Pelosi in letter to House Dems: On Monday House and Senate Dems will "demand the President withdraw his disreputable executive order." pic.twitter.com/atRgraURZ2
— Kyle Griffin (@kylegriffin1) January 29, 2017
Dems rallying tomorrow at 6 outside SCOTUS against #MuslimBan https://t.co/HGAr721vnE
— Dave Weigel (@daveweigel) January 29, 2017
Scoop from @edatpost: Dems are readying bill to stop Trump orders + looking to slow down nominees https://t.co/KD8oRt6ugb
— Dave Weigel (@daveweigel) January 29, 2017
Bahstin Strong!
Lawyers advising green card holders from blocked countries to fly through Boston https://t.co/7V2VlNHN5B
— Ben Schreckinger (@SchreckReports) January 29, 2017
Some immigration lawyers are advising green card holders from seven majority-Muslim countries affected by President Trump’s order and who are traveling overseas to fly back to the United States through Boston because a Massachusetts judge’s order blocking the enforcement of President Trump’s executive order offers them more protection than similar judicial orders elsewhere.
The order signed by Judge Allison Burroughs and Magistrate Judge Judith Dein, issued early Sunday morning, requires the government to release approved refugees and individuals with valid visas from the seven majority-Muslim countries listed in President Trump’s executive order — Iraq, Syria, Sudan, Libya, Somalia, Iran, and Yemen.
A similar order from a New York judge blocks immigration officials from deporting those individuals upon their arrival, but it allows the government to detain them pending further legal review…
White House Chief of Staff Reince Priebus said on NBC’s “Meet the Press” on Sunday morning that the order will not affect any green card holders going forward, but he also said that border agents would have “discretionary authority” over whether to question travelers from the seven countries listed in Trump’s order.
The New York order preventing the deportation of approved refugees and other immigrants with valid visas should apply nationally because it was filed on behalf of a national class of petitioners, but Marielena Hincapie, executive director of the National Immigration Law Center, said federal agents have not universally complied with it.
“We continue to face Border Patrol noncompliance and chaos at every airport across the country and the world, despite the fact we had a great victory last night,” the told reporters on the same conference call on Sunday…
.
Apart from continuing to fight, what’s on the agenda as we start another week?
.
Update: the @ACLU just ran the numbers again. Spokesman says the group received 356,306 online donations totaling $24,164,691 this weekend.
— Brian Stelter (@brianstelter) January 30, 2017
White House saying that Trump will move up his Supreme Court announcement is excellent evidence that the protests are working
— Scott Lemieux (@LemieuxLGM) January 29, 2017
Trump is right about one thing: His popular vote loss matters. It emboldens the opposition, because they know they're not outnumbered.
— Will Oremus (@WillOremus) January 30, 2017
note, too, that there are no pro-Trump counter-demonstrations—and the opposition is barely organized, it’s a spontaneous uprising/outpouring https://t.co/UNnoxyCJkO
— Philip Gourevitch (@PGourevitch) January 30, 2017
Me to cop at LAX today: "bet you've never seen anything like this"
Cop:" actually I have- when I marched last week at the woman's march"
— Matt Cohen (@CamelToad) January 30, 2017
rikyrah
Good Morning, Everyone ???
Baud
@rikyrah: Good morning.
Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes
Hope the ACLU doesn’t go all in for propping up white supremacists with the donations again.
I’m watching them with a wary eye….
TheMightyTrowel
@rikyrah: and good evening from oz ??
OzarkHillbilly
@Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes: Hope the ACLU doesn’t go all in for propping up American citizens with the donations again.
FTFY
Morzer
Calling the executive order disreputable seems overly generous to me. Despicable, contemptible, even deplorable strike me as more proportionate descriptions, but really we should just call it what it is: un-American, anti-American.
raven
Friday my boss let me know that she had made the decision to take a “leave of absence” as she goes into seat another round of chemo. She has initiated the process to go on short, and then, long term disability and is cashing out her life insurance. She has a great attitude and has been in this fight for some 5 years. We all are hoping for the best for her.
Schlemazel
@Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes:
Today is Fred Korematsu birthday. The ACLU took up his cause when it was probably the very least popular thing to do. My guess is an overwhelming majority of Americans were against them, It was the right thing to do,
Patricia Kayden
I applaud the House Dems for standing up. We’re depending on them.
Patricia Kayden
@raven: ((your boss)). Hope she wins her battle.
amk
Toles
raven
@Patricia Kayden: It really doesn’t look good, she’s gone through so much and realizes she needs all her strength to continue the fight. Her job requires a great deal of travel and endless meetings and she’s just not going to be ably to keep that up. We were colleagues for over a decade before she became my boss and she’s young enough to be my daughter so it doubly sucks.
Betty Cracker
Yesterday I met some family at an Irish pub in the Ybor City neighborhood of Tampa for lunch. Afterward, my sister and I went to another place for a drink. We were discussing the women’s march, which we drove to DC for last week. A man at a nearby table overheard us and introduced himself. He was an immigration lawyer from the Middle East — not one of the banned countries — but though he’s lived here for many years and is a green card holder, he said he’s afraid to leave the US for an upcoming business trip in case Hair Furor decides on a whim to ban his home country too and strand him overseas.
He told us there was a demonstration happening in Centennial Park around the corner, and he was there to offer help to anyone who was being held up by Der Gropenfurher’s EO. Our cars were parked across the street from the park, and the demo was just getting underway as we made our way there. A young couple was unloading signs, clipboards, and other supplies from a hatchback right next to my vehicle, and I offered to give them a hand. Once all their crap was out and they shut the hatch, I saw that it was covered with Bernie stickers plus two “Hillary for Prison” stickers.
I briefly considered removing the tire jack from my truck and bashing in their windows. These stupid fucks, just as much as hypocritical evangelicals who threw in their lot with the thrice-married sexual assaulter, are responsible for the fact that white nationalists and an unstable demagogue are now in charge of the world’s most fearsome nuclear arsenal. But instead, I waved and went on my way. We are allies for now; we have a greater evil to defeat. But then will come the reckoning.
Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes
I have unpleasant recollections of their mid to late 80s focus that I believe was a reaction to political criticism that they were “too liberal”. I stopped donating after that.
Betty Cracker
@raven: Damn. That sucks. Hoping for the best for her.
Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes
@Betty Cracker:
God, that’s marvelous. Don’t stop being you.
