in nc: A good reminder that Israel is, in fact, not the US.
Health care in Israel is universal and participation in a medical insurance plan is compulsory. All Israeli citizens are entitled to basic health care as a fundamental right. Based on legislation passed in the 1990s, citizens join one of four health care funds for basic treatment but can increase medical coverage by purchasing supplementary health care. In a survey of 48 countries in 2013, Israel’s health system was ranked fourth in the world in terms of efficiency.
59.
Elie
From the article cited above by Joel:
So a speech will be made. Obama and Netanyahu are supposed to dislike each other. Politicians are going to be elected and jockey for power. All of this is true, and none of it matters. What does matter is that the United States, regardless of who is president, has to develop a new strategy in the region. This is the only option other than trying to occupy Syria and Iraq. Israel, regardless of who is prime minister, does not want to be left as part of this system while the United States maintains ties with all the other players along with Israel. Israel doesn’t have the weight to block this strategy, and the United States has no alternative but to pursue it.
This isn’t about Netanyahu and Obama, and both know it. It is about the reconfiguration of a region the United States cannot subdue and cannot leave. It is the essence of great power strategy: creating a balance of power in which the balancers are trapped into playing a role they don’t want. It is not a perfect strategy, but it is the only one the United States has. Israel is not alone in not wanting this. Turkey, Iran and Saudi Arabia don’t want it, either. But geopolitics is indifferent to wishes. It understands only imperatives and constraints
Politicians are going to be elected and jockey for power. All of this is true, and none of it matters.
This matters gigantically. No nation is an entity of its own plotting its own course independent of its politicians. Romney or Obama makes a huge difference. The writer identifies real issues, but then goes off into a conspiracy theorist fantasy land where international politics is decided by rational, emotionless self-interest and scheming of nations.
62.
catclub
Does anyone know if Bibi said anything new or surprising? NPR was hoping he would. I doubt it.
Also, heard a commentator saying that Churchill gave up the colonial empire to ensure US support in WWII. Bibi has given up bupkis to ensure US support of Israel. And Bibi thinks of himself as like Churchill.
Rather than nitpick those details, take a look at the larger frame that is being described. Surely you cannot disagree about the reality of the US entrapment in the situation and our very real need to reconfigure the balance of power. We will not be able to address (read manage not solve) ISIS or any other the other problems in that region without rethinking what we are doing, no? The sunni empowered countries (Saudi Arabia, Turkey, etc), have not helped this situation much — and Israel has certainly not been anything but an inflammatory issue with its settlements and attacks on the Palastinians. Man, a new approach is absolutely necessary, doncha think?
64.
Bobby Thomson
@Betty Cracker: why? It’s not like Democrats have the courage to do anything about it.
ETA: it’ll be a cold day in Riyadh before AIPAC can’t get its calls returned.
@Elie:
Exhibit A: George and Dick’s Crapulent Adventure. That certainly was not part of a strategy of balancing forces in the Mideast, did not serve America’s interests, and was not decided on or pursued rationally. It was the product of two people’s arrogance and greed. Similarly, Israel’s policies would differ wildly with a liberal coalition involved instead of a far right extremist. It might be useful to balance powers, but politics doesn’t work like that.
EDIT – @Elie:
Again, real issues, but the follow-through does not work that way. Obama’s policies will not be continued by a Republican president. America will not balance forces. Individual politicians will do what they think is right. Some will be Kissingeresque schemers. Others will be warmongers like Bush. Others will just want peace, and think it’s smartest to let the locals handle their own disputes.
EDIT EDIT – I apologize for the tone. I really need to go eat, and I get cranky as Hell before breakfast.
66.
Patrick
Well, at least there is now a new precedent. The next time we have a Republican President who wants to start an idiotic war, the Dems have every fricking right to invite a leader of one of our allies to speak against such a war in Congress.
I couldn’t possibly care less what the Israeli leader stated. It was just wrong to have him there when our own President hadn’t even been consulted.
Churchill gave up the colonial empire to ensure US support in WWII.
Only in the sense that everything would go back to normal after the war. Churchill was an imperialist through and through and had no intention of permanently letting any of the colonies go, especially India. The French were also adamant about reestablishing themselves in North Africa and Indochina.
I agree that the complex internal politics of our system enter into this. That is why the right is trying so desperately to blow the Iran negotiation — it literally puts the US on a totally different path that makes their warmongering more complex and difficult. None of this changes the conclusion above about the geopolitical realities of the region and the imperatives that we face there. Don’t see that.
69.
pseudonymous in nc
@Germy Shoemangler: yeah, I always wish those more-pro-Israel-than-Israelis GOPers were asked about universal healthcare.
