Daniel Larison doesn’t think that Bobby Jindal would be the subject of birther-type suspicions in a Republican primary:
Even though Jindal came to Christianity as a convert just as Obama did, it is the kind of Christianity he embraced that makes a huge difference. His religion and nationalism together immunize him fairly well against any attacks or conspiracy theories of the kind that have been used against Obama. If he were just a traditional Catholic, but not a nationalist, that could create friction with many constituencies in the GOP, and if he were just a secular or non-Christian nationalist he would run into significant resistance from many Christian voters, but the combination makes him acceptable to a broad cross-section of the party. Religious identity politics shields him from being regarded as “Other,” and among a significant number of Republicans his story of first-generation American assimilation and success is one of the main reasons why Jindal is so well-liked. Perhaps just as important, Jindal provides Republican voters with the opportunity to demonstrate their color-blind, anti-racist credentials, and they will jump at the chance to support him, if only to spite people on the left who expect them to do otherwise.
Chris Orr thinks he he will be:
The problem is that it’s not Jindal who needs to overcome anything; it’s voters, in this case Republican voters, and their moods, like any, ebb and flow with the political tides.
Now, obviously it’s still early days in the GOP’s journey of post-November self-definition, and it may yet find a way to arrest its devolution into the Party of White Anger and Paranoia before 2012. But so far I think it’s safe to say that the party’s trajectory has not been a promising one–for Jindal, for the GOP, or for the nation generally.
My opinion: of course Jindal will be birthered if he runs in 2012 or 2016, though not in the same way that Obama has been. Think about the way the birther rumors have spread. There hasn’t been much institutional support for it, outside those crazy billboards, because it’s seen by most Republicans as a losing issue. My guess is that it has mostly spread via those crazy chain emails older wingers are always sending each other, with some help from talk radio. Simply put, it has spread spontaneously.
Anti-Jindal birtherism would probably not grow spontaneously, for the reasons that Larison gives. But it wouldn’t have to, because his primary opponents would be pushing it. How hard is it to get political operatives to start forwarding around chain emails about how Jindal’s really a Hindu or a Muslim or was really born in India? Not very. None of this will be done openly or publicly, mind you, but it will be done.
In 2008, Mitt Romney done in largely by anti-Mormon bigotry, some of which was openly and publicly stoked (see Huckabee, Mike). And he was the favored candidate of right-wing radio. You think something like that wouldn’t happen to Bobby Jindal?
Larison’s point about religion is well-taken here; Romney’s from a non-mainstream religion, Huckabee isn’t. But given the mechanisms by which birtherism has spread, it’s going to be awfully tempting for rival campaigns to start flooding wingers inboxes with JINDAL IS TEH HINDOO.
schrodinger's cat
What is wrong with being a hindu or a muslim or an atheist?
Why is there an unofficial religious test for being president?
DougJ
What is wrong with being a hindu or a muslim or an atheist?
The more you view this country as analogous to an Islamic state like Iran and the less you view it as analogous to the rest of the western world, the better you will understand American politics. That’s not to say that we’re that much like either.
harlana pepper
Obama *converted* to Christianity? This is news to me. The implication, of course, being that he was Mooslim before. What am I missing here?
Ash
Honestly, I think the fact that he’s a Grade A Crazy Christian totally immunizes him from this sort of stuff. Also, I hate him, which is a sign that he’ll have things easy, just to make me suffer.
However, Orly better get on her lawsuit early, since both Jindal’s parents were non-citizens, and therefore the whole thing is obviously moot, since he’ll never qualify….
harlana pepper
Well, apologies for being too damned lazy to use teh Google. Sounds like Obama was basically an agnostic until he got involved with Trinity Church. So he is, indeed, a convert.
Demo Woman
The Southern party will accept any one as long as they are anti choice. Years ago when Powell was thinking of running, the right wing killed him, because of that issue.
schrodinger's cat
The more you view this country as analogous to an Islamic state like Iran
So are we a theocracy now? What happened to the separation of church and state? Was it always like this? Politicians pandering to the devout?
Ash
@harlana pepper: I wouldn’t use convert in Obama’s case. Convert implies going from one religion to another, which Jindal did. In Obama’s case it was more “finding” religion.
Dave S.
Jindal will be
birtheredcolored if he runs in 2012 or 2016.Fixed.