If plural marriage was a thing, I’d throw myself at you….
Morzer
@Betty Cracker:
People who turn on their allies once the emergency is over tend not to attract the allies they will need for the future. That’s not a mistake we can afford to keep making. Leave the rage and vengeance to Trump and let him destroy his minority coalition of the ignorant and hateful.
Ceci n est pas mon nym
I am awestruck by how the fight has grown and magnified, not died off, since the Women’s March last weekend. And I spent much of Saturday at an event with Quakers (who are in activist mode pretty much 24/7; when you hear about 80 year olds being arrested at protests, it’s usually a Quaker). So I’m feeling more optimistic at any time since the election that Democracy and Constitutional Government will survive this test.
What I’m most bothered by right now I think is the reports of immigration officers ignoring court orders. I saw this movie before in microcosm, during the Republican Convention in 2004 in New York. My teenage daughter got swept up in one of the unprovoked mass arrests that Bloomberg ordered to keep any protesters from actually reaching the Convention. They were then held in jail without hearings for 3 days (the law demanded a hearing and charges within 24 hours). I lived in that courthouse for those 3 days, watching as increasingly angry judges wrote court order after court order demanding hearings, demanding medical care, demanding legal representation. And they’d get to the door of the holding area (also in the courthouse), and an officer would read the court order, smile, close the door and ignore it. It all ended on the evening of W’s speech, when I was sitting in the courtroom waiting yet again to see if any of the detainees would be scheduled for a hearing, and the rumor (turned out to be true) came out that they’d been quietly released, no charges, through some back door of the courthouse. It was by rumor because possessions including cell phones had been seized and were being held somewhere else that would require more bureaucracy to get back.
It was the speech that they’d been waiting for. They arrested all the protesters on Monday and kept them locked up till Thursday till it was too late for them to get to W and upset his bubble.
Anyway it was that scene, repeated over and over, of officers smugly ignoring court orders and the court being powerless to enforce them that made me fear for the fragility of democracy. And as you can imagine, the experience radicalized my daughter too, and taught her that same fragility.
So I’m kind of anxiously watching to see how it plays out with customs officials doing the same thing on a national scale.
rikyrah
@raven:
Sending her positive thoughts and prayers out into the universe.
BillinGlendaleCA
@Betty Cracker: Now we’re supposed to be nice to our Wilmer friends, they never bring up the election since the convention, nothing like saying that HRC was the worst candidate ever or anything like that.
Yeah, you should have taken the tire iron out on their windows.
Baud
I wonder if the Muslim ban gives Ellison a leg up in the DNC chair race. It would make quite a statement to the country.
@Betty Cracker:
As long as they kept that sticker on their car, I would not consider them allies and would not join them in fighting Trump.
Danack
Just to point out one bit:
“border agents would have “discretionary authority” over whether to question travelers from the seven countries listed in Trump’s order.”
Having rules interpreted arbitrarily by border agents is a terrible state of affairs.
It means that people can’t be sure whether they’re going to be allowed in or turned away. Not only does being turned away cost them a shedload of money, it can mean that they get banned from re-entering the USA for 5? years.
It also empowers the border agents to be petty tyrants, only allowing those who show the right level of deference to pass them by.
Oh and of course allows the border agents to discriminate against any people who are too brown.
Baud
@Danack: Not that I trust the Trump administration to implement it fairly, but that was probably the rule before.
Mustang Bobby
@Ceci n est pas mon nym:
Yeah, we’re a feisty bunch of pacifists. The folks from Miami Friends Meeting took to the airport yesterday — in the rain — to demonstrate. It went very peacefully. Miami is a huge immigration hub, not just from Latin America but from everywhere, and the resistance is growing.
BillinGlendaleCA
@Baud: When they’re pissing inside the tent and not outside, they ain’t housebroken.
Morzer
@Baud:
We are hardly in a position to impose purity tests on our allies. You can be certain that Trump will happily make common cause with any and all bigots, Nazis, racists, misogynists and haters that he can find. We should be looking to unify against him. Failure to do so will only enable him and the consequences will be terrible.
amk
@Betty Cracker: they still have those vile hillary stickers? jeez.
JosieJ (not Josie)
@Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes:
Actually, I hope they continue representing white supremacists. Because, as much as what’s being said offends me as a black person, protected speech is protected speech. It’s the ACLU’s function to ensure equal speech for all, no matter how noxious the views expressed.
Surely the principle is the same in this case: if we give an inch, the Trumpsters’ll take a mile. First it’s Muslims, then it’s Mexicans, then it’s somebody else. Maybe me!
Morzer
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/01/a-clarifying-moment-in-american-history/514868/
Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes
@Danack:
I can’t tell you how many times I’ve seen barrel bellies among CBP start barking at people the moment they deplane and head toward customs (or as I always mutter, “welcome to America”. I’ve called a few out on it, too. Plus, TSA is worse.
France and Italy are polite. Mexico is phenomenal. The Caribbean very sweet. And China does it very well.
We do nothing right these days.
Baud
@Morzer: I wouldn’t impose a test, but if they are voluntarily speaking by retaining that bumper sticker, then they are spitting in my face. And I’m confident they would not ally with me if I had a “Fuck Wilmer” bumper sticker on my car (which I would never do).
Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism
@Baud: Did he show up at any of the protests? I know Perez and Buttigieg did.
OzarkHillbilly
@raven: Sorry to hear that.
bystander
I was reading a fb page of a gay state politician who had posted pictures of himself with Cory Booker, among other Dems. One post after another about how Booker must be shunned for some vote on something, and elective proximity to Booker is a fatal mistake. I started thinking “troll”. Luckily the politician said he was not going to apply purity tests to our allies.
I just stupidly turned on Moanin’ Joe and sure enough he has Jonathan Turley on to tell everyone how Constitutitonal the EO is. Turdley, indeed.
Baud
@Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism: I think he did.
Baud
@raven: I’m sorry to hear about your friend. Hoping for the best.
bystander
@Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes: I was thinking the border patrol people are the least likely candidates for broad discretionary powers. They invariably act as if they’re personally pissed at you. They can quickly suck the fun out of a vacation abroad.
If Giuliani really is the moron who drafted this abomination, it proves what a crappy lawyer he is.
OzarkHillbilly
@Baud: “The enemy of my enemy is my friend.”