No worries about your tone… I get cranky too with an empty stomach. I can’t do shit without my bowl of oatmeal in the am :-)
I don’t disagree with your point that US policy might change from time to time. That said, a major new relationship with Iran and our continued need to take care of economic and other interests that don’t involve being sucked into the ME forever, will probably influence future leaders to support this at least to some extent. Only the most bizarre Republicans don’t see the reality that we are not going to be sending 500k troops on the ground into Syria… that just aint gonna happen. We have other interests evolving as well as real limitations and they know it.
@catclub: The British grip on the empire was loosening since after the debacle of WW I, Churchill didn’t give up anything, the British could not have held on for much longer even if they had wanted to. The famine of 42-43 was Churchill’s gift to India for supplying the manpower and money to Britain’s war effort.
73.
slag
Why read the transcript when we can just guess the shorter: “Let’s invade Iran and Iraq (again); you go first!”?
@catclub: The British grip on the empire was loosening since after the debacle of WW I, Churchill didn’t give up anything, the British could not have held on for much longer even if they had wanted to. The famine of 42-43 was Churchill’s gift to India for supplying the manpower and money to Britain’s war effort.
The British may have been better than the French as colonial masters but they were not all that wonderful, actually.
77.
Sherparick
@Iowa Old Lady: Actually, although Pope Frank has gone back to the ecumenical spirit of Pope John XXIII and Paul VI and Vatican II, the old Roman Catholic Church of the Council Trent period would say that all you non-Roman Catholics are at best heretical or schismatic Christians, and many of you Evangelicals have left the rails as much as the Muslims have under Mohammed (who got much of his religious education from a cousin who was a Nestorian (Christian heresy of the 5th Century) priest). Of course, most Evangelical protestants I knew in the 1970s (before the culture wars caused the unholy alliance) considered us Papists as very non-Christian idolators between the Papacy itself, our cult of the Virgin, and veneration for the Saints (all rather polytheistic splitting up of attributes of the on the One God). It will be interesting when it comes to making “Christianity” the established religion which version of Christianity gets established in the United States.
78.
Betty Cracker
@Bobby Thomson: That correctly described the state of the relationship before Netanyahu took a dump on buffet table. We’ll see if it continues going forward.
79.
Cermet
With a cheney clone like BiBi, I have to admit that the Religious fundamentalist state of loon’s called Iran just might really need nukes just so many tens’ of thousands of American soldiers don’t die fighting for Israel’s right wing party of loons. That I’d say such a stupid thing wishing for a nuclear Iran say’s a lot about just how sick these war mongers here and in Israel have become. Any physical attack on Iran would dwarf the war in Iraq in all aspects (esp. death.)
80.
Cacti
Did he actually say anything new, or was it just the same speech he’s been giving for the last 20 years? Iran bad, booga booga, nukes, US invasions and occupations are a positive, stabilizing force in the region, etc.
81.
Bobby Thomson
@Betty Cracker: an overwhelming majority of elected Democrats says yes.
Except now the idiot is not Bibi, but the Iranians, for not seeing that making a deal with the US, any deal, is better than being under sanctions. Idiotic nationalism (we will be respected!) does funny things to sensible people.
So does religion.
84.
Lee
Wasn’t he in front of Congress speaking about the WMDs in Iraq as part of the propaganda leading up to that little adventure?
That I’d say such a stupid thing wishing for a nuclear Iran
Not stupid at all. If Iraq in 2003 actually HAD nuclear weapons – a la North Korea – we would never have invaded. Iran saw this.
Hundreds of thousands of lives not lost.
86.
Kropadope
Bibi:
We must all stand together to stop Iran’s march of conquest, subjugation and terror
Hmm…
We must all stand together to stop Iran’s Nothingyahoo’s march of conquest, subjugation and terror
Is that anything like a 70-year campaign of military occupation and land theft from a group of stateless people, while proclaiming yourself a liberal democracy?
We must all stand together to stop Iran’s march of conquest, subjugation and terror
It is interesting to note that he considers the retaking of Tikrit part of that march. In the war between ISIS and Assad, he is definitely on the ISIS side.
91.
piratedan
isn’t it awesome that on the day that a foriegn leader steps in front of our US Congress to tell us about the evil in the world that is IRAN is only two days away from when the Republicans officially refuse to fund their very own creation that was designed to keep us safe… sorry, the hypocrisy is too staggering for me to take this “event” seriously…
92.
LAC
I am surprised that dick sucking is allowed to be shown on daytime TV. How forward thinking congress is. ?
93.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@piratedan: Boehner took advantage of all the shouting and the fog of BiBi to cave, btw
WASHINGTON — It was all but inevitable, and Speaker John Boehner (R-OH) finally cut his losses on Tuesday, telling House Republicans he will allow a vote on legislation to fund the Department of Homeland Security without any immigration restrictions.
The “clean” DHS funding bill could come up as early as Tuesday. It is expected to pass with overwhelming support from Democrats and enough House Republicans.