The Moar You Know
You must be joking. Kennedy was considered unelectable for being Catholic, and had to address the nation and state that he wouldn’t be taking marching orders from the Vatican. He barely, and I mean barely won.
The shrieking for the last thirty years that we are a Judeo-Christian nation built on the bible, that we are a center-right nation, the relentless bombing of the Middle East for the last decade under the explicit mandate of a modern-day crusade – none of this is enough to explain why there is an “unofficial religious test for being president?” I’ll tell you why, it’s because we are a nation of psychos, religious fanatics and dimwits whose main social accomplishment in the last fifty years is that we no longer have state-sponsored lynchings of black people.
AMERICA FUCK YEAH!
BTW: you’ll not see a Muslim president in my lifetime, the fuckers who did 9/11 guaranteed that.
Ash
Was it always like this? Politicians pandering to the devout?
Uhm, for like the last 50 years now?
The Moar You Know
@schrodinger’s cat: Google “Father Coughlin”. We’ve been pandering to the devoutly ignorant forever in this nation.
les
In a sane nation, the fact that Jindal is a nutbag catholic who thinks he’s performed an exorcism would be enough to disqualify him, where ever he or his parents came from. Oh, wait, sorry…
MattF
Can I please point out how completely crazy this is? Jindal is OK because he’s a religious fanatic? Or, on the other hand, maybe he’s not OK because he’ll be the target of psychopathic racists? Hmm, let’s think this one over…
JackieBinAZ
They used racist dogwhistles on John Fucking McCain. Who thinks they’d cut Jindal any slack?
harlana pepper
@Ash: True enough, that occurred to me. I was really trying to present the idea in “conserva-speak” terms.
kay
I think the Louisiana/Catholic ratio skews the results. Louisiana is on the top ten list of US states with the highest percentage of Catholics. It’s the only southern state in the top ten, and it’s the only red state in the top ten.
It’s like saying Romney can win nationally because Republicans accept him in Utah, and we know how that turned out. Louisiana-Catholic-accepted is a political outlier.
Rhode Island
Massachusetts
Connecticut
New Jersey
New York
Louisiana
Wisconsin
Illinois
Pennsylvania
New Mexico
What about the rest of the south?
NonyNony
I find this doubtful in the extreme.
The e-mails will for the most part be flooded with “JINDAL IS TEH MOOSLIM”. Except in Texas where they’ll pass around “JINDAL IS TEH HINDOO” with a conspiracy theory that because of his HINDOOISM he will be making it illegal to eat hamburger in this country and will force us all to worship cows instead.
“TEH MOOSLIMS” are much, much scarier than “TEH HINDOOS”. The stereotypical “MOOSLIM” is the angry terrorist on 24. The stereotypical “HINDOO” is Apu from “The Simpsons”. It’s tough to get crazy-scared over Apu (though I’m sure a few of the wingers will manage it).
But yeah, essentially you’re right. And it will be pushed mainly by his primary opponents, though they’ll just be tapping into the grass-roots xenophobia and racism that is already there to do it.
The Grand Panjandrum
Look what they did to McCain in SC during the 2000 GOP primary. He has WASP and military credentials going back for generations so I have little doubt one of the other contenders will get the get the whisper campaign fired up early enough to quench any possibility of Jindal successfully getting the nomination. Republicans never miss an opportunity to spread this vile racist shit when they want something bad enough. They have just enough people, a sizable percentage of their voting base, who hear the dog whistle shit. It may be called the Southern Strategy, but it works just about everywhere in the country. The South is just a little easier pickings for them.
Hunter Gathers
Jindal isn’t going anywhere in national politics. His fake, Huckleberry Hound accent makes anyone north of the Mason-Dixon line’s ears bleed, and Louisiana is a complete and total mess. The fact he is having it both ways with the stim funds will not be forgotten by Louisiana Democrats. They’ll club him with it. I doubt he’ll win re-election.
southpaw
Unless I miss my guess, Jindal isn’t going to make it far enough in the primaries to be birthered.
Plus, he’s probably going to drop documents fairly soon as a sop to the birthers. “Bobby Jindal’s long form birth certificate is online; why isn’t yours Barack? . . . Hengh! . . .” and so forth and so on until the end of time. Botheration.