Immanentize
@raven: Good luck to your boss and to you and her other employees. My mother in law was just diagnosed with stomach cancer. They were operating to remove the obstruction last Wednesday but it turned into the classic “once we got in there, it had spread more than expected.”. So now it’s chemo and radiation. Hard road but, like your boss, a good attitude certainly helps her.
Baud
@OzarkHillbilly: The friend of my enemy is my enemy.
NotMax
Some catchy morning coffee music to get y’all going.
OzarkHillbilly
@Baud: Edit fail, tried to add “Divide and Conquer”.
Baud
@bystander: Has Turley always been a douchebag, or did he change?
gene108
@Danack:
CBP agents have had the power to question and turn away people for long as I can remember. You don’t have to be from a banned country either. Your on an H1-b and working as a subcontractor, but do not have any paperwork establishing why your employer* and your work location are different…
Be prepared for extra questioning, at best, or turned away at the airport.
The level of petty tyrant power immigration officials have over people on visas (i.e. non-Green Card holders or naturalized U.S. citizens ) is huge.
Get one, who is having a bad day and you’ll be booking a return ticket back to your home country.
* Your employer is based in Michigan, for example, but they have a contract for you to work at Ernst & Young, in NYC. Your employment documents show your MI based employer’s address, but your personal documents show a NYC area address. Unless you have documents proving your employer has a contract with E&Y for your services, to the agent’s satisfaction**, you’ll have problems,
** CBP agents are another branch of law enforcement. If a LEO is not satisfied and wants to give you a hard time that is what they will do.
gene108
@Baud:
Always a douche bag.
zhena gogolia
God, you guys do 50 interesting threads while I’m sleeping at night. Why not during the day?
Baud
@zhena gogolia: Coke and AL are late night people.
BillinGlendaleCA
@zhena gogolia: Do what I do, don’t sleep.
OzarkHillbilly
@Betty Cracker: Say “Hello” to your new neighbors, Betty.
From book to boom: how the Mormons plan a city for 500,000 in Florida
Water will soon be more precious than gold in Florida.
BillinGlendaleCA
@Baud: Coke? I think you mean Cole. Or where you just thinking about what Dolt 45 was snorting last night?
gene108
@Morzer:
I disagree. I think plenty of Americans will be happy to live ina dictatorship, with the external trappings of democracy, as long as “those people” are kept in line or some sort of herrenvollk democracy, where only the “right people” get to vote. Hell, the latter is pretty much how voting worked, until the last 50 years.
Baud
@BillinGlendaleCA: Spell check on my phone has been extra aggressive lately.
danielx
I thought I had some idea of how bad a Trump administration was going to be.
After a week and a half, I freely admit I didn’t. “Shocked but not surprised” doesn’t begin to cover it – the combination of stupidity, arrogance and incompetence is nothing short of breathtaking, in my case almost literally.
@Ceci n est pas mon nym:
The only real mechanism available to enforce the orders of a federal court is the US Marshal Service…whose director, along with the chief marshals of the various federal court distracts, is appointed by the president and subject to Senate confirmation, the very definition of a political appointment. I leave it to your imagination to judge how eager the marshals would be to enforce a federal court order going against the letter and spirit of a presidential executive order, particularly since their chain of command ends in the attorney general’s office. US Marshals were used to enforce court orders in the civil rights era, but…..long ago and far away.
MomSense
Great write up about the protests yesterday in our largest paper. I loved the description of the poor Ochre Ogre supporter.
protests
Kay
The big question for me is if Sessions had anything to do with this. We’re stuck with Trump and the low quality incompetents he hired. Sessions is a mistake we haven’t made yet.
We could stop hiring terrible people. A small goal- fewer bad hires. That would be a start.
HeartlandLiberal
I had not renewed my ACLU membership, which is decades old. We are retired. Jeeze, my wife just hit the 71 mile marker, and I do in three weeks. Nice but fixed income. But I whipped out my credit card used to pay bills online and renewed our membership for $100 this morning. The least I can do.
I also have to really steel myself to call Congress, but I have decided that from here on out, a daily call to both Indiana Senators and IN-09 House Rep may be just the way to boost the effect of my morning coffee and caffeine. Especially since the two GOP members NO LONGER ACCEPT FAXES. They are doing all they can to avoid contact from their constituents.
What boggles my mind is how much this is beginning to look like a massive coup, a complete undermining of the structure of law by a maddened dictator and his crew of right wing neofascists and white supremacists.And the members of the GOP are interested in NOTHING but their power. The are totally devoid of morality and any belief in the Constitution they have purported for so many years to revere. The criminal hypocrisy is truly mind boggling.
OzarkHillbilly
@gene108:
All too often, that’s still how it works. Inner city people have to stand in line for hours to get to one of 2 voting machines while a rich white suburban precinct will have 7 voting machines because one time a woman had to wait 2 minutes for one of 6 machines to open up.
debbie
@raven:
Fucking cancer. Seriously.
HeartlandLiberal
@Betty Cracker: Your response is justified (to the HIllary for prison stickers on Bernie supporters signes). I have a very good friend who is decades younger, still working as an IT director at the university I worked at for 25 years. He is one of the most absolutely brilliant minds I know. Yet he refuses to vote. Because they are all crooks. No amount of persuading could shake him from this. Well, I hope he is happy now. He is, by the way, of East Indian heritage, in fact, I think he is first generation, i.e. his parent came here and he was born.
Applejinx
@Betty Cracker:
Stop it. You’re acting out a freeper fantasy of the brainless psychotic liberal. We need better than that.
If you did, anybody would assume you are firstly a Trumpster, and they wouldn’t be far off the mark. You do realize there are large numbers of people who blame the person who won and was directly responsible for beating Trump bad enough that their voter suppression would be ineffective? And you’re talking to someone who saw how hard she tried in New Hampshire, which was up for grabs.
Stop it, stop it, stop it. Put the motherfucking tire iron DOWN. How dare you?
debbie
@Morzer:
Speaking of, is there any truth to the belief that the countries Trump Inc. has done business with were intentionally not included in the ban?
Betty Cracker
@Kay: Giuliani is bragging about his hand in this disastrous EO, and since 9/11 is invoked three times in the document (though none of the countries from whence the attackers came is on the ban list), maybe it really is his baby. I think we may see some steel in the spines of a few more Democrats this week, after the spontaneous protests nationwide this weekend.
bystander
@Baud: I used to like his blog. Sometime during the Obama Administration he went Greenwald, and I couldn’t read him anymore. I can’t imagine being his student. He’s incredibly pedantic.
Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes
@danielx:
I know, and have been dreading it and am afraid to look.
Anybody know if the previous director held over or if there’s an interim? Or is he nominating some toadie like David Clarke?
And if the court orders aren’t enforced, can we then acknowledge that the principles of nonviolence in protest need to come off the table?
Betty Cracker
@Applejinx: Hey, guess what, you mush-brained nincompoop — I’m not still standing in that parking lot with the tire iron raised, so your counsel to “put the motherfucking tire iron down” isn’t necessary. In fact, I never removed it from my truck, as a person of first-grade reading skills would readily comprehend from my comment.
Comrade Scrutinizer
@Betty Cracker: What happens if the next step is to revoke all green cards and visas?
Jeffro
Next weekend’s SNL skit: Anthony Romero and a couple other ACLU folks sitting in their HQ office with cash drifting down from the rafters…they’re explaining to Alec Baldwin (as Trump) via Skype that his unconstitutional BS won’t stand…Baldwin starts to respond, the cash falls even faster…he stops…tries to say something again, cash pours down…
…cut to ACLU folks buried to their necks in cash and coins, barely able to put the phone to their ears: “yes that’s right, I said let’s take this ________ all the way to the Supreme Court, every time”
*warm fuzzy feeling to start the week*
debbie
@Betty Cracker:
I hope they man up and maul Rudi. There isn’t a thing he’s done in the political world that hasn’t included bullying those without power. Let that prick know what it feels like. Ugly, vindictive little man,
Kay
@Morzer:
I just flat-out don’t believe that Trump attacks the journalists who go after him. I think it’s the opposite. I think he promotes the idea that they’re “tough” by singling them out for criticism. It’s mutually beneficial for both parties.
The Washington Post has done the best reporting on Trump. He never mentions them.
Applejinx
@Betty Cracker: Good. Rage all you want. I am not having the hippie bashing. Not now.
Everything changed once Trump started fucking with the country. Rage all you want, call me anything you like, I’ll even hold off some of the time about my own blame casting (obviously my opinion is not changed) but guess what? It no longer matters, your beliefs about what would have happened no longer matter.
There is only now, and we are all the commie pinkos now. Welcome. Help us smash the ugliest market capitalist would-be genocidal dictator we’ve ever had the misfortune to face. He proved you right: however much people wanted it to be about economic insecurity, he MADE it about racism (sexism sure to follow, real quick). Time to smash and settle accounts later.
Baud
@Kay: Trump is a coward. WaPo has stood up to him, the NYT, being garbage, has not.
Comrade Scrutinizer
@Kay: He’s mentioned wapo a few times, but it’s usually in the context of “the failed nytimes and wapo.” As you say, though, he rarely singles them out.
danielx
@Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes:
I don’t know. I do know that thanks to the most-misnamed Patriot Act and decades of court decisions whittling away at the Fourth Amendment in the name of the ‘war on drugs’ and the ‘war on terror’, the government can do just about anything it likes in the way of surveillance and arrest. I know, further, that the legal definition(s) of ‘terrorism’ and ‘support of terrorism’ are, to all intents and purposes, whatever the Department of Justice and the White House Office of Legal Counsel* says they are. Lastly, I know that a great many Trump supporters would not object, indeed would cheer if demonstrators or others who oppose Dear Leader were shot without trial – the more the better.
So it’s a question you want to think about long and hard.
*Edit: and after seeing the likes of John Yoo and Alberto Gonzales in action, I think it’s safe to say his appointees will come up with whatever Lord Shortfingers desires in the way of legal justification.
AxelFoley
@Applejinx:
Funny thing is, this shit could’ve all been avoided, but you Bernie stans had to dump on Hillary and not Trump.
Now you want us to be allies? Fuck that noise. The country is gonna suffer serious setbacks because hillwasnt pure enough for you.
Betty’s right–there’ll be a reckoning.
rikyrah
@Immanentize:
Sorry about your mother in law.Will send prayers.
Baud
@Immanentize: Best wishes to your MIL.
rikyrah
@gene108:
Most Americans who voted in 2016 DID NOT vote for this. And, I don’t give a shyt if a majority of his voters are OK with it, I and millions more are not. My parents lived in a Police State. I have no intentions of doing the same.
David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch
Stunning gown from last nite’s SAG awards (photo)
Applejinx
@AxelFoley: You’re outnumbered.
bystander
@Betty Cracker: Just an aside: Did you have any desire to get out that tire iron while you were posting that?
I’m reading Bill Bryson’s Road to Little Dribbling and he’s always encountering people who face his imaginary wrath for being rude, stupid, etc. Always gets a laugh out of me, but what do I know?
debbie
@Immanentize:
Best wishes to your mother in law. Again, this sucks.
OzarkHillbilly
@danielx: All available evidence says the Office of Legal Counsel has been sidelined. Apparently none of his executive orders have been run through it as they are supposed to be. When asked directly if the OLC has reviewed any of the EOs, the DOJ has responded, “No comment.”
Betty Cracker
@Applejinx: Hippie bashing? I AM a hippie, motherfucker. A second-generation hippie, as a matter of fact. I am taking that term back from dilettantes with “Bernie 2016” and “Hillary for Prison” stickers on their hatchbacks. Anyone that goddamn stupid isn’t worthy of the label that was originally worn by my mother’s generation.
I defended Sanders and his supporters on this blog for months. I consider people who supported Bernie in the primaries and voted for Hillary in the general — like my husband, and yourself, if your account of your actions is accurate — to be Democrats and allies.
As for the faux-hippie poseurs in the hatchback, like I said, I’ll temporarily form common cause with them to oppose a fascist. I helped them unload their crap, and though their stupid sticker array pissed me off, I didn’t say a word about it. But I won’t forget who and what they are, which is, among other things, people with poor judgment who can’t be trusted to make important decisions.
David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch
Eva Braun Can’t Sleep
debbie
@Betty Cracker:
I would have gotten off one smart-alec if that had been me. “Happy now?”
ETA: It’s the prison one I object to. I’ve seen that on too many GOOPER’s front lawns and car bumpers.
debbie
@David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch:
What is this from?
amk
@Applejinx: Heh moron, what part of BC helping them unload their crap did you not get? And what part of the vile hillary sticker did you not get?