This is “Event” is going to be a big nothingburger for Bibi. He can’t really do much about this. The Iranians would probably figure that he would do something like this and I would be surprised if the US and they didn’t already discount it. Bibi and Israel have limited traction left using their current strategy on the settlements and Palestinian oppression.. I would hope that the Israelis are smart enough to get this. This is their maximum power point and how fast they go downhill from here in relation to driving US policy, is up to them.
98.
Betty Cracker
@Bobby Thomson: I just read Nancy Pelosi’s statement, and now I think maybe you’re right and I’m wrong. She got around to criticizing the speech, and fairly harshly. But only after spending the first paragraph going on about how Israel is the kindest, bravest, warmest, most wonderful nation the US has ever known. I was embarrassed for her, honestly.
I tend to agree with you that Iranis not going to let this derail the ongoing negotiations. They’ll probably try to use it to gain a few more concessions, but that’s what any negotiator would do.
As Fallows said, it’s in Iran’s national interest for there to be a rapprochement between them and the US, which is exactly why Bibi is trying to throw a wrench in the works. It’s hard to be tw big bully on the block when your biggest backer starts getting friendly with everyone else.
101.
Botsplainer
That speech was a wingnut fantasy. He’s claiming that Iran is running things in Beirut, Damascus and Baghdad.
Complete idiocy, and those fools were war-whooping him.
102.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Betty Cracker: it’s her critiques that are getting the most play, and they’re pretty strong. I like Nancy Pelosi a lot, but even before she took impeachment “off the table”– which was true but she didn’t need to say– for most of the Bush years if you asked her what time it was she would preface her answer by saying “We stand shoulder to shoulder with President Bush in the fight against terrorism, but it’s 12:30”. And unfortunately it’s a sign that she gets that everything Dems say and do have to be thought out in terms of willful misinterpretation.
103.
Felonius Monk
If only the FSM could be so kind as to give us the ultimate Boehner slapdown — a Bibi election defeat. Good for us — good for Israel.
104.
mdblanche
@Botsplainer: To be fair, Iran does have considerable influence in those capitals. Bibi is partially responsible for their influence in Baghdad. If Bibi would prefer an alternative, I hear ISIL is available…
I don’t think it matters whether Bibi is or is not re-elected. This is not his to control. Israel is NOT running US policy. Period. THAT is why he was here and reveals his desperation and loss of power….or rather traction… Boehner cannot help him — it is bigger than him or the Republicans…
106.
Elie
I will also add that Diane Feinstein’s reaction to his speech reveals a lot to me. She understands US’s strategic interests better than many having been on the senate foreign relations committee and the coldness she displayed says a lot. She wasn’t pissed off about the decorum and protocol issue.. she was (to me), clearly communicating to Bibi that US interests may be quite different than Israel’s — get used to it.” Pelosi, while superficially smarmy with the tears thing, also sent a basic message that she was not influenced to change US direction on this policy in any real way. She threw him a bone at the beginning with the powerful speech thing.
107.
LAC
@Betty Cracker: lol! It is rude, I know. But my god, the whole situation just pissed me off.
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lawguy
You are a masochist aren’t you?
geg6
I refuse to pay attention to this asshole. I won’t be watching it, reading it or following one iota of coverage about it.
Schlemazel
The Spineless Ms. Klobucher will be part of this fuck show, the Honorable Mr. Franken chose to ignore it as we all should.
eemom
He is an asshole, and I hope the people of Israel throw him out on his ass.
Iowa Old Lady
The horrible part is that the MSM treats this like just part of the horse race rather than something that could start a war in which real people die.
Elizabelle
Shall studiously avoid any Bibi news or transcriptions.
How about that flying baby weasel?
Ridnik Chrome
The speech is running live on NY1 in the cafeteria at my place of employment. Delaying lunch so I won’t have to listen to it while I’m eating…
Villago Delenda Est
Got a letter from my congressman (Peter DeFazio) yesterday.
He won’t be in attendance.
Huzzah.
Frankensteinbeck
@Iowa Old Lady:
They think war is glorious, and that only childish idealists are concerned with whether politics helps or hurts anyone. By now, I’d say that’s quite well established.
Elmo
@Iowa Old Lady: What real people? You mean soldiers and foreigners?
pseudonymous in nc
I like the fact that Israeli TV is showing it on a five-minute delay to cut out anything that smacks of election campaigning, because “election propaganda” is banned in the last two weeks before a vote. Israel also has public financing of elections and strict caps on private contributions. (It’s streamable live, of course, but laws are laws.)
A good reminder that Israel is, in fact, not the US.
Iowa Old Lady
@Frankensteinbeck: That’s true, and it’s sick.
Roger That
10 “bomb bomb bomb, bomb bomb Iran”
20 goto 10
GregB
Remember the real world threat is Iran and not Saudi Arabia or their ISIL proxies.
Michael G
Congress’s habit of clapping and whooping at anything they agree with is really fucking with Bibi’s timing.