El Cid
All Jindal has to do is be more right wing than the challengers and suddenly he will be as normal as any Good Patriot American Conservative could be, just like all good Republican heartlanders are fine with the crazy messianic Moonie church as long as it spreads $$ around and subsidizes the Washington Times to print more of their horse shit.
harlana pepper
The South has no great love for Catholicism (since we are drowning in Baptists who despise Catholics, except on the issue of abortion), so I imagine he would not be well-received. How he got elected gov of a southern state, I still do not understand. But maybe the anti-abortion thing will override hatred of Catholics in general.
Sounds like Larison is really reaching on this one.
Persian
Except Jindal was actually a Hindu for most of his life and converted to Christianity in college I believe, unlike Obama who never was a Muslim. On the other hand, Jindal once attempted an exorcism…
Ash Can
Actually, a Jindal candidacy might yield interesting results. I agree that his primary opponents would push the birther thing, along with anything else they could possibly think of, in order to discredit him. That, after all, is what primaries are all about. The really interesting part would come if he were to win the nomination. Sure, the GOP would nominally rally behind him. But his nomination would stuff dynamite into the religious and racist fissures in the GOP and blow them wide apart. A third-party, very white, and very wacko right-wing candidate could be a result.
mistermix
@NonyNony: “Mooslim” is still to sophisticated. “A-rab” will do.
Ash
@The Grand Panjandrum: “Look what they did to McCain in SC during the 2000 GOP primary.”
If I’m not mistaken, didn’t the whisper campaign involve people saying his adopted daughter was some lovechild with a black lady? Now putting aside the fact how stupid it is to mistake a Bangladeshi child for a half black/white one, Indians, especially ones who hold lots of power, aren’t generally victims of that. Hello Model Minority.
uila
With all due respect to Larison, his math is off. I would not grant the assertion that Catholic + Nationalist = Wingnut Approved, much less the reality of Catholic +Nationalist + Brown Skin Possible Hindoo + Tooth Whistle.
BTW, I’m counting the tooth whistle as a point in his favor. It’s still not enough. Anyone who’s had an actual conversation with a “Christian” of the wingnut variety knows that Catholics (aka the accursed Papists) are not “us” they are “them”. Granted, the existence of Bill Donoghue tends to obscure this fact, but I assure you the mistrust is there.
wilfred
I doubt the process of Muslim Othering can be understood without the construct of Homeland. In order to define the Other as threat there must be something threatened, and that’s more than just a question of racial and religious difference.
Fanon once said that while Jews were perceived as an intellectual and economic threat to Western Europeans Negro represented a biological threat. I would say that the Muslim is now presented as an existential threat, this time to the combined racial, religious and socio-cultural constructs incorporated into Homeland.
Downpuppy
Has everyone forgot the time Jindal went national & had his “Kevin the Intern” moment?
Sometime between now & 2012 there will be an attempt by some rich, semi-sane Republicans to take back the party from the nuts. It should provide an amusing day or 2.
nepat
I think Larison’s post assumes a post-primary, nominated Jindal – or even a President Jindal (i.e. would birthers plague his presidency as they are Obama’s?). But you’re right. He would first have to survive a primary blood bath, where birther supporters of other candidates would be in super-caffeinated overdrive, showing up at Jindal rallies with God Bless America bumper stickers pasted to pieces of garlic Naan.
The big question is how a post-Obama, birther-saturated Fox News/Drudge/WSJ would cover such a primary. The steady stream of hypocrisy will be most entertaining!
Don
I think these all miss the mark. He wouldn’t be ‘birthered’ because this is a movement that’s born of desperation and disbelief. The fact that Obama is black might make it easier for them to do accept the possibility but this is just a mental hail-mary from people who just can’t believe that somehow their way isn’t winning. Clearly if he’s in, it’s a cheat. It can’t be a repudiation of their beliefs or a reflection on their failures.
Jindal wouldn’t get that because the anti-others wouldn’t be the ones who’d be on the outside if he won. Not to say the left doesn’t have plenty of it’s own crazy, but it’s not that flavor.
wilfred
@mistermix:
No, it’s Muslim. Does anyone think that the people at, say, NRO, would have had anything to do with Hispanics, Jews or East Asians 30 years ago? It is the willingness of members of once Otherized groups to accept what is essentially the superiority of the Master and enables them to enter into the Master/Slave paradigm and ultimately be shit out at the other end as a mouthpiece of the very exceptionalism they once opposed.
Muslims will not do that, ever. They have a different, and equally potent, historical project.