Baud
@Betty Cracker:
I might have suggested they remove or cover up the sticker for the sake of unity. If they refused, that would have confirmed that their priorities are not with opposing Trump.
Iowa Old Lady
@amk: I don’t mind the Wilmer stickers at all. Wilmer said some things I like. I do mind the ignorant, destructive HRC sticker. That it’s still there says they’ve learned nothing and are likely to do harm again.
Proudgradofcatladyacademy
Good morning. Expecting snow today. Luckily I work from home so there’s peace in not taking Betsy the Sentra out. Wanted to mention the Border patrol, they are so concerning in their attitude towards immigrants. Did anyone hear This American Life’s recent story on them? As I listened to the short clip they played from a border patrol run podcast I realized Trump has his Brownshirts and even more frighteningly “they are in the government already”. I was not surprised when CBP did not follow court orders.I will find a link next if anyone is interested in the TAL story.
Baud
@Iowa Old Lady: Yes, it’s the right wing meme that’s troubling here.
David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch
@debbie: she had a meltdown yesterday on fixxed news sunday
Peale
@debbie: it’s a good meme, but as I posted yesterday, the list is the standard neocon “scary countries that need regime change” list from 2004. That’s it. Once your country is on that “scary country list”, it never comes off. Now, of course the president can at any time do this to other countries. i won’t be surprised if the list is expanded from time to time if there is a terrorist incident involving the nationality of another country. But the intent of this order seems to justify cruelty for its own sake under the veneer of “national security”. It’s meant to punish people for no reason because they can. But if you want the safety of “national security” to cover your cruelty, best to start from the list of the “regime change needing” states. See, it was thoughtful, not arbitrary.
Baud
@David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch: I wouldn’t mind if all the pundits were replaced, but I assume KAC and I would disagree on who their replacements should be.
Kay
@Comrade Scrutinizer:
He singles out the NYTimes and CNN. But there IS objective reality. The reality is the NYTimes and CNN haven’t been the toughest on Trump- the WaPo has. Therefore, Trump is lying again and he’s a lying for a reason. I think he lies about it because it’s flattering to the NYTimes and CNN to be portrayed as “tough” and Trump knows that. It’s a game- he rants, his supporters cheer, CNN and the NYTimes are flattered by his attention and they get anti-Trump viewers and subscribers. Everybody wins. But it isn’t real. Look at the coverage to see what’s real.
OzarkHillbilly
@Applejinx: By what? Bacteria? No shit. Other than that I have no idea what you are talking about. As one who has refrained from bashing you even tho you have offered many idiot opportunities, I have to ask: Exactly what are you trying to accomplish here? Because you seem to be working overtime with your “holier than thou” attitude that the worst things said about you and your fellow travelers are absolutely true.
If that is in fact your goal, I can only say, “Proceed onward to utter insignificance.”
Kay
@Comrade Scrutinizer:
There would be no “Donald Trump” without Donald Trump playing NY media. If he was a real estate developer in Arkansas (or even Chicago) he wouldn’t have been a national celebrity.
He has been doing this for decades. It’s an alliance, a business relationship.
I do this myself. If I get a weak lawyer on the other side I flatter them with how “tough” they are- I want that opponent. Works like a fucking charm.
bendal
Trumpf held a press conference yesterday to explain how the Muslim ban was working just fine. Except, it was on condition that the names of the White House officials in the conference not be disclosed by the media. The two “unnamed White House representatives” both insisted that ‘green card holders were not affected’ as long as they filled out a form requesting a ‘waiver’, at which point they’d be ‘excepted’ from further detainment. No mention was made of work or education visa holders, just those with green cards, and we’re still hearing of some of them being detained at airports. ISTM the US Marshals need to make a visit to those airports…
Elizabelle
@Betty Cracker: Betty! That’s like an O Henry story.
Thank you for my first laugh of the morning.
Paul in KY
@raven: Sure hope your boss is able to beat it!
Lurking Canadian
@David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch: I’ve never been so happy to see an issue left “there”.
debbie
@David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch:
I think she needs to be told what talking smack really is. Good grief.
Paul in KY
@Betty Cracker: I would have had to point to the ‘Hillary for Prison’ stickers & say that that’s one of the reasons we are in this mess now, dingbats like you. You do have more couth than I, it appears :-)
debbie
@Peale:
Except that the White House and the GOP is saying saying they followed Obama’s list (I’ve already heard it said two times this morning), which is a twisting of the truth.
OzarkHillbilly
@Peale:
I wonder when they are going to put the US on that list? Anyway, this made me laugh:
CNN’s Poppy Harlow and the no longer so esteemed former U.S. Rep. Jack Kingston (R-GA) via Raw Story
Iowa Old Lady
@debbie: As I said yesterday, I don’t remember chaos at the airports when Obama was president so whatever he was doing, it’s not this.
Ohio Mom
@Baud: What fools people about Turley is that he’s very good-humored. Most people with his viewpoint are sourpusses.
So you get caught up in his cute stories and witty remarks until you suddenly realize he’s saying something beyond the pale.
Shalimar
@Betty Cracker: “You might want to take the prison stickers off your car. It makes you look dumb to still be obsessed with emails while you protest a dictator.”
ThresherK
@bystander: I know this sounds meta, but your anecdote made me wonder if “purity test” is nomenclature the unaware sorts on the far left even use. I think not, but have no research or alternate facts to back it up.
Kay
Also, I wish someone would show me where “the enemy of my enemy is my friend” has ever once worked for Democrats in (real) politics.
Why do people believe this saying? Is it based on an actual, specific war? WWII? This isn’t a real war. It’s still politics. It may BECOME a real war- Trump projects and he’s a liar and he’s now accusing people of starting WWIII which means he’s starting WWIII, but not yet.
Paul in KY
@Applejinx: Do you think that some person who supported Bernie & still, at this hour, has a ‘Hillary for Prison’ sticker (2 of them, it appears) on their car is making a helpful Anti-Trump statement or is capable of prioritizing who the real enemy is or is generally going to get people who liked Hillary to help them?
raven
@Ohio Mom: So was he wrong in what he said about how a judge would view this order?
debbie
And he’s off and running:
Only 109 people out of 325,000 were detained and held for questioning. Big problems at airports were caused by Delta computer outage,…..
protesters and the tears of Senator Schumer. Secretary Kelly said that all is going well with very few problems. MAKE AMERICA SAFE AGAIN!