SteveinSC
This is the most outrageous attempt to meddle in American foreign policy since Madam Chiang Kai-shek used to roam around spewing her drivel and Cardinal Spellman was pushing his christianist jehad in Vietnam. Ronald “Stuffed” Dermer should be declared personna non grata and thrown out of this country. Boner is acting at the behest of a foreign power and as such is bordering on treasonous.
Mike in NC
May Bibi the warmonger step on a banana peel as he approaches the top of the Capitol steps.
GregB
This is fucking disgusting.
bjacques
@SteveinSC: Unleash Zombie Chiang Kai-Shek!
PaulW
I must regret to inform Congress that I will not pay attention to this sh-tburger being offered to the world, as I will be busy helping people with their research needs on a state-wide level with Ask-A-Librarian chat support.
P.S. Stop voting Republican, everybody. This is the quality of political leadership we get from them nowadays: worthless and fear-mongering.
PaulW
@bjacques:
One zombie against mainland China is how World War Z started in the book.
Patricia Kayden
I heard that Republicans gave Netanyahu a rapturous standing ovation. Perhaps he can take them back to Israel with him.
Villago Delenda Est
@SteveinSC: I think we’ve established that, for many “Christians”, Catholics are not in the club.
Patricia Kayden
@GregB: Good point. But for some reason, we’re buddy buddy with Saudi Arabia.
Chris
Fuck Bibi.
To be slightly more nuanced about it: fuck Bibi.
There’s a big screen downstairs showing the speech, I don’t have the stomach to watch. I don’t think I even have the stomach to read it.
But seriously, fuck Bibi.
OzarkHillbilly
@pseudonymous in nc: So they’re just blocking it altogether?
Iowa Old Lady
@Villago Delenda Est: When did things change so that you had to be pre-qualified to call yourself a Christian? For most of my life, you were a Christian if you went to, say, a Methodist church or even if you just said believed in Christian doctrine. Pretty much everyone I knew qualified except for my Jewish friends. Now it’s treated like an honorific that some high level crowd gets to say whether you deserve.
D58826
We don’t need to go to war with Iran, just demand a better deal, i.e. 1. Iran gives up terrorism, 2. Iran gives up aggression in the middle east, 3. Iran stops threatening Israel, and last but not least 4. Iran eliminates it’s entire nuclear program. See how easy that all is.
Needless to say pink unicorns will graze on the White House lawn before Iran agrees to any of that.
We now are getting a history lesson on the Holocaust and the Exodus.
Exactly when did the US Congress become a wholly owned subsidiary of Lekud?
Bibi makes it sound like Iran is a bigger threat than the USSR. We survived the cold war I suspect that we will survive a nuclear armed Iran if it comes to that..
Betty Cracker
He has traded the Israeli-US relationship for a Likud-GOP alliance. He chose poorly.
GregB
The entire speech is predicated on the notion that President Obama is working on a bad deal.
The morons in the Democratic Party that went are applauding this?
shortstop
@Chris: Bibi is just being Bibi, exactly as we expect him to be. I think the real fucking should be saved for the GOP for giving a foreign head of state the first-ever opportunity to come to Congress to openly defy a sitting U.S. president. Just imagine Shamir doing this when GHWB was prez.
Elmo
Confession time: I have a troll account over at FreeRepublic that I post to when I’m bored and ornery. Lately I’ve been over there asking why Bibi is even allowing the election to take place, since he’s obviously the leader they need. He should suspend elections until Israel isn’t in mortal danger!
Not one person – not one – has called out the obvious fascism. The most I got was a gentle reminder that it was Bibi who called the elections in the first place.
GregB
So now we find out of this destroys the negotiations with Iran.
Which will pave the way to a more hostile relationship with Iran.
Which will lead to war.
D58826
@GregB: Jeffrey Goldberg on MSNBC said basically the same thing. Obama is weak and naive and will sell out the US and Israel. The GOP obviously agrees.
Bibi painted Iran as the most evil country that the world has ever know. BUT if the US had a real President we could get a better deal.
Now why would the ultimate evil Iran agree to a ‘better’ Bibi dictated deal?. Bibi is demanding an unconditional Iranian surrender. It isn’t going to happen
Betty Cracker
@GregB: It will lead to war for the US only if we keep electing morons. I realize there’s a high likelihood of that; just wanted to point out that Iran is absolutely NO threat to the US.
Iowa Old Lady
@GregB: A war they will not be willing to pay for while screaming about the deficit. And that doesn’t count the cost in lives. Our military is stretched thin already.
GregB
@Betty Cracker:
Oh, the notion that Iran is such a threat to the US is pretty laughable.
schrodinger's cat
Who put Iran’s buddies in power in Iraq? What exactly did Bush’s Iraq invasion achieve except make Iran a more powerful regional player than it was?
Faction
@D58826:
Lovely. Exodus is about as historically accurate as The Flintstones.