KXB
Any birther-type attack against Jindal would differ from Obama in a number of ways. First off, many of the Obama birthers are simply people who wish they could just call him a nigger – but times have changed, and we don’t use such language anymore. Jindal’s parents, unlike Obamas, stayed married and settled in Louisiana. Obama’s mom was a vagabond – in Hawaii one moment, Indonesia the next. In a region that puts a lot of emphasis on having roots, the Jindals beat him on that score.
Jindal does have a number of obstacles that Obama did not have to face. Jindal is a smart guy, and has a long resume – but can he mimic the “Aw shucks” mannerisms that too many Republicans seem to think they need to do to win over Southern primary voters? His performance after the State of the Union does not inspire much confidence on that front. He would be better off if he demonstrated just how smart he is – he is not an Average Joe.
As far as his ethnicity goes, speaking as just one Indian-American who does not like to let my ethnicity be my chief characteristic, even I was a bit disappointed in his 60 Minutes interview, where he seemed to distance himself from anything even remotely related to his Indian background or his parents Hinduism. His constant stating of being raised “All American” did not sit well with me. To me, it suggested he believes his Indian background conflicts with being an American, and will be a liability with Southern Republican primary voters. Hey Bobby, it is possible to go to Bengali lessons on Sunday, and then Boy Scouts on Monday. It is possible to go to Durga Puja in the fall, and exchange Christmas gifts in the winter. If he said something like, “My mom makes the best aloo ghobi” that would be enough for me. This balancing of numerous backgrounds to define a modern American – in this area Obama has Jindal beat, hands down.
Gus
@kay:
Yes, I was surprised neither Orr nor Larison brought that up. There are plenty of Southern Evangelicals who believe that the Pope, not Obama is the Antichrist.
actual_hindu
Okay, I am a hindu, about 5 yrs older than Jindal, born and raised in the Midwest. When we were growing up, any achievement by anyone vaguely Asian was exciting. We would stop and wave and chat if we saw another Indian/Pakistani/Nepai/Bangladeshi family walking around.
Sometimes they turned out to be Latino but nevermind.
So I should be excited about Piyush Jindal, right? But no.
It’s not the conversion to catholicism. That’s fine.
(Henry 1V said: Paris is worth a mass) but he could have stayed
mainstream catholic.
PS: “Piyush” is “nectar” in Sanskrit.
gwangung
Outside of bathroom stalls? No.
RSA
@NonyNony:
I agree. It’ll be accompanied by a line of reasoning so ill-informed that only the birther crowd would accept it, something like this: Jindal’s parents are from a country that shares a long border with a Muslim country–in fact, the two countries were an artificial political creation only sixty years ago. How can we trust him? Plus, he’s trying to make fun of us when he talks.
SGEW
@schrodinger’s cat:
The Jefferson vs. Adams campaign, 1800 (emphasis added):
Yes.
harlana pepper
Well, Rush loves Jindal so all this speculation is pretty much moot.
JK
Bobby Jindal said he witnessed, and then haltingly participated in, the exorcism of his very close friend (a woman named Susan) when he was in college.
In 1994 Jindal penned a piece for the New Oxford Review, under the title “Beating a Demon: Physical Dimensions of Spiritual Warfare,” http://www.newoxfordreview.org/article.jsp?did=1294-jindal in which he recounted what happened.
h/t http://blow.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/02/28/bobby-jindal-the-exorcist-pro-or-con/
Anyone who takes exorcisms seriously is way too fucking crazy to be considered for President of the United States
kay
@Gus:
It was true when I lived there, but that was a long time ago. The percentage of Catholics in the south just isn’t high. I think it’s a completely untested theory that they embrace Catholic Presidential candidates, and shouldn’t be assumed. Considering how Romney was received, I’d lean towards “not”.
There may be something else going on here, though. Republicans have to persuade Catholics if they’re ever going to win again. They want them back. Without white Catholics, they are well and truly screwed.
Ash
@KXB: Yep, as another Indian, that’s what irks me the most. After his overall craziness and general failness, that is.
I wonder if his birth certificate even says Piyush on it.
Brick Oven Bill
My guess is that Jindal would, and probably already has, willingly submit(ed) the information necessary to obtain a US Passport, along with his college transcripts, to election officials in parallel with his hypothetical (previous) filing, making this speculation nothing other than just some fun.
SGEW
@Brick Oven Bill: Massive self-awareness fail.