There is nothing nice about searching for terrorists before they can enter our country. This was a big part of my campaign. Study the world!
You study the world, jackal.
Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho
Anybody else see this last night? The Judicial Branch was still missing from the list of government branches at 7:50 AM EST. Fortunately for my frame of mind, I have a project out of my home “office” that will keep me away from news. I can’t even anymore.
I’ve gotten several kind replies to the email I sent to schools, mosques and Muslim community centers in OH and KY last night. So I’m heartened that people appreciated it. One group from Cols is coming to town in February to meet with “like minded people” and offered to invite me. I’m taking them up on it.
debbie
@Kay:
Pfft. It doesn’t even work on Game of Thrones.
Paul in KY
@David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch: That is some high quality complete bullshit trolling right there. Kudos on her for keeping a straight face & not giggling when she recited the ‘gaping wounds’ line. Goebbels would be in awe.
Kay
@debbie:
I feel like it came from Russia in WWII, but that’s not even true. Russia was making deals with Hitler for years. It didn’t even work for Russia, ultimately. Hitler wasn’t their friend. It’s a “truism” that isn’t true :)
Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism
Great story about a security line experience.
Paul in KY
@Shalimar: Good one! Better than what I would have said.
Shalimar
@Baud: Turley has always had a libertarian and anti-authority streak, and also a love for the spotlight. His support for these EOs seems new to me though. His previous deviations from liberal orthodoxy have been in the realm of limiting government regulation power, as in his interpretation of 2nd amendment rights and opposition to the mandate in Obamacare. This is the first time I can recall him supporting something that clearly oppresses a class of people.
raven
@Kay:
Kay
@debbie:
What they’re worried about is not morality or decency. Trump supporters by definition don’t care about that. They’re worried about appearing incompetent, which tells us something- we should focus on incompetence.
Why was Obama resilient? Temperament and competence. Even if you disagreed with him (and I did, on many things) you knew he was a decent human being and prudent and he hired for competence. That wears well.
raven
@Shalimar: Well I watched it an I didn’t think he supported anything, he said that it was within the purview of the president and that the way it was written didn’t single out any religion.
dogwood
@Paul in KY:
When it comes to the far left and the far right I am always skeptical. In the words of James Baldwin: “I can’t believe what you say because I see what you do.”
BillinGlendaleCA
@Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho:
That was front paged over at LGF last night, it’s still not been corrected, hmmm.
OzarkHillbilly
@Kay: There is another saying: “Keep your friends close. Keep your enemies closer.” What is true in one case isn’t always true in others. WWII is an interesting example in that the enemies/friends statement is proven to be both true and false.
Shalimar
@raven: It singles out entire countries. Not singling out their dominant religion is a dodge, as is leaving out all the countries where Trump has real estate holdings even though those are the countries previous terrorists against the U.S. have originated from. Making the class discriminated against too broad for it’s objective does not make it better. Turley’s interpretation is intentionally missing the point.
satby
@Applejinx: Do not conflate Wilmer supporters with hippies. I am a hippie, from the 60s, and I hate the all talk-no action fucker. And Wilmer supporters do not, and never did outnumber regular Democrats; that’s why he lost in the primaries. His popularity has only gone downhill since.
debbie
@Kay:
I agree a gazillion percent. And we should laugh heartily at them.
I want the next Executive Order to be a ban on the use of the expression “bad guys.” We should not be acting like a bunch of babies in the sandbox.
Oldgold
Turley’s constitutional analysis has always been less than above reproach.
Ohio Mom
@raven: I was speaking in generalities, in answer to Baud’s question, Was Turley always a douchebag?
I haven’t read Turley in a long time, and hadn’t seen what bothered Baud.
When I did read him, I found that he’d say some things that were humorous, some things that were thought-provoking, some things I agreed with, and some things that were jaw-droppinly wrong. After a while, the totally off-target things he said started to creep me out so I stopped looking at his site.
I was trying to say, Yes Baud, I get your surprise, because I had a similar moment myself.
Shalimar
@Oldgold: Turley definitely knows 10 times more about Con Law than I ever will. He’s still wrong here, for whatever reason. He wouldn’t let a student get away with that shoddy reasoning in a class.
Peale
@Shalimar: a lot of what is in the orders is actually constitutional. In the end, most of this will stand up. No one should fool themselves into thinking that. But the implementation has been cruel. And it has violated protections. But my guess is that we’re going to win about green card holders and many others. The point was to be cruel though, and yay! They are.
I mean seriously, if you had a medical visa approved and were due to depart to the US, you now have to wait 90 days and go through a new “vetting”. Lord knows how long that will take. But gosh darn it, we are more secure because you know ISIS is just going to recruit cancer patients for its sleeper cells. You can be sure about it.
Also they just barred all refugees, so they can claim that it doesn’t target Muslims from Muslim countries. Good for them. They can get their little 9/11 retribution hard ons a popping, while refugees from Bhutan and Myanmar wait it out. Because lord knows, 9/11…you never know.
dogwood
@BillinGlendaleCA:
The fact that the judiciary page is still missing is more than likely a sign of the administration’s incompetence. They are committed to running the country off the rails, not to running the government. The “little people” who actually make things work aren’t being hired. Remember Trump thought all the people working in Obama’s WH would stay and work for him.
Shalimar
@Ohio Mom: I stopped reading Turley’s site 4-5 years ago too. Can’t recall getting creeped out by his opinions, but what he wrote about tended to be whatever issues they were asking him to come on tv to support, so it became mostly Mormon polygamy and how horrible the individual mandate was. Now, some of his readers who guest-posted were very creepy.
raven
@Ohio Mom: I wasn’t singling you out, more a general discussion, sorry if I aimed wrong.
Peter
Important point: these demonstrations are sudden, but not spontaneous. They don’t come out of nowhere and they aren’t unplanned. They’re the result of rapid-fire organization by experienced activists with an existing network to call upon. In other words, whatever their material accomplishments may or may not have been, these protests are the fruit of the Occupy and BLM movements.
raven
@Peale: That’s what I got out of what he was saying, “people are protesting something that is not in the order”.
Ohio Mom
@Shalimar: You have a better memory for specifics than I do. It very well could have been the polygymy thing, now that you mention it. I think I was gone by the individual mandate discussion. At any rate, whatever it was, it innoculated me.
Ohio Mom
@raven: no prob.