Elie
I posted this comment on another thread but it fits here too…
This is wrong regardless of what anyone believes the policy should be. For a so called ally to come to our Congress to undermine a foreign policy initiative undertaken by this country is on its face, terrible and without justification. period. Also, what is the alternative for Israel? For us? Do we go to war with Iran or continue sanctions and other punishments just to please them? We need balance in the ME and having a participating Iran will check many of the excesses of not just Israel but Saudi Arabia. Need we be reminded of which country is the most aggressive state sponsor of terrorism????? It aint Iran…
There is something very very wrong on Boehner’s part in this… he is not listening to the demands of his role as an officer of our government. His owner, his loyalty I believe is not even to the Republican Party but to a corporate ownership that respects no national loyalties but their interests… this was very much to instill and inflame and cause splits in the American people so that we can be further manipulated by our anger and tribal interests rather than for the good of all.
I cannot remember being this upset about anything related to our government — and certainly nothing about Israel. I am changed and I will never forget this and in my gut, I feel this is a very very bad precedent and will have deep impact on our country…
Chris
@shortstop:
Oh, I agree – my contempt for Likud and the far-right Orthodox parties is nothing compared to my contempt for their American groupies. But hey, at the moment it’s Bibi giving the speech – and he’s richly deserving of that same phrase in any case. So fuck Bibi.
@Betty Cracker:
Or Israel.
The few little bits I just read of his speech had him fantasizing about Iran “gobbling up entire countries” and being on the march – never mind that they’ve lost their only reliable ally in the region and that the rising tide at the moment is their enemies, not them or their allies.
schrodinger's cat
On BBC World News they had Israel’s economy minister, who called Obama naive. Unlike our MSM hacks, Laura Trevelyan countered, “you are calling the President of a superpower naive? ”
The minister sounded exactly like a Fox News wingnut.
Elie
@schrodinger’s cat:
We need the counter balance of a participating Iran.. the drivers of most of the terrorism (including ISIS) are the Saudis, not Iran or the Shia
Chris
@Elie:
Problem is, this is a problem that goes far beyond Boehner. The notion that our entire Middle East policy should be based around What Israel Wants is a delusion that goes far beyond the political class.
No One of Consequence
@Chris: Hear hear! “Mr Nettanyoohoo, we’d like to help you out. Which way did you come in?”
If I recall correctly, there is a minor corollary that used to be in the Bible before the Council of ReasonableEdit, which went something like: “… and Roasted be the WarMongers…”
Fuck you Bibi. Why don’t you take a lesson from your Holocaust and treat all people with dignity and respect. Keeping a people under your bootheel and continuing to take what land they have left does not engender you or your people or your nation to the rest of the planet.
Oh, and at least one American has not forgotten the USS Liberty you shitweasal.
– NOoC
Frankensteinbeck
@D58826:
Netanyahu doesn’t want a better deal. He wants genocide. I grew up Jewish. I know lots of ultra-orthodox. I know what Likud voters want. It’s a lot like what American conservatives want. They think Arabs/Muslims (they can’t tell the difference) are subhuman and peace will only happen when they’ve been wiped out. As someone I am disgusted to be related to put it when Israel bombed a school, ‘They’d just grow up to be terrorists anyway.’
Elie
@Chris:
I totally agree and was not as clear in my arguments as I should have been… the crazy shit we see from many of the republicans and the silence and passivity from many of the democrats have the same parent and it aint love or respect for what this country is supposed to stand for… this is a reflection of narrow, parochial, corporate interests. That at least is my growing belief… nothing else makes sense…
Joel
Fallows provided this Stratfor link. It is illuminating.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@schrodinger’s cat: I guess the Mossad and the nearly two hundred military and intelligence officers who were calling for BiBi to keep his yap shut are “naive”, too. If only they understood military operations and the geopolitics of the middle east as well as John Boehner, John McCain and Jeffery Goldberg.
on a completely unrelated note, we seem to be quietly relying on the Iranians to lead Shia’ militias working next to the official Iraqi army in the current drive to take Tikrit from ISIS, on the road to Mosul. Good thing there’s no history of conflict between Shias and Sunnis
catclub
@Frankensteinbeck:
Battle anthem for both Israel and Saudi Arabia is “Onward Christian Soldiers”
Chris
@Frankensteinbeck:
I had to crack up last summer when a relative of mine, after spending the entire summer in full mental breakdown over the fact that people were daring to question Infallible Israel, randomly posting a video about the plight of Christians under Hamas, and adding “I didn’t know there were Christians in Gaza!”
Oh, honey. No, of course you didn’t. Just like and for the same reason that you managed to find the video where they talk about how Hamas treats them, but channel surfed right past all the ones where they mention that Israel treats them just as badly. I mean, why would you? They’re only one tenth of the Palestinian population, after all, so not knowing that they exist is kind of like saying “I had no idea there were black people in America.” Does it ever occur to you, when you stumble across something like this, that if you have such a horrifically bad grasp of something as simple as “what religions are involved in this conflict?” maybe it’s time to take a step back and wonder “what ELSE am I missing about this?” instead of continuing the full throated “Israel can do no wrong” screeching?