Teh irony. It burns!
harlana pepper
@kay: You have answered my question. Also, it figures, since La. was settled by the French and Spanish.
JM
But does Jindal teh x0rc15t want to murder your grandparents?
Whatever AM radio feeds the white trash, they believe.
gex
@uila: And this is one of my greatest complaints with the GOP coalition. While they have the muslims and the gays to go after, many of them conveniently forget that without those groups, they would be on the outs with the “real” Americans.
Lola
Jindal will not be birthered because Jindal has Rush’s blessings. No birthernut would dare offend Rush.
Gus
@kay:
Agreed. The question will be can they persuade white Catholics without alienating the Bob Joneses of the South? They’ll have to lean heavily on abortion as an issue, which presents its own dangers.
jwb
Larison’s point is that it’s not race but ideology (nationalism and religion) that is driving the birthers, which is a fair point as far as it goes. One question that he doesn’t address as well as I’d like is whether Jindal’s Catholicism fits sufficiently into the ideology to be acceptable. The resistance to Romney has me doubtful. I also found Larison’s piece to be incredibly depressing, because it implies that any Democratic President is going to get the full crazy treatment—it’s just the manifestation that will change depending on the personal characteristics of the President. Crazy will be attracted to whatever is close at hand—and in the case of Obama it was evidently the cultural legacy of racial imagination. Larison also doesn’t address what it means that crazy chose to play this out in terms of race; to me that suggests that crazy believes that racialization remains an effective political strategy even if crazy can, for other reasons, occasionally look beyond race, even if crazy would in fact like to look beyond race, and even if crazy would, for a different Democratic President, find a wholly different way to express its crazy. Clearly, in the case of Obama, crazy lit on race; and that says something about crazy’s attitude toward race that Larison would seemingly rather ignore.
SGEW
What is the substantive difference between taking exorcisms seriously and earnestly believing in the literal nature of transubstantiation or physical resurrection? Is it a question of “optics”?
Fern
Best not to underestimate evangelical Christian suspicion of Catholics.
DougJ
If he said something like, “My mom makes the best aloo ghobi” that would be enough for me.
You know, he probably could have said that if he’d said it was Indian version of chow-chow or collards. There are ways to present ethnicity that would work for him. But I don’t think he’s that savvy.
DMD
Schrodinger’s cat is apparently new to this country. While the Constitution forbids specific religious requirements, any candidate for higher office who doesn’t show fealty to the vaguely Christian, absolutely pro-American “God” doesn’t have a snowball’s chance in hell.
Bobby Jindal would totally be birfered in the GOP primary. They’d rally around him in the general if it came to that though (I don’t think it will–it’s going to be Romney. Republicans are predictable if anything). Obama’s a bigger “other” than Jindal cause his a Fasc ist Soc ialist or some such.
SGEW
@DMD:
With a few notable exceptions.
Litlebritdifrnt
@Brick Oven Bill:
Keep up BOB, the birfers have already reached the conclusion that natural born citizen = born on US soil of two citizen parents. Therefore Jindal is simply not eligible. It’s funny how that works, go through so many hoops to prove that POTUS isn’t POTUS that you eventually rule out one of your potential star candidates in 2012 or 16. Epic birfer fail.
gwangung
@jwb:
Ehhhh, I’m not so sure. As someone who’s background is Asian, I get a lot of “No, where are you REALLY from” when I say I’m from Arizona. The default assumption is that if you look Asian, you must be foreign and don’t belong here.
schrodinger's cat
I do agree what you are saying here. May be I am naive, but I think that shouldn’t be the case, I know religion matters but it shouldn’t to the extent it does. It doesn’t make sense to me, that’s all.
The Grand Panjandrum
@Ash: I know what you mean about Model Minority, but McCain was a “War Hero” and that didn’t stop the whisper campaign. The opposing candidate doesn’t have to be an obvious and public bigot, they just have to pander to those fears that exist in the GOP primary voters. The moment a candidate like Jindal gets even the slightest traction the wheels will be set in motion.
If Jindal were to run he would probably do OK in New Hampshire, but I just don’t see him making it much farther than that.
SGEW
@gwangung: Ever played this game? [part 1, part 2] Fun!
Ash
@gwangung: “As someone who’s background is Asian, I get a lot of “No, where are you REALLY from” when I say I’m from Arizona. The default assumption is that if you look Asian, you must be foreign and don’t belong here.”