Gotta run now, bye all.
debbie
@Peale:
Right, with zero retribution against the country that gave us practically all of the 9/11 hijackers. smh
Shalimar
@Peale: Constitutionally, we have a centuries-old tradition of racism and what the Constitution says depends on how the Supreme Court chooses to interpret it. That said, lawyers should be salivating over an EO that blocks people from 7 countries because some of them might be terrorists while not including any of the 4 nations those in the last huge terrorist attack from that region came from. It is not tailored in any way to do what they say it is supposed to do
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Kay:
Trump’s a narcissist – he bullies the people he can bully and runs from the people he can’t.
debbie
Anne, you’re probably long gone by now, but that Buzzfeed excerpt about John Hurt last night was just beautiful. Thanks for affording the opportunity to read it.
NeutronFlux
@Baud: Hold your friends close and your enemies closer.
Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism
@Kay: Was the “Enemy of My Enemy” Guy Really Killed by His “Friend”?
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch: Damn, seriously, that “poor me, I am so abused because you won’t help abuse this person” is pure narcissism. That suck ass boss I had would whine like that continuously. That had to come from Trump directly.
Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism
@Peter: And the Women’s March. I was certainly never on the notice lists for Occupy and BLM.
Peale
@debbie: yep. And for that, students from Iran can forget getting back this term or going home this summer. And hopefully they haven’t posted anything on their FB feeds about this matter as those Anti-trump rants will probably get them stopped at the border.
MJMartin
Dear friends,
I wanted to let you know about a new petition I created on We the People, a new feature on WhiteHouse.gov, and ask for your support. Will you add your name to mine? If this petition gets 99,999 signatures by March 01, 2017, the White House will review it and respond!
We the People allows anyone to create and sign petitions asking the White House to take action on a range of issues. If a petition gets enough support, the White House will issue an official response.
You can view and sign the petition here:
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/remove-political-strategist-steve-bannon-national-security-council-reinstate-dni-and-chairman-jcs
Here’s some more information about this petition:
Remove political strategist Steve Bannon from the National Security Council, reinstate DNI and Chairman JCS
Political strategist Steve Bannon has no qualifications whatsoever to sit on the National Security Council and his presence there politicizes our intelligence operations. Director of National Intelligence and Chairman, Joint Chiefs of Staff should be part of every National Security Council meeting.
ThresherK
@satby: Agreed. I’m too young, but Spousal ThresherK was juuust on the tail end of being a hippie as a youth. Maybe “hippie apprentice” is the term, when the age of hippies being a bright new thing had passed and they were falsely retconned into “spitting on Vietname vets” (sic).
And she knows the difference of which you speak.
debit
@Applejinx: I try to stay out of these things, but Jesus Christ on a cracker, grow the fuck up.
Westyny
@Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes: Line forms at the rear.
Paul in KY
@dogwood: To me, ‘the Far Left’ is Trotskyite Communists & Anarchists & whatnot. I don’t put stupid Bernie lovers in that category. They’re more ‘useful idiots’ for the Far Right, which happens to be in power right now.
Skepticat
@Morzer: Not to mention flatly illegal, of course.
ThresherK
@Westyny:
Skepticat
@raven: Please include me in that “all.”
gvg
@Kay:”The Washington Post has done the best reporting on Trump. He never mentions them.”
The Washington Post has a story up about how Trump verbally attacks the NYT’s but doesn’t really do anything to them and it digs up old quotes where Trump says being attacked by the NYT in a short one column story is worth more to his business than a $40,000 1/2 page ad. Then the Post points out Trump has not cut off access from the Times even though the Times has done some tough stories on Trump during the election (according to the Post, some of the toughest antiTrump stories). The implication I get from the Post story is that Trump is very influenced by the Times because he is a New Yorker, as opposed to any other paper. I think it may be a good point to remember and try and push the Times to be more direct.
The Post also quotes the Times claiming they don’t pay much attention to Trumps threats because he has been threatening them for decades.
Nancy Gearhart
I’m pleases to read the local university’s statement that Public Safety will not be supporting the deportation of any student or employee.
http://www.rochester.edu/newscenter/message-from-jane-gatewood-vice-provost-for-global-engagement-on-recent-immigration-news-213242/
The immorality displayed here is unspeakable, can’t find words strong enough.
And the businessman who employs foreign workers didn’t consider the impact on US business.
As has been mentioned elsewhere on this site, how will US universities/corporations handle the loss of international students/potential employees?
Practical considerations clearly came second to thoughts about the show and whether it plays. Wonder who it plays to?
rikyrah
White House has no regrets following incomplete Holocaust statement
01/30/17 08:46 AM—UPDATED 01/30/17 08:47 AM
By Steve Benen
I’d assumed it was a careless mistake. Donald Trump’s White House issued an official statement honoring International Holocaust Remembrance Day, but it made no reference to the Holocaust’s Jewish victims.
The White House is not yet fully staffed, and many of those on Donald Trump’s team are, like the president himself, amateurs. And with that in mind, it was easy to assume that this was an oversight that Team Trump will have to avoid next year.
Except, it turns out the Trump White House deliberately omitted references to Jews from their Holocaust Remembrance Day statement. One presidential spokesperson said the White House “took into account all of those who suffered” in order to be “inclusive.”
Yesterday, as the Washington Post noted, Team Trump kept pushing this line.
Facing growing criticism for failing to mention Jews in a statement marking the Holocaust, the Trump administration on Sunday doubled down on the controversial decision. […]
Wait, is the Trump White House all-lives-mattering the Nazi Holocaust?
LAC
@BillinGlendaleCA: and of course, you always got someone running around with a mop and bucket making excuses for them. “Allies” need to do some clean- up and work too, not just get praised every time they get a feeling right.
Applejinx
@rikyrah: Yes, yes they are.
For the record, what I might have said to the silly ‘hillary so bad’ people with their silly car is “Why do you even have those stickers anymore? Don’t you think that’s like making common cause with the very people we are trying to fight, plus beating a dead neoliberal? She’s not even here. Do you think she is going to be here? Get over it, lose the stickers.”
And if she is there, “Lose the stickers TWICE. Idiots.” But she wasn’t, was she?
I would say that because I have no respect for Hillary Clinton or the campaign she ran, but come the fuck on. It is, as Yahtzee says, pants-on-head retarded to go around behaving like Clinton was history’s great monster when we’re watching the shit Trump is up to. I think she’s not keeping up, where is she if she’s so great? Why isn’t she showing up and saying ‘Fuckin’ arrest me, if that’s your big talk’?