No, of course it didn’t. That would be crimethink. Carry on. You and the rest of this fucking country.
Elie
@Joel:
This this this….
This must not be undermined… or the US will be chasing its tail in non stop ME wars and being led around by the nose by Israel.. we cannot have it. Period
Betty Cracker
@schrodinger’s cat: Bingo, and with Netanyahu’s enthusiastic coat-holding!
Chris
@Elie:
No, I think it’s much too well rooted in the population to be explained simply by corporate interests. I’d say it’s a combination of acting out Bible fan fiction and working through our own Holocaust guilt in a way that doesn’t require us to shoulder much of the burden. In this particular place, the Republican determination to bring down Obama to the exclusion of all other considerations factors into it too.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Joel: pretty much my take as regards Obama’s longer strategy, the alleged naive is practicing some pretty cold-blooded realpolitik. And I approve.
WaterGirl
@Elie: I don’t know if we have the equivalent of “high crimes and misdemeanors” for the house and the senate,but if so, it surely seems like this move by boehner qualifies.
I think we will see President Obama come out very strongly against this in the next few days, after this debacle of a speech and visit is over. I am reminded of the interview where candidate says “I will crush them”.
Frankensteinbeck
@Joel:
I’m sorry, no. This excerpt is beyond bullshit. The US doesn’t want powers balancing each other. Democrats want peace, and Republicans want holy war, and keeping various Mideast nations in tension does not help either. Israel is also not a pawn of anybody. They have their own interests, and they’re sure as Hell not concerned about Iran because of anything the US does. Bibi wants his people to believe they’re facing an existential threat, surrounded by murderous anti-Semite savages, and peace is impossible. That gets him votes and lets him continue his slow attempts to wipe out the Palestinians. This isn’t diabolical Realpolitik. Everyone involved wants exactly what they say except Iran, who only mostly wants what they say but have a tradition of inflamatory rhetoric. It’s just a thing for them, as essential and meaningless as Republicans claiming they’re ‘fiscal conservatives’.
Germy Shoemangler
@pseudonymous in nc: A good reminder that Israel is, in fact, not the US.
Health care in Israel is universal and participation in a medical insurance plan is compulsory. All Israeli citizens are entitled to basic health care as a fundamental right. Based on legislation passed in the 1990s, citizens join one of four health care funds for basic treatment but can increase medical coverage by purchasing supplementary health care. In a survey of 48 countries in 2013, Israel’s health system was ranked fourth in the world in terms of efficiency.
Elie
From the article cited above by Joel:
Elie
@Frankensteinbeck:
I am sorry to disagree… and sorry you cannot see this strategically…
The article is not bullshit.
Frankensteinbeck
@Elie:
From this excerpt:
This matters gigantically. No nation is an entity of its own plotting its own course independent of its politicians. Romney or Obama makes a huge difference. The writer identifies real issues, but then goes off into a conspiracy theorist fantasy land where international politics is decided by rational, emotionless self-interest and scheming of nations.
catclub
Does anyone know if Bibi said anything new or surprising? NPR was hoping he would. I doubt it.
Also, heard a commentator saying that Churchill gave up the colonial empire to ensure US support in WWII. Bibi has given up bupkis to ensure US support of Israel. And Bibi thinks of himself as like Churchill.
Elie
@Frankensteinbeck:
Rather than nitpick those details, take a look at the larger frame that is being described. Surely you cannot disagree about the reality of the US entrapment in the situation and our very real need to reconfigure the balance of power. We will not be able to address (read manage not solve) ISIS or any other the other problems in that region without rethinking what we are doing, no? The sunni empowered countries (Saudi Arabia, Turkey, etc), have not helped this situation much — and Israel has certainly not been anything but an inflammatory issue with its settlements and attacks on the Palastinians. Man, a new approach is absolutely necessary, doncha think?
Bobby Thomson
@Betty Cracker: why? It’s not like Democrats have the courage to do anything about it.
ETA: it’ll be a cold day in Riyadh before AIPAC can’t get its calls returned.
Frankensteinbeck
@Elie:
Exhibit A: George and Dick’s Crapulent Adventure. That certainly was not part of a strategy of balancing forces in the Mideast, did not serve America’s interests, and was not decided on or pursued rationally. It was the product of two people’s arrogance and greed. Similarly, Israel’s policies would differ wildly with a liberal coalition involved instead of a far right extremist. It might be useful to balance powers, but politics doesn’t work like that.