To be fair, I’ve always gotten the impression when people ask me the “Where are you REALLY from?” question, after I tell them I’m from Illinois, that it’s got more to do with just being curious about what your ethnicity is, rather than some suspicion about you being foreign and speaking in an accent and not being American.
schrodinger's cat
Crazy Wingnut email about Jindal, sometime in the future.
Be afraid, be very afraid, secret Hindoo, Jindal is coming after your hamburgers, and hotdogs. Psst BTW his name is not Bobby, it is Piyush. Why won’t he release his birth certificate so we can see what his real name is. What is he hiding?
Nethead Jay
@SGEW: Yes, I think it’s a matter of “optics”. As an atheist I don’t like it, but there’s many so-called moderate or mainstream religious people out there for whom transsubstantiation and resurrection is no problem, but exorcism is to far outside their comfort zone. Ir makes me a little angry sometimes, but that’s the way it is.
Anyhow, the most important thing at the moment is to keep the fanatics and ideologues as far away from power as possible, which is why I think the exorcism story should be hung around Jindal’s neck every time he looks up. And I wish we could find something really damaging on Huckabee that would sink his ship for good.
Bubblegum Tate
@The Moar You Know:
Which will we see first: A Muslim president or an openly gay president?
I don’t think Jindal will be birthered that hard. Probably a little during the primaries, but the guy’s been on “GOP rising star!” status for a while now, so I doubt there will be a concerted effort to undercut him like that.
Blue Raven
SGEW, not sure I’d say optics. There is more than a perspective difference between theological handwaving over wafers and wine and assuming you know better than a trained official of your own Mother Church when it is time to bust out the holy water and pea soup cleaner. Jindal violated RC policy and practice when he exorcised that woman. He was supposed to convince her to talk to a priest, who would first advise her to see a doctor or shrink. So not only is he in the crazy godbotherer tank, he’s in trouble if his college shenanigans go national. The Church will not take well to having that kind of Catholic representing their faith.
SGEW
@Blue Raven:
Huh. Learn something new every day.
Persian
@Bubblegum Tate
BTW: you’ll not see a Muslim president in my lifetime, the fuckers who did 9/11 guaranteed that.
Which will we see first: A Muslim president or an openly gay president?
I’m ethnically Muslim (as you can probably guess from my name) and I don’t see why we should expect a minority that is less than 1% of the US population to have a member be president. Of course, a president with Muslims in his family would be (and is) nice, but I think Asians and gays should be higher on the list of firsts.
Sentient Puddle
@schrodinger’s cat:
Yeah, welcome to America. I’d like to help you out on this one too…but I can’t. Atheists are the supreme evil of the universe, and I don’t know why.
The optimist in me says this may be another one of them generational things. I’m young, and I don’t know a lot of people my age that are religious (and this figure is surely inflated by the fact that I live in Texas). And those that are religious take a rather “meh” attitude towards those who aren’t. But on the other hand, this is all anecdote, and I may be subconsciously staying the fuck away from those that are jackasses about religion.
SGEW
The classic question:
Who will become president first?
Woman
African-American[updated]Hispanic
East Asian
South Asian
Arab Christian
Native American
Jew
(Openly) Homosexual or Bisexual
Muslim
Transgendered
Wiccan
(Openly) Atheist
Place your bets, people.
anonevent
@Litlebritdifrnt: But you’re also missing the point that IOKIYAR. The only thing that prevented Ahnold from running was his accent. If he had just sounded American they would have come up with some birth myth to make him eligible.
Nethead Jay
@Blue Raven: Regarding Bobby Jindal being in trouble with the RC church, I and others have long had some suspicions about what kind of Catholic he is. For quite some years now, there’s been ongoing attemps by dominionist groups to infiltrate the RC church through the vehicle of so-called “Charismatic Catholic” congregations. This sort of thing is also sometimes known as steeplejacking. Having followed this stuff for many years, I wouldn’t be surprised to find Jindal having such ties.
flukebucket
it’s going to be Romney.
I agree. It will be the whitest guy on the planet versus the affirmative action President.
Lots of fun to look forward to.
Comrade Dread
I don’t think he’ll get a pass. I don’t think he’ll get it as bad as Obama has, but he will get some flak, especially during the primaries when the ultrapartisan supporters of his opponents will try and paint him as unAmerican.