But who cares? All the lame crap she did was trivial compared to what Trump does every day. Sometimes it wasn’t even at all bad, like talking about poor basement dwellers with no future: I might not think she had any intention of correcting that but by God she did manage to be aware of it, and that’s a rare thing for Establishment Washington. And it’s silly to be all outraged about the DNC protecting itself, because it is Establishment Washington too.
And all that’s dead now. Reboot.
Anybody who thinks Hil would have been just as bad is crazy. I am more angry that she lost and deprived us of time to evolve things more incrementally, assuming that even happened. I’m also angry that she simply could not and did not avoid arrogant unforced errors, but we’ve been over that. And I have no respect at all for hagiographic crusading, where it’s everybody else’s fault that she did not win. SO many people stayed home, so many people hated everybody. Hate them back if you want to never win an election again, in the event that we even have one.
LAC
@AxelFoley: Seriously, this. Thank you!
The fauxgressive purity pony posing shit that we have to suffer through. No thanks- done with the bullshit. Shut your fucking piehole up, listing all your lefty credentials, and just get to work.
Timurid
@rikyrah:
Feldgrau lives matter!
Timurid
Any news on contempt citations and arrest warrants?
If the US Marshals are compromised, better make them own it right away…
Applejinx
@AxelFoley: Hey. I find it easy to see a role for third way neoliberals in the body politic. You could play the conservative role that Republicans were supposed to be good at, you could represent stability and the incrementalist thing, you could get over it and run other candidates without decades of baggage. No reason you should not be represented.
WHEN (not if) you lot are frothing, talking tire irons and smashing and egging each other on, and vowing in all seriousness to exact total revenge on those you see as your betrayers, you are talking like the Trump people and I know a bunch of people who would and will respond, ‘They are who we thought they are. It’s not safe to have them around. Look at them, these people are dangerous, vindictive and vile.’
And that’s how we got fucking Trump as President, so stop it.
I’ll never trust you guys again. Do we HAVE to go to where it seems necessary to keep you away from power? Holy shit does that limit our options. This is ridiculous. Is it too much to ask that, in the collapse of our country, only the Republicans be monsters?
rikyrah
@Kay:
What they’re worried about is not morality or decency. Trump supporters by definition don’t care about that.
You continue to crack me up by telling the truth.
Yoda Dog
@Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism: ah shit that made the waterworks come. damn you, sister.
Morning everyone, cept the wilmer guy harshing my mellow..
Larkspur
@raven: Raven, I see that your boss has good, compassionate comrades. I wish her days, weeks, months, even years, I hope, of strength and comfort. I know there really are some good times ahead for her in this weird beautiful world.
Steeplejack (phone)
@raven:
Good thoughts to your boss on the tough road ahead. And fuck cancer.
amk
@Applejinx: despite your long winded poutrage, your dear leader bs is gone. forever. deal with it.
No One You Know
@Applejinx: I don’t think you can tell anyone that their opinion no longer matters. That is, after all, what Trump himself is doing.
I loved Betty’s post. Showed someone going high, not low. Can you say that much?
kindness
Who here has seen the DKos front page this morning saying Minnesota Senator (D) Amy Klobuchar will vote to have a hearing and vote on whom ever Trump nominates for SCOTUS. In the article she states: “I believe we must fulfill our constitutional responsibility to have a hearing and a vote,” and “We must give Republicans the courtesy of hearings and votes even though they denied us that ‘courtesy’ for an entire year because I’m sure Trump will be receptive to our ‘urging’!”
Git a rope.
Larkspur
@Baud: Yes, this this this. It’s good to help them unload the car, it’s good to only fantasize about the tire iron.But we also have to say something, like “Hey, I’d stick around and go with you, but that shit on your signs sucks, so I have an elsewhere to be”. Now, I have a strong aversion to conflict, so I have to talk myself into getting ready to say something like that when the occasion arises.
Steeplejack (phone)
@Immanentize:
Sending good thoughts for your MIL.
sukabi
@Applejinx: how about slapping on an “I’m a fucking IDIOT” bumpersticker next to the others….
chopper
@Applejinx:
quick! to the fainting couch!
Chip Daniels
Kind of cool that Google put Fred Korematsu on its home page.
oklahomo
@Betty Cracker: I was very fortunate, having a couple who have been very close family friends for years, and were rabid Wilmerites — they organized for the campaign for a county in Oklahoma. Once the obvious became obvious, the Wilmer stuff went in the garage and out came the Hillary paraphernalia and they proceeded to campaign across the county for her. What’s amazing — these people, in daily interactions, are so goofy you’d think they would have headed for Stein.
They did not.
Captain C
@amk: All of it, Katie.
Captain C
@debbie: As per The Seventy Maxims of Maximally Effective Mercenaries:
And my own corollary:
“Sometimes your enemy’s enemy is an even bigger asshole than your enemy.”
opiejeanne
@Applejinx: I’m going to tell you what I told my kids when they were small: Stop that; you’re annoying people.
It worked for them, now let’s see if you’re as smart as a 5-year-old.
J R in WV
@Applejinx:
If you still have Hitlery for Prison bumper stickers on your vehicle, today, after all the Trump has done, YOU are NOT on our side. Your inability to perceive how important voting for Hillary Clinton in the general election last November is directly responsible for Trump’s presence in the White House.
IT IS YOUR FAULT!!!
Now, if you removed all the anti-Clinton propaganda from your personal effects, you, Applejinx, I’m talking to you now, if you removed your anti-Clinton stickers and signs, and worked to elect Secretary Clinton, and voted for her, then I’m not calling you personally out.
But those folks with Clinton for Prison sticker STILL on their vehicles, IT IS THEIR FAULT THAT TRUMP IS OUR PRESIDENT. And they need to be told so, over and over, until they scrape those anti-Hillary Clinton propaganda devices off and skulk away from decent people.
And if you disagree with this, IT IS YOUR FAULT that people are being locked up in airports here and put off their paid-for airliner seats all over the world. I have no patience for people who still don’t understand what happened November 8th, 2016. Fuck all of them!
Paul in KY
@Applejinx: You do seem to have some amount of sanity.
Paul in KY
@oklahomo: They are pretty cool people. Especially to do that in Oklahoma!