EDIT – @Elie:
Again, real issues, but the follow-through does not work that way. Obama’s policies will not be continued by a Republican president. America will not balance forces. Individual politicians will do what they think is right. Some will be Kissingeresque schemers. Others will be warmongers like Bush. Others will just want peace, and think it’s smartest to let the locals handle their own disputes.
EDIT EDIT – I apologize for the tone. I really need to go eat, and I get cranky as Hell before breakfast.
Patrick
Well, at least there is now a new precedent. The next time we have a Republican President who wants to start an idiotic war, the Dems have every fricking right to invite a leader of one of our allies to speak against such a war in Congress.
I couldn’t possibly care less what the Israeli leader stated. It was just wrong to have him there when our own President hadn’t even been consulted.
Mike in NC
@catclub:
Only in the sense that everything would go back to normal after the war. Churchill was an imperialist through and through and had no intention of permanently letting any of the colonies go, especially India. The French were also adamant about reestablishing themselves in North Africa and Indochina.
Elie
@Frankensteinbeck:
I agree that the complex internal politics of our system enter into this. That is why the right is trying so desperately to blow the Iran negotiation — it literally puts the US on a totally different path that makes their warmongering more complex and difficult. None of this changes the conclusion above about the geopolitical realities of the region and the imperatives that we face there. Don’t see that.
pseudonymous in nc
@Germy Shoemangler: yeah, I always wish those more-pro-Israel-than-Israelis GOPers were asked about universal healthcare.
Elie
@Frankensteinbeck:
No worries about your tone… I get cranky too with an empty stomach. I can’t do shit without my bowl of oatmeal in the am :-)
I don’t disagree with your point that US policy might change from time to time. That said, a major new relationship with Iran and our continued need to take care of economic and other interests that don’t involve being sucked into the ME forever, will probably influence future leaders to support this at least to some extent. Only the most bizarre Republicans don’t see the reality that we are not going to be sending 500k troops on the ground into Syria… that just aint gonna happen. We have other interests evolving as well as real limitations and they know it.
eemom
Fallows has a good take.
schrodinger's cat
@catclub: The British grip on the empire was loosening since after the debacle of WW I, Churchill didn’t give up anything, the British could not have held on for much longer even if they had wanted to. The famine of 42-43 was Churchill’s gift to India for supplying the manpower and money to Britain’s war effort.
slag
Why read the transcript when we can just guess the shorter: “Let’s invade Iran and Iraq (again); you go first!”?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@slag: Heh. “Let’s you and him fight!”
Elie
@eemom:
Hi eemom!
Actually, he cites the conclusions of the article Joel linked to above and that I referenced in his analysis as well.
schrodinger's cat
@catclub: The British grip on the empire was loosening since after the debacle of WW I, Churchill didn’t give up anything, the British could not have held on for much longer even if they had wanted to. The famine of 42-43 was Churchill’s gift to India for supplying the manpower and money to Britain’s war effort.
The British may have been better than the French as colonial masters but they were not all that wonderful, actually.
Sherparick
@Iowa Old Lady: Actually, although Pope Frank has gone back to the ecumenical spirit of Pope John XXIII and Paul VI and Vatican II, the old Roman Catholic Church of the Council Trent period would say that all you non-Roman Catholics are at best heretical or schismatic Christians, and many of you Evangelicals have left the rails as much as the Muslims have under Mohammed (who got much of his religious education from a cousin who was a Nestorian (Christian heresy of the 5th Century) priest). Of course, most Evangelical protestants I knew in the 1970s (before the culture wars caused the unholy alliance) considered us Papists as very non-Christian idolators between the Papacy itself, our cult of the Virgin, and veneration for the Saints (all rather polytheistic splitting up of attributes of the on the One God). It will be interesting when it comes to making “Christianity” the established religion which version of Christianity gets established in the United States.
Betty Cracker
@Bobby Thomson: That correctly described the state of the relationship before Netanyahu took a dump on buffet table. We’ll see if it continues going forward.
Cermet
With a cheney clone like BiBi, I have to admit that the Religious fundamentalist state of loon’s called Iran just might really need nukes just so many tens’ of thousands of American soldiers don’t die fighting for Israel’s right wing party of loons. That I’d say such a stupid thing wishing for a nuclear Iran say’s a lot about just how sick these war mongers here and in Israel have become. Any physical attack on Iran would dwarf the war in Iraq in all aspects (esp. death.)
Cacti
Did he actually say anything new, or was it just the same speech he’s been giving for the last 20 years? Iran bad, booga booga, nukes, US invasions and occupations are a positive, stabilizing force in the region, etc.
Bobby Thomson
@Betty Cracker: an overwhelming majority of elected Democrats says yes.
Mike in NC
@Sherparick: Southern Baptist, of course.
catclub
@eemom: Insightful.
Except now the idiot is not Bibi, but the Iranians, for not seeing that making a deal with the US, any deal, is better than being under sanctions. Idiotic nationalism (we will be respected!) does funny things to sensible people.
So does religion.