And, yeah, he would probably get some flak from some Democrats for being a sell out. (Or an “Uncle Tom” if he were black.)
LD50
@Litlebritdifrnt: This would rule out Romney, too, whose father was TEH MESSKIN.
PurpleGirl
I don’t remember where I saw it (which blog, that is) but there is a way to birther the anchor baby Piyush Jindal: the extreme pro-lifers want to claim personhood from the moment of conception, so Piyush was conceived in India and born here after his parents immigrated. Therefore he’s not a natural-born citizen. That he may have received that status is a mistake because at the time the hospital and vital statistics people didn’t understand about personhood at conception. I think the anchor baby angle is attackable… who knew his parents would like it here and stay to become citizens (they citizens now, aren’t they?).
Trollhattan
Another time, another “candidate”: non-Californians may not recall those halcyon days after Ahnold’s first election, when greater wingnuttia was with one voice asking, “why not repeal that bit in the Constitution requiring the president be born here?”
They thought they had themselves a manly multi-millionaire true believer. Within a month or three, once Ahnold’s sorta centrist ways emerged and he (gasp!) named some Demoncrats to his cabinet, greater wingnuttia zipped that talk, pronto. I missed the memo, but the silence was as sudden as it was predictable.
If Opie/Kenneth the page runs, it will be all kinds of amusing to watch greater wingnuttia bend their “values” like a damn pretzel to accommodate the sackful of disconnects with SOP. A party truly bereft of any shred of moral compass.
drumwolf
@SGEW:
Realistically, I’d say we’re most likely to see a female president next. In terms of which groups you’ve mentioned would face the fewest obstacles and least bigotry, I’d say females first and then East Asians next.
@LD50:
George Romney may have been born in Mexico, but his parents were white Americans. To wingers, he doesn’t count as MESSKIN any more than Hispanics and Asians born in America count as REAL AMERICANS.
kth
John and Cindy McCain were generous enough to adopt a baby from Bangladesh. But that didn’t stop Bush supporters from alleging that McCain was the father of the kid. Because if you have a non-white family member, you must be a degenerate.
If Jindal can somehow become the candidate of those freaks, somewhat like the Asian fiddle player who is the unofficial mascot of the Branson, MO entertainment district, they won’t hurt him. But if he is the chief obstacle for someone else they’ve bonded with, will they go there? You betcha they will.
schrodinger's cat
schrodinger's cat
Oops sorry for the messed up block quotes in comment 79. I can preview function please?
Everything from the second sentence onwards should not be in block quotes.
chrome agnomen
for the life of me, i cannot figure out just what it is that these people get out of religion. i mean, just what does it do for them in any meaningful, constructive, pragmatic way to improve their lot in life. i have met very few people in my long life whose lives, in my opinion, would not have been improved by stepping way back from any influence that religion had in their lives. and i refer to the specific religion they espoused, not the benign universal golden rule tenets that they have clearly forgotten. they are evidently so bereft of a healthy ego, sense of self, that they must seek identity with whatever group will have them. unfortunately, nearly all those groups fall under the rubric of ‘any group that would have me for a member…’
are they completely unable or unwilling to just live their lives from day to day, to confront the quotidian problems of existence as they arise and deal with them as best they can, in short, take personal responsibility.
/end of today’s sermon
Calouste
@The Moar You Know:
Statistics will mostly guarantee that as well, only 0.6% of the US population is Muslim. If there will be another 10 Presidents in your lifetime, the chance that at least one of them is a Muslim is slightly less than 6%.
Toonces
And how come he gets to call himself “Bobby?”
Sure didn’t work for Barack HUSSEIN Obama.
Chuck Butcher
Please Larison, a brown Catholic outside Louisianna? If brown doesn’t sink him, Papist will. As for the ‘Aw shucks’ routine, the cretins don’t expect such a pol to be one of them, just act like they’re cool. Remember, Palin went to ‘x’ number of colleges and that is ‘x’ more than they did.
Larison acts as though (in defense of his indefensible bunch) there is only one bar. Did somebody really expect him to be intellectually honest?
Chuck Butcher
@chrome agnomen:
Speaking from a definitely non-religious perspective, you don’t know enough people. It is my experience that the beneficiaries of religion tend to be quieter about it, especially since they don’t do the meanness part. I find the religion of atheism just as pointless as any other if it comes that and frequently as offensive and mean spirited. When it comes to logic, agnostics have an easy edge over the rest of the faith based opinions on an unprovable assertion.
JL
Larison’s “argument” implies that Obama is the bane of birthers because of the type of Christian he is. Oy.
Birthers exist because of a combination of old-fashioned-American-style racism, the ease of preying on xenophobia, and the desire to use short cuts to whip up opposition rather than focusing on policy principles or issues. In other words, “birtherism” IS GOP politics as usual.
Jinal WILL face birtherism from GOP ranks during the primaries should he join the fray. No doubt in my mind. It will be the (in GOP political “minds) easiest way to eliminate a candidate who is not viable in the general election (he is not viable because of his hypocritical response to the stimulus package and his Palin-esque speech delivery and policy experience; not because of his ethnicity).
pattonbt
Quick reasons why Republicans / Jindal fail:
1) Jindal became popular in the R circles because they thought D’s loved Obama because he was black. Seriously, Jindal was quietly (maybe n ot so quietly) referred to, and hoped to become, as the R’s Obama. The background stories were roughly similar, sure enough, but fail because one is charismatic, thoughtful and empathetic (if a bit cool) and the other is not (nice post SOTU rebuttal dude).
2) Jindal will get some nastiness in the primaries, but if the candidate, it goes away. It then goes to tribalism, not ‘otherism’. And the D’s, for the most part, wont go down the path the R’s are with Obama.
3) Jindal is short (and not charismatic). Hes toast based on that alone. Short men do not win versus tall men. Americans are shallow. Barack is handsome, tall, well presented and sounds cool. Jindal? Not so much. Deal selaed for Obama.
Tax Analyst
schrodinger’s cat said:
“While the Constitution forbids specific religious requirements, any candidate for higher office who doesn’t show fealty to the vaguely Christian, absolutely pro-American “God” doesn’t have a snowball’s chance in hell.
I do agree what you are saying here. May be I am naive, but I think that shouldn’t be the case, I know religion matters but it shouldn’t to the extent it does. It doesn’t make sense to me, that’s all.”
You can’t be a cat. Cats are not idealistic and there are several traits you seem to possess that cats just don’t:
1 Although they often do things that make sense, cats never worry about what makes sense – they prefer to do what seems like a good idea at the time. Generally, what seems like a good idea at the time is something that tantalizes with the promise of instant gratification of some sort. That, combined with the WAY they go about these pursuits tends to make them very interesting creatures.
2 Cats are not in the least bit concerned with “fairness”. There’s a good reason for this. A fairness test would leave most of them in deep trouble well over 1/2 the time.
3 Cats don’t give a cats or a rats ass about religion. They DO believe in “Tribute” however. People should keep that mind when Katmandoo, Datkatdoo, Katamillie or Katamindee or whatever just so awesomely really cute name you tagged it with comes prancing up with a dead, bloody gopher and drops it at your feet. They are gifting you a most precious thing; the prized kill trophy – the fruits from the remnants of their ancient hunting instincts. I mean, they might want to play with the damn thing for a while after they render it helpless and near death, but they sure as hell don’t want to eat the damned thing…unless you have neglected to feed it for a couple days (almost impossible unless you have been away from home or are totally stone-deaf). BTW the way, its a GOOD thing they don’t want to eat that dead gopher. When I was a kid one of our cats DID eat the dead gopher…and spent the next several hours puking up nasty little gopher bits and pieces. Yuck!
Further schrodinger’s cat:
“Schrodinger’s cat is apparently new to this country.
Not new to the country, new to its politics. I started paying close attention to all things political, only recently, from the last Presidential elections that is. In my world (first physics then finance) I rarely meet anyone who wears religion on their sleeve. Overt religiosity is alien to my upbringing as well, its just something that’s not done. Even the Republicans I know are not religious.”
Ah, well that explains it. You are an intellectual cat. Of course. Your observational skills are cat-like, but non-intellectual cats rarely spend time musing over what they have observed. They either go to work and get busy on it or they ignore it and move on to something else that catches their cat’s eye. Non-intellectual cats would treat politicians exactly the same way they treat gophers if the politicians were gopher-sized. I think you have to respect a creature that instinctively makes that move.
If I’m lucky I will have a dream tonight of my late cat Loki dropping a thoroughly mauled Eric Cantor, John Corwyn, Mitch McConnell, John Boehner or Norm Coleman at my feet – or Ah-nuld, for that matter.