Lee
Wasn’t he in front of Congress speaking about the WMDs in Iraq as part of the propaganda leading up to that little adventure?
catclub
@Cermet:
Not stupid at all. If Iraq in 2003 actually HAD nuclear weapons – a la North Korea – we would never have invaded. Iran saw this.
Hundreds of thousands of lives not lost.
Kropadope
Bibi:
Hmm…
catclub
@Sherparick:
the way Rwanda and the 30 years war were interesting.
catclub
@Kropadope: Sounds like he REALLY wanted to start with Onward Christian Soldiers ( and I’ll wait back here).
Cacti
@Kropadope:
Conquest, subjugation, and terror…
Is that anything like a 70-year campaign of military occupation and land theft from a group of stateless people, while proclaiming yourself a liberal democracy?
catclub
@Kropadope:
It is interesting to note that he considers the retaking of Tikrit part of that march. In the war between ISIS and Assad, he is definitely on the ISIS side.
piratedan
isn’t it awesome that on the day that a foriegn leader steps in front of our US Congress to tell us about the evil in the world that is IRAN is only two days away from when the Republicans officially refuse to fund their very own creation that was designed to keep us safe… sorry, the hypocrisy is too staggering for me to take this “event” seriously…
LAC
I am surprised that dick sucking is allowed to be shown on daytime TV. How forward thinking congress is. ?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@piratedan: Boehner took advantage of all the shouting and the fog of BiBi to cave, btw
piratedan
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: ty Jim, but I blame Obama :-)
catclub
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/dc/boehner-caves-dhs-funding
Boehner caves on DHS. I bet he is glad that the Bibi speech is bigfooting this item.
catclub
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Beat me by 5 minutes. I also blame Obama.
Elie
This is “Event” is going to be a big nothingburger for Bibi. He can’t really do much about this. The Iranians would probably figure that he would do something like this and I would be surprised if the US and they didn’t already discount it. Bibi and Israel have limited traction left using their current strategy on the settlements and Palestinian oppression.. I would hope that the Israelis are smart enough to get this. This is their maximum power point and how fast they go downhill from here in relation to driving US policy, is up to them.
Betty Cracker
@Bobby Thomson: I just read Nancy Pelosi’s statement, and now I think maybe you’re right and I’m wrong. She got around to criticizing the speech, and fairly harshly. But only after spending the first paragraph going on about how Israel is the kindest, bravest, warmest, most wonderful nation the US has ever known. I was embarrassed for her, honestly.
Betty Cracker
@LAC: LOL!
Mnemosyne (iPhone)
@Elie:
I tend to agree with you that Iranis not going to let this derail the ongoing negotiations. They’ll probably try to use it to gain a few more concessions, but that’s what any negotiator would do.
As Fallows said, it’s in Iran’s national interest for there to be a rapprochement between them and the US, which is exactly why Bibi is trying to throw a wrench in the works. It’s hard to be tw big bully on the block when your biggest backer starts getting friendly with everyone else.
Botsplainer
That speech was a wingnut fantasy. He’s claiming that Iran is running things in Beirut, Damascus and Baghdad.
Complete idiocy, and those fools were war-whooping him.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Betty Cracker: it’s her critiques that are getting the most play, and they’re pretty strong. I like Nancy Pelosi a lot, but even before she took impeachment “off the table”– which was true but she didn’t need to say– for most of the Bush years if you asked her what time it was she would preface her answer by saying “We stand shoulder to shoulder with President Bush in the fight against terrorism, but it’s 12:30”. And unfortunately it’s a sign that she gets that everything Dems say and do have to be thought out in terms of willful misinterpretation.
Felonius Monk
If only the FSM could be so kind as to give us the ultimate Boehner slapdown — a Bibi election defeat. Good for us — good for Israel.
mdblanche
@Botsplainer: To be fair, Iran does have considerable influence in those capitals. Bibi is partially responsible for their influence in Baghdad. If Bibi would prefer an alternative, I hear ISIL is available…
Elie
@Felonius Monk:
I don’t think it matters whether Bibi is or is not re-elected. This is not his to control. Israel is NOT running US policy. Period. THAT is why he was here and reveals his desperation and loss of power….or rather traction… Boehner cannot help him — it is bigger than him or the Republicans…
Elie
I will also add that Diane Feinstein’s reaction to his speech reveals a lot to me. She understands US’s strategic interests better than many having been on the senate foreign relations committee and the coldness she displayed says a lot. She wasn’t pissed off about the decorum and protocol issue.. she was (to me), clearly communicating to Bibi that US interests may be quite different than Israel’s — get used to it.” Pelosi, while superficially smarmy with the tears thing, also sent a basic message that she was not influenced to change US direction on this policy in any real way. She threw him a bone at the beginning with the powerful speech thing.
LAC
@Betty Cracker: lol! It is rude, I know. But my god, the whole situation just pissed me off.